Hi,
Just wondering if anyone has heard of sessions taking place in Dublin that are only for females??
I heard a while back that this type of session takes place but have forgotten where and when!
If anyone has heard of these, could you let me know a little more about them.
Thanks.
Sooooo, ummm, at a female only session, does that mean that only females are allowed to play, or that only females are allowed in the door? Cause i wouldn't mind sitting in on a female only session... But seriously, i think it's very attractive for a Woman to have instrumental talents. Women that play stringed instruments are especially attractive. Not many sights(if any) beat a beautiful woman holding a beautiful instrument, and playing it beautifully.
And all whistle players are only attractive until you see the long stream of drool coming out the bottom end onto their trousers, or in theirs or someone else's drink......
>_>
Hey now, back in the day, Banjo was a very respectable instrument to play. But really, i favor the fiddle/violin and guitar, but more because i like how they sound. The fiddle is charismatic, and the guitar and violin are soothing when played gently and sweetly.
I have a decent answer to your question; a friend of mine said she was playing in one in Hughes' for a while. I think she said it was on Tuesdays, I don't know if it is still going but as far as I know this is/was the only females only session around Dublin. Of course there could be more that I don't know about as I wouldn't be wanted at any female sessions as I am the wrong gender.
I expect the same feeling that prompted the setting aside areas of train depots and ferry boats for WOMEN PASSENGERS ONLY is the explanation. (Dunno, but maybe this specially designated session might be a legitimate instance of Women being from Venus, men being from the pound) While these arrangements have passed from use in most public places, maybe, just maybe, this one meets a need. Btw, I actually like the old arrangement whereby bars were for males only; places where men did their drinking standing up, there being no such things as lounges. I would like it if a few of those establishments were still around. Thanks for your indulgence.
People have funny reactions when this kind of segregation comes up. I am reminded of a decision by the supreme court of Canada a few years back allowing women-only gatherings of some sort or other, but not of men-only, sorry I don't remember exactly what kind of gathering or club it was. The stated reasoning was the observation, a correct one I think, that one man in a women's group is quite a different dynamic than one woman in a men's group. The USA courts don't seem to be so nuanced, yet I think Canadian women are as tough as any.
TaoCat, I see it as a need for escape, if only briefly, from the realm of women; the need for sloppy sentimental male bonding; the need to stand on a carpet of peanut shells, sawdust, and gawdknowswhat. Or were you asking about the gals? Well, maybe they want a females-only haven for equal but opposite reasons. We could ask.
I think you will find that such a thing is illegal. -- Not a hanging offence, like using multiple question marks -- but certainly warranting a hefty fine or a custodial sentence.
Oh that it were true.....I can see the notice now - 'No requests for 'Old Hag you have killed me' -''The Hag with the money' or The Granny in the corner' and definitely 'No Trannies Allowed''
I can't get past the gross grammatical errors. The sign in stations should read FEMALE PASSENGERS not WOMEN PASSENGERS. By the same token, you can have a session for women, but not a session for females. Female what?
So I thiiink I know what you're talking about--there's a group of gals in Dublin that started a session that, essentially, just sort of happened to be all-female. And then, they decided to keep it that way--you know, like having a social girls' night out only, since they're all mad for the music, a session I'm good friends with one of them (if indeed this is the same group!) and from what I gather, they were all part of the same friends circle anyways and the session happened organically.
They're awesome people and welcoming but I believe it's sort of a "need to know somebody" type deal. "Why Bother" has the right idea, they did used to play at Hughes, the last time I went it was both genders though (musician boyfriends!). More like a night out for a group of friends. And, I'm back in America now, so I've no idea if it's still going or where else they play, and I wouldn't want to disclose any information unknowingly!
Jeez, this is sounding like a session run by the FBI...I cannot disclose anything further
Christ, I thought we got over all these stupid pseudo freedom from discrimination arguments in the 1980's (that's last century guys). Presumably some women would like to play music in a safe environment, away from drunken a**holes who leer and try to pick them up.
"Presumably some women would like to play music in a safe environment, away from drunken a**holes who leer and try to pick them up."
LOL yes, because of course men = that. Just like blacks = violent criminals, and Jews = greedy and rich.
Well I didn't say all men are like that, but as you know, there are some out there. Would you want to put up with that when all you want to do is play the music? And no it has nothing to do with racism or anti-Semitism. That's just an attempt to confuse the issue. What would be your best guess at why women would want to get together for a particular activity without men around?
"The stated reasoning was the observation, a correct one I think, that one man in a women's group is quite a different dynamic than one woman in a men's group."
I'm trying to get my head around this. Is one man in a group of women bad? If so, is it because women are incapable of asserting themselves in such a situation? Wouldn't that reasoning be an example of caving in to the usual gender-based stereotypes?
I've never understood why some folks make such a big issue about gender and sexual orientation in situations where they're not relevant (which is just about everyplace other than than the tryst itself).
Exactly. Everybody has their justifications for exclusion. None of them are right. Substitute the "no *" with any race, gender, ethnicity or whatever. If one is wrong, they all are.
On the one hand, discrimination is discrimination. If you're having an open session in a public place, the shape of someone's naughty bits is really not a respectable basis for rejecting or accepting a participant.
On the other hand...well, I can't really think of another hand, actually.
You know, if gender profiling is correct and good, maybe the rest of profiling is as well. Why don't the people who agree with this "females only" explain why this is good?
The sessions I go to have men and women, I play with people from 1/4 of my age to twice my age. Irish, English, Kiwi, Thai, French, American etc etc.
One of the really great things about this music is that it is so inclusive. Respect the music and the social occaision it is played in and you get respect back.
So help me, I like the idea! It really doesn't matter how folks far away from here choose to run their session. It really doesn't. (There are loftier principles under attack right here in the US) Will, these Dublin gals might just oblige you by letting you (virtually) sit them down, and give them a good listening to. Look after Montana, and turn the lights off when you go to bed ;+)
"If so, is it because women are incapable of asserting themselves in such a situation?"
Maybe it's because [some] women are *uninterested* in putting themselves in situations in which they are likely to have to assert themselves in order to play music in an environment in which drunken arseholes aren't leering at them and trying to pick them up. They may be perfectly *capable* of asserting themselves thusly, but it does tend to make for a less fun and relaxing evening when one *has* to do it, or even to be on guard for the possibility.
Sure, it's better to ban lecherous behaviour than entire groups of people. But banning lecherous behaviour tends to take the form of after-the-fact punishment, invoked after more than a little unpleasantness for the object of such lechery. Now, if players make it *very clear* what kind of behaviour was unwelcome at sessions - so clear that no one would even think of violating the code of conduct - then no one would need to "assert" themselves at all in order to play freely. That's the ideal, as far as I'm concerned. But creating such an environment requires a great deal of commitment and consensus, which is more difficult than simply requiring women to assert themselves to men who behave inappropriately. It's also more difficult than having the women form a splinter session in which everyone who possesses the XY karyotype is persona non grata. One of these easy alternatives disadvantages women; the other, men (including non-lecherous men). I don't see why the former is necessarily superior.
I'd like to hear about how these women-only sessions came about. I suspect that at they were started after some of the female players got sick of coming to a session to unwind and relax, only to have to spend more time than they wanted policing the behaviour of men who were there for an entirely different purpose.
Yeah, I thought about that. Really, I did. But you know, I'm not convinced.
For one thing, I'm sure there are plenty of people in the states who feel much more comfortable playing music in a room where there aren't gay people, or Jewish people, or Catholics, or whatever. They're usually called bigots, because they discriminate against people based on their inherent characteristics because they're uncomforatable around "people like that". And we don't usually make excuses for that sort of preference.
So we don't really accept that logic of separation based on someone's comfort level - there has to be some actual behavior. And I have no problem with kicking people out for bad behavior, but being convex instead of concave isn't a behavior.
"So we don't really accept that logic of separation based on someone's comfort level - there has to be some actual behavior. "
Making someone uncomfortable by creating or tolerating an unwelcome environment for them is a behaviour.
Someone upthread mentioned the women-only passenger cars in Japan. I remember reading about those some time ago, and how they were created in response to women being groped on the mixed-sex cars. I remember being shocked by this, because that sort of behaviour is practically unheard of here in Canada. It's understood that you don't grope your fellow passengers. Consequently, we don't have women-only passenger cars here; the demand just isn't here. I've never seen any women-only sessions (and neither has anyone else here, it seems, save the OP and one other who described a closed session that happens to be women-only), and the lecherous behaviour described above is not endemic at sessions around these parts, and so no one has thought of creating a women-only session. (Though some time ago, there was a session that ended up becoming men-only because the women were routinely being harassed and decided the session wasn't worth it for them. It soon folded.)
If people of a certain sex, ethnic group, sexual orientation, or religion are splintering off, it's worthwhile to wonder what has created the demand. It might be bigotry, but it might be something else. In the case of the women-only cars, it is indeed because of actual behaviour, albeit not a behaviour that every single person excluded from the women-only cars is guilty of. Same, possibly, for the women-only sessions sessions. (Not all men grope/leer at women, but it seems all gropers /leerers were men.) Folks uncomfortable with this sort of segregation could avoid it simply by enforcing a code of conduct that makes women welcome at the standard, mixed sessions (and passenger cars) - if women are welcome at those, they probably won't create their own, and everyone wins, except the arseholes. OTOH, this approach wouldn't work with true bigots - folks who organize Jew-free events aren't doing so because gentiles are routinely made to feel unwelcome.
"And I have no problem with kicking people out for bad behavior"
Thing is, again, you would not be the victim of the bad behaviour under discussion. Those who are more likely to be at the receiving end of such bad behaviour might appreciate the sentiment quoted above, but ultimately decide that it's not worth it for them to be groped/leered at/harassed before you to enforce a civilized code of conduct.
Well, really, after All-State Choir, i kindof don't care who i'm playing music with. I use to favor singing with girls in high school, just cause i didn't like being around a bunch of dudes, cause i didn't fit in. Well, in All-State, there were near 250 of us "dudes" and we sounded amazing. One of the greatest musical experiences of my life. Well... one of them hit on me... but when i told him that "i'm not like that..." he was respectful and backed off... But still, i'll never forget singing with them. Another point, i enjoy the company of Women. I was raised by women, i'm use to being around them, and i fit in better with them. So not being accepted because i'm a guy would be a bit hurtful. But then again, just like i don't like being around a bunch of dogs, i wouldn't like being around of... sexest women either.
So people are (perhaps) doing something to avoid a local cultural environment that makes then feel uncomfortable. Other people, here, are saying they should change the environment rather than avoid it. Maybe they spend a lot of their lives (or at least their time out socialising) standing up for themselves and trying to change the environment and for a while just want to relax and play tunes. The term 'bigot' may be being directed at the wrong people.
David, if someone wants to have a private club, that's fine and good. It's a dodge that bigots the world over have used, and bigots of the female persuasion should stand up and use it too. If Jesse Helms doesn't want to drink martinis with Black people, he starts a private club, and nobody can force him to let anyone in that he doesn't like.
And if Sinead and Fiona don't want to play with any of those XY types, that's fine, they can use the same dodge. I understand - all bigotry comes from fear, and fiona and Sinead can be afraid just like Jesse Helms can, and they have the same remedy.
If you don't want to be around people, you shouldn't go into public places where people are. There's private homes and private clubs for that.
I'm just not willing to pretend that they're all that different.
'Live & Let Live' is not a bad maxim. If women want to gather together and chat, play a few tunes, discuss books or whatever - I can't see any problem whatsoever at all in it. I don't feel threatened by it or excluded, as long as there are alternatives where all can freely attend.
I think Jon, that we do things differently on our side of the pond (see link below for example) . Usually we don't have to hide from people we don't like, we just stick to our corner of the bar or move to a different one. Transparency (not that it is always present) feels safer.
Ah yes, the "separate but equal" argument. Much loved by the US Supreme Court. In 1890s.
I suppose the question is, how open a session is it? If it's a closed session that happens to be a bunch of women who like playing together, it's like a closed session anywhere else. And that's fine. But is it an open session but only to women? If myself and my boyfriend came across it in the pub, would I be allowed to play, but not him? That's where it begins to be problematic.
We are all just surmising here as to the reasoning behind this session.
If it is just a group of friends on the Irish music equivalent of a "girly night out" as Mellow Yellow has suggested, then I don't see any problem with this. Good luck to them.
Also, in such a situation, it's quite possible that a male friend or even a casual visitor might still be welcomed into the fold but they might just choose not to intrude on what appears to be a private affair...not that different from what might seem to be a closed session.
Many sessions are already either male or female dominated on a "de facto" basis for various reasons while others tend to attract the same people on a regular basis and can appear "cliquey" to an outsider whether they are open or not.
If there's a ultra feminist or "anti male" agenda at work, then I'm obviously less well disposed to such a set up but this probably unlikely. On the other hand, if the women are genuinely nervous or uncomfortable with male company in such an environment, this is quite sad and probably says more about us(men) and society in general.
On a lighter note, I actually joined a group of women on a "hen night" many, many years ago for a drink or two as I had just entered the pub by chance.
I wouldn't normally seek out such gatherings nor would I expect an invitation. The same would apply to any other "girly", "lads", or even any other night out or get together which was obviously private.
I feel compelled to observe that there is pretty much room for all of us, no matter what the color, language, or gender. I am not much offended or threatened by other folks doing something I neither like nor understand, so long as no one is being hurt.
Were it violating someone else's rights, I might let my vigilante nature surface. (do not hit a child or a woman, or torch a temple around me.)
That said, I am of the position, let them have their sessions - all male, all female, all Muslim, all Scots, all Koreans, whatever. Ban me, big deal. Why would I want to associate with anyone who would not welcome me into their midst? Because "I have rights!"?
There are still one or two places where my fiddle and my company are welcome, and not intruding on someone else's choices.
I shall repair to my local, where there is a smile and an honest pint waiting.
In the snug in Hughes' on a Tuesday night there's an all girls group. I'm not a girl and I ended up playing there one Tuesday, there were 8 people in there and one was an old man, tunes were great so in I went, only to find that he wasn't playing! I knew I couldn't walk out but I couldn't just sit there either, they insisted that I play and maintained that, like many Hughes' sessions, some trend just happens in who comes, e.g the back session that night is flutes only.
thanks for this discussion, many good points made here.
i got curious and googled this. keep in mind, it was in the last century; but sometimes there are assumptions made that are hard to see. because they're just assumed. there are lots of sides to the question, for sure.
"Gender equity is the process of being fair to women and men. To ensure fairness, measures must often be available to compensate for historical and social disadvantages that prevent women and men from otherwise operating on a level playing field. Equity leads to equality."
Reference: Gender-Based Analysis: A guide for policy-making, Status of Women Canada, 1996."
Paudy, Mellow Yellow and Why Bother - Thanks for your input and suggestions here. God what a lot of crap people talk on here too in relation to practically anything. They take a post and turn it into a whole different ball game!!
I've tried to get involved in a session before on the southside with a friend and they weren't very welcoming - got a few dirty looks as if I was intruding!! Strange how some musicians are so possessive of a session!!! it's not like they were getting paid for it!!!! Thanks again guys. If you know of any contact info for anyone involved in that Hughes session, let me know!
Míle buíochas!
Lighten up. It's only a bit of a laugh and a bit of fun debate. Expected for the board, really. Talking crap is generally more fun than not, in real life as well as online.
Anyway, I think unfriendly session possessiveness is an equal-opportunity phenomenon.
I was just being nice. By "equal-opportunity," I have, in my travels, encountered more cattiness and weird politics amongst female session-goers than male ones.
This reminds me of the "No Dogs, No Women" sign in the car park of the Royal St. George's course in England, that was removed just before the recent British Open!
What next a all gay or lesbian only session, I have often heard sories of what went on in certain well known dance troupes who had frequent ladies only rooms and well you know what Im getting at. Are we to far away from a Lesbian or Gay ( or even openly acknowledged BI sexual) iTrad group.......I know of two well known Trad musicians one is lesbian and the other a closet gay....where will it all end up.????
Dublin 9, no worries, I'm not back to Dublin til August 18th but Devitt's on a Thursday night in the downstairs bar is a very friendly and lively session
Sin E on Ormonde Quay on Sunday nights is also great and looking for more players to get involved. I usually drive to Greystones on a Tuesday night for a session at Danns bar there.
Where else.... well it depends if you want a loud session or a quiet one I guess.
Hughes' ladies session - sorry no idea who runs it or who to contact but they did tell me that they're paid in sandwiches that arrive around 1130 (also the signal to stop !), I was encouraged to eat as many as I felt like when I was there.
Sure I might see you in Devitt's some Thursday.
Actually, one more, the International bar on a Wednesday night, same players that play Devitts on a Friday night, lovely players, lovely people!
belfastrab, it will probably end up with people using multiple punctuation marks for no good reason!!!!
Not rocket science here. If one "x" not allowed is wrong, they all are. As far as men being more likely to be lecherous, I am not. Period. And I have seen women acting very inappropriately at times as well. Is that a good reason to start a "men only" session? Perhaps we should exclude certain players of certain races, as they have a statistical probability to be more likely to commit crimes. Not pretty, is it?
If I was playing with a group of guys, and they told a woman it was a "guys night out" thing, the very least I'd do is walk. Discrimination based on who a person is, is wrong. Not too hard to understand, is it?
I thought Canadian women were unusually tough from having to endure those long, cold, harsh winters that far north.
If I saw a "No Dogs, No Women" sign outside a pub, I wouldn't go in. I can understand banning a dog but not letting me bring my wife in with me is going too far.
Most any big city has shelters for battered women. Dublin, like San Jose, has a number of these sanctuaries. (Sorry to throw a slush ball in this otherwise happy snowball fight.) Guys, discrimination isn't the issue. Is it so hard to grasp the notion that some gals might need to have another sort of refuge -- a musical one -- that is entirely their own?
What's the wager on this whole thing being a completely blown out of proportion non-issue? My theory is a group of gals decide to regularly attend a session, and suddenly the word gets out it's a "chick-clique" and dudes aren't welcome. No Ovaries, no tunes.
I bet the whole thing never occurred. Total hogwash. Utter poppycock. Complete balderdash. A massive flapdoodle (ok, I made that word up) I bet the gals showed up every week, played their tunes and wondered "where were all the blokes again tonight?"
Jusa, is it after five o'clock in Phoenix? Are there any all-male bastions you can disappear into for a pint? Do they have a layer of sawdust on the floor? Is it so hopelessly retro that there aren't even TVs with ball games?
Jusa Nutter Eejit, I think you're basically on the ball, the girls running that ladies session in Hughes' said after a while the session just began to be known as the "fanny power session", they were very nice and told me I was very welcome to come back, I said thanks and I'd say it to a few of my friends.
The session I play at regularly in Dublin had been getting a reputation for a while as a girl dominated event too, pub regulars would pop their head in the door and say "where are all the girls this week?".
AQ - remember this is the wild west out here - spittoons, beer, sawdust floors and big-screen ballgames are par for the course even in ladies hair salons, never mind some imaginary muy macho man-cave. Besides I prefer a place that welcomes memebers of the fairer sex.
I like the ones that are permissive enough to let children approach the back door to call out: "Father, come home." Saloons, not salons, that is. I'm sure the fairer sex wouldn't like my notion of a watering hole.
@ Laurence .. Just for the record, at our Thursday night session up here, the ratio is 40% women players ... oh yes & there's usually at least one customer with a dog in the bar!
In fact, one Fiddler used to bring his own dog every week & it sat quietly by his side all night .... that is, until the barman brought the Cheese & Ham sandwiches around!
Of course, its favourite tune was .... The Dogs Among The Bushes!
Speaking of dogs, our session in New Bedford, Mass, was canceled a few months ago. For the past year or so, the pub encouraged patrons to bring their dogs on Sunday afternoons (concurrent with our session). Between football, hockey, and dogs, we couldn't compete. The pub wouldn't even throw us a bone.
So they told you to take a walk, eh?
Just wait - the patrons will be hounding them to get you back. When you make your triumphant return, your first song should of course be Spaniel Hill.
Dick, due to the strict local health and hygiene laws here in Arkansas, the only places of business (such as stores, restaurants, shops, etc.) where anybody is allowed to bring their pets are the veterinarian's office or pet stores such as Petsmart and/or Petco. Otherwise, you must leave your dog or cat or whatever type of animal companion at home.
back to original post... anybody remember the "thornbush" pub in dublin on parnell st used to have lesbian night that had a sesiun... maybe thats what the op is on about?
Not going to read all of the comments posted after your original thread since there are too many/they seem really ridiculous, but I think the session you're looking for used to happen in Hughes' in the Four Courts. It's just off the Luas. Good luck and have fun!
I'm a bit late replying to this but Paudy is right on the money! Fanny Powers' session, that's what they started calling it because it happened to be a group of girls in most times...Sure I never saw you in there, I was lurking around the dublin sessions for a bit in the beginning of June! Same group plays in the International on Wednesdays and they've been trying to get that session up and on its feet. So, as long as you're a decent person and aren't about to storm a session with 500 of your greatest tunes played loudly on a didgeridoo, you should be grand. Couldn't find a friendlier bunch of people, and a lot of that same crowd play at Devitt's on Saturday nights as well!
Thanks dublin99 for the recognition I believe that, sometimes, people are looking to give sinister reasons behind session mechanics when the answer is simple. Human nature, really!
Mellow Yellow, I was in at the Fanny Powers' session in 2009 I think, probably August but I'm really not sure!
I didn't know that the Wednesday International crew were connected to the Tuesday Hughes' session or the Saturday Devitt's session, sure I suppose the people involved just change so often!
I met some of these so called "fannies" at the fleadh there in Cavan and they told me their session is 2 years old soon. They'll be having a party apparently and are being strict on no-men that night, especially after all the baking they'll be doing for the party!
I'm trying to gather all the men of Dublin and beyond to protest outside hughes that night and protect our rights to play tunes with whoever we want, this is an outrage! We should all be out there spreading the word, and burning our Y-fronts!
Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Hi,
Just wondering if anyone has heard of sessions taking place in Dublin that are only for females??
I heard a while back that this type of session takes place but have forgotten where and when!
If anyone has heard of these, could you let me know a little more about them.
Thanks.
# Posted on August 2nd 2011 by dublin99
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
I don't know, but I am sure they happen nightly in the dreams if many blokes.
# Posted on August 2nd 2011 by DrSilverSpear
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
*of!
# Posted on August 2nd 2011 by DrSilverSpear
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Sooooo, ummm, at a female only session, does that mean that only females are allowed to play, or that only females are allowed in the door? Cause i wouldn't mind sitting in on a female only session... But seriously, i think it's very attractive for a Woman to have instrumental talents. Women that play stringed instruments are especially attractive. Not many sights(if any) beat a beautiful woman holding a beautiful instrument, and playing it beautifully.
# Posted on August 2nd 2011 by fiddlelearner
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
I don't know about all stringed instruments... if I see a beautiful woman on the banjo, I think I'd still be running away no matter how pretty...
# Posted on August 2nd 2011 by JosephC
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
And all whistle players are only attractive until you see the long stream of drool coming out the bottom end onto their trousers, or in theirs or someone else's drink......
>_>
# Posted on August 2nd 2011 by JosephC
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
You would be running from Angelina Carberry?
# Posted on August 2nd 2011 by DrSilverSpear
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Anyone have a decent answer to my question??
# Posted on August 2nd 2011 by dublin99
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
You'll be lucky to get one in this place with such vast potential for bad jokes at the tip of everyone's keyboard.
# Posted on August 2nd 2011 by DrSilverSpear
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
My more serious answer is, why???
# Posted on August 2nd 2011 by DrSilverSpear
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Hey now, back in the day, Banjo was a very respectable instrument to play. But really, i favor the fiddle/violin and guitar, but more because i like how they sound. The fiddle is charismatic, and the guitar and violin are soothing when played gently and sweetly.
# Posted on August 2nd 2011 by fiddlelearner
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Imagine a session with a "men only" sign. That would go over well, wouldn't it?
# Posted on August 2nd 2011 by TaoCat
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
I have a decent answer to your question; a friend of mine said she was playing in one in Hughes' for a while. I think she said it was on Tuesdays, I don't know if it is still going but as far as I know this is/was the only females only session around Dublin. Of course there could be more that I don't know about as I wouldn't be wanted at any female sessions as I am the wrong gender.
# Posted on August 2nd 2011 by Why Bother?
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
I would be very disheartened to learn such a thing exists. Discrimination is wrong no matter where it comes from.
# Posted on August 2nd 2011 by TaoCat
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
The question remains..... why???? Would playing in a "co-ed" session ruin our delicate feminine sensibilities or damage our fragile self-esteem?
Or is it just the risk that traditional music might lead to fornication? There was me thinking we had already been down that road.....
# Posted on August 2nd 2011 by DrSilverSpear
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
"Discrimination is wrong, no matter where it comes from." I totally agree.
# Posted on August 2nd 2011 by fiddlelearner
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
I expect the same feeling that prompted the setting aside areas of train depots and ferry boats for WOMEN PASSENGERS ONLY is the explanation. (Dunno, but maybe this specially designated session might be a legitimate instance of Women being from Venus, men being from the pound) While these arrangements have passed from use in most public places, maybe, just maybe, this one meets a need. Btw, I actually like the old arrangement whereby bars were for males only; places where men did their drinking standing up, there being no such things as lounges. I would like it if a few of those establishments were still around. Thanks for your indulgence.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Atahualpa Quigley
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
What need could it meet?
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by TaoCat
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
People have funny reactions when this kind of segregation comes up. I am reminded of a decision by the supreme court of Canada a few years back allowing women-only gatherings of some sort or other, but not of men-only, sorry I don't remember exactly what kind of gathering or club it was. The stated reasoning was the observation, a correct one I think, that one man in a women's group is quite a different dynamic than one woman in a men's group. The USA courts don't seem to be so nuanced, yet I think Canadian women are as tough as any.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by full measure
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
TaoCat, I see it as a need for escape, if only briefly, from the realm of women; the need for sloppy sentimental male bonding; the need to stand on a carpet of peanut shells, sawdust, and gawdknowswhat. Or were you asking about the gals? Well, maybe they want a females-only haven for equal but opposite reasons. We could ask.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Atahualpa Quigley
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
I think you will find that such a thing is illegal. -- Not a hanging offence, like using multiple question marks -- but certainly warranting a hefty fine or a custodial sentence.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by gam
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Oh that it were true.....I can see the notice now - 'No requests for 'Old Hag you have killed me' -''The Hag with the money' or The Granny in the corner' and definitely 'No Trannies Allowed''
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Free Reed
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
I think women only sessions would be a good idea. Presumably the bodhranists would eventually land up playing in sync.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by skreech
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
I can't get past the gross grammatical errors. The sign in stations should read FEMALE PASSENGERS not WOMEN PASSENGERS. By the same token, you can have a session for women, but not a session for females. Female what?
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Ailin
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Hi there,
I'm good friends with one of them (if indeed this is the same group!) and from what I gather, they were all part of the same friends circle anyways and the session happened organically.
So I thiiink I know what you're talking about--there's a group of gals in Dublin that started a session that, essentially, just sort of happened to be all-female. And then, they decided to keep it that way--you know, like having a social girls' night out only, since they're all mad for the music, a session
They're awesome people and welcoming but I believe it's sort of a "need to know somebody" type deal. "Why Bother" has the right idea, they did used to play at Hughes, the last time I went it was both genders though (musician boyfriends!). More like a night out for a group of friends. And, I'm back in America now, so I've no idea if it's still going or where else they play, and I wouldn't want to disclose any information unknowingly!
Jeez, this is sounding like a session run by the FBI...I cannot disclose anything further
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by mellow yellow
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Christ, I thought we got over all these stupid pseudo freedom from discrimination arguments in the 1980's (that's last century guys). Presumably some women would like to play music in a safe environment, away from drunken a**holes who leer and try to pick them up.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by fabphil39
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
"Presumably some women would like to play music in a safe environment, away from drunken a**holes who leer and try to pick them up."
LOL yes, because of course men = that. Just like blacks = violent criminals, and Jews = greedy and rich.
For f***'s sake, man.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Joe CSS
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Well I didn't say all men are like that, but as you know, there are some out there. Would you want to put up with that when all you want to do is play the music? And no it has nothing to do with racism or anti-Semitism. That's just an attempt to confuse the issue. What would be your best guess at why women would want to get together for a particular activity without men around?
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by fabphil39
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
"What would be your best guess at why women would want to get together for a particular activity without men around?"
Because they're sexist? That's the only reason I can think of to ban men in general rather than just the lecherous ones specifically.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Will Harmon
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Ban the behavior, not the gender.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Will Harmon
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
"The stated reasoning was the observation, a correct one I think, that one man in a women's group is quite a different dynamic than one woman in a men's group."
I'm trying to get my head around this. Is one man in a group of women bad? If so, is it because women are incapable of asserting themselves in such a situation? Wouldn't that reasoning be an example of caving in to the usual gender-based stereotypes?
I've never understood why some folks make such a big issue about gender and sexual orientation in situations where they're not relevant (which is just about everyplace other than than the tryst itself).
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Will Harmon
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Exactly. Everybody has their justifications for exclusion. None of them are right. Substitute the "no *" with any race, gender, ethnicity or whatever. If one is wrong, they all are.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by TaoCat
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Not to be confused with "no strummers, bodhrans. etc." in that case you're excluding because of what they do, not who they are.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by TaoCat
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
On the one hand, discrimination is discrimination. If you're having an open session in a public place, the shape of someone's naughty bits is really not a respectable basis for rejecting or accepting a participant.
On the other hand...well, I can't really think of another hand, actually.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Jon Kiparsky
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
You know, if gender profiling is correct and good, maybe the rest of profiling is as well. Why don't the people who agree with this "females only" explain why this is good?
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by TaoCat
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
The sessions I go to have men and women, I play with people from 1/4 of my age to twice my age. Irish, English, Kiwi, Thai, French, American etc etc.
One of the really great things about this music is that it is so inclusive. Respect the music and the social occaision it is played in and you get respect back.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Rocky Nook
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
So help me, I like the idea! It really doesn't matter how folks far away from here choose to run their session. It really doesn't. (There are loftier principles under attack right here in the US) Will, these Dublin gals might just oblige you by letting you (virtually) sit them down, and give them a good listening to. Look after Montana, and turn the lights off when you go to bed ;+)
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Atahualpa Quigley
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
What's the drill for the emoticons again?
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Atahualpa Quigley
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Here's the other hand, Jon:
Will asks: "Is one man in a group of women bad?"
If it's a bad man, then yes.
"If so, is it because women are incapable of asserting themselves in such a situation?"
Maybe it's because [some] women are *uninterested* in putting themselves in situations in which they are likely to have to assert themselves in order to play music in an environment in which drunken arseholes aren't leering at them and trying to pick them up. They may be perfectly *capable* of asserting themselves thusly, but it does tend to make for a less fun and relaxing evening when one *has* to do it, or even to be on guard for the possibility.
Sure, it's better to ban lecherous behaviour than entire groups of people. But banning lecherous behaviour tends to take the form of after-the-fact punishment, invoked after more than a little unpleasantness for the object of such lechery. Now, if players make it *very clear* what kind of behaviour was unwelcome at sessions - so clear that no one would even think of violating the code of conduct - then no one would need to "assert" themselves at all in order to play freely. That's the ideal, as far as I'm concerned. But creating such an environment requires a great deal of commitment and consensus, which is more difficult than simply requiring women to assert themselves to men who behave inappropriately. It's also more difficult than having the women form a splinter session in which everyone who possesses the XY karyotype is persona non grata. One of these easy alternatives disadvantages women; the other, men (including non-lecherous men). I don't see why the former is necessarily superior.
I'd like to hear about how these women-only sessions came about. I suspect that at they were started after some of the female players got sick of coming to a session to unwind and relax, only to have to spend more time than they wanted policing the behaviour of men who were there for an entirely different purpose.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Tall, Dark, and Mysterious
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Yeah, I thought about that. Really, I did. But you know, I'm not convinced.
For one thing, I'm sure there are plenty of people in the states who feel much more comfortable playing music in a room where there aren't gay people, or Jewish people, or Catholics, or whatever. They're usually called bigots, because they discriminate against people based on their inherent characteristics because they're uncomforatable around "people like that". And we don't usually make excuses for that sort of preference.
So we don't really accept that logic of separation based on someone's comfort level - there has to be some actual behavior. And I have no problem with kicking people out for bad behavior, but being convex instead of concave isn't a behavior.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Jon Kiparsky
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
"So we don't really accept that logic of separation based on someone's comfort level - there has to be some actual behavior. "
Making someone uncomfortable by creating or tolerating an unwelcome environment for them is a behaviour.
Someone upthread mentioned the women-only passenger cars in Japan. I remember reading about those some time ago, and how they were created in response to women being groped on the mixed-sex cars. I remember being shocked by this, because that sort of behaviour is practically unheard of here in Canada. It's understood that you don't grope your fellow passengers. Consequently, we don't have women-only passenger cars here; the demand just isn't here. I've never seen any women-only sessions (and neither has anyone else here, it seems, save the OP and one other who described a closed session that happens to be women-only), and the lecherous behaviour described above is not endemic at sessions around these parts, and so no one has thought of creating a women-only session. (Though some time ago, there was a session that ended up becoming men-only because the women were routinely being harassed and decided the session wasn't worth it for them. It soon folded.)
If people of a certain sex, ethnic group, sexual orientation, or religion are splintering off, it's worthwhile to wonder what has created the demand. It might be bigotry, but it might be something else. In the case of the women-only cars, it is indeed because of actual behaviour, albeit not a behaviour that every single person excluded from the women-only cars is guilty of. Same, possibly, for the women-only sessions sessions. (Not all men grope/leer at women, but it seems all gropers /leerers were men.) Folks uncomfortable with this sort of segregation could avoid it simply by enforcing a code of conduct that makes women welcome at the standard, mixed sessions (and passenger cars) - if women are welcome at those, they probably won't create their own, and everyone wins, except the arseholes. OTOH, this approach wouldn't work with true bigots - folks who organize Jew-free events aren't doing so because gentiles are routinely made to feel unwelcome.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Tall, Dark, and Mysterious
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Also:
"And I have no problem with kicking people out for bad behavior"
Thing is, again, you would not be the victim of the bad behaviour under discussion. Those who are more likely to be at the receiving end of such bad behaviour might appreciate the sentiment quoted above, but ultimately decide that it's not worth it for them to be groped/leered at/harassed before you to enforce a civilized code of conduct.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Tall, Dark, and Mysterious
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
So you're in favor of banning people from a public place because their presence makes some people uncomfortable?
I'm not. I guess we disagree. Oh, well, it's a big world, it had to happen some day that someone would disagree with me.
I guess I'll live.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Jon Kiparsky
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Well, really, after All-State Choir, i kindof don't care who i'm playing music with. I use to favor singing with girls in high school, just cause i didn't like being around a bunch of dudes, cause i didn't fit in. Well, in All-State, there were near 250 of us "dudes" and we sounded amazing. One of the greatest musical experiences of my life. Well... one of them hit on me... but when i told him that "i'm not like that..." he was respectful and backed off... But still, i'll never forget singing with them. Another point, i enjoy the company of Women. I was raised by women, i'm use to being around them, and i fit in better with them. So not being accepted because i'm a guy would be a bit hurtful. But then again, just like i don't like being around a bunch of dogs, i wouldn't like being around of... sexest women either.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by fiddlelearner
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
So people are (perhaps) doing something to avoid a local cultural environment that makes then feel uncomfortable. Other people, here, are saying they should change the environment rather than avoid it. Maybe they spend a lot of their lives (or at least their time out socialising) standing up for themselves and trying to change the environment and for a while just want to relax and play tunes. The term 'bigot' may be being directed at the wrong people.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by David50
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
David, if someone wants to have a private club, that's fine and good. It's a dodge that bigots the world over have used, and bigots of the female persuasion should stand up and use it too. If Jesse Helms doesn't want to drink martinis with Black people, he starts a private club, and nobody can force him to let anyone in that he doesn't like.
And if Sinead and Fiona don't want to play with any of those XY types, that's fine, they can use the same dodge. I understand - all bigotry comes from fear, and fiona and Sinead can be afraid just like Jesse Helms can, and they have the same remedy.
If you don't want to be around people, you shouldn't go into public places where people are. There's private homes and private clubs for that.
I'm just not willing to pretend that they're all that different.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Jon Kiparsky
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
'Live & Let Live' is not a bad maxim. If women want to gather together and chat, play a few tunes, discuss books or whatever - I can't see any problem whatsoever at all in it. I don't feel threatened by it or excluded, as long as there are alternatives where all can freely attend.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by the wounded hussar
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
I think Jon, that we do things differently on our side of the pond (see link below for example) . Usually we don't have to hide from people we don't like, we just stick to our corner of the bar or move to a different one. Transparency (not that it is always present) feels safer.
http://www.yourrights.org.uk/yourrights/right-to-receive-equal-treatment/race-discrimination/race-discrimination-clubs-and-advertisements.html
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by David50
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Ah yes, the "separate but equal" argument. Much loved by the US Supreme Court. In 1890s.
I suppose the question is, how open a session is it? If it's a closed session that happens to be a bunch of women who like playing together, it's like a closed session anywhere else. And that's fine. But is it an open session but only to women? If myself and my boyfriend came across it in the pub, would I be allowed to play, but not him? That's where it begins to be problematic.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by DrSilverSpear
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Sorry, that's the UK, but digging into EU leglisation that would cover Dublin is hard work.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by David50
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
TSS maybe that would need rules...
... like these http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200304/cmbills/068/04068.1-i.html
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by David50
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
We are all just surmising here as to the reasoning behind this session.
If it is just a group of friends on the Irish music equivalent of a "girly night out" as Mellow Yellow has suggested, then I don't see any problem with this. Good luck to them.
Also, in such a situation, it's quite possible that a male friend or even a casual visitor might still be welcomed into the fold but they might just choose not to intrude on what appears to be a private affair...not that different from what might seem to be a closed session.
Many sessions are already either male or female dominated on a "de facto" basis for various reasons while others tend to attract the same people on a regular basis and can appear "cliquey" to an outsider whether they are open or not.
If there's a ultra feminist or "anti male" agenda at work, then I'm obviously less well disposed to such a set up but this probably unlikely. On the other hand, if the women are genuinely nervous or uncomfortable with male company in such an environment, this is quite sad and probably says more about us(men) and society in general.
On a lighter note, I actually joined a group of women on a "hen night" many, many years ago for a drink or two as I had just entered the pub by chance.
I wouldn't normally seek out such gatherings nor would I expect an invitation. The same would apply to any other "girly", "lads", or even any other night out or get together which was obviously private.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Johnny Jay
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
With all due respect to all the views above:
I feel compelled to observe that there is pretty much room for all of us, no matter what the color, language, or gender. I am not much offended or threatened by other folks doing something I neither like nor understand, so long as no one is being hurt.
Were it violating someone else's rights, I might let my vigilante nature surface. (do not hit a child or a woman, or torch a temple around me.)
That said, I am of the position, let them have their sessions - all male, all female, all Muslim, all Scots, all Koreans, whatever. Ban me, big deal. Why would I want to associate with anyone who would not welcome me into their midst? Because "I have rights!"?
There are still one or two places where my fiddle and my company are welcome, and not intruding on someone else's choices.
I shall repair to my local, where there is a smile and an honest pint waiting.
Good Luck, all.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Piece
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
In the snug in Hughes' on a Tuesday night there's an all girls group. I'm not a girl and I ended up playing there one Tuesday, there were 8 people in there and one was an old man, tunes were great so in I went, only to find that he wasn't playing! I knew I couldn't walk out but I couldn't just sit there either, they insisted that I play and maintained that, like many Hughes' sessions, some trend just happens in who comes, e.g the back session that night is flutes only.
Enjoy!
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Paudy
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
thanks for this discussion, many good points made here.
i got curious and googled this. keep in mind, it was in the last century; but sometimes there are assumptions made that are hard to see. because they're just assumed. there are lots of sides to the question, for sure.
http://www.acdi-cida.gc.ca/acdi-cida/acdi-cida.nsf/eng/REN-218125542-Q37
"Equity and equality - what's the difference?
"Gender equity is the process of being fair to women and men. To ensure fairness, measures must often be available to compensate for historical and social disadvantages that prevent women and men from otherwise operating on a level playing field. Equity leads to equality."
Reference: Gender-Based Analysis: A guide for policy-making, Status of Women Canada, 1996."
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by full measure
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Paudy, Mellow Yellow and Why Bother - Thanks for your input and suggestions here. God what a lot of crap people talk on here too in relation to practically anything. They take a post and turn it into a whole different ball game!!
I've tried to get involved in a session before on the southside with a friend and they weren't very welcoming - got a few dirty looks as if I was intruding!! Strange how some musicians are so possessive of a session!!! it's not like they were getting paid for it!!!! Thanks again guys. If you know of any contact info for anyone involved in that Hughes session, let me know!
Míle buíochas!
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by dublin99
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Lighten up. It's only a bit of a laugh and a bit of fun debate. Expected for the board, really. Talking crap is generally more fun than not, in real life as well as online.
Anyway, I think unfriendly session possessiveness is an equal-opportunity phenomenon.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by DrSilverSpear
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
I was just being nice. By "equal-opportunity," I have, in my travels, encountered more cattiness and weird politics amongst female session-goers than male ones.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by DrSilverSpear
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
This reminds me of the "No Dogs, No Women" sign in the car park of the Royal St. George's course in England, that was removed just before the recent British Open!
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/more_sports/2011/07/13/2011-07-13_sign_is_gone_but_discrimination_still_dogs_ra.html
I can just imagine the reaction to a similar sign on a Pub Door in Dublin!
Cheers
Dick
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Ptarmigan
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
What next a all gay or lesbian only session, I have often heard sories of what went on in certain well known dance troupes who had frequent ladies only rooms and well you know what Im getting at. Are we to far away from a Lesbian or Gay ( or even openly acknowledged BI sexual) iTrad group.......I know of two well known Trad musicians one is lesbian and the other a closet gay....where will it all end up.????
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by belfastrab
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Dublin 9, no worries, I'm not back to Dublin til August 18th but Devitt's on a Thursday night in the downstairs bar is a very friendly and lively session
Sin E on Ormonde Quay on Sunday nights is also great and looking for more players to get involved. I usually drive to Greystones on a Tuesday night for a session at Danns bar there.
Where else.... well it depends if you want a loud session or a quiet one I guess.
Hughes' ladies session - sorry no idea who runs it or who to contact but they did tell me that they're paid in sandwiches that arrive around 1130 (also the signal to stop !), I was encouraged to eat as many as I felt like when I was there.
Sure I might see you in Devitt's some Thursday.
Actually, one more, the International bar on a Wednesday night, same players that play Devitts on a Friday night, lovely players, lovely people!
Good luck and happy playing
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Paudy
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
belfastrab, it will probably end up with people using multiple punctuation marks for no good reason!!!!
Not rocket science here. If one "x" not allowed is wrong, they all are. As far as men being more likely to be lecherous, I am not. Period. And I have seen women acting very inappropriately at times as well. Is that a good reason to start a "men only" session? Perhaps we should exclude certain players of certain races, as they have a statistical probability to be more likely to commit crimes. Not pretty, is it?
If I was playing with a group of guys, and they told a woman it was a "guys night out" thing, the very least I'd do is walk. Discrimination based on who a person is, is wrong. Not too hard to understand, is it?
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by TaoCat
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
I thought Canadian women were unusually tough from having to endure those long, cold, harsh winters that far north.
If I saw a "No Dogs, No Women" sign outside a pub, I wouldn't go in. I can understand banning a dog but not letting me bring my wife in with me is going too far.
Laurence
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by fauxcelt
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Thanks 'Paudy'! Much appreciated. Will suss them out.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by dublin99
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
You're welcome, 'dublin99'
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Paudy
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
"I've tried to get involved in a session before on the southside with a friend and they weren't very welcoming"
Be careful with your logic, because if the group of women friends don't welcome you into the fold, you're very quickly running out of Homo sapiens
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Theirlandais
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Most any big city has shelters for battered women. Dublin, like San Jose, has a number of these sanctuaries. (Sorry to throw a slush ball in this otherwise happy snowball fight.) Guys, discrimination isn't the issue. Is it so hard to grasp the notion that some gals might need to have another sort of refuge -- a musical one -- that is entirely their own?
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Atahualpa Quigley
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
What's the wager on this whole thing being a completely blown out of proportion non-issue? My theory is a group of gals decide to regularly attend a session, and suddenly the word gets out it's a "chick-clique" and dudes aren't welcome. No Ovaries, no tunes.
I bet the whole thing never occurred. Total hogwash. Utter poppycock. Complete balderdash. A massive flapdoodle (ok, I made that word up) I bet the gals showed up every week, played their tunes and wondered "where were all the blokes again tonight?"
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Jusa Nutter Eejit
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Jusa, is it after five o'clock in Phoenix? Are there any all-male bastions you can disappear into for a pint? Do they have a layer of sawdust on the floor? Is it so hopelessly retro that there aren't even TVs with ball games?
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Atahualpa Quigley
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Do they bother with fru-fru like bar stools and chairs? (Women wanted so desperately to gain admission into such places? Must have been a let down...)
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Atahualpa Quigley
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Jusa Nutter Eejit, I think you're basically on the ball, the girls running that ladies session in Hughes' said after a while the session just began to be known as the "fanny power session", they were very nice and told me I was very welcome to come back, I said thanks and I'd say it to a few of my friends.
The session I play at regularly in Dublin had been getting a reputation for a while as a girl dominated event too, pub regulars would pop their head in the door and say "where are all the girls this week?".
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Paudy
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
AQ - remember this is the wild west out here - spittoons, beer, sawdust floors and big-screen ballgames are par for the course even in ladies hair salons, never mind some imaginary muy macho man-cave. Besides I prefer a place that welcomes memebers of the fairer sex.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Jusa Nutter Eejit
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
I like the ones that are permissive enough to let children approach the back door to call out: "Father, come home." Saloons, not salons, that is. I'm sure the fairer sex wouldn't like my notion of a watering hole.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Atahualpa Quigley
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
JNE, I assumed the same. My previous comments on this were aimed only at the principle of the thing, not this particular session.
# Posted on August 3rd 2011 by Will Harmon
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
@ Laurence .. Just for the record, at our Thursday night session up here, the ratio is 40% women players ... oh yes & there's usually at least one customer with a dog in the bar!
In fact, one Fiddler used to bring his own dog every week & it sat quietly by his side all night .... that is, until the barman brought the Cheese & Ham sandwiches around!
Of course, its favourite tune was .... The Dogs Among The Bushes!
Cheers,
Dick
# Posted on August 4th 2011 by Ptarmigan
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Speaking of dogs, our session in New Bedford, Mass, was canceled a few months ago. For the past year or so, the pub encouraged patrons to bring their dogs on Sunday afternoons (concurrent with our session). Between football, hockey, and dogs, we couldn't compete. The pub wouldn't even throw us a bone.
# Posted on August 4th 2011 by GaryAMartin
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
So they told you to take a walk, eh?
Just wait - the patrons will be hounding them to get you back. When you make your triumphant return, your first song should of course be Spaniel Hill.
# Posted on August 4th 2011 by Jon Kiparsky
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Female only Sessions...What next...Women only toilets???
# Posted on August 4th 2011 by Free Reed
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Dick, due to the strict local health and hygiene laws here in Arkansas, the only places of business (such as stores, restaurants, shops, etc.) where anybody is allowed to bring their pets are the veterinarian's office or pet stores such as Petsmart and/or Petco. Otherwise, you must leave your dog or cat or whatever type of animal companion at home.
Laurence
# Posted on August 4th 2011 by fauxcelt
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
back to original post... anybody remember the "thornbush" pub in dublin on parnell st used to have lesbian night that had a sesiun... maybe thats what the op is on about?
# Posted on August 8th 2011 by flanum
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Not going to read all of the comments posted after your original thread since there are too many/they seem really ridiculous, but I think the session you're looking for used to happen in Hughes' in the Four Courts. It's just off the Luas. Good luck and have fun!
# Posted on August 8th 2011 by protectorofthesmall
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
I'm a bit late replying to this but Paudy is right on the money! Fanny Powers' session, that's what they started calling it because it happened to be a group of girls in most times...Sure I never saw you in there, I was lurking around the dublin sessions for a bit in the beginning of June! Same group plays in the International on Wednesdays and they've been trying to get that session up and on its feet. So, as long as you're a decent person and aren't about to storm a session with 500 of your greatest tunes played loudly on a didgeridoo, you should be grand. Couldn't find a friendlier bunch of people, and a lot of that same crowd play at Devitt's on Saturday nights as well!
I believe that, sometimes, people are looking to give sinister reasons behind session mechanics when the answer is simple. Human nature, really!
Thanks dublin99 for the recognition
# Posted on August 8th 2011 by mellow yellow
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
Mellow Yellow, I was in at the Fanny Powers' session in 2009 I think, probably August but I'm really not sure!
I didn't know that the Wednesday International crew were connected to the Tuesday Hughes' session or the Saturday Devitt's session, sure I suppose the people involved just change so often!
# Posted on August 9th 2011 by Paudy
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
I met some of these so called "fannies" at the fleadh there in Cavan and they told me their session is 2 years old soon. They'll be having a party apparently and are being strict on no-men that night, especially after all the baking they'll be doing for the party!
I'm trying to gather all the men of Dublin and beyond to protest outside hughes that night and protect our rights to play tunes with whoever we want, this is an outrage! We should all be out there spreading the word, and burning our Y-fronts!
# Posted on August 29th 2011 by Willy Power
Re: Female only sessions in Dublin??????
FP's 2nd Birthday was a hit. Including a scrumptious cake ... nice one ladies ;)
Like most sessions, FP primarily serves a social purpose. Any associations with gender protest would be ... tongue in cheek.
Think of it as a female social network.
And to settle the score--boys are allowed. We like men.
# Posted on October 23rd 2011 by sechale