I play the fiddle and tinwhistle, and have been thinking about taking up Irish flute. I am leaning toward purchasing from Sweetheart, but just wanted to ask about these flutes: http://www.sunreed.com/IRFL_IrishFlutes.html (they seem to be everywhere when you search 'irish flute') I think they are nameless.... Does anyone have any opinions on them?
these flutes, made in Pakistan, are everywhere. The low price and easy availability are tempting...but if you buy one, you will most likely be extremely disappointed. There are no shortcuts or bargains with musical instruments. The Tipple flute and the Sweetheart are good instruments, and there are many makers of fine flutes here on this website as well as on Chiff and Fipple. Save your money and buy a "real" flute; those cheap flutes are only good for stirring paint or propping windows open.
STAY FAR AWAY FROM THEM NOW!!! DO NOT GET ONE!!! ANY IRISH INSTRUMENT MADE IN PAKISTAN IS A JOKE!!! The only thing that will happen is you getting frustrated with the flute and never picking it up again because you think it is your fault. Trust me, I learned the hard way a few years ago. It was awful. I still have it, and it still sucks. If you want a great, reliable wooden Irish flute that is low priced, I would strongly recommend Casey Burns' folk flute.
I'm 100% with Jonny and Greg on this one. I have one of those flutes, given to me years and years ago as a gift, and it's TERRIBLE. I also have a flute made by Terry McGee that is absolutely wonderful, so I know that the reason my other flute sucks is not because of me. Definitely do not buy a nameless Pakistani flute. It's very much worth it to shell out for an instrument from a reputable maker.
i agree with will. great site. i bought a flute there, and couldn't be happier. ironically, it was made by a friend of mine (jon c.), but rather than go on jon's waiting list, i got one from doc jone's instead.
Do not buy any of these flutes (referring to original post link to pakistani flutes) - apart from anything else, you can get the same flute for $60 on ebay! Read the sticky thread warning against them in the Chiff and Fipple flute forum.
Do consider a Burns folk flute. I have one. Other options that are well regarded include Tipple, Copley, Sweetheart and others. Tipple seems to be the only reasonable option under $300. Between $300 and $400 you have quite a lot of choices.
The only time I've ever bought a flute I hadn't tried first was when I had one made for me, but I spent about 4 hours at the maker's house talking with him about what I wanted and how I play, and tried loads of his other instruments and really got to know him so he knew what I was after. He's a good flute player himself as well as a maker so I trusted him... and I was right to.
If someone is just "thinking about taking up Irish flute" (the OP) there is only so much to be gained from trying one out first.
What I needed to know when starting recently was "is the problem me [yes ]) or the flute ? " With an un-named one you won't know unless an experienced player has checked its suitablity for a beginner.
I like my Burns folk flute and can now play tunes on it.
Good point, david_h, and as has been often said on here, but worth repeating, a good instrument won't make you better but it will give you the possibility of being better. A bad instrument...you'll never know how well you might be able to play!
Perhaps, unless you're immensely gifted in which case you will be able to make beautiful music even on a crappy instrument. For instance, John Doherty apparently played on a not very good fiddle with poor strings.
leoj, making music on a crappy instrument only works if the instrument is actually playable. Many of the so-called "Irish" Pakistani flutes *cannot* be played in tune, and some barely produce a sound, even when lipped by the best fluters.
Also, the book, "The Northern Fiddler" describes how John Doherty would travel from town to town and receive the loan of the best fiddle in town for his use while he was there.
Irish fiddler Caoimhín MacAoidh, told a different story to me personally last week and he knows about this first hand. Apparently, the strings were not wound but were flat and the fiddle he carried around with him was not very good. Again, that's from someone who knows.
Anyway, my point is that a really good musician can take a mediocre fiddle (agreed, Pakistani flutes are junk) a make music. I remember my Suzuki teacher taking my 1/8 size fiddle and playing a tune, so I knew that if I couldn't play the thing it was me not the fiddle, even though it was a cheapie child's fiddle.
I think what happens is a great player makes a particular sound
popular and others imitate it - well maybe. If you look at the
concertina world, some people wouldn't be caught dead playing
a 'hybrid' concertina even if it sounds great. After all, Noel Hill, etc
don't use them on recordings. So if somebody records a great
album on a crappy, whispery sounding flute -- people will start
paying big money for them.
leoj, the story in The Northern Fiddler was told by John Doherty himself to the book's authors. I would think he too would know.
I don't doubt that Mr. Doherty could coax a tune out of a poor fiddle, and I'm sure he carried his own until later in life. As Martin Hayes has said, if an instrument is playable, it's not a matter of "bad" or "good." It just takes longer on some fiddles than others to figure out how to get the sound you want.
But that's a wholly different matter from trying to get any musical noise at all out of the Pakistani ladder rungs I've put air into. Yeccchhh.
Caoimhín was visiting because his son was recruited for a technology job locally and he gave a couple of house concerts. Of John D. he said to me "can you imagine how he would have sounded on a good fiddle with decent strings!" A fun evening of stories and music and he'll be returning for visits as long as his son is gainfully employed out here.
Nameless Irish Flute?
Nameless Irish Flute?
I play the fiddle and tinwhistle, and have been thinking about taking up Irish flute. I am leaning toward purchasing from Sweetheart, but just wanted to ask about these flutes: http://www.sunreed.com/IRFL_IrishFlutes.html (they seem to be everywhere when you search 'irish flute') I think they are nameless.... Does anyone have any opinions on them?
Thanks!
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by erika-m
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
these flutes, made in Pakistan, are everywhere. The low price and easy availability are tempting...but if you buy one, you will most likely be extremely disappointed. There are no shortcuts or bargains with musical instruments. The Tipple flute and the Sweetheart are good instruments, and there are many makers of fine flutes here on this website as well as on Chiff and Fipple. Save your money and buy a "real" flute; those cheap flutes are only good for stirring paint or propping windows open.
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by Greg the Piano Tuner
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
The only one I've encountered had a dull breathy sound. BUT that
could been the fault of the player.
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by Hup
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
STAY FAR AWAY FROM THEM NOW!!! DO NOT GET ONE!!! ANY IRISH INSTRUMENT MADE IN PAKISTAN IS A JOKE!!! The only thing that will happen is you getting frustrated with the flute and never picking it up again because you think it is your fault. Trust me, I learned the hard way a few years ago. It was awful. I still have it, and it still sucks. If you want a great, reliable wooden Irish flute that is low priced, I would strongly recommend Casey Burns' folk flute.
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by pipersgrip
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
Visit Doc Jones' online flute shop--nothing but well-made flutes, including used ones, often at great prices: https://www.irishflutestore.com/newsite/index.php?
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by Will Harmon
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
I'm 100% with Jonny and Greg on this one. I have one of those flutes, given to me years and years ago as a gift, and it's TERRIBLE. I also have a flute made by Terry McGee that is absolutely wonderful, so I know that the reason my other flute sucks is not because of me. Definitely do not buy a nameless Pakistani flute. It's very much worth it to shell out for an instrument from a reputable maker.
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by Glass of Beer
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
i agree with will. great site. i bought a flute there, and couldn't be happier. ironically, it was made by a friend of mine (jon c.), but rather than go on jon's waiting list, i got one from doc jone's instead.
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by daiv
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
i second Johnny Ward's caveat.stay clear of it.
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by pipewatcher
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
Similarly with harps from there - not even (in fact, especially not!) would a learner benefit from cheap instruments.
I don't know about flutes, but consider, if you don't get on with an expensive / good instrument, you can sell it again.
The instruments from Pakistan have no resale value whatsoever (and I'd question their value when new)!
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by Mark Harmer
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
Do not buy any of these flutes (referring to original post link to pakistani flutes) - apart from anything else, you can get the same flute for $60 on ebay! Read the sticky thread warning against them in the Chiff and Fipple flute forum.
Do consider a Burns folk flute. I have one. Other options that are well regarded include Tipple, Copley, Sweetheart and others. Tipple seems to be the only reasonable option under $300. Between $300 and $400 you have quite a lot of choices.
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by Crackpot
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
I have posted this before but it is here again to re-enforce why you should not trust any of these Pakistani made flutes or pipes....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QArIMYzCiPQ
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by weebag
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
Inexpensive now, as he's only recently gone into business, but it won't stay that way for long...
http://www.gabrielflutes.com/?page=flutes&lang=en
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by Dragut Reis
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
The only time I've ever bought a flute I hadn't tried first was when I had one made for me, but I spent about 4 hours at the maker's house talking with him about what I wanted and how I play, and tried loads of his other instruments and really got to know him so he knew what I was after. He's a good flute player himself as well as a maker so I trusted him... and I was right to.
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by SineadE
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
If someone is just "thinking about taking up Irish flute" (the OP) there is only so much to be gained from trying one out first.
]) or the flute ? " With an un-named one you won't know unless an experienced player has checked its suitablity for a beginner.
What I needed to know when starting recently was "is the problem me [yes
I like my Burns folk flute and can now play tunes on it.
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by David50
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
Good point, david_h, and as has been often said on here, but worth repeating, a good instrument won't make you better but it will give you the possibility of being better. A bad instrument...you'll never know how well you might be able to play!
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by Mark Harmer
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
Perhaps, unless you're immensely gifted in which case you will be able to make beautiful music even on a crappy instrument. For instance, John Doherty apparently played on a not very good fiddle with poor strings.
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by leoj
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
leoj, making music on a crappy instrument only works if the instrument is actually playable. Many of the so-called "Irish" Pakistani flutes *cannot* be played in tune, and some barely produce a sound, even when lipped by the best fluters.
Also, the book, "The Northern Fiddler" describes how John Doherty would travel from town to town and receive the loan of the best fiddle in town for his use while he was there.
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by Will Harmon
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
Irish fiddler Caoimhín MacAoidh, told a different story to me personally last week and he knows about this first hand. Apparently, the strings were not wound but were flat and the fiddle he carried around with him was not very good. Again, that's from someone who knows.
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by leoj
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
Anyway, my point is that a really good musician can take a mediocre fiddle (agreed, Pakistani flutes are junk) a make music. I remember my Suzuki teacher taking my 1/8 size fiddle and playing a tune, so I knew that if I couldn't play the thing it was me not the fiddle, even though it was a cheapie child's fiddle.
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by leoj
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
I hear the Pakistani flutes make good firewood.
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by ElaineT
Pakistani Flute
http://forums.chiffandfipple.com/viewtopic.php?p=446437
# Posted on July 22nd 2010 by Ben Steen
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
I think what happens is a great player makes a particular sound
popular and others imitate it - well maybe. If you look at the
concertina world, some people wouldn't be caught dead playing
a 'hybrid' concertina even if it sounds great. After all, Noel Hill, etc
don't use them on recordings. So if somebody records a great
album on a crappy, whispery sounding flute -- people will start
paying big money for them.
# Posted on July 23rd 2010 by Hup
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
leoj, the story in The Northern Fiddler was told by John Doherty himself to the book's authors. I would think he too would know.
I don't doubt that Mr. Doherty could coax a tune out of a poor fiddle, and I'm sure he carried his own until later in life. As Martin Hayes has said, if an instrument is playable, it's not a matter of "bad" or "good." It just takes longer on some fiddles than others to figure out how to get the sound you want.
But that's a wholly different matter from trying to get any musical noise at all out of the Pakistani ladder rungs I've put air into. Yeccchhh.
# Posted on July 23rd 2010 by Will Harmon
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
Caoimhín was visiting because his son was recruited for a technology job locally and he gave a couple of house concerts. Of John D. he said to me "can you imagine how he would have sounded on a good fiddle with decent strings!" A fun evening of stories and music and he'll be returning for visits as long as his son is gainfully employed out here.
# Posted on July 23rd 2010 by leoj
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
Heh, I imagine he would've sound like John Doherty....
# Posted on July 23rd 2010 by Will Harmon
Re: Nameless Irish Flute?
yes and more so. I've never seen or played on the old flat strings but it must have been a challenge.
# Posted on July 23rd 2010 by leoj