Not being a greatly experienced player I like to start off nice and slow, but somehow the three reel set I play gets faster and faster so by the time I reach the third tune it is hurtling out of control and usually I go off the rails cos its too fast. Should I change my medication or is there some other way of keeping slow?
Do double foot tapping. This is where you alternate tapping between the heel and ball of your foot, so you're rocking your foot quite fast, and tapping 4 times for every bar of a reel. I found that doing it this way helped my timing and rhythm - it just takes a bit of getting used to. Once you can do it, you suddenly find you don't even have to tap your foot at all, ever again.
I've see a world-famous fiddle player, whose name I do not propose to mention here, for it would only spark off yet another sub-thread, do this in a concert with one foot while the other taps at half the speed. I shouldn't be surprised if said WFFP has shoes specially made for the purpose
Good advice so far, all this tapping and clicking (of the metronome, that is).
A couple of other things come to mind from my experience. One is nerves and the effect thereof. Being anxious often causes one to play faster than one is able, and to find oneself doing that often is very distressing, and leads to more nervousness. Metronome work might help with this also. I'm not a touchy feely kinda person, but I do think that the only way to get over this acceleration caused by nerves is to develop a meditational kind of absorption in the tune, while at the the same time putting the lash to oneself about steady time. Meditation by metronome, or something. Perhaps this makes no sense.
Another thing I've heard a million times is the tendency to "jump on the phrases". This is my own nomenclature, I'm pretty sure. What I perceive is that people don't give the last long note of a phrase it's proper due, don't allow it to lay out there like it should, with even a wee pause before heading into the next phrase. They jump on the next phrase a hair too soon, and the whole tune gradually ratchets faster and faster. I know I've done this in the past. Though I perceive it now, and don't like it, if I'm in a group of players that is doing this, it's really really hard to fight.
Obviously, I don't know if either of those things are part of your problem, but I offer them as things to study on.
Simply concentrate on not going faster and faster. It really is as simple as that.
Practice playing at a steady speed. Apart from initial help, DON'T use a metronome, or you will simply cultivate the ability to play in time with a metronome. What you need to do is cultivate the ability to play in time with yourself.
I've always found metronomes awkward and have always practised my timing by playing along with others including CD recordings etc.
How about using some of software like Transcribe or Amazing Slowdowner?
Foot tapping is quite good as long as your foot just doesn't speed up along with your playing. That used to happen to me too.
Going faster when you shouldn't is a common problem, not only in sessions but in other ensembles such as orchestras. If the music goes up high there is a tendency to play it faster, likewise if it gets louder. Another reason, more prevalent in orchestras than in sessions where most notes are quavers (or eighth notes), is when a flurry of small value "fast" notes pops up there is an observable tendency for the players to hurry (probably a result of mild panic!).
If you're in an orchestra you have a conductor to shout or glare at you. If you're in a session someone might start stamping their feet loudly to haul everyone back on line. If you're practising on your own then it's a case of listening hard and self-discipline, assisted perhaps in the early stages by a metronome or self-recording.
Trevor
I got amazing slow downer for my pc which allows me to play along with tunes on cd at a slower speed. This has helped me no end, i used to have the same trouble as you Mike.
I tried the foot tapping , metronome with little success.
I find that there is usually a point where you tend to speed up. I've been learning the Strayaway Child, which is a 6 part jig... 1st and 2nd parts ok, good tempo, 3rd part I speed up on the rolls, 4th part... realize I've sped up, get back on tempo, 5th part speed up again, can't blame the rolls this time, part 6 - never get it right 'cause I've going too fast. I think my demon is the rolls in particular, or repeated notes.
Anny, are you doing Strayaway on fiddle? Keep the bow speed the same, and really hang on the note before you roll it. Also consider doing less percussive rolls--more "open" and relaxed. This will help prevent speeding up.
Thanks Will. Yes, I'm learning it on the fiddle. I know what you mean about hanging on the note before the roll. I know that will help. It's also the 4th finger roll.... pinky just doesn't want to do what my brain tells it, so it comes off too fast and then I don't finish the note properly. Practice, practice, practice, I guess.
Thanks for all the helpful suggestions. So far the heel and toe has produced effects reminiscent of trying to pat the head and rub the tummy at the same time (or is it the other way round. However I am going to persist with this because some of the steadiest players I've ever soon including WFFP (MH I presume) do just that.
As for 'the' three reel set, its just that I usually play my reels in sets of 14.
i disagree with showaddydadito, you should use a metronome. but they are right, dont get dependent on metronomes. what i would do is take one reel or one jig, and work on it, beat by beat, until you can get it perfectly in time. then, play it without the metronome, and dont speed up or get out of time; basically, learn your lessons with the metronome and only go back to it as a last resort.
Regarding Anny's problem with The Strayaway Child, I have been having just that problem with that tune particularly since I learned it a couple of months ago, despite practising it more than any other tune I know. In fact the Vegan Bodhran discussion I posted here a few weeks ago was prompted by the difficulty I experienced in trying to play it solo at a session. Can anybody say what is it about that particular tune that causes the acceleration? I would love to crack this, as I would agree with Karen Tweed that The Strayaway Child is one of the most beautiful of all tunes, and I have loved it ever since I heard the Bothy Band recording of it so many years ago.
Metronomes are generally *GOOD*. They keep you honest. If nothing else, they are effectively _always_ correct when it comes to keeping time. They are very unforgiving, in a good way. It's often frustrating to work with them at first, but it gets easier--and it will do your rhythm good.
Keeping time primarily with your foot is a *BAD* idea. Tapping your foot is fine, but if your brain is speeding up the tempo, what makes you think your foot will do better? There are outside cases where it works, and it might be better than nothing, but... I find that a student's rhythm usually improves when they stop tapping and feel the beat in their heart instead of their spastic legs. (there's also something particularly annoying about a bad, loud, foot-tapper at a session)
BEST advice: record yourself and see if you can figure out your problem more objectively. Often it's one little section of the tune you speed up on, and listening to yourself will (hopefully) help you to see where that problem is.
If it's not a specfic section of a tune that speeds you up, and if you simply speed up gradually, then a metronome is the prescribed treatment.
Still, as someone else pointed out, the most effective solution is really "Just Do It". It's really pretty remarkable how many issues can actually be solved by simply making a concerted effort from your gut (rather than your brain) to solve them.
How do I play slower?
How do I play slower?
Not being a greatly experienced player I like to start off nice and slow, but somehow the three reel set I play gets faster and faster so by the time I reach the third tune it is hurtling out of control and usually I go off the rails cos its too fast. Should I change my medication or is there some other way of keeping slow?
# Posted on October 5th 2004 by mad mike
Re: How do I play slower?
Hmm... I'd use a metronome! Or tap your foot and try to keep a good moderate, consistent, pace.
# Posted on October 5th 2004 by armandale
Re: How do I play slower?
Do double foot tapping. This is where you alternate tapping between the heel and ball of your foot, so you're rocking your foot quite fast, and tapping 4 times for every bar of a reel. I found that doing it this way helped my timing and rhythm - it just takes a bit of getting used to. Once you can do it, you suddenly find you don't even have to tap your foot at all, ever again.
# Posted on October 5th 2004 by Dr. Dow
Re: How do I play slower?
I've see a world-famous fiddle player, whose name I do not propose to mention here, for it would only spark off yet another sub-thread, do this in a concert with one foot while the other taps at half the speed. I shouldn't be surprised if said WFFP has shoes specially made for the purpose
Trevor
# Posted on October 5th 2004 by Trevor Jennings
Re: How do I play slower?
Good advice so far, all this tapping and clicking (of the metronome, that is).
A couple of other things come to mind from my experience. One is nerves and the effect thereof. Being anxious often causes one to play faster than one is able, and to find oneself doing that often is very distressing, and leads to more nervousness. Metronome work might help with this also. I'm not a touchy feely kinda person, but I do think that the only way to get over this acceleration caused by nerves is to develop a meditational kind of absorption in the tune, while at the the same time putting the lash to oneself about steady time. Meditation by metronome, or something. Perhaps this makes no sense.
Another thing I've heard a million times is the tendency to "jump on the phrases". This is my own nomenclature, I'm pretty sure. What I perceive is that people don't give the last long note of a phrase it's proper due, don't allow it to lay out there like it should, with even a wee pause before heading into the next phrase. They jump on the next phrase a hair too soon, and the whole tune gradually ratchets faster and faster. I know I've done this in the past. Though I perceive it now, and don't like it, if I'm in a group of players that is doing this, it's really really hard to fight.
Obviously, I don't know if either of those things are part of your problem, but I offer them as things to study on.
Kate
# Posted on October 5th 2004 by bogeyman
Re: How do I play slower?
"The" three reel set ??
# Posted on October 5th 2004 by ...
Re: How do I play slower?
Hey! Where did you find three reels? I thought there was only the one.
# Posted on October 5th 2004 by GaryAMartin
Re: How do I play slower?
Simply concentrate on not going faster and faster. It really is as simple as that.
Practice playing at a steady speed. Apart from initial help, DON'T use a metronome, or you will simply cultivate the ability to play in time with a metronome. What you need to do is cultivate the ability to play in time with yourself.
# Posted on October 5th 2004 by showaddydadito
Re: How do I play slower?
I've always found metronomes awkward and have always practised my timing by playing along with others including CD recordings etc.
How about using some of software like Transcribe or Amazing Slowdowner?
Foot tapping is quite good as long as your foot just doesn't speed up along with your playing. That used to happen to me too.
# Posted on October 5th 2004 by Johnny Jay
Re: How do I play slower?
Going faster when you shouldn't is a common problem, not only in sessions but in other ensembles such as orchestras. If the music goes up high there is a tendency to play it faster, likewise if it gets louder. Another reason, more prevalent in orchestras than in sessions where most notes are quavers (or eighth notes), is when a flurry of small value "fast" notes pops up there is an observable tendency for the players to hurry (probably a result of mild panic!).
If you're in an orchestra you have a conductor to shout or glare at you. If you're in a session someone might start stamping their feet loudly to haul everyone back on line. If you're practising on your own then it's a case of listening hard and self-discipline, assisted perhaps in the early stages by a metronome or self-recording.
Trevor
# Posted on October 5th 2004 by Trevor Jennings
Re: How do I play slower?
I got amazing slow downer for my pc which allows me to play along with tunes on cd at a slower speed. This has helped me no end, i used to have the same trouble as you Mike.
I tried the foot tapping , metronome with little success.
# Posted on October 5th 2004 by Celtic1234
Re: How do I play slower?
I find that there is usually a point where you tend to speed up. I've been learning the Strayaway Child, which is a 6 part jig... 1st and 2nd parts ok, good tempo, 3rd part I speed up on the rolls, 4th part... realize I've sped up, get back on tempo, 5th part speed up again, can't blame the rolls this time, part 6 - never get it right 'cause I've going too fast. I think my demon is the rolls in particular, or repeated notes.
# Posted on October 6th 2004 by ANNY
Re: How do I play slower?
Anny, are you doing Strayaway on fiddle? Keep the bow speed the same, and really hang on the note before you roll it. Also consider doing less percussive rolls--more "open" and relaxed. This will help prevent speeding up.
# Posted on October 6th 2004 by Will Harmon
Re: How do I play slower?
Thanks Will. Yes, I'm learning it on the fiddle. I know what you mean about hanging on the note before the roll. I know that will help. It's also the 4th finger roll.... pinky just doesn't want to do what my brain tells it, so it comes off too fast and then I don't finish the note properly. Practice, practice, practice, I guess.
# Posted on October 6th 2004 by ANNY
Re: How do I play slower?
Thanks for all the helpful suggestions. So far the heel and toe has produced effects reminiscent of trying to pat the head and rub the tummy at the same time (or is it the other way round. However I am going to persist with this because some of the steadiest players I've ever soon including WFFP (MH I presume) do just that.
As for 'the' three reel set, its just that I usually play my reels in sets of 14.
# Posted on October 6th 2004 by mad mike
Re: How do I play slower?
I think singing the tunes first at a reasonable pase can help you to play slower. If you play fiddle just trying to use more bow can also help!
# Posted on October 7th 2004 by M0nty10
Re: How do I play slower?
i disagree with showaddydadito, you should use a metronome. but they are right, dont get dependent on metronomes. what i would do is take one reel or one jig, and work on it, beat by beat, until you can get it perfectly in time. then, play it without the metronome, and dont speed up or get out of time; basically, learn your lessons with the metronome and only go back to it as a last resort.
# Posted on October 8th 2004 by daiv
Re: How do I play slower?
Regarding Anny's problem with The Strayaway Child, I have been having just that problem with that tune particularly since I learned it a couple of months ago, despite practising it more than any other tune I know. In fact the Vegan Bodhran discussion I posted here a few weeks ago was prompted by the difficulty I experienced in trying to play it solo at a session. Can anybody say what is it about that particular tune that causes the acceleration? I would love to crack this, as I would agree with Karen Tweed that The Strayaway Child is one of the most beautiful of all tunes, and I have loved it ever since I heard the Bothy Band recording of it so many years ago.
# Posted on October 11th 2004 by An Goban Saor
Re: How do I play slower?
One dot at the time!
# Posted on October 11th 2004 by pitnekit
Re: How do I play slower?
My own $.02 (I am asked this question often):
Metronomes are generally *GOOD*. They keep you honest. If nothing else, they are effectively _always_ correct when it comes to keeping time. They are very unforgiving, in a good way. It's often frustrating to work with them at first, but it gets easier--and it will do your rhythm good.
Keeping time primarily with your foot is a *BAD* idea. Tapping your foot is fine, but if your brain is speeding up the tempo, what makes you think your foot will do better? There are outside cases where it works, and it might be better than nothing, but... I find that a student's rhythm usually improves when they stop tapping and feel the beat in their heart instead of their spastic legs. (there's also something particularly annoying about a bad, loud, foot-tapper at a session)
BEST advice: record yourself and see if you can figure out your problem more objectively. Often it's one little section of the tune you speed up on, and listening to yourself will (hopefully) help you to see where that problem is.
If it's not a specfic section of a tune that speeds you up, and if you simply speed up gradually, then a metronome is the prescribed treatment.
Still, as someone else pointed out, the most effective solution is really "Just Do It". It's really pretty remarkable how many issues can actually be solved by simply making a concerted effort from your gut (rather than your brain) to solve them.
--Georgi
# Posted on October 18th 2004 by Georgi