Funny, I was just talking with a friend this morning about festival sessions. Crusty djembe 'players' who become musicians since the last festival the went to were they bought a djembe. Djembes are ridiculously unsuitable for traditional music.
there are specially trained police dogs at all Irish ports that can sniff a Djembe from 50 meters - deportation or transportation (south west England) for 1st offenders
Oh, I thought it was US English :-b
"Djembes are ridiculously unsuitable for traditional music."
I would have said:
"Djembes are ridiculously unsuitable for Irish traditional music."
From Wikipedia: "There is general agreement that the origin of the djembe is associated with a class of Mandinka/Susu blacksmiths known as Numu. The wide dispersion of the djembe drums throughout West Africa may be due to Numu migrations dating from the first millennium A.D."
If its true, then they are presumably suited to some form of traditional music.
OK, point taken, djembe is ridiculously unsuitable for our type of traditional music.
"Why is any kind of drum more or less suited to a given music?"
- because it is FAR to loud, it eats up a wide range of frequencies and it is almost always in the wrong hands.
What's utterly sad about this thread is that the poster (under a previous user name) stomped off in a hissy fit some two months ago (and is suspended until mid-November this year), but feels the need to use another alter ego to comment upon his own somewhat feeble attempt at humour. Why he needs to keep returning here is, undoubtedly, a suitable cause of investigation for students of psychopathy.
Exactly, Ramiro, it's two pseudonyms, each exhibiting exactly the same idiosyncratic grammar and spelling. But, hey, at least it keeps him off the streets!
Djembe's go very well with trad Irish music if they're played well.
The problem in not the instrument it's the fact that people think that playing the drum is easy and assume it takes no skill.
So they think that if you are not musical you should play the drum.
The fact that the djembe is such a loud drum means that the exact opposite is true. It actually takes a lot of skill to play a loud instrument sensatively and in the right hands it can give alot of energy..
I think maybe the problem arises from embarrasment. If somebody is banging a drum indiscriminatley through a session people get stuck between anger and politness. It's ok to say ' can you stop that now'.
Let them have a bit of fun then take control of the situation like an adult..
You can add KIla to that list sean and prob lots of others too.
Bogman - Couldn't you afford to buy the rest of the kit then. I also played the drums (plural) in a dance band for years. I don't expect to go to hell because I was GREAT...........!!!!!!!!
I myself personally prefer the Bodhran or the Cajon (Though they are two completely different drumming styles) you might try a dumbek, they're easy to carry and sound great. (not to mention they are usually cheap)
ScotiaBalach - we had a cajon "player" at our sessions a few years ago. For those unfamiliar, a cajon is a wooden box with snares and a sound hole popular in Spain. The "player" sits on top of the box and thumps away. A decent percussionist can make it sound like a full drum kit. A novice can destroy an entire session inside of two tunes. If you think a djembe is loud, a cajon is deafening. A person would need some serious cajones to drag a %$#@&* cajon into our pub again. We'd bury him in it.
Ah, just looked at your profile. Highly unlikely to be Glasgow I'd imagine. I know one good Cajon player - but it's a serious nightmare in the wrong hands.
I've heard great cajon players too bogman - used ensemble groups like the Gypsy Kings, etc. They're wonderful in that setting. However, to hear one in a cozy pub trampling slip-jig to death like the running of the bulls in Pamplona is a disaster.
Yes I'd agree, and actually I think some of my comments above were OTT. I'm a bit cranky this week. Should have said that in general djembe isn't great for trad. Folk who know what they're doing can be great for a session, the problem is the vast majority of people who own a djembe can't play it and are generally unlikely to have much knowledge of traditional music.
I have heard a djembe played so sympathetically, bearly fingered, whispered, and so soft and sweet ... its more to do with how the player plays it ...
Drumming sessions are fun ... but nothing to do with Irish Trad.
Bogman - Not necessary crap - Just the fact that a drummer in a dance band referring to the 'snare drum only' was a bit like an accordionst spelling his accordion as 'accordian'. As for the Djembe Drum playing along with Trad......when I hear a Djembe Drummer who can do Flimflams/Paradiddles/ Long Rolls etc, then he is welcome to play in my gang. Until then .........stick with the Bambaras.
The Djembe is used to great effect in Old Blind Dogs - but that is definately the exception rather than the rule. As with any drumming or indeed any instrumentation it is a matter of being able to play it well and sensitively. Any instrument can ruin a session if played badly.
That's true but but you can't just pick up a melody instrument and join in with a session having only played it a few months and/or with very little knowledge of the music you're playing. Probably only 1 in every 100 djembes I've ever heard has been played well.
What Bogman said is one of the main problems with percussionists. It is deceptively easy to think that one can play drums in any session (you just hit it, right?) knowing nothing about the music whereas melody players are less likely to think that this is possible. I gave a lecture to a guy the other day who was listening to a session and at the end of it, he said, "If I buy a hand drum this week, could I bring it to the session next week?" Everyone else looked nervously at each other, afraid to be like, "I don't think so." I very kindly told him that to really play this music, even on the drums, you need to listen to lots and lots and lots of it. You can't just show up with a drum and expect to get by ok. You have to know the tunes.
Nobody who is even vaguely sane thinks they can buy a whistle, a fiddle, a flute, a box, or even worse, a set of pipes this week and play it in the session next week. Oftentimes people believe it can be done with a drum, and it can't. You can debate about whether or not drums are *necessary* in trad music all day but the main problem with drums seems to emerge from the delusion that it's easy and you can play in the session without knowing tunes.
Okay ... "barely" ... not that "bearly" RichardB (embarrassed emoticon) Sheeze!
Where I heard the lovely djembe playing was at a performance (not Trad) under the stars at the birds of prey amphitheatre in the Desert Park (like a big open plan zoo for desert animals and plants) ... I forget exactly what was being celebrated ... a full moon or the longest night, or something. Everyone was rugged up but it was still cold. Two people were playing guitar and djembe while they sang. As I say, just a whisper of djembe. Memorable. Lovely.
Djembe Drums
Re: Djembe Drums
Ha ha ha ha ha ha, Michael, on you go xx
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by Kathryn35
Re: Djembe Drums
Beating a Djembe drum with a metronome would result in mutually assured destruction!
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by RichardB
Re: Djembe Drums
Wind up alert.
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by Henk Bos
Re: Djembe Drums
Funny, I was just talking with a friend this morning about festival sessions. Crusty djembe 'players' who become musicians since the last festival the went to were they bought a djembe. Djembes are ridiculously unsuitable for traditional music.
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by bogman
Re: Djembe Drums
there are specially trained police dogs at all Irish ports that can sniff a Djembe from 50 meters - deportation or transportation (south west England) for 1st offenders
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by iwerzon
Re: Djembe Drums
"Djembes are ridiculously unsuitable for traditional music."
If all percussion instruments are superflous, per Mr. Llig...
...and we allow bodhrans, clicky clacky things and shakey eggs...
...then why not allow any superflous percussion instrument?
Now that's a wind-up. Ha ha ho ho hee hee.
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Djembe Drums
The word I typed above, 'superflous' is more commonly known as "superflUous" and on that error, I'm off to get another cuppa coffee.
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Djembe Drums
Oh, I thought it was US English :-b
"Djembes are ridiculously unsuitable for traditional music."
I would have said:
"Djembes are ridiculously unsuitable for Irish traditional music."
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by Ramiro
Re: Djembe Drums
From Wikipedia: "There is general agreement that the origin of the djembe is associated with a class of Mandinka/Susu blacksmiths known as Numu. The wide dispersion of the djembe drums throughout West Africa may be due to Numu migrations dating from the first millennium A.D."
If its true, then they are presumably suited to some form of traditional music.
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by showaddydadito
Re: Djembe Drums
crossed post with yours Ramiro.
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by showaddydadito
Re: Djembe Drums
It's a drum. You beat it. Why is any kind of drum more or less suited to a given music?
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by Tirno
Re: Djembe Drums
mmm . . .
I see your point Tirno . . . . .
but the place of the snare drum in the slow air is eluding me just now . . . . I expect it'll come to me if I try harder
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by showaddydadito
Re: Djembe Drums
OK, point taken, djembe is ridiculously unsuitable for our type of traditional music.
"Why is any kind of drum more or less suited to a given music?"
- because it is FAR to loud, it eats up a wide range of frequencies and it is almost always in the wrong hands.
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by bogman
Re: Djembe Drums
.....a djembe that is.
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by bogman
Re: Djembe Drums
And when I was a teenager I played the snare drum in a dance band. I expect to burn in hell for that sin.
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by bogman
Re: Djembe Drums
Be sure and use the finest djembe sticks.
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by reenactor
Re: Djembe Drums
What's utterly sad about this thread is that the poster (under a previous user name) stomped off in a hissy fit some two months ago (and is suspended until mid-November this year), but feels the need to use another alter ego to comment upon his own somewhat feeble attempt at humour. Why he needs to keep returning here is, undoubtedly, a suitable cause of investigation for students of psychopathy.
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by MacCruiskeen
Re: Djembe Drums
Another _two_ alter egos.
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by Ramiro
Re: Djembe Drums
What do you all think of the djembe used in some of Mary Bergin's music (as well as Dordan's music)?
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by Sutor
Re: Djembe Drums
Exactly, Ramiro, it's two pseudonyms, each exhibiting exactly the same idiosyncratic grammar and spelling. But, hey, at least it keeps him off the streets!
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by MacCruiskeen
Re: Djembe Drums
"And when I was a teenager I played the snare drum in a dance band. I expect to burn in hell for that sin."
I wouldn't worry about it too much Bogman. They have the best music in Hell anyway!
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by No Cause For Alarm
Re: Djembe Drums
Djembe's go very well with trad Irish music if they're played well.
The problem in not the instrument it's the fact that people think that playing the drum is easy and assume it takes no skill.
So they think that if you are not musical you should play the drum.
The fact that the djembe is such a loud drum means that the exact opposite is true. It actually takes a lot of skill to play a loud instrument sensatively and in the right hands it can give alot of energy..
I think maybe the problem arises from embarrasment. If somebody is banging a drum indiscriminatley through a session people get stuck between anger and politness. It's ok to say ' can you stop that now'.
Let them have a bit of fun then take control of the situation like an adult..
You can add KIla to that list sean and prob lots of others too.
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by paulflute
Re: Djembe Drums
"Djembe's go very well with trad Irish music if they're played well."
Well, it's nice to have that sorted.
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by Gzeg
Re: Djembe Drums
Bogman - Couldn't you afford to buy the rest of the kit then. I also played the drums (plural) in a dance band for years. I don't expect to go to hell because I was GREAT...........!!!!!!!!
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by Free Reed
Re: Djembe Drums
Yes, I played kit too and skill levels are not what I'm talking about. Do you assume I was crap?
# Posted on February 2nd 2009 by bogman
Re: Djembe Drums
I myself personally prefer the Bodhran or the Cajon (Though they are two completely different drumming styles) you might try a dumbek, they're easy to carry and sound great. (not to mention they are usually cheap)
# Posted on February 3rd 2009 by ScotiaBalach
Re: Djembe Drums
ScotiaBalach - we had a cajon "player" at our sessions a few years ago. For those unfamiliar, a cajon is a wooden box with snares and a sound hole popular in Spain. The "player" sits on top of the box and thumps away. A decent percussionist can make it sound like a full drum kit. A novice can destroy an entire session inside of two tunes. If you think a djembe is loud, a cajon is deafening. A person would need some serious cajones to drag a %$#@&* cajon into our pub again. We'd bury him in it.
# Posted on February 3rd 2009 by Jusa Nutter Eejit
Re: Djembe Drums
Was it in the Uisge Beatha in Glasgow by any chance Jusa?
# Posted on February 3rd 2009 by bogman
Re: Djembe Drums
Ah, just looked at your profile. Highly unlikely to be Glasgow I'd imagine. I know one good Cajon player - but it's a serious nightmare in the wrong hands.
# Posted on February 3rd 2009 by bogman
Re: Djembe Drums
I've heard great cajon players too bogman - used ensemble groups like the Gypsy Kings, etc. They're wonderful in that setting. However, to hear one in a cozy pub trampling slip-jig to death like the running of the bulls in Pamplona is a disaster.
# Posted on February 3rd 2009 by Jusa Nutter Eejit
Re: Djembe Drums
Yes I'd agree, and actually I think some of my comments above were OTT. I'm a bit cranky this week. Should have said that in general djembe isn't great for trad. Folk who know what they're doing can be great for a session, the problem is the vast majority of people who own a djembe can't play it and are generally unlikely to have much knowledge of traditional music.
# Posted on February 3rd 2009 by bogman
Re: Djembe Drums
our trad that is
# Posted on February 3rd 2009 by bogman
Re: Djembe Drums
Djembes are great - for drumming sessions.
# Posted on February 3rd 2009 by RockyRoader
Re: Djembe Drums
I have heard a djembe played so sympathetically, bearly fingered, whispered, and so soft and sweet ... its more to do with how the player plays it ...
Drumming sessions are fun ... but nothing to do with Irish Trad.
# Posted on February 3rd 2009 by Clear Drops
Re: Djembe Drums
Bogman - if more of the people on this site were as honest and gentle as your last post, the world would be a better place.
On the other hand, we've enjoyed some great fights on this board over the years . . . . .
# Posted on February 3rd 2009 by showaddydadito
Re: Djembe Drums
"bearly fingered", eh, Clear Drops! Here's an example: http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=fax5J2zjHsA
# Posted on February 3rd 2009 by RichardB
Re: Djembe Drums
Bogman - Not necessary crap - Just the fact that a drummer in a dance band referring to the 'snare drum only' was a bit like an accordionst spelling his accordion as 'accordian'. As for the Djembe Drum playing along with Trad......when I hear a Djembe Drummer who can do Flimflams/Paradiddles/ Long Rolls etc, then he is welcome to play in my gang. Until then .........stick with the Bambaras.
# Posted on February 3rd 2009 by Free Reed
Re: Djembe Drums
Well, what the rest of the kit does in a dance band barely justifies mentioning. Boom, chick. Hardly Ginger Baker is it?
# Posted on February 3rd 2009 by bogman
Re: Djembe Drums
The Djembe is used to great effect in Old Blind Dogs - but that is definately the exception rather than the rule. As with any drumming or indeed any instrumentation it is a matter of being able to play it well and sensitively. Any instrument can ruin a session if played badly.
# Posted on February 3rd 2009 by No Cause For Alarm
Re: Djembe Drums
That's true but but you can't just pick up a melody instrument and join in with a session having only played it a few months and/or with very little knowledge of the music you're playing. Probably only 1 in every 100 djembes I've ever heard has been played well.
# Posted on February 3rd 2009 by bogman
Re: Djembe Drums
What Bogman said is one of the main problems with percussionists. It is deceptively easy to think that one can play drums in any session (you just hit it, right?) knowing nothing about the music whereas melody players are less likely to think that this is possible. I gave a lecture to a guy the other day who was listening to a session and at the end of it, he said, "If I buy a hand drum this week, could I bring it to the session next week?" Everyone else looked nervously at each other, afraid to be like, "I don't think so." I very kindly told him that to really play this music, even on the drums, you need to listen to lots and lots and lots of it. You can't just show up with a drum and expect to get by ok. You have to know the tunes.
Nobody who is even vaguely sane thinks they can buy a whistle, a fiddle, a flute, a box, or even worse, a set of pipes this week and play it in the session next week. Oftentimes people believe it can be done with a drum, and it can't. You can debate about whether or not drums are *necessary* in trad music all day but the main problem with drums seems to emerge from the delusion that it's easy and you can play in the session without knowing tunes.
# Posted on February 3rd 2009 by DrSilverSpear
Re: Djembe Drums
Okay ... "barely" ... not that "bearly" RichardB (embarrassed emoticon) Sheeze!
Where I heard the lovely djembe playing was at a performance (not Trad) under the stars at the birds of prey amphitheatre in the Desert Park (like a big open plan zoo for desert animals and plants) ... I forget exactly what was being celebrated ... a full moon or the longest night, or something. Everyone was rugged up but it was still cold. Two people were playing guitar and djembe while they sang. As I say, just a whisper of djembe. Memorable. Lovely.
# Posted on February 3rd 2009 by Clear Drops
Re: Djembe Drums
Same applies to guitars!
# Posted on February 9th 2009 by stevekeene