Hi all, I'm rare to posting on this site, but I have a wee dilemma that might well be solved by yous.
I'm spending a month working in the Sahara and since we'll be in the middle of nowhere with little entertainment and - *gasp* - no alcohol, I want to take my fiddle with me, practise like a mad thing, and make up for all the neglect of recent months.
Dilemma: I 'm a mere beginner; I have a decent fiddle which I love and although it is insured, I'm not sure I want to submit it to the rigours of travel and the heat of the desert. I saw a previous thread about keeping fiddles humidified, and that sounds do-able. However, I'm toying with the idea of forking out about 100 quid to buy a student violin that I can take instead and won't fret over.
So, do I spend a bit of money, or do I risk my beloved instrument? (And will 100 quid be enough to get me something playable?)
erm.... difficult one. I have had a very similar dilema and decided to risk it with my good fiddle - I just enjoy playing it soooooooo much more.
But....... it is worth considering where you'll be keeping it when it's there - if they get too warm the glue can melt (a friend left one in the back of a hot car only to find it in pieces later!) I know that the strength of the glue holding the bellys on is weaker than elsewhere on the fiddle because of the necessity of removing it for repair work. I wouldn't fancy your chances of finding an abundance of fiddle-makers in the Sahara to put it together again!
Also, if the fiddle is quite old then they are often considered more stable in different humiditys than new ones.... well at least less likey to crack as they contain less water than the new ones.
If you think that it can be kept in fairly stable conditions then I'd put that £100 into upgrading your case (if it needs it)
or
I'm personaly not a fan of cheap new fiddles - the ones I have tried have been consistently easy to play but produce a consistently dull sound. (in my opinion) Whereas I do pick up some bargainous old fiddles for under £100 and £30 for a basic makeover could leave you with something that makes an impressive noise for the price.
Not sure if that's of any use.
Have fun in deserty-places,
I would prefer to have my best fiddle somewhere safe. I've taken fairly good fiddles abroad but not anywhere as hot as you're planning.
I managed to leave one of my fiddles in a hot car with the roisin loose in the case. The roisin melted over two of the pegs and set solid! I had to chip it off to use the fiddle in the evening and then I had to replace the pegs later. I'm now very careful about putting the rosin back after use!!
Thanks Alex and Tarrantella - I've been told that since it's winter it won't get too hot, but it will be very dry, and will be pretty cold at nights, so the temperature will fluctuate quite a bit. My fiddle is an old one, and I am very attached to it. If I bought a second el cheap-o one I wouldn't expect too much from it - just enough to practise on, pick up new tunes, and serenade the odd passing camel.
Ah! That should answer the question right there. If the temperature is going to fluctuate a lot (as it tends to do in the desert), do NOT bring your good fiddle. It's not worth ruining your instrument to take it with you in such an extreme environment. By all means, get a cheap student instrument, or buy one off eBay for the short term. And this way, you'll always have a travel fiddle, or one that you could take with you to places that your beloved instrument shouldn't go...
Yeah, i didn't like to mention e-bay b4 but there are a lot going on there. Which means a lot of bargains and a lot of total.....y not-so-good-value ones. Tactful.
Well good luck anyway.
Alex
ps- Maybe camels have strong opnions on fiddle tone - I wouldn't like to offend one! x
Kate,
I did something similar some years ago, and got a student fiddle for "questionable situations". If you decide to go that route, try to get one of the cheaper models from a violin catalogue. (I got one from the Shar catalogue.) They're a lot better quality (and probably a bit cheaper) than the student models in most music stores. The one I have is very playable; just doesn't have much character. I consider it "atonal" as it doesn't have any particular tone quality to it. Other than that, it sounds reasonable and seems to be much less sensitive to changes in temperature, humidity, etc, than my better fiddle.
Kate_d, a bit of an off-the-wall thought which probably involve more expense than it's worth to you ...
... but FWIW these fiddles are probably good in "extreme" conditions and they come properly set up with reasonable pegs and so forth, which an eBay cheapie might not:
They look a bit "out there" but some pretty reputable fiddlers are happy to endorse them. Their electrics get more promotion than their acoustics these days but the acoustics are intended to provide robust, easily repairable value-for-money instruments for students.
I tried to find current prices but a few sites seem to be down at the moment. (And I have seen one at a session - once - played by an elderly fellow who kept it as his folk camp/travelling around instrument.)
I took my fiddle to Marocco. It was fine, except I hardly practised because all my time was taked tuning it!! It went so out of tune everyday! Finally the E broke, and a friend's Maroccan friend went out on his bicycle and got another. But it turned out (after tuning it to breaking point) to be an A!! But as long as you don't keep it in the direct sun, it should be ok.
My post has disappeared! This isn't the first time. I hardly contribute much these days, but then when I do - it disappears!!!
Yeah, its pretty arid out here in Central Australia, and I have had a couple of occasions when all the strings of all three fiddles have pinged unwound in the cases. Pretty distressing at the time and I'm sure it doesn't do the pegs any good.
I was very concerned about making sure the very old fiddle I got at this time last year would not just fall apart out here, so I keep all three well humidified and in their cases. I also bought a little water feature for the room where I practice.
None of the fiddles have become unglued, cracked or sustained any other permanent damage in the dry conditions (so far, touch wood), but I must admit to taking the cheapy when I'm travelling or going out bush, and leaving the good one safely at home. I recon fiddles sound different when you play them out in the open bush. I don't think the lack of tone is such an issue out there unless the fiddle gets hot. I don't play in the sun anyway, and others have already said it: don't ever leave your fiddle behind in your car.
I had said this so much better before in the message that disappeared when I posted it.
I love taking my fiddle out into the bush - it loves it, I love it, the birds keep singing and the trees don't run away, so I recon it must be alright.
All the best, kate_d
Oh, that's what I said in the first post (that isn't) and forgot in this one: I knew someone once who used to labouriously unwind the strings on his guitar every time before he put his guitar in its case. I used to laugh at it, but in deserts, it might be a sensible thing to do this with your fiddle if you are not living in airconditioned comfort because of the huge fluctuation in day/night temperatures.
I would go around and try to get my hands on an old fiddle, and put about as much into it as I could. Don't take your "good" fiddle. It will die on your trip it sounds like. Basically, a good rule of thumb is that if you're not comfortable, it's not comfortable.
The desert is not a comfortable place. Try not to buy a new fiddle, because they sound horrible. Try going to some violin shops and telling the luthier what you want to do, and to see if he has an older "junk" fiddle he would be willing to let you buy for cheap. I used to work at a violin shop, and we always had old stuff lying around. Try that. Good luck. Cheers!
one lesson i've learned, is never bring your good instrument with you if you feel like you shouldnt. its more worth it to spend a 100 on a fiddle that you barely like but can enjoy, than ruin your good one. sometimes i wish i could bring my flute to marching band or my piccolo... but t hen i remember i'm not about to throw several thousand dollars of other people's money down the drain (my grandma bought me the flute, and the wooden piccolo is my flute teacher's so eventually i have to give it back and i am not paying 3000+ to replace it) because i am a music snob and want to play good instruments all the time. the fact that you are seriously concerned shows the mark of a good musician; you need to have respect for your instrument!
Yes, I think everyone is in agreement, but still it should not be at personal cost to yourself, ie. find a way to keep playing without endangering your good instrument.
You will still need to look after a knock-about instrument if it is going to last in dry hot/cold conditions.
I have got to play in some awe inspiring places in the desert, for example, along the dingo fence that transverses Australia from Queensland to Western Australia - and I wouldn't swap experiences like that for the world. You will find heaps of beautiful places begging to be played in. Just make sure you take your music with you, and don't not play because of some self erected barrier. The experience will be enriching. Make it possible for yourself.
Me again - yeah on reflection the other guys here are prob right about e-bay (or perhaps most non-fiddle shops) fiddles needing setting-up. It depends how confident you are with this. I always have setup my fiddles so am comfortable with it, but a friendly violin shop are unlikely to charge tooooo much for it.
ooooh yeah, ( you can tell I'm from dorset, ooh ahh! - that's a dialect thing for you non-english people here)
but yeah, the idea of detuning strings all the time..... I don't know if it's a good idea with metal core strings, the metal fatigue might weaken them into breaking even faster. I prob wouldn't do this to my steel-string guitar - but I might be wrong not too - come to think of it steel doesn't fatigue much does it?
I do regly detune my fiddle by a tone - and I HAVE got metal strings but then I get through strings every 3 months!!!!!
fiddle travel dilemma
fiddle travel dilemma
Hi all, I'm rare to posting on this site, but I have a wee dilemma that might well be solved by yous.
I'm spending a month working in the Sahara and since we'll be in the middle of nowhere with little entertainment and - *gasp* - no alcohol, I want to take my fiddle with me, practise like a mad thing, and make up for all the neglect of recent months.
Dilemma: I 'm a mere beginner; I have a decent fiddle which I love and although it is insured, I'm not sure I want to submit it to the rigours of travel and the heat of the desert. I saw a previous thread about keeping fiddles humidified, and that sounds do-able. However, I'm toying with the idea of forking out about 100 quid to buy a student violin that I can take instead and won't fret over.
So, do I spend a bit of money, or do I risk my beloved instrument? (And will 100 quid be enough to get me something playable?)
# Posted on November 10th 2004 by kate_d
Re: fiddle travel dilemma
Hi Kate,
erm.... difficult one. I have had a very similar dilema and decided to risk it with my good fiddle - I just enjoy playing it soooooooo much more.
But....... it is worth considering where you'll be keeping it when it's there - if they get too warm the glue can melt (a friend left one in the back of a hot car only to find it in pieces later!) I know that the strength of the glue holding the bellys on is weaker than elsewhere on the fiddle because of the necessity of removing it for repair work. I wouldn't fancy your chances of finding an abundance of fiddle-makers in the Sahara to put it together again!
Also, if the fiddle is quite old then they are often considered more stable in different humiditys than new ones.... well at least less likey to crack as they contain less water than the new ones.
If you think that it can be kept in fairly stable conditions then I'd put that £100 into upgrading your case (if it needs it)
or
I'm personaly not a fan of cheap new fiddles - the ones I have tried have been consistently easy to play but produce a consistently dull sound. (in my opinion) Whereas I do pick up some bargainous old fiddles for under £100 and £30 for a basic makeover could leave you with something that makes an impressive noise for the price.
Not sure if that's of any use.
Have fun in deserty-places,
Alex
# Posted on November 10th 2004 by Kazoo and Bones Player
Re: fiddle travel dilemma
I would prefer to have my best fiddle somewhere safe. I've taken fairly good fiddles abroad but not anywhere as hot as you're planning.
I managed to leave one of my fiddles in a hot car with the roisin loose in the case. The roisin melted over two of the pegs and set solid! I had to chip it off to use the fiddle in the evening and then I had to replace the pegs later. I'm now very careful about putting the rosin back after use!!
# Posted on November 10th 2004 by Tarrantella
Re: fiddle travel dilemma
Thanks Alex and Tarrantella - I've been told that since it's winter it won't get too hot, but it will be very dry, and will be pretty cold at nights, so the temperature will fluctuate quite a bit. My fiddle is an old one, and I am very attached to it. If I bought a second el cheap-o one I wouldn't expect too much from it - just enough to practise on, pick up new tunes, and serenade the odd passing camel.
# Posted on November 10th 2004 by kate_d
Re: fiddle travel dilemma
Ah! That should answer the question right there. If the temperature is going to fluctuate a lot (as it tends to do in the desert), do NOT bring your good fiddle. It's not worth ruining your instrument to take it with you in such an extreme environment. By all means, get a cheap student instrument, or buy one off eBay for the short term. And this way, you'll always have a travel fiddle, or one that you could take with you to places that your beloved instrument shouldn't go...
Have a great time in the Sahara!
# Posted on November 10th 2004 by violynnsey
Re: fiddle travel dilemma
Yeah, i didn't like to mention e-bay b4 but there are a lot going on there. Which means a lot of bargains and a lot of total.....y not-so-good-value ones. Tactful.
x
Well good luck anyway.
Alex
ps- Maybe camels have strong opnions on fiddle tone - I wouldn't like to offend one!
# Posted on November 10th 2004 by Kazoo and Bones Player
Re: fiddle travel dilemma
Kate,
I did something similar some years ago, and got a student fiddle for "questionable situations". If you decide to go that route, try to get one of the cheaper models from a violin catalogue. (I got one from the Shar catalogue.) They're a lot better quality (and probably a bit cheaper) than the student models in most music stores. The one I have is very playable; just doesn't have much character. I consider it "atonal" as it doesn't have any particular tone quality to it. Other than that, it sounds reasonable and seems to be much less sensitive to changes in temperature, humidity, etc, than my better fiddle.
# Posted on November 10th 2004 by Zhenya
Re: fiddle travel dilemma
Kate_d, a bit of an off-the-wall thought which probably involve more expense than it's worth to you ...
... but FWIW these fiddles are probably good in "extreme" conditions and they come properly set up with reasonable pegs and so forth, which an eBay cheapie might not:
http://www.epochstrings.com.au
They look a bit "out there" but some pretty reputable fiddlers are happy to endorse them. Their electrics get more promotion than their acoustics these days but the acoustics are intended to provide robust, easily repairable value-for-money instruments for students.
I tried to find current prices but a few sites seem to be down at the moment. (And I have seen one at a session - once - played by an elderly fellow who kept it as his folk camp/travelling around instrument.)
# Posted on November 11th 2004 by Tish
Re: fiddle travel dilemma
I took my fiddle to Marocco. It was fine, except I hardly practised because all my time was taked tuning it!! It went so out of tune everyday! Finally the E broke, and a friend's Maroccan friend went out on his bicycle and got another. But it turned out (after tuning it to breaking point) to be an A!! But as long as you don't keep it in the direct sun, it should be ok.
# Posted on November 11th 2004 by act
Re: fiddle travel dilemma
My post has disappeared! This isn't the first time. I hardly contribute much these days, but then when I do - it disappears!!!
Yeah, its pretty arid out here in Central Australia, and I have had a couple of occasions when all the strings of all three fiddles have pinged unwound in the cases. Pretty distressing at the time and I'm sure it doesn't do the pegs any good.
I was very concerned about making sure the very old fiddle I got at this time last year would not just fall apart out here, so I keep all three well humidified and in their cases. I also bought a little water feature for the room where I practice.
None of the fiddles have become unglued, cracked or sustained any other permanent damage in the dry conditions (so far, touch wood), but I must admit to taking the cheapy when I'm travelling or going out bush, and leaving the good one safely at home. I recon fiddles sound different when you play them out in the open bush. I don't think the lack of tone is such an issue out there unless the fiddle gets hot. I don't play in the sun anyway, and others have already said it: don't ever leave your fiddle behind in your car.
I had said this so much better before in the message that disappeared when I posted it.
I love taking my fiddle out into the bush - it loves it, I love it, the birds keep singing and the trees don't run away, so I recon it must be alright.
All the best, kate_d
# Posted on November 11th 2004 by Clear Drops
Re: fiddle travel dilemma
Oh, that's what I said in the first post (that isn't) and forgot in this one: I knew someone once who used to labouriously unwind the strings on his guitar every time before he put his guitar in its case. I used to laugh at it, but in deserts, it might be a sensible thing to do this with your fiddle if you are not living in airconditioned comfort because of the huge fluctuation in day/night temperatures.
# Posted on November 11th 2004 by Clear Drops
Re: fiddle travel dilemma
I would go around and try to get my hands on an old fiddle, and put about as much into it as I could. Don't take your "good" fiddle. It will die on your trip it sounds like. Basically, a good rule of thumb is that if you're not comfortable, it's not comfortable.
The desert is not a comfortable place. Try not to buy a new fiddle, because they sound horrible. Try going to some violin shops and telling the luthier what you want to do, and to see if he has an older "junk" fiddle he would be willing to let you buy for cheap. I used to work at a violin shop, and we always had old stuff lying around. Try that. Good luck. Cheers!
# Posted on November 12th 2004 by nfiddle
Re: fiddle travel dilemma
Also get one of those humidifier "snake" things you put in the fiddle... "dampit" I believe they are called, and soak it once a day.
# Posted on November 12th 2004 by nfiddle
Re: fiddle travel dilemma
one lesson i've learned, is never bring your good instrument with you if you feel like you shouldnt. its more worth it to spend a 100 on a fiddle that you barely like but can enjoy, than ruin your good one. sometimes i wish i could bring my flute to marching band or my piccolo... but t hen i remember i'm not about to throw several thousand dollars of other people's money down the drain (my grandma bought me the flute, and the wooden piccolo is my flute teacher's so eventually i have to give it back and i am not paying 3000+ to replace it) because i am a music snob and want to play good instruments all the time. the fact that you are seriously concerned shows the mark of a good musician; you need to have respect for your instrument!
# Posted on November 13th 2004 by daiv
Re: fiddle travel dilemma
Yes, I think everyone is in agreement, but still it should not be at personal cost to yourself, ie. find a way to keep playing without endangering your good instrument.
You will still need to look after a knock-about instrument if it is going to last in dry hot/cold conditions.
I have got to play in some awe inspiring places in the desert, for example, along the dingo fence that transverses Australia from Queensland to Western Australia - and I wouldn't swap experiences like that for the world. You will find heaps of beautiful places begging to be played in. Just make sure you take your music with you, and don't not play because of some self erected barrier. The experience will be enriching. Make it possible for yourself.
# Posted on November 14th 2004 by Clear Drops
Re: fiddle travel dilemma
Try buying a pawn shop fiddle. They'll be more playable than those cheapy E-bay $100 fiddles.
# Posted on November 15th 2004 by Zina Lee
Re: fiddle travel dilemma
Me again - yeah on reflection the other guys here are prob right about e-bay (or perhaps most non-fiddle shops) fiddles needing setting-up. It depends how confident you are with this. I always have setup my fiddles so am comfortable with it, but a friendly violin shop are unlikely to charge tooooo much for it.
ooooh yeah, ( you can tell I'm from dorset, ooh ahh! - that's a dialect thing for you non-english people here)
but yeah, the idea of detuning strings all the time..... I don't know if it's a good idea with metal core strings, the metal fatigue might weaken them into breaking even faster. I prob wouldn't do this to my steel-string guitar - but I might be wrong not too - come to think of it steel doesn't fatigue much does it?
I do regly detune my fiddle by a tone - and I HAVE got metal strings but then I get through strings every 3 months!!!!!
I think I must have very pointy fingers,
Alex
# Posted on November 16th 2004 by Kazoo and Bones Player