There was a discussion named "Fiddletunes for Guitar" a while back. http://thesession.org/discussions/display.php/228
I gave my $.02 on what I could make of it.
Today I was trying to put some old Lute Pieces to the guitar & found that the old Lute tuning (EADF#Be) to take a lot of the work out of fretting the F# on the 4th fret on the D string. But today most "Irish" guitarists love DADGAD, but I find it limiting for a couple of reasons
I find the Major second interval between the G & A (2&3) strings to be etotally useless & secondly the chord choices available are even more limited than standard (EADGBE). But it's good for avoiding the thirds in modal tunes (which is important for backing tunes). I think the best way for playing tunes is a bozouki, ocatve mando or a cittern. I used to take the g-string off of the guitar and tune it DADAe (for playing tunes) I liked it becuase I could play the melody with the same figering (for the most part) as a fiddle/mando but could drone out the big DAD like the pipes. It sounded nice. Good luck with the tunes!
There's a mel bay book on celtic fingerstyle guitar which has a lot of carolan stuff in it amongst other things. Many of the arrangements are in DADGAD, dropped D or Orkney (low C) tunings. If you don't play fingerstyle then a good place to look for ideas on playing with a flatpick is on the flatpick-L site
Glen weisser (sp?) runs a site that has a lot of really nice pieces on it, but sticking 'DADGAD' through a search engine is probably your best bet. A lot of the DADGAD sites also carry advice on playing this type of music in standard tuning also.
You might try the book 'Traditional Irish Guitar' by Paul De Gray
OMB130 from Ossian Publications, PO Box 84, Cork
e-mail ossian@iol.ie Published 1996
There is also a tape available I believe, but I've not heard it !
(I have also got a 1989 soft back version which much the same text, but many different example tunes - I think this original version is out of print, but you may be able to get it direct from Paul De Gray, The Spa, Tralee, County Kerry)
This book explores the DADEAE 'Irish' tuning and has radically changed the way I play - I use the tuning almost exclusively for Irish tunes, since it is very similar to the Banjo/Mandolin GDAE which I normally play
It is a very nicely put together book, with excellent intro, chord diagrams, discography, etc
It covers back-up, and solo tunes, and suggests some ideas for fingerstyle playing
I would suggest Paul De Grae's book over the Glen Weiser book. Paul's a lot more in tune with Irish Trad than Weiser is. I found Weiser settings of tunes to have "untraditional" chord choices that screw up the flow of the tune, they also tend to be over harmonized.
I would suggest listening to Daithi Sproul play airs on the guitar then try to learn those pieces.
try Gavin Ralstons 'irish traditional guitar accompaniment' which deals mainly with DADGAD but also other tunings. theres also a video available to accompany the book
mac
I take my guitar to sessions and love to play a few tunes on it--not just strum Em and D. While others
like to hear it, I must admit its much harder to play at speed on guitar than fiddle or mandolin.
But I often have trouble hearing myself on guitar
in a large session, and I tend to get lost. There are'nt many tunes I can't play in standard tuning--
so don't reject it before you explore it a bit.
I have been playing guitar as my main instrument and, about a year ago switched to DADEAE tuning - and, like Derek - it has radically changed my playing Irish tunes. I have not re-tuned to standard tuning. I went to a one day class on using DADEAE taught by John Brennan of Philadelphia and was so impressed that I am a convert.
I also bought Paul DeGrae's book - but I found that just practicing using the tuning was more helpful - especially since the current book that is out is built around various tunings rather than just DADEAE.
Of particular value is his discussion of the use of alternative chords - the John Doyle Irish Rhythm Guitar video from Homespun tapes is also very good - however, Doyle uses DADGAD and is left-handed - so I find his tape is best for listening to chord changes and basis strumming patterns.
I am finally pulling out of the boom-chuck-a folk strum rut - after being severely beat up by my melody players about how inappropriate strumming patterns can make it much harder for the melody players to do their part.............
Are there others out there using DADEAE? I would be curious...........
I think it's great when a guitarist plays melody along with the rest of us, but the main reasons most of them don't is 1) it really is very hard to play on the guitar, and 2) it really is hard to hear in a noisy (or even not so noisy) session. Matt Heaton generally has his students learn to play melody on the guitar almost first off to have them study chord structure round the tunes, and encourages them to keep it up for its own sake.
But I've always loved the sound of a solo guitar -- Altan's King of the Pipers (the five part one) is what made me realize how wonderful it could sound where it came to Irish trad. If a guitarist begins playing melody in a session, I generally try not to play unless the room is very quiet (thankfully, at our session it usually is as it's a Sunday afternoon in a coffeehouse) so s/he can be heard.
What the heck! Start your own session, then. If there's no afternoon weekend sessions around where you live, it's always great to have the option, for most folks, and the local musicians will probably appreciate it.
Start with maybe three or four core players and aim at having seven or ten tops. Perhaps you could make it a slower session for people who are taking up a second instrument (and therefore already know the tunes, and are just trying to get a new instrument up to speed), like yourself.
At our session the most that's possible is a deep caffeine buzz -- no alcohol at the coffeeshop! If I had known of a pub that wouldn't mind a learner's session on a Sunday afternoon, I'd have done the session there, but our lovely folks at Small Circle in Longmont have been great to us, so we'll probably live there as long as they'll have us!
We just joined slowplayers.org (thanks Joe!). Take a look for us there!
Well, heck, Sharron, they're ALL slow tunes -- just play them slower! I'm sure you've already noted that some tunes are easier to play on the guitar than others, and that some tunes really sound nice played slowly (Miss McLeod's, for instance, sounds very sweet played slowly). King of the Pipers (the five part one) is the one that got me to love guitar solo melody stuff, so try that one! Altan plays it relaxed and swingy.
Don't give up on an afternoon session. Variety is the spice of life! If all your area has is late nights, my bet is that SOMEone besides yourself would like something earlier so as to be able to spend an evening with a loved one. Ask around. It's worth a try!
hey sharron did you ever hear of a french guitarist called pierre bensusan? some of the stuff he has composed is really nice. a favourite of mine is called La Voyage Pour l'Irlande which i find very nice if played on the bass strings. i reccommennd you go to his website- www.pierrebensusan.com
good luck
mac
A HAPPY NEW YEAR to the others at The Session and of course to you!
Another book that deals with Irish music is "The Irish DADGAD Guitar Book" by Sarah McQuaid, Ossian Pub. as well. When I started looking for their website I found they have a site in the U.S. as well: ossianusa.com. You
Jorg I don't flatpick & I think that the G-A is useless, it's a waste of strings. If your strumming chords for acc. DADGAD or DADEAE is fine, but I think standard is the hands down best for fingerstyling tunes.
"I used to take the g-string off of the guitar and tune it DADAe (for playing tunes) I liked it becuase I could play the melody with the same figering (for the most part) as a fiddle/mando but could drone out the big DAD like the pipes."
But I do admittedly know it's a cittern tuning, guitars should be tuned like guitars.
Tunes for guitar
Re: Tunes for guitar
There was a discussion named "Fiddletunes for Guitar" a while back.
http://thesession.org/discussions/display.php/228
I gave my $.02 on what I could make of it.
Today I was trying to put some old Lute Pieces to the guitar & found that the old Lute tuning (EADF#Be) to take a lot of the work out of fretting the F# on the 4th fret on the D string. But today most "Irish" guitarists love DADGAD, but I find it limiting for a couple of reasons
I find the Major second interval between the G & A (2&3) strings to be etotally useless & secondly the chord choices available are even more limited than standard (EADGBE). But it's good for avoiding the thirds in modal tunes (which is important for backing tunes). I think the best way for playing tunes is a bozouki, ocatve mando or a cittern. I used to take the g-string off of the guitar and tune it DADAe (for playing tunes) I liked it becuase I could play the melody with the same figering (for the most part) as a fiddle/mando but could drone out the big DAD like the pipes. It sounded nice. Good luck with the tunes!
# Posted on January 5th 2002 by B Rad
Re: Tunes for guitar
There's a mel bay book on celtic fingerstyle guitar which has a lot of carolan stuff in it amongst other things. Many of the arrangements are in DADGAD, dropped D or Orkney (low C) tunings. If you don't play fingerstyle then a good place to look for ideas on playing with a flatpick is on the flatpick-L site
http://www.adelphi.edu/~bradley/Flatpickle/
Flatpick L covers mainly bluegrass but there's a lot of crossover stuff in there too. Another site that you might find helpful is
http://www.pnx.com/thebrowns/jim/flatpicking/tablature.asp?page=home
(big database of tunes arranged for guitar)
Glen weisser (sp?) runs a site that has a lot of really nice pieces on it, but sticking 'DADGAD' through a search engine is probably your best bet. A lot of the DADGAD sites also carry advice on playing this type of music in standard tuning also.
Hope this is of some help
G
# Posted on January 6th 2002 by evilmouse
Re: Tunes for guitar
You might try the book 'Traditional Irish Guitar' by Paul De Gray
OMB130 from Ossian Publications, PO Box 84, Cork
e-mail ossian@iol.ie Published 1996
There is also a tape available I believe, but I've not heard it !
(I have also got a 1989 soft back version which much the same text, but many different example tunes - I think this original version is out of print, but you may be able to get it direct from Paul De Gray, The Spa, Tralee, County Kerry)
This book explores the DADEAE 'Irish' tuning and has radically changed the way I play - I use the tuning almost exclusively for Irish tunes, since it is very similar to the Banjo/Mandolin GDAE which I normally play
It is a very nicely put together book, with excellent intro, chord diagrams, discography, etc
It covers back-up, and solo tunes, and suggests some ideas for fingerstyle playing
# Posted on January 6th 2002 by Enob
Re: Tunes for guitar
I would suggest Paul De Grae's book over the Glen Weiser book. Paul's a lot more in tune with Irish Trad than Weiser is. I found Weiser settings of tunes to have "untraditional" chord choices that screw up the flow of the tune, they also tend to be over harmonized.
I would suggest listening to Daithi Sproul play airs on the guitar then try to learn those pieces.
# Posted on January 6th 2002 by B Rad
Re: Tunes for guitar
try Gavin Ralstons 'irish traditional guitar accompaniment' which deals mainly with DADGAD but also other tunings. theres also a video available to accompany the book
mac
# Posted on January 6th 2002 by mac an caman
Re: Tunes for guitar
I take my guitar to sessions and love to play a few tunes on it--not just strum Em and D. While others
like to hear it, I must admit its much harder to play at speed on guitar than fiddle or mandolin.
But I often have trouble hearing myself on guitar
in a large session, and I tend to get lost. There are'nt many tunes I can't play in standard tuning--
so don't reject it before you explore it a bit.
# Posted on January 8th 2002 by kenya
Re: Tunes for guitar
I have been playing guitar as my main instrument and, about a year ago switched to DADEAE tuning - and, like Derek - it has radically changed my playing Irish tunes. I have not re-tuned to standard tuning. I went to a one day class on using DADEAE taught by John Brennan of Philadelphia and was so impressed that I am a convert.
I also bought Paul DeGrae's book - but I found that just practicing using the tuning was more helpful - especially since the current book that is out is built around various tunings rather than just DADEAE.
Of particular value is his discussion of the use of alternative chords - the John Doyle Irish Rhythm Guitar video from Homespun tapes is also very good - however, Doyle uses DADGAD and is left-handed - so I find his tape is best for listening to chord changes and basis strumming patterns.
I am finally pulling out of the boom-chuck-a folk strum rut - after being severely beat up by my melody players about how inappropriate strumming patterns can make it much harder for the melody players to do their part.............
Are there others out there using DADEAE? I would be curious...........
Steve
# Posted on January 8th 2002 by Rice-st
Re: Tunes for guitar
I think it's great when a guitarist plays melody along with the rest of us, but the main reasons most of them don't is 1) it really is very hard to play on the guitar, and 2) it really is hard to hear in a noisy (or even not so noisy) session. Matt Heaton generally has his students learn to play melody on the guitar almost first off to have them study chord structure round the tunes, and encourages them to keep it up for its own sake.
But I've always loved the sound of a solo guitar -- Altan's King of the Pipers (the five part one) is what made me realize how wonderful it could sound where it came to Irish trad. If a guitarist begins playing melody in a session, I generally try not to play unless the room is very quiet (thankfully, at our session it usually is as it's a Sunday afternoon in a coffeehouse) so s/he can be heard.
Zina
# Posted on January 9th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Tunes for guitar
Hi Sharron:
What the heck! Start your own session, then. If there's no afternoon weekend sessions around where you live, it's always great to have the option, for most folks, and the local musicians will probably appreciate it.
Start with maybe three or four core players and aim at having seven or ten tops. Perhaps you could make it a slower session for people who are taking up a second instrument (and therefore already know the tunes, and are just trying to get a new instrument up to speed), like yourself.
At our session the most that's possible is a deep caffeine buzz -- no alcohol at the coffeeshop! If I had known of a pub that wouldn't mind a learner's session on a Sunday afternoon, I'd have done the session there, but our lovely folks at Small Circle in Longmont have been great to us, so we'll probably live there as long as they'll have us!
We just joined slowplayers.org (thanks Joe!). Take a look for us there!
Zina
# Posted on January 10th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Tunes for guitar
Well, heck, Sharron, they're ALL slow tunes -- just play them slower! I'm sure you've already noted that some tunes are easier to play on the guitar than others, and that some tunes really sound nice played slowly (Miss McLeod's, for instance, sounds very sweet played slowly). King of the Pipers (the five part one) is the one that got me to love guitar solo melody stuff, so try that one! Altan plays it relaxed and swingy.
Don't give up on an afternoon session. Variety is the spice of life! If all your area has is late nights, my bet is that SOMEone besides yourself would like something earlier so as to be able to spend an evening with a loved one. Ask around. It's worth a try!
zls
# Posted on January 10th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Tunes for guitar
hey sharron did you ever hear of a french guitarist called pierre bensusan? some of the stuff he has composed is really nice. a favourite of mine is called La Voyage Pour l'Irlande which i find very nice if played on the bass strings. i reccommennd you go to his website- www.pierrebensusan.com
good luck
mac
# Posted on January 11th 2002 by mac an caman
Re: Tunes for guitar
Hi, Sharron,
A HAPPY NEW YEAR to the others at The Session and of course to you!
Another book that deals with Irish music is "The Irish DADGAD Guitar Book" by Sarah McQuaid, Ossian Pub. as well. When I started looking for their website I found they have a site in the U.S. as well: ossianusa.com. You
# Posted on January 12th 2002 by Joerg Froese
Jorg I don't flatpick & I think that the G-A is useless, it's a waste of strings. If your strumming chords for acc. DADGAD or DADEAE is fine, but I think standard is the hands down best for fingerstyling tunes.
# Posted on January 13th 2002 by B Rad
Re: Tunes for guitar
Brad: if your tuning and playing style works for you I
# Posted on January 14th 2002 by Joerg Froese
Re: Tunes for guitar
Which brings us back to...
"I used to take the g-string off of the guitar and tune it DADAe (for playing tunes) I liked it becuase I could play the melody with the same figering (for the most part) as a fiddle/mando but could drone out the big DAD like the pipes."
But I do admittedly know it's a cittern tuning, guitars should be tuned like guitars.
# Posted on January 14th 2002 by B Rad