I was recently playing for a community dance and was asked to play some waltzes when I realized, Kripes!! I only play a scant few. So, I've been exploring more waltzes to learn and found (amongst others) The Waterford Waltz. I'm enjoying getting to know it. It has a part that includes top D on the pipes and I'm actually able to make it work. Very exciting if you know what top D on the pipes is all about.
I've been looking at old threads about them. I must learn Thom Bhettys. I thought maybe a thread about current waltz status might be of benefit.
I'm interested to hear what some of your favorite waltzes to play are. I sure don't hear them much at sessions. Does your session ever play very many waltzes? Or are they more appreciated by the folks who play for dancers?
Waltzes have always been a favorite of mine - but yoú´re right: you don´t hear them at sessions a lot. Once I actually sort of smuggled a waltz into a session, but this was Cape Breton this summer, and they sometimes play them there. Otherwise, I played them for dancers. My absolute favorite as a waltz is "Midnight on the water" - which is a Texas waltz (part of my musical background is playing guitar in a country band in the 70s, and I know I´m walking on thin ice here, probably) that can actually be found in the tunes section here. Other waltzes I like - and the dancers liked them when I was playing them - are "Amy´s"(Irish) - sometimes called "The burst mattress", and the "Lighthousekeeper´s"(Scottish, I believe). "Sourgrass and granite" (Canadian) is also beautiful - all of these waltzes are in the tunes section here. Also have a look at one of the latest published here: "The youngest ancient marriner" (lovely).
I play them flatpicked on the guitar, by the way - for some of them I have versions on the concertina.
Inisheer
Midnight On The Water
The Dark Island
Mull Of The Woods
Felton Lonnin'
Margaret's Waltz
I always wondered where the last one - Margaret's Waltz - came from. It was composed, I gather, by the great folk-world collector / performer / composer / organiser Pat Shuldham-Shaw, who grew up in England but went on to spend a lot of time in Shetland in particular.
Have you tried the Marino Waltz? It goes quite well with Tom Bhettie's.
I see you mentioned Mazurkas. Try this pair composed and played by our local musical genius Chris Corbett: http://www.myspace.com/chriscorbettfluter
Tommy Bhetty's is a beauty. It is often ruined by prattish accompaniment, so I reckon it's a rare example of a tune that needs collaborative work with yer guitar man (the rest of the time you can just sack him). Inspiration for playing it well can come no better than from a listen to Altan's version on The Red Crow.
I wish to speak up in defence of mazurkas, which are all too often accompanied like waltzes but which have no place in this thread. Properly played and accompanied, they are an entirely different kind of tune. I hate it when they sound like fast waltzes. The emphasis should be on the second beat of each bar, not the first, and there's always a lovely little kick at the end of each part. Sadly, it's what you seldom hear.
I know Inisheer is in waltz time but I don't really regard it as a waltz. It should be played quite slowly, and you wouldn't want Anne Widdecombe dancing to it.
A really nice modern waltz is Waltz For Polle, composed in 1990 by Wim Poesen for his mate Polle's wedding.
I forgot one of my very favourites, which is Miss Rowan Davies, composed I believe by Phil Cunningham. A cracking example of how to write a great tune without sticking millions of notes into it.
Yes Ben, but what a shame to lose a tune-type because of ignorance (not you, the people who blithely play 'em like waltzes). Why not keep it distinct? Its like arguing to abolish apostrophe's just because some people dont get em.
No Rudall I haven't tried The Marino Waltz, but I had a good friend named Joe Moreno (different spelling I know) who passed away so I must learn it to play in honor of him.
As a matter of my opinion; I just haven't heard many waltzes that strike my fancy. Most waltzes are too schmaltzy or ridiculous to really 'grab' me. I know, everyones opinions are different & I mean no disrespect, and yes there are some nice waltzes. I only mention this as as an answer to why there aren't many waltzes played at sessions; perhaps many other players more or less feel the same way about them. (Please have mercy on my soul)
Waltz, schmaltz, who cares?
I like 'em. They are an integral part of the traditional repertoire, in my view.
I think they don't always sit well with some players' session expectations, and like yourself Mad Brad, but from the opposite side, I respect everyone else's opinions so no probs if ye's don't like them but I do. Good ones that is....
No ceildhe is complete without a good waltz. Instead of changing partners through the dance, you get a chance to spend some quality time with the one you love, whirling around the dance floor. What could be better?
One of my favorite descriptions of a waltz is from Rodney Miller writing about Irma's Waltz" -- more sap than a Vermont maple tree -- I love to play waltzes so I can watch people dance. Good waltzes and good dancers make a great combination.
Well, Brad, fair enough, they get on your threepenny bits, but for the rest of us..... Why don't we play more at sessions!!??!! They are a great way to cool the blood down..... and think - no bodhrans! No spoons or eggs! Minimal guitar pollution!
Waltzes? Come on down!
I know a man who plays the bodhran not only in waltzes but also in slow airs and every song ever sung in sessions. I'm really sorry to have to disappoint you with this depressing information.
You want schmaltz? For the fun of it, to play in a December performance, the group I am in is learning the song "Christmas in Killarney" from the Bing Crosby White Christmas album. That, my friends, is schmaltz!!!
I'm fond of "Tramps and Hawkers". Such a simple tune but so lovely. I think simpler, traditional tunes make the nicest waltzes, especially if they are slightly wistful or mournful. "Four Maries" is another nice one.
Some beautiful waltzes work well as songs, but if they only have an "A" part, they may quickly pall as a tune.
A couple of sets I play at dances and care homes:
Fanny Power / The Orange In Bloom / Endearing Young Charms
Westering Home / The Arran Boat / Ye Banks and Braes
If you look up recordings by Scottish or Contra dance bands, you will find sets of tried and true waltzes.
Reared on Waltzes - Apart from the ones already mentioned,, and numerous Irish and Scottish tunes, why not try some of these beautiful waltzes:
Snow in Summer
Bourrasque
The Humming Bird
The Rose
Rheine de Musette
The Agnes
Queen Maries
The Saturday Night
The Veleta
The Jacqueline
The Cuckoo
The Oslo....etc etc etc
My band fairly regularly plays
Lord Inchiquin
Crossing to Ireland
Little Ingrid
I'm also fond of
Metsakukkia
Star of the County Down (which is also sometimes played in march time)
and several others. Peter Barnes's book A Little Couple-Dancemusik is a good source.
Now for a speculation: most of the reels and jigs have their origins in the 18th century (or earlier) and were used either for set dances or step dancing done individually. The waltz was introduced in the late 18th and early 19th century and became quite popular, but also quite scandalous, in the 19th century as a couple dance.
Perhaps the different temporal and social origin of the waltz and the jigs and reels more common in Irish partially explains their rarity at sessions. That said, there are often waltzes played at sessions near where I live and I'm not always the one starting them.
That's so hilarious, waltzes being scandalous. What in the world would they think of what goes on nowadays Rocky Horror Picture show. Now there's scandal. Tim Curry, there's something you never hear in sessoins either.
Thanks again so much for all the tune titles folks. I'm playing for another dance in a couple weeks and I'll be armed with some great new scandalous waltzes. Maybe even a little Bing Crosby and Tim Curry. Ha!
Ah, nice, someone recently mentioned how she'd been into waltzes of late, some of the ones mentioned I already know, but some I'll have to look up and have a listen to. One we do play in our local tunes-group and that hasn't been mentioned yet is the Pernod Waltz. I think atm that's my fav waltz.
Yes Free Reed, La Reine de la Musette is a cracker -- but you'll have your work cut out playing it on the pipes. Some good ones in that list. That's me set for a couple of weeks, thanks.
Waltzes can be remarkably different in feel and in tempo - they're not a 'one-size-fits-all' group of tunes. There's one to fit, or evoke, practically any mood - reelers and jiggers permitting, of course!
"... but also quite scandalous..."
The teacher of a ballroom class I once took insisted "locked together at the hips" was essential.
Could be difficult for some shy folk to handle...
"There's a brilliant set of 5 waltzes recorded by the Bucks including Galway Bay and Lakes of Pontchartrain"
Just to acknowledge that (though I didn't know the names of any of the tunes). I have that CD and that set of waltzes is indeed wonderful. I hope to get the chaps to play it soon!
Another tick for Tommy Bhetty's. Its my favourite. We also do a version of 'Believe Me If All Those Endearing Young Charms' with variations which our smallpipes player introduced. Played (wierdly but kinda nice) in A myx.
Les Roses Valse, by the French composer Metra, played rather chintzily here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7iKm1NrMqFI I learned it from a wonderful recording made in the late 1920s by Blind Joe Mangrum, born 1853, backed up by piano accordion, of all things. Dunno if you can buy that on a CD, however - it was a test pressing that someone miraculously came across.
I like to play this tune on the pipes in D, with a few notes up in the chanter's third octave. As they say YMMV.
What oldstrings said is correct. The waltz was meant to be danced close together, and somewhat intimate. I am sure it got the same disdain from conservatives that dancing at night clubs gets nowadays. Same story, different age.
Waltzes
Waltzes
I was recently playing for a community dance and was asked to play some waltzes when I realized, Kripes!! I only play a scant few. So, I've been exploring more waltzes to learn and found (amongst others) The Waterford Waltz. I'm enjoying getting to know it. It has a part that includes top D on the pipes and I'm actually able to make it work. Very exciting if you know what top D on the pipes is all about.
I've been looking at old threads about them. I must learn Thom Bhettys. I thought maybe a thread about current waltz status might be of benefit.
I'm interested to hear what some of your favorite waltzes to play are. I sure don't hear them much at sessions. Does your session ever play very many waltzes? Or are they more appreciated by the folks who play for dancers?
# Posted on November 6th 2010 by Gone to work
Re: Waltzes
Josefin's, Margaret's, The Faraway, Aly's ...
http://www.bfv.com/waltz/
& mazurkas too!
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Ben Steen
Re: Waltzes
Waltzes have always been a favorite of mine - but yoú´re right: you don´t hear them at sessions a lot. Once I actually sort of smuggled a waltz into a session, but this was Cape Breton this summer, and they sometimes play them there. Otherwise, I played them for dancers. My absolute favorite as a waltz is "Midnight on the water" - which is a Texas waltz (part of my musical background is playing guitar in a country band in the 70s, and I know I´m walking on thin ice here, probably) that can actually be found in the tunes section here. Other waltzes I like - and the dancers liked them when I was playing them - are "Amy´s"(Irish) - sometimes called "The burst mattress", and the "Lighthousekeeper´s"(Scottish, I believe). "Sourgrass and granite" (Canadian) is also beautiful - all of these waltzes are in the tunes section here. Also have a look at one of the latest published here: "The youngest ancient marriner" (lovely).
I play them flatpicked on the guitar, by the way - for some of them I have versions on the concertina.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by alexweger
Re: Waltzes
Wals voor Polle
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBxqKx1BTyc
Sometimes more of a march, but lovely.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Ben Steen
Re: Waltzes
Nice Ben, Those waltz books are a great resource. Thanks
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Gone to work
Re: Waltzes
Alexweger, the youngest ancient mariner is just the kind of tune I'm looking for, it plays great on the pipes. Many thanks
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Gone to work
Re: Waltzes
Some personal favourites:
Inisheer
Midnight On The Water
The Dark Island
Mull Of The Woods
Felton Lonnin'
Margaret's Waltz
I always wondered where the last one - Margaret's Waltz - came from. It was composed, I gather, by the great folk-world collector / performer / composer / organiser Pat Shuldham-Shaw, who grew up in England but went on to spend a lot of time in Shetland in particular.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by nicholas
Re: Waltzes
Have you tried the Marino Waltz? It goes quite well with Tom Bhettie's.
I see you mentioned Mazurkas. Try this pair composed and played by our local musical genius Chris Corbett:
http://www.myspace.com/chriscorbettfluter
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Rudall the time
Re: Waltzes
My favorites:
Josefin's
Tommy Bhetty's
The Lighthouse Keeper's (Cal Scott's)
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by sara505sings
Re: Waltzes
Tommy Bhetty's is a beauty. It is often ruined by prattish accompaniment, so I reckon it's a rare example of a tune that needs collaborative work with yer guitar man (the rest of the time you can just sack him). Inspiration for playing it well can come no better than from a listen to Altan's version on The Red Crow.
I wish to speak up in defence of mazurkas, which are all too often accompanied like waltzes but which have no place in this thread. Properly played and accompanied, they are an entirely different kind of tune. I hate it when they sound like fast waltzes. The emphasis should be on the second beat of each bar, not the first, and there's always a lovely little kick at the end of each part. Sadly, it's what you seldom hear.
I know Inisheer is in waltz time but I don't really regard it as a waltz. It should be played quite slowly, and you wouldn't want Anne Widdecombe dancing to it.
A really nice modern waltz is Waltz For Polle, composed in 1990 by Wim Poesen for his mate Polle's wedding.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Steve Shaw
Re: Waltzes
Steve you're correct but waltzes, mazurkas, mazurka-polkas, & others have each changed partners over time across the dance floor.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Ben Steen
Re: Waltzes
I forgot one of my very favourites, which is Miss Rowan Davies, composed I believe by Phil Cunningham. A cracking example of how to write a great tune without sticking millions of notes into it.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Steve Shaw
Re: Waltzes
Yes Ben, but what a shame to lose a tune-type because of ignorance (not you, the people who blithely play 'em like waltzes). Why not keep it distinct? Its like arguing to abolish apostrophe's just because some people dont get em.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Steve Shaw
Re: Waltzes
No Rudall I haven't tried The Marino Waltz, but I had a good friend named Joe Moreno (different spelling I know) who passed away so I must learn it to play in honor of him.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Gone to work
Thanks for all the ideas folks, good stuff, keep it coming.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Gone to work
Re: Waltzes
Bill Mathieson has collected a bunch of waltzes and organized them in some books. http://www.bfv.com/waltz/
There are some great ones in the collection.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by John Culhane
Re: Waltzes
Sorry, should have read the entire thread first. I see that Ben Steen has already provided the link. (It's a good one, though.)
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by John Culhane
Re: Waltzes
As a matter of my opinion; I just haven't heard many waltzes that strike my fancy. Most waltzes are too schmaltzy or ridiculous to really 'grab' me. I know, everyones opinions are different & I mean no disrespect, and yes there are some nice waltzes. I only mention this as as an answer to why there aren't many waltzes played at sessions; perhaps many other players more or less feel the same way about them. (Please have mercy on my soul)
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by B Rad
Re: Waltzes
Waltz, schmaltz, who cares?
I like 'em. They are an integral part of the traditional repertoire, in my view.
I think they don't always sit well with some players' session expectations, and like yourself Mad Brad, but from the opposite side, I respect everyone else's opinions so no probs if ye's don't like them but I do. Good ones that is....
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Rudall the time
Re: Waltzes
No ceildhe is complete without a good waltz. Instead of changing partners through the dance, you get a chance to spend some quality time with the one you love, whirling around the dance floor. What could be better?
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by AlBrown
Re: Waltzes
So do I, it's just I only like 1:1000 that I hear
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by B Rad
Re: Waltzes
One of my favorite descriptions of a waltz is from Rodney Miller writing about Irma's Waltz" -- more sap than a Vermont maple tree -- I love to play waltzes so I can watch people dance. Good waltzes and good dancers make a great combination.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by John Culhane
Re: Waltzes
@al a barndance
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by B Rad
Re: Waltzes
Well, Brad, fair enough, they get on your threepenny bits, but for the rest of us..... Why don't we play more at sessions!!??!! They are a great way to cool the blood down..... and think - no bodhrans! No spoons or eggs! Minimal guitar pollution!
Waltzes? Come on down!
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Rudall the time
Re: Waltzes
I know a man who plays the bodhran not only in waltzes but also in slow airs and every song ever sung in sessions. I'm really sorry to have to disappoint you with this depressing information.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Steve Shaw
Re: Waltzes
You want schmaltz? For the fun of it, to play in a December performance, the group I am in is learning the song "Christmas in Killarney" from the Bing Crosby White Christmas album. That, my friends, is schmaltz!!!
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by AlBrown
Re: Waltzes
Love Bing Crosby!!
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by big_tab
Re: Waltzes
I'm fond of "Tramps and Hawkers". Such a simple tune but so lovely. I think simpler, traditional tunes make the nicest waltzes, especially if they are slightly wistful or mournful. "Four Maries" is another nice one.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Red Menace
Re: Waltzes
Some beautiful waltzes work well as songs, but if they only have an "A" part, they may quickly pall as a tune.
A couple of sets I play at dances and care homes:
Fanny Power / The Orange In Bloom / Endearing Young Charms
Westering Home / The Arran Boat / Ye Banks and Braes
If you look up recordings by Scottish or Contra dance bands, you will find sets of tried and true waltzes.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by oldstrings
Re: Waltzes
Buds in Winter
Ookpick Waltz
There's a brilliant set of 5 waltzes recorded by the Bucks including Galway Bay and Lakes of Pontchartrain.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by kuec
Re: Waltzes
Reared on Waltzes - Apart from the ones already mentioned,, and numerous Irish and Scottish tunes, why not try some of these beautiful waltzes:
Snow in Summer
Bourrasque
The Humming Bird
The Rose
Rheine de Musette
The Agnes
Queen Maries
The Saturday Night
The Veleta
The Jacqueline
The Cuckoo
The Oslo....etc etc etc
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Free Reed
Re: Waltzes
http://www.thesession.org/tunes/display/480
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Kenny
Re: Waltzes
My band fairly regularly plays
Lord Inchiquin
Crossing to Ireland
Little Ingrid
I'm also fond of
Metsakukkia
Star of the County Down (which is also sometimes played in march time)
and several others. Peter Barnes's book A Little Couple-Dancemusik is a good source.
Now for a speculation: most of the reels and jigs have their origins in the 18th century (or earlier) and were used either for set dances or step dancing done individually. The waltz was introduced in the late 18th and early 19th century and became quite popular, but also quite scandalous, in the 19th century as a couple dance.
Perhaps the different temporal and social origin of the waltz and the jigs and reels more common in Irish partially explains their rarity at sessions. That said, there are often waltzes played at sessions near where I live and I'm not always the one starting them.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by fiddlentina
Re: Waltzes
That's so hilarious, waltzes being scandalous. What in the world would they think of what goes on nowadays
Rocky Horror Picture show. Now there's scandal. Tim Curry, there's something you never hear in sessoins either.
Thanks again so much for all the tune titles folks. I'm playing for another dance in a couple weeks and I'll be armed with some great new scandalous waltzes. Maybe even a little Bing Crosby and Tim Curry. Ha!
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Gone to work
Re: Waltzes
Ah, nice, someone recently mentioned how she'd been into waltzes of late, some of the ones mentioned I already know, but some I'll have to look up and have a listen to. One we do play in our local tunes-group and that hasn't been mentioned yet is the Pernod Waltz. I think atm that's my fav waltz.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by zaivanbuijs
Re: Waltzes
Enjoyed learning Ashokan Farewell recently, lovely tune.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Eòsaph
Re: Waltzes
La Valse Pour Les Jeunes Filles--current favorite.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by Michele Sims
Re: Waltzes
Yes Free Reed, La Reine de la Musette is a cracker -- but you'll have your work cut out playing it on the pipes. Some good ones in that list. That's me set for a couple of weeks, thanks.
# Posted on November 7th 2010 by gam
Re: Waltzes
Waltzes can be remarkably different in feel and in tempo - they're not a 'one-size-fits-all' group of tunes. There's one to fit, or evoke, practically any mood - reelers and jiggers permitting, of course!
# Posted on November 8th 2010 by nicholas
Re: Waltzes
"... but also quite scandalous..."
The teacher of a ballroom class I once took insisted "locked together at the hips" was essential.
Could be difficult for some shy folk to handle...
# Posted on November 8th 2010 by oldstrings
Can-can
It's been ages since we have played this, but I have played Offenbach in session;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lK0gYi1YEZ8
# Posted on November 8th 2010 by Ben Steen
Re: Waltzes
"There's a brilliant set of 5 waltzes recorded by the Bucks including Galway Bay and Lakes of Pontchartrain"
Just to acknowledge that (though I didn't know the names of any of the tunes). I have that CD and that set of waltzes is indeed wonderful. I hope to get the chaps to play it soon!
# Posted on November 8th 2010 by Steve Shaw
Re: Waltzes
Another tick for Tommy Bhetty's. Its my favourite. We also do a version of 'Believe Me If All Those Endearing Young Charms' with variations which our smallpipes player introduced. Played (wierdly but kinda nice) in A myx.
# Posted on November 8th 2010 by Bredna
Re: Waltzes
Les Roses Valse, by the French composer Metra, played rather chintzily here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7iKm1NrMqFI I learned it from a wonderful recording made in the late 1920s by Blind Joe Mangrum, born 1853, backed up by piano accordion, of all things. Dunno if you can buy that on a CD, however - it was a test pressing that someone miraculously came across.
I like to play this tune on the pipes in D, with a few notes up in the chanter's third octave. As they say YMMV.
# Posted on November 9th 2010 by KLR
Re: Waltzes
They sailed Away from Dublin Bay and The Pretty Maid Milking her Cow.
# Posted on November 9th 2010 by pennhorse
Re: Waltzes
What oldstrings said is correct. The waltz was meant to be danced close together, and somewhat intimate. I am sure it got the same disdain from conservatives that dancing at night clubs gets nowadays. Same story, different age.
# Posted on November 10th 2010 by banshee misfortune
Re: Waltzes
http://www.streetswing.com/histmain/z3waltz.htm
# Posted on November 10th 2010 by Ben Steen