Are there any intermediate level players in Amsterdam interested in getting together for a trial session? Currently there is a lovely session in Mulligan's on a Wednesday night but the standard is very high and the format appears to be alternate sets of tunes and songs, suggesting those involved are paid. If the singer is paid to sing after every set of tunes it makes things very stop-start-stop-start for players. So not the best environment for intermediate level players to try muddling through sets. Mulligan's on a Sunday night has the same problem - it is led by the band who performed the previous Friday and Saturday nights and so by definition the standard is high. Often the bands just seem to play through the sets they performed the previous two nights and anyone else who happens to turn up is left to sink or swim. If you are interested in trying to organize/attend an intermediate level session in Amsterdam please drop me an email.
Intermediate or otherwise, it's good to have a session to which players can feel comfortable about entering. It's not necessarily about ability and repertoire/style also plays a very important part.
On my previous visits to Mulligans, I got the same impression as Sergeant Fox. It was usually the "booked band" and seldom anyone else who were involved in the session and it was more like an "unplugged performance".
Of course, if more players had joined, the dynamics of the session may have altered and, of course, there might not have been anyone else around that day. On the other hand, local musicians might just feel that this sort of situation isn't for them.
I'm only an occasional visitor to Amsterdam and this might not be the norm although it probably is as Sergeant Fox and my own experience suggests.
There's a band that plays gigs in a pub every Friday and Saturday ... and on Sunday they turn up at the same pup for a session and they just play the same sets of tunes they played the previous night? Flippin heck they must be the most boring set of dudes on the planet.
So the thing to with with them is go to the two gigs, clock what their sets are, then turn up at the session and play all their tunes in mixed up sets ... that'll learn 'em.
I may be wrong, having never been to Amsterdam, but I think it is a different "band" in each week. For example I know that a fair few musicians from Glasgow have gone down before. They are put up for the weekend and play in the pub. The idea of 2 gigs and a session seems quite likely for that.
I would agree though that if they are just playing the same music every night then that is a bit boring.
It is a "different" band each week and, admittedly, they frequently have some great musicians there.
However, this might be another reason why "locals" (many will probably be ex pats) won't always necessarily want to get involved as they won't know what to expect.
I wouldn't want to tell the pub how to run its business but it might be more sensible to hire a regular core of musicians to run the session on a weekly basis while, by all means, encourage the visiting band to get as involved as they wish.
Of course, there might not be enough good local players in Amsterdam to perform this role but I very much doubt that.
Certainly, in most European Capitals and elsewhere you will encounter lots of good musicians especially in Copenhagen where the Irish scene has always been very strong.
I'm sure Amsterdam will be no different.
Sgt. Fox, let us know if there is new session. I'm over in September for a few days, and thought I'd go for a few tunes on the Wednesday session, but the more the better (sessions, that is....)
If I see a pub called Mulligan's (or Finnegan's, or Murphy's, or anywhere with green uncial lettering and a Guinness logo) anywhere in Europe, my immediate response is to cross the road and walk on FAST.
There must be alternative venues in most cities that could host a session without the kitsch.
I was in Mulligans on the Wednesday night a couple of months ago and it was a nice session. There was no "format" that I was aware of and visiting musicians were welcomed and mixed in a normal spontaneous way.
Of course you get regulars, and of course in a place with a relatively small trad music scene , some of those regulars are likely to form bands that play in venues like Mulligans. So it wouldn't surprise me if there was some crossover.
The thing that is most likely to put the fastidious session.orger off, if they haven't already crossed the road FAST (straight into the Amstel!) is that the small back room used for sessions is also the smoking room (or at least it was in March, summer might be different) so you can end up well kippered.
Oh, and "No cause for Alarm" - yes, I've heard of the deal where some musicians are paid to be the band and also take part in the session but I doubt it happens every week. There was nothing like that going on when I was there. Or maybe it's more of a summer thing as well.
I have been in there a few years ago when the "session" was at the front and miked-up (which is awkward for an intermediate muddler I must admit) but last time it was "back bar" and it's advertised as in the "back bar" tonight.
Small pubs everywhere are closing due to hard times, in Netherlands as well as UK, and Mulligans is a decent place with good friendly long-term staff so I certainly don't grudge them a bit of tack and a few Guinness signs.
Right enough, now that I think of it, the back bar might be slightly miked up so that people in the bar hear it but you're not really aware of it.
Lots of pubs in Ireland seem to be doing that miking up as well. Just one or two mics hanging from the ceiling above the session and set to a low level. I can't say I have ever found it off-putting or even particularly noticeable.
The main problem with this approach is that it just encourages the punters to become even more noisy.
So, you can't hear yourself although they can obviously hear you.
It's a bit like this is Hairy Annie's pub in Inverness and is the reason why I seldom venture into the sessions there unless the pub itself is fairly quiet.
I'm not that keen on the huge "round table" scenario either which is also quite common especially abroad. It may be more egalitarian in that there is no "outer circle" or people squeezing to get in. However, it also makes it more difficult when you are trying to hear what another player is doing.
This isn't exactly correct. I've been a session regular at Mullies for about 4 years now and I've found it quite welcoming. The way it works is that generally when a band is booked they are paid to play the evenings of the Thursday through the Sunday. They perform Thursday, Friday, and Saturday and then are meant to take part in the session Sunday, not actually perform their sents then (though i think those acts that are a bit less tune oriented do sometimes end up playing the sets they worked up, that may be true on occasion). However I would say between 1/3 to 1/2 of the time there is no band booked for the sunday and instead its just the locals. Mind you, the standard most of the locals play at is quite high (and I for one appreciate that), but I've never found the attitude arrogant or unwelcoming, and in my experience there have been loads of circumstances when beginners and intermediate players join. The wednesday sessions are more of a new thing, but are also generally at a high standard (e.g., Dave Munnelly and Martin McGinley will be around this evening).
Anyhow, good luck organizing an intermediate session as well, the more the merrier!
I know the pub you mean, John. The hole of acoustic death. I don't think the miked up session thing works, as only a couple people get the mikes, even if they are the hangy down ones, and you basically get the regulars doing their regular, miked up sets, and the only thing you can contribute to such a place is just playing along to the ones you know while not being able to hear what you're playing.
It's more like having a baby monitor in Mulligans back room than a band mike. And if you're in the back room, you can't hear it so it doesn't affect your playing or listening. From the front bar, it sounds somewhat unbalanced toward some instruments and in the background. Just like any session does. I'm talking from memory so maybe RobBBQ can clarify but I think you're making it sound a bigger deal than it really is.
Yeah, Bren has it right, its more that they are hanging a few mics over the session so that it can be heard in the back smoking room. It isn't at all a mic'd gig with the name "session" on it.
The plus at Mullies is that *most* of the time they are booking quite good musicians, so that the sundays when out of towners are in playing you are actually in for a treat rather than the opposite (though the "wild rover" evenings have happened on very rare occasion). You get the lads over from Belfast, then the next week from Cork, then the next week from Mayo and maybe from Scotland or Brittany every now and again and etc. I think for the most part it works really well.
As the owner of Mulligans, I must say that I'm surprised to be the centre of all this attention. Secondly I must say though, that between all of you, you're not very easy to please! acoustic, not-acoustic, local musicians, traveling musicians, band-members, no-band members, back room, front bar..... I think if there was a bar that could please you all, they deserve a medal!
Just to set a few things right: There is an open Session every sunday from ± 19.00, which is mainly instrumental lead by a few musicians, who can be either local or traveling bands that are over, it's usually 50 % of each, each month. The level is quite high, as we like to please the listeners as well, but it's open for everybody; we get children joining as well at times. The sunday sessions have been there since 1988.
Since early this year we also have a back room session on a wednesday from ± 21.00, which is -as no surprise , in the back room. This is more a singing session, acoustic, and perhaps a bit easier to join in for less advanced musicians or people that just like to sing. Unlike the sunday sessions, which are mainly Irish, we had Scottish songs, French songs, Croation songs, Beatles and all sorts on wednesdays.
As for people with comments on "tacky Guinness signs etc., you've obviously never even been inside.. so no comment.
Further more, anybody with any other initiative, always welcome to come and talk to us about it.
Miriam. Mulligans.
Hi Bren, most of the time it is more a singing session, it can be a tune session as well, depending who comes in..
And yes it is still the smoking room, just like the sessions in Ireland in the good old days...
Guys this is great banter but not really helping me! First off, I love Mulligans as a pub and it in no way complies with the stereotyped Oirish Pub cynically reeling in expats as some poster above mistakenly assumed. There must be fourteen Irish pubs in Amsterdam but only Mulligan's is the real thing. Secondly, I'm still hoping that someone will post saying they are interested in getting together for an intermediate level session. The music in Mulligan's is always wonderful to listen to, just a bit challenging to join in with if you are intermediate. Knowing that there are punters in enjoying listening to great musicians is not an great incentive for a player like myself to try and wobble through the Tarbolton Set!
Anyway, it is now nine o'clock on a Wednesday night and me and the wife are about to cycle up to Mulligans to enjoy listening to the session. I'll be wearing a black and white shirt if anyone there wants to continue this discussion face to face!
I also think Mulligans is a good pub and the music there is generally of high quality too. It's certainly not your typical Oirish pub as you have mentioned.
However, it's not necessarily ideal for everyone and many musicians and singers prefer a more relaxed type of environment whether they are beginners, intermediate, or even the more experienced players.
Of course, you have to do what you feel is best for your own particular pub and it's certainly not possible to please everyone. For myself, I am happy enough to accept things for what they are and would always be happy to visit there when I'm in Amsterdam.
Well in the clear light of dawn I can report that there was an absolutely stonking session in Mulligan's last night. Eight fiddlers from a workshop threw a bit of weight into the mix and led to the session spilling out into the front bar. Still hoping to hear from interested intermediate parties! And thanks for the hat Miriam!
Allow me to introduce myself first, as I just got on here. My name is Isaac Muller, and I play quite a bit in Mulligan's. Flute to be more precise.
I believe everything there is to be mentioned about the Mulligan's session habits is said allready, but here is a note to sergeant fox: it may be a good idea to start an intermediate session here in Amsterdam, but are you aware of a few that allready exist not so fare away? There's one in Alkmaar, and there used to be one in Monickendam, not sure if it is still there. Eltjo Toorn makes an effort to list all that is going on on his website. You may find a nice session there, and otherwise it is the perfect place to advertise your own.
Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
Are there any intermediate level players in Amsterdam interested in getting together for a trial session? Currently there is a lovely session in Mulligan's on a Wednesday night but the standard is very high and the format appears to be alternate sets of tunes and songs, suggesting those involved are paid. If the singer is paid to sing after every set of tunes it makes things very stop-start-stop-start for players. So not the best environment for intermediate level players to try muddling through sets. Mulligan's on a Sunday night has the same problem - it is led by the band who performed the previous Friday and Saturday nights and so by definition the standard is high. Often the bands just seem to play through the sets they performed the previous two nights and anyone else who happens to turn up is left to sink or swim. If you are interested in trying to organize/attend an intermediate level session in Amsterdam please drop me an email.
Thanks,
Sergeant Fox
# Posted on June 14th 2011 by sergeant fox
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
Learn to swim?
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by Dragut Reis
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
Intermediate or otherwise, it's good to have a session to which players can feel comfortable about entering. It's not necessarily about ability and repertoire/style also plays a very important part.
On my previous visits to Mulligans, I got the same impression as Sergeant Fox. It was usually the "booked band" and seldom anyone else who were involved in the session and it was more like an "unplugged performance".
Of course, if more players had joined, the dynamics of the session may have altered and, of course, there might not have been anyone else around that day. On the other hand, local musicians might just feel that this sort of situation isn't for them.
I'm only an occasional visitor to Amsterdam and this might not be the norm although it probably is as Sergeant Fox and my own experience suggests.
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by Johnny Jay
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
There's a band that plays gigs in a pub every Friday and Saturday ... and on Sunday they turn up at the same pup for a session and they just play the same sets of tunes they played the previous night? Flippin heck they must be the most boring set of dudes on the planet.
So the thing to with with them is go to the two gigs, clock what their sets are, then turn up at the session and play all their tunes in mixed up sets ... that'll learn 'em.
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by ...
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
I may be wrong, having never been to Amsterdam, but I think it is a different "band" in each week. For example I know that a fair few musicians from Glasgow have gone down before. They are put up for the weekend and play in the pub. The idea of 2 gigs and a session seems quite likely for that.
I would agree though that if they are just playing the same music every night then that is a bit boring.
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by No Cause For Alarm
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
It is a "different" band each week and, admittedly, they frequently have some great musicians there.
However, this might be another reason why "locals" (many will probably be ex pats) won't always necessarily want to get involved as they won't know what to expect.
I wouldn't want to tell the pub how to run its business but it might be more sensible to hire a regular core of musicians to run the session on a weekly basis while, by all means, encourage the visiting band to get as involved as they wish.
Of course, there might not be enough good local players in Amsterdam to perform this role but I very much doubt that.
Certainly, in most European Capitals and elsewhere you will encounter lots of good musicians especially in Copenhagen where the Irish scene has always been very strong.
I'm sure Amsterdam will be no different.
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by Johnny Jay
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
Sgt. Fox, let us know if there is new session. I'm over in September for a few days, and thought I'd go for a few tunes on the Wednesday session, but the more the better (sessions, that is....)
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by snorre
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
If I see a pub called Mulligan's (or Finnegan's, or Murphy's, or anywhere with green uncial lettering and a Guinness logo) anywhere in Europe, my immediate response is to cross the road and walk on FAST.
There must be alternative venues in most cities that could host a session without the kitsch.
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by Jack Campin
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
I was in Mulligans on the Wednesday night a couple of months ago and it was a nice session. There was no "format" that I was aware of and visiting musicians were welcomed and mixed in a normal spontaneous way.
Of course you get regulars, and of course in a place with a relatively small trad music scene , some of those regulars are likely to form bands that play in venues like Mulligans. So it wouldn't surprise me if there was some crossover.
The thing that is most likely to put the fastidious session.orger off, if they haven't already crossed the road FAST (straight into the Amstel!) is that the small back room used for sessions is also the smoking room (or at least it was in March, summer might be different) so you can end up well kippered.
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by Bren
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
Oh, and "No cause for Alarm" - yes, I've heard of the deal where some musicians are paid to be the band and also take part in the session but I doubt it happens every week. There was nothing like that going on when I was there. Or maybe it's more of a summer thing as well.
I have been in there a few years ago when the "session" was at the front and miked-up (which is awkward for an intermediate muddler I must admit) but last time it was "back bar" and it's advertised as in the "back bar" tonight.
Small pubs everywhere are closing due to hard times, in Netherlands as well as UK, and Mulligans is a decent place with good friendly long-term staff so I certainly don't grudge them a bit of tack and a few Guinness signs.
Right enough, now that I think of it, the back bar might be slightly miked up so that people in the bar hear it but you're not really aware of it.
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by Bren
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
Lots of pubs in Ireland seem to be doing that miking up as well. Just one or two mics hanging from the ceiling above the session and set to a low level. I can't say I have ever found it off-putting or even particularly noticeable.
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by No Cause For Alarm
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
The main problem with this approach is that it just encourages the punters to become even more noisy.
So, you can't hear yourself although they can obviously hear you.
It's a bit like this is Hairy Annie's pub in Inverness and is the reason why I seldom venture into the sessions there unless the pub itself is fairly quiet.
I'm not that keen on the huge "round table" scenario either which is also quite common especially abroad. It may be more egalitarian in that there is no "outer circle" or people squeezing to get in. However, it also makes it more difficult when you are trying to hear what another player is doing.
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by Johnny Jay
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
This isn't exactly correct. I've been a session regular at Mullies for about 4 years now and I've found it quite welcoming. The way it works is that generally when a band is booked they are paid to play the evenings of the Thursday through the Sunday. They perform Thursday, Friday, and Saturday and then are meant to take part in the session Sunday, not actually perform their sents then (though i think those acts that are a bit less tune oriented do sometimes end up playing the sets they worked up, that may be true on occasion). However I would say between 1/3 to 1/2 of the time there is no band booked for the sunday and instead its just the locals. Mind you, the standard most of the locals play at is quite high (and I for one appreciate that), but I've never found the attitude arrogant or unwelcoming, and in my experience there have been loads of circumstances when beginners and intermediate players join. The wednesday sessions are more of a new thing, but are also generally at a high standard (e.g., Dave Munnelly and Martin McGinley will be around this evening).
Anyhow, good luck organizing an intermediate session as well, the more the merrier!
Rob
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by RobBBQ
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
I know the pub you mean, John. The hole of acoustic death. I don't think the miked up session thing works, as only a couple people get the mikes, even if they are the hangy down ones, and you basically get the regulars doing their regular, miked up sets, and the only thing you can contribute to such a place is just playing along to the ones you know while not being able to hear what you're playing.
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by DrSilverSpear
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
It's more like having a baby monitor in Mulligans back room than a band mike. And if you're in the back room, you can't hear it so it doesn't affect your playing or listening. From the front bar, it sounds somewhat unbalanced toward some instruments and in the background. Just like any session does. I'm talking from memory so maybe RobBBQ can clarify but I think you're making it sound a bigger deal than it really is.
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by Bren
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
It may not be that big a deal in Mulligans but it can be in many other places including the one to which I was referring...
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by Johnny Jay
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
Yeah, Bren has it right, its more that they are hanging a few mics over the session so that it can be heard in the back smoking room. It isn't at all a mic'd gig with the name "session" on it.
The plus at Mullies is that *most* of the time they are booking quite good musicians, so that the sundays when out of towners are in playing you are actually in for a treat rather than the opposite (though the "wild rover" evenings have happened on very rare occasion). You get the lads over from Belfast, then the next week from Cork, then the next week from Mayo and maybe from Scotland or Brittany every now and again and etc. I think for the most part it works really well.
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by RobBBQ
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
As the owner of Mulligans, I must say that I'm surprised to be the centre of all this attention. Secondly I must say though, that between all of you, you're not very easy to please! acoustic, not-acoustic, local musicians, traveling musicians, band-members, no-band members, back room, front bar..... I think if there was a bar that could please you all, they deserve a medal!
Just to set a few things right: There is an open Session every sunday from ± 19.00, which is mainly instrumental lead by a few musicians, who can be either local or traveling bands that are over, it's usually 50 % of each, each month. The level is quite high, as we like to please the listeners as well, but it's open for everybody; we get children joining as well at times. The sunday sessions have been there since 1988.
Since early this year we also have a back room session on a wednesday from ± 21.00, which is -as no surprise , in the back room. This is more a singing session, acoustic, and perhaps a bit easier to join in for less advanced musicians or people that just like to sing. Unlike the sunday sessions, which are mainly Irish, we had Scottish songs, French songs, Croation songs, Beatles and all sorts on wednesdays.
As for people with comments on "tacky Guinness signs etc., you've obviously never even been inside.. so no comment.
Further more, anybody with any other initiative, always welcome to come and talk to us about it.
Miriam. Mulligans.
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by mulligans
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
"This is more a singing session"
I guess we turned it into a tune session when we were there Miriam!
is it still "smoking area" in the back room?
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by Bren
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
Hi Bren, most of the time it is more a singing session, it can be a tune session as well, depending who comes in..
And yes it is still the smoking room, just like the sessions in Ireland in the good old days...
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by mulligans
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
Guys this is great banter but not really helping me! First off, I love Mulligans as a pub and it in no way complies with the stereotyped Oirish Pub cynically reeling in expats as some poster above mistakenly assumed. There must be fourteen Irish pubs in Amsterdam but only Mulligan's is the real thing. Secondly, I'm still hoping that someone will post saying they are interested in getting together for an intermediate level session. The music in Mulligan's is always wonderful to listen to, just a bit challenging to join in with if you are intermediate. Knowing that there are punters in enjoying listening to great musicians is not an great incentive for a player like myself to try and wobble through the Tarbolton Set!
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by sergeant fox
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
Anyway, it is now nine o'clock on a Wednesday night and me and the wife are about to cycle up to Mulligans to enjoy listening to the session. I'll be wearing a black and white shirt if anyone there wants to continue this discussion face to face!
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by sergeant fox
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
Ach - it was only Jack making assumptions. I wouldn't worry about that.
In fact, with this new knowledge, if I ever open a pub in Edinburgh, I might call it Murphy Maguire's Shillelagh Shop on purpose!
If I ever do make it to Mulligans though I may just stick to the front bar - which is hopefully more like Ireland is now...
# Posted on June 15th 2011 by No Cause For Alarm
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
Miriam,
I also think Mulligans is a good pub and the music there is generally of high quality too. It's certainly not your typical Oirish pub as you have mentioned.
However, it's not necessarily ideal for everyone and many musicians and singers prefer a more relaxed type of environment whether they are beginners, intermediate, or even the more experienced players.
Of course, you have to do what you feel is best for your own particular pub and it's certainly not possible to please everyone. For myself, I am happy enough to accept things for what they are and would always be happy to visit there when I'm in Amsterdam.
# Posted on June 16th 2011 by Johnny Jay
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
Well in the clear light of dawn I can report that there was an absolutely stonking session in Mulligan's last night. Eight fiddlers from a workshop threw a bit of weight into the mix and led to the session spilling out into the front bar. Still hoping to hear from interested intermediate parties! And thanks for the hat Miriam!
# Posted on June 16th 2011 by sergeant fox
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
This sounds great. I'll be in with my concertina for a few tunes in the beginning of September (on the Wednesday)
# Posted on June 16th 2011 by snorre
Re: Intermediate level session Amsterdam anyone interested?
Hey all,
Allow me to introduce myself first, as I just got on here. My name is Isaac Muller, and I play quite a bit in Mulligan's. Flute to be more precise.
I believe everything there is to be mentioned about the Mulligan's session habits is said allready, but here is a note to sergeant fox: it may be a good idea to start an intermediate session here in Amsterdam, but are you aware of a few that allready exist not so fare away? There's one in Alkmaar, and there used to be one in Monickendam, not sure if it is still there. Eltjo Toorn makes an effort to list all that is going on on his website. You may find a nice session there, and otherwise it is the perfect place to advertise your own.
Have a look: http://www.eltjot.dds.nl/tcn.htm
In the meantime I am happy enough to join you for the Tarbolton set, it's been way too long.
Good luck,
Isaac.
# Posted on June 20th 2011 by Isaac Muller