At a member of this site's wedding recently, my quite newly acquired blackwood Boehm flute was swept off the table, still in its case, but with the case open, so all three flute sections landed on the floor. The flute was ok but the case got ripped in two, as it dangled on the precipice of the table, splitting along the leather seam which hinges the top and bottom.
Immediately before the incident, I could see what was coming, so I kept calling the guys name out but he just kept lumbering forward. This all happened as if in slow motion and I couldn't believe my eyes as it was occurring.
Afterwards, the culprit of this accident (no name mentioned as he's a very decent guy - just not very agile) was most copiously apologetic, and me placating him saying it was bound to happen sooner or later.
Bit of a shame but there you go.... no problem I suppose really - I don't intend to sell this flute, so whether its resale value is now compromised isn't an issue.
Shame about the scratch too. Makes the music shop in the village in Ireland next to the wonderful old pub etc etc all seem just a waste of time now doesn't it.
;o)
I'd hate to sound smug, but my beautiful Fylde mandolin hasn't yet got a first scratch - I've had it five months and play it every day - is this some sort of a record?
I bought a new mandolin a few months back. I've rarely taken it out the house and I keep it in its case when I'm not actually playing it. And yet somehow it's already acquired a couple of dings on the face and a bit of paintwork has been chipped off the headstock. It hacks me off no end, because no doubt these little blemishes have afected its resale value.
On the other hand, my regular session instrument, a cheap and nasty Musikalia Octave Mandolin, is completely battered and chipped and battle-stained. I can live with that. Its resale value is pretty low in any event and there's something about a lived-in instrument that's quite appealing.
But I have a new Fylde mandolin "in the post" at the time of writing ... I'll be really cheesed-off when it gets its first scratch, ding, whatever!
As for Stewpot's story ... I sympathise, I really do. I remember waking up one morning, very unwell, to be confronted by my favourite guitar of the time lying in bits in the corner where I'd dumped it after having fallen over a few times on the way home from a band rehearsal that turned into a three-day bender ... sob! Beyond repair is only the half of it!
I've owned various accordions in my time - my current one is the only box I've bought new. The rest were second-hand and not that expensive so I didn't treat them very well. One accordion was lost, still in it's case, bound to a trolley in a park in Lorient. When I got drunk one night, I decided to sleep under a tree and when I woke up couldn't remember where I left it. A similar fate befell a small box which I lost while having a drunken piddle under Archway tube station one night. Another accordion is in our garage in Belfast succumbing to mildew. Yet another was given away for parts, Another lost it's front cover and side strap (which was replaced with electrical wire) on tour in Romania. My present box was in mint condition until my girlfriend noticed a dent in the front casing last Sunday :
You don't tend to get this kind of thing with fiddles... my current fiddle has a cross that someone's burnt into the back at some point in the past, a bit of old woodworm, most of the varnish has blackened (being original) and any number of little scrapes. Beautiful instrument though, I love it. I've just never been *too* concerned about "getting the first scratch"...
Get over IT, Scratches and use are signs of a well loved instrument. My Gibson 12 string that my mom gave me in high school (US- what do they call it over in England/Ireland) some 40+ years ago has nicks and goughes with this giant sound.
Now if someone did that to my UP chanter and the reed got damaged, there would be H**L to pay.
Hi Steve,
Sympathy! My then brand-new, dearly beloved fiddle got its first scratch last fall. I had it laid across my lap while i was tightening my bow and generally futzing around getting ready to play. Then as I picked up the tuning fork my husband suddenly made a loud exclamation that startled me. The tuning fork bounced off the fiddle top, twice. Ding, ding, scratch. ARRGHHHHH!
(And i couldn't blame my poor husband, he was being told over the phone that his favorite cousin was due to get shipped to Iraq.)
Oh, well. My favorite instrument guy fixed it so it hardly shows. And Rog is right, fiddles are considered to have extra character when they're dinged. But still...
Sara
My fiddle's has a few scratches in it's lifetime, but none by me...ever seen Tommy Emmanuel's and Steve Cooney's guitars?
There are guitars on their scratches. Yea, that's it - the scabbier and more beat up the instrument, the better the sound!
I got a great stry about a chip on my Bass my friend and I we're hangin' out in my basement I was playing drums although I was pretty bad then (this was like 7 months ago I have since gotten better) so he thinks he'll pick up my bass so I keep yelling at stuff like "put my Bass down you ass face" so eventually I just threw a drumstick at him he used my bass as a sheild but that is the Bass I use when playing Punk Rock (well I use it all the time but mainly for jmming with my friends) so I didn't really care a lot but it was funny.
As an American and a fellow lover of Irish music I would like to apologize for the seemingly rude Americans. Unfortunately, I hear all too often about Americans being a bit rude while in foreign countries.
Please be assured that we aren't all this way. As well, sorry to hear about the scratch.
The first violin I played was a school rental instrument, so it was already really damaged. And my fiddle has been passed around the family a little- my grandfather gave it to my sister, who quit playing. So by the time I had it, it was fairly beat up, especially because my sister would put pens and pencils in her case, where they ended up scratching into the varnish. But I still get upset when it gains new scratches.
Jim, (if you don't already know) I can tell you why some of Tommy Emanuel's guitars look like that. He does extended improvisations where he plays the guitar body with a pair of drum brushes, using both the "sharp" and "blunt" ends, and at various other times he gets a lovely subtle pitch bend by pushing on the belly with his right hand whilst bending the neck forward with his left hand on the back of the machine head. I think that's why he plays "production" Matons for some of his live shows 8>#
None of my fiddles have had accidents at my hands yet but I have one that was sat on in a past life. I found it in a junk shop (probably part of a deceased estate clear-out) and it had been unplayed for decades, though the repairs had been done far earlier than that. This description was written to go with some close-up photographs for our insurance records:
"Repaired splits from bottom of the belly to the bottom centre of the F hole on each side; repaired splits from top centre of each F hole to the top of the belly. "Rectangular" notches approx. 2" long taken out of the inner of each F hole, probably to facilitate repairs, and replaced afterwards. Extensive borer damage to the top of the instrument, particularly to the left of the fingerboard. Upper left shoulder of the instrument extremely worn (not visible in photo) indicating heavy use. V-shaped "double" split in middle bout and split through lower bout. (Similar damage on the other side of the instrument and to bouts either side of tailpin.) A strip approx. 1" wide snapped out of the left hand half of the back running the full length of the instrument, and has been replaced.
Slight Hijack here, Steve - you mentioned some rude Americans, other people may accuse the English or Germans or French, or whoever as being the rudest nation when abroad.
But in my book it must be the Scots - they are the most arrogant (more than Israelis) loudest (more than Americans), most uncaring of other customer's feelings (more than Germans or French) more cynical concerning the effects of their ungracious behaviour upon others (English), more canny and devious in their transactions when the bill comes (more than Italians), they sing wierder songs (than the Icelandics), they eat wierd food, eg haggis, (worse than the people of the Kamchatka peninsula) and they play horrible music (more truly terrifyingly horrible than Laotian nose pipes)....
..yet I'm one of them. Despite the above, there exist among them some good people. I don't know if I'm one of *them* yet.
Tish - about Tommy Emanuel, he beats seven shades of sh** out of one of his guitars when he does the aborigine 'sound picture', as I saw him do at one of his concerts. Incredible stuff.
Little bit different, but I think fear of instrument scratch or damage is why I love my M and E polymer flute so much. If anything is ever gonna get damaged, it's gonna be the instigator of any given fight. Really, I'm not a violent person, but it is nice knowing that my instrument could double as a club if needed. Gets a nice sound as well .
Danny,
I was getting quite indignant there until I realised that it was yourself and surely (hopefully) a wind up. However, I think the best description for Scots abroad is "maudlin'". They love the country so much, are so homesick, enjoy all the traditional music including tartan kitsch and all (though they would never listen to it at home) but they would still never go back there.
Apparently one of the previous owners of my favorite fiddle was incapable of keeping the bridge in a vertical position. I think most fiddlers are willing to accept scratches, chips and dents. But nobody should have to live with chewed up dents caused by a bridge.
Ran-
My previous accordion (galanti musette) had a chunk out of one of the black keys (so that wood showed through) for most of its life. I played at a very, very late session in Brunswick Bay, near Whitby, and woke up the next morning on the 3rd floor of the Youth Hostel with no recollection of how me and the box got up there.
I painted the wood black to hide it.
You haven't plumbed the depths of despair until you get your first damage (at the hands of some SOB clod) to the first major instrument you built yourself from scratch, having invested hundred of hours in the project and having been fortunate enough to have it turn out vastly better than you deserve. My first F-5 style mandolin, I'm talkin' about here. Endless hours of carving, bending, graduating, MOP and abalone inlay, lacquering and polishing to a mirror finish. For a long time I was afraid to take it anywhere, eventually starting using it at gigs and, of course, it finally got its first whack, right in the middle of the belly.
Fortunately, lacquer finishes are really easy to repair, as long as the damage doesn't go through the sunburst stain and into the wood.
I've often thought, about new instruments, cars, etc. you might as well go out yerself the first day and whack 'em with a ball peen hammer. At least it would get you past that overprotective period ASAP and make it impossible for somebody else to cause you the heartache.
Scott I agree, its best to get that first scratch over and done with and get on with the playing. My first flute was a Des Seery and I got into the habit of walking around the house from room to room playing it when I had nothing better to do but one day walked into a wall with it and cracked the barrel. I never felt the same about it after that. Now I'm very protective of my Sam Murray. By the way do other people have dreams about their instruments being broken, damaged etc., I have recurring dreams about trying to play my instrument and the top falls off or it crumbles in my hands. What does this mean, something very deep I'm sure!!!
The leader of the two chamber orchestras I play in has a fiddle - sorry, "violin" - made in 1700, and it has so many repaired cracks and splits in the belly that it bears a marked resemblance to an aerial photo of a railroad marshalling yard. Nevertheless, it has a superb tone and response, which is all that matters.
Trevor
My first fiddle was well over 20 years old when some inebriated guy at a session I was at completely missed the table with his pint of Guinness, splat, and christened it indelibly. I also got Guinness in the eye (uncomfortable, but thankfully not a slither of glass). I don't think there could be anything to lessen the value of that Chinese fiddle anyhow, it was bought new so cheap, although untill last year I thought it sounded a bit more than alright. Well it did, but everything is relative and I used to get flack. I didn't listen to it. Maybe I didn't know any better, but now I have this beautiful 200+ year old fiddle, so light and lovely, it plays itself, vibrating in my hand even when I'm not playing.
Its incredible. It came complete with well repaired dingles adding to its character, and a restoration label from over 80 years ago. Somebody obviously loved it. The varnish is not original, and I am allergic to it - such a small price to pay when the fiddle sounds so phenomenal.
Hey! It's not me that plays this stuff any more - its my fiddle, and it loves it.
Cheers
I purchased a Vanden mandolin about 12 years ago now (before they had such a great reputation, although still highly thought of even then). Before then, I had been used to cheap instruments and was really encouraged to play/practice all the more since its purchase. I found that some superficial damage i.e varnish marks/scratches occurred fairly quickly-probably because it was so new and, over the years, it has received a few more knocks.
Anyway, what I'm trying to say is that it's a practical, day to day instrument for me and one which I continually wish to play. Sure, if I left it at home and treated it it extremely delicately, it might be in pristine condition. However, I feel that there should be a balance struck between being caring and over protective--a bit like allowing your kids to play outside.
Perhaps, the scratches have affected its sale value but as I wish to continue to play this particular instrument until my last breath (in between bursts on the fiddle etc, of course), then that doesn't really matter too much. For me, it's MY musical instrument not an asset, investment, showpiece, family heirloom or whatever.
Danny
What about the Scotsman who bought the Australian a pint and then was honest enought to admit it was free anyway? Fair play to him I say.
I got my first mandolin in 1975. In 1977, in a remote mining camp in Western Australia, the camp carpenter (he was butch really came in to my cabin and sat on it, crushing the top. He was mortified, I was scarified, and he tried to repair it by putting two support poles under the bridge feet. It still had a nice sweet sound but not much resonance. Later on I put a pickup on it and used in in an electric jug band for a couple of years, so it wasn't a complete disaster. The carpenter subsequently took up mandolin and is probably ripping it up at a session somewhere as I type. Don't leave yer instrument lying around on chairs and bunks though would be the lesson.
A look at Tommy Emmanuel's or Willie Nelson's guitars would soon cure you of being too precious about scratches and dings though.
(Not, I hasten to add, that I am interpreting Steve's post as being precious, I can see he is just marking a rite of passage.)
A little point that comes up now and then when members talk about their old fiddles is how light these old instruments are, presumably when compared with their modern counterparts.
For instance, my old German fiddle (which has had its fair share of knocks in its 200 years) is substantially lighter than my 2002 vintage Jay Haide (still scratchless), by about 10% perhaps. Both instruments are about equally resonant and responsive, but the old one is the clear winner in tonal quality and volume (give the Jay Haide a few years of playing and I think it may catch up a bit).
Are modern fiddles as a class being made heavier than they were 200 years ago, or are we talking about the lower-medium price range of instruments?
Or is it the case that the older fiddles still around are the survivors because of their intrinsic good quality, one sign of which seems to be that a good-sounding fiddle is usually light in weight. The old, bottom-of-the-pile cheap fiddles perhaps would be seen as more disposable, and perhaps would be have been made heavier than the upmarket instruments.
Comments from the luthiers in the membership would be appreciated (David A?).
Trevor
I bought a skyanbow (not how you spell it i know) electric fiddle after saving up for ages, and some twit walked right into the band area, past the table where it was lying and caught the cable with their foot, pulling the fiddle off the table, where I watched in horror as it bounced neatly off its end pin and cracked the whole way up the front. And then to add insult to injury, noone could repair it cos you can't get the front off! Mind you, it has made no difference to the sound quality at all - thank goodness it was an electric one...
Of course you can always protect a fiddle against scratches by letting a layer of rosin dust build up In due course that rosin will oxidise and become a hard black layer adherent to the varnish. What it does in time to the varnish and the underlying wood is, however, quite a different story, horror versions of which can be recounted by experienced luthiers.
Trevor
The First Scratch
Re: The First Scratch
My daughter literally cut her teeth on my brand new guitar some years ago. The little darling left 2 or 3 nice grooves in it.
# Posted on April 1st 2004 by Bill Reeder
Re: The First Scratch
I bought myself a new acoustic guitar about 30 years ago, it cost
# Posted on April 1st 2004 by Justintime
Re: The First Scratch
Yes, when the piper took a penknife to my bodhr
# Posted on April 1st 2004 by Joe Quinn
Re: The First Scratch
Ah well, Steve, that's it Christened now.
At a member of this site's wedding recently, my quite newly acquired blackwood Boehm flute was swept off the table, still in its case, but with the case open, so all three flute sections landed on the floor. The flute was ok but the case got ripped in two, as it dangled on the precipice of the table, splitting along the leather seam which hinges the top and bottom.
Immediately before the incident, I could see what was coming, so I kept calling the guys name out but he just kept lumbering forward. This all happened as if in slow motion and I couldn't believe my eyes as it was occurring.
Afterwards, the culprit of this accident (no name mentioned as he's a very decent guy - just not very agile) was most copiously apologetic, and me placating him saying it was bound to happen sooner or later.
Bit of a shame but there you go.... no problem I suppose really - I don't intend to sell this flute, so whether its resale value is now compromised isn't an issue.
# Posted on April 1st 2004 by Rudall the time
Re: The First Scratch
Steve - that's awful - the Danny Boy bit I mean.
Shame about the scratch too. Makes the music shop in the village in Ireland next to the wonderful old pub etc etc all seem just a waste of time now doesn't it.
;o)
I'd hate to sound smug, but my beautiful Fylde mandolin hasn't yet got a first scratch - I've had it five months and play it every day - is this some sort of a record?
Dave
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by showaddydadito
Re: The First Scratch
I bought a new mandolin a few months back. I've rarely taken it out the house and I keep it in its case when I'm not actually playing it. And yet somehow it's already acquired a couple of dings on the face and a bit of paintwork has been chipped off the headstock. It hacks me off no end, because no doubt these little blemishes have afected its resale value.
On the other hand, my regular session instrument, a cheap and nasty Musikalia Octave Mandolin, is completely battered and chipped and battle-stained. I can live with that. Its resale value is pretty low in any event and there's something about a lived-in instrument that's quite appealing.
But I have a new Fylde mandolin "in the post" at the time of writing ... I'll be really cheesed-off when it gets its first scratch, ding, whatever!
As for Stewpot's story ... I sympathise, I really do. I remember waking up one morning, very unwell, to be confronted by my favourite guitar of the time lying in bits in the corner where I'd dumped it after having fallen over a few times on the way home from a band rehearsal that turned into a three-day bender ... sob! Beyond repair is only the half of it!
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by Aidan Crossey
Re: The First Scratch
I've owned various accordions in my time - my current one is the only box I've bought new. The rest were second-hand and not that expensive so I didn't treat them very well. One accordion was lost, still in it's case, bound to a trolley in a park in Lorient. When I got drunk one night, I decided to sleep under a tree and when I woke up couldn't remember where I left it. A similar fate befell a small box which I lost while having a drunken piddle under Archway tube station one night. Another accordion is in our garage in Belfast succumbing to mildew. Yet another was given away for parts, Another lost it's front cover and side strap (which was replaced with electrical wire) on tour in Romania. My present box was in mint condition until my girlfriend noticed a dent in the front casing last Sunday :
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by Conán McDonnell
Re: The First Scratch
Steve - sorry to hear about that. Having to buy your instruments I mean.
All mine have been given to me by people who love to hear me play.
Smug smug smuggy smug smug ;o)
One day when I'm over your way I'll call in - it's easy to recognise me, I'm smug with a magnificent beard. We could have a smugness competition.
Dave
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by showaddydadito
Re: The First Scratch
You don't tend to get this kind of thing with fiddles... my current fiddle has a cross that someone's burnt into the back at some point in the past, a bit of old woodworm, most of the varnish has blackened (being original) and any number of little scrapes. Beautiful instrument though, I love it. I've just never been *too* concerned about "getting the first scratch"...
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by rog
Re: The First Scratch
Get over IT, Scratches and use are signs of a well loved instrument. My Gibson 12 string that my mom gave me in high school (US- what do they call it over in England/Ireland) some 40+ years ago has nicks and goughes with this giant sound.
Now if someone did that to my UP chanter and the reed got damaged, there would be H**L to pay.
Your mileage will vary....
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by I_Fel
Re: The First Scratch
LOL -- Oh Dave, yer a treasure.
I bought a pawn shop fiddle when I started up playing this stuff, and I was amazed at how much that makes you less fussy about scratches...
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by Zina Lee
Re: The First Scratch
Hi Steve,
Sympathy! My then brand-new, dearly beloved fiddle got its first scratch last fall. I had it laid across my lap while i was tightening my bow and generally futzing around getting ready to play. Then as I picked up the tuning fork my husband suddenly made a loud exclamation that startled me. The tuning fork bounced off the fiddle top, twice. Ding, ding, scratch. ARRGHHHHH!
(And i couldn't blame my poor husband, he was being told over the phone that his favorite cousin was due to get shipped to Iraq.)
Oh, well. My favorite instrument guy fixed it so it hardly shows. And Rog is right, fiddles are considered to have extra character when they're dinged. But still...
Sara
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by sara g
Re: The First Scratch
My fiddle's has a few scratches in it's lifetime, but none by me...ever seen Tommy Emmanuel's and Steve Cooney's guitars?
There are guitars on their scratches. Yea, that's it - the scabbier and more beat up the instrument, the better the sound!
Jim
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by Worldfiddler
Re: The First Scratch
I got a great stry about a chip on my Bass my friend and I we're hangin' out in my basement I was playing drums although I was pretty bad then (this was like 7 months ago I have since gotten better) so he thinks he'll pick up my bass so I keep yelling at stuff like "put my Bass down you ass face" so eventually I just threw a drumstick at him he used my bass as a sheild but that is the Bass I use when playing Punk Rock (well I use it all the time but mainly for jmming with my friends) so I didn't really care a lot but it was funny.
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by Why Bother?
Re: The First Scratch
As an American and a fellow lover of Irish music I would like to apologize for the seemingly rude Americans. Unfortunately, I hear all too often about Americans being a bit rude while in foreign countries.
Please be assured that we aren't all this way. As well, sorry to hear about the scratch.
- Concerned American from Kansas.
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by ICTPiper
Re: The First Scratch
The first violin I played was a school rental instrument, so it was already really damaged. And my fiddle has been passed around the family a little- my grandfather gave it to my sister, who quit playing. So by the time I had it, it was fairly beat up, especially because my sister would put pens and pencils in her case, where they ended up scratching into the varnish. But I still get upset when it gains new scratches.
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by strider_girl
Re: The First Scratch
Jim, (if you don't already know) I can tell you why some of Tommy Emanuel's guitars look like that. He does extended improvisations where he plays the guitar body with a pair of drum brushes, using both the "sharp" and "blunt" ends, and at various other times he gets a lovely subtle pitch bend by pushing on the belly with his right hand whilst bending the neck forward with his left hand on the back of the machine head. I think that's why he plays "production" Matons for some of his live shows 8>#
None of my fiddles have had accidents at my hands yet but I have one that was sat on in a past life. I found it in a junk shop (probably part of a deceased estate clear-out) and it had been unplayed for decades, though the repairs had been done far earlier than that. This description was written to go with some close-up photographs for our insurance records:
"Repaired splits from bottom of the belly to the bottom centre of the F hole on each side; repaired splits from top centre of each F hole to the top of the belly. "Rectangular" notches approx. 2" long taken out of the inner of each F hole, probably to facilitate repairs, and replaced afterwards. Extensive borer damage to the top of the instrument, particularly to the left of the fingerboard. Upper left shoulder of the instrument extremely worn (not visible in photo) indicating heavy use. V-shaped "double" split in middle bout and split through lower bout. (Similar damage on the other side of the instrument and to bouts either side of tailpin.) A strip approx. 1" wide snapped out of the left hand half of the back running the full length of the instrument, and has been replaced.
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by Tish
Re: The First Scratch
That's all right, there's rude people from everywhere, every country, natch.
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by Zina Lee
Re: The First Scratch
Slight Hijack here, Steve - you mentioned some rude Americans, other people may accuse the English or Germans or French, or whoever as being the rudest nation when abroad.
But in my book it must be the Scots - they are the most arrogant (more than Israelis) loudest (more than Americans), most uncaring of other customer's feelings (more than Germans or French) more cynical concerning the effects of their ungracious behaviour upon others (English), more canny and devious in their transactions when the bill comes (more than Italians), they sing wierder songs (than the Icelandics), they eat wierd food, eg haggis, (worse than the people of the Kamchatka peninsula) and they play horrible music (more truly terrifyingly horrible than Laotian nose pipes)....
..yet I'm one of them. Despite the above, there exist among them some good people. I don't know if I'm one of *them* yet.
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by Rudall the time
Re: The First Scratch
You're even ruder than me, you fat wah.
Jim
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by Worldfiddler
Re: The First Scratch
Tish - about Tommy Emanuel, he beats seven shades of sh** out of one of his guitars when he does the aborigine 'sound picture', as I saw him do at one of his concerts. Incredible stuff.
Jim
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by Worldfiddler
Re: The First Scratch
Anyone want to compose a tune and title it "the first scratch", preferably d or G so I can try it on my UP???
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by I_Fel
Re: The First Scratch
Little bit different, but I think fear of instrument scratch or damage is why I love my M and E polymer flute so much. If anything is ever gonna get damaged, it's gonna be the instigator of any given fight. Really, I'm not a violent person, but it is nice knowing that my instrument could double as a club if needed. Gets a nice sound as well
.
~~Jason
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by Jason G
Re: The First Scratch
Danny,
I was getting quite indignant there until I realised that it was yourself and surely (hopefully) a wind up. However, I think the best description for Scots abroad is "maudlin'". They love the country so much, are so homesick, enjoy all the traditional music including tartan kitsch and all (though they would never listen to it at home) but they would still never go back there.
See you later. I'm off for a wee dram. :>))
# Posted on April 2nd 2004 by Johnny Jay
Re: The First Scratch
Apparently one of the previous owners of my favorite fiddle was incapable of keeping the bridge in a vertical position. I think most fiddlers are willing to accept scratches, chips and dents. But nobody should have to live with chewed up dents caused by a bridge.
Ran-
# Posted on April 3rd 2004 by Ran
Re: The First Scratch
My previous accordion (galanti musette) had a chunk out of one of the black keys (so that wood showed through) for most of its life. I played at a very, very late session in Brunswick Bay, near Whitby, and woke up the next morning on the 3rd floor of the Youth Hostel with no recollection of how me and the box got up there.
I painted the wood black to hide it.
# Posted on April 3rd 2004 by geoffwright
Re: The First Scratch
You haven't plumbed the depths of despair until you get your first damage (at the hands of some SOB clod) to the first major instrument you built yourself from scratch, having invested hundred of hours in the project and having been fortunate enough to have it turn out vastly better than you deserve. My first F-5 style mandolin, I'm talkin' about here. Endless hours of carving, bending, graduating, MOP and abalone inlay, lacquering and polishing to a mirror finish. For a long time I was afraid to take it anywhere, eventually starting using it at gigs and, of course, it finally got its first whack, right in the middle of the belly.
Fortunately, lacquer finishes are really easy to repair, as long as the damage doesn't go through the sunburst stain and into the wood.
I've often thought, about new instruments, cars, etc. you might as well go out yerself the first day and whack 'em with a ball peen hammer. At least it would get you past that overprotective period ASAP and make it impossible for somebody else to cause you the heartache.
# Posted on April 3rd 2004 by ScottC
Re: The First Scratch
Scott I agree, its best to get that first scratch over and done with and get on with the playing. My first flute was a Des Seery and I got into the habit of walking around the house from room to room playing it when I had nothing better to do but one day walked into a wall with it and cracked the barrel. I never felt the same about it after that. Now I'm very protective of my Sam Murray. By the way do other people have dreams about their instruments being broken, damaged etc., I have recurring dreams about trying to play my instrument and the top falls off or it crumbles in my hands. What does this mean, something very deep I'm sure!!!
# Posted on April 3rd 2004 by MollyB
Re: The First Scratch
Yes, it's a shame when you get your first scratch on an instrument but you just have to "Bite the Bullet". :>))
Sorry, S---e and Z---.
# Posted on April 3rd 2004 by Johnny Jay
Re: The First Scratch
The leader of the two chamber orchestras I play in has a fiddle - sorry, "violin"
- made in 1700, and it has so many repaired cracks and splits in the belly that it bears a marked resemblance to an aerial photo of a railroad marshalling yard. Nevertheless, it has a superb tone and response, which is all that matters.
Trevor
# Posted on April 4th 2004 by Trevor Jennings
Re: The First Scratch
My first fiddle was well over 20 years old when some inebriated guy at a session I was at completely missed the table with his pint of Guinness, splat, and christened it indelibly. I also got Guinness in the eye (uncomfortable, but thankfully not a slither of glass). I don't think there could be anything to lessen the value of that Chinese fiddle anyhow, it was bought new so cheap, although untill last year I thought it sounded a bit more than alright. Well it did, but everything is relative and I used to get flack. I didn't listen to it. Maybe I didn't know any better, but now I have this beautiful 200+ year old fiddle, so light and lovely, it plays itself, vibrating in my hand even when I'm not playing.
Its incredible. It came complete with well repaired dingles adding to its character, and a restoration label from over 80 years ago. Somebody obviously loved it. The varnish is not original, and I am allergic to it - such a small price to pay when the fiddle sounds so phenomenal.
Hey! It's not me that plays this stuff any more - its my fiddle, and it loves it.
Cheers
# Posted on April 4th 2004 by Clear Drops
Re: The First Scratch
I purchased a Vanden mandolin about 12 years ago now (before they had such a great reputation, although still highly thought of even then). Before then, I had been used to cheap instruments and was really encouraged to play/practice all the more since its purchase. I found that some superficial damage i.e varnish marks/scratches occurred fairly quickly-probably because it was so new and, over the years, it has received a few more knocks.
Anyway, what I'm trying to say is that it's a practical, day to day instrument for me and one which I continually wish to play. Sure, if I left it at home and treated it it extremely delicately, it might be in pristine condition. However, I feel that there should be a balance struck between being caring and over protective--a bit like allowing your kids to play outside.
Perhaps, the scratches have affected its sale value but as I wish to continue to play this particular instrument until my last breath (in between bursts on the fiddle etc, of course), then that doesn't really matter too much. For me, it's MY musical instrument not an asset, investment, showpiece, family heirloom or whatever.
John
# Posted on April 4th 2004 by Johnny Jay
Re: The First Scratch
Danny
came in to my cabin and sat on it, crushing the top. He was mortified, I was scarified, and he tried to repair it by putting two support poles under the bridge feet. It still had a nice sweet sound but not much resonance. Later on I put a pickup on it and used in in an electric jug band for a couple of years, so it wasn't a complete disaster. The carpenter subsequently took up mandolin and is probably ripping it up at a session somewhere as I type. Don't leave yer instrument lying around on chairs and bunks though would be the lesson.
What about the Scotsman who bought the Australian a pint and then was honest enought to admit it was free anyway? Fair play to him I say.
I got my first mandolin in 1975. In 1977, in a remote mining camp in Western Australia, the camp carpenter (he was butch really
A look at Tommy Emmanuel's or Willie Nelson's guitars would soon cure you of being too precious about scratches and dings though.
(Not, I hasten to add, that I am interpreting Steve's post as being precious, I can see he is just marking a rite of passage.)
# Posted on April 4th 2004 by Bren
Re: The First Scratch
A little point that comes up now and then when members talk about their old fiddles is how light these old instruments are, presumably when compared with their modern counterparts.
For instance, my old German fiddle (which has had its fair share of knocks in its 200 years) is substantially lighter than my 2002 vintage Jay Haide (still scratchless), by about 10% perhaps. Both instruments are about equally resonant and responsive, but the old one is the clear winner in tonal quality and volume (give the Jay Haide a few years of playing and I think it may catch up a bit).
Are modern fiddles as a class being made heavier than they were 200 years ago, or are we talking about the lower-medium price range of instruments?
Or is it the case that the older fiddles still around are the survivors because of their intrinsic good quality, one sign of which seems to be that a good-sounding fiddle is usually light in weight. The old, bottom-of-the-pile cheap fiddles perhaps would be seen as more disposable, and perhaps would be have been made heavier than the upmarket instruments.
Comments from the luthiers in the membership would be appreciated (David A?).
Trevor
# Posted on April 4th 2004 by Trevor Jennings
Re: The First Scratch
Ditto. I would like to know too, please luthiers.
# Posted on April 4th 2004 by Clear Drops
Re: The First Scratch
Who started this discussion? If only scratches could be removed from your beloved instruments as easily!! :>))
# Posted on April 4th 2004 by Johnny Jay
Re: The First Scratch
David, many thanks for that information. We knew we could rely on you.
Trevor
# Posted on April 4th 2004 by Trevor Jennings
Re: The First Scratch
Sorry, I forgot to add ...
Trevor
# Posted on April 4th 2004 by Trevor Jennings
Re: The First Scratch
Thank you, David. Amazing.
# Posted on April 4th 2004 by Clear Drops
Re: The First Scratch
I bought a skyanbow (not how you spell it i know) electric fiddle after saving up for ages, and some twit walked right into the band area, past the table where it was lying and caught the cable with their foot, pulling the fiddle off the table, where I watched in horror as it bounced neatly off its end pin and cracked the whole way up the front. And then to add insult to injury, noone could repair it cos you can't get the front off! Mind you, it has made no difference to the sound quality at all - thank goodness it was an electric one...
# Posted on April 4th 2004 by Fionafiddler
Re: The First Scratch
What happened to ShannaquaySteve?
I was just standing there, and there was a loud bang, and he was gone.
Who's next? ;o)
Dave
# Posted on April 4th 2004 by showaddydadito
Re: The First Scratch
Dunno, Dave. But how many Steve's do we have left, anyway?
# Posted on April 4th 2004 by Q
Re: The First Scratch
Do a search for "Steve" under Members. There's a couple of dozen or so. Enough to go on with for a while at any rate
Trevor
# Posted on April 4th 2004 by Trevor Jennings
Re: The First Scratch
Steve! Steve? where are you?
Hello . . . . .
# Posted on April 5th 2004 by showaddydadito
Re: The First Scratch
We're only scratching the surface here.
# Posted on April 6th 2004 by Joe Quinn
Re: The First Scratch
I reckon he's been Leeyed out - sorry. Oops.
# Posted on April 6th 2004 by MollyB
Re: The First Scratch
LOL -- it wasn't me. I don't have veto power! All Hail Jeremy, the Great and Terrible! ;)
# Posted on April 6th 2004 by Zina Lee
Re: The First Scratch
Escaped without a scratch. VarRnished without trace.
# Posted on April 6th 2004 by Johnny Jay
Re: The First Scratch
Of course you can always protect a fiddle against scratches by letting a layer of rosin dust build up
In due course that rosin will oxidise and become a hard black layer adherent to the varnish. What it does in time to the varnish and the underlying wood is, however, quite a different story, horror versions of which can be recounted by experienced luthiers.
Trevor
# Posted on April 8th 2004 by Trevor Jennings