Here's a precursor to the ITM/Hip Hop track...but guess what? It's not the fuse track yet.....It's just straight ol' ITM, with me on the bodhran.
The fusetrack will be here in two-three weeks. You know I love feed back....follow the link....Let me know based on this track how I can improve the fusion track...
P.S. The tunes are the first two on list.....They also will be uploaded to "The Mighty Craic Online"....but I wanted you to get this new ish now....
"Let me know based on this track how I can improve the fusion track..."
Sure, but first you have to tell me based on my last car design how I can improve my next boat design. Is this a habit of yours, asking people to critique things that don't exist yet? I remain clueless as to how to participate in this.
"It's just straight ol' ITM, with me on the bodhran."
And this track I can actually comment on, what with being able to actually listen to it and all, and I think it's pretty decent. I only have one question, is it possible to get some solo fiddle tracks out of that guy? : )
Oh, and tone down the reverb just a hair, if you will.
For a fusion track, you'll probably want to drop the bodhran in favour of some high-end electronic percussion loops. Be careful with that though, 'cause it's easy to make that sort of thing sound rubbish.
Unfortunately, for a successful, say, hiphop or jungle/breakbeat fusion, you'll have to reduce the fiddle to a mere sample that you then must loop creatively. It'll be no mean feat, and I don't think you'll find many people who'll appreciate it, no matter how well done it is. But as long as you're amusing yourself and your friends I don't see the harm.
Yeah....ya'll like that fiddle huh? That means I come with tha heat....But the fiddle player is mine....My secret weapon....now I'm not so stupid on this site huh? I got those music connections.....
In training. So far, I've only split hairs and infinitives. Working my way up to atoms. Or down to atoms, rather. It's all about finding the right chisel, I'm told.
"But the fiddle player is mine....My secret weapon"
Well if you want "Sess Cred" you will just have to play by the rules and tell us who is playing the fiddle. I suppose you have noticed, GRY, that everyone is more interested in the fiddle playing than the bodhran or any possible fusion/fission that might occur.
Those who come with "tha heat" may leave in flames☺
So here's the deal....I'm not holding any information to be mean. The fiddle player wants to remain unknown....and that's how it will stay. Like I need "Sess Cred"....I got "street cred" and any other cred I want. Like I'm actually going to listen to any of you cause you demand things(please, this is real Chi-Town).
Same goes for the fusion track. These are my fam doing me a solid. They are not here for you, they are here to help me. Basically any musical project I wanna do....I can....cause we got it like that here in da Chi-Tizzy.....The session may have rules....but so does the revolution....
Oh yeah, Janek the link is just fine that's my music sample page....I think it may be your comp.....
OK then - so how do you go about putting tunes on that web site?
GRY - enjoyed both sets and I agree the fiddling is grand altogether but to do the fiddler justice and give him credit for what you have published his name has to be revealed at once!!!
pretty nice fiddling (don't need to know h/is/er name, if s/he insists remaining anonymous, but out of courtessy, i'ld drop the name).
sounds like you play pretty steady too, though i find the bodhran-sound a bit too tense. loosen it up a bit maybe, and use more hand-muffling maybe?
for the 'fusion thing' i think this is a wrong way to start (set of reels/jigs). i would concentrate on only 1 tune, and take it appart, rip it to pieces and use it like any other sample.
for the bodhran bit: i think one exelent choise for putting the beats down as a hip-hop piece.
Frankly, I don't care what the fiddler's name is, whether it's male/female/undecided, or even if it's a hamster that didn't listen and took the brown acid.
All i care about is whether I can get a dumpster full of solo recordings; and in a plain, brown wrapper will be just fine. The sound is all the cred I need.
Ok, I'm willing to take a stab here at the mystery fiddler.
I guess that your fiddler is female, probably in her twenties. I guess that she has some sort of Liz Carroll connection, whether having had lessons, or spent some time in the Chicago area, or just likes Liz's style. There's also a bit of Martin Hayes in the jazzy, swingy, choppy thing she's got going on there.
Your fiddler is very good - the fiddle playing is definately modern (the rolls, the pacing, the choppier style with backbeat emphasis), but since you are doing "fusion" stuff it is perfect.
I agree with stefanpaz - dampen the bodhran so that the fiddle really comes through.
Mr Peacegry has asked how he can improve the track that he will not release to us for another three weeks.
Using the ancient art of divination by lying wrapped in a bulls hide underneath a waterfall, I have looked into the future and can offer the following:
There is a bum note in the seventeenth bar - I'm sure the f-natural should be a g. The attempt to rhyme "pickle" with "motorcycle" in verse 8 is rather clumsy. And the gratuitous use of the word "mother****er" in the fourth line of the slow movement is a little over the top - especially in view of the fact that the poor man is in hospital in Rome with breathing difficulties. The presentation of the group as a whole is brilliantly funny - dressing as 18th century irish-immigrant canal workers really shows off the name "Diggaz with Attitude" very well. I think the fade out at the end ought to be replaced with a single final chord, and the farmyard sounds are probably best replaced with something more in keeping with the theme of the work - perhaps a rolling mill. Beyond that, the only improvement I can see would be to remove all except the bodhran player from the line-up.
I hope these comments will be taken in the spirit of love and peace in which they are intended, and I trust that we can look forward to something really special when this work is finally unleashed onto the world.
I think I'm aware of the fiddle player as well 'picking up that fiddle'. He is very good, but no, I haven't heard anything about him in quite some time.
The bodhran playing was a bit dry for me. Nothing spectacular about it. I would suggest playing with someone more your equal, so that the concentration of the listener doesn't veer off to only the better player.
Okay everybody.....it's no secret that mostly everybody on either has it in for me or is confused by me....But to compare the fiddle to bodhran and fiddle is just dumb.....apples and oranges....
Plus we have won 6 straight competitions together. So think before you speak.
My drum skill goes way beyond ITM. The bodhran is just like any drum The possibilities beat wise are infinate....that means you can play to any style music you would like(ITM,Hip Hop,Rock,Alternative,etc.)....It's the craftsman not the tools. When the craftsman learns more so does his tool.....
Yes, I'm wondering if it's the same person I think I'm thinking the same on as I suspect you two are. (Um. Okay. Well, you guys probably know what I mean.) The only thing is that the double stopping is not quite the choice I'd've expected from the playing of who I think it might in fact be -- also, not quite as relaxed and easy as I'd have expected if it was who i think it was. But fine fiddling all the same.
On the other hand, my contact with the Chicago fiddlers is fairly limited, so maybe it's not.
No, you can't compare the two instruments...but I can say he was good, and you were not. He was good on the fiddle, you were not good on the bodhran. Is that more clear?
You were too stiff, and there was absolutely no variety in your playing "style".
I suggest lessons. I can suggest a fantastic bodhran player in Chicago if you are serious about playing. Let me know.
I don't care if you two won 6 competitions together, because I don't really consider duets at the Fleadh that hard to win...would you? I certainly hope not.
Well, Garry, if by "confused by me" you mean "don't understand what exactly you meant by asking for feedback on something that doesn't exist yet", I think you've probably got something right there. If you post asking a question that can't be answered, don't be surprised if people give you answers you don't like or feel are inappropriate.
Most people seem to think that the fiddle playing on the track is quite nice and that the bodhran playing is appropriate (although personally I've never been a big fan of the loud rim knocking thing, though certainly quite a few bodhran players seem to do it despite it driving most other players nuts, so I'd guess they don't care) and does not take away from the fiddling. Other than Dave, the rest of us haven't a window to the future and so can't tell you how to improve your fusion track, as it doesn't exist yet, as others have pointed out.
Given that many people here (though I'm not one of them) find the Comhaltas adjudicators laughably subjective and the very idea of competitions anathema, I'd say that perhaps touting your many competition wins may not be getting you exactly the effect you might be wishing for from this group of people -- this is not hip hop music and most people here won't understand that self-aggrandizement is accepted behavior in hip hop and other "street" sort of musics. It may, for most people here, just make you sound like a braggart. It's just not part of the accepted social behavior in Irish music.
The thing to do is to get one of your friends who *does* have the street cred among Irish players to tout your wins on the board, you see. That way you still look becomingly modest ("aw, hell, I was really on that day, was all, I'm still crap compared to the old guy I learned from") and like you might be someone who could be a good "hang". Which is largely what Irish players care about from another fellow player.
Look ya'll I do what I do.....but for me and those who like it. I'm a lot cooler than most of you think. I know I can't please everybody....trust me. I make music cause I want to. And I think all of you have proven what you know about hip hop(sh*te). Me on the other hand I have given ITM a chance. To see what is all about. To see what inspires the people to play this music with such passion. And guess what I found it....If you gave hip hop that chance, so would you find those answers too.
Judgments are not what I'm about. This is my turn to burn on this planet....and even though I know I will live a long while and then be back again for another turn...this is my time at this age and point and time to explore this world where no one is stopping me....so every experiance I can have ....I will.
I'm not just Hip Hop or ITM....I'm everything I have seen and heard. Gotta take advantage of being a living organism that can experiance things and suck up the information and filter it any way you like. For me that's a gift.....but I do understand for others it's a curse and a road-block.
I don't need approval to do my thing....I just share stuff with you cause I want to. I'm not humble, that's not my style. You guys are not the only one's that don't like what I do.....but there are others who do like it....and they are not stupid for thinking so...they are just who they are, I'm who I am, and you are who you are.....
God be with the days when people used sit round the fire, play a few tunes, speak in simple tones, and become friends, without any requiremint to be "aproved" by their peers.
"And I think all of you have proven what you know about hip hop(sh*te). Me on the other hand I have given ITM a chance."
After all, this is a site about sessions, not hip hop. And if people were interested in hip hop, I'm pretty sure they will give it a chance. It's just that most of us aren't... ;)
Actually, quite a few members of my extended family are into hip hop and other such. Don't assume that others don't also feel that they are the sum of all their experiences. If you don't want or need approval, don't ask for it, or, when you do, then don't mind if people give you the feedback that you in fact asked for. If you don't want to be humble, then you get to take the consequences of that choice - which include that people won't like you or what you do. *shrug* So long as you go into it with a clear idea of what your choices mean in terms of consequences.
Backer, everyone feels the need to be approved by their peers. It just depends on who they think their peers are. The "good old days" weren't very, if you look at them closely enough. ;)
Zina, I did'nt use the term "good old days", .....I was refering to the concept, which still exists even in modern times, where people go to a session just to enjoy themselves, in good company, without any hint of judgement, or any need for approval. I think everyone needs to be accepted, not necessarily approved by their peers.
It's a concept, sure, but as soon as you bring human beings into it, it all goes to hell. ;)
Of *course* everyone needs to be accepted. But they also want approval, even if it's by tacit acceptance and the approval only faint. If a kid comes up to show you something they've done, if you only say something like "what's that supposed to be?" instead of, "why, what a lovely picture you've drawn!" enough times, see how long that child will continue to draw you pictures.
Well, i've got my own good company coming by for some tunes, I'd better get a move on!
I admit, I haven't read any of the responses. Only listened to the second set you posted -- Fiddle / Percussion.
Percussion is not good. No, it's crappy. Where is the melody in the percussion? Percussion is playing high notes, low notes, and banging on the rim. Those seem to be the only tricks on display in this cut and they don't work.
Fiddling is very nice borderline excellent.
Fiddle would sound great solo. It would sound great backed up by a competent percussion player. It would sound great backed up by flute and guitar (it would sound decent backed up by a cat yowling)...
"I'm a lot cooler than most of you think. [...] Me on the other hand I have given ITM a chance. To see what is all about. To see what inspires the people to play this music with such passion. "
And the opinion and ambient temperature of my brain has just dropped to about 0 Kelvin....O_o Admitedly, that may be because I am a (youngish) old fogey, who would prefer to play for dancers, and usually only plays one or two tunes at a time....
Gry, you should receive an award for Most Economical Self-Promotion. You are the Tom Ridge of musical titillation. But beyond that, my opinion is that you are the Jimmy Buffet of Keltic Fyooshun. You're both talented and misunderstood just like Buffet was at the beginning of his career. Look what happened to him. His music took off; his popularity skyrocketed; he amassed tremendous wealth and fame, he golfs with state governors and has become an icon to generations of adoring fans. This is going to happen to you whether you want it to or not.
I would be envious of you but my invisible friend Timmy has informed me that envy is one of the seven deadly sins so I'm going to refrain from that. Bon voyage. I know its going to continue to be a great trip. And don't forget to use a latex barrier.
OK, I'm home. Had a listen. Sounds good. I'm assuming you have gone for an intentionally simple beat to avoid coming up with something that conflicts with whatever hip hop beat you come up with, and that you must plan to layer in some rolls and variations later. If that's the case, you have done a good job of keeping a beat, as has already been mentioned.
The main problem with this track is that your bodhran doesn't sound like a bodhran. I've tried to record my very nice, well-tuned bodhran for years and have never been able to come up with something that sounds remotely like a bodhran. Or it does at first, but then the tone disappears completely in the mix.
No matter how good your playing is, if you have your heart set on recording a bodhran track for this thing, then you'll have to play for hours recording the thing with various mic positions, various tensions, and various mixes until you find a combination that works as it should.
For what you're up to, you're better off faking it with samples. Still, if you're going to be stubborn about it, a friend of mine had his bodhran set up with a small condenser mic clipped to inside, pointed at the center of the drum, and from there he went through a DI into a bass amp, which was miked and fed through a reverb unit, and THAT sounded like a bodhran. Even better. But he gets brilliant tone to start with and the drums he makes are top notch. If your drum sounds like a wet rag slapped against an aluminum shed to start with, I'm afraid you're SOL.
I do wish people would stop picking on you. I find that annoying.
And this one if you want to be assured that lots of folks prefer straight rhythm, though they'll never admit it on one of your threads, due to that whole humility thing Zina was talking about.
Yep, I enjoyed that. The fiddler is brilliant, obviously, and I thougnt the bodhran playing was well in sympathy with it - which is a good thing, no? Can't tell much about the tone - I have crappy speakers (and proud of them!)
I think it would be a shame to add anything to this. But it's not mine, it's GRY's. Have fun with it GRY!
I'm just sooooo thankful you fine folks didn't unleash this thrashing on me and my techno rave 'irish tune' compilation (For the odd couple of you that may have heard my abismal attempt at fusion). That was a bad time in life and a bad time in music for me...and that's another story altogether. *But* for the benfit of GRY, I feel need to mention that there were actaully people who really liked what I did... and people who still ask for more stuff like it... but they were the folks who know only the maistream and nothing about the music. MOreover, they don't care to know anything. And I refuse to do it any more becasue it's a sellout. But ultimately, this just ain't the venue for that kind of experimentation Bra'.
There is thousands of years of wisdom between the people on this board, so, when they tell collectively tell you that you need to work on your craft, you should probably listen.
By the way, can anyone explain to me how being humble is part of a person's style. I thought a personality trait was a 'quality' not a 'style' feature? I'm having trouble seeing the difference. ...hmm maybe it's a 'virtue'...ok now I'm just f__k'd.
Well, I can't speak to that latter, there, Mike. ;) No, really. It's a "style" thing as well as a virtue. Kerri once likened it to being the exact opposite of the whole hip hop thing, as a matter of fact -- in hip hop, you have to earn the right to brag. In Irish, you earn the right to NOT brag. ;)
Mike, it's like this. I *know* I'm the smartest, cutest, funniest, most talented creature to illuminate the face of this planet since... whatserface there... Helen of Troy - that's it (I'm assuming here she must have been smart, funny, and talented in addition to her legendary physical qualities). But it simply won't do to prance around blabbing this totally hush-hush secret of mine all over town.
Knowing I'm brilliant is personality. Keeping it to myself is style, carefully cultivated for the purpose of nurturing friendships with folks who have yet to realize they, too are brilliant, and are put off by my overwhelming Irie.
Ah, sure Zina, of course I wasn't talking about you. There's a big difference between a frank and heartfelt opinion and a casual, tossed off snide remark.
LOL -- from now on, you're That Troy Babe in my book, kiddo. ;)
Aw, nah, I'm not brilliant, Ker. Perhaps a shade less bright than that. Okay, maybe a whole spectrum less bright. I consider myself "passable", actually.
I think I see your point about the hiphop bragging. But, I think perhaps I'm too analytical to understand how anyone could earn the right to not brag...hmmmm. Yeah, definitely missing the boat on that one. I'm going to meditate on it for a while.
Well, it's kind of like that English thing, where if someone says, "oh, well, I'm a bit keen on skiing" you know that they're probably the sort to spend every possible holiday skiing all the double blacks at all the really tough skiing mountains...
Here is the development of your typical trad musician broken down into phases:
Step one: Decide "Well, I'm never going to be Santana or Rachmaninov, but this stuff looks doable!" Get yourself the cheapest instrument you can find (if you're poor) or the most expensive (if you're rich). (At this point the entire price range between the two is irrelevant.)
Step two: Buy a book or video and take a pinch of lessons. Cover and let simmer for about a year.
Step three: Puffed up with excitement about your improvement over the past year and that crazy rush of knowing, like TWENTY WHOLE TUNES off by heart, decide it's time to go public.
Step four: Show up at a session, filled with unchecked enthusiasm, and do whatever it takes to make sure you get ALL TWENTY TUNES in during the night. Go home feeling like you've just ARRIVED. You've found your people. Your music. You promise to develop a taste for Guinness and give up your fancy grenadine-coloured cocktails forever.
Step five: Become obsessed. Put your Great Big Sea, Enya, and Natalie MacMaster CDs in the corner of some dark drawer and stock up on albums filled with nothing but tunes, straight up, rom beginning to end.
Step six: Try to make the sounds you hear on these albums.
Step seven: Realize you suck, and not only will you never be Santana or Rachmaninov, you will also never be Kevin Burke.
Fortunately, by this point the fondness for Guiness you've been carefully nurturing all this time has taken root.
Okay everybody.....After some thought and reading some of the stuff you posted I've come to a conclusion. Yes I do think I am one of the best bodhran players on this planet....but just one. The world is not a scale to me. When one thing is heavy the other is not light. My scales don't rise or fall....and so should no one else's.
I do believe I have earned the right to brag.....I have been through a great deal in ITM and I am still standing. Everything from skill, politics, race....you name it. But Hip Hop like I said is not all I am....my reason does not come from Hip Hop....it comes from me.
I am the only one who's complete job it is to brag about me. I leave that to no one but myself....and why should anyone else? They have thier own talents to show the world. And who best to do it than them?
I don't know why I keep posting here....I know how everyone feels about me. I come off cocky and maybe I am....but not without reason and skill to prove it. I have done things with the bodhran I thought was impossible. That's not to brag, but to say I look to prove things even to myself.....everyone else is secondary.
I'm glad some of you are listening to my other tracks. Please do....I work very hard on them. I do what I do in Hip Hop because like most of you I see it needs a change also. But so does ITM.....and everything deserves to evolve....the real question is who will have the courage to change it....and who will have the will to follow....?
It's interesting to read these reactions to Gry's tune samples and speculate how folks would have reacted if Gry didn't present himself with such a shameless ego. If he would have said something like, "Hi gang, I want you to listen to this track my friend and I put together -- we're very excited but would like some feedback." Instead of announcing how he's "the best bodran player" playing with the best “All Ireland” musicians and how we're going to be the next biggest thing crap, and then asking abstract questions about what we thought his music was going to sound like in the future. I’m going to answer as though he asked in the first, more humble way I suggested… ok? Had he asked without the egomania thing, I would have said something like; “Very nice Gry, especially the fiddling. You might want to work on the tone of the drum in the recording, and give a bit more thought to how your rhythm patterns might follow the tune a little better. Nice effort.” See how nice I can be?
"I have done things with the bodhran I thought was impossible. "
I think it would be impossible to fit a thousand pounds of elephant testicles into one, shimmy up a light post and dump the whole load on a passing motorcade without damaging the skin. Have you done that?
I cross-posted with Gry. After reading what he said after my last posting -- I take my nice comments back. Gry seems to me more like a crazy guy I've seen walking around in the Tenderloin who believes he's the real Mohammed Ali. I'm out of this thread.
And also because you love to write when you're stoned.
And because you can see that for the most part we are intelligent and literate people, and a great sample group to test how your ideas will be taken by the ITM community.
GRY - Have you asked your teacher for comments on the tracks? I would guess that he would be the person best able to judge this new work.
So many have said this so eloquently, but I guess it really does need to be said again because you don't seem to understand: as a musician, your music should speak for you - you shouldn't have to say a word about it. It's incredibly pompous to proclaim yourself one of the world's best ANYTHING. It's a big world GRY.
So if "everyone is secondary," than why the heck do you want our input and care what we think, if we are SOOOO inferior to your immense bodhran talent. Wake up -- the world doesn't revolve around you just as it doesn't revolve around me or anyone else. Unless you're Paris Hilton.
If you think that posting to this board seems like a waste of time, perhaps you should listen to that little voice in your head next time. But you obviously love to wallow in the negative attention, which is pathetic in itself. We might be nicer to you if you weren't so arrogant, as Jack pointed out.
No, you're an exceptional trad player because you don't drink.
When I'm not sharing the prevaricator's corner with Kerri feel free to join me in the coffee corner, if you can deal with the flatlander staring daggers at me all the time.
Paddy - you need to clarify at this point, because of international cultural differences.
In the UK, (I don't know about the rest of the world) Cider is a strongly alcoholic drink - typically around 6 to 8 % alcohol, (compared with Guinness at a mere 4.4%), so to say you don't drink, and then say you will have cider could be a little confusing outside the US.
I was talking to some US friends of my sister a couple of years back, and when cider was mentioned they seemed not to understand the significance of what was said, until my sister said "You guys would call this Hard Cider" - whereupon the US visitors developed saucer-eyes, and said in awed tones "You drink hard cider in pints?". (Remember also that a UK pint is 20 fluid ounces).
Funny thing Geoff - I too had begun to wonder whether this gry guy is just a wind up. Reminds me of a comment I heard once "he's a well balanced person - got a chip on each shoulder".
I've just read over this thread and its almost embarrasing...
Ok its a kid, who is full of confidence and enthusiasm...he hears Irish music, appreciates it but thinks to himself - hmm it needs a lift - probably the same thoughts with his second love - hip - hop...Thats fine - work away with it! Good man.
But just leave it at that GRY for gods sake - you really come across to me that you are winding people up, and its a waste of time and not fair to us who genunely want a discussion about the music. We are here to talk about our love for Irish music. Thats it. Not to start arguments. You have your opinions, you have your visions etc, but thats all they are - their yours.
Jack Gilder, Zina Lee, Showaddy..., me, Slainte - whoever visits this forum regularly - we have our opinions - but again thats all they are - opinions. doesnt make us right or wrong.
No one can comment on how something should be done, that has been done for a long time, and has evolved alot of times....we dont have the authority. We can give our opinion and our preferences and thats it, and if we can - play it, with out blowing our own trumpets.
It doesnt make us right or wrong....this music has been going on for a long time, and some of us (most of us) feel its too beautiful to be changed or challenged...but it doesnt mean beacause you are doing it I'd think of you as a bad person, or a
egotistical so and so....go for it - but do it and leave it be.
you are not the X-ibit of Celtic music ok - just accept it.
It annoys me that people give you a hard time, but i have to say now, You do look for it alot. You are a resonable bodhran player - well done. You still have alot of work to do, and you are off on alot of the beats, and your sound is tinny.
Id love to play with you, I admire your enthusiasm, your views, your beliefs, and your style, but ill tell you now if you came into a session where I live with the attitude you sometimes show, I can gurantee you, youd end up off O'connell street with your bodhran up ur ar*e.
Calm down, enjoy the music for what it is, stop winding people up, and stop believeing your mum when she tells you you are the best in the world. All our mums do that.
Oh, c'mon, Stefan ... why does it annoy you that people give him a hard time? It's inevitable, surely? The posturing and chest-beating are sure to rile from the outset; hijacking other people's music to link it with some alien format are guarnteed to seal the deal. A complete disrespect for generations of Irish musicians who have moulded the music into its current form, only to find that the fruit of all that labour, all that quiet unassuming crafting and honing ends up with the music being commodified. One more titbit from the global smorgasbord to be plundered by thieving magpies and used cynically for their own ends. That's why I, for one, feel compelled to comment on this travesty!
i hate people who think an say they are the best,
they always get me in trouble ...
mm
stefan, i fully agree with your point, everybody has to make the music he wants, but comming here again and again to ask our opinions, and braging about abilities, of which they cannot produce evidence, i don't know.
i gave an honest answer to the question, but mr GRY does not comment on that. so, why bother taking him serious?
anyway, this thread has so many reactions already, i think there must be an interest in this, be it out of curiosity for the fusion-thing or the personality on display here ...
i am surely having an amusing time following this thread.
It's all slightly reminiscent of our favourite Internet inhabitant, the mighty Troll. GRY have you ever considered work in the movie business? I hear Orcs are the in thing right now.
Outright meanness may lack elegance, Kerri, but there comes a point when it may be called for. If you're opposed to "whoremongering" the music, then sometimes you have to argue forcibly against it. However, in retrospect, Conanmay have hit the nail on the head, I'm afraid. Yer man's a classic troll, posting inflammatory remarks designed to get people's backs up and then coming over all hurt when he gets the inevitable response.
Every time I come back after completion of a work project(gets in the way of life!), the same or very similar discussion(s) is going on. It reminds me of the people at zoos throwing assorted treats to the animals to get a laugh! Funny reading for the a.m.
Gry indicated somewhere here that Irish Traditional Music needs to change as does hip hop. Music which stands the test of time does invariably get “toyed” with. But the heart of it remains constant. Trends come and go. Gry can do is do his fusion deal and either make a go it or fall flat on his face. The music will still be alive. Dave, a lot of people still enjoy listening to the Motorsickle song! Thanks for bringing that one up. I chuckle every time I think about it. The music does live on!
What sort of treatment would you give to someone who came into your local session demanding the right to change the nature of the session, telling you in an aggressive/patronising way that you have to listen to his opinions, but he doesn't have to listen to yours, cos he's as good as anyone, and has all the 'street cred" and any other cred he wants, and how you're all a load of stick-in-the-muds because you don't happen to share his own desire to try different sorts of music?
I think we've discussed this sort of thing a few times in the past, and have always agreed that a polite and non-violent response is the correct way to proceed.
But supposing the guy keeps coming back?
What then?
When does your response change? To some who do not know the history of the case, your response on, say, the third or fourth time might seem like "outright meanness" - but you yourself will know that gentle politeness has not worked, and it is time to be more forceful.
I suggest that this thread and it's predecessors are a "virtual session" equivalent of this.
Once again you guys only hear what you want. I'm not stealing the music or hijacking it. I am fusing two musics that I love.....can't you see that. Trying to create something that might be enjoyable to everybody. I'm not some idiot/creep sitting on his comp with very little power....if I wanted to start trouble, everyone would know......
For the record my mother never liked my bodhran playing....she did not understand it and she only went to see me play once(that's where the conversation about my mother ends).
I am very musical and I have much respect for music and what it does to people and lives. Have any of you really listened to my music on my page? That stuff is not easy to do...and even though none of you wish to do it....respect the craft....for I put time and effort into both without anyone telling me I'm the best.
Watch what you say about other kinds of music you do not give a chance(ie Hip Hop). From the outside ITM looks like a bunch of beer drinking hicks who sit and play this music just to drink all night and not go home to wifey and could not get a decent piece of p*ssy if they were born again. But we all know that is not the case is it.....the same with Hip Hop. To a lot of people, mostly colored.....Hip Hop is a voice for them. A political voice....in a get Bush out of office way. Puff Daddy ran the biggest side campaign to get Bush out of office...it was called "Vote or Die". Lets face it colored people have not really had a voice yet in this country....and Hip Hop provides that....sure it's got it's flaws. But I and a lot of people(young and old) love it. And no matter how much anyone hates ITM or Hip Hop they are not going anywhere......
Oh yeah, for the record....me in sessions. I am very cool. I sit and wait to be asked play....which sometime takes hours. Especailly if there are other bodhran players. Most times I just sit and listen, then I fill in for others who arms are tired or just wanna hear me play. I don't come in the pub/bar saying I'm the best.....that is not what sessions are for. That's the Fleadh. I go to sessions for the same reasons you guys do...to play, drink, smoke, talk, and maybe meet someone hot(sorry, I'm young). Oh yeah in those recordings my bodhran is very high I know.....my bad, I should have tunned it better....I do know what I am doing....
Well, then, Dave, to take your metaphor a little further, in this thread gry is actually the host. So you are at his session in a matter of speaking, and if you don't like it you're perfectly free to go next door to janiek's session and chat about finding gigs in Ireland, or up the street to rea's session and chat about finding your mojo. By now, we all ought to realize that when we're in one of gry's sessions, we can only chat about his projects, his ideas, hip hop, "trad contests" (now there's an oxymoron), and how good he is at everything. So why come into the pub KNOWING the host rubs you the wrong way, you hate the repertoire, and you're going to have a miserable time?
I disagree with your stretched metaphor Kerri - I see the whole of the discussion board as the session, and individual threads as individual conversations within the session. Sure - you can go away and talk to other people - but then where will it end? If you treat this one thread as a stand alone session and only go to others, I think you would end up with a much more fragmented affair, with whole threads and sections talking about things totally unrelated to ITM and the whole thing would cease to be a site about Irish Traditional Music and would become simply a free for all chat room.
GRY, having read this entire thread, and listened to the tracks...
I am not a professional musician or an adjudicator, and I don't care if you are the next Dennis Rodman or the next Mother Teresa. Chances are we'd get along just fine and enjoy a few tunes together if we ever met. I'd be glad to have the opportunity.
You simply asked for an evaluation of the tracks - and I like them well enough. I do feel, however, that the bodhran falls behind a tiny bit in spots. It seems to lag behind the beat, rather than stay on top of it. I'm probably not skilled enough with words to get my point across, but that is the best way that I can describe what I'm hearing.
Jack Gilder also made the comment that there are places where the percussion might follow the rhythm of the tune a little more closely. I agree.
I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, given your apparent credentials, and guess that you made a conscious choice to keep the percussion simpler, and not follow the tune when you could have? Perhaps in preparation for the fusion work you will be doing?
I can't comment on the sound or recording quality of the bodhran because I can only listen to the tracks thru the tinny little built-in speakers on my laptop - but it looks like some folks have given you some good advice on that.
So there you have it - a plain review of the tracks. Just stay on top of the beat a little more consistently and you'll be grand. I'm looking forward to hearing the finished product.
I don't know, Dave, I certainly don't read or participate in every single thread. I just pick the ones that look interesting to me. I haven't got a clue what's going on in the other ones. Since Gry only ever appears in threads he started himself and the topic and tone never vary, all you have to do is not participate in his discussions and you'll never have to deal with what you feel is his unacceptable attitude ever again.
Stef - "I don't know whether to laugh or cry". Laugh *until* you cry. Best of both worlds.
Personally, I think the whole thing is hilarious! Garry is just asking for it, Kerri and Stefan, and of course no one else should bother taking him as a personal affront; thankfully, the music'll be around for a hundred years at least despite any attempts to chip away at it.
For traditional music to stay alive it has to change, but it must change slowly to stay traditional. We come up with that every single time we talk about this. Therefore, we need both the thrashers and the floaters, the deep divers and the paddlers. Like all human conditions, we tend to swing wildly from end to end at any given time. If we have all ends covered, then we'll end up more or less staying in the middle.
Garry probably doesn't think of himself as a Troll even if the rest of us do. The fact that most here clearly think of him as a stirrer upper of messes (and that almost every time he posts there's lots of fuss) should probably tell him something that he should pay attention to if he cares about getting along, but he clearly doesn't care, as he equally clearly seems to feel it's his God-given mission to stir.
At least I know more or less where I *don't* want to go for some tunes while in Chicago! I DO like going to sessions to enjoy myself, not necessarily to be improved, even if I needled Backer about it. ;)
This thread, as well as GRY's others, have great entertainment value never mind the music. But it's sad that there's over 100 comments on this thread and only 11 regarding Martyn Bennett, who did exactly what GRY aspires to, regarding fusing traditional and electronic music forms, while playing every instrument himself into the bargain. Listening to Martin Bennett should be a humbling experience for anyone trying to produce such fusion music.
I too thought of that sometime yesterday, Ian! The thing is, at least by my observation, players like Martyn Bennett and Michael McGoldrick and the Lunasa boys and Eileen Ivers and Ashley MacIsaac and the many others who have done exactly this sort of thing tend to be 1) really really nice people who enjoy getting along with other people and who know how to navigate the general society we've got here, and 2) can play any traditional player under the table playing in the most traditional ways possible. Both things are important.
I remember once hearing about Eileen Ivers playing with her world music band at a festival, having to plead with departing audience members to give the music a chance, even though it wasn't her Irish stuff. I found that sad, because she's a stellar player in any genre or mix of genres, but I'll also admit that I don't really find myself interested in listening to her world beat stuff, and I don't think there's anything wrong with that, either.
I once was talking with a touring player after a lesson, and we were discussing whether it really was important to get along with other people or whether you can be that stereotyped bahstid who is put up with because of their excellent playing. He said, "You can't afford to be a jerk these days. Word gets around the promoters AND the players, and there's too many other good players available on tour for them to put up with prima donnas."
I hasten to add that I'd ever get up in the middle of a performance and leave, that's for sure, Eileen Ivers or whoever, unless for unusual provocation -- I've been onstage myself too many times to do that to another performer.
My friend Stu said to me about a year ago: "Eliot, you're starting to get good. Let me tell you something about being good. You are now an ambassador for the music: above all, be nice."
I don't think I have learned Stu's lesson yet, but I think of it often. It certainly applies to this thread.
Ok, sorry to take something of an actual dig at you, but you're another that's got the oldtimer giggling by trying to show me how to suck eggs.
Dude, I was born in East Harlem. My first exposure to hip hop came at a Kool Herc block party back in the early 70's. KH and Bambaataa are my age group peers. I was there when and where the sh*te was happenin'. It's my frickin' native tradition, and you're a punk kid in my face all about not knowing sh*te about hip hop.
I'm sorry, but I can't stop laughing.
Have you even heard of these people? Do you know anything about your own tradition, or are you like most of the kids I see writing about the history of hip hop on the web who think it all started with the neo-rap of the 90s?
And you know who one of the biggest influences on rap and hip hop was? Little Jewish white kid named Bobby Zimmerman who blew into town from Minnesota. He learned it from Woody Guthrie who called it "Talking Blues" and *he* got the notion from. . . square dance calling fiddlers, many of whom were Irish, playing Irish dance tunes.
There were Irish block parties in NYC too, and I loved the sh*te out of those as well. Once upon a time Little Ireland had a larger population than Dublin. A lot O' great fiddlin' done gone down in The City, and "K" is for Kevin.
And I've got no beef with your trying to combine the two, seeing as how dance fiddle music is the genesis of hip hop in the first place. I can't promise to like it, but I'll listen, and let you know. . .when I hear it, and not one minute before. So, like, just stop with the asking what I think about it before you've made it, 'K 'Bro?
"From the outside ITM looks like a bunch of beer drinking hicks who sit and play this music just to drink all night and not go home to wifey and could not get a decent piece of p*ssy if they were born again."
Oh man, ok, now you've got me rollin' on the floor. You should take this act to Second City or something. (My dad's family is Chicago. Once upon I time I had some street cred on your own streets too, but I ain't been around in a while. I admit I'm more at home back east. You take care of 'em for me, 'K?).
I'm really trying very, very hard to be on your side, but you're making it very, very hard.
"I disagree with your stretched metaphor Kerri"
Ahhhhh, well, I'm with Kerri on this one. If you're in the pub and there's some drunk over in the corner who throws his arm around you every time you go over there and starts telling you about his spleen operation. . . .you stop going over to that corner, don't you?
"The fact that most here clearly think of him as a stirrer upper of messes (and that almost every time he posts there's lots of fuss) should probably tell him something that he should pay attention to if he cares about getting along, but he clearly doesn't care, as he equally clearly seems to feel it's his God-given mission to stir."
Ah, well, that's really part of the hip hop culture. You're an oppressed minority (something the Irish in NYC and Chicago wouldn't know about, so that's why the Irish communities there don't share this culture) poor, powerless and one littte speck of dust in a city of millions. So you throw a hissy fit until mommy notices you. Trying to get along is completely foreign concept. Maybe you knock over the fishbowl or something. Ok, so you get your ass wupped over it, but at least you're getting atttention. It's just part of the schtick.
And a symptom of degraded civilization, but don't tell them that. They'll throw a hissy fit and knock over your fishbowl.
I've heard the same lesson as Eliot, from a number of well-known ambassadors of the music, who said that's how it was passed on to them by the previous generation. I think of it as an important if not integral part of the whole tradition--it's as much about building a social circle as it is about the tunes. And self-aggrandizement tends to interfere with that circle building.
Zina, that was me who watched Eileen Ivers lose her audience. It *was* sad--she was the headliner, but also the least traditional of all the bands that night. I'm not crazy about her world beat stuff either, but I stuck it out till the end. Though it was particularly hard to watch her lose not only the audience but also her (brilliant) uillean piper, who valiantly tried to keep up on the reggae numbers but couldn't quite manage it.
We used to play a theatre-sports game where one improvisor had to do a scene alone onstage and the audience was told to leave the theatre when they got bored. Brutal for the old ego, but a very effective way to learn what works and what doesn't.
I know I said "I'm out of this thread." but I'm compelled to read it for the same reason folks are compelled to look at car crashes. Gry's behavior in this, and others, reminds me of something else besides the crazy guy I mentioned who wanders the streets believing he's the real Mohammed Ali. There was this totally mental eejit who plagued our sessions around here for a while who thought he was going to blow our minds with how brilliant he was. The first time he showed up he had a walkman with headphones that he would place on people's heads during the session that featured him playing guitar in some session from Scotland. (Where he was from) Then, if he actually got someone to listen to it he would start rhythms on the guitar and call out the tune he thought it should go with. If he didn't get any takers, he would go back to soliciting listeners for his walkman. This happened back in the days when the sessions attracted 20 players/noodlers in the early 90s, but if he tried it now he'd be waddling away from the pub with the neck of his guitar placed securely in a place where the sun doesn't shine, and his walkman in the urinal where everyone could give it the attention it deserved.
The irony, just like with Gry perhaps, is that if you weren’t playing tunes – he was a decent (but mad) guy to chat with. A bit opinionated and obtuse, but in an entertaining way.
By the way, Gry, I’ll have you know that many of my musical pals happen to be cat lovers and have them at home to pet and adore all they want thank you.
Jack, did you read my story about my "gigging" in Ireland? I worked so hard on it but then the thread died so I have no idea if you're aware how thoroughly I answered your question. Pout, pout. Boo hoo. I was expecting some wise cracks.
'...couldn't get a decent piece of p*ssy if they were born again.'
Whatever!
Why don't you just play the music? And if you really feel the need to peacock around, I think you should go to West Clare and see how welcome your attitude is amongst the calibre of musicians there.
It just occurred to me what might have drawn Gry into ITM: He wanted to sit and play this music just to drink all night and get a decent piece of p*ssy -- and be born again. Now THAT"S inspiration.
I once watched a documentary about wacky foreign diets that went into great detail about the consumption of rats (I think it was in India) and the open vending of live puppies and kittens in an Asian market. I saw footage with my own eyes of live kittens being chosen from their cages by grocery shoppers, submerged alive in boiling water to loosen their hair for easy removal, then butchered, packaged, and paid for. I admit, I was disturbed at the time.
But, logical creature that I am, I can't see why the idea of eating a puppy or a kitten should be less appealing than eating an ickle baby cow or a bunny rabbit. (Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?)
So bring on the pussy! Why not? For dessert, I'll take some of those warm living monkey brains you scoop out with an elegant silver spoon.
(Although, it was West Africa, not India. Apologies to any Indians offended by my assumption they eat rats as well as any West Africans offended by my apology to the Indians).
In a way you're right, Kerri, but one fundamental difference is that the humane slaughter of grass eaters for food in "production quantites" is far easier than humane slaughter of dogs, cats and other animals who cannot be as easily controlled and who by definition will fight tooth and nail and are therefore almost certain to suffer injury and trauma in the process. So it's not *quite* the same.
There is a group of Indians who eat rats, they are itinerant rat catchers who work in family groups who charge grain farmers for their services ,and then live off the fruits of their labours. The rats they catch, though, are clean-living, grain-fed rural ones, not disease-ridden, garbage-fed city ones. I can't imagine these people would touch a city rat with a barge pole.
Yes! It's Friday and I'm long overdue to go home. I hear a fiddle calling ...
Does anyone out there know two psychology students? One of them can play fiddle passably well, and one has a bodhran.
They are working on a project aimed at studying peoples reactions to provocation about a subject dear to them, and have lighted on the idea of creating an outrageous virtual character, who will cleverly wind up the regular subscribers to a discussion board.
They have designed this character very well, and even his "pseudo-speech" on the discussion board is written very carefully to give the impression of a 'street-cred yoof' - note the use of rows of full stops to represent the idea of the sort of sentenceless/breathless babble that such a person might be expected to speak - presumably in the belief that the arrival of such a person will in itself cause something of a stir.
Sometimes, however, their need for a speedy reaction causes them to write his part with a little less rehearsal. This tends to be around their characters fourth or fifth post in each thread, where the need to keep up the stirring becomes more urgent.
Take a look.
But remember that your every move is being watched.
I only found your early name last night when following a lead for Mells Irish Festival from a few years a go!
Actually all I was going to ask was wasn't there a difference between a bodhran player and a chiropodist...like one of them bucks up your feet...something like that anyway...
"Humane slaughter" Oxymoron if ever I heard one. Although saying that I' d prefer to have a bolt in the back of the head than what they do to veal calves. Anyway, are we going off topic here? Um, what was the question?
I tried goat. I thought it tasted exactly like you'd expect - sort of like an ugly version of sheep.
Here's a bit more tangent for you Kerri: on the old humane killing thing - I always wonder when people talk of "putting a cat/dog/gerbil/penguin out of its misery" - don't they really mean "I'll put it out of my misery"?
I dunno, Dave. The last cat we had have put down due to illness and old age caused huge amounts of trauma in our house. (Although we had a most lovely young vet back then, who came out on her lunch with a tech to put my husband's beloved cat Spock down in our backyard in my husband's lap. His ashes are buried there under a white rose that he loved to sleep under in the summer.) I'm not looking forward to the day Barkley, the next oldest cat, dies.
Showaddy, they may very well be phych students... I think if it's true, then GRY has just finished the chapter about histrionic and narcissitic personality disorders and wanted a real live demonstration of the it's effects.
One of our cat has started requesting (by standing at the back door and saying "mrooooouwww!") to go out back and barf once a day. We're planning a trip to the vet later, but any advice will be gratefully accepted!
We suspect bulemia, actually. His brother has gotten very plump and seems comfortable with it, but Timmy's as skinny as a rake. Wouldn't get a second look at a West African delicacy mart.
No, it means when he goes out, he's actually looking for some p*ssy. You know. People are into some pretty wacky things. Being the best in the world can get a bit boring. You have to get creative.
Gry wouldn't like our sessions. Sometimes I scan the room and I think if someone walked in and didn't know better they'd think it was a gay bar for ugly guys.
Kerri, nobody's been feeding me *fairy stories*, sorry.
Current slaughtering practices are not what *I* would call humane at all, which is one of the reasons we don't eat animals, but even so, raising and handling herd animals in large numbers has greater possibilities for humane treatment that meat eaters with totally different instincts and behaviour. The fact that you don't have to scruff a cow to restrain it is precisely the point. Herd animals can be herded. It's a topic that's been given a fair but of research and thought round here, on both sides of the equation, and farming is something I do know a bit about, so differing viewpoint, yes, but fairy stories, no, 'fraid not.
I'm with you though when you say the best bits of this thread are the tangents!
Ahem, to bring this back to music: I have at last found my copy of Orchesographie, the Renaissance dance manual that I couldn't find for daiv a few weeks ago to answer his question about repeats in early dances. Arbeau the dancing master, in instructing pupil Capriol in the many social and physical benefits of dancing and expressing withering contempt for those who would suppress it, finishes off by saying, "We take part in such rejoicing to celebrate ... in spite of the abhorrence of reformers, which latter deserve to be fed upon goat's meat cooked in a pie *without bacon*".
Sorry, Kerri, that reads a bit snappy. Lessavanuthergo.
I don't think we should eat any animals, personally. That said, when people say we eat cows and sheep, *therefore* there's no reason why we shouldn't eat cats and dogs because it's *exactly the same thing* once we put sentimentality aside, I take issue with the logic of the statement, due to the fundamental differences in the animals' natural behaviour. But it's arguing a point of philosophy as far as I'm concerned because I don't think we should eat any animals, personally.
And I'll shut up now. Back to the topic ... whichever one of the several on offer you think is worth pursuing ...
Read this and tell me if this sounds more humane to you than just keeping a puppy in a little cage until he's big enough to eat, then eating him. (That's exactly what we do to our chickens. No big deal, right? As long as it's a chicken. And not a puppy. Because... uh... chickens can be... herded. Right? and... uh... puppies can't... Just let me know if I've misrepresented your position.)
Just because humane treatment of cattle is *possible * doesn't mean it's the norm.
(I've never argued with another vegetarian about vegetarianism before! How thrilling!)
So I guess it's like this: guy musicians go to sessions to leave 'wifey' at home and seek out 'decent p*ssy'. And the girl musicians go in search of vegetarian wieners!
Oh, I'm totally a hypocrite, myself. I love meat of all sorts, but if I had to butcher the poor things myself, I suspect I'd probably quickly become a confirmed vegetarian. Actually, they've done lots of tests and studies and they think houseplants identify emotionally with their owners, anyone else remember those airplane takeoff studies they did? So maybe there's no such thing as humane eating.
See, Zina, I'm the opposite. Vegetarian for 15 years, disgusted by the commercial practice of raising for consumption anything that can look me in the eye, but I'd happily scarf back a bunny if I caught it out in the wild and wrung its furry ickle neck myself.
Sometimes I go to the park and look at those big fat carps swimming around in the Asian garden and think "mmmmmm... that looks delicious!" I've tried it, they let you touch them. WIth a little practice...
Yum! Sheep brains! Another point I'm going to bring up while I wait for this evening's musical companion to arrive...
Are we going to consider the physical damage and psychological trauma inflicted on the *human* employees at your typical slaughterhouse compared to those in your average Asian produce market?
At a cattle slaughterhouse, empoyees regularly suffer injuries ranging from repetitive stress to the loss of limbs. The people hired to *clean* the place have been known to die from exposure to the chemicals they use. As a meat-eating human, would you rather stand in the same position for 8 hours a day or more shooting bolt after bolt into the the heads of live cows, or spend part of your day, haggling, part of your day shooting the bull abut the weather, part of the day killing puppies, and the rest of the night counting your money?
I didn't say it's the norm, Kerri, in fact, I said it *isn't*, and I also said that that's that's one of the reasons (only one) that we're vegetarian. Given the current state of the nation, it's a philosophical point, as I've already said, not one based on current animal welfare reality. (I know all about feedlots, can *still* smell 'em, too.)
'Fraid I will have to shut up at this point, Kerri, as I've got three gigs breathing down our f-holes here and X hours of work infrunname and X/2 hours to do it in. You haven't *quite* misrepresented my position, but the crux of the argument is in the ramifications of the animals' different natural behaviours combined with the natural behaviour of humans whenever commercial interests are involved, and how that makes the conditions required for at least basic animal welfare standards different in each case.
The reality is though that while large-scale commercial interests are involved, no animal will ever be treated well. Without writing an in-depth treatise though I think we'll just end up repeating ourselves from here and probably boring the audience who are probably well and truly bored with this thread already, so I'll go back to my chart-writing ;-(
Have fun playing tonight, Kerri! (Well it's last night from where I sit, nearly lunchtime here.)
Reading some of the comments on my other thread brought up an important point I felt I really needed a separate thread for it. I hope that's ok.
First off, I’m not a psychology project and I’m nobody’s creation….
But here’s how it goes....No one but me is responsible for anything I say.....I work alone. I am a loner, trust me...... I know you guys can understand why no one would want to associate with me. Just cause someone plays fiddle with me doesn't make them my parole officer, mother/father or manager.... that means the fiddler has nothing to do what-so-ever with what I do and say.
I don't want anyones dirt and no one should have to carry mine as the price for not treating me like sh*te or actually enjoying knowing me or playing with me. So listen good...I am long past the days of being manipulated by anyone in my life....the things I do belong to me and me alone. If you don’t like what I say, don't try and get to me by using others to do so......I'll tell you now, there’s no point. I do what I wish.
Yo, someone on this site said they knew a good Chi-Town bodhran teacher....who is that person you spoke of?
I think some of you at least enjoyed the tracks….that’s what it’s all about. The fusion one will probably be done sooner than planned….you guys will be the first to know.
Please, just play music, and hang out with other people who play music, and chit chat, and talk about tunes, and talk about other things. Accept that everyone of us has work to do, we all want to be better, right? But leave all the extra stuff out! It's not necessary! I mean, come on! There's young young young people, kids even, who play better than most of us could ever hope to! Just know that, keep making music, and don't cast so much bread upon the water, and no one is gonna have any problem with a blend of trad and hip hop! (already done by Black 47 among others).
Good luck in what you do, it's just that humility is 100 times more attractive than grandiose statements and throw downs! Think about it!
Gry, go back, read the thread, find the comment about the Chicago teacher, click on the little orange name that appears beneath it, in the member profile that comes up, click on "send an email", ask your question, and Bob's your uncle.
GRY I've been reading your threads, and have decided that you are so damn cool and amazing that I actually want to *be* you. Please tell me more about yourself so that I can teach myself to be like you. I love your music and bow down to you. I want a poster of you. Is there anywhere I can order one off the net?
Best,
Dow
Well thank you for the compliment.....The best thing I can say is that you have to be who you are.....but it's not that simple I know. It's the journey to find yourself that is the fun part(if you let it be). Everyone knows it's easy to fit in and not start trouble.....But that often leads to full life with an empty heart. That sucks....A full life and full heart is ideal.....but an empty life and full heart is a start(it's were i'm at). You'll see the more you do for yourself the more people will do for you. Remember you can't please everybody.....and everybody can't please you.....so don't try. There are those who will support and there are those who don't.
As for Kevin Rice.....thanks but been there before, I'm one of his more accomplished students....That time is over for me....I move forward not backward...
That would be NTI. And when he becomes you, I want to become him but I don't want to relocate because I've become too accustomed to how water flows down drains where I live.
Gry, it's wierd, I love you and hate you at the same time. I love you because you make me laugh an you make everybody else uncomfortable, but I hate you because you never have any new material.
Be creative. You're a refreshing change, but you're too predictable. Try *listening* to people once in a while instead of just pressing "play". You know? I've listened to your rap, I've read a bit of your philosophy before it got deleted, and I know you aren't a one trick pony. I know you have more than one song to sing.
Seriously. When you come home and check your messages, do you just sit there and play the "Hi! Gary can't come to the phone right now, but if you leave a message, Im'a call y'all right back. Peace." over and over again, or are you interested in who might have called?
". . . disgusted by the commercial practice of raising for consumption anything that can look me in the eye, but I'd happily scarf back a bunny if I caught it out in the wild and wrung its furry ickle neck myself."
No, I'm not going to scarf back any bunnies, but if I *were* so inclined I'd be with you. This is one vegetarian who respects the Nuge more than he does many of "his fellow" vegetarians.
Kevin, I'll be candid. Occasionally my body craves meat. I do my best to comply, but anything that comes in a bloody plastic wrapped packet makes me feel sick. If I *need* to eat it, I ought to be willing to kill it before I cook it. I know I can't kil a cow. If it came down to a cage match, the cow would win. If I were hungry enough, here is the ranking of sentient beings I would happily murder:
1: OK, how "sentient" is a mollusc? (research required)
2: Fish
3: Those infuriating wild turkeys I chased for hours in my knickers with my cousin a couple years back after his girlfriend's dog pooped on my leg.
4: My cousin's girlfriend's dog.
5: Anything I shot in the wilderness with a gun.
6: The fattest of the shipwreck survivors.
Now, where do "cows" fit into this, you ask? I just don't eat them. I never would. They are an abomination. I'm not a bovine rights activist, I honestly think there should be no such thing as cows. All they do is crap and pee on land I could use to grow hash browns and porridge.
i agree with kerri, you've posted here a handful of times, however each time you are saying the same things over and over again.
if you are out to convince everyone of your talents and beliefs in relation to ITM, don't bother.
there are people who support you... and there are others who don't. get over it.
its almost like you keep posting just to get reactions from people... but maybe thats me.
and as for kevin rice, i personally have never heard a better bodhran player.. i think he is bloody amazing!!
and as i told you in your last post, when you asked what we thought of the tracks you posted with that fiddle player, i said that i thought you didn't play with any style variety or even sometimes you weren't really on the beat... it might not hurt to brush up on some stuff... esp. since you've said that you've been out of the game for a couple of years....
Fiddle picker upper, you too should give me something to call you.
I've finished my beer and gotten into the whiskey. (Begods, if you could hear this little reel that sprung up after the whiskey hit me! ... but you can't, I'm afraid. Got to dig up five auld tchoons before I post another of my own.)
GRY,
go on pay the money and get the professional help you need.
You seem to have an attention seeking disorder or something to that nature, they have very good treatments available today for that kind of thing. Why make yourself suffer any longer?
Go on... pick up the phone and make that call......
Garry, thanks for this post. I feel like it is finally you that is talking here. There is the bravado, but there is some humility there, some realness. I know D the fiddler better, but I know that if he is laying down tracks for you, that you are OK.
That's it man, OK. Not the best in the world, not the best in the midwest. Just OK. And from there...
Well GRY, your definitely going down a storm here.All your threads (which are all about you) get a deluge of responses.You come out with a helluva lot of bull but then you come out with something like that bit about having an empty life & a full heart which is touching in it's honesty.
I have absolutely no interest in your fusion thing but go on being who you are & feck the begrudgers
(not like you need any telling : )
Ih? If ye ever get up tae Glesga oan yer trevels pye a visit tae Drumchapel, Easterhouse or Possilpark. Ye'll git aw the attention ye waant therr. Yamugye
Start your engines.......
Start your engines.......
Here's a precursor to the ITM/Hip Hop track...but guess what? It's not the fuse track yet.....It's just straight ol' ITM, with me on the bodhran.
The fusetrack will be here in two-three weeks. You know I love feed back....follow the link....Let me know based on this track how I can improve the fusion track...
P.S. The tunes are the first two on list.....They also will be uploaded to "The Mighty Craic Online"....but I wanted you to get this new ish now....
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/9/theastonishinggrymusic.htm
PEACE
GRY
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by GRY
Re: Start your engines.......
"Let me know based on this track how I can improve the fusion track..."
Sure, but first you have to tell me based on my last car design how I can improve my next boat design. Is this a habit of yours, asking people to critique things that don't exist yet? I remain clueless as to how to participate in this.
"It's just straight ol' ITM, with me on the bodhran."
And this track I can actually comment on, what with being able to actually listen to it and all, and I think it's pretty decent. I only have one question, is it possible to get some solo fiddle tracks out of that guy? : )
Oh, and tone down the reverb just a hair, if you will.
Or quit playing in the shower. Whichever.
KFG
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by KFG
Re: Start your engines.......
Yeah, who's the fiddler? Sounds vaguely familiar to me...
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
That's some great fiddling.
For a fusion track, you'll probably want to drop the bodhran in favour of some high-end electronic percussion loops. Be careful with that though, 'cause it's easy to make that sort of thing sound rubbish.
Unfortunately, for a successful, say, hiphop or jungle/breakbeat fusion, you'll have to reduce the fiddle to a mere sample that you then must loop creatively. It'll be no mean feat, and I don't think you'll find many people who'll appreciate it, no matter how well done it is. But as long as you're amusing yourself and your friends I don't see the harm.
But yeah, who's the fiddler?
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by Q
Re: Start your engines.......
Yeah....ya'll like that fiddle huh? That means I come with tha heat....But the fiddle player is mine....My secret weapon....now I'm not so stupid on this site huh? I got those music connections.....
PEACE
GRY
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by GRY
Re: Start your engines.......
Coat tails.
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by Q
Re: Start your engines.......
Knee pads. You must be a physicist too.
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by joesmith
Re: Start your engines.......
In training. So far, I've only split hairs and infinitives. Working my way up to atoms. Or down to atoms, rather. It's all about finding the right chisel, I'm told.
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by Q
Re: Start your engines.......
Curiously, that extremely blunt instrument, the party balloon, is just the right chisel.
If you wish to split atom, however, you'll need a finer tool. Like maybe a very, very small party balloon.
KFG
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by KFG
Re: Start your engines.......
"But the fiddle player is mine....My secret weapon"
Well if you want "Sess Cred" you will just have to play by the rules and tell us who is playing the fiddle. I suppose you have noticed, GRY, that everyone is more interested in the fiddle playing than the bodhran or any possible fusion/fission that might occur.
Those who come with "tha heat" may leave in flames☺
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by Donough
Re: Start your engines.......
Hello Peace Gry. Nice to be reading from you again.
I can't access the link. Is it dead or is it my 'oldschool' computer?
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by EastPole
Re: Start your engines.......
So here's the deal....I'm not holding any information to be mean. The fiddle player wants to remain unknown....and that's how it will stay. Like I need "Sess Cred"....I got "street cred" and any other cred I want. Like I'm actually going to listen to any of you cause you demand things(please, this is real Chi-Town).
Same goes for the fusion track. These are my fam doing me a solid. They are not here for you, they are here to help me. Basically any musical project I wanna do....I can....cause we got it like that here in da Chi-Tizzy.....The session may have rules....but so does the revolution....
Oh yeah, Janek the link is just fine that's my music sample page....I think it may be your comp.....
PEACE
GRY
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by GRY
Re: Start your engines.......
The fiddler wants to remain anonymous? Well, I guess that's understandable. Tars and brushes, etc.
Still, this is all very entertaining. Tell us again why it's important to you to keep us in the loop? I demand to know!
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by Q
Re: Start your engines.......
"The fiddler wants to remain anonymous"
Taxman thing?
Criminal record?
Tommy Peoples moonlighting???
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by cunnla
Re: Start your engines.......
enjoyed especially the first tune set (.. crow-morning dew...) and want to know: who played the fiddle???
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by crannog
Re: Start your engines.......
OK then - so how do you go about putting tunes on that web site?
GRY - enjoyed both sets and I agree the fiddling is grand altogether but to do the fiddler justice and give him credit for what you have published his name has to be revealed at once!!!
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by breandan
Re: Start your engines.......
Or her name - of course!!
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by breandan
Re: Start your engines.......
pretty nice fiddling (don't need to know h/is/er name, if s/he insists remaining anonymous, but out of courtessy, i'ld drop the name).
sounds like you play pretty steady too, though i find the bodhran-sound a bit too tense. loosen it up a bit maybe, and use more hand-muffling maybe?
for the 'fusion thing' i think this is a wrong way to start (set of reels/jigs). i would concentrate on only 1 tune, and take it appart, rip it to pieces and use it like any other sample.
for the bodhran bit: i think one exelent choise for putting the beats down as a hip-hop piece.
mm
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by MM
Re: Start your engines.......
Frankly, I don't care what the fiddler's name is, whether it's male/female/undecided, or even if it's a hamster that didn't listen and took the brown acid.
All i care about is whether I can get a dumpster full of solo recordings; and in a plain, brown wrapper will be just fine. The sound is all the cred I need.
KFG
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by KFG
Re: Start your engines.......
Yes, it was my comp. I got past the problem and had a go at your tunes.
Very nice pieces. Fiddler is really good, and I must say your Irish drum playing is also sound - you keep the tempo.
Take care
Janek
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by EastPole
Re: Start your engines.......
The Bodhran is nice GRY a little resonant maybe though - how about dampening a little more...
Its nice though.
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by Hugo Chavez
Re: Start your engines.......
Ok, I'm willing to take a stab here at the mystery fiddler.
I guess that your fiddler is female, probably in her twenties. I guess that she has some sort of Liz Carroll connection, whether having had lessons, or spent some time in the Chicago area, or just likes Liz's style. There's also a bit of Martin Hayes in the jazzy, swingy, choppy thing she's got going on there.
Your fiddler is very good - the fiddle playing is definately modern (the rolls, the pacing, the choppier style with backbeat emphasis), but since you are doing "fusion" stuff it is perfect.
I agree with stefanpaz - dampen the bodhran so that the fiddle really comes through.
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by violynnsey
Re: Start your engines.......
maybe the fiddler only wishes to remain anonymous until she hears the finished product. ;^)
Can't listen at work, GRY, but I'm all in a tizzy. Can't wait to hear it.
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
Why are none of you answering the question?
Mr Peacegry has asked how he can improve the track that he will not release to us for another three weeks.
Using the ancient art of divination by lying wrapped in a bulls hide underneath a waterfall, I have looked into the future and can offer the following:
There is a bum note in the seventeenth bar - I'm sure the f-natural should be a g. The attempt to rhyme "pickle" with "motorcycle" in verse 8 is rather clumsy. And the gratuitous use of the word "mother****er" in the fourth line of the slow movement is a little over the top - especially in view of the fact that the poor man is in hospital in Rome with breathing difficulties. The presentation of the group as a whole is brilliantly funny - dressing as 18th century irish-immigrant canal workers really shows off the name "Diggaz with Attitude" very well. I think the fade out at the end ought to be replaced with a single final chord, and the farmyard sounds are probably best replaced with something more in keeping with the theme of the work - perhaps a rolling mill. Beyond that, the only improvement I can see would be to remove all except the bodhran player from the line-up.
I hope these comments will be taken in the spirit of love and peace in which they are intended, and I trust that we can look forward to something really special when this work is finally unleashed onto the world.
DOUBLE PEACE (and no returns)
Dave
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by showaddydadito
Re: Start your engines.......
Hmmm ur a big fan then Dave?
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by Hugo Chavez
Re: Start your engines.......
the fiddle player is from chicago, right? and its a HE, i believe... i recognize the playing.
he is a great fiddler... used to hear of him more often, but not in the last couple of years.
perhaps try a little variety in the bodhran playing? you keep the rythym, but thats mainly it.
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by picking up that fiddle
Re: Start your engines.......
I think I'm aware of the fiddle player as well 'picking up that fiddle'. He is very good, but no, I haven't heard anything about him in quite some time.
The bodhran playing was a bit dry for me. Nothing spectacular about it. I would suggest playing with someone more your equal, so that the concentration of the listener doesn't veer off to only the better player.
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by BTCpz
Re: Start your engines.......
Okay everybody.....it's no secret that mostly everybody on either has it in for me or is confused by me....But to compare the fiddle to bodhran and fiddle is just dumb.....apples and oranges....
Plus we have won 6 straight competitions together. So think before you speak.
My drum skill goes way beyond ITM. The bodhran is just like any drum The possibilities beat wise are infinate....that means you can play to any style music you would like(ITM,Hip Hop,Rock,Alternative,etc.)....It's the craftsman not the tools. When the craftsman learns more so does his tool.....
PEACE
GRY
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by GRY
Re: Start your engines.......
Yes, I'm wondering if it's the same person I think I'm thinking the same on as I suspect you two are. (Um. Okay. Well, you guys probably know what I mean.) The only thing is that the double stopping is not quite the choice I'd've expected from the playing of who I think it might in fact be -- also, not quite as relaxed and easy as I'd have expected if it was who i think it was. But fine fiddling all the same.
On the other hand, my contact with the Chicago fiddlers is fairly limited, so maybe it's not.
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
GRY,
No, you can't compare the two instruments...but I can say he was good, and you were not. He was good on the fiddle, you were not good on the bodhran. Is that more clear?
You were too stiff, and there was absolutely no variety in your playing "style".
I suggest lessons. I can suggest a fantastic bodhran player in Chicago if you are serious about playing. Let me know.
I don't care if you two won 6 competitions together, because I don't really consider duets at the Fleadh that hard to win...would you? I certainly hope not.
.
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by BTCpz
Re: Start your engines.......
Oops. Cross posted.
Well, Garry, if by "confused by me" you mean "don't understand what exactly you meant by asking for feedback on something that doesn't exist yet", I think you've probably got something right there. If you post asking a question that can't be answered, don't be surprised if people give you answers you don't like or feel are inappropriate.
Most people seem to think that the fiddle playing on the track is quite nice and that the bodhran playing is appropriate (although personally I've never been a big fan of the loud rim knocking thing, though certainly quite a few bodhran players seem to do it despite it driving most other players nuts, so I'd guess they don't care) and does not take away from the fiddling. Other than Dave, the rest of us haven't a window to the future and so can't tell you how to improve your fusion track, as it doesn't exist yet, as others have pointed out.
Given that many people here (though I'm not one of them) find the Comhaltas adjudicators laughably subjective and the very idea of competitions anathema, I'd say that perhaps touting your many competition wins may not be getting you exactly the effect you might be wishing for from this group of people -- this is not hip hop music and most people here won't understand that self-aggrandizement is accepted behavior in hip hop and other "street" sort of musics. It may, for most people here, just make you sound like a braggart. It's just not part of the accepted social behavior in Irish music.
The thing to do is to get one of your friends who *does* have the street cred among Irish players to tout your wins on the board, you see. That way you still look becomingly modest ("aw, hell, I was really on that day, was all, I'm still crap compared to the old guy I learned from") and like you might be someone who could be a good "hang". Which is largely what Irish players care about from another fellow player.
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
Look ya'll I do what I do.....but for me and those who like it. I'm a lot cooler than most of you think. I know I can't please everybody....trust me. I make music cause I want to. And I think all of you have proven what you know about hip hop(sh*te). Me on the other hand I have given ITM a chance. To see what is all about. To see what inspires the people to play this music with such passion. And guess what I found it....If you gave hip hop that chance, so would you find those answers too.
Judgments are not what I'm about. This is my turn to burn on this planet....and even though I know I will live a long while and then be back again for another turn...this is my time at this age and point and time to explore this world where no one is stopping me....so every experiance I can have ....I will.
I'm not just Hip Hop or ITM....I'm everything I have seen and heard. Gotta take advantage of being a living organism that can experiance things and suck up the information and filter it any way you like. For me that's a gift.....but I do understand for others it's a curse and a road-block.
I don't need approval to do my thing....I just share stuff with you cause I want to. I'm not humble, that's not my style. You guys are not the only one's that don't like what I do.....but there are others who do like it....and they are not stupid for thinking so...they are just who they are, I'm who I am, and you are who you are.....
PEACE
GRY
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by GRY
Re: Start your engines.......
I think the people who say they like it are lying to you...
seriously.
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by BTCpz
Re: Start your engines.......
God be with the days when people used sit round the fire, play a few tunes, speak in simple tones, and become friends, without any requiremint to be "aproved" by their peers.
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by Backer
Re: Start your engines.......
"And I think all of you have proven what you know about hip hop(sh*te). Me on the other hand I have given ITM a chance."
After all, this is a site about sessions, not hip hop. And if people were interested in hip hop, I'm pretty sure they will give it a chance. It's just that most of us aren't... ;)
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by Pontus Adefjord
Re: Start your engines.......
Actually, quite a few members of my extended family are into hip hop and other such. Don't assume that others don't also feel that they are the sum of all their experiences. If you don't want or need approval, don't ask for it, or, when you do, then don't mind if people give you the feedback that you in fact asked for. If you don't want to be humble, then you get to take the consequences of that choice - which include that people won't like you or what you do. *shrug* So long as you go into it with a clear idea of what your choices mean in terms of consequences.
Backer, everyone feels the need to be approved by their peers. It just depends on who they think their peers are. The "good old days" weren't very, if you look at them closely enough. ;)
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
Zina, I did'nt use the term "good old days", .....I was refering to the concept, which still exists even in modern times, where people go to a session just to enjoy themselves, in good company, without any hint of judgement, or any need for approval. I think everyone needs to be accepted, not necessarily approved by their peers.
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by Backer
Re: Start your engines.......
It's a concept, sure, but as soon as you bring human beings into it, it all goes to hell. ;)
Of *course* everyone needs to be accepted. But they also want approval, even if it's by tacit acceptance and the approval only faint. If a kid comes up to show you something they've done, if you only say something like "what's that supposed to be?" instead of, "why, what a lovely picture you've drawn!" enough times, see how long that child will continue to draw you pictures.
Well, i've got my own good company coming by for some tunes, I'd better get a move on!
# Posted on February 2nd 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
I admit, I haven't read any of the responses. Only listened to the second set you posted -- Fiddle / Percussion.
Percussion is not good. No, it's crappy. Where is the melody in the percussion? Percussion is playing high notes, low notes, and banging on the rim. Those seem to be the only tricks on display in this cut and they don't work.
Fiddling is very nice borderline excellent.
Fiddle would sound great solo. It would sound great backed up by a competent percussion player. It would sound great backed up by flute and guitar (it would sound decent backed up by a cat yowling)...
OK, all MHO of course,
E
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Eliot
Re: Start your engines.......
"I'm a lot cooler than most of you think. [...] Me on the other hand I have given ITM a chance. To see what is all about. To see what inspires the people to play this music with such passion. "
And the opinion and ambient temperature of my brain has just dropped to about 0 Kelvin....O_o Admitedly, that may be because I am a (youngish) old fogey, who would prefer to play for dancers, and usually only plays one or two tunes at a time....
" I'm not humble, that's not my style."
Humility is more than just a style, grasshopper.
~a Phádraig
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Pádraig
Re: Start your engines.......
Oh God this is depressing! That someone could SO COMPLETELY miss the point of EVERYTHING to do with the music. What sort of monsters have we reared?
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Aidan Crossey
Re: Start your engines.......
"Never trust the artist. Trust the tale"
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Bren
Re: Start your engines.......
Gry, you should receive an award for Most Economical Self-Promotion. You are the Tom Ridge of musical titillation. But beyond that, my opinion is that you are the Jimmy Buffet of Keltic Fyooshun. You're both talented and misunderstood just like Buffet was at the beginning of his career. Look what happened to him. His music took off; his popularity skyrocketed; he amassed tremendous wealth and fame, he golfs with state governors and has become an icon to generations of adoring fans. This is going to happen to you whether you want it to or not.
I would be envious of you but my invisible friend Timmy has informed me that envy is one of the seven deadly sins so I'm going to refrain from that. Bon voyage. I know its going to continue to be a great trip. And don't forget to use a latex barrier.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by joesmith
Re: Start your engines.......
OK, I'm home. Had a listen. Sounds good. I'm assuming you have gone for an intentionally simple beat to avoid coming up with something that conflicts with whatever hip hop beat you come up with, and that you must plan to layer in some rolls and variations later. If that's the case, you have done a good job of keeping a beat, as has already been mentioned.
The main problem with this track is that your bodhran doesn't sound like a bodhran. I've tried to record my very nice, well-tuned bodhran for years and have never been able to come up with something that sounds remotely like a bodhran. Or it does at first, but then the tone disappears completely in the mix.
No matter how good your playing is, if you have your heart set on recording a bodhran track for this thing, then you'll have to play for hours recording the thing with various mic positions, various tensions, and various mixes until you find a combination that works as it should.
For what you're up to, you're better off faking it with samples. Still, if you're going to be stubborn about it, a friend of mine had his bodhran set up with a small condenser mic clipped to inside, pointed at the center of the drum, and from there he went through a DI into a bass amp, which was miked and fed through a reverb unit, and THAT sounded like a bodhran. Even better. But he gets brilliant tone to start with and the drums he makes are top notch. If your drum sounds like a wet rag slapped against an aluminum shed to start with, I'm afraid you're SOL.
I do wish people would stop picking on you. I find that annoying.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
SO would that be how Lunny gets his bodhrán to be a bodhrán? :D
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Pádraig
Re: Start your engines.......
Probably.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
Read this thread, gry. Lots of good ideas in there:
http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display.php/3675/comments#comment74257
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
And this one if you want to be assured that lots of folks prefer straight rhythm, though they'll never admit it on one of your threads, due to that whole humility thing Zina was talking about.
;^)
http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display.php/2008/comments#comment35965
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
"I make music cause I want to. And I think all of you have proven what you know about hip hop(sh*te)."
You made me giggle again. Thank you.
By the way. I've done a bit of fiddling to "Aw Yeah." I think Dave LaFlame could do something with that. Give him a call.
KFG
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by KFG
Re: Start your engines.......
Yep, I enjoyed that. The fiddler is brilliant, obviously, and I thougnt the bodhran playing was well in sympathy with it - which is a good thing, no? Can't tell much about the tone - I have crappy speakers (and proud of them!)
I think it would be a shame to add anything to this. But it's not mine, it's GRY's. Have fun with it GRY!
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by kris
Re: Start your engines.......
Some of us learn here, and some of us burn here.
I'm just sooooo thankful you fine folks didn't unleash this thrashing on me and my techno rave 'irish tune' compilation
(For the odd couple of you that may have heard my abismal attempt at fusion). That was a bad time in life and a bad time in music for me...and that's another story altogether. *But* for the benfit of GRY, I feel need to mention that there were actaully people who really liked what I did... and people who still ask for more stuff like it... but they were the folks who know only the maistream and nothing about the music. MOreover, they don't care to know anything. And I refuse to do it any more becasue it's a sellout. But ultimately, this just ain't the venue for that kind of experimentation Bra'.
There is thousands of years of wisdom between the people on this board, so, when they tell collectively tell you that you need to work on your craft, you should probably listen.
By the way, can anyone explain to me how being humble is part of a person's style. I thought a personality trait was a 'quality' not a 'style' feature? I'm having trouble seeing the difference. ...hmm maybe it's a 'virtue'...ok now I'm just f__k'd.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by c_ya
Re: Start your engines.......
Well, I can't speak to that latter, there, Mike. ;) No, really. It's a "style" thing as well as a virtue. Kerri once likened it to being the exact opposite of the whole hip hop thing, as a matter of fact -- in hip hop, you have to earn the right to brag. In Irish, you earn the right to NOT brag. ;)
And Kerri -- I pick 'cause I care. ;)
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
Mike, it's like this. I *know* I'm the smartest, cutest, funniest, most talented creature to illuminate the face of this planet since... whatserface there... Helen of Troy - that's it (I'm assuming here she must have been smart, funny, and talented in addition to her legendary physical qualities). But it simply won't do to prance around blabbing this totally hush-hush secret of mine all over town.
Knowing I'm brilliant is personality. Keeping it to myself is style, carefully cultivated for the purpose of nurturing friendships with folks who have yet to realize they, too are brilliant, and are put off by my overwhelming Irie.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
Ah, sure Zina, of course I wasn't talking about you. There's a big difference between a frank and heartfelt opinion and a casual, tossed off snide remark.
(And did I ever tell you you're brilliant?)
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
LOL -- from now on, you're That Troy Babe in my book, kiddo. ;)
Aw, nah, I'm not brilliant, Ker. Perhaps a shade less bright than that. Okay, maybe a whole spectrum less bright. I consider myself "passable", actually.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
Are you, by any chance, familiar with that unit of measurement known as the millihelen?
KFG
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by KFG
Re: Start your engines.......
The second it takes to realize that Kerri outshines Helen of Troy?
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
I think I see your point about the hiphop bragging. But, I think perhaps I'm too analytical to understand how anyone could earn the right to not brag...hmmmm. Yeah, definitely missing the boat on that one. I'm going to meditate on it for a while.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by c_ya
Re: Start your engines.......
That quantity of beauty required to launch a single ship.
KFG
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by KFG
Re: Start your engines.......
You know, this is seriously cutting into my Learning with Jim Dorans night!
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by c_ya
Re: Start your engines.......
"they are just who they are, I'm who I am, and you are who you are" - Gry
You got us there, Gry. I don't think you'll get any argument from us on this point.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Phantom Button
Re: Start your engines.......
Well, it's kind of like that English thing, where if someone says, "oh, well, I'm a bit keen on skiing" you know that they're probably the sort to spend every possible holiday skiing all the double blacks at all the really tough skiing mountains...
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
Well, Mike, since you asked...
Here is the development of your typical trad musician broken down into phases:
Step one: Decide "Well, I'm never going to be Santana or Rachmaninov, but this stuff looks doable!" Get yourself the cheapest instrument you can find (if you're poor) or the most expensive (if you're rich). (At this point the entire price range between the two is irrelevant.)
Step two: Buy a book or video and take a pinch of lessons. Cover and let simmer for about a year.
Step three: Puffed up with excitement about your improvement over the past year and that crazy rush of knowing, like TWENTY WHOLE TUNES off by heart, decide it's time to go public.
Step four: Show up at a session, filled with unchecked enthusiasm, and do whatever it takes to make sure you get ALL TWENTY TUNES in during the night. Go home feeling like you've just ARRIVED. You've found your people. Your music. You promise to develop a taste for Guinness and give up your fancy grenadine-coloured cocktails forever.
Step five: Become obsessed. Put your Great Big Sea, Enya, and Natalie MacMaster CDs in the corner of some dark drawer and stock up on albums filled with nothing but tunes, straight up, rom beginning to end.
Step six: Try to make the sounds you hear on these albums.
Step seven: Realize you suck, and not only will you never be Santana or Rachmaninov, you will also never be Kevin Burke.
Fortunately, by this point the fondness for Guiness you've been carefully nurturing all this time has taken root.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
Ah! I see, you're talking my language now...all it takes is a sking analogy and the world makes sense to me
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by c_ya
"from" not "rom"
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
Okay everybody.....After some thought and reading some of the stuff you posted I've come to a conclusion. Yes I do think I am one of the best bodhran players on this planet....but just one. The world is not a scale to me. When one thing is heavy the other is not light. My scales don't rise or fall....and so should no one else's.
I do believe I have earned the right to brag.....I have been through a great deal in ITM and I am still standing. Everything from skill, politics, race....you name it. But Hip Hop like I said is not all I am....my reason does not come from Hip Hop....it comes from me.
I am the only one who's complete job it is to brag about me. I leave that to no one but myself....and why should anyone else? They have thier own talents to show the world. And who best to do it than them?
I don't know why I keep posting here....I know how everyone feels about me. I come off cocky and maybe I am....but not without reason and skill to prove it. I have done things with the bodhran I thought was impossible. That's not to brag, but to say I look to prove things even to myself.....everyone else is secondary.
I'm glad some of you are listening to my other tracks. Please do....I work very hard on them. I do what I do in Hip Hop because like most of you I see it needs a change also. But so does ITM.....and everything deserves to evolve....the real question is who will have the courage to change it....and who will have the will to follow....?
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by GRY
Re: Start your engines.......
It's interesting to read these reactions to Gry's tune samples and speculate how folks would have reacted if Gry didn't present himself with such a shameless ego. If he would have said something like, "Hi gang, I want you to listen to this track my friend and I put together -- we're very excited but would like some feedback." Instead of announcing how he's "the best bodran player" playing with the best “All Ireland” musicians and how we're going to be the next biggest thing crap, and then asking abstract questions about what we thought his music was going to sound like in the future. I’m going to answer as though he asked in the first, more humble way I suggested… ok? Had he asked without the egomania thing, I would have said something like; “Very nice Gry, especially the fiddling. You might want to work on the tone of the drum in the recording, and give a bit more thought to how your rhythm patterns might follow the tune a little better. Nice effort.” See how nice I can be?
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Phantom Button
Re: Start your engines.......
"I have done things with the bodhran I thought was impossible. "
I think it would be impossible to fit a thousand pounds of elephant testicles into one, shimmy up a light post and dump the whole load on a passing motorcade without damaging the skin. Have you done that?
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
That is nice, Jack, Are you feeling OK?
And GRY, you keep posting here because deep down inside you're a sh*t disturber.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
I cross-posted with Gry. After reading what he said after my last posting -- I take my nice comments back. Gry seems to me more like a crazy guy I've seen walking around in the Tenderloin who believes he's the real Mohammed Ali. I'm out of this thread.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Phantom Button
And also because you love to write when you're stoned.
And because you can see that for the most part we are intelligent and literate people, and a great sample group to test how your ideas will be taken by the ITM community.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
GRY - Have you asked your teacher for comments on the tracks? I would guess that he would be the person best able to judge this new work.
So many have said this so eloquently, but I guess it really does need to be said again because you don't seem to understand: as a musician, your music should speak for you - you shouldn't have to say a word about it. It's incredibly pompous to proclaim yourself one of the world's best ANYTHING. It's a big world GRY.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by kate-dowling
Re: Start your engines.......
So if "everyone is secondary," than why the heck do you want our input and care what we think, if we are SOOOO inferior to your immense bodhran talent. Wake up -- the world doesn't revolve around you just as it doesn't revolve around me or anyone else. Unless you're Paris Hilton.
If you think that posting to this board seems like a waste of time, perhaps you should listen to that little voice in your head next time. But you obviously love to wallow in the negative attention, which is pathetic in itself. We might be nicer to you if you weren't so arrogant, as Jack pointed out.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by violynnsey
Re: Start your engines.......
LOL -- Kerri, your Development of the Typical Player is a CLASSIC...!
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
Susie
Susie Creamcheese
This is the voice of your conscience speaking . . .
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by joesmith
Re: Start your engines.......
Am I not a trad player then because I don't drink, eh KerrI? :( :P
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Pádraig
Re: Start your engines.......
No, you're an exceptional trad player because you don't drink.
When I'm not sharing the prevaricator's corner with Kerri feel free to join me in the coffee corner, if you can deal with the flatlander staring daggers at me all the time.
KFG
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by KFG
Re: Start your engines.......
Sorry, man, but coffee just don't jive with my system... ;)
I'll have a mug of hot apple cider.
And sure enough, the man hasn't even heard me play.. ;-P
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Pádraig
Re: Start your engines.......
Paddy - you need to clarify at this point, because of international cultural differences.
In the UK, (I don't know about the rest of the world) Cider is a strongly alcoholic drink - typically around 6 to 8 % alcohol, (compared with Guinness at a mere 4.4%), so to say you don't drink, and then say you will have cider could be a little confusing outside the US.
I was talking to some US friends of my sister a couple of years back, and when cider was mentioned they seemed not to understand the significance of what was said, until my sister said "You guys would call this Hard Cider" - whereupon the US visitors developed saucer-eyes, and said in awed tones "You drink hard cider in pints?". (Remember also that a UK pint is 20 fluid ounces).
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by showaddydadito
Re: Start your engines.......
Good Grief!
I have only just caught this thread and have come to a worrying conclusion...
Is GRY Tanya? Is s/he f**kin' gorgeous too?
The same self-procalimed virtuousity, the monstrous ego the incipient paranoia.
We deserve to be told!
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Geoff Pollitt
Re: Start your engines.......
Funny thing Geoff - I too had begun to wonder whether this gry guy is just a wind up. Reminds me of a comment I heard once "he's a well balanced person - got a chip on each shoulder".
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by showaddydadito
Re: Start your engines.......
This is insane!!
I've just read over this thread and its almost embarrasing...
Ok its a kid, who is full of confidence and enthusiasm...he hears Irish music, appreciates it but thinks to himself - hmm it needs a lift - probably the same thoughts with his second love - hip - hop...Thats fine - work away with it! Good man.
But just leave it at that GRY for gods sake - you really come across to me that you are winding people up, and its a waste of time and not fair to us who genunely want a discussion about the music. We are here to talk about our love for Irish music. Thats it. Not to start arguments. You have your opinions, you have your visions etc, but thats all they are - their yours.
Jack Gilder, Zina Lee, Showaddy..., me, Slainte - whoever visits this forum regularly - we have our opinions - but again thats all they are - opinions. doesnt make us right or wrong.
No one can comment on how something should be done, that has been done for a long time, and has evolved alot of times....we dont have the authority. We can give our opinion and our preferences and thats it, and if we can - play it, with out blowing our own trumpets.
It doesnt make us right or wrong....this music has been going on for a long time, and some of us (most of us) feel its too beautiful to be changed or challenged...but it doesnt mean beacause you are doing it I'd think of you as a bad person, or a
egotistical so and so....go for it - but do it and leave it be.
you are not the X-ibit of Celtic music ok - just accept it.
It annoys me that people give you a hard time, but i have to say now, You do look for it alot. You are a resonable bodhran player - well done. You still have alot of work to do, and you are off on alot of the beats, and your sound is tinny.
Id love to play with you, I admire your enthusiasm, your views, your beliefs, and your style, but ill tell you now if you came into a session where I live with the attitude you sometimes show, I can gurantee you, youd end up off O'connell street with your bodhran up ur ar*e.
Calm down, enjoy the music for what it is, stop winding people up, and stop believeing your mum when she tells you you are the best in the world. All our mums do that.
PEACE
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Hugo Chavez
Re: Start your engines.......
lol, stef. Very well put.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
Oh, c'mon, Stefan ... why does it annoy you that people give him a hard time? It's inevitable, surely? The posturing and chest-beating are sure to rile from the outset; hijacking other people's music to link it with some alien format are guarnteed to seal the deal. A complete disrespect for generations of Irish musicians who have moulded the music into its current form, only to find that the fruit of all that labour, all that quiet unassuming crafting and honing ends up with the music being commodified. One more titbit from the global smorgasbord to be plundered by thieving magpies and used cynically for their own ends. That's why I, for one, feel compelled to comment on this travesty!
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Aidan Crossey
Re: Start your engines.......
gosh . . . .
Dr David Banner is not alone.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by showaddydadito
Re: Start your engines.......
i hate people who think an say they are the best,
they always get me in trouble ...
mm
stefan, i fully agree with your point, everybody has to make the music he wants, but comming here again and again to ask our opinions, and braging about abilities, of which they cannot produce evidence, i don't know.
i gave an honest answer to the question, but mr GRY does not comment on that. so, why bother taking him serious?
anyway, this thread has so many reactions already, i think there must be an interest in this, be it out of curiosity for the fusion-thing or the personality on display here ...
i am surely having an amusing time following this thread.
mm
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by MM
Re: Start your engines.......
It's all slightly reminiscent of our favourite Internet inhabitant, the mighty Troll. GRY have you ever considered work in the movie business? I hear Orcs are the in thing right now.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Start your engines.......
Aidan, I find it annoying because outright mean-ness seems to just fuel the fire in this case, and also lacks elegance.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
Outright meanness may lack elegance, Kerri, but there comes a point when it may be called for. If you're opposed to "whoremongering" the music, then sometimes you have to argue forcibly against it. However, in retrospect, Conanmay have hit the nail on the head, I'm afraid. Yer man's a classic troll, posting inflammatory remarks designed to get people's backs up and then coming over all hurt when he gets the inevitable response.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Aidan Crossey
Re: Start your engines.......
Good Morning/Afternoon/Evening Everyone!
Every time I come back after completion of a work project(gets in the way of life!), the same or very similar discussion(s) is going on. It reminds me of the people at zoos throwing assorted treats to the animals to get a laugh! Funny reading for the a.m.
Gry indicated somewhere here that Irish Traditional Music needs to change as does hip hop. Music which stands the test of time does invariably get “toyed” with. But the heart of it remains constant. Trends come and go. Gry can do is do his fusion deal and either make a go it or fall flat on his face. The music will still be alive. Dave, a lot of people still enjoy listening to the Motorsickle song! Thanks for bringing that one up. I chuckle every time I think about it. The music does live on!
Deb.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Agnes Nutter
Re: Start your engines.......
What sort of treatment would you give to someone who came into your local session demanding the right to change the nature of the session, telling you in an aggressive/patronising way that you have to listen to his opinions, but he doesn't have to listen to yours, cos he's as good as anyone, and has all the 'street cred" and any other cred he wants, and how you're all a load of stick-in-the-muds because you don't happen to share his own desire to try different sorts of music?
I think we've discussed this sort of thing a few times in the past, and have always agreed that a polite and non-violent response is the correct way to proceed.
But supposing the guy keeps coming back?
What then?
When does your response change? To some who do not know the history of the case, your response on, say, the third or fourth time might seem like "outright meanness" - but you yourself will know that gentle politeness has not worked, and it is time to be more forceful.
I suggest that this thread and it's predecessors are a "virtual session" equivalent of this.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by showaddydadito
Re: Start your engines.......
Once again you guys only hear what you want. I'm not stealing the music or hijacking it. I am fusing two musics that I love.....can't you see that. Trying to create something that might be enjoyable to everybody. I'm not some idiot/creep sitting on his comp with very little power....if I wanted to start trouble, everyone would know......
For the record my mother never liked my bodhran playing....she did not understand it and she only went to see me play once(that's where the conversation about my mother ends).
I am very musical and I have much respect for music and what it does to people and lives. Have any of you really listened to my music on my page? That stuff is not easy to do...and even though none of you wish to do it....respect the craft....for I put time and effort into both without anyone telling me I'm the best.
Watch what you say about other kinds of music you do not give a chance(ie Hip Hop). From the outside ITM looks like a bunch of beer drinking hicks who sit and play this music just to drink all night and not go home to wifey and could not get a decent piece of p*ssy if they were born again. But we all know that is not the case is it.....the same with Hip Hop. To a lot of people, mostly colored.....Hip Hop is a voice for them. A political voice....in a get Bush out of office way. Puff Daddy ran the biggest side campaign to get Bush out of office...it was called "Vote or Die". Lets face it colored people have not really had a voice yet in this country....and Hip Hop provides that....sure it's got it's flaws. But I and a lot of people(young and old) love it. And no matter how much anyone hates ITM or Hip Hop they are not going anywhere......
PEACE
GRY
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by GRY
Re: Start your engines.......
Oh yeah, for the record....me in sessions. I am very cool. I sit and wait to be asked play....which sometime takes hours. Especailly if there are other bodhran players. Most times I just sit and listen, then I fill in for others who arms are tired or just wanna hear me play. I don't come in the pub/bar saying I'm the best.....that is not what sessions are for. That's the Fleadh. I go to sessions for the same reasons you guys do...to play, drink, smoke, talk, and maybe meet someone hot(sorry, I'm young). Oh yeah in those recordings my bodhran is very high I know.....my bad, I should have tunned it better....I do know what I am doing....
PEACE
GRY
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by GRY
Re: Start your engines.......
Oh my God -
Why do I go Red on behalf of you everytime you write something GRY.
Please stop man - I really don't know whether to laugh or cry.
Post your tune - say here it is , and please stop wasting peoples time, and shouting your mouth off.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Hugo Chavez
Re: Start your engines.......
Well, then, Dave, to take your metaphor a little further, in this thread gry is actually the host. So you are at his session in a matter of speaking, and if you don't like it you're perfectly free to go next door to janiek's session and chat about finding gigs in Ireland, or up the street to rea's session and chat about finding your mojo. By now, we all ought to realize that when we're in one of gry's sessions, we can only chat about his projects, his ideas, hip hop, "trad contests" (now there's an oxymoron), and how good he is at everything. So why come into the pub KNOWING the host rubs you the wrong way, you hate the repertoire, and you're going to have a miserable time?
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
well said...pity i lost my temper at the host back there!
but he goes too far!
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Hugo Chavez
Re: Start your engines.......
I disagree with your stretched metaphor Kerri - I see the whole of the discussion board as the session, and individual threads as individual conversations within the session. Sure - you can go away and talk to other people - but then where will it end? If you treat this one thread as a stand alone session and only go to others, I think you would end up with a much more fragmented affair, with whole threads and sections talking about things totally unrelated to ITM and the whole thing would cease to be a site about Irish Traditional Music and would become simply a free for all chat room.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by showaddydadito
Re: Start your engines.......
Isnt that what it is already......???
Posts about broccoli, bearded musicians etc???
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Hugo Chavez
Re: Start your engines.......
"I'm not some idiot/creep sitting on his comp with very little power....if I wanted to start trouble, everyone would know......"
At first, I was angry with this thread, but now the laughing has begun...
"From the outside ITM looks like a bunch of beer drinking hicks who sit and play this music just to drink all night [...]"
Hey! What's wrong with that? :P
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Pontus Adefjord
Re: Start your engines.......
GRY, having read this entire thread, and listened to the tracks...
I am not a professional musician or an adjudicator, and I don't care if you are the next Dennis Rodman or the next Mother Teresa. Chances are we'd get along just fine and enjoy a few tunes together if we ever met. I'd be glad to have the opportunity.
You simply asked for an evaluation of the tracks - and I like them well enough. I do feel, however, that the bodhran falls behind a tiny bit in spots. It seems to lag behind the beat, rather than stay on top of it. I'm probably not skilled enough with words to get my point across, but that is the best way that I can describe what I'm hearing.
Jack Gilder also made the comment that there are places where the percussion might follow the rhythm of the tune a little more closely. I agree.
I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, given your apparent credentials, and guess that you made a conscious choice to keep the percussion simpler, and not follow the tune when you could have? Perhaps in preparation for the fusion work you will be doing?
I can't comment on the sound or recording quality of the bodhran because I can only listen to the tracks thru the tinny little built-in speakers on my laptop - but it looks like some folks have given you some good advice on that.
So there you have it - a plain review of the tracks. Just stay on top of the beat a little more consistently and you'll be grand. I'm looking forward to hearing the finished product.
Peace, indeed. All the best.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by browndog
Re: Start your engines.......
I don't know, Dave, I certainly don't read or participate in every single thread. I just pick the ones that look interesting to me. I haven't got a clue what's going on in the other ones. Since Gry only ever appears in threads he started himself and the topic and tone never vary, all you have to do is not participate in his discussions and you'll never have to deal with what you feel is his unacceptable attitude ever again.
Stef - "I don't know whether to laugh or cry". Laugh *until* you cry. Best of both worlds.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
Personally, I think the whole thing is hilarious! Garry is just asking for it, Kerri and Stefan, and of course no one else should bother taking him as a personal affront; thankfully, the music'll be around for a hundred years at least despite any attempts to chip away at it.
For traditional music to stay alive it has to change, but it must change slowly to stay traditional. We come up with that every single time we talk about this. Therefore, we need both the thrashers and the floaters, the deep divers and the paddlers. Like all human conditions, we tend to swing wildly from end to end at any given time. If we have all ends covered, then we'll end up more or less staying in the middle.
Garry probably doesn't think of himself as a Troll even if the rest of us do. The fact that most here clearly think of him as a stirrer upper of messes (and that almost every time he posts there's lots of fuss) should probably tell him something that he should pay attention to if he cares about getting along, but he clearly doesn't care, as he equally clearly seems to feel it's his God-given mission to stir.
At least I know more or less where I *don't* want to go for some tunes while in Chicago! I DO like going to sessions to enjoy myself, not necessarily to be improved, even if I needled Backer about it. ;)
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
This thread, as well as GRY's others, have great entertainment value never mind the music. But it's sad that there's over 100 comments on this thread and only 11 regarding Martyn Bennett, who did exactly what GRY aspires to, regarding fusing traditional and electronic music forms, while playing every instrument himself into the bargain. Listening to Martin Bennett should be a humbling experience for anyone trying to produce such fusion music.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by ian clark
Re: Start your engines.......
I too thought of that sometime yesterday, Ian! The thing is, at least by my observation, players like Martyn Bennett and Michael McGoldrick and the Lunasa boys and Eileen Ivers and Ashley MacIsaac and the many others who have done exactly this sort of thing tend to be 1) really really nice people who enjoy getting along with other people and who know how to navigate the general society we've got here, and 2) can play any traditional player under the table playing in the most traditional ways possible. Both things are important.
I remember once hearing about Eileen Ivers playing with her world music band at a festival, having to plead with departing audience members to give the music a chance, even though it wasn't her Irish stuff. I found that sad, because she's a stellar player in any genre or mix of genres, but I'll also admit that I don't really find myself interested in listening to her world beat stuff, and I don't think there's anything wrong with that, either.
I once was talking with a touring player after a lesson, and we were discussing whether it really was important to get along with other people or whether you can be that stereotyped bahstid who is put up with because of their excellent playing. He said, "You can't afford to be a jerk these days. Word gets around the promoters AND the players, and there's too many other good players available on tour for them to put up with prima donnas."
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Zina Lee
P.S.
I hasten to add that I'd ever get up in the middle of a performance and leave, that's for sure, Eileen Ivers or whoever, unless for unusual provocation -- I've been onstage myself too many times to do that to another performer.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Zina Lee
P.P.S.
"never" not "ever" *sigh*
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
On being nice...
My friend Stu said to me about a year ago: "Eliot, you're starting to get good. Let me tell you something about being good. You are now an ambassador for the music: above all, be nice."
I don't think I have learned Stu's lesson yet, but I think of it often. It certainly applies to this thread.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Eliot
Re: Start your engines.......
"sorry, I'm young"
Nooooooooooooooo! Really?
Ok, sorry to take something of an actual dig at you, but you're another that's got the oldtimer giggling by trying to show me how to suck eggs.
Dude, I was born in East Harlem. My first exposure to hip hop came at a Kool Herc block party back in the early 70's. KH and Bambaataa are my age group peers. I was there when and where the sh*te was happenin'. It's my frickin' native tradition, and you're a punk kid in my face all about not knowing sh*te about hip hop.
I'm sorry, but I can't stop laughing.
Have you even heard of these people? Do you know anything about your own tradition, or are you like most of the kids I see writing about the history of hip hop on the web who think it all started with the neo-rap of the 90s?
And you know who one of the biggest influences on rap and hip hop was? Little Jewish white kid named Bobby Zimmerman who blew into town from Minnesota. He learned it from Woody Guthrie who called it "Talking Blues" and *he* got the notion from. . . square dance calling fiddlers, many of whom were Irish, playing Irish dance tunes.
There were Irish block parties in NYC too, and I loved the sh*te out of those as well. Once upon a time Little Ireland had a larger population than Dublin. A lot O' great fiddlin' done gone down in The City, and "K" is for Kevin.
And I've got no beef with your trying to combine the two, seeing as how dance fiddle music is the genesis of hip hop in the first place. I can't promise to like it, but I'll listen, and let you know. . .when I hear it, and not one minute before. So, like, just stop with the asking what I think about it before you've made it, 'K 'Bro?
"From the outside ITM looks like a bunch of beer drinking hicks who sit and play this music just to drink all night and not go home to wifey and could not get a decent piece of p*ssy if they were born again."
Oh man, ok, now you've got me rollin' on the floor. You should take this act to Second City or something. (My dad's family is Chicago. Once upon I time I had some street cred on your own streets too, but I ain't been around in a while. I admit I'm more at home back east. You take care of 'em for me, 'K?).
I'm really trying very, very hard to be on your side, but you're making it very, very hard.
"I disagree with your stretched metaphor Kerri"
Ahhhhh, well, I'm with Kerri on this one. If you're in the pub and there's some drunk over in the corner who throws his arm around you every time you go over there and starts telling you about his spleen operation. . . .you stop going over to that corner, don't you?
"The fact that most here clearly think of him as a stirrer upper of messes (and that almost every time he posts there's lots of fuss) should probably tell him something that he should pay attention to if he cares about getting along, but he clearly doesn't care, as he equally clearly seems to feel it's his God-given mission to stir."
Ah, well, that's really part of the hip hop culture. You're an oppressed minority (something the Irish in NYC and Chicago wouldn't know about, so that's why the Irish communities there don't share this culture) poor, powerless and one littte speck of dust in a city of millions. So you throw a hissy fit until mommy notices you. Trying to get along is completely foreign concept. Maybe you knock over the fishbowl or something. Ok, so you get your ass wupped over it, but at least you're getting atttention. It's just part of the schtick.
And a symptom of degraded civilization, but don't tell them that. They'll throw a hissy fit and knock over your fishbowl.
KFG
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by KFG
Re: Start your engines.......
I've heard the same lesson as Eliot, from a number of well-known ambassadors of the music, who said that's how it was passed on to them by the previous generation. I think of it as an important if not integral part of the whole tradition--it's as much about building a social circle as it is about the tunes. And self-aggrandizement tends to interfere with that circle building.
Zina, that was me who watched Eileen Ivers lose her audience. It *was* sad--she was the headliner, but also the least traditional of all the bands that night. I'm not crazy about her world beat stuff either, but I stuck it out till the end. Though it was particularly hard to watch her lose not only the audience but also her (brilliant) uillean piper, who valiantly tried to keep up on the reggae numbers but couldn't quite manage it.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Will CPT
Re: Start your engines.......
We used to play a theatre-sports game where one improvisor had to do a scene alone onstage and the audience was told to leave the theatre when they got bored. Brutal for the old ego, but a very effective way to learn what works and what doesn't.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
I know I said "I'm out of this thread." but I'm compelled to read it for the same reason folks are compelled to look at car crashes. Gry's behavior in this, and others, reminds me of something else besides the crazy guy I mentioned who wanders the streets believing he's the real Mohammed Ali. There was this totally mental eejit who plagued our sessions around here for a while who thought he was going to blow our minds with how brilliant he was. The first time he showed up he had a walkman with headphones that he would place on people's heads during the session that featured him playing guitar in some session from Scotland. (Where he was from) Then, if he actually got someone to listen to it he would start rhythms on the guitar and call out the tune he thought it should go with. If he didn't get any takers, he would go back to soliciting listeners for his walkman. This happened back in the days when the sessions attracted 20 players/noodlers in the early 90s, but if he tried it now he'd be waddling away from the pub with the neck of his guitar placed securely in a place where the sun doesn't shine, and his walkman in the urinal where everyone could give it the attention it deserved.
The irony, just like with Gry perhaps, is that if you weren’t playing tunes – he was a decent (but mad) guy to chat with. A bit opinionated and obtuse, but in an entertaining way.
By the way, Gry, I’ll have you know that many of my musical pals happen to be cat lovers and have them at home to pet and adore all they want thank you.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Phantom Button
Re: Start your engines.......
Jack, did you read my story about my "gigging" in Ireland? I worked so hard on it but then the thread died so I have no idea if you're aware how thoroughly I answered your question. Pout, pout. Boo hoo. I was expecting some wise cracks.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
". . .he was a decent (but mad) guy to chat with. A bit opinionated and obtuse, but in an entertaining way."
Uh oh! I better not ever by a walkman.
"I worked so hard on it but then the thread died. . . "
I read it, and even thought about answering it, but all I could think of to say was, "Jeezum Crow lass, smile, yer got loverly teeth."
KFG
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by KFG
Re: Start your engines.......
I've got two. Cats, I mean.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
Phew. I thought I was talking to myself.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
If you mean by that, that you're actually talking to your cats, you *are* talking to yourself. Cats never pay any attention to anything we say.
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
Sorry, showaddy... Non-alcoholic cider...
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Pádraig
Re: Start your engines.......
What "gigging thread"?
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Phantom Button
Re: Start your engines.......
http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display.php/5716/comments#comment121276
# Posted on February 3rd 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
'...couldn't get a decent piece of p*ssy if they were born again.'
Whatever!
Why don't you just play the music? And if you really feel the need to peacock around, I think you should go to West Clare and see how welcome your attitude is amongst the calibre of musicians there.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by swearbox
Re: Start your engines.......
I can't seem to get a decent piece of p*ssy, but then again I'm not born again.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
Here you go, Kerri. Glad to help.
http://www.snopes.com/horrors/food/chinese.htm
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by joesmith
Re: Start your engines.......
I get p*ssy all the time. My wife thinks it's some sort of male menopause, but I blame it on not getting to go to sessions seven nights a week.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Will CPT
Re: Start your engines.......
It just occurred to me what might have drawn Gry into ITM: He wanted to sit and play this music just to drink all night and get a decent piece of p*ssy -- and be born again. Now THAT"S inspiration.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Phantom Button
Re: Start your engines.......
OK, Laitch, HOWEVER:
I once watched a documentary about wacky foreign diets that went into great detail about the consumption of rats (I think it was in India) and the open vending of live puppies and kittens in an Asian market. I saw footage with my own eyes of live kittens being chosen from their cages by grocery shoppers, submerged alive in boiling water to loosen their hair for easy removal, then butchered, packaged, and paid for. I admit, I was disturbed at the time.
But, logical creature that I am, I can't see why the idea of eating a puppy or a kitten should be less appealing than eating an ickle baby cow or a bunny rabbit. (Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?)
So bring on the pussy! Why not? For dessert, I'll take some of those warm living monkey brains you scoop out with an elegant silver spoon.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Kerri Brown
Wow, for once, I found evidence that the documentary I saw actually exists!
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/04/0419_040419_TVfoodtaboo.html
(Although, it was West Africa, not India. Apologies to any Indians offended by my assumption they eat rats as well as any West Africans offended by my apology to the Indians).
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
Weird. My last post makes no sense at all thanks to Jeremy's automatic "i" replacement program. Not that I was trying to make sense....
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Will CPT
Re: Start your engines.......
In a way you're right, Kerri, but one fundamental difference is that the humane slaughter of grass eaters for food in "production quantites" is far easier than humane slaughter of dogs, cats and other animals who cannot be as easily controlled and who by definition will fight tooth and nail and are therefore almost certain to suffer injury and trauma in the process. So it's not *quite* the same.
There is a group of Indians who eat rats, they are itinerant rat catchers who work in family groups who charge grain farmers for their services ,and then live off the fruits of their labours. The rats they catch, though, are clean-living, grain-fed rural ones, not disease-ridden, garbage-fed city ones. I can't imagine these people would touch a city rat with a barge pole.
Yes! It's Friday and I'm long overdue to go home. I hear a fiddle calling ...
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Tish
Re: Start your engines.......
And I don't eat ickle baby cows or bunny rabbits, just for the record
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Tish
Re: Start your engines.......
Mmm.... Beef.... Lamb....Duck.........
Dangnabit, i'm hungry!
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Pádraig
Re: Start your engines.......
Vegeterian: Indian word for "bad hunter".
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Tish
Re: Start your engines.......
What's the Indian word for "bad bodhran"?
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Phantom Button
Re: Start your engines.......
humdrum
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Q
Re: Start your engines.......
hahahaha ho-hum drum
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Phantom Button
Re: Start your engines.......
Is this the dictionary or the culinary corner??
Amazing how we start with engines and end up here.
I do like "humdrum", though☺☺☺.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Donough
Re: Start your engines.......
This is the auto repair thread, Donough.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Phantom Button
Re: Start your engines.......
zoom zoom zoom!
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Pádraig
Re: Start your engines.......
Does anyone out there know two psychology students? One of them can play fiddle passably well, and one has a bodhran.
They are working on a project aimed at studying peoples reactions to provocation about a subject dear to them, and have lighted on the idea of creating an outrageous virtual character, who will cleverly wind up the regular subscribers to a discussion board.
They have designed this character very well, and even his "pseudo-speech" on the discussion board is written very carefully to give the impression of a 'street-cred yoof' - note the use of rows of full stops to represent the idea of the sort of sentenceless/breathless babble that such a person might be expected to speak - presumably in the belief that the arrival of such a person will in itself cause something of a stir.
Sometimes, however, their need for a speedy reaction causes them to write his part with a little less rehearsal. This tends to be around their characters fourth or fifth post in each thread, where the need to keep up the stirring becomes more urgent.
Take a look.
But remember that your every move is being watched.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by showaddydadito
Re: Start your engines.......
No Dave, this guy is the real thing, the chosen one. I'm so convinced by this I'm chucking my bodhrán in favour of BeatBox... keepin' it real.
Bo!
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Start your engines.......
In fact, propa Bo, I tell thee!
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Start your engines.......
I, for one, believe in the Almighty GRY.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Key Maniac Lad
Re: Start your engines.......
And now we've got computer-literate penguins! What's going on??
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Start your engines.......
Have you ever noticed how Pingu's igloo is much bigger inside than outside?
And I think you'll find it is the "astonishing" GRY, Pingu, please pay attention.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by showaddydadito
Re: Start your engines.......
Mee-mwaww!
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Key Maniac Lad
Re: Start your engines.......
Ah! The baby penguin returns!
Hi Danny!
I only found your early name last night when following a lead for Mells Irish Festival from a few years a go!
Actually all I was going to ask was wasn't there a difference between a bodhran player and a chiropodist...like one of them bucks up your feet...something like that anyway...
Bx
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by briantheflute
Re: Start your engines.......
"the humane slaughter of grass eaters for food in "production quantites" is far easier than humane slaughter of dogs..."
Um.... Tish? Someone's been feeding you fairy tales, love.
You ever tried to pick up a cow by the scruff of its neck?
"are therefore almost certain to suffer injury and trauma in the process."
I think most sentient beings find being butchered very traumatic and painful. Like, the ultimate uber-trauma.
A valiant effort though, really.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
"Humane slaughter" Oxymoron if ever I heard one. Although saying that I' d prefer to have a bolt in the back of the head than what they do to veal calves. Anyway, are we going off topic here? Um, what was the question?
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Start your engines.......
something about killing goats for their skins, wasn't it?
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Key Maniac Lad
Re: Start your engines.......
Wel I hope it wasn't for their meat. Have you ever tasted goat? Jiving.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Start your engines.......
This topic was doomed from the start. It's a mercy to go off on tangents.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
I tried goat. I thought it tasted exactly like you'd expect - sort of like an ugly version of sheep.
Here's a bit more tangent for you Kerri: on the old humane killing thing - I always wonder when people talk of "putting a cat/dog/gerbil/penguin out of its misery" - don't they really mean "I'll put it out of my misery"?
Discuss. (its that or back to topic).
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by showaddydadito
Re: Start your engines.......
Oh god, discuss, then.
I dunno, Dave. The last cat we had have put down due to illness and old age caused huge amounts of trauma in our house. (Although we had a most lovely young vet back then, who came out on her lunch with a tech to put my husband's beloved cat Spock down in our backyard in my husband's lap. His ashes are buried there under a white rose that he loved to sleep under in the summer.) I'm not looking forward to the day Barkley, the next oldest cat, dies.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
Showaddy, they may very well be phych students... I think if it's true, then GRY has just finished the chapter about histrionic and narcissitic personality disorders and wanted a real live demonstration of the it's effects.
.... jeebus! I better get back to work!
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by c_ya
Re: Start your engines.......
...oops... I meant *narcissistic *
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by c_ya
Re: Start your engines.......
Narcissitic = adj. having a quality of parasitic narcissism.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
bleagh....
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
One of our cat has started requesting (by standing at the back door and saying "mrooooouwww!") to go out back and barf once a day. We're planning a trip to the vet later, but any advice will be gratefully accepted!
(This is the vetinary discussion, isn't it?)
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by grego
Re: Start your engines.......
Will, darnit, why did you have to go and explain? It actually came to me after the fifth reading.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by grego
Re: Start your engines.......
No, Grego, it's not a veterinary thread -- this is the gynecology thread. That’s what attracted Gry to ITM... remember?
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Phantom Button
Re: Start your engines.......
hahahahahahahaha!!!! Good one Jack!
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by swearbox
Re: Start your engines.......
I think some cats are just all about barfing, greg.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
At least he asks, Greg. Mine just go "heoughw!" and there it is.
Zina (on Pete's office computer)
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Reverend
Re: Start your engines.......
We suspect bulemia, actually. His brother has gotten very plump and seems comfortable with it, but Timmy's as skinny as a rake. Wouldn't get a second look at a West African delicacy mart.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by grego
Re: Start your engines.......
No, it means when he goes out, he's actually looking for some p*ssy. You know. People are into some pretty wacky things. Being the best in the world can get a bit boring. You have to get creative.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
Gry wouldn't like our sessions. Sometimes I scan the room and I think if someone walked in and didn't know better they'd think it was a gay bar for ugly guys.
# Posted on February 4th 2005 by Phantom Button
Re: Start your engines.......
Kerri, nobody's been feeding me *fairy stories*, sorry.
Current slaughtering practices are not what *I* would call humane at all, which is one of the reasons we don't eat animals, but even so, raising and handling herd animals in large numbers has greater possibilities for humane treatment that meat eaters with totally different instincts and behaviour. The fact that you don't have to scruff a cow to restrain it is precisely the point. Herd animals can be herded. It's a topic that's been given a fair but of research and thought round here, on both sides of the equation, and farming is something I do know a bit about, so differing viewpoint, yes, but fairy stories, no, 'fraid not.
I'm with you though when you say the best bits of this thread are the tangents!
Ahem, to bring this back to music: I have at last found my copy of Orchesographie, the Renaissance dance manual that I couldn't find for daiv a few weeks ago to answer his question about repeats in early dances. Arbeau the dancing master, in instructing pupil Capriol in the many social and physical benefits of dancing and expressing withering contempt for those who would suppress it, finishes off by saying, "We take part in such rejoicing to celebrate ... in spite of the abhorrence of reformers, which latter deserve to be fed upon goat's meat cooked in a pie *without bacon*".
(shudder)
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Tish
Re: Start your engines.......
No, Tish, not WITHOUT BACON....surely no one deserves that. ;)
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
Sorry, Kerri, that reads a bit snappy. Lessavanuthergo.
I don't think we should eat any animals, personally. That said, when people say we eat cows and sheep, *therefore* there's no reason why we shouldn't eat cats and dogs because it's *exactly the same thing* once we put sentimentality aside, I take issue with the logic of the statement, due to the fundamental differences in the animals' natural behaviour. But it's arguing a point of philosophy as far as I'm concerned because I don't think we should eat any animals, personally.
And I'll shut up now. Back to the topic ... whichever one of the several on offer you think is worth pursuing ...
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Tish
Re: Start your engines.......
That's what I thought, Zina ;-D
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Tish
Re: Start your engines.......
No! No shutting up! This is a silly topic anyway! Let's have it out:
http://www.animal-lib.org.au/lists/feedlots/feedlots.shtml
Read this and tell me if this sounds more humane to you than just keeping a puppy in a little cage until he's big enough to eat, then eating him. (That's exactly what we do to our chickens. No big deal, right? As long as it's a chicken. And not a puppy. Because... uh... chickens can be... herded. Right? and... uh... puppies can't... Just let me know if I've misrepresented your position.)
Just because humane treatment of cattle is *possible * doesn't mean it's the norm.
(I've never argued with another vegetarian about vegetarianism before! How thrilling!)
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
So I guess it's like this: guy musicians go to sessions to leave 'wifey' at home and seek out 'decent p*ssy'. And the girl musicians go in search of vegetarian wieners!
I wonder what GRY's next post is gonna be like?
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by swearbox
Re: Start your engines.......
Oh, I'm totally a hypocrite, myself. I love meat of all sorts, but if I had to butcher the poor things myself, I suspect I'd probably quickly become a confirmed vegetarian. Actually, they've done lots of tests and studies and they think houseplants identify emotionally with their owners, anyone else remember those airplane takeoff studies they did? So maybe there's no such thing as humane eating.
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
See, Zina, I'm the opposite. Vegetarian for 15 years, disgusted by the commercial practice of raising for consumption anything that can look me in the eye, but I'd happily scarf back a bunny if I caught it out in the wild and wrung its furry ickle neck myself.
Sometimes I go to the park and look at those big fat carps swimming around in the Asian garden and think "mmmmmm... that looks delicious!" I've tried it, they let you touch them. WIth a little practice...
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
Yeah, but have you seen what those carps eat? You pay a quarter and feed them things that look like rabbit pellets. eeeew!
At least cows get fed nice sheep brains and stuff.
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by grego
Re: Start your engines.......
Yum! Sheep brains! Another point I'm going to bring up while I wait for this evening's musical companion to arrive...
Are we going to consider the physical damage and psychological trauma inflicted on the *human* employees at your typical slaughterhouse compared to those in your average Asian produce market?
At a cattle slaughterhouse, empoyees regularly suffer injuries ranging from repetitive stress to the loss of limbs. The people hired to *clean* the place have been known to die from exposure to the chemicals they use. As a meat-eating human, would you rather stand in the same position for 8 hours a day or more shooting bolt after bolt into the the heads of live cows, or spend part of your day, haggling, part of your day shooting the bull abut the weather, part of the day killing puppies, and the rest of the night counting your money?
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
Kerri
Would that be standing while wearing boots with comfortable and supportive insoles, or huaraches?
I'll confirm Zina's statement about emotional houseplants. I saw a weeping willow in the house of a bodhran player in Chicago once.
Bonsai, of course.
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by joesmith
Re: Start your engines.......
Huaraches? Wouldn't that get a little...squishy between the toes?
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
Some people would call that moisturizing.
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by joesmith
Re: Start your engines.......
Would they? Let's see, who was it who purportedly used to take baths in the blood of young maidens...?
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
Whoever it was certainly didn't market the concept very well.
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by joesmith
Re: Start your engines.......
See, she simply should have used Elizabeth's Arden's marketing strategy and engaged her pr firm, and all would have been well...
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: Start your engines.......
Probably still in denile over her fate.
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by joesmith
Re: Start your engines.......
I didn't say it's the norm, Kerri, in fact, I said it *isn't*, and I also said that that's that's one of the reasons (only one) that we're vegetarian. Given the current state of the nation, it's a philosophical point, as I've already said, not one based on current animal welfare reality. (I know all about feedlots, can *still* smell 'em, too.)
'Fraid I will have to shut up at this point, Kerri, as I've got three gigs breathing down our f-holes here and X hours of work infrunname and X/2 hours to do it in. You haven't *quite* misrepresented my position, but the crux of the argument is in the ramifications of the animals' different natural behaviours combined with the natural behaviour of humans whenever commercial interests are involved, and how that makes the conditions required for at least basic animal welfare standards different in each case.
The reality is though that while large-scale commercial interests are involved, no animal will ever be treated well. Without writing an in-depth treatise though I think we'll just end up repeating ourselves from here and probably boring the audience who are probably well and truly bored with this thread already, so I'll go back to my chart-writing ;-(
Have fun playing tonight, Kerri! (Well it's last night from where I sit, nearly lunchtime here.)
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Tish
I'm the One......
Reading some of the comments on my other thread brought up an important point I felt I really needed a separate thread for it. I hope that's ok.
First off, I’m not a psychology project and I’m nobody’s creation….
But here’s how it goes....No one but me is responsible for anything I say.....I work alone. I am a loner, trust me...... I know you guys can understand why no one would want to associate with me. Just cause someone plays fiddle with me doesn't make them my parole officer, mother/father or manager.... that means the fiddler has nothing to do what-so-ever with what I do and say.
I don't want anyones dirt and no one should have to carry mine as the price for not treating me like sh*te or actually enjoying knowing me or playing with me. So listen good...I am long past the days of being manipulated by anyone in my life....the things I do belong to me and me alone. If you don’t like what I say, don't try and get to me by using others to do so......I'll tell you now, there’s no point. I do what I wish.
Yo, someone on this site said they knew a good Chi-Town bodhran teacher....who is that person you spoke of?
I think some of you at least enjoyed the tracks….that’s what it’s all about. The fusion one will probably be done sooner than planned….you guys will be the first to know.
PEACE
GRY
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by GRY
Re: I'm the One......
GRY,
Please, just play music, and hang out with other people who play music, and chit chat, and talk about tunes, and talk about other things. Accept that everyone of us has work to do, we all want to be better, right? But leave all the extra stuff out! It's not necessary! I mean, come on! There's young young young people, kids even, who play better than most of us could ever hope to! Just know that, keep making music, and don't cast so much bread upon the water, and no one is gonna have any problem with a blend of trad and hip hop! (already done by Black 47 among others).
Good luck in what you do, it's just that humility is 100 times more attractive than grandiose statements and throw downs! Think about it!
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by swearbox
Re: I'm the One......
Gry, go back, read the thread, find the comment about the Chicago teacher, click on the little orange name that appears beneath it, in the member profile that comes up, click on "send an email", ask your question, and Bob's your uncle.
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: I'm the One......
GRY I've been reading your threads, and have decided that you are so damn cool and amazing that I actually want to *be* you. Please tell me more about yourself so that I can teach myself to be like you. I love your music and bow down to you. I want a poster of you. Is there anywhere I can order one off the net?
Best,
Dow
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Dow
Re: I'm the One......
I can set you up on an installment plan...
**slick smile**
:D
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Pádraig
Re: I'm the One......
GRY...
Kevin Rice was the one I was speaking of.
I've heard him play many times with his band, He is great.
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by picking up that fiddle
Re: I'm the One......
Well thank you for the compliment.....The best thing I can say is that you have to be who you are.....but it's not that simple I know. It's the journey to find yourself that is the fun part(if you let it be). Everyone knows it's easy to fit in and not start trouble.....But that often leads to full life with an empty heart. That sucks....A full life and full heart is ideal.....but an empty life and full heart is a start(it's were i'm at). You'll see the more you do for yourself the more people will do for you. Remember you can't please everybody.....and everybody can't please you.....so don't try. There are those who will support and there are those who don't.
As for Kevin Rice.....thanks but been there before, I'm one of his more accomplished students....That time is over for me....I move forward not backward...
PEACE
GRY
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by GRY
No you're not, he is.
That would be NTI. And when he becomes you, I want to become him but I don't want to relocate because I've become too accustomed to how water flows down drains where I live.
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by joesmith
Re: I'm the One......
Yeh, and if you become NTI, then will you teach me how to play hornpipes? :D
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Pádraig
Re: I'm the One......
RP
It would be simpler if you just become me.
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by joesmith
Re: I'm the One......
Gry, it's wierd, I love you and hate you at the same time. I love you because you make me laugh an you make everybody else uncomfortable, but I hate you because you never have any new material.
Be creative. You're a refreshing change, but you're too predictable. Try *listening* to people once in a while instead of just pressing "play". You know? I've listened to your rap, I've read a bit of your philosophy before it got deleted, and I know you aren't a one trick pony. I know you have more than one song to sing.
Seriously. When you come home and check your messages, do you just sit there and play the "Hi! Gary can't come to the phone right now, but if you leave a message, Im'a call y'all right back. Peace." over and over again, or are you interested in who might have called?
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: Start your engines.......
"Vegetarian for 15 years. . ."
A bit more than double that in this corner.
". . . disgusted by the commercial practice of raising for consumption anything that can look me in the eye, but I'd happily scarf back a bunny if I caught it out in the wild and wrung its furry ickle neck myself."
No, I'm not going to scarf back any bunnies, but if I *were* so inclined I'd be with you. This is one vegetarian who respects the Nuge more than he does many of "his fellow" vegetarians.
KFG
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by KFG
Re: Start your engines.......
Kevin, I'll be candid. Occasionally my body craves meat. I do my best to comply, but anything that comes in a bloody plastic wrapped packet makes me feel sick. If I *need* to eat it, I ought to be willing to kill it before I cook it. I know I can't kil a cow. If it came down to a cage match, the cow would win. If I were hungry enough, here is the ranking of sentient beings I would happily murder:
1: OK, how "sentient" is a mollusc? (research required)
2: Fish
3: Those infuriating wild turkeys I chased for hours in my knickers with my cousin a couple years back after his girlfriend's dog pooped on my leg.
4: My cousin's girlfriend's dog.
5: Anything I shot in the wilderness with a gun.
6: The fattest of the shipwreck survivors.
Now, where do "cows" fit into this, you ask? I just don't eat them. I never would. They are an abomination. I'm not a bovine rights activist, I honestly think there should be no such thing as cows. All they do is crap and pee on land I could use to grow hash browns and porridge.
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Kerri Brown
Tangent:
"You're not" and "You aren't". What the hell?
Discuss.
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Kerri Brown
(I amn't a person who accepts bizarre linguistic rules "just because.")
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: I'm the One......
English is the language of the damned. That is all.
NOW I'm going to bed.
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Zina Lee
Re: I'm the One......
i agree with kerri, you've posted here a handful of times, however each time you are saying the same things over and over again.
if you are out to convince everyone of your talents and beliefs in relation to ITM, don't bother.
there are people who support you... and there are others who don't. get over it.
its almost like you keep posting just to get reactions from people... but maybe thats me.
and as for kevin rice, i personally have never heard a better bodhran player.. i think he is bloody amazing!!
and as i told you in your last post, when you asked what we thought of the tracks you posted with that fiddle player, i said that i thought you didn't play with any style variety or even sometimes you weren't really on the beat... it might not hurt to brush up on some stuff... esp. since you've said that you've been out of the game for a couple of years....
just my opinion...
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by picking up that fiddle
Re: I'm the One......
's colloquial, Kerri, 's colloquial.
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by joesmith
Re: I'm the One......
Fiddle picker upper, you too should give me something to call you.
I've finished my beer and gotten into the whiskey. (Begods, if you could hear this little reel that sprung up after the whiskey hit me! ... but you can't, I'm afraid. Got to dig up five auld tchoons before I post another of my own.)
but I digress...
*looking around*
Dear god in heaven, what am I doing here?
TAXI!!
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Kerri Brown
Re: I'm the One......
GRY,
go on pay the money and get the professional help you need.
You seem to have an attention seeking disorder or something to that nature, they have very good treatments available today for that kind of thing. Why make yourself suffer any longer?
Go on... pick up the phone and make that call......
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by compaqjohn
Re: I'm the One......
Garry, thanks for this post. I feel like it is finally you that is talking here. There is the bravado, but there is some humility there, some realness. I know D the fiddler better, but I know that if he is laying down tracks for you, that you are OK.
That's it man, OK. Not the best in the world, not the best in the midwest. Just OK. And from there...
And have you heard Martyn Bennett?
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Jode
Re: I'm the One......
Awaye. Am noo convinced he is a coupla psychology students. Mibbe 3.
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Key Maniac Lad
Re: I'm the One......
Well GRY, your definitely going down a storm here.All your threads (which are all about you) get a deluge of responses.You come out with a helluva lot of bull but then you come out with something like that bit about having an empty life & a full heart which is touching in it's honesty.
I have absolutely no interest in your fusion thing but go on being who you are & feck the begrudgers
(not like you need any telling : )
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by cunnla
Re: I'm the One......
Ih? If ye ever get up tae Glesga oan yer trevels pye a visit tae Drumchapel, Easterhouse or Possilpark. Ye'll git aw the attention ye waant therr. Yamugye
# Posted on February 5th 2005 by Key Maniac Lad
Re: Start your engines.......
". . .infuriating wild turkeys I chased for hours in my knickers. . ."
Yeah, I can see where getting wild turkeys in your knickers might tend to annoy. I'd probably have chased them too. . . bu