Much has been written about session etiquette but I thought it would be nice to tease this out with a group of musicians from very differing backgrounds. These are the views of last week's Foinn Seisiún workshop group of 25 or so musicians from around the globe (Alaska to Australia, Colorado to Japan and places in between). The list which evolved over the 5 days of the workshop is as follows:-
1) LISTEN
2) Ask before attempting to record the session
3) Don’t leave recording device on during discussions between tunes
4) Don’t “put down” tunes (eg the Kesh Jig syndrome)
5) Don’t hi jack someone else’s set (also includes interference with tempo)
6) Be open and friendly
7) Don’t attempt to play tunes you don’t know
8) Don’t play too many tunes others don’t know
9) Always switch off mobile phones
10) Don’t Noodle
11) Remember only one bodhrán player at a time
This list may not be too significant due to the low sample – 25 or so musicians – but then again it was allowed to grow naturally without any prompting (for example the mobile phone one got added when mine went off during the workshop!) and it makes a lot of commonsense. The first one “Listen” we all agreed to be most important as it covers everything from tuning to keeping together, etc and probably obviates the need for some of the others in particular Nos. 5 and 10. All of the others were agreed unanimously apart from No. 11 which was almost 50/50
I hope the above is fairly accurate but as there were a few Yellow Boarders there I'm sure I'll be put right if there are any omissions. If anyone else has additional comments or vehemently disagrees with any of these points it would be interesting to hear your views.
get ta foook! who out there has a problem with people's phones being on? never heard that one before. How else is one meant to hear word where the better session without stupid rules like this is?!
Hmmm. When they're typed up like that, the list comes across like a session police poster. A little too serious and formal. But I don't really disagree with any of them.
Except I would amend #7 to allow players who really can learn tunes on the fly to discretely do so. Good players learn tunes this way, and they can support less experienced players when no one else knows the tune.
Also, even though #1 should do the trick, lots of people need an explicit reminder to keep their volume in line with the rest of the circle.
All of those rules are broken every week at the session I regularly go to. I could just stay at home... But then I'd miss out on the excitement, the unpredictability, the petty annoyances, the larger-than-life personalities, the inspirational, the dreadful etc. I could try and control everybody by putting a little list of do's and don'ts on each seat - if I want my head kicked in, that is!
Well, if you want rules, why not go to the conservatory, learn classical music, play from sheet and listen only to the conductor. Then you have set rules and no bodhrans.
Why must there be so much rules? Can't we just have fun with the music, and just enjoy ourselfs???
I have had some great sessions with 3 or even more bodhran players (who lestened to each other), so that is possible.
Also, I hope people will allways play tunes the rest doesn't know, that's what keeps the tradition alive!
Oh, and sometimes I'm really glad that someone "hi jacks" my set, it makes it more interesting and changes your train of thought (in wich case most of us will learn new ways of puting tunes together).
Last bitty, I will NEVER switch of my mobile phone! I might kill the sound (hate ringtones anyway), but I will never shut it down...
get ta foook! who out there has a problem with people's phones being on? never heard that one before. How else is one meant to hear word where the better session without stupid rules like this is?! "
How about "Have your phone switched to silent. If it should vibrate in your pocket during the session, do not answer it. Wait until a convenient juncture (e.g. the end of a set), politely leave the session circle, check to see who the caller was, and return the call if you consider it important enough."
It is an all too frequent sight nowadays, young (and some not so young) musicians texting, making and receiving calls at the table between tunes - sometimes even stopping mid-tune to do so. But I see no problem with having your phone switched on, so long as it doesn't disrupt the session by playing a mosquito-like rendition of Mozart's Gypsy Rondo or some such like.
3) Don’t leave recording device on during discussions between tunes
I understand why people would feel this way, but what a pain in the neck to have to reach over to turn the thing off every time a set ends and turn it on every time one starts. Maybe some people have hours to kill listening to all the boring mumbled chatter from the night before, but honestly, if I bother to record a session, I skip through to the music bits only. And even those, I don't listen to very often. Oh well. I guess it's good to know how other people feel. I wouldn't care if someone left a recorder running, though.
I believe that, if you search for "Rules of this session" here, you will find some interesting discussions previously. The Reverend put his own version onto a t-shirt.
I'd add, to your current one, 'only one strung chordal instrument at a time' to go along with the bodhran limits.
I think a lightly & tastefully played DADGAD Guitar can work well alongside a similarly played Bouzouki or Cittern &/or a Harp, as long as they are not just 'strumming' the same chords.
As for the top 11, I'd take out No 3 & as No 11 is far too important to be stuck at the bottom ... it should be No 3 .. giving you a top 10!
Kennedy, you obviously don't say what you really think of the bodhrán player when he goes out for a smoke - others mightn't be so discreet! No Michael, the feeling of the group tended to be pro-bodhrán. In fact when No. 11 was mentioned one musician (a fiddle player) immediately said why single out bodhráns when uilleann pipes, banjos and piano accordions might also qualify for this type of treatment. My view was that melody instruments of whatever type tend to be in unison whereas backing instruments are another kettle of fish. I would agree though that this rule should be expanded to include strummers, keyboards, harps and any other backing instruments.
I must admit that there were a lot fewer bodhrán players and strummers around this year than back in the old days. I also have no complaints about the ones I did meet.
So if someone doesn't like recorders running at a session, that really means they like to gossip and don't want to be caught? Hmmm. Interesting. I hadn't thought of that.
I just wanted to make sure everyone was listening Random as all of the gang last week felt so strongly about No. 1. I'd agree with you about No. 6 as the "Closed Session" gang wouldn't be too keen on it!
Putting this whole thing in perspective these are just suggested guidelines to make for better sessions and not rules to be strictly adhered to in every situation. Likewise, anyone who was there last week will confirm that most of our time was spent playing tunes and not arguing over what should or should not be on the list.
Bugger rules! Don't bother with rules. Just make sure you've got a session fascist amongst your number to lay down the most outrageous form of elitism possible.
Ptarmy, it's trying to find a 'light and tasteful', or even to define it, that causes all the problems.....
We did used to have a DADGAD player in our session, and i simply used to pick up the bodhran when he was strumming, and vicky verky when he was bashing the goat. But this was years ago in my 'zouk adolescence - I think I was still playing a Greek one, restrung, then.
12 Always use two hands when playing instruments
13 Sit on chairs
14 Play tunes
15 Don't play football, Risk or Buckaroo
16 Play tunes
17 Have your documentation ready in case of an OFSESH visit
18 Drink stuff
19 Start at the beginning of the session and finish at the end
19 Don't repeat rule 19
20 Leave the dots at home
21 Be kind to micro-organisms
22 Dress well, but appropriately
23 Play inductively, not deductively
24 Stop playing at the end of a set, if you are the last one to finish
25 Speak orally
26 Go on a lifelong quest to find yourself; when you have found yourself, take yourself back to the sssion and carry on where you left off
27 Always ensure the contract has a sanity clause
28 Don't believe in Sanity Clause
1. You do not talk about the session.
2. You DO NOT talk about the session.
3. If someone goes limp, says 'stop', or taps out, the set is over.
4. Only two guys in a set at the same time.
5. One set of tunes at a time.
6. No shirts and no shoes.
7. Sets will go on for as long as they have to.
8. If this is your first night at the session, you HAVE to play.
Well Bren ,maybe we need the return of the session police . Commissioner Larry could have a paid troop of highly trained homeland music security experts. Nice green uniform peaked cap, harp badge, shiny shoes, funded maybe by a tune tax in line with current economic realities. We could call them Guardians of peaceful music.
Offenders forced to listen to Colman records …you know the ones with the piano player on but played backwards Or sent to Bodhran boot Camp with Commandant Bodhran Bliss.
Sergeant Llig could run the Flying along the tune Squad .
SWFL fiddler could be the J.I.G man working full time in the states.
You could be nicked by Nicolas
( I think I have maybe taken this metaphor a bit far )
Or shall we all put up with things and then vote with our feet when things get beyond a moan. After all it’s a free world ……….at the moment.
The most important session rule is that you must always guard against revealing that you have session sweaty arse. You may well be prone to this distressing condition, but the only advice I can give is to never get up to go to the lavvy when the lights are full on, and to always wear dark trousers.
1. Share/enjoy music together.
2. Welcome others regardless of ability.
3. Teach where you can - pay it forward.
4. Listen - never stop learning or being willing to learn.
5. If you want your session to run to a strict protocol, share that information promptly and politely with newbies, otherwise, don't take things so seriously.
What I meant about the "listen" comment, is that the people who need to listen aren't goingto be reading or paying attention to such advice. Otherwise they'd be listening already.
So sets of rules are just preaching to the converted, in order to make us feel good about ourselves, since we are not among those who transgresseth O Lord.
Sessions differ so much that its impossible to draw absolute conclusions from every one about how they should be approached. There are certain guidelines which should be taken into consideration, but the only relevant ones are those which are linked to psychological behaviour (e.g. somebody being obnoxious unnecessarily or tormenting other people.) I've been in sessions made up of myself (banjo), fiddler, guitar player, bodhran player and 5-string banjo player. We all really enjoyed ourselves, no arguments. So to try and fit this into some bunch of regulations is a regression on the whole concept of music which is free to be used by anyone and everyone, in whatever way they feel fit.
This sounds like one those books that spawned a whole series of films like 'The Quiller Memorandum' ,'The Bedford Incident' and 'The Parallax View' etc.
I see Matt Damon playing the role of a killer piper trying to discover a shady network of session irregulars and taking the appropiate action.
At five minutes and six seconds after 4am on the 7th of August this year, the time and date will be 04:05:06 07/08/09 - and this will never happen again.
Ok?
~ once in Greenwich I suppose.
Considering each time zone we will all experience it once; where ever we are.
Time is relative. In California we are on daylight saving. If it matters.
I thought the rhythm method was about bodhran players banging the old goat 11 days out of a month. Can't expect them all to know when to pull out of tune.
I jest of course; but enough innuendos aimed at Helena Bonham Carter. (smirk)
What does 'to put down a tune' mean? If I read 'the Kesh Jig syndrom' I imagine that it means: negative behaviour to tunes too well known. Something like that?
Henk, You got it in one! we could have used "Boys of Bluehill", "Miss McCleod", "The Butterfly" and many more here. There's nothing restrictive about these guidelines as they cover just basic good behaviour making the session a good experience for all participants.
This is stupid. People are talking about being considerate of beginners or whatever. Thats fine as long as they know when a particular session is too much for them in terms of what they know. If I was an intermediate player I wouldn't go around joining sessions whenever I can without any thought for how it might affect the quality for the other people there.
If you are a beginner of intermediate, you shouldnt go to a session to improve your ability. People also have to be considerate of the people already in the session first. If the person joining is discreet and sits and listens until a tune they know comes up then fine, but if they insist on trying to play every tune and struggle to keep up then forget about it.
Being 'nicey, nicey' all the time sacrifices a few things, i.e. quality.
I've never had a problem with playing the boys of blue hill or whatever with beginners, provided they don't start it too fast for themselves. Welcoming others, regardless of ability, is straight forward. And asking people politely to stop playing if they outstay their welcome is also straight forward.
"If the person joining is discreet and sits and listens until a tune they know comes up then fine, but if they insist on trying to play every tune and struggle to keep up then forget about it."
There should be no problem in complying with guideline No. 7 providing everyone also complies with Nos. 1, 7 & 10. Even if one knows nothing about guidelines, commonsense should tell you the level of the session - you don't start Fáinne Geal an Lae when you're playing in a session with Frankie Gavin, Jackie Daly and Alec Finn!
And speaking of Fáinne Geal an Lae, was I the only one amused to see a British Army pipe band that won a classical music award playing this tune on the tv?
I just want to say that as a session newbie I really appreciated having some guidelines so I didn't walk in and make a complete fool of myself. (I'm still a newbie, but I am familiar with the basics now). Surely there is variation from session to session - the session I attend is not strict about all 11 of those rules, and we must have a few other conventions that aren't listed - but this is a helpful start for someone who is new.
It reminds me of those travel books that help you gain some basic phrases in a new language and understanding about a culture so you don't make a complete fool of yourself when you get there. Yes, you could just go to your destination and listen for hours and days until you figured out how to say "Where is the W.C.?" but it's quite helpful to already know this phrase when the need arises. And in some cultures it's considered downright disgusting to eat food with the "wrong" hand, so it's helpful to already know this before you sit down at the table and offend everyone there in a way that none will ever forget.
It's really fundamental to know that in ITM sessions, unlike some other kinds of gatherings like jams, you're universally expected to know the tune (or be able to fake it really well) before you join in.
It's also helpful to be reminded that the person who starts the tune sets the tempo. I think some old-timers need this reminder as much as some newbies.
Maybe another one I would add is to figure out early on if the session has a leader and whether or not you should wait to be called on or just jump in. Apparently this varies. As a newbie, I didn't realize that there might be a leader - just thought it was an organic gathering, but it turns out ours is more leader-run than not. I learned the socially painful way and it would have been better to go in with a clue about this.
I learned that if I wanted to participate I'd better arrive prepared to lead multiple tunes confidently and up to speed or nearly so. I learned that I'd best learn the tunes that the folks there play regularly. I learned that I'd best wait until I get the nod to start a tune...unless there is an unusually long lag of time (like the others are eating their dinner) and no one else seems interested, and then it is okay to jump in. But in that case I'd best be prepared to play alone or nearly alone if I do that. I learned that I'd best know a tune full well and to speed before I try to play along. I learned that it's best not to play on every tune even if you know it. I learned that other folks appreciate it most if you pick tunes they like to play. I learned that staying in tune throughout the session is very, very important. I learned that guitarists and bodhran players should take turns. I learned that if I pack up my instrument before the very last moment of the session, the next tune played will always be one I know and could have played along with, so don't pack up until everyone else packs up.
And I learned that rules are made to be broken - at the last session, a couple of very accomplished and well-respected players pulled out (gasp) a tunebook with dots, and proceeded to use it. I was shocked, because of what I have read here, and then I realized that our session is friendly and the rules aren't so stiff that they can't be broken.
And surely there is more to learn. I also learned, from word-of-mouth and experience, that the other sessions in our general area do NOT operate the same way, and that I would not be as comfortable and/or welcome at either...for very different reasons.
Sessions have their own culture, and that is one thing that makes them so intriguing and mysterious to outsiders. But it also makes it hard for newbies to fit in. I think it's really, really helpful to go in with a clue, or eleven of them, or whatever number. I got most of my clues from this website and from some very tentative, hushed questions asked of people I trusted not to make me feel stupid. It is hard being a newbie.
But those of you who enjoy making fun of this sort of thing can carry on, of course.
This topic is definitely an "old chestnut" which comes up year after year. A thought just came to me that why don't we put it to bed once and for all by agreeing just 10 points (maybe we can knock out No. 3 or No. 11). Then just as the religious 10 commandments have satisfied our moral wellbeing so well down through the generations, surely this approach could equally guarantee our musical wellbeing. What does everyone think?
++Sessions have their own culture, and that is one thing that makes them so intriguing and mysterious to outsiders++
That's not culture, that's mystique
amyamanda, that's a brilliant post and covers nearly all the points one needs to be familiar with to get the most out of session playing. You also make the point that you've built up this knowledge over a period of time and thereby strengthen the argument for a readily available agreed set of guidelines. You'd definitely be very welcome at our session anytime you want to drop in!
Bren, I agree with you that most sessions have their own culture but that doesn't mean we have to suffer crap ones! I know that you're not inferring this, but some posters (a small minority fortunately) did advocate an "anything goes" approach.
It's not about rules in sessions.
"....Where there is a little common interest and activity, kindness grows like weeds by the roadside."
--Charles Horton Cooley, 1909, p. 26
Great list amyamanda. Being a newbie myself I've gotten the cold shoulder at seasoned sessions simply because I didn't know this stuff, and no-one took the time to politely tell me anything! If it wasn't for sites like this I'd still be clueless! I'm now part of a slow session where many of us are new or relatively new to the genre, but we also have a few more seasoned folks who don't care about "rules" - they just want to share and enjoy music together (how refreshing!). Sheet music abounds (we're memorizing tunes faster so that will get us into the ranks of being able to join more seasoned sessions sooner, rather than later (my personal goal), and we all take the time to help each other, talk about the genre/tunes etc and share/learn. Fun, fun, fun.
Tuning properly should be Rule #1, followed by listening. As for recording, I don't se where any rules are needed for that. You want to exclude newbies from playing but insist they ask in order to record? How else are they going to learn? There should also be a rule about more than one guitar/zouk as well. THere should be rules for session leaders as well, including welcoming new players and asking pertinent questions in order to gauge their ability and subtly finding a way to include them without sacrificing the quality of the music. A good leader shoudl be able to manage without to much stress, unless the newbie is thick, (which is often the case sadly)
I guess I have a few other suggestions for newbies...I'm sticking this here to keep it with the others.
Ask the regulars how they feel about a newbie joining in. Test the waters to be sure. I was very pleasantly surprised by the supportiveness and inclusiveness at the session I attend. But it would also have been helpful to find out early on if they weren't so open to playing with newbies. I wouldn't want to waste my time trying to fit in with people who don't want to be fit in with. I have heard that another semi-local session is really not open to having new players join in. It's good to know before you show up to play.
I'd also suggest finding a way to ask the regulars what is "usual" at their session. I found, to my surprise and delight, that most of our session regulars also happen to be teachers, and many of them seemed very happy to offer constructive advice to a new player - when asked. This is where you can get good clues about how things typically go. For example, I found out that at our session it's considered fine to play a lone tune instead of a set. This was such a relief to me when I was not yet comfortable stringing tunes together. Also at our session, the number of repetitions varies widely from tune to tune. I hear that at some sessions it's more of a strict "three times through and then on to the next."
I do think that it's really funny that the regulars couldn't rattle off a list of oft-played tunes - they were at a loss when I asked, even though my experience now tells me that there is clearly a collection of favorites at this session. I am recognizing more and more tunes as familiar because of this, and I lament not having enough time to learn to play them as fast as I learn to recognize them... I try not to ask them for tune names too often; I carry a notebook and write them down and try not to be bothersome.
It was definitely challenging for me to start those initial conversations - I felt really awkward at first. But the folks at my session turned out to be quite friendly (despite what my research here on this website unfortunately led me to expect!) and I intend to pay their kindness forward when I'm in a position to help other newbies feel more comfortable.
Whether or not they want to remember or admit it, everyone was a newbie once.
OK, how did I end up one of the scary, mean thesession.org guys all of a sudden? Sheesh!
I was being serious! Why not make a new thread? You've said it well and explained in detail what common sense and courtesy will bring any newbie from any decent session worth its salt.
Ahhhh... it's nice to see no one has any opposition to rule #10. I guess this confirms once again my previous efforts in this forum have not been in vain.
It's a good guideline. Noodling can be kept to a minimum, hopefully.
The best players probably never noodle in session. Or, they are so good mortals, such as I, do not catch them.
I spend plenty of time listening to the tunes I do not fully know. I am not one to *jump in* before I am ready.
Sometimes I simply get eager & do jump in. I give it my best & try not to flinch when I make mistakes.
I have learned things about playing in session from making these errors of judgement. Some say I am not playing the tune, I am noodling.
I do not promote noodling. Neither do I expect to always play without mistakes. I leave it to the masters.
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus Agreed
1) LISTEN (includes making sure your instrument is in tune)
2) Ask before attempting to record the session
3) Only one accompaniment instrument of a particular type (bodhrán, guitar, etc) at a time
4) Don’t “put down” tunes (eg the Kesh Jig or Drowsie Maggie, etc syndrome)
5) Don’t hi jack someone else’s set (also includes interference with tempo)
6) Be open and friendly
7) Don’t attempt to play tunes you don’t know
8) Don’t play too many tunes others don’t know
9) Always switch mobile phones to "silent" mode
10) Don’t Noodle
Many thanks to all of you who have contributed to this thread. What started out as a bit of fun has, I think, turned into something useful. So much has been written on session etiquette that I thought it would be nice to try and establish just the bare essentials . For this reason it was never intended for more than 10 points to be agreed. From the comments received so far this has been possible as the original No. 3 about switching off recording devices was probably a bit too fussy.
I did run this revised list past the group who contributed to the original one at Fleadh Nua and all who replied were in agreement - we wouldn't want to contravene No. 5 with a hi-jack!
I must admit I like the comparisons with the 10 commandments which have worked so well for christian morality down through the centuries - after all most of us would know many of them off the top of our heads such as the sixth! It was quite funny how No. 5 was broken at the Friday lunchtime session where 3 young musicians of very high technical ability joined us. We played "The Cup of Tea", which they didn't seem to know, at a nice session pace but as we moved into the Copperplate, which they knew only too well, they ramped up the speed to Riverdance rates. The facial expressions of most of the group who had been together throughout the week were priceless - a combination of resignation as they contemplated how one might achieve reasonable session behaviour amongst the uninitiated. To many of us who've been around sessions since the year dot, guidelines like these which are so obvious may seem rediculous, but to many of those new to the session scene, I think they would be very useful. And it's not just me as all of the 25 or so musicians who helped put them together are behind them to a man (and woman!).
OK Grego, if "everyone were to love thy neighbour ...etc" then there would arguably be no need for the other nine commandments. Similarly the same might be said for guideline No. 1 because musicians who "listen" would know when they were out of tune, were creating dissonance, were altering the tempo of the session, etc. For certain musicians though, experience suggests that these things need to be spelt out.
I had the good fortune of visiting Ireland and attending the workshop in Ennis, I found this to be a great opportunity to learn session tunes and with the book and cd package it will help when I return home to Canada. There was some good humour over the creation of this list as we discovered how we each might break the occasional one even during the workshop. It was taken with a certain amount of seriousness as most people feel they want to have fun during sessions without all the ego stuff. I found it interesting that the subject of session guidlines was discussed. At first I was a bit surprised that the Irish have the same issues that we might face in our jams with bluegrass and jazz groups that we attend. Goes to show that people are the same everywhere. You will always find those that like to play the loudest, with masterful speed and usually with a closed mind regarding other players. My wife and I have attended several other festivals in Ireland over the past 6 years and will continue to do so, we enjoy the music and the sense of humour that most people have. Other session players that I know will be interested in the tunes that were discussed and will want to hear more about what is going on in the trad music world in Ireland. Keep up the good work bannerman.
Thanks for the comments Blanch. I agree that it was a lot of fun and that many of the rules we agreed came out of the week's sessions - I'll never forget the embarrassment of being responsible for the mobile phones one! I was most interested also in your view that some of these points might equally apply in other areas such as bluegrass and jazz - noodling may not just be the bane of trad players after all! I think I know who you are and we'll be delighted if you can visit us again sometime in the future when you're in the Ennis area.
Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Much has been written about session etiquette but I thought it would be nice to tease this out with a group of musicians from very differing backgrounds. These are the views of last week's Foinn Seisiún workshop group of 25 or so musicians from around the globe (Alaska to Australia, Colorado to Japan and places in between). The list which evolved over the 5 days of the workshop is as follows:-
1) LISTEN
2) Ask before attempting to record the session
3) Don’t leave recording device on during discussions between tunes
4) Don’t “put down” tunes (eg the Kesh Jig syndrome)
5) Don’t hi jack someone else’s set (also includes interference with tempo)
6) Be open and friendly
7) Don’t attempt to play tunes you don’t know
8) Don’t play too many tunes others don’t know
9) Always switch off mobile phones
10) Don’t Noodle
11) Remember only one bodhrán player at a time
This list may not be too significant due to the low sample – 25 or so musicians – but then again it was allowed to grow naturally without any prompting (for example the mobile phone one got added when mine went off during the workshop!) and it makes a lot of commonsense. The first one “Listen” we all agreed to be most important as it covers everything from tuning to keeping together, etc and probably obviates the need for some of the others in particular Nos. 5 and 10. All of the others were agreed unanimously apart from No. 11 which was almost 50/50
I hope the above is fairly accurate but as there were a few Yellow Boarders there I'm sure I'll be put right if there are any omissions. If anyone else has additional comments or vehemently disagrees with any of these points it would be interesting to hear your views.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by Bannerman
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
eminently reasonable-
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by azfiddle
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
no 9 - switch off mobile phones...
get ta foook! who out there has a problem with people's phones being on? never heard that one before. How else is one meant to hear word where the better session without stupid rules like this is?!
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by munya beor
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Hmmm. When they're typed up like that, the list comes across like a session police poster. A little too serious and formal. But I don't really disagree with any of them.
Except I would amend #7 to allow players who really can learn tunes on the fly to discretely do so. Good players learn tunes this way, and they can support less experienced players when no one else knows the tune.
Also, even though #1 should do the trick, lots of people need an explicit reminder to keep their volume in line with the rest of the circle.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by Miss Lonelyhearts
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
I'm asuming the 50% who voted against "one bodhran at a time", were voting for no bodhrans at all. You didn't make that clear enough.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by llig leahcim
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
All of those rules are broken every week at the session I regularly go to. I could just stay at home... But then I'd miss out on the excitement, the unpredictability, the petty annoyances, the larger-than-life personalities, the inspirational, the dreadful etc. I could try and control everybody by putting a little list of do's and don'ts on each seat - if I want my head kicked in, that is!
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by RichardB
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
I disagree with number 7 too...
I know a lot of musicians who have learn a lot of tunes while sessions BUT.... before playing they must LISTEN !
I will change the number 7 to "When you don't know the tune, don't try to play directly. Listen !"
Amicalement,
Fred
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by Thaindor
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
"Remember only one bodhrán player at a time."
- I have trouble remembering any!
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by grego
... perhaps that was mis-spelt and should have said "dismember?"
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by grego
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
3) Don’t leave recording device on during discussions between tunes
But then you'd miss the best bits!
Anyway, it's nice to know there's nothing in this world that can't be decided by a committee
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by Bren
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Ugh. Bodhrans!
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by bestcraic
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Well, if you want rules, why not go to the conservatory, learn classical music, play from sheet and listen only to the conductor. Then you have set rules and no bodhrans.
Why must there be so much rules? Can't we just have fun with the music, and just enjoy ourselfs???
I have had some great sessions with 3 or even more bodhran players (who lestened to each other), so that is possible.
Also, I hope people will allways play tunes the rest doesn't know, that's what keeps the tradition alive!
Oh, and sometimes I'm really glad that someone "hi jacks" my set, it makes it more interesting and changes your train of thought (in wich case most of us will learn new ways of puting tunes together).
Last bitty, I will NEVER switch of my mobile phone! I might kill the sound (hate ringtones anyway), but I will never shut it down...
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by Dark Raven
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
"no 9 - switch off mobile phones...
get ta foook! who out there has a problem with people's phones being on? never heard that one before. How else is one meant to hear word where the better session without stupid rules like this is?! "
How about "Have your phone switched to silent. If it should vibrate in your pocket during the session, do not answer it. Wait until a convenient juncture (e.g. the end of a set), politely leave the session circle, check to see who the caller was, and return the call if you consider it important enough."
It is an all too frequent sight nowadays, young (and some not so young) musicians texting, making and receiving calls at the table between tunes - sometimes even stopping mid-tune to do so. But I see no problem with having your phone switched on, so long as it doesn't disrupt the session by playing a mosquito-like rendition of Mozart's Gypsy Rondo or some such like.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by OrganicPeatCreature
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
3) Don’t leave recording device on during discussions between tunes
I understand why people would feel this way, but what a pain in the neck to have to reach over to turn the thing off every time a set ends and turn it on every time one starts. Maybe some people have hours to kill listening to all the boring mumbled chatter from the night before, but honestly, if I bother to record a session, I skip through to the music bits only. And even those, I don't listen to very often. Oh well. I guess it's good to know how other people feel. I wouldn't care if someone left a recorder running, though.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by kennedy
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
I believe that, if you search for "Rules of this session" here, you will find some interesting discussions previously. The Reverend put his own version onto a t-shirt.
I'd add, to your current one, 'only one strung chordal instrument at a time' to go along with the bodhran limits.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by Guernsey Pete
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
OK, fly everyone back, do it again. No rules for strummers?
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Not sure I entirely agree with you there Pete.
I think a lightly & tastefully played DADGAD Guitar can work well alongside a similarly played Bouzouki or Cittern &/or a Harp, as long as they are not just 'strumming' the same chords.
As for the top 11, I'd take out No 3 & as No 11 is far too important to be stuck at the bottom ... it should be No 3 .. giving you a top 10!
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by Ptarmigan
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
It's like the Pirate's Code -- think of it as guidelines more than rules.
Arrrghhhhh
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by TheSilverSpear
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Kennedy, you obviously don't say what you really think of the bodhrán player when he goes out for a smoke - others mightn't be so discreet! No Michael, the feeling of the group tended to be pro-bodhrán. In fact when No. 11 was mentioned one musician (a fiddle player) immediately said why single out bodhráns when uilleann pipes, banjos and piano accordions might also qualify for this type of treatment. My view was that melody instruments of whatever type tend to be in unison whereas backing instruments are another kettle of fish. I would agree though that this rule should be expanded to include strummers, keyboards, harps and any other backing instruments.
I must admit that there were a lot fewer bodhrán players and strummers around this year than back in the old days. I also have no complaints about the ones I did meet.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by Bannerman
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Good discussion Bannerman.
You don't have to shout though. I am listening.
There will be plenty of banter to go with #6. ;)
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by Random_notes
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
So if someone doesn't like recorders running at a session, that really means they like to gossip and don't want to be caught? Hmmm. Interesting. I hadn't thought of that.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by kennedy
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
I just wanted to make sure everyone was listening Random as all of the gang last week felt so strongly about No. 1. I'd agree with you about No. 6 as the "Closed Session" gang wouldn't be too keen on it!
Putting this whole thing in perspective these are just suggested guidelines to make for better sessions and not rules to be strictly adhered to in every situation. Likewise, anyone who was there last week will confirm that most of our time was spent playing tunes and not arguing over what should or should not be on the list.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by Bannerman
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Good list! It just amounts to courtesy and good manners - surely that's at the core of making fine music?
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by boxershort
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Bugger rules! Don't bother with rules. Just make sure you've got a session fascist amongst your number to lay down the most outrageous form of elitism possible.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by Jamie
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Ptarmy, it's trying to find a 'light and tasteful', or even to define it, that causes all the problems.....
We did used to have a DADGAD player in our session, and i simply used to pick up the bodhran when he was strumming, and vicky verky when he was bashing the goat. But this was years ago in my 'zouk adolescence - I think I was still playing a Greek one, restrung, then.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by Guernsey Pete
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Turn your mobile to silent/vibrate and put it down the front of your trousers. When it goes off it won't half make your rolls sound better.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by Steve Shaw
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
How do you make someone listen if they won't listen?
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by Bren
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Bren, that's the first and only thing of value that's been said on this thread so far. Thank you.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by llig leahcim
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
The answer, of course, is you can't. But you can, and should, kick them out.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by llig leahcim
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
12 Always use two hands when playing instruments
13 Sit on chairs
14 Play tunes
15 Don't play football, Risk or Buckaroo
16 Play tunes
17 Have your documentation ready in case of an OFSESH visit
18 Drink stuff
19 Start at the beginning of the session and finish at the end
19 Don't repeat rule 19
20 Leave the dots at home
21 Be kind to micro-organisms
22 Dress well, but appropriately
23 Play inductively, not deductively
24 Stop playing at the end of a set, if you are the last one to finish
25 Speak orally
26 Go on a lifelong quest to find yourself; when you have found yourself, take yourself back to the sssion and carry on where you left off
27 Always ensure the contract has a sanity clause
28 Don't believe in Sanity Clause
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by maxF
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
1. You do not talk about the session.
2. You DO NOT talk about the session.
3. If someone goes limp, says 'stop', or taps out, the set is over.
4. Only two guys in a set at the same time.
5. One set of tunes at a time.
6. No shirts and no shoes.
7. Sets will go on for as long as they have to.
8. If this is your first night at the session, you HAVE to play.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
9. if you have a split personality, you can shag Tim Burton's wife
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by llig leahcim
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
That was close Llig, I almost spit my drink all over the screen. Well done.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Mmmmmmm, interesting. Not one rule about using sheet music......... did this topic come up during the workshop and just not make the final list?
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by CarolWhitaker
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Carol, you miss a fundamental rule about rules. There are unsaid rules.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by llig leahcim
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
... you know ... like ... don't spit on people when you speak.
It's all just basic manners. That's why attempting a top ten is merely silly. It's arrogant, presumptuous and condescending.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by llig leahcim
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
BO££OCKS, STUFF & NONSENSE!
It's just a simple way of getting folks to think a little bit more about what they're doing, while in a session, nothing more!
Let's face it, it's a lot more fun than just saying - be mannerly!
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by Ptarmigan
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
CarolW - MaxF's no. 20.
Interestingly, my band uses music for gigs; no rules against that.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by Guernsey Pete
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Well Bren ,maybe we need the return of the session police . Commissioner Larry could have a paid troop of highly trained homeland music security experts. Nice green uniform peaked cap, harp badge, shiny shoes, funded maybe by a tune tax in line with current economic realities. We could call them Guardians of peaceful music.
Offenders forced to listen to Colman records …you know the ones with the piano player on but played backwards Or sent to Bodhran boot Camp with Commandant Bodhran Bliss.
Sergeant Llig could run the Flying along the tune Squad .
SWFL fiddler could be the J.I.G man working full time in the states.
You could be nicked by Nicolas
( I think I have maybe taken this metaphor a bit far )
Or shall we all put up with things and then vote with our feet when things get beyond a moan. After all it’s a free world ……….at the moment.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by bazouki dave
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Hey, I like the sound of the "Flying along the tune Squad".
Thanks.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by llig leahcim
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
43. Do not show up at the session wearing ONLY your instrument (1). You'd think someone would have included that one.
(1) Unless of course you are doing it in protest of.... something. See: http://www.dailycamera.com/news/2008/oct/27/boulder-naked-pumpkin-run/
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by TheSilverSpear
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
The most important session rule is that you must always guard against revealing that you have session sweaty arse. You may well be prone to this distressing condition, but the only advice I can give is to never get up to go to the lavvy when the lights are full on, and to always wear dark trousers.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by Steve Shaw
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Here are some others to consider:
1. Share/enjoy music together.
2. Welcome others regardless of ability.
3. Teach where you can - pay it forward.
4. Listen - never stop learning or being willing to learn.
5. If you want your session to run to a strict protocol, share that information promptly and politely with newbies, otherwise, don't take things so seriously.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by CarolWhitaker
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
What I meant about the "listen" comment, is that the people who need to listen aren't goingto be reading or paying attention to such advice. Otherwise they'd be listening already.
So sets of rules are just preaching to the converted, in order to make us feel good about ourselves, since we are not among those who transgresseth O Lord.
No harm in that I guess.
# Posted on May 26th 2009 by Bren
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Sessions differ so much that its impossible to draw absolute conclusions from every one about how they should be approached. There are certain guidelines which should be taken into consideration, but the only relevant ones are those which are linked to psychological behaviour (e.g. somebody being obnoxious unnecessarily or tormenting other people.) I've been in sessions made up of myself (banjo), fiddler, guitar player, bodhran player and 5-string banjo player. We all really enjoyed ourselves, no arguments. So to try and fit this into some bunch of regulations is a regression on the whole concept of music which is free to be used by anyone and everyone, in whatever way they feel fit.
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by 52Paddy
Re: Dr. Gilbert v. Dr. No
This sounds like one those books that spawned a whole series of films like 'The Quiller Memorandum' ,'The Bedford Incident' and 'The Parallax View' etc.
I see Matt Damon playing the role of a killer piper trying to discover a shady network of session irregulars and taking the appropiate action.
Stand by for the Bodhrán Ulitimatum...
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by biggus dave
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
With reference to 'The Ennis Consensus',I should have made clear.
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by biggus dave
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
I rather like a healthy bodhran section, three or four at least.
It seems to level out the screeching of fiddles and wailing of whistles.
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by mcknowall
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
The Chinese have a saying that goes:
If thine enemy offend thee, buy each of his children a drum.
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by Lint - upon - Tweed
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
McKnowall likes the rhythm method.
At five minutes and six seconds after 4am on the 7th of August this year, the time and date will be 04:05:06 07/08/09 - and this will never happen again.
Ok?
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by Duijera Dubh
*
~ once in Greenwich I suppose.
Considering each time zone we will all experience it once; where ever we are.
Time is relative. In California we are on daylight saving. If it matters.
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by Random_notes
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
I'm sorry but some of those rules are ridiculous and elitist
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by D.J.F.
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
I thought the rhythm method was about bodhran players banging the old goat 11 days out of a month. Can't expect them all to know when to pull out of tune.
I jest of course; but enough innuendos aimed at Helena Bonham Carter. (smirk)
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by Lint - upon - Tweed
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
What does 'to put down a tune' mean? If I read 'the Kesh Jig syndrom' I imagine that it means: negative behaviour to tunes too well known. Something like that?
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by Henk Bos
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
I think so Henk, that's how I interpreted it.
Not to be confused with the Pollard Syndrum , which was the first electronic drum.
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by Lint - upon - Tweed
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
...or Bollock's Syndrome for that matter.
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by Duijera Dubh
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Henk, You got it in one! we could have used "Boys of Bluehill", "Miss McCleod", "The Butterfly" and many more here. There's nothing restrictive about these guidelines as they cover just basic good behaviour making the session a good experience for all participants.
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by Bannerman
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
a lot of people have been mentioning the ...
'Welcome others, regardless of ability'.
...as a rule.
This is stupid. People are talking about being considerate of beginners or whatever. Thats fine as long as they know when a particular session is too much for them in terms of what they know. If I was an intermediate player I wouldn't go around joining sessions whenever I can without any thought for how it might affect the quality for the other people there.
If you are a beginner of intermediate, you shouldnt go to a session to improve your ability. People also have to be considerate of the people already in the session first. If the person joining is discreet and sits and listens until a tune they know comes up then fine, but if they insist on trying to play every tune and struggle to keep up then forget about it.
Being 'nicey, nicey' all the time sacrifices a few things, i.e. quality.
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by fiddleruairi
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
I've never had a problem with playing the boys of blue hill or whatever with beginners, provided they don't start it too fast for themselves. Welcoming others, regardless of ability, is straight forward. And asking people politely to stop playing if they outstay their welcome is also straight forward.
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by llig leahcim
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
And it's important to note that while you are playing the boys of blue hill or whatever with beginners, you can still improve your own ability.
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by llig leahcim
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
"If the person joining is discreet and sits and listens until a tune they know comes up then fine, but if they insist on trying to play every tune and struggle to keep up then forget about it."
See Rule #7
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by OrganicPeatCreature
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
rule #12: it is a night out with friends relax and don't take it too seriously.
OTOH we've had to institute rule #13: no djembes
- chris
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by ramblingpitchfork
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
There should be no problem in complying with guideline No. 7 providing everyone also complies with Nos. 1, 7 & 10. Even if one knows nothing about guidelines, commonsense should tell you the level of the session - you don't start Fáinne Geal an Lae when you're playing in a session with Frankie Gavin, Jackie Daly and Alec Finn!
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by Bannerman
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Sorry for the typo - I meant "no problem in complying with guideline No. 6"
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by Bannerman
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
And speaking of Fáinne Geal an Lae, was I the only one amused to see a British Army pipe band that won a classical music award playing this tune on the tv?
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by ramblingpitchfork
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
I just want to say that as a session newbie I really appreciated having some guidelines so I didn't walk in and make a complete fool of myself. (I'm still a newbie, but I am familiar with the basics now). Surely there is variation from session to session - the session I attend is not strict about all 11 of those rules, and we must have a few other conventions that aren't listed - but this is a helpful start for someone who is new.
It reminds me of those travel books that help you gain some basic phrases in a new language and understanding about a culture so you don't make a complete fool of yourself when you get there. Yes, you could just go to your destination and listen for hours and days until you figured out how to say "Where is the W.C.?" but it's quite helpful to already know this phrase when the need arises. And in some cultures it's considered downright disgusting to eat food with the "wrong" hand, so it's helpful to already know this before you sit down at the table and offend everyone there in a way that none will ever forget.
It's really fundamental to know that in ITM sessions, unlike some other kinds of gatherings like jams, you're universally expected to know the tune (or be able to fake it really well) before you join in.
It's also helpful to be reminded that the person who starts the tune sets the tempo. I think some old-timers need this reminder as much as some newbies.
Maybe another one I would add is to figure out early on if the session has a leader and whether or not you should wait to be called on or just jump in. Apparently this varies. As a newbie, I didn't realize that there might be a leader - just thought it was an organic gathering, but it turns out ours is more leader-run than not. I learned the socially painful way and it would have been better to go in with a clue about this.
I learned that if I wanted to participate I'd better arrive prepared to lead multiple tunes confidently and up to speed or nearly so. I learned that I'd best learn the tunes that the folks there play regularly. I learned that I'd best wait until I get the nod to start a tune...unless there is an unusually long lag of time (like the others are eating their dinner) and no one else seems interested, and then it is okay to jump in. But in that case I'd best be prepared to play alone or nearly alone if I do that. I learned that I'd best know a tune full well and to speed before I try to play along. I learned that it's best not to play on every tune even if you know it. I learned that other folks appreciate it most if you pick tunes they like to play. I learned that staying in tune throughout the session is very, very important. I learned that guitarists and bodhran players should take turns. I learned that if I pack up my instrument before the very last moment of the session, the next tune played will always be one I know and could have played along with, so don't pack up until everyone else packs up.
And I learned that rules are made to be broken - at the last session, a couple of very accomplished and well-respected players pulled out (gasp) a tunebook with dots, and proceeded to use it. I was shocked, because of what I have read here, and then I realized that our session is friendly and the rules aren't so stiff that they can't be broken.
And surely there is more to learn. I also learned, from word-of-mouth and experience, that the other sessions in our general area do NOT operate the same way, and that I would not be as comfortable and/or welcome at either...for very different reasons.
Sessions have their own culture, and that is one thing that makes them so intriguing and mysterious to outsiders. But it also makes it hard for newbies to fit in. I think it's really, really helpful to go in with a clue, or eleven of them, or whatever number. I got most of my clues from this website and from some very tentative, hushed questions asked of people I trusted not to make me feel stupid. It is hard being a newbie.
But those of you who enjoy making fun of this sort of thing can carry on, of course.
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by amyamanda
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
This topic is definitely an "old chestnut" which comes up year after year. A thought just came to me that why don't we put it to bed once and for all by agreeing just 10 points (maybe we can knock out No. 3 or No. 11). Then just as the religious 10 commandments have satisfied our moral wellbeing so well down through the generations, surely this approach could equally guarantee our musical wellbeing. What does everyone think?
I'm now running for cover!
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by Bannerman
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
++Sessions have their own culture, and that is one thing that makes them so intriguing and mysterious to outsiders++
That's not culture, that's mystique
Why don't we all just agree?
Because we don't, that's why
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by Bren
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
amyamanda, that's a brilliant post and covers nearly all the points one needs to be familiar with to get the most out of session playing. You also make the point that you've built up this knowledge over a period of time and thereby strengthen the argument for a readily available agreed set of guidelines. You'd definitely be very welcome at our session anytime you want to drop in!
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by Bannerman
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Bren, I agree with you that most sessions have their own culture but that doesn't mean we have to suffer crap ones! I know that you're not inferring this, but some posters (a small minority fortunately) did advocate an "anything goes" approach.
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by Bannerman
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Oh, the diddley diddley diddley Oh, the diddley iddley odey oh
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by mcknowall
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Wow amyamanda, you should post this in its own thread entitled "How To Be A Good Newbie".
http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display/21664#comment450640
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Thanks, Bannerman.
SWFL Fiddler - I know enough not to take that bait! ;)
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by amyamanda
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
It's not about rules in sessions.
"....Where there is a little common interest and activity, kindness grows like weeds by the roadside."
--Charles Horton Cooley, 1909, p. 26
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by gtag
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Great list amyamanda. Being a newbie myself I've gotten the cold shoulder at seasoned sessions simply because I didn't know this stuff, and no-one took the time to politely tell me anything! If it wasn't for sites like this I'd still be clueless! I'm now part of a slow session where many of us are new or relatively new to the genre, but we also have a few more seasoned folks who don't care about "rules" - they just want to share and enjoy music together (how refreshing!). Sheet music abounds (we're memorizing tunes faster so that will get us into the ranks of being able to join more seasoned sessions sooner, rather than later (my personal goal), and we all take the time to help each other, talk about the genre/tunes etc and share/learn. Fun, fun, fun.
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by CarolWhitaker
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Tuning properly should be Rule #1, followed by listening. As for recording, I don't se where any rules are needed for that. You want to exclude newbies from playing but insist they ask in order to record? How else are they going to learn? There should also be a rule about more than one guitar/zouk as well. THere should be rules for session leaders as well, including welcoming new players and asking pertinent questions in order to gauge their ability and subtly finding a way to include them without sacrificing the quality of the music. A good leader shoudl be able to manage without to much stress, unless the newbie is thick, (which is often the case sadly)
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by spencern
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
I guess I have a few other suggestions for newbies...I'm sticking this here to keep it with the others.
Ask the regulars how they feel about a newbie joining in. Test the waters to be sure. I was very pleasantly surprised by the supportiveness and inclusiveness at the session I attend. But it would also have been helpful to find out early on if they weren't so open to playing with newbies. I wouldn't want to waste my time trying to fit in with people who don't want to be fit in with. I have heard that another semi-local session is really not open to having new players join in. It's good to know before you show up to play.
I'd also suggest finding a way to ask the regulars what is "usual" at their session. I found, to my surprise and delight, that most of our session regulars also happen to be teachers, and many of them seemed very happy to offer constructive advice to a new player - when asked. This is where you can get good clues about how things typically go. For example, I found out that at our session it's considered fine to play a lone tune instead of a set. This was such a relief to me when I was not yet comfortable stringing tunes together. Also at our session, the number of repetitions varies widely from tune to tune. I hear that at some sessions it's more of a strict "three times through and then on to the next."
I do think that it's really funny that the regulars couldn't rattle off a list of oft-played tunes - they were at a loss when I asked, even though my experience now tells me that there is clearly a collection of favorites at this session. I am recognizing more and more tunes as familiar because of this, and I lament not having enough time to learn to play them as fast as I learn to recognize them... I try not to ask them for tune names too often; I carry a notebook and write them down and try not to be bothersome.
It was definitely challenging for me to start those initial conversations - I felt really awkward at first. But the folks at my session turned out to be quite friendly (despite what my research here on this website unfortunately led me to expect!) and I intend to pay their kindness forward when I'm in a position to help other newbies feel more comfortable.
Whether or not they want to remember or admit it, everyone was a newbie once.
Hope that wasn't too much of a tangent.
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by amyamanda
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
OK, how did I end up one of the scary, mean thesession.org guys all of a sudden? Sheesh!
I was being serious! Why not make a new thread? You've said it well and explained in detail what common sense and courtesy will bring any newbie from any decent session worth its salt.
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Oh - okay - thanks. (Where's that sheepish grin icon?)
I suppose if I get hit with pies, I can blame you, SWFL!
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by amyamanda
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
HA! That's right amy, you tell 'em I sent ya!
(Mmm...pie...)
I used to be the guy who wade into every thread where there was some newbie all upset becaue some old-timer rubbed him or her the wrong way.
Whew. That just got exhausting over the years, sorry.
However, I will always have your back. You get into any scuffles you let me know and tell those meanies that SWFL sent ya.
# Posted on May 27th 2009 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Ahhhh... it's nice to see no one has any opposition to rule #10. I guess this confirms once again my previous efforts in this forum have not been in vain.
# Posted on May 31st 2009 by Phantom Button
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
sorry jack ;)
# Posted on May 31st 2009 by Random_notes
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
I like noodles.... noodlers of this world unite!.... noodle doodle
ahh... sorry was this thread going somewhere? oops shoulda kept my mouth shut... great session tonight.... hic... doodle noodle hic ...
# Posted on May 31st 2009 by the wicked hacker
The Ennis Consensus # 10
It's a good guideline. Noodling can be kept to a minimum, hopefully.
The best players probably never noodle in session. Or, they are so good mortals, such as I, do not catch them.
I spend plenty of time listening to the tunes I do not fully know. I am not one to *jump in* before I am ready.
Sometimes I simply get eager & do jump in. I give it my best & try not to flinch when I make mistakes.
I have learned things about playing in session from making these errors of judgement. Some say I am not playing the tune, I am noodling.
I do not promote noodling. Neither do I expect to always play without mistakes. I leave it to the masters.
# Posted on May 31st 2009 by Random_notes
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
I lost this thread ages ago. Who is Tim Burton and what's wrong with his wife???
# Posted on June 1st 2009 by awwilko
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Why, do you have a split personality?
# Posted on June 1st 2009 by Random_notes
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus Agreed
1) LISTEN (includes making sure your instrument is in tune)
2) Ask before attempting to record the session
3) Only one accompaniment instrument of a particular type (bodhrán, guitar, etc) at a time
4) Don’t “put down” tunes (eg the Kesh Jig or Drowsie Maggie, etc syndrome)
5) Don’t hi jack someone else’s set (also includes interference with tempo)
6) Be open and friendly
7) Don’t attempt to play tunes you don’t know
8) Don’t play too many tunes others don’t know
9) Always switch mobile phones to "silent" mode
10) Don’t Noodle
Many thanks to all of you who have contributed to this thread. What started out as a bit of fun has, I think, turned into something useful. So much has been written on session etiquette that I thought it would be nice to try and establish just the bare essentials . For this reason it was never intended for more than 10 points to be agreed. From the comments received so far this has been possible as the original No. 3 about switching off recording devices was probably a bit too fussy.
I did run this revised list past the group who contributed to the original one at Fleadh Nua and all who replied were in agreement - we wouldn't want to contravene No. 5 with a hi-jack!
# Posted on June 1st 2009 by Bannerman
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Okay, so it's to be Ten Commandments, then.
Next project: the Seven Deadly Sins?
# Posted on June 1st 2009 by grego
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Reminds me of the classic scene with Mel Brooks with long grey beard
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TAtRCJIqnk
# Posted on June 1st 2009 by llig leahcim
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Talk about butterfingers. What say the broken tablet was 5 ways to get around the other 10?
# Posted on June 2nd 2009 by Random_notes
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Now that you've accomplished this list of 10 why not carve them in stone, put them in the Ark of the Covenant and bury it where it can't be found.
# Posted on June 2nd 2009 by Phantom Button
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
I must admit I like the comparisons with the 10 commandments which have worked so well for christian morality down through the centuries - after all most of us would know many of them off the top of our heads such as the sixth! It was quite funny how No. 5 was broken at the Friday lunchtime session where 3 young musicians of very high technical ability joined us. We played "The Cup of Tea", which they didn't seem to know, at a nice session pace but as we moved into the Copperplate, which they knew only too well, they ramped up the speed to Riverdance rates. The facial expressions of most of the group who had been together throughout the week were priceless - a combination of resignation as they contemplated how one might achieve reasonable session behaviour amongst the uninitiated. To many of us who've been around sessions since the year dot, guidelines like these which are so obvious may seem rediculous, but to many of those new to the session scene, I think they would be very useful. And it's not just me as all of the 25 or so musicians who helped put them together are behind them to a man (and woman!).
# Posted on June 2nd 2009 by Bannerman
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
But, Bannermen, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?
# Posted on June 2nd 2009 by grego
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
OK Grego, if "everyone were to love thy neighbour ...etc" then there would arguably be no need for the other nine commandments. Similarly the same might be said for guideline No. 1 because musicians who "listen" would know when they were out of tune, were creating dissonance, were altering the tempo of the session, etc. For certain musicians though, experience suggests that these things need to be spelt out.
# Posted on June 2nd 2009 by Bannerman
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
If you have to command someone, more than a few times, to listen;
chances are they are not.
# Posted on June 2nd 2009 by Random_notes
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
I like that! Very Zen, very one hand clapping there.
# Posted on June 2nd 2009 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
I had the good fortune of visiting Ireland and attending the workshop in Ennis, I found this to be a great opportunity to learn session tunes and with the book and cd package it will help when I return home to Canada. There was some good humour over the creation of this list as we discovered how we each might break the occasional one even during the workshop. It was taken with a certain amount of seriousness as most people feel they want to have fun during sessions without all the ego stuff. I found it interesting that the subject of session guidlines was discussed. At first I was a bit surprised that the Irish have the same issues that we might face in our jams with bluegrass and jazz groups that we attend. Goes to show that people are the same everywhere. You will always find those that like to play the loudest, with masterful speed and usually with a closed mind regarding other players. My wife and I have attended several other festivals in Ireland over the past 6 years and will continue to do so, we enjoy the music and the sense of humour that most people have. Other session players that I know will be interested in the tunes that were discussed and will want to hear more about what is going on in the trad music world in Ireland. Keep up the good work bannerman.
# Posted on June 24th 2009 by blanch
Re: Session Behaviour - The Ennis Consensus
Thanks for the comments Blanch. I agree that it was a lot of fun and that many of the rules we agreed came out of the week's sessions - I'll never forget the embarrassment of being responsible for the mobile phones one! I was most interested also in your view that some of these points might equally apply in other areas such as bluegrass and jazz - noodling may not just be the bane of trad players after all! I think I know who you are and we'll be delighted if you can visit us again sometime in the future when you're in the Ennis area.
# Posted on June 24th 2009 by Bannerman