At the moment, when I want to really annoy people by being loud, I use an "open" mike on a boom.
While happy with the sound (if not my standard of playing), I get fed up lugging all the equipment arround with me. In the past I have used piezo electric type pick-ups but have never liked the tinny results.
Any one out there used Micro Vox or have any other suggestions?
By the way, this is for gigs, NOT for use in a session.
Yeah, I'd appreciate some fresh input (har har) on this as well, as it looks like I may have to give in and buy a real pickup for a gig two months from now.
Anything which fits on, or in, the bridge is bound to mute the acoustic sound somewhat. I now use a little Yamaha swan neck condenser mike which clips comfortably on the chin rest and sits just behind the bridge. I use a waist band pre-amp (with regional effects...turn the knob one way it sounds Sligo, the other and it sounds Clare....OK I made that bit up, but it does have reverb effects if you want them) and have a direct input to the mixing desk. There is always, with this type of microphone, the problem of feedback but, if you see where those areas are just avoid pointing the fiddle that way. It has never been a problem and the truly acoustic sound I get is better than any transducer mike I have used in the past. Best of luck with it.
... see there my posting about the schertler system. I´m still in the long process of filling my saving box to be able to buy a schertler system one day...
in the meantime I use the little condenser mic I mentioned. Lately had a gig with my mates as an opener to some classic rock band (guitar, accordion fiddle for 45 minutes with some ballads and a bunch of tunes). we played on the big stage to an audience of 700 .... After a few tunes I produced a terrible feed back by bringing my mic too close to the stage monitor. the monitor sound engineer shut down my monitor sound and I was not able anymore to hear my fiddling - so I went through this "blind" only guided by the tapping of my pals feet ... it was a bad snafu situation..
in about ten days we have a similar gig with a Ska band and decided to have a couple of tunes accompanied by these guys after us and them will have finished the regular sets ... to avoid the mentioned above trouble I use the piezo pick up fiddle (shadow + fishman) and feed the flat piezo sound into some effect device. thats something different than natural trad irish fiddle sound ... but for me it is fine in this situation.
I have a Fishman on one fidlle - after trying several others - the worst of which was the Microvox. I now have a Tim Phillips electro acoustic fiddle which my husband, who is our bands sound engineer, says gives him the cleanest signal of any thing we've tried so far.
Has anyone tried the new Concertmaster shoulder rest yet - this is supposed to give the advantage of both mic and piezo but with an ability to split the signal so that the monitors don't create feedback from the mic. It's quite expensive but if it works it would be worth it for my 5 string and octave fiddles which I don't tend to use for gigs much as I can't get a quality of sound I'm happy with
I realise that in effect I am replying to myself but I would like to point out that my request was intended for amplification of an octave mandola. Apologies for not making that clear but drink had been taken.
for octave mandolas, best solution to amplifcation in my experience is to construct a "live" bridge. a new bridge (made of the densest material available - good grade ebony works well) is made to match the existing bridge as closely as possible. a top grade acoustic piezo element (like a schatten or headway) is permanently mounted inside this bridge in such a way that minimal vibration is necessary to excite the pick-up (ie fairly near the top). this signal can then be fed to either an on-board or pedal mounted pre-amp/EQ unit which should give you a lovely fat sound with minimal feed-back problems. it's a bit fiddly but it's worth the effort. i wouldn;t waste my time with microvox..
Geoff, have you tried one of those mikes-in-the-soundpost mikes? I have a friend who really loves hers but it's really pricey and I'm not sure I want to go to that kind of expense without getting REALLY good sound...
I think I heard "Marcus Baggs" or something that sounded like that is the standard for casual pros in my town with more money to blow than myself, who want their pickup to be a permanent attachment. I use a little pick-up that clips onto my bridge. It's light enough not to mute the sound much and comes with a decent preamp for about 300 bucks. I'll be damned if I can remember what it's called now though. Whether or not it sounds any good seems to have a lot to do with the sound guy. The big seller for me is that I can take it off effortlessly for the au naturel experience when I am not plugged in and avoid that awkward looking pointless quarter inch input jack that serves no purpose at an acoustic session but to show everybody you're so good that somewhere, somebody with speakers lets you play loud. (Before anybody gets offended - it's only the aesthetic of useless technological appendages on small elegant pieces of art that I dislike, not the people who have opted for permanent pickups to be installed. After all, some of my best friends have useless appendages!)
Was in Ireland for "a month" (in other words three). Hot diggity dog I had a good time.
I suddenly got the job of my dreams last night. A too good to be true job that pays way more money than I would ever know what to do with. (In a vague attempt to stay on topic: MAYBE I WILL BUT A NEW FIDDLE PICK-UP WITH MY BIG PILE OF CASH). Now on with the personal stuff...
Yow! Three months! Lucky you! Where'd you go? What'd you do? What's the new job? Three months in Ireland! Play a lot? Who'd you play with!? Bet you're damned good now, me lass...
I'm OK. I played just about every night all night. I still stink compared to all the people I was playing with, but managed to pick up quite a few tunes, tips, delightfully musical boyfriends, gigs and a job a tiny Gaeltacht island that I love with every fiber of my being. I am a fairly sluggish traveller (and I know a good thing when I see it) so I spent nearly all of my time there. I took a glance at this and that from Waterford to the Giant's Causeway, (WHERE I OVERHEARD A MAGNIFICENT DISCUSSION RE. FIDDLE PICK-UPS...)
The new job is a "Music Industry Job", flying around first class and drinking. (I promise I will let you know if it's just a malicious prank.)
I am also looking for a pickup for the M&E as I would like to use it at a fairly noisy market I often play at.
Have been reluctant to seek advice as it could be seen as heretical by some.
Have seen little strap on jobbies on the net and tried one out in Halifax but it was pricey . Do use a voice mike but thought a flute mike would work better?
No too terrible much. More of the same really, your life sounds much more exciting than mine recently!
The new job sounds fab! Let us know if you can make any of us famous. *grin* Or at least money. Money would be nice. I can just see you now, jetting about, hobnobbing with...well, that part might not be so fun, but the jetset stuff would be, especially staying in nice hotels where you don't need to worry what's going to come out of the showerhead before the water does.
Pete used to be a rep for Sony, College. He hated it after the thrill of hanging out with all those stars wore off. But it's nice having the gold record on our wall. Wish we had his others so we had a set.
Yup, now I know you must be very good these days, because all the very good players I know talk about how much they stink compared to whoever they were playing with in Ireland. The fact remains, however, that they were indeed playing with those people, so modesty may forbid, but I have my suspicions, chick.
Hey, get Michael Bolton to write me a rhyme about hornpipes, willya?
I've heard of the sound post jobbies but they are expensive and my Yamaha swan neck works really well so I will stick with it ....it also clips on and off very easily and can be switched to my mandolin with ease.
I heard the Headway Pickups demonstrated at a guitar festival a few years ago. They were very impressive. The Band pickup they have for the violin gave excellent quality sound and it's a noninvasive install. They still recommend a preamp however.
Bob http://www.headwayelectronics.com/
Clair (my mom) loved Clare (the county). When we went to Kerry it was too foggy to be very lovable.
The job did turn out to be a malicious prank. Toronto girls, watch out for guys named Edward who offer you glamorous sounding jobs working for Columbia House. And, as my grandmother warned me, "never trust a man with a mustache." (Apologies for all the mustachioed gents here who disagree with her advice.)
So it looks like I get to be a temp for a while. Whoopee.
Electrocute me
Electrocute me
At the moment, when I want to really annoy people by being loud, I use an "open" mike on a boom.
While happy with the sound (if not my standard of playing), I get fed up lugging all the equipment arround with me. In the past I have used piezo electric type pick-ups but have never liked the tinny results.
Any one out there used Micro Vox or have any other suggestions?
By the way, this is for gigs, NOT for use in a session.
# Posted on November 25th 2003 by len
Re: Electrocute me
Yeah, I'd appreciate some fresh input (har har) on this as well, as it looks like I may have to give in and buy a real pickup for a gig two months from now.
# Posted on November 25th 2003 by Zina Lee
Re: Electrocute me
Anything which fits on, or in, the bridge is bound to mute the acoustic sound somewhat. I now use a little Yamaha swan neck condenser mike which clips comfortably on the chin rest and sits just behind the bridge. I use a waist band pre-amp (with regional effects...turn the knob one way it sounds Sligo, the other and it sounds Clare....OK I made that bit up, but it does have reverb effects if you want them) and have a direct input to the mixing desk. There is always, with this type of microphone, the problem of feedback but, if you see where those areas are just avoid pointing the fiddle that way. It has never been a problem and the truly acoustic sound I get is better than any transducer mike I have used in the past. Best of luck with it.
# Posted on November 25th 2003 by Geoff Pollitt
Re: Electrocute me
http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display.php/1446
http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display.php/1256
... see there my posting about the schertler system. I´m still in the long process of filling my saving box to be able to buy a schertler system one day...
in the meantime I use the little condenser mic I mentioned. Lately had a gig with my mates as an opener to some classic rock band (guitar, accordion fiddle for 45 minutes with some ballads and a bunch of tunes). we played on the big stage to an audience of 700 .... After a few tunes I produced a terrible feed back by bringing my mic too close to the stage monitor. the monitor sound engineer shut down my monitor sound and I was not able anymore to hear my fiddling - so I went through this "blind" only guided by the tapping of my pals feet ... it was a bad snafu situation..
in about ten days we have a similar gig with a Ska band and decided to have a couple of tunes accompanied by these guys after us and them will have finished the regular sets ... to avoid the mentioned above trouble I use the piezo pick up fiddle (shadow + fishman) and feed the flat piezo sound into some effect device. thats something different than natural trad irish fiddle sound ... but for me it is fine in this situation.
# Posted on November 25th 2003 by crannog
Re: Electrocute me
I have a Fishman on one fidlle - after trying several others - the worst of which was the Microvox. I now have a Tim Phillips electro acoustic fiddle which my husband, who is our bands sound engineer, says gives him the cleanest signal of any thing we've tried so far.
Has anyone tried the new Concertmaster shoulder rest yet - this is supposed to give the advantage of both mic and piezo but with an ability to split the signal so that the monitors don't create feedback from the mic. It's quite expensive but if it works it would be worth it for my 5 string and octave fiddles which I don't tend to use for gigs much as I can't get a quality of sound I'm happy with
# Posted on November 25th 2003 by Tarrantella
Re: Electrocute me
I realise that in effect I am replying to myself but I would like to point out that my request was intended for amplification of an octave mandola. Apologies for not making that clear but drink had been taken.
# Posted on November 26th 2003 by len
Re: Electrocute me
for octave mandolas, best solution to amplifcation in my experience is to construct a "live" bridge. a new bridge (made of the densest material available - good grade ebony works well) is made to match the existing bridge as closely as possible. a top grade acoustic piezo element (like a schatten or headway) is permanently mounted inside this bridge in such a way that minimal vibration is necessary to excite the pick-up (ie fairly near the top). this signal can then be fed to either an on-board or pedal mounted pre-amp/EQ unit which should give you a lovely fat sound with minimal feed-back problems. it's a bit fiddly but it's worth the effort. i wouldn;t waste my time with microvox..
# Posted on November 26th 2003 by teetotaller
Re: Electrocute me
Geoff, have you tried one of those mikes-in-the-soundpost mikes? I have a friend who really loves hers but it's really pricey and I'm not sure I want to go to that kind of expense without getting REALLY good sound...
# Posted on November 26th 2003 by Zina Lee
Re: Electrocute me
I think I heard "Marcus Baggs" or something that sounded like that is the standard for casual pros in my town with more money to blow than myself, who want their pickup to be a permanent attachment. I use a little pick-up that clips onto my bridge. It's light enough not to mute the sound much and comes with a decent preamp for about 300 bucks. I'll be damned if I can remember what it's called now though. Whether or not it sounds any good seems to have a lot to do with the sound guy. The big seller for me is that I can take it off effortlessly for the au naturel experience when I am not plugged in and avoid that awkward looking pointless quarter inch input jack that serves no purpose at an acoustic session but to show everybody you're so good that somewhere, somebody with speakers lets you play loud. (Before anybody gets offended - it's only the aesthetic of useless technological appendages on small elegant pieces of art that I dislike, not the people who have opted for permanent pickups to be installed. After all, some of my best friends have useless appendages!)
# Posted on November 26th 2003 by Kerri Brown
Re: Electrocute me
KERRI! KERRI! Woweee!!!!! Hey, you, what are YOU up to these days!? Heard you took a trip to Ireland...what the hell is up with you, girlfriend!?!
# Posted on November 26th 2003 by Zina Lee
Re: Electrocute me
Was in Ireland for "a month" (in other words three). Hot diggity dog I had a good time.
I suddenly got the job of my dreams last night. A too good to be true job that pays way more money than I would ever know what to do with. (In a vague attempt to stay on topic: MAYBE I WILL BUT A NEW FIDDLE PICK-UP WITH MY BIG PILE OF CASH). Now on with the personal stuff...
I'm back in Toronto. Sobering up.
# Posted on November 26th 2003 by Kerri Brown
Re: Electrocute me
Yow! Three months! Lucky you! Where'd you go? What'd you do? What's the new job? Three months in Ireland! Play a lot? Who'd you play with!? Bet you're damned good now, me lass...
# Posted on November 26th 2003 by Zina Lee
Re: Electrocute me
I'm OK. I played just about every night all night. I still stink compared to all the people I was playing with, but managed to pick up quite a few tunes, tips, delightfully musical boyfriends, gigs and a job a tiny Gaeltacht island that I love with every fiber of my being. I am a fairly sluggish traveller (and I know a good thing when I see it) so I spent nearly all of my time there. I took a glance at this and that from Waterford to the Giant's Causeway, (WHERE I OVERHEARD A MAGNIFICENT DISCUSSION RE. FIDDLE PICK-UPS...)
The new job is a "Music Industry Job", flying around first class and drinking. (I promise I will let you know if it's just a malicious prank.)
What's up with you?
# Posted on November 26th 2003 by Kerri Brown
Re: Electrocute me
I am also looking for a pickup for the M&E as I would like to use it at a fairly noisy market I often play at.
Have been reluctant to seek advice as it could be seen as heretical by some.
Have seen little strap on jobbies on the net and tried one out in Halifax but it was pricey . Do use a voice mike but thought a flute mike would work better?
peter
# Posted on November 26th 2003 by ppitussi
Re: Electrocute me
No too terrible much. More of the same really, your life sounds much more exciting than mine recently!
The new job sounds fab! Let us know if you can make any of us famous. *grin* Or at least money. Money would be nice. I can just see you now, jetting about, hobnobbing with...well, that part might not be so fun, but the jetset stuff would be, especially staying in nice hotels where you don't need to worry what's going to come out of the showerhead before the water does.
Pete used to be a rep for Sony, College. He hated it after the thrill of hanging out with all those stars wore off. But it's nice having the gold record on our wall. Wish we had his others so we had a set.
Yup, now I know you must be very good these days, because all the very good players I know talk about how much they stink compared to whoever they were playing with in Ireland. The fact remains, however, that they were indeed playing with those people, so modesty may forbid, but I have my suspicions, chick.
Hey, get Michael Bolton to write me a rhyme about hornpipes, willya?
zls
# Posted on November 26th 2003 by Zina Lee
Re: Electrocute me
Zina!
I've heard of the sound post jobbies but they are expensive and my Yamaha swan neck works really well so I will stick with it ....it also clips on and off very easily and can be switched to my mandolin with ease.
Good to hear from fiddleronvermouth again.
# Posted on November 26th 2003 by Geoff Pollitt
Re: Electrocute me
I heard the Headway Pickups demonstrated at a guitar festival a few years ago. They were very impressive. The Band pickup they have for the violin gave excellent quality sound and it's a noninvasive install. They still recommend a preamp however.
Bob
http://www.headwayelectronics.com/
# Posted on November 27th 2003 by bmcivor
Re: Electrocute me
So Kerri is back from Kerry. And how is Claire? ;o)
# Posted on November 27th 2003 by crannog
Re: Electrocute me
Clair (my mom) loved Clare (the county). When we went to Kerry it was too foggy to be very lovable.
The job did turn out to be a malicious prank. Toronto girls, watch out for guys named Edward who offer you glamorous sounding jobs working for Columbia House. And, as my grandmother warned me, "never trust a man with a mustache." (Apologies for all the mustachioed gents here who disagree with her advice.)
So it looks like I get to be a temp for a while. Whoopee.
# Posted on December 1st 2003 by Kerri Brown
Re: Electrocute me
Oh, what a bummer, Kerri. Kill him.
# Posted on December 1st 2003 by Zina Lee