If you want perfection off you go and play classical music where everything is structured and only certain instruments allowed.
Surely the attraction of ITM is that it's fun to play and listen to. Have a look at the first youtube clip. Is anyone there not enjoying themselves?

If you want purism can we take it that Irish Traditional Music should only be played by people born and bred on this Island (Ireland) and should only be listened to by Irish people is strict silence.

Are you in favour of C#D or do you hate all box players with equal contempt

# Posted on June 3rd 2009 by southpaw

Re: the b/c box

this thread has been started to raise a few hackles , and it seems to have worked! balladfans head must be up his box.

# Posted on June 3rd 2009 by myparasgon

Re: the b/c box

Well........when you think about Balledfan's original question it does raise a few questions about the position of the box in Irish Trad Music over the years.
Firstly 'they' removed one of the straps from what was usually a two strap instrument (Mind you, I think that was done so that box players could avoid standing up when playing the National Anthem)
Then 'they' avoided using the basses (tits on a bull comes to mind)
Then 'they' ripped out the original reeds and turned it into a concertina sounding instrument.
Lastly, 'they' spent the rest of the time arguing about the merits of B/C as against C#/D tuning.
So why not scrap it altogether and let us box players get on with playing all the other types of music that is available for the accordion.

# Posted on June 3rd 2009 by Free Reed

Re: the b/c box

Never heard such sh*te in all my life. So what instrument is solely associated with ITM then? As for the B/C box well what has one or two straps got to do with it's sound? Not every one avoids the basses in fact listen to the basses on this clip:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9qOiYoaxUc&feature=channel_page

As for the reed sound it's a matter of personal taste.

# Posted on June 3rd 2009 by upmine3

Re: the b/c box

FR's irony evidently lost on you there upmine!

# Posted on June 3rd 2009 by Jeeves Tones

Re: the b/c box

Geez upmine - that bait was pretty obvious wasn't it? The whole thread is an obvious wind-up.

Which is nice.

# Posted on June 4th 2009 by Martin_BC

Re: the b/c box

What exactly is a balled fan?

Hmmmm

# Posted on June 4th 2009 by Lint - upon - Tweed

Re: the b/c box

"Mind you, I think that was done so that box players could avoid standing up when playing the National Anthem"
That's a good one Free .. years ago I used to drink betimes with friends who would have rather disparaging views on the sentiments expressed in the above and who would resolutely refuse to stand to ATTENTION when it was trotted out. It can be a lonely place to be in a busy rural pub.. now, if only we had boxes to hide behind.
These days, I'd be inclined to be a little more diplomatic and stand with the sheep but I'd still have my reservations..

# Posted on June 4th 2009 by the wounded hussar

Re: the b/c box

Ah Feck it - I tried to be constuctive only to be told it's lt's a load of cack, spelt with an S......I'm smarting now......walks slowly away playing his harmonica with the sound of James Keane ringing in his ears..

# Posted on June 4th 2009 by Free Reed

Re: the g/d box

One would get the impression from sessions in England, that only English tunes must only be played, as slowly as possible, in the keys of G and D, with the basses played as often as possible, changing chord as little as possible.

Give me a C/G box any day.
Anglos Rule.

# Posted on June 4th 2009 by geoffwright

Re: the b/c box

I hate this kind of post.

Isn't there an instrument joke website where people interested in this sort of discussion can go to satisfy their negative angst.

I appreciate some of the regulars who responded above carrying on a civil conversation. But the question on its face isn't worth dignifying.

AArrgh

# Posted on June 4th 2009 by zippydw

Re: the b/c box

Zippy, the OP does have a a point IMO. If only he had asked the question in a different way we might (just might) have got a reasonable discussion about the effect on Irish music of the accordion in general, and the B/C accordion in particular.

There is lot that could be said about this. Great as accordions are in many respects (and I have to say that because I play one) they have major limitations in a number of areas, and it is a fact that these limited instruments have had a huge and sometimes devastating impact on music traditions all over the world. In some regions they have come to define what traditional (esp. dance) music is and how it is played, and have all but squeezed out less powerful but more interesting instruments.

Whether what accordions "have done for" traditional music (Irish or other) is entirely positive, entirely negative or somewhere in between is a matter of taste, opinion, aesthetics, etc.

# Posted on June 4th 2009 by Jeeves Tones

Re: the b/c box

Jeez i walked right into this one, last time i post after necking 4 bottles of Hobgoblin lol

# Posted on June 4th 2009 by upmine3

Re: the b/c box

Whether its bodhrans, spoons, accordians or blonde pixies flitting about in sheer costumes with fiddles, it just seemed those were all 'well-beaten horses' as it were. Historically many threads on the subjects.

Recently we have had a few posts out of the blue by people who discover the Mustard board, start a bit of a row and disappear. Not terribly productive. So I chose to be orthodox since I warned weeks ago that I would occasionally swing over to 'the dark side' since that did provide a valuable counterpoint from time to time.

And put in my earnest 2 cents. Long Day. Short level of patience.

# Posted on June 4th 2009 by zippydw

Re: the b/c box

The B/C box allows the button accordion to play in a more flowing, lilting style than the C#/D; it has smoother bellows motion (due to large portions of scales being in the same bellows direction rather than constantly going in and out). There's been wonderful traditional music played on it. While it can still pulse, and while the rhythmic nature of the box can still be utilized, the B/C accordion has created a style of box-playing that can suit almost all Irish music, and is quite a bit more versatile than its counterparts in other keys.

Bear in mind that the fiddle was once a new instrument in Irish music. People probably balked at it then too.

# Posted on June 7th 2009 by Zazzaliss

Re: the b/c box

There is nothing inherent in the B/C box that make it smoother than any other system. It's the practice required to make it sound smooth in one key that enable the player to be smooth in another key. It's more of an approach to playing by the player than any physical advantages.

# Posted on June 8th 2009 by Paul_draper

Re: the b/c box

Perhaps that's true; however, most C#/D players that I've seen tend to stay on the D row, which makes for a more rhythmic approach.

# Posted on June 8th 2009 by Zazzaliss

Re: the b/c box

If you don't have rythem you dont have anything

# Posted on June 10th 2009 by balledfan