Just today received Gerry O'Connor's 2004 cd, "Journeyman" -- absolutely lovely stuff, and as Gerry's brother Peter (who posts here upon occasion) says in the recordings section of this site, the cost of the cd is recouped in the first track of jaw-dropping, staggeringly lovely playing. (You can hear some clips of the album on Gerry's website at http://gerryoconnor.net/journeyman.html. I *love* this album and highly recommend it.
(I'd love to hear a whole cd of Gerry playing unaccompanied some day in the future -- I first heard him play live at a feis here in Colorado, where four stages of stepdancers had NO trouble finding and dancing to the beat of his lone fiddle, and anyone who has ever watched dancers stepdance to a lone fiddler who can't match Gerry's playing will appreciate exactly what I'm saying here.)
The thing that I really love about "Journeyman" is that, going through the tracks, Gerry traces the major influences on his playing; the liner notes give full credit and due to the musicians that he's learned from through his life. On first listening, I really enjoyed looking at the liner notes and trying to discern how Gerry's musician friends and teachers influenced what he was playing and how he played them.
Most of us (and I'm finally getting to the point here, sorry) can point to certain influences on our playing and many of us can even explain how they've affected our playing style. I'd love to hear some musings from everyone as to their influences, what it's done (or not done) for their own playing style, whether these things are conscious or not, whether you decide to incorporate a style thing from your influences or just pick them up all wil-he-nil-he, etc. Any takers?
(Thanks, btw, Peter O'Connor, for the bow washing tip, passed it on to a friend who tried it last month and is very happy with the results. )
Ian Hardie, my first teacher was a big influence on my technique, he taught me how to hammer, and a lot about sticking tunes together etc.
Angus R Grant of Shooglenifty fame, was a massive influence on my playing style around the time I was 14, he plays with an incredible swing and I just loved his playing. I've never even met him but the playing on the shoogle albums greatly influenced me. That swing is still (I hope) quite apparent in my playing.
Anna Massie, an incredible all round musician, virtuoso on several instruments including madolin, fiddle, guitar, has influenced me. we're the same age and I've known her through fiddling since we were 8. She chose the path of music long before me, took me a while to realise that i wanted the same thing, and after seeing her success, hearing her incredible first album etc, I did chose. So thanks to her. Picked up the guitar about a year ago now and shes my only influence really. I get the occasional tip from her!
Discovered some of the great Irish (fiddle) players about 2 or 3 years ago. Firstly, Winifred Horan of Solas, so her great and sporadic tripletting influenced mine. Then Martin Hayes, his other style of sporadic tripletting rubbed off. There are countless others, but those are the few I can explain right now.
Although he's not really considered an Irish flutist, my original influence was Chris Norman. Back when I took lessons from him when I was about 10 years old or so, all I had ever played was classical music, and it was from him that I realized that there was life outside of the classical stuff. Granted I didn't start playing ITM until several years after my lessons with him ended, but he planted that seed in my conscious.
Now that I've gotten into the music, I would have to go with Paul McGrattan as my main influence. He just has that raw style of playing that I think Irish flute playing should be. Nothing frilly or too pulse-less, just a nice driving style. Do I try to play like him? I don't think I necessarily do, but I do try to match my philosophy with how his playing sounds. I avoid short breathy phrases typical of some styles, stay relatively true to the tunes, and try to really just dig into the notes and keep the sound solid.
I’m sure my playing of Irish tunes is influenced, willy-nilly, by some decidedly non-Irish sources, but the ones closer to the tradition would be
Paddy Moloney, Aly Bain, Cathal McConnell – the earliest influences that stuck
Dolores Keane - her singing has influenced my playing and my shower singing – the way the flow of her voice and the ornaments wring a powerful story out of the tune even when I can’t understand the words – also true for Aly Bain
Kevin Burke – of course
Moira Nelligan - a very talented friend in Atlanta – the first person I saw up close playing authentic Irish fiddle – unwittingly introduced me to fiddle crans
There are others, but these people helped sink the soul of the music into my head and heart. Whether it comes out in my playing is an entirely different question, but the bulk of how I *want* it to sound came from them.
Well there are a couple to be named here. I will have to name my biggest two influences (speaking as a Flute player). First, the one who influenced my ornamentation the most would probably be Kevin Crawford as I do like to use a lot of triplets, plus the fact that I also play (well not any more really) GHBs I just use more ornaments in general, but usually in a Crawford-esque style. Secondly, Tom Doorley has influenced my sound more as even though I prefer a smaller bored Rudall Flute I like to have the power and presence that he has, yes this does mean I have to push the Flute a lot to be loud.
I was going to cite all of my GHB teachers from when I was a teenager. . . like Avery I find a lot of the skills and ideas from that translate over to my flute playing. But I don't think I ornament a whole bunch. . . only in very particular spots.
As far as flute players go, some of the other players who I meet up with once or twice a month in sessions have probably had the most direct influence. I can't think of a single "famous" player who I consciously strive to sound like in general. It depends on the tune - if I got it from a Lunasa CD, than clearly the influence will be McGoldrick or Crawford. If I got it from a piping CD, then maybe David Power. I haven't been playing long enough to develop a distinct style yet. Or at least a mature one.
First and foremost - Mr. Donogh H., whose powerful bashing was the first thing I encountered and - for better and worse - became a foundation of my style. Even though I like to think I'm playing much lighter now, I still inherited the liking for broken chords and strange progressions.
Then, John Doyle.
Then, Antoine, a great guitar player from Paris.
Recently, Mark Kelly. He actually was the one who showed me that playing melody is much easier than I expected. In consequence, he pushed me towards Nicolas Quemener, but that is an influence I'm just starting to explore.
In a way, all these were conscious influences. As well as dozens of others, whom I met on the way and from whom I got tips and tricks on how to squeeze more out of my instrument.
Heya, Bob -- Peter O'Connor gives his mother Rose's directions for bow-hair washing here: http://thesession.org/discussions/display.php/4074/comments#comment83239 -- at the same time, you can discover a great place to stay at an Irish B&B with sessions attached. Also, the answer to my question below Peter's post on that thread is: any mild soap such as Ivory.
I am really enjoying everyone's posts! I'm thinking about my own answer, to be honest -- it's brought up some things I'm trying to decide before I answer... Please keep them coming, I'm finding them not only informative but also am enjoying finding out more about how y'all think about this stuff.
I was thinking that there aren't enough musicians on my current instrument ( 'zouk ) that I've listened to recently, that I might say have influenced me. I used to listen to the Boys of the Lough a lot, but Dave Richardson always seems to be part of the whole ensemble, rather than a stand-out solo musician.
I could always blame Donal Lunny for everything and leave it at that. It's probably a good exercise not only to take your inspiration from players of your own instrument, but to listen to every good musician you can, that way you don't become tied down in the techiques, but try to learn from everyone.
Guernsey Pete, good point there about learning from other instruments. I play flute and whistle, but I still love the way Tommy Peoples plays those jagged triplets. That doesn't mean, though, that I copied Peoples in everything. I like to play with a lot of swing, and I think that approach might come from Frankie Gavin. Not, of course, that I sound like either of them, just that I like certain aspects of their very different styles.
Ah -- it's possibly worth mentioning that I think technique is something different from influence.
My top influence overall has probably been Shannon (and Matt) Heaton. Having a flute player as my first teacher has had a certain amount of influence on the sort of settings that feel natural to me, even as a fiddler.
Brendan Bulger, George Keith, Kevin Glackin, and Tommy Peoples have been direct influences, although those personal encounters have been regrettably brief. However, seeing how they all deal with their music, how they approach the stuff, how they pass it on personally, has been inspiration and influence far beyond the shortness of the lessons I've taken from them. I've had other teachers give me lessons, and each of them gave me something unique and valued, but those four probably have had the greatest influence on me, both in technique and in influence.
And the musos I've played with and play with regularly have been hugely important. Playing with Dirk has had a particularly large influence, as playing with a piper definitely has changed how I'd have played otherwise. I have to say that John Carr has been a huge, important influence on me, though it would be an insult to him to imply that I can play even remotely as well as he does (and if I wasn't about 95% certain he never reads this site, I wouldn't dare post this for fear of embarrassing him completely and utterly, and if you know him and are reading this, don't you DARE pass on to him that I've done this! Please? *smirk*).
Lastly but certainly not leastly, as it were, you'd be surprised at how much I've gotten from this site and the people on it. There's prolly two that deserve special mention: Will Harmon is a great friend that I'm honored to learn from, first and foremost. Orson Carte has been an inspiration (and he's going to kill me for this); I only met him in person this last trip to London, and look forward to learning as much from him as I can. But I learn from almost everyone here on a regular basis.
It's so embarrassing to note that here I've listed all these wonderful people and I'm STILL a distinctly mediocre player. But that's me, and not them. (And I know I've missed out on lots of names. But you know who you are and sorry in advance that I've forgotten to put your name down here, I'm in a bit of a hurry as we have a session to get to!)
I'm with Guernsey Pete--still trying to get through the tune with dignity intact, much less in something approaching some master's style...
That said--Martin Hayes, Tommy Peoples, Dale Russ, Randal Bays.... in my dreams, I should play something that reminds a listener of any of those people....
It's an interesting question; and I'm having a bit of trouble coming to grips with it. It would seem my biggest ITM influence would have to be refered to as "some old guy with a fiddle" just picked up wil-he-nil-he.
"Some old guy" to be taken as plural.
I was young and entranced with the fiddling and the music. Personages didn't mean squat to me. I just watched and listened intently. I only played classical piano at the time with a bit of noodling around randomly on guitar. Took a few classical violin lessons in primary school, but that only taught me to hate old, German music masters, so I quit.
Since that time I've had opportunity to closely observe John Hartford, George Wilson, Alan Block, Jay Unger, Vassar Clements, Johnny Cunningham, Darol Anger and Kevin Burke.
I believe I took away something from each of them in terms of approach to fiddling in general (note that of these only Kevin is a "real" Irish player), but I really couldn't say what or that any one of them stands out in particular and I have no particular desire to sound like any one of them.
I pay attention and just sort of absorb.
When I think in terms of who I would like to sound like Paddy Cronin is generally the first name that comes to mind (and I might add Jode now), but I don't really spend any particular time listening to him or trying to sound like that. It's just something that's in the back of my mind.
On the whole I'd say it's simply paying attention to the tune and the instrument that has influenced my style the most. They have a lot to teach if you pay very, very close attention.
well, of course it would have to be my teacher, Larry Nugent, and to lesser extent Catherine McEvoy. they both fall more or less in the "northern" style flute playing, which tends to emphasize the pulse. the ultimate gift of any great teacher is that they teach you--or rather inspire you--to interpret the music for yourself. i'm only just now finding my sea legs in this regard, but damn once you get a taste of sculpting a tune on your own, wow, there's nothing like it.
hey zines, i'm pretty sure i don't have that one in my archive (which consists of a hapless pile of mini-dics and cassettes stuffed in a drawer). i'll try and track larry down and get a clip. i've heard that that tune he wrote for gwen sales is positively lovely.
My main influence is the piper Denis Brooks. I think pretty much everything I know about Irish music comes from him. And I'm not a piper! I played with him for several years and worked and worked at getting my fiddle to make the kinds of sounds his pipes made. It was great fun while we were able to do it frequently (we both lived in Seattle). I'm looking forward to having a bunch of tunes with him next month when he will be in Seattle for the West Coast Tionol.
Joe O'Dowd is also an influence but maybe more of an inspiration. He was a great fiddle player in Sligo who I met in the late 70's when I was learning to play Irish music. He was very generous with his time and his skill and I learned a lot from him. Dale Russ is another strong influence. He lived in or near Seattle when I was learning to play and it seems like we had a session nearly every night of the week then.
There are also recorded influences - Denis Murphy and Julia Clifford (Star Above the Garter ! ), Sliabh Notes, Paddy Canny, Jerry Holland, Tommy Doucet, and many more.
What a great question, Zina. I don't know what I can say about style - it's too much fun to remember influences and to try to recall them. This is a wonderful thread for jogging the memory.
Well, after nearly three years of learning (?) the fiddle, I still have no discernible style, but, and this is way out in left field here and probably going to earn me some serious flak, I would have to say that the two fiddlers who created my by now deeply ingrained concept of what fiddling should sound like were (late sixties early seventies) Peter Knight and Robin Williamson. With some slight hiccoughs along the way by the likes of Doug Kershaw and Vassar Clements. So you can imagine, if you dare, what I am going to sound like if I perservere and actually ever get anywhere. Be warned.
Like Gunernsey Pete, I'm not far along this journey - I don't have a style *yet* - one day when I'm not puffing from the tunes.
But there are a number of musicians who have and still influence me most. I guess for me it comes down to what is musically pleasing (not just catchy, mind) & enchanting; and of course it varies.
Sometimes I can't get enough of the driving fiddling of Altan - eg Tommy People's or Glory
Other times I can listen to Frankie Gavin & Paul Brock over and over.
The playing of Liz Doherty will always be special - her music really got me into ITM - the first Trad concert I ever went to.
& of course Brendan Power.
But there are loads and loads more, people whose playing affects or impresses, maybe it's just one tune that sweeps me along.
Initially Kevin Burke, Tommy Peoples and Aly Bain for this side of the pond but ALL the bluegrass players from Chubby Wise, Kenny Baker onwards who ever played with Bill Monroe and Lester Flatt. I don't play bluegrass any more but the occasional bluesy slide works its way in to a reel .
Recently John Carty, Frank McKillop and the exceptionally good Sam Proctor, who leads the Herschel Arms session, have all had a good influence.
I have no idea what my style is ....Reading/Slough fusion?
My style on guitar owes many of its characteristics to the first guitarists that influenced me--singing cowboys on the TV, like Roy Rogers. Being self taught until recently, that rudimentary, simple style kind of stuck with me through the years. In some ways, my original approach to ITM had similarities to ceilidhe band piano playing, which has some of the same approach to chords and rhythm as that simple country guitar playing.
Through a lot of listening, session playing, and more recently, through lessons, that style has been becoming more and more "Irish," but I still have a long way to go before I start sounding even close to the guitarists I admire, who include John Doyle, Donal Clancy, and Daithe Sprouil, to name the first few who come to mind.
There is a similar thing going on with my whistle playing, you can still hear hints of the American fife tradition in my playing, especially when I play some of the first Irish tunes that I learned.
I guess what I am saying is that I have very strong American roots!
Have to agree, Sam is the Dog's.
We've been lucky enough to have himself, Jamie Smith and Ben Gunnery at the Porterhouse session at the same time. 3 totally different styles, all fantastic players in their own right.
I prefer to listen to pipes and fiddle rather than box, Jackie Daly, Mairtín O'Connor and Dermot Byrne being notable exceptions. I haven't really got good enough for a style to show; just a mish-mash of versions and riffs from my favourite musicians. I particularly like Donegal and related styles - Tommy Peoples, Dermot McLaughlin and Paddy Glackin, as well as more aggressive Sligo fiddlers such as Declan Folan. Big fan of Tommy Potts too. Around Belfast I would have played with pipers quite often - Fra McIlduff, Patrick O'Hare and John McSherry; all quite forceful players so, if anything, you might hear that in my playing.
I must confess that I listen to fiddlers more than flute players when it comes to recordings. Tommy P. and Cathal Hayden are just two who provide endless fascination. Flute players I do like to listen to on record are Harry Bradley and John Wynne ... Mostly I like hearing anything played live, next to me with no amplification, and that's when I really like flutes - to me they just don't tend to really come across on CD (Anyone else think that?)
As far as way back recorded music that really got me going - all the Dolres Keane/John Faulkner stuff, and Frankie Gavin and Jacky D giving it some on tracks like Charlie Harris' reels and that set that ends with Collins' Jig - they are the sort of thing that makes me desperate to play or dance or something!)
An interesting question, but a bit hard to answer.
I'm a fan of northern flute players, such as Harry Bradley, Marcas O'Murchu, and so on, but Carmel Gunning, Mary MacNamara, James Kelly, and Brenda Stubbert are also among my sources of inspiration. They have totally different playing styles of different instruments, and I'm not really sure how much influence they have on my flute and whistle playing. I just play, not thinking about how I should do.
I believe nobody knows him, but Dutch recorder genius Frans Brueggen might be the most inspirational musician to me. He was a great interpreter of baroque music, and a very powerful player too. It's a shame he stopped playing the instrument, even if not completely.
Trying to figure it out, Beebs! I may have to be in London for an audition anyway, so I wonder if I can just sort of tack on a trip to Oz at the same time?
I wonder sometimes whether we're really capable of judging our own influences and style. I'm reminded of a guitarist I've admired for many years (not an Irish player) who said that he "started out trying to sound like Big Bill Broonzy and is still trying." You'll occasionally hear Broonzy-like chops in his playing, but his overall style, excellent though it is, is nothing like Broonzy's was, I don't think.
I imagine we all find players to admire and strive for, but influences can be subtle, and style is probably a combination of those subtle influences and your own personality, which is itself a product of subtle influences as well as maybe genetics.
Yes, the main things that have shaped the way I play are my spastic, uncooperative fingers, my tin ear, and a penchant for trainwrecking on the B parts....
None of which I can credit to Kevin Burke, Linda Danielson, or my other early teachers.
Hee-hee! I didn't even think of the genetic influence on the fingers.
I was really thinking of , say, the difference between Pinchas Zuckerman and Izaak Perlman. I guess I'd say Zuckerman is sort of more cerebral and Perlman more, I don't know, emotional, maybe? I hear Burke as sort of a witty, easy sounding player, and Frankie Gavin as sort of hyper and joyous; I may well like one over the other, but if I'm kind of a reserved, morose sort of personality, there's no part of Gavin's style that is going to do it for me.
That and thick fingers will conspire against me!
Heh, yeah Zeens - but dont forget - its still 21 hours flying time plus a stopover to sydney from London But that does sound good - qantas has a deal from the US at the moment - $1399 return plus 3 internal flights in Australia.
I have been playing for just over four years, so I don't have a huge repetoire of teachers and famous acquaintances (Working on it! ). However the greatest influence on my playing is my mentor. Also, I listen to the first ten years of Altan a lot, so my style is strongly based in their playing. I model my playing after what I have heard of Frankie Kennedy's, but mine is much worse, I assure you
Bobby Casey, Andy McGann,
James Kelly, Conor Tully,Johnny Doran, Jimmy Power,Angelina Carberry, John Carty,Tommy Peoples , Joe Cooley , Tony McMahon, Liz Carroll
Great discussion - can I add just one more comment?
When I was first getting into ITM in the early 70's, I used to go to sessions in Liverpool. One of the most formative influences on me at that time came from a single phrase, a pearl of wisdom, from Eamonn Coyne (senior, RIP) who leaned across to me and quietly advised - "Bobby, don't bother about the notes - play the music". It has stood me in good stead ever since and I have shared that piece of information with most people that I have taught over the intervening years - a brilliant observation.
Great post Zina because it is a really difficult question to answer. It is not difficult to think of people who have inspired or influenced me over the years. There were countless. That is what is so incredible about this music. There are so many interesting and inspiring musicians and characters. Frankly, I could go on and on. (Am I that old or that lucky?)
But who are the influences that appear in my style? Hmm, as others have stated, someone else may need to answer that question. I feel like I have a Sligo-based style. What's funny, is that the people that have inspired me musically, the people I have so enjoyed playing music with, are from other regions like Belfast, Cork, Donegal and Clare. In the end, though, my Mom is from Sligo, and she has been a huge influence on me for the simple fact that I want to play music that she enjoys. And I feel like it is my heritage, and that I should sound like a Sligo fiddler. So as I continue to grow, that is probably the direction that I will continue to head. (But then there are all those lovely Sliabh Luachra polkas and slides, Donegal barn dances and mazurkas and Clare reels out there to learn! And those blasted Belfast fluters! How can I keep up with it all!!!)
Your influences and your style
Your influences and your style
Just today received Gerry O'Connor's 2004 cd, "Journeyman" -- absolutely lovely stuff, and as Gerry's brother Peter (who posts here upon occasion) says in the recordings section of this site, the cost of the cd is recouped in the first track of jaw-dropping, staggeringly lovely playing. (You can hear some clips of the album on Gerry's website at http://gerryoconnor.net/journeyman.html. I *love* this album and highly recommend it.
(I'd love to hear a whole cd of Gerry playing unaccompanied some day in the future -- I first heard him play live at a feis here in Colorado, where four stages of stepdancers had NO trouble finding and dancing to the beat of his lone fiddle, and anyone who has ever watched dancers stepdance to a lone fiddler who can't match Gerry's playing will appreciate exactly what I'm saying here.)
The thing that I really love about "Journeyman" is that, going through the tracks, Gerry traces the major influences on his playing; the liner notes give full credit and due to the musicians that he's learned from through his life. On first listening, I really enjoyed looking at the liner notes and trying to discern how Gerry's musician friends and teachers influenced what he was playing and how he played them.
Most of us (and I'm finally getting to the point here, sorry) can point to certain influences on our playing and many of us can even explain how they've affected our playing style. I'd love to hear some musings from everyone as to their influences, what it's done (or not done) for their own playing style, whether these things are conscious or not, whether you decide to incorporate a style thing from your influences or just pick them up all wil-he-nil-he, etc. Any takers?
(Thanks, btw, Peter O'Connor, for the bow washing tip, passed it on to a friend who tried it last month and is very happy with the results.
)
# Posted on January 18th 2006 by Zina Lee
Re: Your influences and your style
http://www.gerryoconnor.net/journeyman.html
thats the link
Ok.
Ian Hardie, my first teacher was a big influence on my technique, he taught me how to hammer, and a lot about sticking tunes together etc.
Angus R Grant of Shooglenifty fame, was a massive influence on my playing style around the time I was 14, he plays with an incredible swing and I just loved his playing. I've never even met him but the playing on the shoogle albums greatly influenced me. That swing is still (I hope) quite apparent in my playing.
Anna Massie, an incredible all round musician, virtuoso on several instruments including madolin, fiddle, guitar, has influenced me. we're the same age and I've known her through fiddling since we were 8. She chose the path of music long before me, took me a while to realise that i wanted the same thing, and after seeing her success, hearing her incredible first album etc, I did chose. So thanks to her. Picked up the guitar about a year ago now and shes my only influence really. I get the occasional tip from her!
Discovered some of the great Irish (fiddle) players about 2 or 3 years ago. Firstly, Winifred Horan of Solas, so her great and sporadic tripletting influenced mine. Then Martin Hayes, his other style of sporadic tripletting rubbed off. There are countless others, but those are the few I can explain right now.
http://www.mikevass.com
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Mike.Vass
Re: Your influences and your style
Although he's not really considered an Irish flutist, my original influence was Chris Norman. Back when I took lessons from him when I was about 10 years old or so, all I had ever played was classical music, and it was from him that I realized that there was life outside of the classical stuff. Granted I didn't start playing ITM until several years after my lessons with him ended, but he planted that seed in my conscious.
Now that I've gotten into the music, I would have to go with Paul McGrattan as my main influence. He just has that raw style of playing that I think Irish flute playing should be. Nothing frilly or too pulse-less, just a nice driving style. Do I try to play like him? I don't think I necessarily do, but I do try to match my philosophy with how his playing sounds. I avoid short breathy phrases typical of some styles, stay relatively true to the tunes, and try to really just dig into the notes and keep the sound solid.
Anywho, that's my take on things.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Jason G
Re: Your influences and your style
Bow washing, Zina? Did I miss that one?
I’m sure my playing of Irish tunes is influenced, willy-nilly, by some decidedly non-Irish sources, but the ones closer to the tradition would be
Paddy Moloney, Aly Bain, Cathal McConnell – the earliest influences that stuck
Dolores Keane - her singing has influenced my playing and my shower singing – the way the flow of her voice and the ornaments wring a powerful story out of the tune even when I can’t understand the words – also true for Aly Bain
Kevin Burke – of course
Moira Nelligan - a very talented friend in Atlanta – the first person I saw up close playing authentic Irish fiddle – unwittingly introduced me to fiddle crans
There are others, but these people helped sink the soul of the music into my head and heart. Whether it comes out in my playing is an entirely different question, but the bulk of how I *want* it to sound came from them.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Bob himself
Re: Your influences and your style
Well there are a couple to be named here. I will have to name my biggest two influences (speaking as a Flute player). First, the one who influenced my ornamentation the most would probably be Kevin Crawford as I do like to use a lot of triplets, plus the fact that I also play (well not any more really) GHBs I just use more ornaments in general, but usually in a Crawford-esque style. Secondly, Tom Doorley has influenced my sound more as even though I prefer a smaller bored Rudall Flute I like to have the power and presence that he has, yes this does mean I have to push the Flute a lot to be loud.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Why Bother?
Re: Your influences and your style
I was going to cite all of my GHB teachers from when I was a teenager. . . like Avery I find a lot of the skills and ideas from that translate over to my flute playing. But I don't think I ornament a whole bunch. . . only in very particular spots.
As far as flute players go, some of the other players who I meet up with once or twice a month in sessions have probably had the most direct influence. I can't think of a single "famous" player who I consciously strive to sound like in general. It depends on the tune - if I got it from a Lunasa CD, than clearly the influence will be McGoldrick or Crawford. If I got it from a piping CD, then maybe David Power. I haven't been playing long enough to develop a distinct style yet. Or at least a mature one.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by wormdiet
Re: Your influences and your style
Hm, tough one...
First and foremost - Mr. Donogh H., whose powerful bashing was the first thing I encountered and - for better and worse - became a foundation of my style. Even though I like to think I'm playing much lighter now, I still inherited the liking for broken chords and strange progressions.
Then, John Doyle.
Then, Antoine, a great guitar player from Paris.
Recently, Mark Kelly. He actually was the one who showed me that playing melody is much easier than I expected. In consequence, he pushed me towards Nicolas Quemener, but that is an influence I'm just starting to explore.
In a way, all these were conscious influences. As well as dozens of others, whom I met on the way and from whom I got tips and tricks on how to squeeze more out of my instrument.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by EastPole
Re: Your influences and your style
Heya, Bob -- Peter O'Connor gives his mother Rose's directions for bow-hair washing here: http://thesession.org/discussions/display.php/4074/comments#comment83239 -- at the same time, you can discover a great place to stay at an Irish B&B with sessions attached. Also, the answer to my question below Peter's post on that thread is: any mild soap such as Ivory.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Zina Lee
BTW
I am really enjoying everyone's posts! I'm thinking about my own answer, to be honest -- it's brought up some things I'm trying to decide before I answer...
Please keep them coming, I'm finding them not only informative but also am enjoying finding out more about how y'all think about this stuff.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Zina Lee
Re: Your influences and your style
I do kind of a Lyle Lovett thing with my hair, but my clothes are more Peewee Herman.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by cuchulain54
Re: Your influences and your style
John Doyle on guitar, Mick McAuley on box, and Donnchadh Gough and Sean McCann on bodhran. Each with a bit of my own style thrown in.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Zazzaliss
Re: Your influences and your style
I was thinking that there aren't enough musicians on my current instrument ( 'zouk ) that I've listened to recently, that I might say have influenced me. I used to listen to the Boys of the Lough a lot, but Dave Richardson always seems to be part of the whole ensemble, rather than a stand-out solo musician.
I could always blame Donal Lunny for everything and leave it at that. It's probably a good exercise not only to take your inspiration from players of your own instrument, but to listen to every good musician you can, that way you don't become tied down in the techiques, but try to learn from everyone.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Guernsey Pete
Re: Your influences and your style
Guernsey Pete, good point there about learning from other instruments. I play flute and whistle, but I still love the way Tommy Peoples plays those jagged triplets. That doesn't mean, though, that I copied Peoples in everything. I like to play with a lot of swing, and I think that approach might come from Frankie Gavin. Not, of course, that I sound like either of them, just that I like certain aspects of their very different styles.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by smw
Re: Your influences and your style
On the other hand.......techniques, what techniques ? I'm just trying to learn the bloody tunes........
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Guernsey Pete
Love letters to my influences
Ah -- it's possibly worth mentioning that I think technique is something different from influence.
My top influence overall has probably been Shannon (and Matt) Heaton. Having a flute player as my first teacher has had a certain amount of influence on the sort of settings that feel natural to me, even as a fiddler.
Brendan Bulger, George Keith, Kevin Glackin, and Tommy Peoples have been direct influences, although those personal encounters have been regrettably brief. However, seeing how they all deal with their music, how they approach the stuff, how they pass it on personally, has been inspiration and influence far beyond the shortness of the lessons I've taken from them. I've had other teachers give me lessons, and each of them gave me something unique and valued, but those four probably have had the greatest influence on me, both in technique and in influence.
And the musos I've played with and play with regularly have been hugely important. Playing with Dirk has had a particularly large influence, as playing with a piper definitely has changed how I'd have played otherwise. I have to say that John Carr has been a huge, important influence on me, though it would be an insult to him to imply that I can play even remotely as well as he does (and if I wasn't about 95% certain he never reads this site, I wouldn't dare post this for fear of embarrassing him completely and utterly, and if you know him and are reading this, don't you DARE pass on to him that I've done this! Please? *smirk*).
Lastly but certainly not leastly, as it were, you'd be surprised at how much I've gotten from this site and the people on it. There's prolly two that deserve special mention: Will Harmon is a great friend that I'm honored to learn from, first and foremost. Orson Carte has been an inspiration (and he's going to kill me for this); I only met him in person this last trip to London, and look forward to learning as much from him as I can. But I learn from almost everyone here on a regular basis.
It's so embarrassing to note that here I've listed all these wonderful people and I'm STILL a distinctly mediocre player.
But that's me, and not them. (And I know I've missed out on lots of names. But you know who you are and sorry in advance that I've forgotten to put your name down here, I'm in a bit of a hurry as we have a session to get to!)
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Zina Lee
Oh and
I'll have to cover "style" later -- too much of a hurry!
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Zina Lee
Re: Your influences and your style
I'm with Guernsey Pete--still trying to get through the tune with dignity intact, much less in something approaching some master's style...
That said--Martin Hayes, Tommy Peoples, Dale Russ, Randal Bays.... in my dreams, I should play something that reminds a listener of any of those people....
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by tuckered out
Re: Your influences and your style
Oh heck, I forgot Kevin Burke... and countless others.
I'll just keep hacking away, with all those other fiddlers in mind. At least I won't be as terrible as I used to be, maybe.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by tuckered out
Re: Your influences and your style
It's an interesting question; and I'm having a bit of trouble coming to grips with it. It would seem my biggest ITM influence would have to be refered to as "some old guy with a fiddle" just picked up wil-he-nil-he.
"Some old guy" to be taken as plural.
I was young and entranced with the fiddling and the music. Personages didn't mean squat to me. I just watched and listened intently. I only played classical piano at the time with a bit of noodling around randomly on guitar. Took a few classical violin lessons in primary school, but that only taught me to hate old, German music masters, so I quit.
Since that time I've had opportunity to closely observe John Hartford, George Wilson, Alan Block, Jay Unger, Vassar Clements, Johnny Cunningham, Darol Anger and Kevin Burke.
I believe I took away something from each of them in terms of approach to fiddling in general (note that of these only Kevin is a "real" Irish player), but I really couldn't say what or that any one of them stands out in particular and I have no particular desire to sound like any one of them.
I pay attention and just sort of absorb.
When I think in terms of who I would like to sound like Paddy Cronin is generally the first name that comes to mind (and I might add Jode now), but I don't really spend any particular time listening to him or trying to sound like that. It's just something that's in the back of my mind.
On the whole I'd say it's simply paying attention to the tune and the instrument that has influenced my style the most. They have a lot to teach if you pay very, very close attention.
KFG
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by KFG
Re: Your influences and your style
well, of course it would have to be my teacher, Larry Nugent, and to lesser extent Catherine McEvoy. they both fall more or less in the "northern" style flute playing, which tends to emphasize the pulse. the ultimate gift of any great teacher is that they teach you--or rather inspire you--to interpret the music for yourself. i'm only just now finding my sea legs in this regard, but damn once you get a taste of sculpting a tune on your own, wow, there's nothing like it.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Brendan
An aside
Brendan, I didn't realize that Larry was your teacher. Um. Hey, could you get a clip for me of him playing the waltz he wrote for Gwen? Pleeeeeaaaase?
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Zina Lee
Re: Your influences and your style
hey zines, i'm pretty sure i don't have that one in my archive (which consists of a hapless pile of mini-dics and cassettes stuffed in a drawer). i'll try and track larry down and get a clip. i've heard that that tune he wrote for gwen sales is positively lovely.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Brendan
Re: Your influences and your style
My main influence is the piper Denis Brooks. I think pretty much everything I know about Irish music comes from him. And I'm not a piper! I played with him for several years and worked and worked at getting my fiddle to make the kinds of sounds his pipes made. It was great fun while we were able to do it frequently (we both lived in Seattle). I'm looking forward to having a bunch of tunes with him next month when he will be in Seattle for the West Coast Tionol.
Joe O'Dowd is also an influence but maybe more of an inspiration. He was a great fiddle player in Sligo who I met in the late 70's when I was learning to play Irish music. He was very generous with his time and his skill and I learned a lot from him. Dale Russ is another strong influence. He lived in or near Seattle when I was learning to play and it seems like we had a session nearly every night of the week then.
There are also recorded influences - Denis Murphy and Julia Clifford (Star Above the Garter ! ), Sliabh Notes, Paddy Canny, Jerry Holland, Tommy Doucet, and many more.
What a great question, Zina. I don't know what I can say about style - it's too much fun to remember influences and to try to recall them. This is a wonderful thread for jogging the memory.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by tacoman
Re: Your influences and your style
Well, after nearly three years of learning (?) the fiddle, I still have no discernible style, but, and this is way out in left field here and probably going to earn me some serious flak, I would have to say that the two fiddlers who created my by now deeply ingrained concept of what fiddling should sound like were (late sixties early seventies) Peter Knight and Robin Williamson. With some slight hiccoughs along the way by the likes of Doug Kershaw and Vassar Clements. So you can imagine, if you dare, what I am going to sound like if I perservere and actually ever get anywhere. Be warned.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by reedy grins
Re: Your influences and your style
Like Gunernsey Pete, I'm not far along this journey - I don't have a style *yet* - one day when I'm not puffing from the tunes.
But there are a number of musicians who have and still influence me most. I guess for me it comes down to what is musically pleasing (not just catchy, mind) & enchanting; and of course it varies.
Sometimes I can't get enough of the driving fiddling of Altan - eg Tommy People's or Glory
Other times I can listen to Frankie Gavin & Paul Brock over and over.
The playing of Liz Doherty will always be special - her music really got me into ITM - the first Trad concert I ever went to.
& of course Brendan Power.
But there are loads and loads more, people whose playing affects or impresses, maybe it's just one tune that sweeps me along.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Brown Creeper
Re: Your influences and your style
Initially Kevin Burke, Tommy Peoples and Aly Bain for this side of the pond but ALL the bluegrass players from Chubby Wise, Kenny Baker onwards who ever played with Bill Monroe and Lester Flatt. I don't play bluegrass any more but the occasional bluesy slide works its way in to a reel .
Recently John Carty, Frank McKillop and the exceptionally good Sam Proctor, who leads the Herschel Arms session, have all had a good influence.
I have no idea what my style is ....Reading/Slough fusion?
You've heard me Zina, you tell me
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Geoff Pollitt
Re: Your influences and your style
My style on guitar owes many of its characteristics to the first guitarists that influenced me--singing cowboys on the TV, like Roy Rogers. Being self taught until recently, that rudimentary, simple style kind of stuck with me through the years. In some ways, my original approach to ITM had similarities to ceilidhe band piano playing, which has some of the same approach to chords and rhythm as that simple country guitar playing.
Through a lot of listening, session playing, and more recently, through lessons, that style has been becoming more and more "Irish," but I still have a long way to go before I start sounding even close to the guitarists I admire, who include John Doyle, Donal Clancy, and Daithe Sprouil, to name the first few who come to mind.
There is a similar thing going on with my whistle playing, you can still hear hints of the American fife tradition in my playing, especially when I play some of the first Irish tunes that I learned.
I guess what I am saying is that I have very strong American roots!
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by AlBrown
Re: Your influences and your style
In addition to being exceptionally good, Sam P. is such a powerful player that it's not so much that he influences you as completely overwhelms you(!)
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Ottery
Re: Your influences and your style
Have to agree, Sam is the Dog's.
We've been lucky enough to have himself, Jamie Smith and Ben Gunnery at the Porterhouse session at the same time. 3 totally different styles, all fantastic players in their own right.
I prefer to listen to pipes and fiddle rather than box, Jackie Daly, Mairtín O'Connor and Dermot Byrne being notable exceptions. I haven't really got good enough for a style to show; just a mish-mash of versions and riffs from my favourite musicians. I particularly like Donegal and related styles - Tommy Peoples, Dermot McLaughlin and Paddy Glackin, as well as more aggressive Sligo fiddlers such as Declan Folan. Big fan of Tommy Potts too. Around Belfast I would have played with pipers quite often - Fra McIlduff, Patrick O'Hare and John McSherry; all quite forceful players so, if anything, you might hear that in my playing.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Your influences and your style
I must confess that I listen to fiddlers more than flute players when it comes to recordings. Tommy P. and Cathal Hayden are just two who provide endless fascination. Flute players I do like to listen to on record are Harry Bradley and John Wynne ... Mostly I like hearing anything played live, next to me with no amplification, and that's when I really like flutes - to me they just don't tend to really come across on CD (Anyone else think that?)
As far as way back recorded music that really got me going - all the Dolres Keane/John Faulkner stuff, and Frankie Gavin and Jacky D giving it some on tracks like Charlie Harris' reels and that set that ends with Collins' Jig - they are the sort of thing that makes me desperate to play or dance or something!)
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Ottery
Re: Your influences and your style
That would be Dolores Keane ....
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Ottery
Re: Your influences and your style
An interesting question, but a bit hard to answer.
I'm a fan of northern flute players, such as Harry Bradley, Marcas O'Murchu, and so on, but Carmel Gunning, Mary MacNamara, James Kelly, and Brenda Stubbert are also among my sources of inspiration. They have totally different playing styles of different instruments, and I'm not really sure how much influence they have on my flute and whistle playing. I just play, not thinking about how I should do.
I believe nobody knows him, but Dutch recorder genius Frans Brueggen might be the most inspirational musician to me. He was a great interpreter of baroque music, and a very powerful player too. It's a shame he stopped playing the instrument, even if not completely.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by slainte
Re: Your influences and your style
Well Zeens - better come to Australia for that trip after all as Gerry O'Connor will be playing at that festival I was telling you about.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by shoddy fiddle player
Re: Your influences and your style
Trying to figure it out, Beebs! I may have to be in London for an audition anyway, so I wonder if I can just sort of tack on a trip to Oz at the same time?
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Zina Lee
Re: Your influences and your style
I wonder sometimes whether we're really capable of judging our own influences and style. I'm reminded of a guitarist I've admired for many years (not an Irish player) who said that he "started out trying to sound like Big Bill Broonzy and is still trying." You'll occasionally hear Broonzy-like chops in his playing, but his overall style, excellent though it is, is nothing like Broonzy's was, I don't think.
I imagine we all find players to admire and strive for, but influences can be subtle, and style is probably a combination of those subtle influences and your own personality, which is itself a product of subtle influences as well as maybe genetics.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by cuchulain54
Re: Your influences and your style
Mick O'Brien is my role model for his impeccable sense of rhythm and highly developed use of variation that never gets in the way of the tune itself.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Hanley
Re: Your influences and your style
Yes, the main things that have shaped the way I play are my spastic, uncooperative fingers, my tin ear, and a penchant for trainwrecking on the B parts....
None of which I can credit to Kevin Burke, Linda Danielson, or my other early teachers.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Miss Lonelyhearts
Re: Your influences and your style
Hee-hee! I didn't even think of the genetic influence on the fingers.
I was really thinking of , say, the difference between Pinchas Zuckerman and Izaak Perlman. I guess I'd say Zuckerman is sort of more cerebral and Perlman more, I don't know, emotional, maybe? I hear Burke as sort of a witty, easy sounding player, and Frankie Gavin as sort of hyper and joyous; I may well like one over the other, but if I'm kind of a reserved, morose sort of personality, there's no part of Gavin's style that is going to do it for me.
That and thick fingers will conspire against me!
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by cuchulain54
Re: Your influences and your style
I think earlier I said Frank McKillop when of course I meant Jim Mckillop. Oops!
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Geoff Pollitt
Re: Your influences and your style
Heh, yeah Zeens - but dont forget - its still 21 hours flying time plus a stopover to sydney from London
But that does sound good - qantas has a deal from the US at the moment - $1399 return plus 3 internal flights in Australia.
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by shoddy fiddle player
Re: Your influences and your style
Or even McKillop.
Nurse!
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Geoff Pollitt
Re: Your influences and your style
I have been playing for just over four years, so I don't have a huge repetoire of teachers and famous acquaintances (Working on it! ). However the greatest influence on my playing is my mentor. Also, I listen to the first ten years of Altan a lot, so my style is strongly based in their playing. I model my playing after what I have heard of Frankie Kennedy's, but mine is much worse, I assure you
# Posted on January 19th 2006 by Red Crow
Re: Your influences and your style
Bobby Casey, Andy McGann,
James Kelly, Conor Tully,Johnny Doran, Jimmy Power,Angelina Carberry, John Carty,Tommy Peoples , Joe Cooley , Tony McMahon, Liz Carroll
# Posted on January 20th 2006 by Red Robin
Re: Your influences and your style
I almost forgot,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,David McWilliams !
# Posted on January 20th 2006 by Red Robin
Re: Your influences and your style
This has been a really interesting thread, guys. Thanks for sharing!
# Posted on January 20th 2006 by Zina Lee
Re: Your influences and your style
Great discussion - can I add just one more comment?
When I was first getting into ITM in the early 70's, I used to go to sessions in Liverpool. One of the most formative influences on me at that time came from a single phrase, a pearl of wisdom, from Eamonn Coyne (senior, RIP) who leaned across to me and quietly advised - "Bobby, don't bother about the notes - play the music". It has stood me in good stead ever since and I have shared that piece of information with most people that I have taught over the intervening years - a brilliant observation.
# Posted on January 20th 2006 by Bob Tracey
Re: Your influences and your style
Awwww...Bob, that's such a good one.
# Posted on January 20th 2006 by Zina Lee
Re: Your influences and your style
Great post Zina because it is a really difficult question to answer. It is not difficult to think of people who have inspired or influenced me over the years. There were countless. That is what is so incredible about this music. There are so many interesting and inspiring musicians and characters. Frankly, I could go on and on. (Am I that old or that lucky?)
But who are the influences that appear in my style? Hmm, as others have stated, someone else may need to answer that question. I feel like I have a Sligo-based style. What's funny, is that the people that have inspired me musically, the people I have so enjoyed playing music with, are from other regions like Belfast, Cork, Donegal and Clare. In the end, though, my Mom is from Sligo, and she has been a huge influence on me for the simple fact that I want to play music that she enjoys. And I feel like it is my heritage, and that I should sound like a Sligo fiddler. So as I continue to grow, that is probably the direction that I will continue to head. (But then there are all those lovely Sliabh Luachra polkas and slides, Donegal barn dances and mazurkas and Clare reels out there to learn! And those blasted Belfast fluters! How can I keep up with it all!!!)
# Posted on January 20th 2006 by Jode
Re: Your influences and your style
Zina? Audition? Pray tell.
# Posted on January 20th 2006 by Brendan
Re: Your influences and your style
# Posted on January 20th 2006 by Zina Lee
Re: Your influences and your style
ah, i got it. as they say, break a leg
# Posted on January 21st 2006 by Brendan
Re: Your influences and your style
...into the mouths of the wolves...
# Posted on January 21st 2006 by Zina Lee
Re: Your influences and your style
so i would have figured that at least dow or MG would have called me a momma's boy by now...
# Posted on January 22nd 2006 by Jode
Re: Your influences and your style
Jode, would it make any difference if they had?
# Posted on January 23rd 2006 by Zina Lee