I've seen advice in a few places that suggest you record yourself while playing.
Who does this, how helpful is it and why do you do it (e.g. do you do it to make backing tracks for yourself to play harmonies with or is it more of a disciplin thing)?
It's effective if you're interested in cleaning up your playing.
As has been said before, it's hard to separate the track we are playing to in our heads from what is actually happening real-time.
Listening after the fact particularly allows you to better hear rhythmic inconsistencies. They will jump out at you especially if you come back to the recording a day or two after you record it.
Also it's a very good tool to help you decide whether the ornamentation and phrasing you put into the tune is actually appropriate and within the confines of your own personal taste.
It will be a discouraging exercise unless you approach it with a critical ear bent on improvement. Focus on the positive things you hear, and build on them.
Listen with the intention of learning what your particular habits/tendencies are. Work constructively toward changing them if you're not pleased. It's a good reality check everytime you learn a new tune, and a more efficient way to build up a tune than just playing it through a hundred times or so.
For example, any time I start thinking I sound quite good I play into a tape recorder, just to remind myself that I still have a long way to go!
Also, if I were going in for a competition, playing an important concert or doing some work in a recording studio I would constantly tape myself before-hand until I could play with confidence, without any silly mistakes.
It's obvious that if you can't play your music in the quiet of your own room, without making mistakes, then you sure as hell won't be able to do it in the tense atmosphere of a studio or in front of an audience or adjudicators.
It's something I wish I'd done more often. I got myself a mini-disc player earlier this year, and since then have used it not only to record band practices but also myself playing/singing alone.
Interestingly enough, while I most certainly found much to improve and tinker with, there also were some bits -- guitar breaks, chord progressions, etc. -- that actually sounded _better_ when I heard them on the recording. So the news isn't always necessarily all bad.
As of recent, I record myself. I find it very helpful. Often the way the tune sounds in my head when I'm playing it sounds quite different than when I play it back on the recorder.
In particular, recording myself helps me to improve phrasing and helps me to establish what I would consider a proper tempo.
Recording yourself can be a depressing experience though. All those years of practice and I still can't play in time and stumble over the rhythm. Best to just go the the session, smile inanely, and let everyone else listen to the bad timing while you hear the perfect rendition in your own head.
If you can get over the depressing thing, I reckon it's probably a very useful thing to do.
Recording oneself can be the most humbling experience. It’s like hearing a recording of your own voice – “Do I sound like THAT?!”
At the same time I don’t think I’ve ever really learned a tune quite so well as when I’ve recorded. Live performance is only a distant second.
Part of it is the knowledge that my playing is no longer ephemeral, that it becomes independent of me, and the here and now, and can be played back at any time.
This motivates me to really concentrate on what I’m putting down. It doesn’t hurt when you’re driven to do multiple takes to make it “perfect”. (Music is never perfected when recording, merely abandoned.)
If you’re a multi-instrumentalist and have the equipment it’s really instructive to lay down multiple tracks, be it rhythm or the melody doubled on another (or even the same) instrument. There’s almost no wiggle room, you really have to think through where everything goes.
Oh, and I hope I don’t come off like I think I'm some big shot studio pro, I’m talking about recording on my laptop for my own enjoyment (and the derision of my friends).
What's worse than recording yourself is videoing yourself. My son (bless him) recorded a bit of a gig we were doing and I found out that I look like someone who's been stuffed while they were in a very bad mood.
I have to agree with the comment about multi-tracking. It's great fun and it really shows up timing and intonation errors. Before I started playing with GarageBand, I never realized how much I change tempo while playing melody without a backer or how hard it is to make a backing track with no melody to follow.
Aye KFC, () it's hard not to speed up a little. As for click tracks, I hate those yolks, there's something very uncool & unnatural about those lads. I don't think God invented them at all, I think yer other fellow had a hand in those, they're evil, pure evil!! Be gone, cast them out........................
I do it all the time, I find it good for several different things. a) If your ear tends to be a bit lazy, and you slip into playing a few too many flats here and there from time to time (fiddle...), listening to a recording of yourself really brings it home. b) It can really help you tidy up your phrasing and rhythm, when you listen to yourself playing a tune you really hear where you're going wrong.
I often record myself playing along with CDs too, it can really emphasise maybe the one or two points in a tune that are tripping you up. Especially because you don't have to worry about setting the rhythm for yourself, those technical spots that cause you trouble really stand out then.
Fiddlers tend to be arrogant gits, so I record from time to time when I get too full of myself. I can tell myself it's the cheap mike, but I don't believe it either.
I really don't have time to do an indepth analysis of my playing, & my understanding of the tradition is based on "variations on the fly", so I 'd think it would be self defeating in that sense.
If yr a disciple and want to play exactly like, (...fill in hero here...)
it might be useful, but that's about the same thing as plagarism, isn't it?
Fidkid said, "the knowledge that my playing is no longer ephemeral, that it becomes independent of me, and the here and now, and can be played back at any time". This is the craziest nonsense I've heard in a while. How can it become independent of you? It is is you?
I suspect, Fidkid, that you know what I'm on about because you say, "Music is never perfected when recording, merely abandoned".
But is it not better to abandon it to the ephemeral?
I've served my time spending what seems like an eternity in cold, dry studios patching in the tiniest of mistakes only to have produced the most boring music ever. Give me the ephemeral any day. If you can't play music with "gay abandon", then there aint no point in it
I think I'd better get a move on and start some self-recording. I intend to record onto a laptop and perhaps, for that ultimate humiliation, use Audacity to put my efforts alonside the midi files produced from the ABC files on this site... I guess there'll be a few timing issues that might need me to go over to the dark-sdie and use a <hush> click track </hush>
Walk with me here. The music as one plays is usually ephemeral. As soon as you play a note, as soon as the sound wave decays, it’s gone forever and there’s no proof that it was off time or a bit sharp. Or brilliant. But when you record, there’s a, um, a record.
The music is independent of you once it’s recorded because you don’t have to be there for others to listen to it. Hell, you don’t even have to be alive any more. I can still listen to Coleman, Morrison, Reevy but it’s not them playing, it’s a recording of them playing. A snapshot of a party isn’t the party. It’s a subtle distinction but no less true because of the subtlety.
I completely agree that it’s “better to abandon music to the ephemeral”! But recording has its uses. If you’re still a pup like me it allows you a little distance to more objectively assess your strengths and weaknesses. If you’re really good it allows you to share with a wider audience and maybe even leave a legacy.
Mandowind, please tell me you were kidding. You are not seriously going to measure yourself against a midi file, are you? If you play with the midi file, you will certainly have timing issues. Abandon this plan, please.
If you must do a direct comparison, record yourself playing a tune that you have on a recording. Then compare what you are doing differently to the person on the recording.
But mostly, you should just have a listen to what you are doing, and find how it is in sync or out of sync with the music that you have in your head. If you are not happy with the way it sounds, try to figure out why. If you have no idea, then you should go back and listen to other people and find music that you admire. Get that music into your head before recording yourself again.
Recording Yourself
Recording Yourself
I've seen advice in a few places that suggest you record yourself while playing.
Who does this, how helpful is it and why do you do it (e.g. do you do it to make backing tracks for yourself to play harmonies with or is it more of a disciplin thing)?
# Posted on September 7th 2005 by JonB
Re: Recording Yourself
It's effective if you're interested in cleaning up your playing.
As has been said before, it's hard to separate the track we are playing to in our heads from what is actually happening real-time.
Listening after the fact particularly allows you to better hear rhythmic inconsistencies. They will jump out at you especially if you come back to the recording a day or two after you record it.
Also it's a very good tool to help you decide whether the ornamentation and phrasing you put into the tune is actually appropriate and within the confines of your own personal taste.
It will be a discouraging exercise unless you approach it with a critical ear bent on improvement. Focus on the positive things you hear, and build on them.
Listen with the intention of learning what your particular habits/tendencies are. Work constructively toward changing them if you're not pleased. It's a good reality check everytime you learn a new tune, and a more efficient way to build up a tune than just playing it through a hundred times or so.
Cheers.
# Posted on September 7th 2005 by _Steph_
Re: Recording Yourself
Answer ME!
I find it very helpful.
For example, any time I start thinking I sound quite good I play into a tape recorder, just to remind myself that I still have a long way to go!
Also, if I were going in for a competition, playing an important concert or doing some work in a recording studio I would constantly tape myself before-hand until I could play with confidence, without any silly mistakes.
It's obvious that if you can't play your music in the quiet of your own room, without making mistakes, then you sure as hell won't be able to do it in the tense atmosphere of a studio or in front of an audience or adjudicators.
# Posted on September 7th 2005 by Ptarmigan
Re: Recording Yourself
_Steph_ Right On Bro! Polkas certainly do 'KICK ASS'!! At last, another ITM with real taste!!
# Posted on September 7th 2005 by Ptarmigan
Re: Recording Yourself
Did someone say Polkas?
# Posted on September 7th 2005 by JerryH
Re: Recording Yourself
It's something I wish I'd done more often. I got myself a mini-disc player earlier this year, and since then have used it not only to record band practices but also myself playing/singing alone.
Interestingly enough, while I most certainly found much to improve and tinker with, there also were some bits -- guitar breaks, chord progressions, etc. -- that actually sounded _better_ when I heard them on the recording. So the news isn't always necessarily all bad.
# Posted on September 7th 2005 by sts
Re: Recording Yourself
As of recent, I record myself. I find it very helpful. Often the way the tune sounds in my head when I'm playing it sounds quite different than when I play it back on the recorder.
In particular, recording myself helps me to improve phrasing and helps me to establish what I would consider a proper tempo.
# Posted on September 7th 2005 by Pete D
Re: Recording Yourself
Recording yourself can be a depressing experience though. All those years of practice and I still can't play in time and stumble over the rhythm. Best to just go the the session, smile inanely, and let everyone else listen to the bad timing while you hear the perfect rendition in your own head.
If you can get over the depressing thing, I reckon it's probably a very useful thing to do.
# Posted on September 7th 2005 by JerryH
Re: Recording Yourself
I get that depressing thing just looking in the mirror every morning JerryH, so a little more can't hurt - that much!
When you do see an improvement, it really can encourage you.
# Posted on September 7th 2005 by Ptarmigan
Re: Recording Yourself
Recording oneself can be the most humbling experience. It’s like hearing a recording of your own voice – “Do I sound like THAT?!”
At the same time I don’t think I’ve ever really learned a tune quite so well as when I’ve recorded. Live performance is only a distant second.
Part of it is the knowledge that my playing is no longer ephemeral, that it becomes independent of me, and the here and now, and can be played back at any time.
This motivates me to really concentrate on what I’m putting down. It doesn’t hurt when you’re driven to do multiple takes to make it “perfect”. (Music is never perfected when recording, merely abandoned.)
If you’re a multi-instrumentalist and have the equipment it’s really instructive to lay down multiple tracks, be it rhythm or the melody doubled on another (or even the same) instrument. There’s almost no wiggle room, you really have to think through where everything goes.
# Posted on September 7th 2005 by fidkid
Re: Recording Yourself
Oh, and I hope I don’t come off like I think I'm some big shot studio pro, I’m talking about recording on my laptop for my own enjoyment (and the derision of my friends).
# Posted on September 7th 2005 by fidkid
Re: Recording Yourself
I record myself to hear what i sound like and whats more to "clean it up"!
Sam
# Posted on September 7th 2005 by flamin fiddler
Re: Recording Yourself
What's worse than recording yourself is videoing yourself. My son (bless him) recorded a bit of a gig we were doing and I found out that I look like someone who's been stuffed while they were in a very bad mood.
I have to agree with the comment about multi-tracking. It's great fun and it really shows up timing and intonation errors. Before I started playing with GarageBand, I never realized how much I change tempo while playing melody without a backer or how hard it is to make a backing track with no melody to follow.
# Posted on September 7th 2005 by JerryH
Re: Recording Yourself
My but you are a 'brave man' indeed to let someone video you while playing! Give that man a medal!
# Posted on September 7th 2005 by Ptarmigan
Re: Recording Yourself
"I never realized how much I change tempo while playing melody without a backer or how hard it is to make a backing track with no melody to follow."
That's why God invented click tracks.
KFG
# Posted on September 7th 2005 by KFG
Re: Recording Yourself
Aye KFC, (
) it's hard not to speed up a little. As for click tracks, I hate those yolks, there's something very uncool & unnatural about those lads. I don't think God invented them at all, I think yer other fellow had a hand in those, they're evil, pure evil!! Be gone, cast them out........................
# Posted on September 8th 2005 by Ptarmigan
Re: Recording Yourself
I do it all the time, I find it good for several different things. a) If your ear tends to be a bit lazy, and you slip into playing a few too many flats here and there from time to time (fiddle...), listening to a recording of yourself really brings it home. b) It can really help you tidy up your phrasing and rhythm, when you listen to yourself playing a tune you really hear where you're going wrong.
I often record myself playing along with CDs too, it can really emphasise maybe the one or two points in a tune that are tripping you up. Especially because you don't have to worry about setting the rhythm for yourself, those technical spots that cause you trouble really stand out then.
# Posted on September 8th 2005 by oraghalm
Re: Recording Yourself
Fiddlers tend to be arrogant gits, so I record from time to time when I get too full of myself. I can tell myself it's the cheap mike, but I don't believe it either.
I really don't have time to do an indepth analysis of my playing, & my understanding of the tradition is based on "variations on the fly", so I 'd think it would be self defeating in that sense.
If yr a disciple and want to play exactly like, (...fill in hero here...)
it might be useful, but that's about the same thing as plagarism, isn't it?
# Posted on September 8th 2005 by Owell Mabee
Re: Recording Yourself
Fidkid said, "the knowledge that my playing is no longer ephemeral, that it becomes independent of me, and the here and now, and can be played back at any time". This is the craziest nonsense I've heard in a while. How can it become independent of you? It is is you?
I suspect, Fidkid, that you know what I'm on about because you say, "Music is never perfected when recording, merely abandoned".
But is it not better to abandon it to the ephemeral?
I've served my time spending what seems like an eternity in cold, dry studios patching in the tiniest of mistakes only to have produced the most boring music ever. Give me the ephemeral any day. If you can't play music with "gay abandon", then there aint no point in it
# Posted on September 8th 2005 by llig leahcim
Re: Recording Yourself
Great replies! Thanks.
I think I'd better get a move on and start some self-recording. I intend to record onto a laptop and perhaps, for that ultimate humiliation, use Audacity to put my efforts alonside the midi files produced from the ABC files on this site... I guess there'll be a few timing issues that might need me to go over to the dark-sdie and use a <hush> click track </hush>
# Posted on September 8th 2005 by JonB
Re: Recording Yourself
The problem I find with click tracks is that
a) for some reason my brain filters the clicks out, probably because I've been exposed to too many spoons players in the past
and b) they don't speed up when you do want to speed up as the track goes on, e.g. at the final tune in the set for that glorious finish.
# Posted on September 8th 2005 by JerryH
Re: Recording Yourself
Mr. Gill,
Walk with me here. The music as one plays is usually ephemeral. As soon as you play a note, as soon as the sound wave decays, it’s gone forever and there’s no proof that it was off time or a bit sharp. Or brilliant. But when you record, there’s a, um, a record.
The music is independent of you once it’s recorded because you don’t have to be there for others to listen to it. Hell, you don’t even have to be alive any more. I can still listen to Coleman, Morrison, Reevy but it’s not them playing, it’s a recording of them playing. A snapshot of a party isn’t the party. It’s a subtle distinction but no less true because of the subtlety.
I completely agree that it’s “better to abandon music to the ephemeral”! But recording has its uses. If you’re still a pup like me it allows you a little distance to more objectively assess your strengths and weaknesses. If you’re really good it allows you to share with a wider audience and maybe even leave a legacy.
# Posted on September 8th 2005 by fidkid
Re: Recording Yourself
Mandowind, please tell me you were kidding. You are not seriously going to measure yourself against a midi file, are you? If you play with the midi file, you will certainly have timing issues. Abandon this plan, please.
If you must do a direct comparison, record yourself playing a tune that you have on a recording. Then compare what you are doing differently to the person on the recording.
But mostly, you should just have a listen to what you are doing, and find how it is in sync or out of sync with the music that you have in your head. If you are not happy with the way it sounds, try to figure out why. If you have no idea, then you should go back and listen to other people and find music that you admire. Get that music into your head before recording yourself again.
# Posted on September 8th 2005 by Jode
Re: Recording Yourself
I'm just going to nip off and find a dictionary.
Got stumped at "ephemeral"
# Posted on September 8th 2005 by BegF
Re: Recording Yourself
Well, BegF, in that case you better hurry :D
# Posted on September 9th 2005 by Owell Mabee