Hi, I am playing on violin for almost two years, and I am learning by my self. I found only now, that beside Major and Minor scales, there is a Dorian, Phrygian.... modes. And I have two questions:
1. How can I know from sheetmusic, which mode it is? When I see keysignature, and I think it is D-major, but on details are writen, that it is E-dorian. How can I found it out only from sheetmusic?
2. What this means for play? If song is in D-major, I must play it defferently as when it is in E-dorian? Or for what reason is good to know, which mode it is?
Sorry for bad english and THX a lot for explain
Key signature indicates which notes are natural & which are sharp (or flat).
D major has 2 sharps & the root note is D.
If you play the scale for the D major key signature, beginning on D, you are playing in D ionian mode.
If you play the same notes, but begin with E, you are in E dorian.
... same notes starting with A would be A mixolydian.
... same notes starting with B is B aeolian (same as B minor)
Azuritko, your english is far better than my Slovak.
In Irish traditional music, we mostly learn by ear--hearing the tunes and figuring out where the notes are on our fiddles. Most Irish fiddlers don't worry about what mode a tune is in--they just play the notes.
The quick and dirty answer is that D major and E dorian tunes (from your question above) use the same scale, but D major tunes have D as the root or home note (the note that the tune wants to end on). E dorian tunes have E as the root or home note. (And E minor tunes also have E as the root or home note, but they use a C natural note, not C sharp.)
But the best advice I can give is to ***listen*** to as much Irish music as you can and learn the tunes by ear, using sheet music only if you're really struggling to learn by ear.
Are there many other musicians interested in Irish music in Slovakia?
When I 1st began reading this forum I had the impression there were members from many more countries than actually are. I thought perhaps Llig Leahcim was a Slovakian member. Imagine my surprise.
Hi, Azuritko
A mode is only a label, and a somewhat inaccurate one at that when it comes to Irish. You don't need to know the mode any more than you need the name to play a tune.
Try to find a recording of whatever you're learning by a good player and rely more on listening than sheet music. You'll hear easily enough whether the tune is major, minor/dorian, or possibly moves back and forth.
My my, what a predjudice little bunch you are here at thesession.
Imagine the response he would have gotten if he would have wrote: "What r like, scales 4? Sorry about my spelling, I'm a Texter."
A native speaker of English, to be taken seriously in a written forum, is expected to have learned the standard orthography used in writing English. Not to use that standard orthography displays either disrespect for the reader or a lamentable and correctable ignorance. Someone who's learned English as a second (or third, or fourth) language is to be congratulated for taking on a difficult task, not chided for having failed to learn a second skill, arguably more difficult than the first.
Actually, I've responded here to txt in kind. I don't mind it. Painting us all with the same brush, Jwalkert, smacks of generalized prejudice itself, eh?
Hmm.... OP says "violin" not "fiddle" - and "songs" not "tunes" and also refers to "sheet music". Has also has been a member of this site for quite a lot longer than period claimed to be learning the "violin".
Quick check of the bio ,... what's this? OP has requested "Old Macdonald had a Farm".
Thx people, so it is good to know, what mode it is, but it is not so important for play - if I understand it correctly.
Will Harmon - I try sometimes learn music by ear, but it is hard for me to recognize all notes. And I do not know who is interested in Irish music in Slovakia. But I am, because I like how it sounds
Mix O'Lydian - I do not even know that I requested this song :D And do not be so sarcastic and explain me why tunes, why fiddle, why not sheet music? I am not here on this site very active. I am here only when I want to find some tune. About fiddle I some time ago find only that fiddle instrument has less curved bridge. But I do not know which tune and why is fiddle.
"My my, what a predjudice little bunch you are here at thesession."
I can't argue with that, this board can be a bit rough at times.
Look, the OP seems to be new to the music and trying to find out how to play it right. You can't expect a beginner to even know the right questions to ask, but you can offer the correct answers in a friendly and constructive manner just the same.
There have been a lot of wind-up artists haunting this board which leads people to assume that any provocative question from a beginner is a wind-up. Maybe that's the case here or maybe not, but I don't see enough evidence to support that from this thread.
Taking down a tune request after it has been criticized in a snide way seems perfectly understandable to me. Assuming that every naive question is a wind-up is a good way to discourage honest questions from beginners and a good way to encourage more actual wind-ups.
Azuritko, assuming that you aren't actually winding people up, don't be too put off by the rude treatment. There really have been a lot of wind-up artists artists around here, and people who have been around here a while tend to be a bit paranoid about it. Don't let it discourage you from asking questions, as long as you are polite about it and listen then you have as much right to be here as anyone else.
I don't see anything in what Azuritko has posted to deserve some of the responses here.
Azuritko, 1st off I want to welcome you to the forum. If I have made prejudicial comments on this thread that is not my intention. When someone asks about Irish tunes & modes the answers are both simple & complex.
In my humble opinion the 1st three responses were posted for the sake of answering the original question. I do not know how Will Harmon sussed out that you are from Slovakia. I simply assumed you are & then searched for sessions in Slovakia. The reason I did is because, if you can find other musicians who are playing Irish music, where you live, it can help you learn tunes in ways that this forum cannot.
If there is anything about this forum which I agree with it is each time a new player is instructed to find a session, & go there, & listen.
Having said that I have no problem with providing what I can regarding modes. The music theory is just that, a verbal & intellectual explanation. The real music comes from listening.
All I did was google "Azuritko" and hit on a myspace page that seemed to be a good fit. Between a photo and "SK" (mail code for Slovakia), and Azuritko's syntax here, it seemed a reasonable guess.
I don't think it's a wind up at all...just some honest questions from someone who wants to delve deeper into this music.
Random_humour --- Yes I am from Slovakia, and I do not know how Will Harmon find it? Maybe by my IP or somehow. And when I am learning the new tune, I need to listen to it. As it is hard for me to play tune only by ear, same hard is play it only by notes. I need both. I am learning everything only less then two years and by myself, so I am real beginner. Maybe it is easier to understand because I am 24 year old, but I need sometimes good explain of things that I really do not understand and when I do not find good answer on internet. So I am asking here because I found, that people there know a lot of this thinks. And it approve for that really people there can help. So I absolutely do not understand the outrage of Mix O'Lydian. But I think it is only language problem and maybe now it is explained. I will see
The problem with sheet music is that it doesn't represent the way Irish music is played. Sheet music is good for music that is complex and played the same every time, like Beethoven or Brahms. It completely fails to capture all the little ornaments, changes, and details in Irish music.
Irish tunes are short, simple, and easy to teach yourself to learn by ear. You only think you "need" sheet music. What you really need is to train your ear to hear the simple patterns in tunes and learn them easily and quickly. All the listening will also help teach you how to play the music with the right style.
ElaineT --- I am using sheet music only short time to remember song. Speed and accuracy I am learning then without sheet music, by repeatedly playing and sometimes I hear to tune, because I must find how long tones I have to play and to get whole think in mind (I do not know how to explain it in english correctly :D ). But I am still learning how to play on violin, there is a lot of things I do not know yet (vibrato is hard for me, but I am not learning it very often) Violin is very hard instrument, but I love it and I will try, I will learn, I will study, maybe I will go to "school" --- I will never give up (I hope that never :D )....
Azuritko, please don't worry about vibrato, it's not necessary in Irish music and most players rarely use it. The ability to use vibrato and control it (which is very important) will naturally come in time when you know how to relax your left hand, arm and fingers when playing.
The most important thing for you at this stage is to find a good teacher who will show you how to control the bow and your left hand, and to stop you from getting into bad technical habits. Meanwhile, as others have said, learn the tunes by listening to them, and avoid using sheet music. If you can sing a tune, or "play" it in your head, then you can be sure you know it. Playing it on an instrument is then a matter of learning to play that instrument.
The violin is difficult because, in order to play it well, you have to develop neural pathways in the brain and nervous system to control the muscles you use for playing. This takes time (longer than for many other musical instruments, but it is worth it), but when you have developed the neural muscle control you will have it with you for life.
To get back to the original topic, if you have something that looks like scales on your violin, perhaps you need to take it to the shop to get it refinished...
"The problem with sheet music is that it doesn't represent the way Irish music is played. Sheet music is good for music that is complex and played the same every time, like Beethoven or Brahms. It completely fails to capture all the little ornaments, changes, and details in Irish music."
There's no difference. You'll sound like crap playing Beethoven without studying the style properly. The sheet music isn't meant to represent details of style, in either case. If you DO know the style you will know how to make effective use of the notation to play something that sounds good.
Random, I'm sure I must have heard that somewhere before, maybe it's a case of deja fu, that well known Eastern martial art which involves mind over body.
Classical is very different. Can you imagine having to pick out, learn, and memorize the second clarinet part of a Brahms symphony only by ear from listening to a full orchestra? I imagine there are people who can do it, but I played in orchestras for years and I'm sure not one of them. The whole art of symphonic composition revolved around being able to use sheet music to coordinate 100 individual musicians playing 30 to 45-minute works. In contrast, learning a 32-bar single melody by ear should be well within the grasp of anyone learning an instrument.
Can you imagine trying to keep a repertoire of 20,000 tunes in your head and personally pass them all on to future generations?
Notation does the otherwise-impossible for traditional music too.
Sheet music predates its use in the orchestra by several centuries. The first printed sheet music was sold about 1000 years ago in China - it was solo harp music.
I have one question now. When I am going to play maybe "The Rocky Road To Dublin (slip jig)", it is good to play before this tune the G-major scale, or A-dorian scale or both?
I tend to listen for the tonal center of a tune. If you can drone a single note while the tune is played that is likely to be the tonal center. For "The Rocky Road to Dublin" an A drone works. In other words while you can shift the drone to G it is mostly A.
Not quite accurate, zenfiddler. The two scales share the same notes, but they start on different notes, which more often than not, is that tonal center that Random_humor is referring to.
More to the point for the tunes we play, it's the note the tune *ends* on (the tone it resolves to) that matters, and that determines the key (and mode).
I oversimplified a bit, because of the language barrier. But mostly because I don't think Azuritko should worry about it.
I'm sure plenty of fiddlers have played great tunes, without knowing any of the academic theories involved. You don't need any of that, to play a tune well.
I think that it is important to know what exactly you are playing to fully understand it and than you can play better. But it is true that even without any theory you can be very good player, but you must be talent.
As Mr. Gill likes to point out, scales are just bad tunes.
Azuritko, in this music, the tunes can teach you everything you need to know. The more you play them, the better you will come to understand this music (and your bow, oh, and the fiddle the noise comes out of).
I like to warm up with a few scales and arpeggios, not just because almost all tunes contain fragments of scales and arpeggios, but to check my tone and to remind my fingers where the notes are. Warming up also helps to stabilise the tuning of the strings before the music making starts.
In contrast to Mr Gill's dictum, I look on scales not as bad tunes but as important parts of good tunes. Sometimes I find myself wandering off into a tune when warming up with scales.
I warm up on tunes. Same thing but more interesting and fun.
I like getting right into the feel of the rhythm and timing of the music. Ever notice how most people automatically play scales in 4/4? I often warm up on jigs or slip jigs.....
Scales on violin
Scales on violin
Hi, I am playing on violin for almost two years, and I am learning by my self. I found only now, that beside Major and Minor scales, there is a Dorian, Phrygian.... modes. And I have two questions:
1. How can I know from sheetmusic, which mode it is? When I see keysignature, and I think it is D-major, but on details are writen, that it is E-dorian. How can I found it out only from sheetmusic?
2. What this means for play? If song is in D-major, I must play it defferently as when it is in E-dorian? Or for what reason is good to know, which mode it is?
Sorry for bad english and THX a lot for explain
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Azuritko
Re: Scales on violin
Modes use the same notes as a major scale. They just begin and end on a different note than the major scale.
For example, E dorian uses the same notes as D major--but it starts and ends on E, so it sounds somewhat "minor."
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by John Galt
Re: Scales on violin
Key signature indicates which notes are natural & which are sharp (or flat).
D major has 2 sharps & the root note is D.
If you play the scale for the D major key signature, beginning on D, you are playing in D ionian mode.
If you play the same notes, but begin with E, you are in E dorian.
... same notes starting with A would be A mixolydian.
... same notes starting with B is B aeolian (same as B minor)
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Ben Steen
Re: Scales on violin
Azuritko, your english is far better than my Slovak.
In Irish traditional music, we mostly learn by ear--hearing the tunes and figuring out where the notes are on our fiddles. Most Irish fiddlers don't worry about what mode a tune is in--they just play the notes.
But it doesn't hurt to understand how modes fit this music. Here's a link to two charts that help explain keys and modes: http://www.slowplayers.org/SCTLS/modes.htm
The quick and dirty answer is that D major and E dorian tunes (from your question above) use the same scale, but D major tunes have D as the root or home note (the note that the tune wants to end on). E dorian tunes have E as the root or home note. (And E minor tunes also have E as the root or home note, but they use a C natural note, not C sharp.)
But the best advice I can give is to ***listen*** to as much Irish music as you can and learn the tunes by ear, using sheet music only if you're really struggling to learn by ear.
Are there many other musicians interested in Irish music in Slovakia?
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Will Harmon
Re: Scales on violin
in b4 llig
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by I ♥ Dow
Re: Scales on violin
When I 1st began reading this forum I had the impression there were members from many more countries than actually are. I thought perhaps Llig Leahcim was a Slovakian member. Imagine my surprise.
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Ben Steen
Re: Scales on violin
Hi, Azuritko
A mode is only a label, and a somewhat inaccurate one at that when it comes to Irish. You don't need to know the mode any more than you need the name to play a tune.
Try to find a recording of whatever you're learning by a good player and rely more on listening than sheet music. You'll hear easily enough whether the tune is major, minor/dorian, or possibly moves back and forth.
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by ElaineT
Re: Scales on violin
My my, what a predjudice little bunch you are here at thesession.
Imagine the response he would have gotten if he would have wrote: "What r like, scales 4? Sorry about my spelling, I'm a Texter."
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Jwalkert
Re: Scales on violin
A native speaker of English, to be taken seriously in a written forum, is expected to have learned the standard orthography used in writing English. Not to use that standard orthography displays either disrespect for the reader or a lamentable and correctable ignorance. Someone who's learned English as a second (or third, or fourth) language is to be congratulated for taking on a difficult task, not chided for having failed to learn a second skill, arguably more difficult than the first.
You see the distinction, d00d?
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Jon Kiparsky
Re: Scales on violin
Oh, and that would be "prejudiced".
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Jon Kiparsky
Re: Scales on violin
Actually, I've responded here to txt in kind. I don't mind it. Painting us all with the same brush, Jwalkert, smacks of generalized prejudice itself, eh?
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Will Harmon
Re: Scales on violin
@jwalkert: Try not to be so abrasive please, You are not helping anybody.
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by gam
Re: Scales on violin
Hmm.... OP says "violin" not "fiddle" - and "songs" not "tunes" and also refers to "sheet music". Has also has been a member of this site for quite a lot longer than period claimed to be learning the "violin".
Quick check of the bio ,... what's this? OP has requested "Old Macdonald had a Farm".
I smell windup here.
Slovak, eh?
Might be a good idea to czech up on that ...
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Mix O'Lydian
Re: Scales on violin
Thx people, so it is good to know, what mode it is, but it is not so important for play - if I understand it correctly.
Will Harmon - I try sometimes learn music by ear, but it is hard for me to recognize all notes. And I do not know who is interested in Irish music in Slovakia. But I am, because I like how it sounds
Mix O'Lydian - I do not even know that I requested this song :D And do not be so sarcastic and explain me why tunes, why fiddle, why not sheet music? I am not here on this site very active. I am here only when I want to find some tune. About fiddle I some time ago find only that fiddle instrument has less curved bridge. But I do not know which tune and why is fiddle.
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Azuritko
Re: Scales on violin
"My my, what a predjudice little bunch you are here at thesession."
I can't argue with that, this board can be a bit rough at times.
Look, the OP seems to be new to the music and trying to find out how to play it right. You can't expect a beginner to even know the right questions to ask, but you can offer the correct answers in a friendly and constructive manner just the same.
There have been a lot of wind-up artists haunting this board which leads people to assume that any provocative question from a beginner is a wind-up. Maybe that's the case here or maybe not, but I don't see enough evidence to support that from this thread.
Taking down a tune request after it has been criticized in a snide way seems perfectly understandable to me. Assuming that every naive question is a wind-up is a good way to discourage honest questions from beginners and a good way to encourage more actual wind-ups.
Azuritko, assuming that you aren't actually winding people up, don't be too put off by the rude treatment. There really have been a lot of wind-up artists artists around here, and people who have been around here a while tend to be a bit paranoid about it. Don't let it discourage you from asking questions, as long as you are polite about it and listen then you have as much right to be here as anyone else.
I don't see anything in what Azuritko has posted to deserve some of the responses here.
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Marklar
Re: Scales on violin
Azuritko, 1st off I want to welcome you to the forum. If I have made prejudicial comments on this thread that is not my intention. When someone asks about Irish tunes & modes the answers are both simple & complex.
In my humble opinion the 1st three responses were posted for the sake of answering the original question. I do not know how Will Harmon sussed out that you are from Slovakia. I simply assumed you are & then searched for sessions in Slovakia. The reason I did is because, if you can find other musicians who are playing Irish music, where you live, it can help you learn tunes in ways that this forum cannot.
If there is anything about this forum which I agree with it is each time a new player is instructed to find a session, & go there, & listen.
Having said that I have no problem with providing what I can regarding modes. The music theory is just that, a verbal & intellectual explanation. The real music comes from listening.
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Ben Steen
...
Listing on the session.org for sessions in Slovakia;
http://www.thesession.org/sessions/index.php/search?country_id=150
Pubs listed on website found on one of those listings;
http://keltieg.sk/index.php?page=linky_puby
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Ben Steen
Re: Scales on violin
All I did was google "Azuritko" and hit on a myspace page that seemed to be a good fit. Between a photo and "SK" (mail code for Slovakia), and Azuritko's syntax here, it seemed a reasonable guess.
I don't think it's a wind up at all...just some honest questions from someone who wants to delve deeper into this music.
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Will Harmon
Re: Scales on violin
Cheers, Will. The slowplayers link gives a good explanation of modes *and* the tunes.
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Ben Steen
Re: Scales on violin
Random_humour --- Yes I am from Slovakia, and I do not know how Will Harmon find it? Maybe by my IP or somehow. And when I am learning the new tune, I need to listen to it. As it is hard for me to play tune only by ear, same hard is play it only by notes. I need both. I am learning everything only less then two years and by myself, so I am real beginner. Maybe it is easier to understand because I am 24 year old, but I need sometimes good explain of things that I really do not understand and when I do not find good answer on internet. So I am asking here because I found, that people there know a lot of this thinks. And it approve for that really people there can help. So I absolutely do not understand the outrage of Mix O'Lydian. But I think it is only language problem and maybe now it is explained. I will see
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Azuritko
Re: Scales on violin
Ironically Mixolydian has a website with a page about modes & scales:
http://www.intermix.freeuk.com/modes_and_scales.htm
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Ben Steen
Re: Scales on violin
Hi Azuritko--
Maybe you can find this fiddler, for some lessons. I think she's pretty good--although I'm sure that opinions will vary, on this web site.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tec6WaZ3C7I
(I assume she is Slovakian--the comments say, "Wow, I really must show the world how Slovaks do love Irish music... and how they can make it! ")
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by John Galt
Re: Scales on violin
The problem with sheet music is that it doesn't represent the way Irish music is played. Sheet music is good for music that is complex and played the same every time, like Beethoven or Brahms. It completely fails to capture all the little ornaments, changes, and details in Irish music.
Irish tunes are short, simple, and easy to teach yourself to learn by ear. You only think you "need" sheet music. What you really need is to train your ear to hear the simple patterns in tunes and learn them easily and quickly. All the listening will also help teach you how to play the music with the right style.
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by ElaineT
Re: Scales on violin
Looking at notes can provide a "quick fix" but it really pays to invest the time developing the ability to play by ear.
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by leoj
Re: Scales on violin
ElaineT --- I am using sheet music only short time to remember song. Speed and accuracy I am learning then without sheet music, by repeatedly playing and sometimes I hear to tune, because I must find how long tones I have to play and to get whole think in mind (I do not know how to explain it in english correctly :D ). But I am still learning how to play on violin, there is a lot of things I do not know yet (vibrato is hard for me, but I am not learning it very often) Violin is very hard instrument, but I love it and I will try, I will learn, I will study, maybe I will go to "school" --- I will never give up (I hope that never :D )....
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Azuritko
Re: Scales on violin
Azuritko, please don't worry about vibrato, it's not necessary in Irish music and most players rarely use it. The ability to use vibrato and control it (which is very important) will naturally come in time when you know how to relax your left hand, arm and fingers when playing.
The most important thing for you at this stage is to find a good teacher who will show you how to control the bow and your left hand, and to stop you from getting into bad technical habits. Meanwhile, as others have said, learn the tunes by listening to them, and avoid using sheet music. If you can sing a tune, or "play" it in your head, then you can be sure you know it. Playing it on an instrument is then a matter of learning to play that instrument.
The violin is difficult because, in order to play it well, you have to develop neural pathways in the brain and nervous system to control the muscles you use for playing. This takes time (longer than for many other musical instruments, but it is worth it), but when you have developed the neural muscle control you will have it with you for life.
Best of luck!
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Trevor Jennings
Re: Scales on violin
To get back to the original topic, if you have something that looks like scales on your violin, perhaps you need to take it to the shop to get it refinished...
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by AlBrown
Re: Scales on violin
Azuritko, ignore him. He's still taking the tablets
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Trevor Jennings
Re: Scales on violin
I like fish
Fish likes me.
When I want a piece of fish,
I go to to Grims-by
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by john knoss
Re: Scales on violin
that,
http://barbilliards.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=viewprofile&user=azuritko
'nough said...
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by john knoss
Scales on fish
more non sequitur tongue in cheek (or gill)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zq0OsPZIlgw
♫ Barnes & Barnes ~~ Fish Heads (1976)
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Ben Steen
It was a time before YouTube
A time of innocence.
# Posted on July 18th 2010 by Ben Steen
Re: Scales on violin
"The problem with sheet music is that it doesn't represent the way Irish music is played. Sheet music is good for music that is complex and played the same every time, like Beethoven or Brahms. It completely fails to capture all the little ornaments, changes, and details in Irish music."
There's no difference. You'll sound like crap playing Beethoven without studying the style properly. The sheet music isn't meant to represent details of style, in either case. If you DO know the style you will know how to make effective use of the notation to play something that sounds good.
# Posted on July 19th 2010 by Jack Campin
Re: Scales on violin
Random, I'm sure I must have heard that somewhere before, maybe it's a case of deja fu, that well known Eastern martial art which involves mind over body.
# Posted on July 19th 2010 by john knoss
Re: Scales on violin
Classical is very different. Can you imagine having to pick out, learn, and memorize the second clarinet part of a Brahms symphony only by ear from listening to a full orchestra? I imagine there are people who can do it, but I played in orchestras for years and I'm sure not one of them. The whole art of symphonic composition revolved around being able to use sheet music to coordinate 100 individual musicians playing 30 to 45-minute works. In contrast, learning a 32-bar single melody by ear should be well within the grasp of anyone learning an instrument.
# Posted on July 19th 2010 by ElaineT
Re: Scales on violin
one 32 bar melody doesn't even scratch the surface.
# Posted on July 19th 2010 by Ben Steen
Re: Scales on violin
Can you imagine trying to keep a repertoire of 20,000 tunes in your head and personally pass them all on to future generations?
Notation does the otherwise-impossible for traditional music too.
Sheet music predates its use in the orchestra by several centuries. The first printed sheet music was sold about 1000 years ago in China - it was solo harp music.
# Posted on July 19th 2010 by Jack Campin
Re: Scales on violin
I always get scales on my fiddle when I use my electronic tuna
Coat!
# Posted on July 19th 2010 by Geoff Pollitt
Re: Scales on violin
I have one question now. When I am going to play maybe "The Rocky Road To Dublin (slip jig)", it is good to play before this tune the G-major scale, or A-dorian scale or both?
# Posted on July 19th 2010 by Azuritko
Re: Scales on violin
G-major and A-dorian use the same notes, so they are really the same scale.
You should just learn the notes of the tune.
# Posted on July 19th 2010 by John Galt
Re: Scales on violin
I tend to listen for the tonal center of a tune. If you can drone a single note while the tune is played that is likely to be the tonal center. For "The Rocky Road to Dublin" an A drone works. In other words while you can shift the drone to G it is mostly A.
# Posted on July 19th 2010 by Ben Steen
Re: Scales on violin
Not quite accurate, zenfiddler. The two scales share the same notes, but they start on different notes, which more often than not, is that tonal center that Random_humor is referring to.
# Posted on July 20th 2010 by AlBrown
Re: Scales on violin
More to the point for the tunes we play, it's the note the tune *ends* on (the tone it resolves to) that matters, and that determines the key (and mode).
# Posted on July 20th 2010 by Will Harmon
Re: Scales on violin
I oversimplified a bit, because of the language barrier. But mostly because I don't think Azuritko should worry about it.
I'm sure plenty of fiddlers have played great tunes, without knowing any of the academic theories involved. You don't need any of that, to play a tune well.
# Posted on July 20th 2010 by John Galt
Re: Scales on violin
I think that it is important to know what exactly you are playing to fully understand it and than you can play better. But it is true that even without any theory you can be very good player, but you must be talent.
# Posted on July 20th 2010 by Azuritko
Re: Scales on violin
Fair enough, Azuritko. That is a good attitude.
But I still think you should spend more time playing tunes than playing scales. For one thing, it's a lot more fun.
# Posted on July 20th 2010 by John Galt
Re: Scales on violin
As Mr. Gill likes to point out, scales are just bad tunes.
Azuritko, in this music, the tunes can teach you everything you need to know. The more you play them, the better you will come to understand this music (and your bow, oh, and the fiddle the noise comes out of).
# Posted on July 20th 2010 by Will Harmon
Re: Scales on violin
OK thanks a lot. Now I have to play play and play
# Posted on July 20th 2010 by Azuritko
Re: Scales on violin
I like to warm up with a few scales and arpeggios, not just because almost all tunes contain fragments of scales and arpeggios, but to check my tone and to remind my fingers where the notes are. Warming up also helps to stabilise the tuning of the strings before the music making starts.
In contrast to Mr Gill's dictum, I look on scales not as bad tunes but as important parts of good tunes. Sometimes I find myself wandering off into a tune when warming up with scales.
# Posted on July 20th 2010 by Trevor Jennings
Re: Scales on violin
I warm up on tunes. Same thing but more interesting and fun.
I like getting right into the feel of the rhythm and timing of the music. Ever notice how most people automatically play scales in 4/4? I often warm up on jigs or slip jigs.....
# Posted on July 20th 2010 by Will Harmon