My first real post here, so if this topic was already discussed please ignore my stupidity of posting it again. But I was wondering, is it really necessary to go to sessions to learn Irish music???
I mainly posted this question just because I have been playing fiddle for about 8 years now and have only attended a few sessions. My schedule has always been hectic, especially now that I have my 1yr old daughter, so I never really have the time to attend sessions regularly due to no babysitter. (Which I don't even dare bring her to a session because I know it would not be good session etiquette to have a 1yr old running wild)
But is it possible for a person to learn tunes by other means besides going to a session. Either by lessons, books, music or sources from the internet? Or will he/she be frowned upon by other musicians? I'm interested to hear what you all think.
Slan
Liz
Not really answering the question, but:
1) I went to a session on Inisheer where the flute player brought a small baby, and every few minutes put the flute down to tend to the child - I didn't get the impression that anybody had a problem with that;
2) One of the fiddler players at our session was there two consecutive Sundays and gave birth on the Wednesday in between.
sessions dont have to be in a pub. sessioning is playing together. do you have to go to a bar to play? well... i dont think thats the case. but, see, you really cant play irish music if you CANT play at a bar session. so is it that you cant play at sessions, or you dont want to?
a good teacher playing with you should end up being like a session, otherwise they're doing something wrong, because thats not the way to teach irish music. it should be like a session with a lot of stops. you should end up playing long sets once you get a large repertoire of tunes.
the best way to learn tunes is from other people, or recordings (as my grandma says, session with a tape. its the same). as my grandma and uncle's teacher said, "you cant play music without hearing it". so listen listen listen and listen some more.
you're really missing out if you learn just from sheet music.
Sessions are a relatively new thing in Irish Traditional music.
This music was originally kitchen music, and more often solo rather than ensemble. Variation and ornamentation of the basic tune are often lost in a big session.
Although it’s not necessary to go to sessions to play this music, what is necessary is to
play with and listen to good musicians to learn it properly.
However I would say it is necessary to go to session to learn how to play IN sessions,
which is a different thing entirely.
No, you don't have to go to sessions, but you do need to hear it and play with people who can already play. Your list of books, music or sources from the internet is inadequatee
These days most of us will learn our tunes from various sources rather than sessions. I don't think the latter is really practicable much of the time, regardless of your views about picking up tunes "on the fly". I'll not start that argument again, except to say that I think it's ok to do this and/or swap tunes with other sessioners but that depends on the type of session and whether you can do it discreetly enough. However, sessions are important, as you have to have the experience of playing with others and being able to know how the tunes should sound. Also, you'll find out what the current or standard (I'll avoid the word "fashionable", though it might be) repertoire happens to be.
As many here have mentioned, sessions don't have to be held in a pub. How about inviting a few playing friends to your house and , perhaps, this invitation could be reciprocated from time to time? Also, there are many "family friendly" sessions these days (even here in Scotland, the last bastion of grumpy male spit and sawdust attitudes ) and there's no harm in going along to listen, even if you don't feel it's appropriate to play. You'll still gain a lot from this.
Lizzie - according to your profile you play in at least one band (and seem possibly to have done so for some years). You also "play a lot" with members of another local Irish band - though you don't appear to play IN the band.
So you:
a) already know quite a few tunes
and
b) play with other musicians quite a lot
so I am struggling to see quite what you are actually asking in your post. Now we see that you already fulfil all the things outlined by Daiv, BegF and Michael above, it would seem that the only question left is the small child.
I know several sessions where a small child would not be a problem - see what you can find near you. And if you know a tune, who is going to ask where you learned it?
Yes I do play in a band and do play with some local musicians from time to time. But when we do play, its usually only a few reels and jigs that I know and they play along. And the rest of the time its them singing songs and I just play along with them. So I didnt really think that that could be considered as a session type of thing.
As for bringing up my daughter, I did just to give background on why I havent been going to sessions lately. And it is not because I dont want to go. I have gone to several and had a blast every time, but that was a while back before I had my daughter and I had never really seen any young children at the ones I've been to. But since some of you brought up that it was ok, I just might start bringing her to some. She does always clap whenever I play..
As for how I learn my music, its mostly by listening to any cds I can get my hands on. When I danced I bought a lot of the feis musician's cds so I could get a better idea of how the tunes were played and what not. I do have a few books, but I had bought them when I first started out. I only refer to sheet music if I really can't figure out a tune, but that's about it. I use the internet to find cds and occasionally look up a song if I cant figure out the notes.
I am truly sorry if I offended anyone by posting this. That was not my intent. I was just curious to know what everyone thought because I didnt know if it was right that I've been playing in a band and haven't been attending sessions in a while. If I have offended anyone, I am so so so so so so sorry.
Ok, I think I'm gonna shut up now before I dig a deeper grave for myself.
Slan
Lizzie
Liz, I can't possibly see how you offended anyone. Don't take anything said on here too much to heart. If anyone gives the impression they were offended by a simple question then they are defeating the purpose of this site. In my view, no - you don't have to go to sessions to learn Irish music. Nor do you necessarily need to go to sessions to enjoy Irish music. Many of my friends took lessons from respected musicians at their homes and would play tunes with them; some go to sessions, some don't. People enjoy this music in many different ways and in various contexts. If you haven't got the time or the inclination to go to sessions, don't worry; they are not the be all and end all of Irish music, despite what some people might tell you. Personally speaking I love sessions as they suit my personality and how I want to hear the music played, but as long as you keep on enjoying the music for what it is, that's great. Good luck! :¬)
No, you didn't offend anyone, Lizzie. Of course, there's always some people who will be upset about anything and/or be deliberately difficult but that's not your fault. Don't worry about Will and Jack. They had their own issue which I believe has been resolved, so that was just a bit of humour on their part ). As for Dave, I think he was just trying to clarify a couple of points and didn't mean to be awkward.
Hope you get back to playing in sessions soon.
Liz - Jack and I were just having a good chuckle at our own expense, not yours.
Your question's a good one, but there are any number of answers. Here's mine, for what it's worth.
Sessions are fun. Whether you go to play, or to just listen, the point is to enjoy the company of friends and neighbors over a few pints and a slew of tunes. Sessions are a good way to get a grounding in what this music is all about, to immerse yourself in the tunes by listening, and to get to know other people who share a passion for this stuff. (Sitting in the kitchen of a good player and swapping tunes and stories is also a good way to do this, as is going to a music camp.)
In my experience, nothing can replace face-to-face interaction with other musicians who know what this music is about.
That said, there are differences of opinion about actually learning the music at a session. Some people think it's okay to pick up tunes "on the fly" at a session. Most of us in this camp would say you should already be proficient on your instrument, and practiced at learning tunes by ear before attempting this at a session. Also, to avoid distracting the other players, you need to be as discreet as possible -- ask first if it's okay to try to learn a tune, then play very quietly, only on one or two tunes, and stop if it's not working. I usually don't try learning a tune on the fly unless I've already heard it a hundred times (at the session, most likely), so it's already in my head and all I have to do is suss out where the notes are on my fiddle. I've been learning tunes by ear (and often on the fly at sessions) for nearly 30 years, yet I tend to reserve it for only one or two tunes in a night, and easily go weeks without giving it a try, just out of respect for my friends and the music.
Bear in mind that some people think it's NOT okay for people to learn tunes at a session. They reason that such attempts tend to detract from the quality of music. The session is where you air out the tunes you know and can play well. It's best to learn tunes and practice at home. If you're sitting in their session, it's only polite to play *only* on tunes you already know.
Also bear in mind that the same folks at the same session may be open to some tune learning one night and not the next.
One way around all this is to learn the tunes in your head at the session, without trying to suss them out on your instrument. If you can lilt a tune in your head, you will be able to work the tune out later, at home, without annoying anyone but your spouse (who's resigned to it, right? . In fact, until you can do this, there's not much point in scraping along tune an unfamiliar tune--it has to be in your head first. You can do this by simply listening deeply and following the tune in your mind's ear.
A good session is a wondrous thing--go as often as you can, get the music in your head and heart, and you'll be well on the way to playing your share of tunes.
Sorry - had to close quick cos there were someones fingers jammed inside a delicate and expensive machine.
Will and Jack were continuing an in house joke from a previous thread, as JohnJ points out.
As for me - the question "Am I missing something" was a genuine question, to be taken exactly as asked with no hidden insinuations. I'll tell you why: I can think of no better definition of a session than what you say you do with your band friends. Just playing a few tunes together. That's what a session is.
When I get together with the lads and lasses at the local pub - we play a few reels and jigs together, and that's really all there is to it. A pub session is one that takes place in a pub, a kitchen session is one that takes place in a kitchen. I've played in "car-park" sessions (thats probably "parking-lot" to you), and in "field" sessions, traffic jam sessions and even a bus session. If Zina were about to find the thread for us, you'd see that some folks on this site play regularly or occasionally in places such as laboratories, lavatories and observatories too. They're all sessions, because they're gatherings of musicians for the purpose of playing a few tunes, just for the pleasure of doing so (as distinct from doing it for practice or paid performance). So after reading in your profile I was genuinely at a loss as to what you were asking - because you obviously get to plenty of sessions already.
We always welcome children at our sesh, because they are the players of the future.
If you don't go to sessions, why would you be bothered if other musicians frowned at you? Presumable your friends that you play with don't frown at you, otherwise I'd get new friends, so where would one come across other musicians that would frown?
If you just play at home there seems to be no reason that you couldn't play just exactly what you liked, whether it sounds "Irish" or like punk rock with a fiddle. That's the beauty of playing alone.
Once you play outside of your own home, it is either a gig, in which case you still can play whatever you feel like (some things will get more of an audience than others, but that's no reason to change your style in my opinion. Unless the audience is locked in a room with you it's their choice to listen or to walk away) or it's a session.
The session is the only situation I can think of where people would have a case for being unhappy with you for playing a whatever you thought sounded nice. Without getting into a huge discussion, sessions are generally situations where a group of musicians have decided to play in a certain way. Therefore in this case you will have to, in some way shape or form, adapt to what's already going on. Otherwise much pulling or hair, gnashing of teeth and general unhappiness will ensue.....
So, to answer your question. It is only really necessary to learn to play in a session, if you actually want to play in a session.
Lizzie, I was at a pub session in Ennystimon (County Clare) last summer that was populated by family members of all ages, down to toddlers coloring with crayons on the floor.
Perhaps you could host a slow session at your house for tune learning, as mentioned above.
I find that every member of our session group has a different version of any particular tune and all claim their's is the REAL one. Unless of course we all learn a tune from any one of the others, then we all know it the same way.
I learn quite a lot from CD's. That way I get to play along with some of the world's greatest musicians.
Chris
Don't be shy, redhead. If you think you've offended people in *this* thread, just wait until somebody brings up spoons or recorders!
Stephen King said "If you don't have the time to read, you lack the necessary tools to write" (I'm sure I'm paraphrasing a bit). In other words, in order to create something of quality, it is necessary to take in as much as possible. Whether you get it at a bar, or with your bands, or in your kitchen, there is no substitute for the physical presence of other musicians, *especially ones who play your instrument better than you.*
If there's nobody like that in your current circle of friends, you might want to go to enough sessions just to find a mentor and either ask for lessons or get a phone number so you can invite him/her to your kitchen for some tunes.
Well saw the recent posts and just wanted to say thanks. I am quite shy, if u havent noticed, and it takes me a lot to talk about something with people I dont know. Im weird I guess...lol..anyways...
But thank you for the input. Really helped me out..so thanks!
Why even try and re-open the discussion of this point? There are so many other directions this discussion could go.
I believe (and sorry if I am wrong) that Jack's intent was to point that out, and that he was being a gentleman by not taking the bait. At least, that is how I read his humor.
Relax Eliot. Despite our different approaches to communication, Jack and I are clearly on the same wavelength when it comes to sessions. I'm not trying to re-open anything or bait anyone--simply posting my thoughts in response to Liz's queries. You're welcome to read into that whatever you want, but that doesn't mean I was trying to imply anything.
You get to meet Emily tomorrow, wow Eliot???!!! Check it out man -- she let me hold and fondle her uh... she has one of the loveliest, most gorgeous...
...flutes I've ever seen. Rudall & Rose by Carte, mint condition.
Wow, I had no idea I'm meeting Jim & Stu, as well as the regular Wednesday night crowd & yerself, Eliot! A. I better find my hair brush. B. More gum! Lots of wine to polish off before Himself heads out for good...... Today we made a big dent in a lot of the packing & storage locker organization, also a great session at the Plough last night, we missed you Jack! Big turnout, & really solid players all around. The Sebastopol Festival was great as well, with my personal highlight being the concert on Sunday with Martin Hayes, Kevin Crawford & John Doyle aka the amateur club Teetotalers. All 3 wore black with black sunglasses, & absolutely rocked our world. Now that it's apple season, I'm gonna try to bake an apple pie tonight! If it's successful, I'll make one for Wednesday, haha.
Yea Emily, I heard about that session... sounds like it might have been a bit too big for my preference. I like the smaller quieter ones… I’m very delicate you see.
Lizzie, back to your original question. I have a 2 1/2 and a 9 month old. If the local pub supports such a thing as bringing your kids, ask a friend along and go on down. My wife and I used to swap, one following boyo around the bar, the other playing tunes. It worked pretty well until the management noticed. It's an Irish pub by name only...
Our other way around it is to host parties! We've had a few doosies, and we have a lovely kitchen for tunes. Sometimes the kids go to bed late, and we have to run up and put them back to sleep, but otherwise it is great.
And sometimes you just have to listen to the good tunes that are going on in your house. And that is fun too, and educational.
My opinion of this music is that it is social. One must practice on their own, but to really get a tune down, it is best to play it with other musicians.
Learning from recordings is OK, but face time and 'ear' time is important.
If you don't have the courage or resources to host parties, then find a mentor. Someone you can visit and play tunes with. Invite them over for dinner. Set up a regular visit time with them. If they are kid friendly, bring along a favorite toy or book!
Um, Kerri, tell us something we don't already know.
Here's hoping all our friends in California made it through today's 6.0 earthquake without any harm. I imagine it sent a few interesting ripples across the pond in the Plough and Stars.
Sessions necessary??
Sessions necessary??
My first real post here, so if this topic was already discussed please ignore my stupidity of posting it again. But I was wondering, is it really necessary to go to sessions to learn Irish music???
I mainly posted this question just because I have been playing fiddle for about 8 years now and have only attended a few sessions. My schedule has always been hectic, especially now that I have my 1yr old daughter, so I never really have the time to attend sessions regularly due to no babysitter. (Which I don't even dare bring her to a session because I know it would not be good session etiquette to have a 1yr old running wild)
But is it possible for a person to learn tunes by other means besides going to a session. Either by lessons, books, music or sources from the internet? Or will he/she be frowned upon by other musicians? I'm interested to hear what you all think.
Slan
Liz
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by redheadgirl1219
Re: Sessions necessary??
I'm not saying anything.
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Phantom Button
Re: Sessions necessary??
LOL, me either.
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Will CPT
Re: Sessions necessary??
Not really answering the question, but:
1) I went to a session on Inisheer where the flute player brought a small baby, and every few minutes put the flute down to tend to the child - I didn't get the impression that anybody had a problem with that;
2) One of the fiddler players at our session was there two consecutive Sundays and gave birth on the Wednesday in between.
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by GaryAMartin
Re: Sessions necessary??
Your baby can get into our local pub with a fake ID.
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Phantom Button
Re: Sessions necessary??
sessions dont have to be in a pub. sessioning is playing together. do you have to go to a bar to play? well... i dont think thats the case. but, see, you really cant play irish music if you CANT play at a bar session. so is it that you cant play at sessions, or you dont want to?
a good teacher playing with you should end up being like a session, otherwise they're doing something wrong, because thats not the way to teach irish music. it should be like a session with a lot of stops. you should end up playing long sets once you get a large repertoire of tunes.
the best way to learn tunes is from other people, or recordings (as my grandma says, session with a tape. its the same). as my grandma and uncle's teacher said, "you cant play music without hearing it". so listen listen listen and listen some more.
you're really missing out if you learn just from sheet music.
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by daiv
Re: Sessions necessary??
Is it really necessary to learn Irish music if you don't go to sessions?
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Kerri Brown
Re: Sessions necessary??
Yes and no.
Sessions are a relatively new thing in Irish Traditional music.
This music was originally kitchen music, and more often solo rather than ensemble. Variation and ornamentation of the basic tune are often lost in a big session.
Although it’s not necessary to go to sessions to play this music, what is necessary is to
play with and listen to good musicians to learn it properly.
However I would say it is necessary to go to session to learn how to play IN sessions,
which is a different thing entirely.
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by BegF
Re: Sessions necessary??
No, you don't have to go to sessions, but you do need to hear it and play with people who can already play. Your list of books, music or sources from the internet is inadequatee
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by llig leahcim
Re: Sessions necessary??
These days most of us will learn our tunes from various sources rather than sessions. I don't think the latter is really practicable much of the time, regardless of your views about picking up tunes "on the fly". I'll not start that argument again, except to say that I think it's ok to do this and/or swap tunes with other sessioners but that depends on the type of session and whether you can do it discreetly enough. However, sessions are important, as you have to have the experience of playing with others and being able to know how the tunes should sound. Also, you'll find out what the current or standard (I'll avoid the word "fashionable", though it might be) repertoire happens to be.
) and there's no harm in going along to listen, even if you don't feel it's appropriate to play. You'll still gain a lot from this.
As many here have mentioned, sessions don't have to be held in a pub. How about inviting a few playing friends to your house and , perhaps, this invitation could be reciprocated from time to time? Also, there are many "family friendly" sessions these days (even here in Scotland, the last bastion of grumpy male spit and sawdust attitudes
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Johannes J
Re: Sessions necessary??
Am I missing something here?
Lizzie - according to your profile you play in at least one band (and seem possibly to have done so for some years). You also "play a lot" with members of another local Irish band - though you don't appear to play IN the band.
So you:
a) already know quite a few tunes
and
b) play with other musicians quite a lot
so I am struggling to see quite what you are actually asking in your post. Now we see that you already fulfil all the things outlined by Daiv, BegF and Michael above, it would seem that the only question left is the small child.
I know several sessions where a small child would not be a problem - see what you can find near you. And if you know a tune, who is going to ask where you learned it?
Gotta go quick - the creaser's jammed.
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by showaddydadito
Re: Sessions necessary??
Sessions aren't necessary but they're fun
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Cath
Re: Sessions necessary??
Ok, well to answer some questions:
Yes I do play in a band and do play with some local musicians from time to time. But when we do play, its usually only a few reels and jigs that I know and they play along. And the rest of the time its them singing songs and I just play along with them. So I didnt really think that that could be considered as a session type of thing.
As for bringing up my daughter, I did just to give background on why I havent been going to sessions lately. And it is not because I dont want to go. I have gone to several and had a blast every time, but that was a while back before I had my daughter and I had never really seen any young children at the ones I've been to. But since some of you brought up that it was ok, I just might start bringing her to some. She does always clap whenever I play..
As for how I learn my music, its mostly by listening to any cds I can get my hands on. When I danced I bought a lot of the feis musician's cds so I could get a better idea of how the tunes were played and what not. I do have a few books, but I had bought them when I first started out. I only refer to sheet music if I really can't figure out a tune, but that's about it. I use the internet to find cds and occasionally look up a song if I cant figure out the notes.
I am truly sorry if I offended anyone by posting this. That was not my intent. I was just curious to know what everyone thought because I didnt know if it was right that I've been playing in a band and haven't been attending sessions in a while. If I have offended anyone, I am so so so so so so sorry.
Ok, I think I'm gonna shut up now before I dig a deeper grave for myself.
Slan
Lizzie
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by redheadgirl1219
Re: Sessions necessary??
Liz, I can't possibly see how you offended anyone. Don't take anything said on here too much to heart. If anyone gives the impression they were offended by a simple question then they are defeating the purpose of this site. In my view, no - you don't have to go to sessions to learn Irish music. Nor do you necessarily need to go to sessions to enjoy Irish music. Many of my friends took lessons from respected musicians at their homes and would play tunes with them; some go to sessions, some don't. People enjoy this music in many different ways and in various contexts. If you haven't got the time or the inclination to go to sessions, don't worry; they are not the be all and end all of Irish music, despite what some people might tell you. Personally speaking I love sessions as they suit my personality and how I want to hear the music played, but as long as you keep on enjoying the music for what it is, that's great. Good luck! :¬)
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Sessions necessary??
No, you didn't offend anyone, Lizzie. Of course, there's always some people who will be upset about anything and/or be deliberately difficult but that's not your fault. Don't worry about Will and Jack. They had their own issue which I believe has been resolved, so that was just a bit of humour on their part
). As for Dave, I think he was just trying to clarify a couple of points and didn't mean to be awkward.
Hope you get back to playing in sessions soon.
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Johannes J
Re: Sessions necessary??
Liz - Jack and I were just having a good chuckle at our own expense, not yours.
Your question's a good one, but there are any number of answers. Here's mine, for what it's worth.
Sessions are fun. Whether you go to play, or to just listen, the point is to enjoy the company of friends and neighbors over a few pints and a slew of tunes. Sessions are a good way to get a grounding in what this music is all about, to immerse yourself in the tunes by listening, and to get to know other people who share a passion for this stuff. (Sitting in the kitchen of a good player and swapping tunes and stories is also a good way to do this, as is going to a music camp.)
In my experience, nothing can replace face-to-face interaction with other musicians who know what this music is about.
That said, there are differences of opinion about actually learning the music at a session. Some people think it's okay to pick up tunes "on the fly" at a session. Most of us in this camp would say you should already be proficient on your instrument, and practiced at learning tunes by ear before attempting this at a session. Also, to avoid distracting the other players, you need to be as discreet as possible -- ask first if it's okay to try to learn a tune, then play very quietly, only on one or two tunes, and stop if it's not working. I usually don't try learning a tune on the fly unless I've already heard it a hundred times (at the session, most likely), so it's already in my head and all I have to do is suss out where the notes are on my fiddle. I've been learning tunes by ear (and often on the fly at sessions) for nearly 30 years, yet I tend to reserve it for only one or two tunes in a night, and easily go weeks without giving it a try, just out of respect for my friends and the music.
Bear in mind that some people think it's NOT okay for people to learn tunes at a session. They reason that such attempts tend to detract from the quality of music. The session is where you air out the tunes you know and can play well. It's best to learn tunes and practice at home. If you're sitting in their session, it's only polite to play *only* on tunes you already know.
Also bear in mind that the same folks at the same session may be open to some tune learning one night and not the next.
One way around all this is to learn the tunes in your head at the session, without trying to suss them out on your instrument. If you can lilt a tune in your head, you will be able to work the tune out later, at home, without annoying anyone but your spouse (who's resigned to it, right?
. In fact, until you can do this, there's not much point in scraping along tune an unfamiliar tune--it has to be in your head first. You can do this by simply listening deeply and following the tune in your mind's ear.
A good session is a wondrous thing--go as often as you can, get the music in your head and heart, and you'll be well on the way to playing your share of tunes.
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Will CPT
Re: Sessions necessary??
Lizzie
Sorry - had to close quick cos there were someones fingers jammed inside a delicate and expensive machine.
Will and Jack were continuing an in house joke from a previous thread, as JohnJ points out.
As for me - the question "Am I missing something" was a genuine question, to be taken exactly as asked with no hidden insinuations. I'll tell you why: I can think of no better definition of a session than what you say you do with your band friends. Just playing a few tunes together. That's what a session is.
When I get together with the lads and lasses at the local pub - we play a few reels and jigs together, and that's really all there is to it. A pub session is one that takes place in a pub, a kitchen session is one that takes place in a kitchen. I've played in "car-park" sessions (thats probably "parking-lot" to you), and in "field" sessions, traffic jam sessions and even a bus session. If Zina were about to find the thread for us, you'd see that some folks on this site play regularly or occasionally in places such as laboratories, lavatories and observatories too. They're all sessions, because they're gatherings of musicians for the purpose of playing a few tunes, just for the pleasure of doing so (as distinct from doing it for practice or paid performance). So after reading in your profile I was genuinely at a loss as to what you were asking - because you obviously get to plenty of sessions already.
We always welcome children at our sesh, because they are the players of the future.
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by showaddydadito
Re: Sessions necessary??
If you don't go to sessions, why would you be bothered if other musicians frowned at you? Presumable your friends that you play with don't frown at you, otherwise I'd get new friends, so where would one come across other musicians that would frown?
If you just play at home there seems to be no reason that you couldn't play just exactly what you liked, whether it sounds "Irish" or like punk rock with a fiddle. That's the beauty of playing alone.
Once you play outside of your own home, it is either a gig, in which case you still can play whatever you feel like (some things will get more of an audience than others, but that's no reason to change your style in my opinion. Unless the audience is locked in a room with you it's their choice to listen or to walk away) or it's a session.
The session is the only situation I can think of where people would have a case for being unhappy with you for playing a whatever you thought sounded nice. Without getting into a huge discussion, sessions are generally situations where a group of musicians have decided to play in a certain way. Therefore in this case you will have to, in some way shape or form, adapt to what's already going on. Otherwise much pulling or hair, gnashing of teeth and general unhappiness will ensue.....
So, to answer your question. It is only really necessary to learn to play in a session, if you actually want to play in a session.
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by SL*
Re: Sessions necessary??
Lizzie, I was at a pub session in Ennystimon (County Clare) last summer that was populated by family members of all ages, down to toddlers coloring with crayons on the floor.
Perhaps you could host a slow session at your house for tune learning, as mentioned above.
I find that every member of our session group has a different version of any particular tune and all claim their's is the REAL one. Unless of course we all learn a tune from any one of the others, then we all know it the same way.
I learn quite a lot from CD's. That way I get to play along with some of the world's greatest musicians.
Chris
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by unique
Re: Sessions necessary??
Uh, Will... a couple of things...
nevermind
hee hee hee
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Phantom Button
Re: Sessions necessary??
Don't be shy, redhead. If you think you've offended people in *this* thread, just wait until somebody brings up spoons or recorders!
Stephen King said "If you don't have the time to read, you lack the necessary tools to write" (I'm sure I'm paraphrasing a bit). In other words, in order to create something of quality, it is necessary to take in as much as possible. Whether you get it at a bar, or with your bands, or in your kitchen, there is no substitute for the physical presence of other musicians, *especially ones who play your instrument better than you.*
If there's nobody like that in your current circle of friends, you might want to go to enough sessions just to find a mentor and either ask for lessons or get a phone number so you can invite him/her to your kitchen for some tunes.
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Kerri Brown
Re: Sessions necessary??
Well saw the recent posts and just wanted to say thanks. I am quite shy, if u havent noticed, and it takes me a lot to talk about something with people I dont know. Im weird I guess...lol..anyways...
But thank you for the input. Really helped me out..so thanks!
Slan
Lizzie
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by redheadgirl1219
Re: Sessions necessary??
I'm tired.
Anyone have a good shot of espresso they can fax me?
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Eliot
Re: Sessions necessary??
Jack, if we've narrowed it down to just a couple of things, then we must be doing something right.
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Will CPT
Re: Sessions necessary??
Will,
Why even try and re-open the discussion of this point? There are so many other directions this discussion could go.
I believe (and sorry if I am wrong) that Jack's intent was to point that out, and that he was being a gentleman by not taking the bait. At least, that is how I read his humor.
My personal opinion?
I need a shot of espresso...
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Eliot
Re: Sessions necessary??
I don't think that was Will's intent, Eliot. He and I are just in that awkward and squishy kiss and make-up phase right now.
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Phantom Button
Re: Sessions necessary??
Relax Eliot. Despite our different approaches to communication, Jack and I are clearly on the same wavelength when it comes to sessions. I'm not trying to re-open anything or bait anyone--simply posting my thoughts in response to Liz's queries. You're welcome to read into that whatever you want, but that doesn't mean I was trying to imply anything.
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Will CPT
Re: Sessions necessary??
And our beards keep getting in the way....
Yyyyccccchhhhh!
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Will CPT
Re: Sessions necessary??
Uh...Will... did you forget to brush this morning by the way? Want some gum? I have a piece left over that Emily tried to give me last Saturday.
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Phantom Button
Re: Sessions necessary??
Lol, no thanks, I'll just snack on this leftover stir fry here in your beard....
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Will CPT
Re: Sessions necessary??
Uh... That's from last Thursday, Will.
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Phantom Button
Re: Sessions necessary??
So's my breath....
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Will CPT
Re: Sessions necessary??
OK, maybe it was the lack of espresso... apologies
I get to meet Emily tomorrow night... I'll save the gum.
--E
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Eliot
Re: Sessions necessary??
You get to meet Emily tomorrow, wow Eliot???!!! Check it out man -- she let me hold and fondle her uh... she has one of the loveliest, most gorgeous...
...flutes I've ever seen. Rudall & Rose by Carte, mint condition.
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Phantom Button
Re: Sessions necessary??
The idea is that we're going to have a bit of a session, Jim Wimmer, Stu H., Dave L., Emily and myself (I hope...) Dave is organizing it.
Come on down! It's in SLO at Dave's house
# Posted on September 27th 2004 by Eliot
Re: Sessions necessary??
Ahhh... the good 'ol boys... eee ha!
# Posted on September 28th 2004 by Phantom Button
Re: Sessions necessary??
Wow, I had no idea I'm meeting Jim & Stu, as well as the regular Wednesday night crowd & yerself, Eliot! A. I better find my hair brush. B. More gum! Lots of wine to polish off before Himself heads out for good...... Today we made a big dent in a lot of the packing & storage locker organization, also a great session at the Plough last night, we missed you Jack! Big turnout, & really solid players all around. The Sebastopol Festival was great as well, with my personal highlight being the concert on Sunday with Martin Hayes, Kevin Crawford & John Doyle aka the amateur club Teetotalers. All 3 wore black with black sunglasses, & absolutely rocked our world. Now that it's apple season, I'm gonna try to bake an apple pie tonight! If it's successful, I'll make one for Wednesday, haha.
# Posted on September 28th 2004 by emily_bmore
Re: Sessions necessary??
OMG I just read the stir fry in the beard thing. I've absolutely no earthly way how to process that. I think I'm scarred for life.
# Posted on September 28th 2004 by emily_bmore
Re: Sessions necessary??
Yea Emily, I heard about that session... sounds like it might have been a bit too big for my preference. I like the smaller quieter ones… I’m very delicate you see.
# Posted on September 28th 2004 by Phantom Button
Re: Sessions necessary??
Lizzie, back to your original question. I have a 2 1/2 and a 9 month old. If the local pub supports such a thing as bringing your kids, ask a friend along and go on down. My wife and I used to swap, one following boyo around the bar, the other playing tunes. It worked pretty well until the management noticed. It's an Irish pub by name only...
Our other way around it is to host parties! We've had a few doosies, and we have a lovely kitchen for tunes. Sometimes the kids go to bed late, and we have to run up and put them back to sleep, but otherwise it is great.
And sometimes you just have to listen to the good tunes that are going on in your house. And that is fun too, and educational.
My opinion of this music is that it is social. One must practice on their own, but to really get a tune down, it is best to play it with other musicians.
Learning from recordings is OK, but face time and 'ear' time is important.
If you don't have the courage or resources to host parties, then find a mentor. Someone you can visit and play tunes with. Invite them over for dinner. Set up a regular visit time with them. If they are kid friendly, bring along a favorite toy or book!
Good luck to you and keep it going!!
# Posted on September 28th 2004 by Jode
Re: Sessions necessary??
Will, Jack, you're both disgusting.
# Posted on September 28th 2004 by Kerri Brown
Re: Sessions necessary??
Um, Kerri, tell us something we don't already know.
Here's hoping all our friends in California made it through today's 6.0 earthquake without any harm. I imagine it sent a few interesting ripples across the pond in the Plough and Stars.
# Posted on September 29th 2004 by Will CPT
Re: Sessions necessary??
No ripples... I did see a few nipples though. There was a bit of a chill in the air here today.
(didn't want to disappoint Kerri)
# Posted on September 29th 2004 by Phantom Button
Re: Sessions necessary??
I think I need a rolfing session.
# Posted on September 29th 2004 by Kerri Brown