The Session >> Discussions >> Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Comments
Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
There is something which has been bothering me again and again for quite some time, but now I have found a website for 5string players - I won´t get into any more details - which offers beautiful tunes, information,what have you - but there is also a lot of very personal information floating around, a lot of which goes in the direction of "I have got religion and now I´m a new person", etc, which to me sounds neo-evangelical in the mode of Sarah Palin and everything that is connected with her. I know that if I met some of these people, no amount of drink could bridge the gap, and probably no amount of music-making (?). The tunes they offer and the sentiments that go with them are deep, beautiful, but I know that on any other level than the purely musical it would be completely impossible for me to relate to the people who play them - they usually seem to be heartland or Southern Americans ... Anybody else who has made a similar experience of liking the music some people make but having a hard time liking the people themselves? Maybe it´s not such a big deal anyway because these experiences are very small in number, but still ?
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Some people really like to get their "Jesus-on" as we say in my house. I have family members, and co workers who all do. I don't mind their Jesus talk at all, it's the politics... as you say... that turns me straight off. Seems we see one or two of these Jesus folks at the local session, and other than some bumper stickers, and sticking with soda and water or tea (rather than beer), they seem to keep it to themselves, they know it's just not welcome.
As for "their" music? I suppose if its just the tune you like and not the words, why not change them... (words) it's a folk music tradition!
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Yep. Not a matter of being a***holes, just having a different take on life. Don't care what anyone says, IMHO the majority of trad musicians do seem to share certain aspects of 'world view', no matter what the internal sub-divisions.
But it depends on where/how you want to play. I'm not too bothered about conflicting 'rest of the lives' of people who play sessions, other than any who become personal friends, so long as it didn't intrude on the music - but it's more important to see reasonably eye to eye with people you play with closely or regularly, for example in a band.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
alexweger, you're not the first to make this observation about so very many of the folks in this country. Heck, the first person to publish this finding may have been De Tocqueville -- a long time ago. But, have you also experienced the graciousness? The beautiful manners along with all the evangelical craziness makes for quite a combination. I get the feeling it isn't going to change any time soon. No point in getting your Darwin on; arguments with heathens and the possibility of making a religious conversion are too powerful a distraction from playing music.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
I think it is pretty shallow to judge people or not be friends with someone due to their religious or political outlook. I am a black sheep at my session when it comes to politics. I know my political views are probably different from everyone else at the session, but we all get along greatly. I have good friends from sessions that are Christian, Pagan, Wiccan, Atheist, or anything else, you name it.
My advice is don't talk politics or religion, it will always ruin relationships. No matter how open minded people claim to be, sometimes those are the most close minded.
Plus, I live in the Southern American part of the US now, and I can tell you that they are some of the friendliest people I have ever met. If they don't treat you differently for your views, then you should at least make an attempt to be their friends.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
If I remember right, Alan Lomax once spent a week collecting gospel songs in a small town in the American South. Great stuff. It was only when he was packing up to go that they started talking to him about the lynchings they'd done.
What I find equally disturbing is some kinds of personal stuff. There are musicians that have made self-destruction by alcohol into a personal religion just as fervent and unshakeable as any fundamentalist sect.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
>>There are musicians that have made self-destruction by alcohol into a personal religion
There's something in the artistic spirit in many who make music that also makes them prone to being afflicted by the soulful side of life. You can't make emotional music unless you are affected (afflicted?) by emotion itself. It doesn't always channel itself as constructively as music...
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
I thought that a rather flowery, heart-on-sleeve presentation of one's own (or someone else's) credentials and worldview was pretty standard American publicity material, and didn't vary so much from one part of the country to another!
As a Brit, I gulped at some of these at first. Then, after seeing more, I came to the conclusion:
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
@ Atahualpa Q: Yes, I have experienced the graciousness, definitely... staying with people in the American South, and in Arkansas. Maybe I´m making things too difficult for myself in this respect: I´ve always liked the music - the lonesome fiddle tunes - and I always will, and somebody else here was right: there are always occasions where you make music with people whose views on other things you don´t share.. and so you should be sensible and just stick to the music. Even in some of your friends there might be some sides you´re not too happy about, and you stick with them nevertheless...
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Sometimes I'd rather play music than talk. However, I do like to hear what people think, it's another form of expression. Sometimes only slightly, though sometimes very expressive ~ even without words;
In case you're wondering, the image was later used for a T shirt w/a different slogan: "American by birth. Southern by the grace of god." I prefer the original, from Cash himself. The latter doesn't make sense. ;)
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
If someone gets too religious and tries to push something on you, just state your own beliefs, or lack thereof, and usually they will move on to another target. In some areas, there seems to be a 'scalp-hunting' mentality, and I have heard people brag about how many souls they personally have 'saved,' which I find rather arrogant and distasteful.
In some parts of the USA, Democrats are thin on the ground, while up here in New England, we only occasionally have anyone with Republican tendencies playing in the circle. We often chat about things other than music, but there seems to be an unwritten consensusat the session that, if it appears divisive, we change the subject, or play a tune and move on.
Now down at the bar, that is where the heated political and religious discussions take place!
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
i dont care what your take on life is. i just be quite up front with people from the outset, and i dont push my view on life on them. i only ask that they do the same. if they dont i ask politely to leave it, and if they still dont i walk away. i think mutual respect is a great benefit for playing music with others. personally i dont care for religion at all, but that wouldnt stop me enjoying somebodys company who is religious. i have a few quite fanatical friends. i quite like the conversation when they are open minded. i think its blown out of proportion these days. just dont bless me!
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
I remember years ago, a delightful young girl and superb whistle player. I saw her hand the Comhalthas set of pipes back to the club secretary. When asked why, she gave the reply :-
"Because I'm going to become a nun"
I was the only person that laughed.
I was'nt being ignorant, honest, it was just a shock to me. We English don't do that sort of thing, well, its not something we hear about every day. It was a culture thing.
I don't mind other people practicing what ever main stream religion they like (I do draw the line at wierdo sects). The thing I will not stand is other people trying to inflict their beliefs on me. Having said that, they hardly ever do.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Well they should...play the pipes, not drink too much, but whatever.
You can come across both religious and political evangelical types in all sorts of situations. It's never comfortable, no matter what they are selling, be it liberal, conservative, theistic or atheistic. You'd think humans would have more social sense than that.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
I have a sister-in-law (one of my wife's sisters) who really likes to "get her Jesus on"(thank you SandyBottoms). Her primary goal in this life seems to be trying to impose her religious beliefs as a way of life on all of her immediate family members (such as myself).
I have heard her sing many times and she is a good singer. However, she will only sing and/or listen to "Contemporary Christian Music" and nothing else.
One day, when my sister-in-law was riding with us in my car, my wife and I were listening to a CD of Southern Gospel music which I had recently given to my wife as a birthday present because I know my wife likes that type of music. Although it was Christian music, my sister-in-law objected to listening to it because it was "old" and "dead" and it wasn't "contemporary". She wanted us to take the CD out of the player and turn on the radio so she could listen to her own special brand of Christian music. She pouted and became unhappy when both my wife and myself refused to stop listening to the Southern Gospel CD.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
There are some musicians at the local session whom I enjoy making music with but I don't like them because they don't think I am a good enough musician to be invited to perform on a stage in front of an audience with them.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
I'll take down-to-earth, working class people, farmers or hillbillies over a s s h o l e s like nicholas any day. As far as playing music goes I couldn't care less what world view you espouse as long as you're not a dumb bigot...
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
"Getting my Jesus on" - what a lovely expression. I must try and get away with using it in my next sermon (that's the bit inbetween fiddle tunes and service on Sunday evenings) !
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Just before Christmas I had an agreeable conversation at the door with an affable fellow who was trying to persuade me to buy some Eastern religious literature. He was dressed appropriately for the sub-zero temperature in an anorak, jeans etc, but had an orange mark painted on his forehead. As we parted he called out something and I called back "Merry Christmas!". It was only when I'd closed the door that I realized he hadn't said "Merry Christmas", but "Hare Khrishna".
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Way back I had a friend who use to play with a ceili band in the Donegal area of Ireland. He told me that the leader of the band always insisted on the band reciting 'The Rosary' on the way to a gig. Nice gesture don't you think....?
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Okay, Ben, I will put that horse out to pasture in the Back Forty but only here on The Session.org
While I am playing around on Facebook, I may point out that specific horse in the pasture to someone else.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
I think playing music is like being at work. I'm not lucky enough to have an endless inexhaustible choice of sessions to go to so my attitude is that I'm there for a tune first and foremost, not specifically to make friends.
One session I sometimes go to has a handful of fairly diverse people who often turn up. The dropped out hippy to the local primary school head, the cadger and the grafter. When a good tune is on the go even sworn enemies can become kindred spirits for the moment. Thats what I like about going out for a tune, the inclusiveness.
I'll have no truck with anything that messes with my inclusiveness mojo; religion sex politics personal issues cudgels dirks and side-arms should be left at the door to enable people to find their common ground.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
The rest of my band is quite religious and plays music in church on special occasions once or twice a year. I refuse to but that has never been a problem. The trouble starts when people try to convert you.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
I agree with you, Solidmahog. There are some on this site, however, who appear not to believe in that inclusiveness and would, according to what they've said on other threads, refuse to play with some people, eg with committed Christians.
Personally, in a session, for all I know I could be sat next to an axe murderer. I don't care, as long as he doesn't try to play my axe.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Aye ........... & there are some who think all Christians should be committed!
But seriously, I do read that kind of Holy Joe stuff regularly on one American based music forum I visit now & then & I must admit, it does make me squirm a bit.
However, I must say, I've been amongst a number of pretty staunch believers at sessions & don't remember any of them ever spoiling a session by trying to ram the holy stuff down our throats.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
There was a born again evangelist twanger who lived in a caravan along the road from me, Ted. Nice enough bloke but never missed an opportunity to attempt to save my soul. There would often be tunes in my house at all hours and lasting for a couple of days at times back in the day, and he'd call with his guitar and sing us a few holy Joe songs.
Unfortunately my inclusiveness policy failed with Ted due to his Christian prudishness and on account of my unchristian like life style. One of my pals told him where to get off with the songs and he stopped calling. He has a council house now and evangelises to his neighbours.
Yes EB, provided it's kept to ones self I don't get to precious about who I get a tune with, and provided it's tunes and not pap or hymns psalms or what have you I've no problem.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Just don't bring up religion or politics. I play with three very conservative guys and I am more "liberal" in their eyes. We still enjoy making music and connecting on other levels. We just don't bring up religion or politics and, if we do, we make a point not to argue about it.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Easy to pretend you're tolerant when you surround yourself with people who share your opinions. I've a good friend who regularly tells me that I'm going to Hell because I don't believe in Christ and that my wife and kids will be going to hell because they are Catholic (the whore of babylon in his opinion). He's a good guy, funny as hell, great musician, not preachy at all but has a very different religious view than me. We've been friends for over 25 years. I could care less what his religious views are-- we shall all find out soon enough what the truth is!
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
This here made me think. (I'm not trying to insult anybody or provoke.)
"Good people can do good things without religion.
Bad people can do bad things without religion.
But to make good people do bad things you need religion."
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Good people can also do good things with religion. Something many people seem to forget. And people do a lot of bad stuff without religion. The world makes no sense and the sooner we all realise that the better we'll be. Then we can maybe start looking for real solutions to peaceful existance.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
I just read this read this by Robert Henri.
“We build up our religion upon the lives of the freest men that ever lived, the men who refused all limitations , all boundaries, all race kinship, all family ties; and then we circumscribe our religion until the power that comes from the organisation blinds and binds its adherents. We would circumscribe our music, we would limit the expression of our painter, we would curb our sculpture, we would have a fixed form for our poet if we could. Fortunately, however, the great, significant, splendid impulse for beauty can force its way through any boundary.”
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
A guy dies and goes to heaven. It is a slow day, so Saint Peter offers to personally lead him to his appointed spot. They pass an area surrounded by high walls, and the man hears hymns being sung inside. Saint Peter has him take off his shoes, and two of them tiptoe past the door. As they move away from the area, the man asks, "What was all that about?" Saint Peter replies, "That is where we keep the fundamentalists. We don't want to spoil things for them by letting them know the rest of you are here!"
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Just what I've always wanted to do, swig strychnine and garland myself with rattlesnakes in church. I saw this once on TV, going on somewhere in Tennessee or that part of the world, and I couldn't believe it!
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Ben Steen --Nothing fake about those snake handling, strychnine gulping churches. People die doing it. Those people are hardcore! When someone is bitten and dies they just figure the victim wasn't a true believer! It's a different world....
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Some years ago I was in an ad hoc orchestra for a concert in a local church. At the first rehearsal, the conductor, an earnest sort of chap whom I'd never come across before, just before we started asked us all to stand up and bow out heads while he said a short prayer for God's help in our music making. I wasn't the only one who felt embarrassed in that unexpected situation.
OK, let's get less serious a moment ...
A couple of orchestral musicians were discussing their new conductor during a take-five in their first rehearsal.
Said one, "What's the difference between a Conductor and God?
Second musician: "I dunno."
First musician: "God knows he's not a Conductor".
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Yes, Ptarmigan, all Christians (such as myself) should be committed because we are all CRAZY.
No where in the Bible does it say we aren't allowed to enjoy ourselves and have fun occasionally by doing something we like such as playing secular music with some friends in a bar or restaurant. The problem supposedly starts if having too much fun is your primary objective or pupose in life.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Some people, like my sister-in-law, take their religion too seriously and cannot allow themselves to have any fun with it. You should try to use a more balanced viewpoint or perspective and not take it so serioulsy all of the time.
For many years, one of my favorite songs has been the one that starts:
"My name is Jesus, the son of God.
I come from heaven to save your bod.
Our names are Mathew, Mark, Luke, and John.
We wrote the Gospels to put you on.
My name is Moses, just call me Mo.
I carve stone tablets, ten cents a throw."
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Some people become like robots with their religion; others
stay human. I find the people in group 1 to be pretty scary and
I don't care what religion they are-- it's the robotic quality that's
worrying - the detachment from the real world of cause and effect.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
"Does hedonism count as a religion?" TSS.
Jings there's a thought , I may not be a total prophet but I may be remembered as a disciple if I'm not careful. Mind, if I were to be sanctified I'd have my shrine in a shabeen that was session friendly, promise.
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
AlBrown, there are four uninterrupted posts from me because I was at work and it was a very slow day. I volunteered to work overtime in the SICU and since it was only half-full, there almost nothing for me to do except answer the telephone on the rare occasions when it rang. I had too much time on my hands like in that song by Styx.
Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
There is something which has been bothering me again and again for quite some time, but now I have found a website for 5string players - I won´t get into any more details - which offers beautiful tunes, information,what have you - but there is also a lot of very personal information floating around, a lot of which goes in the direction of "I have got religion and now I´m a new person", etc, which to me sounds neo-evangelical in the mode of Sarah Palin and everything that is connected with her. I know that if I met some of these people, no amount of drink could bridge the gap, and probably no amount of music-making (?). The tunes they offer and the sentiments that go with them are deep, beautiful, but I know that on any other level than the purely musical it would be completely impossible for me to relate to the people who play them - they usually seem to be heartland or Southern Americans ... Anybody else who has made a similar experience of liking the music some people make but having a hard time liking the people themselves? Maybe it´s not such a big deal anyway because these experiences are very small in number, but still ?
# Posted on January 22nd 2011 by alexweger
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Some people really like to get their "Jesus-on" as we say in my house. I have family members, and co workers who all do. I don't mind their Jesus talk at all, it's the politics... as you say... that turns me straight off. Seems we see one or two of these Jesus folks at the local session, and other than some bumper stickers, and sticking with soda and water or tea (rather than beer), they seem to keep it to themselves, they know it's just not welcome.
As for "their" music? I suppose if its just the tune you like and not the words, why not change them... (words) it's a folk music tradition!
# Posted on January 22nd 2011 by SandyBottoms
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
"Anybody else who has made a similar experience of liking the music some people make but having a hard time liking the people themselves?"
Yep. I'm sure there's plenty of fantastic musicians who are absolute arseholes, it doesn't mean I'd think any less of their music.
# Posted on January 22nd 2011 by Tom.M
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Yep. Not a matter of being a***holes, just having a different take on life. Don't care what anyone says, IMHO the majority of trad musicians do seem to share certain aspects of 'world view', no matter what the internal sub-divisions.
But it depends on where/how you want to play. I'm not too bothered about conflicting 'rest of the lives' of people who play sessions, other than any who become personal friends, so long as it didn't intrude on the music - but it's more important to see reasonably eye to eye with people you play with closely or regularly, for example in a band.
Something I too am trying to sort out at present.
Ian
# Posted on January 22nd 2011 by ian stock
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
alexweger, you're not the first to make this observation about so very many of the folks in this country. Heck, the first person to publish this finding may have been De Tocqueville -- a long time ago. But, have you also experienced the graciousness? The beautiful manners along with all the evangelical craziness makes for quite a combination. I get the feeling it isn't going to change any time soon. No point in getting your Darwin on; arguments with heathens and the possibility of making a religious conversion are too powerful a distraction from playing music.
# Posted on January 22nd 2011 by Atahualpa Quigley
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
I think it is pretty shallow to judge people or not be friends with someone due to their religious or political outlook. I am a black sheep at my session when it comes to politics. I know my political views are probably different from everyone else at the session, but we all get along greatly. I have good friends from sessions that are Christian, Pagan, Wiccan, Atheist, or anything else, you name it.
My advice is don't talk politics or religion, it will always ruin relationships. No matter how open minded people claim to be, sometimes those are the most close minded.
Plus, I live in the Southern American part of the US now, and I can tell you that they are some of the friendliest people I have ever met. If they don't treat you differently for your views, then you should at least make an attempt to be their friends.
# Posted on January 22nd 2011 by pipersgrip
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
If I remember right, Alan Lomax once spent a week collecting gospel songs in a small town in the American South. Great stuff. It was only when he was packing up to go that they started talking to him about the lynchings they'd done.
What I find equally disturbing is some kinds of personal stuff. There are musicians that have made self-destruction by alcohol into a personal religion just as fervent and unshakeable as any fundamentalist sect.
# Posted on January 22nd 2011 by Jack Campin
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
>>There are musicians that have made self-destruction by alcohol into a personal religion
There's something in the artistic spirit in many who make music that also makes them prone to being afflicted by the soulful side of life. You can't make emotional music unless you are affected (afflicted?) by emotion itself. It doesn't always channel itself as constructively as music...
# Posted on January 22nd 2011 by ian stock
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
I thought that a rather flowery, heart-on-sleeve presentation of one's own (or someone else's) credentials and worldview was pretty standard American publicity material, and didn't vary so much from one part of the country to another!
As a Brit, I gulped at some of these at first. Then, after seeing more, I came to the conclusion:
"IT'S THE CULTURE, STOOPID!! "
# Posted on January 22nd 2011 by nicholas
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
@ Atahualpa Q: Yes, I have experienced the graciousness, definitely... staying with people in the American South, and in Arkansas. Maybe I´m making things too difficult for myself in this respect: I´ve always liked the music - the lonesome fiddle tunes - and I always will, and somebody else here was right: there are always occasions where you make music with people whose views on other things you don´t share.. and so you should be sensible and just stick to the music. Even in some of your friends there might be some sides you´re not too happy about, and you stick with them nevertheless...
# Posted on January 22nd 2011 by alexweger
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Sometimes I'd rather play music than talk. However, I do like to hear what people think, it's another form of expression. Sometimes only slightly, though sometimes very expressive ~ even without words;
Fair warning: *some may not want to view the following image.*
http://kuoi.com/~kamikaze/Audio/images/cash-ad.jpg
In case you're wondering, the image was later used for a T shirt w/a different slogan: "American by birth. Southern by the grace of god." I prefer the original, from Cash himself. The latter doesn't make sense. ;)
# Posted on January 22nd 2011 by Ben Steen
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
If someone gets too religious and tries to push something on you, just state your own beliefs, or lack thereof, and usually they will move on to another target. In some areas, there seems to be a 'scalp-hunting' mentality, and I have heard people brag about how many souls they personally have 'saved,' which I find rather arrogant and distasteful.
In some parts of the USA, Democrats are thin on the ground, while up here in New England, we only occasionally have anyone with Republican tendencies playing in the circle. We often chat about things other than music, but there seems to be an unwritten consensusat the session that, if it appears divisive, we change the subject, or play a tune and move on.
Now down at the bar, that is where the heated political and religious discussions take place!
# Posted on January 22nd 2011 by AlBrown
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
The thought just struck me how grand it would be to meet someone from the Church of Christ & corrupt them with a few lessons on tinwhistle.
# Posted on January 22nd 2011 by Ben Steen
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
i dont care what your take on life is. i just be quite up front with people from the outset, and i dont push my view on life on them. i only ask that they do the same. if they dont i ask politely to leave it, and if they still dont i walk away. i think mutual respect is a great benefit for playing music with others. personally i dont care for religion at all, but that wouldnt stop me enjoying somebodys company who is religious. i have a few quite fanatical friends. i quite like the conversation when they are open minded. i think its blown out of proportion these days. just dont bless me!
# Posted on January 22nd 2011 by christofloffer
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
I remember years ago, a delightful young girl and superb whistle player. I saw her hand the Comhalthas set of pipes back to the club secretary. When asked why, she gave the reply :-
"Because I'm going to become a nun"
I was the only person that laughed.
I was'nt being ignorant, honest, it was just a shock to me. We English don't do that sort of thing, well, its not something we hear about every day. It was a culture thing.
I don't mind other people practicing what ever main stream religion they like (I do draw the line at wierdo sects). The thing I will not stand is other people trying to inflict their beliefs on me. Having said that, they hardly ever do.
# Posted on January 22nd 2011 by ormepipes
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
You always hear of the fiddling father or the fluting vicar, why not the piping nun? She should have done both.
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
SWFL
I know, my pipes drove me to drink, rather than God. She should have done both. Maybe she did later on in life, I hope so !
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by ormepipes
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Swiff, I think it's just the initiation. They usually sneak away, following lights out, to have a pint, a smoke, & squeeze the bellows.
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by Ben Steen
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Arkansas, alexweger, where is that?
Laurence
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by fauxcelt
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Well they should...play the pipes, not drink too much, but whatever.
You can come across both religious and political evangelical types in all sorts of situations. It's never comfortable, no matter what they are selling, be it liberal, conservative, theistic or atheistic. You'd think humans would have more social sense than that.
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by SWFL Fiddler
Pay attention, now
If this weren't on the internet you'd only have this one chance ...
Explaining trinity - Nuns on the Run
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlOv3ZSqjfo
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by Ben Steen
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
I have a sister-in-law (one of my wife's sisters) who really likes to "get her Jesus on"(thank you SandyBottoms). Her primary goal in this life seems to be trying to impose her religious beliefs as a way of life on all of her immediate family members (such as myself).
I have heard her sing many times and she is a good singer. However, she will only sing and/or listen to "Contemporary Christian Music" and nothing else.
One day, when my sister-in-law was riding with us in my car, my wife and I were listening to a CD of Southern Gospel music which I had recently given to my wife as a birthday present because I know my wife likes that type of music. Although it was Christian music, my sister-in-law objected to listening to it because it was "old" and "dead" and it wasn't "contemporary". She wanted us to take the CD out of the player and turn on the radio so she could listen to her own special brand of Christian music. She pouted and became unhappy when both my wife and myself refused to stop listening to the Southern Gospel CD.
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by fauxcelt
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
There are some musicians at the local session whom I enjoy making music with but I don't like them because they don't think I am a good enough musician to be invited to perform on a stage in front of an audience with them.
Laurence
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by fauxcelt
Laurence, are you still riding that old pony? Someday you may consider turning her to pasture, or not. ;)
So many tunes, so little time.
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by Ben Steen
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
I'll take down-to-earth, working class people, farmers or hillbillies over a s s h o l e s like nicholas any day. As far as playing music goes I couldn't care less what world view you espouse as long as you're not a dumb bigot...
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by shanty
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
"Getting my Jesus on" - what a lovely expression. I must try and get away with using it in my next sermon (that's the bit inbetween fiddle tunes and service on Sunday evenings) !
Thanks Folks!
Chris B.
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by Ebor_fiddler
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Just before Christmas I had an agreeable conversation at the door with an affable fellow who was trying to persuade me to buy some Eastern religious literature. He was dressed appropriately for the sub-zero temperature in an anorak, jeans etc, but had an orange mark painted on his forehead. As we parted he called out something and I called back "Merry Christmas!". It was only when I'd closed the door that I realized he hadn't said "Merry Christmas", but "Hare Khrishna".
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by Trevor Jennings
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
I only play with pagans. Here in Kernow you have no choice. Fortunately, I happen to be of their persuasion!
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by Steve Shaw
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Way back I had a friend who use to play with a ceili band in the Donegal area of Ireland. He told me that the leader of the band always insisted on the band reciting 'The Rosary' on the way to a gig. Nice gesture don't you think....?
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by Free Reed
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
It's amazing how much music teaches us forgiveness for those who play well, and intolerance for those who don't!
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by fidkid
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Okay, Ben, I will put that horse out to pasture in the Back Forty but only here on The Session.org
While I am playing around on Facebook, I may point out that specific horse in the pasture to someone else.
Laurence
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by fauxcelt
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Good one, fidkid.
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by Bob himself
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
I think playing music is like being at work. I'm not lucky enough to have an endless inexhaustible choice of sessions to go to so my attitude is that I'm there for a tune first and foremost, not specifically to make friends.
One session I sometimes go to has a handful of fairly diverse people who often turn up. The dropped out hippy to the local primary school head, the cadger and the grafter. When a good tune is on the go even sworn enemies can become kindred spirits for the moment. Thats what I like about going out for a tune, the inclusiveness.
I'll have no truck with anything that messes with my inclusiveness mojo; religion sex politics personal issues cudgels dirks and side-arms should be left at the door to enable people to find their common ground.
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by Solidmahog
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
The rest of my band is quite religious and plays music in church on special occasions once or twice a year. I refuse to but that has never been a problem. The trouble starts when people try to convert you.
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by kuec
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
I agree with you, Solidmahog. There are some on this site, however, who appear not to believe in that inclusiveness and would, according to what they've said on other threads, refuse to play with some people, eg with committed Christians.
Personally, in a session, for all I know I could be sat next to an axe murderer. I don't care, as long as he doesn't try to play my axe.
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by ethical blend
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Aye ........... & there are some who think all Christians should be committed!
But seriously, I do read that kind of Holy Joe stuff regularly on one American based music forum I visit now & then & I must admit, it does make me squirm a bit.
However, I must say, I've been amongst a number of pretty staunch believers at sessions & don't remember any of them ever spoiling a session by trying to ram the holy stuff down our throats.
Cheers
Dick
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by Ptarmigan
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
What about apathetic agnostics? Don't know and don't care.
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by DrSilverSpear
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
There was a born again evangelist twanger who lived in a caravan along the road from me, Ted. Nice enough bloke but never missed an opportunity to attempt to save my soul. There would often be tunes in my house at all hours and lasting for a couple of days at times back in the day, and he'd call with his guitar and sing us a few holy Joe songs.
Unfortunately my inclusiveness policy failed with Ted due to his Christian prudishness and on account of my unchristian like life style. One of my pals told him where to get off with the songs and he stopped calling. He has a council house now and evangelises to his neighbours.
Yes EB, provided it's kept to ones self I don't get to precious about who I get a tune with, and provided it's tunes and not pap or hymns psalms or what have you I've no problem.
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by Solidmahog
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Thank God I'm an atheist, that's all I can say.
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by Steve Shaw
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Just don't bring up religion or politics. I play with three very conservative guys and I am more "liberal" in their eyes. We still enjoy making music and connecting on other levels. We just don't bring up religion or politics and, if we do, we make a point not to argue about it.
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by Fiddlechick7
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
And, in case you're wondering where I stand on it (though why would you be?), and since Steve has started wheeling out the old ones ...
... I used to be agnostic, but now I'm not so sure ...
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by ethical blend
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Easy to pretend you're tolerant when you surround yourself with people who share your opinions. I've a good friend who regularly tells me that I'm going to Hell because I don't believe in Christ and that my wife and kids will be going to hell because they are Catholic (the whore of babylon in his opinion). He's a good guy, funny as hell, great musician, not preachy at all but has a very different religious view than me. We've been friends for over 25 years. I could care less what his religious views are-- we shall all find out soon enough what the truth is!
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by shanty
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
In the fullness of time, we should hope. Planning to commit some outrage? (smiley emoticon)
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by Atahualpa Quigley
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Thank God for religion, I say. All that lovely music! All those paintings and buildings! And the wars! Well, maybe not the wars...
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by gam
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Drink and dance and laugh and lie
The reeling midnight through
For tomorrow we shall die
But, alas, we never do
but we will soon enough....
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by shanty
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
This here made me think. (I'm not trying to insult anybody or provoke.)
"Good people can do good things without religion.
Bad people can do bad things without religion.
But to make good people do bad things you need religion."
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by kuec
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Good people can also do good things with religion. Something many people seem to forget. And people do a lot of bad stuff without religion. The world makes no sense and the sooner we all realise that the better we'll be. Then we can maybe start looking for real solutions to peaceful existance.
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by shanty
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Peace there, shanty! Sorry if I offended.
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by nicholas
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Apology not accepted untill you say three Hail Marry's, handle the rattlesnakes and take a swig of the strychnine....
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by shanty
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
I just read this read this by Robert Henri.
“We build up our religion upon the lives of the freest men that ever lived, the men who refused all limitations , all boundaries, all race kinship, all family ties; and then we circumscribe our religion until the power that comes from the organisation blinds and binds its adherents. We would circumscribe our music, we would limit the expression of our painter, we would curb our sculpture, we would have a fixed form for our poet if we could. Fortunately, however, the great, significant, splendid impulse for beauty can force its way through any boundary.”
Here’s to the splendid impulse.
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by Eòsaph
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
A guy dies and goes to heaven. It is a slow day, so Saint Peter offers to personally lead him to his appointed spot. They pass an area surrounded by high walls, and the man hears hymns being sung inside. Saint Peter has him take off his shoes, and two of them tiptoe past the door. As they move away from the area, the man asks, "What was all that about?" Saint Peter replies, "That is where we keep the fundamentalists. We don't want to spoil things for them by letting them know the rest of you are here!"
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by AlBrown
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Just what I've always wanted to do, swig strychnine and garland myself with rattlesnakes in church. I saw this once on TV, going on somewhere in Tennessee or that part of the world, and I couldn't believe it!
# Posted on January 23rd 2011 by nicholas
"I saw this once on TV ... and I couldn't believe it"
Think about it.
# Posted on January 24th 2011 by Ben Steen
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
The other day I saw four blokes carrrying a coffin round a graveyard for three hours.
"I reckon those blokes have lost the plot," I thought to myself.
# Posted on January 24th 2011 by Steve Shaw
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Ben Steen --Nothing fake about those snake handling, strychnine gulping churches. People die doing it. Those people are hardcore! When someone is bitten and dies they just figure the victim wasn't a true believer! It's a different world....
# Posted on January 24th 2011 by shanty
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Some years ago I was in an ad hoc orchestra for a concert in a local church. At the first rehearsal, the conductor, an earnest sort of chap whom I'd never come across before, just before we started asked us all to stand up and bow out heads while he said a short prayer for God's help in our music making. I wasn't the only one who felt embarrassed in that unexpected situation.
OK, let's get less serious a moment ...
A couple of orchestral musicians were discussing their new conductor during a take-five in their first rehearsal.
Said one, "What's the difference between a Conductor and God?
Second musician: "I dunno."
First musician: "God knows he's not a Conductor".
# Posted on January 24th 2011 by Trevor Jennings
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
AlBrown, my sister-in-law would definitely be one of the "fundamentalists" in the area in heaven which was enclosed by the high walls.
Laurence
# Posted on January 24th 2011 by fauxcelt
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Yes, Ptarmigan, all Christians (such as myself) should be committed because we are all CRAZY.
No where in the Bible does it say we aren't allowed to enjoy ourselves and have fun occasionally by doing something we like such as playing secular music with some friends in a bar or restaurant. The problem supposedly starts if having too much fun is your primary objective or pupose in life.
Laurence
# Posted on January 24th 2011 by fauxcelt
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Some people, like my sister-in-law, take their religion too seriously and cannot allow themselves to have any fun with it. You should try to use a more balanced viewpoint or perspective and not take it so serioulsy all of the time.
For many years, one of my favorite songs has been the one that starts:
"My name is Jesus, the son of God.
I come from heaven to save your bod.
Our names are Mathew, Mark, Luke, and John.
We wrote the Gospels to put you on.
My name is Moses, just call me Mo.
I carve stone tablets, ten cents a throw."
Laurence
# Posted on January 24th 2011 by fauxcelt
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
God preserve me from these fools who take their religion much too seriously.
Laurence
# Posted on January 24th 2011 by fauxcelt
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
I love this scene:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dG9tuuznL1Y
# Posted on January 24th 2011 by fidkid
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Some people become like robots with their religion; others
stay human. I find the people in group 1 to be pretty scary and
I don't care what religion they are-- it's the robotic quality that's
worrying - the detachment from the real world of cause and effect.
# Posted on January 24th 2011 by Hup
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Uh oh, fauxcelt, four posts from you uninterrupted by a reply from someone else. A sure sign that you need a break from Mustardland!!!
# Posted on January 24th 2011 by AlBrown
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
"What about apathetic agnostics? Don't know and don't care." Och, they're just Atheists who are afraid to stand up for what they .. Don't believe in!
# Posted on January 24th 2011 by Ptarmigan
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Religion. I just dont get it.
# Posted on January 24th 2011 by harmonic miner
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Does hedonism count as a religion?
# Posted on January 24th 2011 by DrSilverSpear
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
"Does hedonism count as a religion?" TSS.
Jings there's a thought , I may not be a total prophet but I may be remembered as a disciple if I'm not careful. Mind, if I were to be sanctified I'd have my shrine in a shabeen that was session friendly, promise.
# Posted on January 24th 2011 by Solidmahog
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
'Does hedonism count as a religion?'
Most certainly. I can't get through the day without at least a couple of Dionysian romps.
# Posted on January 24th 2011 by MacCruiskeen
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
AlBrown, there are four uninterrupted posts from me because I was at work and it was a very slow day. I volunteered to work overtime in the SICU and since it was only half-full, there almost nothing for me to do except answer the telephone on the rare occasions when it rang. I had too much time on my hands like in that song by Styx.
Laurence
# Posted on January 24th 2011 by fauxcelt
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Unintentionally hilarious correspondence between a school chaplain and parent - certainly not a meeting of minds!
http://www.27bslash6.com/easter.html
# Posted on January 25th 2011 by Trevor Jennings
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
ha, that's priceless
# Posted on January 25th 2011 by ...
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Michael, a brief web search for Pikkiwoki uncovered
http://unreasonablefaith.com/2010/03/18/daryl-the-christian-volunteer/, which has comments worth reading about that email correspondence.
# Posted on January 25th 2011 by Trevor Jennings
Re: Making a difference between the music and the people who play it ??
Ah, the whole www.27bslash6.com site is hilarious!
Many thanks for the original link, Trevor.
# Posted on January 25th 2011 by MacCruiskeen