I doubt it. If you shortened it to raise the fundamental pitch to B then the holes would be in the wrong places and wouldn't have the correct spacing between them. It would be like the bridge on a banjo a centimeter towards the fingerboard - the frets would be completely out of position for the new string length.
It would be easier to make your own B whistle from scratch.
I don't believe that the position of holes would be that critical in the case a semitone alteration. What would be important is the distance between the fipple and the end of the whistle. Twist off the mouthpiece, and re-glue at decreased distance. Check result using against a fixed-pitched instrument or electronic tuner. If it doesn't work - well, Generation whistles are cheap enough ...
But neither do I belive that this question was a serious one. Who would you be playing with who likes to play in five sharps? And if you were just playing solo, it wouldn't matter anyway, would it?
Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer the slings and arrows of an outrageously tuned Bb whistle, or to take up arms against it, and by opposing, change it to B?
It is possible and it sounds good. I have one. You have to trim both ends of the tube. I have mislaid the measurements, but I looked them up on the Chiffandfipple forum. Do a search for a similar topic there.
Our lead singer is now doing a few SONGS in the key of B, a few years back there was a suggestion here about changing an Eflat to an E by reducing the length which I did succesfully..and still use my sawn off eflat for e/a..so just wondered if it was worth trying same with the Bflat.
I will now chase up the measurements on C n F and see where I get..if not the F whistle seems likliest or where can I get a reasonable priced b whistle to buy..love the comments...
Hi Jumper,
thanks for that..I took 9mm off each end and that gave me some tuning range, using my korg at 440 it is spot on the middle in 2 octaves and also sounds ok in the third....that will do for me, once again thank you all for your comments......I have always had postive results here on the mustard board and once again you have came up trumps.
Why do some folks here need to present their conjecture as fact? I find that I learn more by listening and reading than by carrying on about a subject I have no knowledge of.
I tried it once and it was not quite in tune. I fixed it with tape and a file; but maybe I was unlucky. If you can get a whistle in tune in three octaves you're a better man than I am.
Tape over the existing fingerholes and drill/file a new set more tightly spaced on the other side, with a bottom vent hole to get the low B (that way you don't need to shorten the tube).
You may need to throw a couple of whistles away before you get this right, but they're meant to be a disposable instrument.
Cutting off some of the top of the whistle will bring the position of the top hole to the right place to produce, lets see...G# rather than the G of the Bb whistle. Cutting off some of the bottom (after getting the top right) will give the proper B bell tone (replacing the Bb). But, the remaining notes are proportional to the length of the tube and those proportions will have changed when the tube length is changed. And, on most whistles the size of those holes is adjusted also. So, in theory you can not just whack something off each end and get an in tune whistle in the new key. In fact though the changes may well be small enough given the total length you are working with so that the end result is quite satisfying. So, both camps are probably correct.
It reminds me a bit of the old theory of limits story: If a boy and girl start at opposite ends of the coach and the boy repeatedly moves half the distance to the girl in theory he will never reach her. But, he will get close enough for practical purposes.
I've cut down a Generation Bb to play in B and a Generation C to play it C#.
These whistles play great and play in tune.
This is what I do:
1) chop off the TOP of the body until the upper-hand notes xoo|ooo (what would be B on a D whistle) and xxo|ooo (what would be A on a D whistle) and xxx|ooo (what would be G on a D whistle) are in tune at the new target pitch.
2) you'll find that xxx|xxx (what would be Bottom D on a D whistle) is now flat. Chop the bottom until "bottom D" is in tune with "B", "A", and "G".
3) now you'll notice that "E" and "F#" are flat and those two holes will have to be carved out somewhat.
Now I suppose several experts will chime in saying that this doesn't work, but my proof is my Generation B and Generation C# whistles which both play in perfect tune. They've been used on many professional gigs including TV and/or movie soundtracks etc.
RIchard has the measure of it.
Depending on the whistle, you will be doing a wee bit of carving on some of the holes. The trick is to carve from flat to sharp .. can't un-carve. If the hole gets too big it will go sharp in octave 2. The method described is good for a semi-tone - any more than that probably won't work.
OK lads I will try that idea as well Richard and see what I end up with, so basically the answer to my query is yes and to follow Richards instruction..thanks again all of you.
Bflat whistle to B
Bflat whistle to B
Hi guys is it possible to trim my generation bflat and make it into a B.
If so how do I accomplish it.
Thanks in anticipation..Dave
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by Dave_
Re: Bflat whistle to B
I doubt it. If you shortened it to raise the fundamental pitch to B then the holes would be in the wrong places and wouldn't have the correct spacing between them. It would be like the bridge on a banjo a centimeter towards the fingerboard - the frets would be completely out of position for the new string length.
It would be easier to make your own B whistle from scratch.
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by Trevor Jennings
Re: Bflat whistle to B
"moving the bridge"
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by Trevor Jennings
Re: Bflat whistle to B
I don't believe that the position of holes would be that critical in the case a semitone alteration. What would be important is the distance between the fipple and the end of the whistle. Twist off the mouthpiece, and re-glue at decreased distance. Check result using against a fixed-pitched instrument or electronic tuner. If it doesn't work - well, Generation whistles are cheap enough ...
But neither do I belive that this question was a serious one. Who would you be playing with who likes to play in five sharps? And if you were just playing solo, it wouldn't matter anyway, would it?
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by Mix O'Lydian
Re: Bflat whistle to B
to be or to be flat...that is the question
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by Nate Ryan
Re: Bflat whistle to B
No, you can't do it.
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by gam
Re: Bflat whistle to B
Go to Chiff & Fipple and ask Jerry Freeman or one of the other tweakers/makers.
http://forums.chiffandfipple.com/viewforum.php?f=1
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by buddhuu
Re: Bflat whistle to B
"Who would you be playing with who likes to play in five sharps?"
Uilleann pipes in B are not uncommon.
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by CreadurMawnOrganig
Re: Bflat whistle to B
Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer the slings and arrows of an outrageously tuned Bb whistle, or to take up arms against it, and by opposing, change it to B?
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by Mix O'Lydian
Re: Bflat whistle to B
CreadurMawnOrganig: "Uilleann pipes in B are not uncommon."
But are they common in Spain, where the OP says that he is living?
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by Mix O'Lydian
Re: Bflat whistle to B
why do you care Poirot
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by Miss Mulligan
Re: Bflat whistle to B
Blow harder
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by Toppish
Re: Bflat whistle to B
No chance of making a Bb play B and hope to have even reasonable intonation.
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by bogman
Re: Bflat whistle to B
Talking about my g-g-ge-n-er-at-ion ...
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by Mix O'Lydian
Re: Bflat whistle to B
It is possible and it sounds good. I have one. You have to trim both ends of the tube. I have mislaid the measurements, but I looked them up on the Chiffandfipple forum. Do a search for a similar topic there.
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by ChristianRo
Re: Bflat whistle to B
Yes, you can, and I have. It works fine.
Pipemaker Bill Haneman posted instructions on C&F in 2006 for doing exactly what you want:
http://forums.chiffandfipple.com/viewtopic.php?p=508479#p508479
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by Jumper
Re: Bflat whistle to B
Hi guys thanx for the replies.
Our lead singer is now doing a few SONGS in the key of B, a few years back there was a suggestion here about changing an Eflat to an E by reducing the length which I did succesfully..and still use my sawn off eflat for e/a..so just wondered if it was worth trying same with the Bflat.
I will now chase up the measurements on C n F and see where I get..if not the F whistle seems likliest or where can I get a reasonable priced b whistle to buy..love the comments...
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by Dave_
Re: Bflat whistle to B
Hi Jumper,
thanks for that..I took 9mm off each end and that gave me some tuning range, using my korg at 440 it is spot on the middle in 2 octaves and also sounds ok in the third....that will do for me, once again thank you all for your comments......I have always had postive results here on the mustard board and once again you have came up trumps.
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by Dave_
Re: Bflat whistle to B
You're welcome, and I'm glad to be of assistance.
Why do some folks here need to present their conjecture as fact? I find that I learn more by listening and reading than by carrying on about a subject I have no knowledge of.
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by Jumper
Re: Bflat whistle to B
I tried it once and it was not quite in tune. I fixed it with tape and a file; but maybe I was unlucky. If you can get a whistle in tune in three octaves you're a better man than I am.
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by gam
Re: Bflat whistle to B
Gam:" If you can get a whistle in tune in three octaves you're a better man than I am"
It so happens that the whistle is one of my instruments, and I could certainly play it in the third (i.e. highest octave) if I wanted to.
But why would I want to? Session tunes very rarely go above high "b" in the second octave.
If a whistle is capable of being retuned for good intonation in two octaves, that should satisfy most people.
Or am I missing something here?
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by Mix O'Lydian
Re: Bflat whistle to B
I don't think so -- it's just that Dave said it sounded OK in the third octave.
# Posted on July 9th 2010 by gam
Re: Bflat whistle to B
Tape over the existing fingerholes and drill/file a new set more tightly spaced on the other side, with a bottom vent hole to get the low B (that way you don't need to shorten the tube).
You may need to throw a couple of whistles away before you get this right, but they're meant to be a disposable instrument.
# Posted on July 10th 2010 by Jack Campin
Re: Bflat whistle to B
jumper - "Why do some folks here need to present their conjecture as fact? " - because other than cutting and re-drilling it is fact.
# Posted on July 10th 2010 by bogman
Re: Bflat whistle to B
Why don't you just put a capo on it, like I do with my guitar?
# Posted on July 10th 2010 by AlBrown
Re: Bflat whistle to B
Cutting off some of the top of the whistle will bring the position of the top hole to the right place to produce, lets see...G# rather than the G of the Bb whistle. Cutting off some of the bottom (after getting the top right) will give the proper B bell tone (replacing the Bb). But, the remaining notes are proportional to the length of the tube and those proportions will have changed when the tube length is changed. And, on most whistles the size of those holes is adjusted also. So, in theory you can not just whack something off each end and get an in tune whistle in the new key. In fact though the changes may well be small enough given the total length you are working with so that the end result is quite satisfying. So, both camps are probably correct.
It reminds me a bit of the old theory of limits story: If a boy and girl start at opposite ends of the coach and the boy repeatedly moves half the distance to the girl in theory he will never reach her. But, he will get close enough for practical purposes.
# Posted on July 10th 2010 by cboody
Re: Bflat whistle to B
I've cut down a Generation Bb to play in B and a Generation C to play it C#.
These whistles play great and play in tune.
This is what I do:
1) chop off the TOP of the body until the upper-hand notes xoo|ooo (what would be B on a D whistle) and xxo|ooo (what would be A on a D whistle) and xxx|ooo (what would be G on a D whistle) are in tune at the new target pitch.
2) you'll find that xxx|xxx (what would be Bottom D on a D whistle) is now flat. Chop the bottom until "bottom D" is in tune with "B", "A", and "G".
3) now you'll notice that "E" and "F#" are flat and those two holes will have to be carved out somewhat.
Now I suppose several experts will chime in saying that this doesn't work, but my proof is my Generation B and Generation C# whistles which both play in perfect tune. They've been used on many professional gigs including TV and/or movie soundtracks etc.
# Posted on July 10th 2010 by Richard D Cook
Re: Bflat whistle to B
RIchard has the measure of it.
Depending on the whistle, you will be doing a wee bit of carving on some of the holes. The trick is to carve from flat to sharp .. can't un-carve. If the hole gets too big it will go sharp in octave 2. The method described is good for a semi-tone - any more than that probably won't work.
# Posted on July 12th 2010 by Mozle
Re: Bflat whistle to B
OK lads I will try that idea as well Richard and see what I end up with, so basically the answer to my query is yes and to follow Richards instruction..thanks again all of you.
# Posted on July 12th 2010 by Dave_