Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
Basically was directed to an amzing night, with some very talanted players, loving the sound of the music but i was wondering if any one can direct me towards any musician who has a large cataloge of irish guitar with an advanced finger picking. I'm playng a few ragtime peices quite confidently but have to master this sound, its quite something.
Cheers for the help
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
My current moderately undiscovered favorite fingerstyle player is John Sherman. Look his up on google + "Celtic guitar" should find him for you and some sound clips. I also play fingerstyle and won't indulge in "too much" self promotion, and have a CD out of Celtic fingerstyle, but if you want to know more you can email me privately.
I love Celtic fingerstyle and find DADGAD to be the best tuning for it, though indulge in some other odd tunings on occassion. I get lost in it and "waste" lots of time playing when I should be doing other things! My house could be lots cleaner, LOL! But I have my "priorities"!
I also started as a ragtime player a long long time ago, before I had heard Celtic music.
For some really amazing players check out Tony McManus and for Breton style, Soig Siberel (sp?). Donal Clancy has a new CD on Shanachie, Masters Of Celtic Guitar" which includes many players, it's a compilation. Great CD. Donal himself does a few and he is one of the best on the CD. Randal Bays, better known for fiddle is on there, he is an amazing fingerstyle guitarist too though.
I think the movements of the thumb and finger in ragtime are a great intro into playing Celtic. If you try DADGAD I think you will find more tunes emerging from the guitar almost on their own!
I went over to England and Scotland in 1971 playing ragtime and got captivated with Celtic, some players I met there got enchanted with ragtime, we swapped tunes and techniques, and though I love ragtime, i ever really went back to it.
Have to say my ultimate idol though is John Renbourne, though he also plays other kinds of tunes, he is amazing.
Stefan Grossman's Guitar Workshop, which you can find online has many lessons on DVD by John Renbourne, I think Tony McManus, El McMeen, and many others.
What's nice about this is you can play at home alone when the mood hits, you don't have to wait until the next session!
I play totally by ear and can't seem to grasp notes or tab, but if you can read either, Stefan's DVDs come with booklets of tab and music, plus you can watch the player's fingers.
good luck.... wish there were more of "us" around!!
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
I strongly recommend John Doyle (remember Solas?), a genius guitarist who not only does it all, he even teaches it, and has made a CD thingy summarizing his method with both notes and recordings.
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
Martin Simpson sings more than he plays tunes, but he does play tunes and has a very nice style utilizing the "harp effect" extensively. Iris mentioned John Renbourn. He is a master of exploiting different tunings to get the right effect for a tune. For sheer technical mastery, it's hard to beat Tony McManus ("The best Celtic guitarist in the world" - John Renbourn). He's also a grandmaster of flat pick playing.
I think all of the above have instructional material and/or transcriptions available.
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
Pete.... so right, I almost never fingerpick *tunes* at a session, too soft... but I do fingerpick for backing too, and get quite a lot of volume with the thumbpick and index fingernail. So if you develop a good attack to where you are heard, finger backing can really compliment the music quite well without being overbearing. It can be very melodic, though many do prefer to flatpick. Some people fingerpick and flatpick at the same time, like Donal Clancy. Very interesting!
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
Yes, if you are fingerpicking while holding a flatpick between thumb and first finger, that's what the country pickers call "Chicken-picking ".
I'm well out of practice at it, but it's a useful technique, you have the plectrum ready to do whatever you need while still keeping that finger-picking sound gong.
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
I’ve heard that’s required technique in the Nashville studios, Pete, so they can switch between fingerpicking and flatpicking instantaneously. But I always thought “chicken picking” referred to another technique, where the pick is held with the fingertip and thumbtip very close to the tip of the pick so the nails contact the string just before the pick does, giving a sound reminiscent of a chicken’s cluck (if you have a vivid barnyard imagination). It’s similar to the plucky sound that some clawhammer banjo players get.
Hmmm, after a quick google, I now have three different definitions of “chicken picking.” We must get to the bottom of this!
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
I sez to myself, if yer frustrated with multiple names for the same thing, and the same thing with multiple names, yer in the wrong music, boyo.
I’m with Bob himself. The plectrum/fingerstyle combo technique is amazing in skilled hands, but I’ve never heard it called “chicken pickin” Always took chicken pickin to mean a thumb&fingertip/pick attack to the strings, a slight artificial pinch harmonic, with lots of string bending. I’m thinking James Burton popularized this style when he played with Elvis.
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
I stand corrected. Burton did not popularize the style "when he played with Elvis". According to "Elvis Presley: Authentic record transcriptions" by Fred Sokolow, Mr. Burton's chicken pickin gained wide notice with his work with Buck Owens and Merle Haggard in the early 60's .
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
but can't one strum with the thumbpick too.... i do give a strum with it now and then..... i just don't get the chicken picking thing or whatever..... just rely so heavily on that index finger. Guess the flatpick is way more flexible as a rule and a more desireable sound for true flatpicking though, or easier if you primarily flatpick and just use the fingers occassionally.
I was mind-boggled the first time I saw that. Donal Clancy was doing it...I asked him afterwards about it. tried it....can't adapt to it at all!
Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
Basically was directed to an amzing night, with some very talanted players, loving the sound of the music but i was wondering if any one can direct me towards any musician who has a large cataloge of irish guitar with an advanced finger picking. I'm playng a few ragtime peices quite confidently but have to master this sound, its quite something.
Cheers for the help
# Posted on April 2nd 2006 by johnblack
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
Arty McGlynn is a great tune picker there are many others but I dont remember the names
# Posted on April 2nd 2006 by Ripthecalico
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
http://www.thesession.org/recordings/display/1292
http://www.thesession.org/recordings/display/1586
Recommend these, although Pat Kilbride plays cittern and not just guitar.
# Posted on April 2nd 2006 by Kenny
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
My current moderately undiscovered favorite fingerstyle player is John Sherman. Look his up on google + "Celtic guitar" should find him for you and some sound clips. I also play fingerstyle and won't indulge in "too much" self promotion, and have a CD out of Celtic fingerstyle, but if you want to know more you can email me privately.
I love Celtic fingerstyle and find DADGAD to be the best tuning for it, though indulge in some other odd tunings on occassion. I get lost in it and "waste" lots of time playing when I should be doing other things! My house could be lots cleaner, LOL! But I have my "priorities"!
I also started as a ragtime player a long long time ago, before I had heard Celtic music.
For some really amazing players check out Tony McManus and for Breton style, Soig Siberel (sp?). Donal Clancy has a new CD on Shanachie, Masters Of Celtic Guitar" which includes many players, it's a compilation. Great CD. Donal himself does a few and he is one of the best on the CD. Randal Bays, better known for fiddle is on there, he is an amazing fingerstyle guitarist too though.
I think the movements of the thumb and finger in ragtime are a great intro into playing Celtic. If you try DADGAD I think you will find more tunes emerging from the guitar almost on their own!
I went over to England and Scotland in 1971 playing ragtime and got captivated with Celtic, some players I met there got enchanted with ragtime, we swapped tunes and techniques, and though I love ragtime, i ever really went back to it.
Have to say my ultimate idol though is John Renbourne, though he also plays other kinds of tunes, he is amazing.
Stefan Grossman's Guitar Workshop, which you can find online has many lessons on DVD by John Renbourne, I think Tony McManus, El McMeen, and many others.
What's nice about this is you can play at home alone when the mood hits, you don't have to wait until the next session!
I play totally by ear and can't seem to grasp notes or tab, but if you can read either, Stefan's DVDs come with booklets of tab and music, plus you can watch the player's fingers.
good luck.... wish there were more of "us" around!!
iris nevins
# Posted on April 2nd 2006 by irisnevins
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
I strongly recommend John Doyle (remember Solas?), a genius guitarist who not only does it all, he even teaches it, and has made a CD thingy summarizing his method with both notes and recordings.
# Posted on April 2nd 2006 by Charmion
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
Yes... and John Doyle is on the Clancy Compilation too I believe.
# Posted on April 2nd 2006 by irisnevins
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
The worst thing about it is that it's very much a solo/arranged style, you'ld be inaudible in a session....
# Posted on April 2nd 2006 by Guernsey Pete
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
Martin Simpson sings more than he plays tunes, but he does play tunes and has a very nice style utilizing the "harp effect" extensively. Iris mentioned John Renbourn. He is a master of exploiting different tunings to get the right effect for a tune. For sheer technical mastery, it's hard to beat Tony McManus ("The best Celtic guitarist in the world" - John Renbourn). He's also a grandmaster of flat pick playing.
I think all of the above have instructional material and/or transcriptions available.
# Posted on April 2nd 2006 by Bob himself
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
Pete.... so right, I almost never fingerpick *tunes* at a session, too soft... but I do fingerpick for backing too, and get quite a lot of volume with the thumbpick and index fingernail. So if you develop a good attack to where you are heard, finger backing can really compliment the music quite well without being overbearing. It can be very melodic, though many do prefer to flatpick. Some people fingerpick and flatpick at the same time, like Donal Clancy. Very interesting!
# Posted on April 3rd 2006 by irisnevins
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
Yes, if you are fingerpicking while holding a flatpick between thumb and first finger, that's what the country pickers call "Chicken-picking ".
I'm well out of practice at it, but it's a useful technique, you have the plectrum ready to do whatever you need while still keeping that finger-picking sound gong.
# Posted on April 3rd 2006 by Guernsey Pete
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
"Gong"! ..going......always proof-read before posting !
# Posted on April 3rd 2006 by Guernsey Pete
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
I’ve heard that’s required technique in the Nashville studios, Pete, so they can switch between fingerpicking and flatpicking instantaneously. But I always thought “chicken picking” referred to another technique, where the pick is held with the fingertip and thumbtip very close to the tip of the pick so the nails contact the string just before the pick does, giving a sound reminiscent of a chicken’s cluck (if you have a vivid barnyard imagination). It’s similar to the plucky sound that some clawhammer banjo players get.
Hmmm, after a quick google, I now have three different definitions of “chicken picking.” We must get to the bottom of this!
# Posted on April 3rd 2006 by Bob himself
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
Richard Thompson is the man when it comes to chicken picking.
# Posted on April 3rd 2006 by dafydd
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
But which chicken picking, dafydd?
# Posted on April 3rd 2006 by Bob himself
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
I sez to myself, if yer frustrated with multiple names for the same thing, and the same thing with multiple names, yer in the wrong music, boyo.
I’m with Bob himself. The plectrum/fingerstyle combo technique is amazing in skilled hands, but I’ve never heard it called “chicken pickin” Always took chicken pickin to mean a thumb&fingertip/pick attack to the strings, a slight artificial pinch harmonic, with lots of string bending. I’m thinking James Burton popularized this style when he played with Elvis.
# Posted on April 3rd 2006 by fidkid
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
Er, “frustrated with multiple names for the same thing, and multiple things with the same name”. Guess I wasn’t listening too closely to myself.
# Posted on April 3rd 2006 by fidkid
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
Did James Burton play with Elvis? I remember that he played with Ricky Nelson, dunno about Elvis.
# Posted on April 3rd 2006 by Bob himself
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
Oh, I see (having googled for the truth). JB played with Elvis starting in the late sixties. I had pretty much given up on Elvis by the mid sixties.
# Posted on April 3rd 2006 by Bob himself
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
Yeah, his life's arc is pretty sad, in the end.
# Posted on April 4th 2006 by fidkid
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
I stand corrected. Burton did not popularize the style "when he played with Elvis". According to "Elvis Presley: Authentic record transcriptions" by Fred Sokolow, Mr. Burton's chicken pickin gained wide notice with his work with Buck Owens and Merle Haggard in the early 60's .
# Posted on April 4th 2006 by fidkid
Re: Newbie at the irish folk guitar suggestions welcome...
but can't one strum with the thumbpick too.... i do give a strum with it now and then..... i just don't get the chicken picking thing or whatever..... just rely so heavily on that index finger. Guess the flatpick is way more flexible as a rule and a more desireable sound for true flatpicking though, or easier if you primarily flatpick and just use the fingers occassionally.
I was mind-boggled the first time I saw that. Donal Clancy was doing it...I asked him afterwards about it. tried it....can't adapt to it at all!
# Posted on April 4th 2006 by irisnevins