Im 14 years old and when i go to a session in a pub, i always have the feeling that people are looking to "grass" me up, for being underage. In a certain pub in Ireland that i went to, they asked me to leave early due to being caught with a person under 18 previously. Do you think these laws are neccasary? It is stopping me from being able to enjoy what music is all about. I know these laws are only in Ireland, but that is where the best sessions are!
Thanks
Hey fluter, I see you live in London, so just to put the record straight, it is widely recognised that the phenomenon, we all know & love today, the Pub Session, actually originated in London.
Some of the best of the earliest ITM recordings came out of London.
Some of the finest ITM players live, or have lived, or regularly pass through & session - in London.
So if you are allowed to session to your hearts content, at your age, in London, then you should count your blessings.
Many folks who visit this site would have to travel hundreds of miles to get to a session.
14 yrs old! You lucky blighter - it's all in front of you - ENJOY!
"that is where the best sessions are" - so what are you going to do?
so don't just sit whingeing about it - DO something.
Get a good session going somewhere that you are allowed. Invite people to your home, perhaps. We have heard from people here who have sessions in kitchens, parks, workplaces, cafés, beaches - someone was telling us on this site the other week about a regular session on a bus!
And - yes, I do think the laws are necessary. Sadly the law is a rather blunt instrument, but it's what we've got
But i've noticed that all of the people who say that are adults :(
I have learnt the best tunes from pub sessions in Ireland. Believe me, i have tried to start sessions up in the middle of streets!!
Keep on trying, Fluter. You will make it if you're good enough!
I've seen with my own eyes many really good young musicians at sessions in great pubs in Ennis and Westport, so it can be done. Maybe you should aim at the earlier, afternoon sessions? I guess in London you'll have a range wide enough to choose from.
Ah - I see what you're doing wrong Fluter: Try at the side of the street, instead of in the middle.
If ever you're up our way we welcome children in our pub session - but they are required to be out at 9pm. There was a little girl about 9 playing fiddle with us the other week. Great.
"But i've noticed that all of the people who say that are adults"
The french have a proverb "Si jeunesse savait. Si viellesse pouvait".
For a picture of world with no adult laws read Lord of the Flies.
And don't worry Fluter - when you're as old as I am, you can be just as annoyingly patronising as I am. (But there'll be a lot of other things that you can do when you're young that you won't be able to do when you're as old as I am.)
Seriously though - good luck with finding some session contentment.
Fluter are you a boy or a girl? Because if you're a girl what you need to do is wear more make-up to make you look older. Try having a baby or 2 and start smoking, then you'll look really old, but if you bring your babies you'll have to leave them outside.
"...what you need to do is wear more make-up to make you look older. Try having a baby or 2 and start smoking, then you'll look really old..." are these the secrets of your success, Dow?
What's this, pick on Dow day?!
I can only see 8 tuning pegs on that machine, so it's probably a zouk, but it looks as though it has extra low frets for the bottom courses, or are my eyes going funny. It's certainly very interessant-looking on close inspection.
My bus looks almost exactly like this http://www.bussalesonline.com.au/photos_Toyota_Coaster_Mini_Bus_295.htm but it has dirty curtains inside, a stone guard on the windscreen and a (very very hard indeed) metal tow bar on the back, which is fortunate because there was this one time I reversed the bus into a lamppost, with the customers inside (the bus, not the lamppost), and they were laughing at me, the bastards, but anyway we don't talk about that.
According to the Essex Police website and others you are legally allowed to go into a pub at 14 as long as you don't drink alcohol, have someone buy it for you or have alcohol on you. But bear in mind the landlord has the right to decide whether to let you in or not. If it's other punters giving you the evil eye then they're probably just jealous (as long as you leave off the booze!)
Legal Age
AGE 13
You can be employed for a certain number of hours a week
AGE 14
You can go to the pub, but you cannot drink or buy alcohol
You are responsible for wearing a seat belt
AGE 16
You can buy cigarettes or tobacco
You can leave school
You can choose your own doctor
You can claim social security benefit
You can work full time
You can leave home with your parents’ consent
You can get married with one parent’s consent
You can drink wine or beer with a meal in a restaurant
You can hold a licence to drive a moped
You can buy a ticket in the National Lottery
AGE 17
You can hold a licence to drive any vehicle except certain heavy ones
You can engage in street trading
You can purchase an air rifle
You can leave home without your parents’ consent
AGE 18
You can appear before adult courts
You can get married without your parents’ consent
You can vote
You can act as an executor of a person’s will
You can bet
You can buy fireworks
You can change your name
You can apply for a passport
You can own houses and land
You can apply for a mortgage
You can go abroad to sing, play or perform professionally
You can sit on a jury
You can be a blood donor
You can buy alcohol
You can drink alcohol in a pub
You can hold a licence to sell alcohol
Completely of topic, but an interesting coincidence - The fellow in the photo in the photo with the mandolin (not the 'Sister', as I believe they call that instrument in Sverige) is someone I was put in touch with because he's one of the few people here in Portugal who plays Irish music. I've only ever spoken to him on the phone. Now I know what he looks like - so, thanks, Ptarmigan.
In fact, now I think about it, he's a member of this site - I won't reveal his true (session) identity without his approval.
Careful now Quirl, don't go off topic, whatever you do, or you will upset young 'Mr Straight & Narrow' - bodhran2112!
But seriously, that's fascinating.
It sounds like an unusual combination alright, Portugese & Swedish music.
That Nordic Mandola sounds great too, especially on the 'Linda Rosa' track.
It's one of the joys of visiting this site, I think.
You come in looking for something & leave with a whole bunch of other stuff!
I guess, when you think about it, thesession.org is a bit like an ITM, ideas & information, Supermarket!
I have already E-Mailed Simon to find out more about that Nordic Mandola but perhaps, in the meantime, your friend Sverige will weigh in with some info on it?
got a feeling that the "french accordion moustache" is pure ironic swedish sense of humour... I knew exactly what kind of music they meant when described like that, but I wouldn't be able to explain it to anyone else...
Just like all of you know the "swedish" hurdi-flurdi-gurdi-hurdistuff, we've got different "sounds" associated with other counctries. Accordions and France is one of these. Like Norway and Cowbells. Or Scotland and Kevin Costner's voice.....
By the way if you want to see the real Swedish Chef in action, IKEA has him on their website at the moment, cooking meatballs. And the story behind how he ended up in the Muppet Show as well...
Hello Jennie, engaged to a Scotsman eh? My German wife married a Scotsman, have you met fiddling American Deborah, St. Andrews way - also married to a Scotsman, Nick. Guess it must be true what they say about us Scotsmen eh?
I notice from your bio - "...and playing whistle. Well, trying hard at least... It's not a native instrument in Sweden really..." There is a theory that the Vikings actually brought Whistles, along with Pan Pipes, to Scotland & Ireland, so what have you guys been doing with them up there, since then?
We actually had a young Swedish fiddle playing student staying with us for three months, couple of years back. She wasn't amused by my imitation of the Swedish Chef either...........
Well, we might have made the whistles longer and used them to support us when skiing or as hockey sticks, and look where that brought us... Lots of Olympic medals...!
The Nordic Mandola is a development of the "CBOM" family of instruments by Swedish luthiers Ådin and Ekvall (http://www.luthiers.nu/) in collaboration whith Ale Möller (the Swedish multiinstrumentalist who among others, work whith Aly Bain). It has longer string length on the bass courses and
you use pinpoint capos a lot.
Cister (or may be it is spelled Sister?) is more or less the Swedish word for Cittern.....so its not a "sister" that he plays.
Yes, the bone whistles might have been brougth to Ireland by Vikings. At least similar instruments have been found in both areas. The only whistle-like instruments to have survived in Swedish folk music in modern time is a very primitive wooden whistle called spilopipa, usually tuned in minor. Otherwise we've had very little flutes in our tradition. Henrik Norbeck has written an essay about it, which I think can be found on his website.
And last the Swedish chef:
The correct translation of "huuurdy, fluuurdy, guuurdy, spluuurdy" ought to be (more or less) "huuurdy, fluuurdy, guuurdy, spluuurdy".
As for Viking bone whistles, we have a couple, but not originals of course, made for us by Lindsay Porteous of Culross, Fife. Amazing the music you can get from a simple piece of Deer leg bone, isn't it?
Sorry, Ptarmigan, but I don't recognise Nanna, unless she is the girl from Gotland who plays whistle and harp - but she holds a fiddle on the picture. But you're right - the ITM scene here is very small.
Yes, that seems to be some kind of spilopipa. There are several regional versions.
I use to make most of the instruments that I play on, but I have still not made a bone whistle. But it's kind of easy. Drill some holes and file a labium in the bone - make a fippleblock of bees wax! I'll make me one some day.
"Is it true that the swedish chef was called the norweigan chef in the swedish version of The Muppets?"
No, no, no!
But as a kid I always wondered how the americans could think that swedish sounded like that
grow some facial hair if you can this may help if anyone asks how old you are say im 21 so stop taking the pi** I cant help it if i have a genetic disease that stops me ageing fast like you ye old fart
If you decide to take MacThewife's advice, this info might interest you:
When he died in 1927, the beard of Hans Langseth of Norway, was measured at - 17 & 1/2 feet.
Hans Langseth's beard can now be seen at the Smithsonian Institution.
Children in pubs
Children in pubs
Im 14 years old and when i go to a session in a pub, i always have the feeling that people are looking to "grass" me up, for being underage. In a certain pub in Ireland that i went to, they asked me to leave early due to being caught with a person under 18 previously. Do you think these laws are neccasary? It is stopping me from being able to enjoy what music is all about. I know these laws are only in Ireland, but that is where the best sessions are!
Thanks
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by fluter
Re: Children in pubs
Hey fluter, I see you live in London, so just to put the record straight, it is widely recognised that the phenomenon, we all know & love today, the Pub Session, actually originated in London.
Some of the best of the earliest ITM recordings came out of London.
Some of the finest ITM players live, or have lived, or regularly pass through & session - in London.
So if you are allowed to session to your hearts content, at your age, in London, then you should count your blessings.
Many folks who visit this site would have to travel hundreds of miles to get to a session.
14 yrs old! You lucky blighter - it's all in front of you - ENJOY!
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: Children in pubs
And smoke free too!
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Newty
Re: Children in pubs
"that is where the best sessions are" - so what are you going to do?
so don't just sit whingeing about it - DO something.
Get a good session going somewhere that you are allowed. Invite people to your home, perhaps. We have heard from people here who have sessions in kitchens, parks, workplaces, cafés, beaches - someone was telling us on this site the other week about a regular session on a bus!
And - yes, I do think the laws are necessary. Sadly the law is a rather blunt instrument, but it's what we've got
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by showaddydadito
Re: Children in pubs
But i've noticed that all of the people who say that are adults :(
I have learnt the best tunes from pub sessions in Ireland. Believe me, i have tried to start sessions up in the middle of streets!!
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by fluter
Re: Children in pubs
Children are stupid and should be banned worldwide.
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Dow
Re: Children in pubs
Yeah Showy the session on the bus was great until Dow crashed it.
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Newty
Re: Children in pubs
Keep on trying, Fluter. You will make it if you're good enough!
I've seen with my own eyes many really good young musicians at sessions in great pubs in Ennis and Westport, so it can be done. Maybe you should aim at the earlier, afternoon sessions? I guess in London you'll have a range wide enough to choose from.
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Barfly
Re: Children in pubs
Ah - I see what you're doing wrong Fluter: Try at the side of the street, instead of in the middle.
If ever you're up our way we welcome children in our pub session - but they are required to be out at 9pm. There was a little girl about 9 playing fiddle with us the other week. Great.
"But i've noticed that all of the people who say that are adults"
The french have a proverb "Si jeunesse savait. Si viellesse pouvait".
For a picture of world with no adult laws read Lord of the Flies.
And don't worry Fluter - when you're as old as I am, you can be just as annoyingly patronising as I am. (But there'll be a lot of other things that you can do when you're young that you won't be able to do when you're as old as I am.)
Seriously though - good luck with finding some session contentment.
Dave
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by showaddydadito
Re: Children in pubs
fluter, try to put on fake moustaches
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by gian marco
Re: Children in pubs
Fluter are you a boy or a girl? Because if you're a girl what you need to do is wear more make-up to make you look older. Try having a baby or 2 and start smoking, then you'll look really old, but if you bring your babies you'll have to leave them outside.
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Dow
Re: Children in pubs
The guy on the left is only 15 but he looks much older - with that fake moustache, doesn't he?
http://www.svartkaffe.com/
Incidentally, does anyone know what kind of 'machine' the dude on the right is playing?
10 string Mandolin or odd shaped Cittern perhaps?
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: Children in pubs
"...what you need to do is wear more make-up to make you look older. Try having a baby or 2 and start smoking, then you'll look really old..." are these the secrets of your success, Dow?
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: Children in pubs
Looks like the bumper off Dows bus.
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Newty
Re: Children in pubs
Is this what you were looking for Dow?
http://www.wolfsburgwest.com/wolfsburg_new/bumpers/bus_bumper/bump_bolt_kit.cfm
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: Children in pubs
What's this, pick on Dow day?!
I can only see 8 tuning pegs on that machine, so it's probably a zouk, but it looks as though it has extra low frets for the bottom courses, or are my eyes going funny. It's certainly very interessant-looking on close inspection.
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Dow
Re: Children in pubs
Anyone here speak Swedish? Is so, perhaps they'll translate the huuurdy, fluuurdy, guuurdy, spluuurdy 'Muppet Speak' for us?
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: Children in pubs
My bus looks almost exactly like this http://www.bussalesonline.com.au/photos_Toyota_Coaster_Mini_Bus_295.htm but it has dirty curtains inside, a stone guard on the windscreen and a (very very hard indeed) metal tow bar on the back, which is fortunate because there was this one time I reversed the bus into a lamppost, with the customers inside (the bus, not the lamppost), and they were laughing at me, the bastards, but anyway we don't talk about that.
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Dow
Re: Children in pubs
According to the Essex Police website and others you are legally allowed to go into a pub at 14 as long as you don't drink alcohol, have someone buy it for you or have alcohol on you. But bear in mind the landlord has the right to decide whether to let you in or not. If it's other punters giving you the evil eye then they're probably just jealous (as long as you leave off the booze!)
Legal Age
AGE 13
You can be employed for a certain number of hours a week
AGE 14
You can go to the pub, but you cannot drink or buy alcohol
You are responsible for wearing a seat belt
AGE 16
You can buy cigarettes or tobacco
You can leave school
You can choose your own doctor
You can claim social security benefit
You can work full time
You can leave home with your parents’ consent
You can get married with one parent’s consent
You can drink wine or beer with a meal in a restaurant
You can hold a licence to drive a moped
You can buy a ticket in the National Lottery
AGE 17
You can hold a licence to drive any vehicle except certain heavy ones
You can engage in street trading
You can purchase an air rifle
You can leave home without your parents’ consent
AGE 18
You can appear before adult courts
You can get married without your parents’ consent
You can vote
You can act as an executor of a person’s will
You can bet
You can buy fireworks
You can change your name
You can apply for a passport
You can own houses and land
You can apply for a mortgage
You can go abroad to sing, play or perform professionally
You can sit on a jury
You can be a blood donor
You can buy alcohol
You can drink alcohol in a pub
You can hold a licence to sell alcohol
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Compo
Re: Children in pubs
Whereas:
"The Leith police dismisseth thee,
The Leith police dismisseth us."
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: Swedish Site
Ptarmigan, that Swedish site has an English option on the top right hand corner. The instrument translates as "nordic mandola"
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Strathfoyle
Re: Children in pubs
Dog bless yer young eyes Strathfoyle. Thanks
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: Children in pubs
I tried the translated version.
I'm not sure it didn't give more questions than answers.
What is a "french accordion moustache" ?
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by showaddydadito
Re: Children in pubs
Surely a 'Tin Sandwich' showaddy i.e. Harmonica?
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: Children in pubs
Here's another photo of that - 'Nordic Mandola':
http://www.ardosia.com.pt/simonsergio.htm
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: Children in pubs
Completely of topic, but an interesting coincidence - The fellow in the photo in the photo with the mandolin (not the 'Sister', as I believe they call that instrument in Sverige) is someone I was put in touch with because he's one of the few people here in Portugal who plays Irish music. I've only ever spoken to him on the phone. Now I know what he looks like - so, thanks, Ptarmigan.
In fact, now I think about it, he's a member of this site - I won't reveal his true (session) identity without his approval.
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by ragaman
Re: Children in pubs
Careful now Quirl, don't go off topic, whatever you do, or you will upset young 'Mr Straight & Narrow' - bodhran2112!
But seriously, that's fascinating.
It sounds like an unusual combination alright, Portugese & Swedish music.
That Nordic Mandola sounds great too, especially on the 'Linda Rosa' track.
It's one of the joys of visiting this site, I think.
You come in looking for something & leave with a whole bunch of other stuff!
I guess, when you think about it, thesession.org is a bit like an ITM, ideas & information, Supermarket!
I have already E-Mailed Simon to find out more about that Nordic Mandola but perhaps, in the meantime, your friend Sverige will weigh in with some info on it?
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: Children in pubs
got a feeling that the "french accordion moustache" is pure ironic swedish sense of humour... I knew exactly what kind of music they meant when described like that, but I wouldn't be able to explain it to anyone else...
Just like all of you know the "swedish" hurdi-flurdi-gurdi-hurdistuff, we've got different "sounds" associated with other counctries. Accordions and France is one of these. Like Norway and Cowbells. Or Scotland and Kevin Costner's voice.....
By the way if you want to see the real Swedish Chef in action, IKEA has him on their website at the moment, cooking meatballs. And the story behind how he ended up in the Muppet Show as well...
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by jennie
Re: Children in pubs
Hello Jennie, engaged to a Scotsman eh? My German wife married a Scotsman, have you met fiddling American Deborah, St. Andrews way - also married to a Scotsman, Nick. Guess it must be true what they say about us Scotsmen eh?
I notice from your bio - "...and playing whistle. Well, trying hard at least... It's not a native instrument in Sweden really..." There is a theory that the Vikings actually brought Whistles, along with Pan Pipes, to Scotland & Ireland, so what have you guys been doing with them up there, since then?
We actually had a young Swedish fiddle playing student staying with us for three months, couple of years back. She wasn't amused by my imitation of the Swedish Chef either...........
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: Children in pubs
Shes Swedish - what do you think they've been doing with them?
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Newty
Re: Children in pubs
I don't know Nigel, I just can't imagine. Can you enlighten me & send some drawings, or better still, photographs?
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: Children in pubs
Unfortunatly not. Quick Ptarmy find a link before Jeremy gets in from work.
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Newty
Re: Children in pubs
Oh, that was low... but not unexpected...
Well, we might have made the whistles longer and used them to support us when skiing or as hockey sticks, and look where that brought us... Lots of Olympic medals...!
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by jennie
Re: Children in pubs
Aw your agood sport Jennie - have a word with Dow.
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Newty
Nordic Mandolas and Swedish Chefs....
The Nordic Mandola is a development of the "CBOM" family of instruments by Swedish luthiers Ådin and Ekvall (http://www.luthiers.nu/) in collaboration whith Ale Möller (the Swedish multiinstrumentalist who among others, work whith Aly Bain). It has longer string length on the bass courses and
you use pinpoint capos a lot.
Cister (or may be it is spelled Sister?) is more or less the Swedish word for Cittern.....so its not a "sister" that he plays.
Yes, the bone whistles might have been brougth to Ireland by Vikings. At least similar instruments have been found in both areas. The only whistle-like instruments to have survived in Swedish folk music in modern time is a very primitive wooden whistle called spilopipa, usually tuned in minor. Otherwise we've had very little flutes in our tradition. Henrik Norbeck has written an essay about it, which I think can be found on his website.
And last the Swedish chef:
The correct translation of "huuurdy, fluuurdy, guuurdy, spluuurdy" ought to be (more or less) "huuurdy, fluuurdy, guuurdy, spluuurdy".
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by lars
Re: Children in pubs
Hello Lars, as your ITM scene is so small, perhaps you know Nanna, see photo at foot of this page: http://www.causewaymusic.co.uk/primary.html
That Mandola of Simon's does look elegent.
As for Viking bone whistles, we have a couple, but not originals of course, made for us by Lindsay Porteous of Culross, Fife. Amazing the music you can get from a simple piece of Deer leg bone, isn't it?
Is the wooden recorder like instrument in this photo a Spilopipa? I have not heard of them before!
http://www.rfod.se/fmk/detail.asp?lang=sw&nr=882
# Posted on February 24th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: Children in pubs
Sorry, Ptarmigan, but I don't recognise Nanna, unless she is the girl from Gotland who plays whistle and harp - but she holds a fiddle on the picture. But you're right - the ITM scene here is very small.
Yes, that seems to be some kind of spilopipa. There are several regional versions.
I use to make most of the instruments that I play on, but I have still not made a bone whistle. But it's kind of easy. Drill some holes and file a labium in the bone - make a fippleblock of bees wax! I'll make me one some day.
# Posted on February 25th 2006 by lars
Re: Children in pubs
Is it true that the swedish chef was called the norweigan chef in the swedish version of The Muppets?
# Posted on February 25th 2006 by kjay_bc_box
Re: Children in pubs
Hey kjay, what does an Auzzie Chef sound like?
Surely just - "huuurdy, fluuurdy, guuurdy, spluuurdy" but with each word rising in pitch at the end?
But wait a minute, that's exactly how the Swedish Chef sounds!
I guess though, that the Auzzie Chef's head would actually also go up at the end of each word, like he was watching a Kangaroo going past?
# Posted on February 25th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Norwegian chef?
"Is it true that the swedish chef was called the norweigan chef in the swedish version of The Muppets?"
No, no, no!
But as a kid I always wondered how the americans could think that swedish sounded like that
# Posted on February 25th 2006 by lars
Re: Children in pubs
Hey, why not take a trip down memory lane:
http://www.almac.co.uk/chef/chef/picsound/picsound.html
&
http://www.thesession.org/tunes/display/417
# Posted on February 25th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: Children in pubs
grow some facial hair if you can this may help if anyone asks how old you are say im 21 so stop taking the pi** I cant help it if i have a genetic disease that stops me ageing fast like you ye old fart
# Posted on February 26th 2006 by Ripthecalico
Re: Children in pubs
If you decide to take MacThewife's advice, this info might interest you:
When he died in 1927, the beard of Hans Langseth of Norway, was measured at - 17 & 1/2 feet.
Hans Langseth's beard can now be seen at the Smithsonian Institution.
Currently the longest beard belonging to a living person is that of Shamsher Singh of India.
His beard last measured in at 6 feet.
http://www.guinnessworldrecords.com/content_pages/record.asp?recordid=48565
In case you are female:
What is the longest beard in the world for a female?
With the longest hair in her beard measuring 11 inches - 27.9 cm., Vivian Wheeler of Illinois is blessed with having the longest beard for a female.
Her father insisted she start shaving at the age of 7, but since 1993 Vivian Wheeler has not, letting her beard grow.
See her here:
http://thelongestlistofthelongeststuffatthelongestdomainnameatlonglast.com/long98.html
Here’s what growing a beard looks like - weird or what:
http://members.aol.com/beardguy/beardvideo.htm
# Posted on February 26th 2006 by Ptarmigan