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Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
Hey, folks,
I've been lurking around here for the last few weeks sponging up information and advice, so I figured I'd start contributing. I'm a 15+ year musician (mainly bass in metal and hardcore punk bands) just taking my first steps with The Tunes. I'm in Massachusetts (closer to Worcester than Boston), so there's at least one biweekly session available to me in Worcester (and about a million in Boston), but I know that one doesn't just turn up and demand to be taught - currently I know all of one tune (Sleep Soond I'da Moarnin') (I know, not ITM, still a great tune), and I'm about halfway through The Nine Points of Roguery, but I don't imagine that's enough to allow me to participate in a non-beginner session in any meaningful fashion.
So, I've resolved to start teaching the tunes as fast as I can learn them. I've got a good number of friends and acquaintances who are into various folk styles, so it shouldn't be all that impossible to get a few people on the same page. It does mean that I'm putting myself through a sort of "ITM boot camp" - I've got to learn how to arrange for any instrument anybody might bring, as well as my own. (Currently, I'm learning the melodies on flatpicked guitar, and working on the tin whistle. Hope to pick up a banjo and/or a decent mandolin at some point soon.)
Which leads me to my main question: I know that the melody players do their thing, and that the accompaniment players do theirs (and hopefully not too many of'em at the same time), but are there any resources for how to arrange for the "in between" instruments? Piano accordion, for example - am I understanding it correctly that the box player does melody on the keys and chordal accompaniment on the buttons? The banjo - melody, chords, or both?
Beyond that, any general advice for a raw beginner who's starting from the ground up? Good tunes to learn/teach?
I'll give you the rundown as I have it, so far. Again, I'm doing melody on guitar for the time being - always too many guitars, I know, but it's something I can pick up quickly for the time being. Once I have some of the tunes passed on to other people, I can start messing with the whistle a bit more. I've got another guitarist (ideally we'd be able to trade off doing melody and accompaniment), a piano accordion player (who's just learning the instrument, although he's otherwise an accomplished musician), a percussionist (the drummer in my main band - I still have to convince him that snares are for ceilidhs, outside, not so much for the pub, and that the bodhran is better suited for the environment), and potentially two fiddlers (one who plays a bit, one who's pretty green). The odds of attracting a random piper are a bit slim, so I'll probably have to make do with two out of three (of the Big Three). And there you have it.
Anyway, any and all advice is welcome (and I may even follow some of it!). This site has proven to be a great resource, and I'll be sure to list the session once I actually have a date. (Trying to get at least three tunes under my belt before we get started.)
Re: Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
Ah, the enthusiasm of youth ! ( Pauses to tap the dottle out of his curly pipe, and take a hefty swig of Old Scrottum mild'n'bitter from his pewter tankard ).
I suggest two lines of action; one is to take as many of these mates of yours as may be legitimably allowed to enter wherever one of these sessions you know of, and let them, no MAKE THEM, just stand in a corner, not bother the musicians, and try and understand as much as possible of what is going on musically in the course of the evening.
Two; if there are any left after this event, go to the list of the most popular tunes in the listings,and get them all to start learning the melodies of these, one by one and together.
Forget backing/accompaniment; this tradition is essentially and remains a melodic, not harmonic, style of playing. Backing is purely periferral and unimportant.
Come back to me again and report on progress in a couple of years' time. And not before.
Oh, and if I hear of you out in public, claiming any sort of experience and right to be heard, I'll tan your hide, you little varmint !
Re: Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
Best advice is to have a musician *experienced* in Irish music teach such a thing. Why would anybody want to learn from somebody who doesn't know what they're doing? Find a teacher and 10 committed students, and have them all contribute $10 to each lesson to pay the teacher for his time. The teacher can make mp3's and have structured material for each lesson. There's a very similar program in this area and it works quite well.
Note: The teachers and student must be committed, and paying upfront for a block of 10 lessons is a good idea to cement the deal for everybody.
Re: Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
DYA,
As you go forth planning your learning session, why not come to ours and see how it goes? Hop on the Pike to exit 17, take Washington Street all the way through Brighton Center, and the Green Briar will be on your right.
The learning session goes from 7 to 8:45 on Monday evenings.
See my bio for the full link. Good luck to you!
Re: Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
How do you eat an elephant?
One bite at a time.
How do you learn this music?
One tune at a time.
Click on my user name and under my bio, find some info on playing this music, which includes the 'famous' Dow's List of 50 common session tunes that are a good starting point.
And the Green Briar, that Greg recommends, is a great starting place for many a musician....Never been there myself but I have met many people who have.
Enjoy!
Re: Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
I'll second what Forrest Tucker said - FWIW learn the fiddle. Play the melodies. It can be a bit painful to start with but get over that and its well worth it.
Re: Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
If you try to learn and teach this music in a hurry, you'll ineveitably do both badly.
In addition to the good advice above, check out things like the BBC Virtual Session or The Working Party Videos.
I would also get hold of some of the seminal recordings of the music and maybe have listening parties with your friends to start absorbing the subtle things that make the music really come alive.
Re: Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
Well, I went looking for strong opinions, and it looks like I came to the right place! ;)
I'm still determined to take a "damn the torpedoes approach" and jump in with both feet here, but I can certainly see that tracking down a tutor will be worth my while. All the same, I'll continue learning the tunes by ear until that happens. I'll be pushing that aspect real hard with anybody that signs on for the learning sessions - and no worries, everyone will be attending a pre-existing session to see what the deal is, first.
Speaking of which, I went to check out the session at Fiddler's Green in Worcester yesterday. Great stuff; they were very welcoming and it seems like a beginner-friendly environment. With any luck, I'll be able to make the next one with a guitar in hand. (Have a feeling I'll be a little worse for wear that day, though; the regular band is playing out the night before.)
Greg, thanks for the invite! Monday is my regular band practice night, but I'll make sure and set one aside to check out the deal at the Briar.
Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
Hey, folks,
I've been lurking around here for the last few weeks sponging up information and advice, so I figured I'd start contributing. I'm a 15+ year musician (mainly bass in metal and hardcore punk bands) just taking my first steps with The Tunes. I'm in Massachusetts (closer to Worcester than Boston), so there's at least one biweekly session available to me in Worcester (and about a million in Boston), but I know that one doesn't just turn up and demand to be taught - currently I know all of one tune (Sleep Soond I'da Moarnin') (I know, not ITM, still a great tune), and I'm about halfway through The Nine Points of Roguery, but I don't imagine that's enough to allow me to participate in a non-beginner session in any meaningful fashion.
So, I've resolved to start teaching the tunes as fast as I can learn them. I've got a good number of friends and acquaintances who are into various folk styles, so it shouldn't be all that impossible to get a few people on the same page. It does mean that I'm putting myself through a sort of "ITM boot camp" - I've got to learn how to arrange for any instrument anybody might bring, as well as my own. (Currently, I'm learning the melodies on flatpicked guitar, and working on the tin whistle. Hope to pick up a banjo and/or a decent mandolin at some point soon.)
Which leads me to my main question: I know that the melody players do their thing, and that the accompaniment players do theirs (and hopefully not too many of'em at the same time), but are there any resources for how to arrange for the "in between" instruments? Piano accordion, for example - am I understanding it correctly that the box player does melody on the keys and chordal accompaniment on the buttons? The banjo - melody, chords, or both?
Beyond that, any general advice for a raw beginner who's starting from the ground up? Good tunes to learn/teach?
I'll give you the rundown as I have it, so far. Again, I'm doing melody on guitar for the time being - always too many guitars, I know, but it's something I can pick up quickly for the time being. Once I have some of the tunes passed on to other people, I can start messing with the whistle a bit more. I've got another guitarist (ideally we'd be able to trade off doing melody and accompaniment), a piano accordion player (who's just learning the instrument, although he's otherwise an accomplished musician), a percussionist (the drummer in my main band - I still have to convince him that snares are for ceilidhs, outside, not so much for the pub, and that the bodhran is better suited for the environment), and potentially two fiddlers (one who plays a bit, one who's pretty green). The odds of attracting a random piper are a bit slim, so I'll probably have to make do with two out of three (of the Big Three). And there you have it.
Anyway, any and all advice is welcome (and I may even follow some of it!). This site has proven to be a great resource, and I'll be sure to list the session once I actually have a date. (Trying to get at least three tunes under my belt before we get started.)
DYA
# Posted on July 26th 2009 by DestroyYouAlot
Re: Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
Ah, the enthusiasm of youth ! ( Pauses to tap the dottle out of his curly pipe, and take a hefty swig of Old Scrottum mild'n'bitter from his pewter tankard ).
I suggest two lines of action; one is to take as many of these mates of yours as may be legitimably allowed to enter wherever one of these sessions you know of, and let them, no MAKE THEM, just stand in a corner, not bother the musicians, and try and understand as much as possible of what is going on musically in the course of the evening.
Two; if there are any left after this event, go to the list of the most popular tunes in the listings,and get them all to start learning the melodies of these, one by one and together.
Forget backing/accompaniment; this tradition is essentially and remains a melodic, not harmonic, style of playing. Backing is purely periferral and unimportant.
Come back to me again and report on progress in a couple of years' time. And not before.
Oh, and if I hear of you out in public, claiming any sort of experience and right to be heard, I'll tan your hide, you little varmint !
# Posted on July 26th 2009 by Guernsey Pete
Re: Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
Best advice is to have a musician *experienced* in Irish music teach such a thing. Why would anybody want to learn from somebody who doesn't know what they're doing? Find a teacher and 10 committed students, and have them all contribute $10 to each lesson to pay the teacher for his time. The teacher can make mp3's and have structured material for each lesson. There's a very similar program in this area and it works quite well.
Note: The teachers and student must be committed, and paying upfront for a block of 10 lessons is a good idea to cement the deal for everybody.
# Posted on July 26th 2009 by awildman
Re: Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
DYA,
As you go forth planning your learning session, why not come to ours and see how it goes? Hop on the Pike to exit 17, take Washington Street all the way through Brighton Center, and the Green Briar will be on your right.
The learning session goes from 7 to 8:45 on Monday evenings.
See my bio for the full link. Good luck to you!
# Posted on July 26th 2009 by Greg the Piano Tuner
Re: Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
Yes, do find somebody who knows something about this music, don't be "the blind leading the blind."
I know a fellow who switched from guitar to tenor banjo and mandolin, and it definitely worked out well for him--he knows lots and lots of tunes now.
But if you have the courage and fortitude for it--it's not for the weak of heart!--learn the fiddle.
# Posted on July 26th 2009 by John Galt
Re: Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
How do you eat an elephant?
One bite at a time.
How do you learn this music?
One tune at a time.
Click on my user name and under my bio, find some info on playing this music, which includes the 'famous' Dow's List of 50 common session tunes that are a good starting point.
And the Green Briar, that Greg recommends, is a great starting place for many a musician....Never been there myself but I have met many people who have.
Enjoy!
# Posted on July 26th 2009 by AlBrown
Re: Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
I'll second what Forrest Tucker said - FWIW learn the fiddle. Play the melodies. It can be a bit painful to start with but get over that and its well worth it.
# Posted on July 26th 2009 by sashiko calico
Re: Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
If you try to learn and teach this music in a hurry, you'll ineveitably do both badly.
In addition to the good advice above, check out things like the BBC Virtual Session or The Working Party Videos.
I would also get hold of some of the seminal recordings of the music and maybe have listening parties with your friends to start absorbing the subtle things that make the music really come alive.
# Posted on July 27th 2009 by Steve L
Re: Starting from the ground up - arranging a learning session in Worcester, Massacusetts
Well, I went looking for strong opinions, and it looks like I came to the right place! ;)
I'm still determined to take a "damn the torpedoes approach" and jump in with both feet here, but I can certainly see that tracking down a tutor will be worth my while. All the same, I'll continue learning the tunes by ear until that happens. I'll be pushing that aspect real hard with anybody that signs on for the learning sessions - and no worries, everyone will be attending a pre-existing session to see what the deal is, first.
Speaking of which, I went to check out the session at Fiddler's Green in Worcester yesterday. Great stuff; they were very welcoming and it seems like a beginner-friendly environment. With any luck, I'll be able to make the next one with a guitar in hand. (Have a feeling I'll be a little worse for wear that day, though; the regular band is playing out the night before.)
Greg, thanks for the invite! Monday is my regular band practice night, but I'll make sure and set one aside to check out the deal at the Briar.
# Posted on July 27th 2009 by DestroyYouAlot