Walked into a session tonight.
There were two bass players. One electric, one double bass. If I'd have had any brains at all I'd have snuck out quick before anyone saw me.
Tried to play a couple tunes.
The guys started doing battle on bass.
One guy had sheet music (at least he had some of the changes), the other was using his bow for god knows what and then setting it down to play boom slap boom chunk slam boom, then picking the bow back up and waking up mummies.
When the catostrophic three and a half minutes were over, a clueless "violin" player with a music stand scattered with paper glared at me and said " I'd appreciate it if you'd tell me the names of the tunes before you play them so I can find the sheet music".
WHAT THE F~~~~!!
I must be insane.
Somebody please shoot me!
I kindly requested that the bass players take turns and play one at a time. The double bass guy had a big snit and stormed off followed closely by the clueless "violin" player.
Double basses are horrible for Irish Music (IMHO) ..
At The National Folk Festival here in OZ, they play in the Session Bar and the thud,thud just permeates the whole room,which is a cacaphony at the best of times...
An electric Bass......Crikey,that'd be twice as horrible ..
And both of 'em at once at a Traditional Music session....well maybe Mr llig just might be onto something there...
Several of the standard and accepted traditional irish instruments play the role of bass. The accordians, guitar, and the drones on a set of pipes. Depending on what you find acceptable, maybe even piano.
I think if it was done by tastefully by good musicians who understood the music, there isn't a reason a bassist could not join a session. Electric, eh... no? A double bass would need to be treated delicately. The best fit for a session would be an aucoustic bass guitar.
Sorry about the bad experience Boatpiper. I guess not all sessions can be brilliant. Sometimes we have to sit through the rough ones to get to the nights with fun people and good tunes.
Double bass is my main instrument, and a wonderful instrument it is. Double basses, music stands, sheet music...throw in punters with coins and a new bodhrain wielder or two...all these things are perfectly normal and to be expected when you have an open jam session.
And that's exactly what I thought a session was when I first joined the Yellow Mustard. I quickly learned that a session is very different. We all know this...but we don't know it right away.
To most beginners, it looks like an open jam session where all styles, all instruments, plenty of "songs", and sheet music are all welcome. That bass player or "violin" player, or guy who just got back from Ireland with his souvenir Guiness bodhran hears about a musical gathering of sorts down at the local and figures "why not?"
Sessions are very different and if we don't let people know exactly what is expected before they unpack their tubas and Casio keyboards, it won't get any better.
Now, I got slagged off the other day suggesting to a person thinking of taking up the accordion that, really, he'd picked the wrong instrument for this sort of music, or words to that effect.
I think a comment along those lines might have been good before anything started at your session. People could have just walked out sooner.
Asking if anyone had ever been to an ITM ( or other expression ) session before might have been instructive too.
Getting rid of ( or teaching ) people who think you just tap an undamped bodhran skin with one end of the tipper is useful as well.
There was a nice session going at a nice pace . A decent box player ,a couple of fiddles,a banjo a bouzouki player and a bodhran player. The crowd was good.This man arrived into the pub armed with a double bass.20 minutes later the whole place was completely stuck into the music.The double bass had put a groove into the music and there was no need to change the tempo and the music could go on for hours.Once again Paul O'Driscoll had worked his magic on the music and we were grateful.
Anytime I think of double bass in this music it seems to be either a horribly inappropriate American Old-Timey or Bluegrass type boom chucka, or Lunasa type syncopation. Is there any other way to play bass in this music?
Boatpiper, that's a travesty of a sham you waltzed into right there, sorry to hear!
You folks are great. Thanks for shooting me Michael. I feel better now.
There really IS life after death.
A little piece of me died last night and I still woke up this morning.
i agree, especially in providing the rhytmic base of the string sound, that the double bass fits elegantly into this music in the hands of an accomplished bassist (as does the piano box by an accordionist who knows their stuff - just as much as the bodhran for that matter . . . )
but will admit to being a frustrated guitarist on electric bass in my irish band, but conversly, do aim to be a more sensitive (but still driving) ''guitarist with ears'' in an open acoustic session, believing that all players should use their ears more
only then, when the sitting feels just right, you can bring things like 'volumn dynamics' in to play and take it to another level _ this turns ears in the audience and brings natural highs to players involved, i tell you you can't beat it . . .
BP, I can only assume that you were a victim of the JamSession Phenomena. It is, unfortunately, the norm in remote outposts like the Upper Left Coast, where a little knowledge is a very dangerous thing.
The difficulty arises when a few people choose to gather in public to play tunes. Let's face it: most folks in our particular neck of the woods are familiar with bluegrass jams, country-music sing-alongs, and blues jams, but not any flavor of traditional session. That would be because it is not traditional here. So you get bass players, vibrato-wielding violists, would-be bodhranistas, boom-chick guitarists, and even some really great fiddle/violin players who can send things off the rails. I won't even mention the music-stand thing. (I did, though...) People (fortunately) will show up to play, but (unfortunately) you get what you get.
If I have a point, I guess that it is I'm finding it less and less mandatory to stick to a perceived protocol when I venture out of the safety of the kitchen session and into the jungle of the brewpubs and bookstores that constitute our local sessions.
On the other hand, the scenario you describe has sent me packing more than once. But the rewards still outweigh the horrors. Playing music in public is still an exercise in community-building; still a way to engage people in an activity instead of passive listening/watching.
The kumbaya moments happen, even if some of these sessions truly smelt.
Adding a bass to The Music changes it into something else. Personally, I just don’t like that something else. When I hear it, it’s like trying to listen to a tune while there’s a Harley-Davidson idling nearby. Oh, well. I guess every kind of music eventually gets grafted, willy-nilly, onto a rhythm section.
Okay, sometimes, *rarely*, I like it. Brilliant music is self-justifying.
Many years ago, I was playing piano at an Irish session where there were two acoustic double bass or string bass players. Since one bass player was on my left and the other was on my right, when both of them were playing at the same time, I felt as if I was about to be vibrated into a lower dimension.
I get a "my grain haddock" if I am not careful about what I eat.
If I was a haddock player, I would be such a fishy haddock player that I would have to swim in.
Thank you for the encouragement, Biggus Dave, but I do try to resist the temptation to post too many puns to these discussions because there are other members of The Session.Org who are more atrociously clever punsters than myself. These other punsters don't need any encouragment or an example to follow--if any of them are stupid enough to try to follow my example.
Sure!
I think heroes come in all shapes, sizes and fields of expertise.
Forrest is a genius at simple and clear observation.
Most of us are clouded with far too many ideas about stuff.
His way of zeroing in on the most obvious of things is nothing short of astonishing.
"Life is like a box of chocolates, you never know what you're gonna get".
That's brilliant!
"Most of us are clouded with far too many ideas about stuff." That describes me when I went to my first Irish music session in October 1995. The musicians who started these sessions soon helped clear my head of all of my misconceptions about Irish music but they did encourage me to "cloud" my thoughts in a fog of good beer such as something called "Guiness" (which I am sure you have never ever heard of).
Two Bass Players?
Two Bass Players?
Walked into a session tonight.
There were two bass players. One electric, one double bass. If I'd have had any brains at all I'd have snuck out quick before anyone saw me.
Tried to play a couple tunes.
The guys started doing battle on bass.
One guy had sheet music (at least he had some of the changes), the other was using his bow for god knows what and then setting it down to play boom slap boom chunk slam boom, then picking the bow back up and waking up mummies.
When the catostrophic three and a half minutes were over, a clueless "violin" player with a music stand scattered with paper glared at me and said " I'd appreciate it if you'd tell me the names of the tunes before you play them so I can find the sheet music".
WHAT THE F~~~~!!
I must be insane.
Somebody please shoot me!
I kindly requested that the bass players take turns and play one at a time. The double bass guy had a big snit and stormed off followed closely by the clueless "violin" player.
I'm going back to play on the cliff over the sea.
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by Gone to work
Re: Two Bass Players?
Bang Bang
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by ...
Re: Two Bass Players?
Double basses are horrible for Irish Music (IMHO) ..
At The National Folk Festival here in OZ, they play in the Session Bar and the thud,thud just permeates the whole room,which is a cacaphony at the best of times...
An electric Bass......Crikey,that'd be twice as horrible ..
And both of 'em at once at a Traditional Music session....well maybe Mr llig just might be onto something there...
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by zoukboy
Re: Two Bass Players?
Several of the standard and accepted traditional irish instruments play the role of bass. The accordians, guitar, and the drones on a set of pipes. Depending on what you find acceptable, maybe even piano.
I think if it was done by tastefully by good musicians who understood the music, there isn't a reason a bassist could not join a session. Electric, eh... no? A double bass would need to be treated delicately. The best fit for a session would be an aucoustic bass guitar.
Sorry about the bad experience Boatpiper. I guess not all sessions can be brilliant. Sometimes we have to sit through the rough ones to get to the nights with fun people and good tunes.
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by banshee misfortune
Re: Two Bass Players?
Ah...communication. That most elusive goal.
Double bass is my main instrument, and a wonderful instrument it is. Double basses, music stands, sheet music...throw in punters with coins and a new bodhrain wielder or two...all these things are perfectly normal and to be expected when you have an open jam session.
And that's exactly what I thought a session was when I first joined the Yellow Mustard. I quickly learned that a session is very different. We all know this...but we don't know it right away.
To most beginners, it looks like an open jam session where all styles, all instruments, plenty of "songs", and sheet music are all welcome. That bass player or "violin" player, or guy who just got back from Ireland with his souvenir Guiness bodhran hears about a musical gathering of sorts down at the local and figures "why not?"
Sessions are very different and if we don't let people know exactly what is expected before they unpack their tubas and Casio keyboards, it won't get any better.
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by Greg the Piano Tuner
Re: Two Bass Players?
Now, I got slagged off the other day suggesting to a person thinking of taking up the accordion that, really, he'd picked the wrong instrument for this sort of music, or words to that effect.
I think a comment along those lines might have been good before anything started at your session. People could have just walked out sooner.
Asking if anyone had ever been to an ITM ( or other expression ) session before might have been instructive too.
Getting rid of ( or teaching ) people who think you just tap an undamped bodhran skin with one end of the tipper is useful as well.
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by Guernsey Pete
Re: Two Bass Players?
PS; I play the electric bass in my ceilidh band, but a dance band is not a session.
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by Guernsey Pete
Re: Two Bass Players?
There was a nice session going at a nice pace . A decent box player ,a couple of fiddles,a banjo a bouzouki player and a bodhran player. The crowd was good.This man arrived into the pub armed with a double bass.20 minutes later the whole place was completely stuck into the music.The double bass had put a groove into the music and there was no need to change the tempo and the music could go on for hours.Once again Paul O'Driscoll had worked his magic on the music and we were grateful.
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by big_tab
Re: Two Bass Players?
Anytime I think of double bass in this music it seems to be either a horribly inappropriate American Old-Timey or Bluegrass type boom chucka, or Lunasa type syncopation. Is there any other way to play bass in this music?
Boatpiper, that's a travesty of a sham you waltzed into right there, sorry to hear!
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Two Bass Players?
You folks are great. Thanks for shooting me Michael. I feel better now.
There really IS life after death.
A little piece of me died last night and I still woke up this morning.
Guess I'll play a couple tunes
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by Gone to work
Re: Two Bass Players?
What if a haddock player showed up?
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by DrSilverSpear
Re: Two Bass Players?
boom boom
i agree, especially in providing the rhytmic base of the string sound, that the double bass fits elegantly into this music in the hands of an accomplished bassist (as does the piano box by an accordionist who knows their stuff - just as much as the bodhran for that matter . . . )
but will admit to being a frustrated guitarist on electric bass in my irish band, but conversly, do aim to be a more sensitive (but still driving) ''guitarist with ears'' in an open acoustic session, believing that all players should use their ears more
only then, when the sitting feels just right, you can bring things like 'volumn dynamics' in to play and take it to another level _ this turns ears in the audience and brings natural highs to players involved, i tell you you can't beat it . . .
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by lisaniska
Re: Two Bass Players?
Only one Haddock player at a time please.
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by Gone to work
Re: Two Bass Players?
Haddock? As in, waiter how's your haddock? Better since I took two aspirins, haddock?
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Two Bass Players?
All depends if the bass player was steamed I guess.
I'd probably be a smoked haddock player.
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by yhaalhouse
Re: Two Bass Players?
How disappointing, yhaalhouse. I prefer haddock battered.
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by DrSilverSpear
Re: Two Bass Players?
BP, I can only assume that you were a victim of the JamSession Phenomena. It is, unfortunately, the norm in remote outposts like the Upper Left Coast, where a little knowledge is a very dangerous thing.
The difficulty arises when a few people choose to gather in public to play tunes. Let's face it: most folks in our particular neck of the woods are familiar with bluegrass jams, country-music sing-alongs, and blues jams, but not any flavor of traditional session. That would be because it is not traditional here. So you get bass players, vibrato-wielding violists, would-be bodhranistas, boom-chick guitarists, and even some really great fiddle/violin players who can send things off the rails. I won't even mention the music-stand thing. (I did, though...) People (fortunately) will show up to play, but (unfortunately) you get what you get.
If I have a point, I guess that it is I'm finding it less and less mandatory to stick to a perceived protocol when I venture out of the safety of the kitchen session and into the jungle of the brewpubs and bookstores that constitute our local sessions.
On the other hand, the scenario you describe has sent me packing more than once. But the rewards still outweigh the horrors. Playing music in public is still an exercise in community-building; still a way to engage people in an activity instead of passive listening/watching.
The kumbaya moments happen, even if some of these sessions truly smelt.
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by Michele Sims
Re: Two Bass Players?
Adding a bass to The Music changes it into something else. Personally, I just don’t like that something else. When I hear it, it’s like trying to listen to a tune while there’s a Harley-Davidson idling nearby. Oh, well. I guess every kind of music eventually gets grafted, willy-nilly, onto a rhythm section.
Okay, sometimes, *rarely*, I like it. Brilliant music is self-justifying.
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by Bob himself
Re: Two Bass Players?
Many years ago, I was playing piano at an Irish session where there were two acoustic double bass or string bass players. Since one bass player was on my left and the other was on my right, when both of them were playing at the same time, I felt as if I was about to be vibrated into a lower dimension.
I get a "my grain haddock" if I am not careful about what I eat.
If I was a haddock player, I would be such a fishy haddock player that I would have to swim in.
Laurence
# Posted on August 11th 2010 by fauxcelt
Re: Two Bass Players?
Batlady-you know that the term 'vibrato-wielding violists' is an oxymoron...
# Posted on August 12th 2010 by biggus dave
Re: Two Bass Players?
Would it be a viola-tion of the viola's players code if a player of this string instrument attempted to use vibrato?
# Posted on August 12th 2010 by fauxcelt
Re: Two Bass Players?
Your puns are nearly as bad as mine-keep it up,fauxcelt!
# Posted on August 13th 2010 by biggus dave
Re: Two Bass Players?
Thank you for the encouragement, Biggus Dave, but I do try to resist the temptation to post too many puns to these discussions because there are other members of The Session.Org who are more atrociously clever punsters than myself. These other punsters don't need any encouragment or an example to follow--if any of them are stupid enough to try to follow my example.
# Posted on August 14th 2010 by fauxcelt
Re: Two Bass Players?
"Stupid is as stipid does" Forrest Gump, 1994.
# Posted on August 14th 2010 by Gone to work
Re: Two Bass Players?
Thank you Boatpiper, Forrest Gump is one of my favorite movies.
Laurence
# Posted on August 15th 2010 by fauxcelt
Re: Two Bass Players?
My pleasure Laurence,
Forrest is a genius in his own special way.
He's one of my all time heroes.
Gary
# Posted on August 15th 2010 by Gone to work
Re: Two Bass Players?
Despite the fact that Forrest Gump doesn't play any musical instruments?
Laurence
# Posted on August 15th 2010 by fauxcelt
Re: Two Bass Players?
Sure!
I think heroes come in all shapes, sizes and fields of expertise.
Forrest is a genius at simple and clear observation.
Most of us are clouded with far too many ideas about stuff.
His way of zeroing in on the most obvious of things is nothing short of astonishing.
"Life is like a box of chocolates, you never know what you're gonna get".
That's brilliant!
# Posted on August 16th 2010 by Gone to work
Re: Two Bass Players?
"Most of us are clouded with far too many ideas about stuff." That describes me when I went to my first Irish music session in October 1995. The musicians who started these sessions soon helped clear my head of all of my misconceptions about Irish music but they did encourage me to "cloud" my thoughts in a fog of good beer such as something called "Guiness" (which I am sure you have never ever heard of).
Laurence
# Posted on August 17th 2010 by fauxcelt