The Nine Points Of Roguery

reel

Key signature: Dmajor

Submitted on December 9th 2001 by Will Harmon.

This tune has been added to 234 tunebooks.

Also known as 9 Points Of Roguery, The 9 Points Of Roguery, The Black Mare Of Fanad, Nine Points Of Roguery.

Recordings of a tune by this name:

• And So The Story Goes... by Sean Tyrrell, Kevin Glackin And Ronan Browne
• Ard Rí by Aileach
• As Long As You're Enjoying Yourself by John Brennan And John McGillian
• Banish Misfortune by Malcolm Dalglish And Grey Larsen
• Boys Of The Lough by Boys Of The Lough
• Bruscar Bán by The Culchies
• Bundle And Go by John Doherty
• Far From Home by Blackthorn Band
• Ireland's Best Session Tunes CD 1 by Waltons Recording
• Irish Fiddle Player by Jimmy Power
• Live At Passim by Boys Of The Lough
• Live From Dublin - A Tribute To Derek Bell by The Chieftains
• Mist And Stone by Maggie Sansone
• Music From The Blind Fiddler by Cathal Hayden, Máirtín O'Connor, Cathal Synnott & Seamus O'Dowd
• North-by-NorthWest by Eliot Grasso And Dave Cory
• Our Musical Heritage Disc 2 by Various Artists
• Pleasures Of Home by Winifred Horan
• Sea Changes Of The Toucan Pirates by Toucan Pirates
• Smoking On The Bog by Spud
• The Angel's Share by Atlantic Wave
• The Bridge Céilí Band by The Bridge Céilí Band
• The Dawn by Baal Tinne
• The High Part Of The Road by Tommy Peoples And Paul Brady
• The Sound Of Coleman Country by Various Artists
• The Wynd You Know by Ronan Browne
• Traditional Irish Dance Music by Various Artists
• Turn Of The Wheel by Tempest
• Whenever by Munnelly Flaherty Masure
• Ye Jacobites By Name by The Johnstons

X: 1
T: Nine Points Of Roguery, The
M: 4/4
L: 1/8
R: reel
K: Dmaj
FE|:D2 (3FED ADFE|DEFG ABAF|D2 (3FED GEFA|BEED EGFE|
|D2 (3FED ADFE|DEFG ABAF|DEFA GABc|1 dfec d2 FE:|2 dfec d2 AB||
|:~=c3 A ~B3 G|AGAB AGFE|DE (3FED GEFA|BEED E2 AB|
|~=c3 A ~B3 G|Adcd fdAF|DEFA GABc|1dfec d2 AB:|2 dfec d2 fe|
|:d2 fa gfec|defg abaf|(3ddd fa gfed|be (3eee beef|
|d2 fa gfec|defg abaf|defa gfeg|1 fdge fddA:|2 fdge fdAF||

The Nine Points of Roguery

A great set of notes to go with a wonderful title. The B part, with it's c natural, is the signature of this three part reel.

If you don't want the triplets in the A part, just play them as FD. Similarly, you can skip the rolls on the c and B in the B Part by simply playing |=c2 cA B2 BG|. The rest of the tune is pretty straightforward.

# Posted on December 9th 2001 by Will Harmon

Yes, Will, it´s a great tune. I can´t make much sense of the title though (the finer nuances of a foreign language again...). Maybe the title is another one of the reasons the tune has survived in my active repertoire for so long (originally learned from a recording by English fiddler Dave Swarbrick in 1983/4, I think). I don´t play it in sessions very often because usually nobody joins in, but it has been part of my warming up and sound check routine for the last fifteen years or so.

A great version of it is played in Donegal where they call "The Black Mare of Fanad". Like I wrote in the thread, as a four part tune, with the 2nd part repeated after the third. And the fact that Donegal fiddlers seem to hear a C major chord in bar 4 (both 1st and 2nd parts, rarely in the 3rd!) made me come up with the following variation for this bar, sort of trying to catch up with them: |BE~E2 cE~E2|
In the 3rd part it could be played like: |be (3eee c'e (3eee | or |be (3gfe c'e (3gfe | It´s fun! (By the way, Will: the loose forearm on the bowed triplets seems to work - when it does - they look and sound a lot smoother this way. Only the success rate has gone down dramatically for the moment... but I keep working at it. I had more time to practise before I started playing music for a living... and before I discovered the internet!)

And bars 1 and 5 of the 2nd part I have very frequently heard played like |=cBAc BAGB | in the repeats.

Jörg Fröse

# Posted on December 11th 2001 by Joerg Froese

Triplets

Jorg, Glad to hear the loose forearm is helping...stay with it and the consistency will come. Thanks too for the variations, always welcome, and the cross reference to Black Mare of Fanad, which I know from the Northern Fiddler book.
Will

# Posted on December 16th 2001 by Will Harmon

A fiddler I know told me the title refers to the seven deadly sins, plus the two you love the most, thus equaling "The Nine Points of Roguery."

# Posted on March 12th 2004 by errik

Natalie McMaster...

...plays this with Ivers, I think, with the Chieftains album Tears of Stone. Called 'Fiddling Ladies' or something similar, it's the 13 minute long song. Willie Frazer is another song in the set, though the last one continues to elude me.

# Posted on January 25th 2005 by vivyenne

Actually I think it's Maire Breatnach that starts it out (Natalie McMaster has the 2nd solo with some Cape Breton stuff, while Eileen Ivers goes bezerk on The College Groves afterwards). Anyhow, here's my attempt at the dots from the Chieftain's version. They play it AA BB CC BB, or "Donegal style", as Jörg mentioned above.

X: 1
T: Nine Points Of Roguery, The
M: 4/4
L: 1/8
R: reel
K: Dmaj
S: Chieftains, Tears of Stone
|:D2 FD GEFE|DEFG ABAF|D2 FD GEFA|BE~E2 BE~E2|
|D2 FD GEFE|DEFG ABAF|D2FD GEFG|Addc d4:|
B|:~=c3 A ~B2 GB|A3B AGFE|D2 FD GEFA|BE~E2 BE~E2|
|cBAc BAGB|Adde fdAF|D2FD GEFG|Addc d3:|
|:d2 fd gefe|defg abaf|d2 fd gefa|be~e2 be~e2|
|d2 fd gefe|defg abaf|defg a3g|faeg fdd2:|
B|:~=c3 A ~B2 GB|A3B AGFE|D2 FD GEFA|BE~E2 BE~E2|
|cBAc BAGB|Adde fdAF|D2FD GEFG|Addc d3:|

# Posted on June 9th 2005 by Bleedin' Heart

Confused....

We played this tune at our session last night as AA BB CC BB AA and then moved on to the next tune, which succeeded in getting me very lost and confused. Is this the normal flow of the tune, or just a variation unique to our session?

# Posted on July 20th 2005 by Fiddlekit

Re: Fiddlekit

I think the Boys of the Lough play this song AA BB CC BB AA, which could very well be how the session players got it.

Re: the nine points being 7 deadly sins plus your 2 favorites...

That's great, I love it! However, I've also heard that the nine points of roguery are something to the effect of the opposites of the nine points of knightly virtue, those being honor, loyalty, liberality, pride, good faith, bravery, glory, unselfishness, and courtesy.

# Posted on June 2nd 2006 by septictankyank

Order of parts

I just heard Tommy Peoples' version (from High Part of the Road) of this tune for the first time in years, and it was some of the most aggressive, even violent, fiddling I've ever heard. He played the tune AA BB CC BB, and then repeated it like that once, before going into Bean an Ti Lar.

# Posted on August 7th 2006 by smw

I love listening to Matt Molloy whiz through this tune. How do you flute/whistle players play the C nat roll on the second part?

# Posted on October 13th 2008 by Greg the Piano Tuner

Not at all.

# Posted on October 13th 2008 by Kenny

@Greg t P T

C nat roll is played fingering the C nat with the two index fingers up (everything else down), closing the right index finger to play the upper note of the ornament and closing the left index finger to play the lower. Sounds good if done quickly.

# Posted on January 14th 2009 by -AP-

Full version of Black Mare of Fanad

We play the Black Mare of Fanad with friends in Seattle. They do the Nine Points of Roguery when we play in Olympia....
Anyway, they are somewhat different.
Here's the full version of Black Mare...

X: 1
T:The Black Mare of Fanad
M:C|
L:1/8
S:Donnegal
R:Reel
K:D
A, | "D" D2 FD GFED | AdAF AdAF | {DE}D2 FA "G" GFEd |"C" =cE (3EEE CE
EF | !
"D" DEFD GFED | AdAF AdAF | {DE}D2 FA "G" GFEc | dD (3DDD dDD :| !
|: B | "C" {d}C2 cA "G/B" {d} B2 BG | "Am" {Ad} A2 Ad "G/B" AGFE | "D" (
3DDD FA "G" GFEd | "C"=cE (3EEE "Am" cEEd|!
"C" =cecA "G/B" BdBG | "Am" Adcd "G/B" fdAF | "D" (3DED FA "G" GFEc |"
D" dD (3DDD dDD :| !
|: c| "D" d2 fa "C" gfec | "D" defg abaf | d2 fa "C" gfga | "Am" be (3d
fd beef| !
"D" d2 fa "C" gfec | "D" defg abaf | d2 fa "C" gfga | "Am" fage "D" fdA
:| !
B | "C" =cedA "G/B" BdBG | " Am" Adcd "G/B" fdAF | "D" {DE}D2 FA GFEd |
"C" =cE (3EEE "Am" cEEd |!
"C" (3=cdc ca "G/B" B2 BG | "Am" {B} A2 Ad "G/B" AGFE | "D" (3DED FA "G"
GFEc | "D" dD (3DDD dDDB |!
"C" [E2=c2] cA "G/B" [D2B2] BG | "Am" A2 Ad "G/B" AGFE | "D" {DE} D2 FA
"G" GFEd | "C" =cE (3EEE "Am" cEEd | !
"C" =cecA "G/B" BdBG | "Am" Adcd "D" fdAF | (3DED FA "G" GFEc | "D" dD (
3DDD dDD |]

# Posted on February 18th 2009 by jardineromi

Black Mare source

I forgot to mention.
I was told this version came from "The Northern Fiddler" book...

# Posted on February 18th 2009 by jardineromi

What are the Nine Points of Roguery?

1. deceit
2. slight of hand
3. cunning
4. influence
5. a comely face
6. upper hand
7. good natured (hint of cynicism optional)
8. loadsa style
9. perfectly ruthless (can play the bagpipe and will)

Well, I'm only guessing... Any specialist out there?

# Posted on October 28th 2010 by birlibirdie