If anyone cares to discuss how they go about learning a new tune ~
here is a short survey regarding your session/ your tunes. Feel free to skip over the 1st part if you like. But thanks if you care to elaborate on the last bit.
The session meets:
- once a month
- weekly
- more often than once a week
Of all the tunes played in our last session I:
- had already learned every tune played.
- knew most of the tunes played.
- knew a few of the tunes.
- none of the above.
At the last session in which new tunes were introduced I:
- introduced every tune.
- introduced a new tune as did at least one other player.
- did not introduce a new tune.
- have not heard a new tune submitted in the past year.
Regarding new tunes ~
When learning a tune in session we ______ .
- weekly
- knew most of the tunes
- introduced a new tune as did at least one other player
When learning a tune in session, we usually have had one person learn it, and send it around to at least one of the other players via email. And then people get interested in it, and ask to have it sent to them so they can learn it too.
There are tunes that I play that I never "officially learned". Often, those will be tunes that I've heard played for some time, and I know the tune well enough to try playing it on my instrument. Occasionally, I'll be playing a tune, and think "wow, I haven't played this forever, and I'm playing it like crap..." Later to find out that it was the first time I ever tried playing that tune...
Weekly
Knew most of the tunes
Introduced a new tune as did at least one other player
A month ago, I learned The Golden Keyboard on the fly as our flute player played it. I kept it very quiet - in fact I turned away from the other players so as not to disrupt - but the phrases jumped right out at me and I nearly had it complete by the time he was done. I went home and ironed out a few wrinkly spots with a few ABC files and was able to play it cleanly with him by the next session. Some tunes just come easily that way - others take me months to get comfortable with - so it goes.
- Weekly session
- Knew most of the tunes played
- did not introduce a tune.
When new tunes are introduced it depends on who brings the tune. So I'll take the most recent ~ a Breton tune recorded by Ad Vielle Que Pourra. I have not learned it but can pick up the basic melody if they play it several times in the next few sessions.I think it is in A minor with some funny modulation that has a G# (maybe). Iwill try to borrow the CD.
'Golden Keyboard' is cool, A few months back one of the flute players' introduced 'Golden Castle'. It is a good new/old tune that is fun to play.
once a week
knew some of the tunes
did not introduce a tune
new tunes - if I like a tune we hear, ask the name, go away and learn it, some other people can learn asthey go, but not me
Spot on, Trevor. Also, I'm not aware of *anyone* deliberately introducing 'new' tunes, unless it's me, once in a blue moon, trying to sneak one of my own in ...
Mostly, though, people just play tunes they've thought of, and sometimes everyone knows them, and sometimes not.
The trouble with the concept of 'introducing' tunes is that that implies that there is a 'repertoire' for the session. Sounds terribly stale to me, even before you start.
To me, the way it works is this:
All my session mates (well, most, anyway) have hundreds of tunes.
I have hundreds of tunes.
Not all of our respective 'repertoires' overlap.
All of us have constantly shifting repertoires, with some tunes being added - because of trips, fleadhs etc, and some being forgotten.
All of the above means that, for any given night, none of us knows quite what's going to happen, which keeps the session interesting.
Of all the tunes played in our last session I:
- knew most of the tunes played.
At the last session in which new tunes were introduced I:
- introduced a new tune as did at least one other player.
Regarding new tunes ~
When learning a tune in session we listen first... give it a go if we can pick it up... or ask what the name is/where the person got it from and learn it later.
Weekly, though I have folks over for a relaxed, learning-style kitchen session at my house too.
Of all the tunes played in our last session I:
Knew nearly all of them
At the last session in which new tunes were introduced I:
Introduced a new tune as did at least one other player.
Regarding new tunes:
Here's where it gets tricky. I'm the anchor and there's a small gang of weekly regulars. We know all each others' tunes or almost know them all. We are always are learning new things and inflicting (teaching?) them on each other, which is great and lots of fun. Keeps the relationship new and exciting, we've never needed any session counseling over the years.
We also have a rotating cast of folks who make it every few weeks, so there' always a different face around. Always they have tunes not everyone knows that we get from them and try to make sure everyone in the extended circle knows. It's a never ending wonderful and fun challenge to try to get everyone in the big extended circle to know everyone else's tunes, plus everyone keeps learning new ones and sharing them! AAA!!!
In any one of the local sessions, most of the tunes are played more or less every time. But new or seldom-played tunes are regularly brought on. When I do this they are usually of shattering obscurity, mainly because I have made them up the week before. This allows others to go to the bar or the bogs or catch up on the goss, so it's a public service, really. When new tunes come in, I noodle shamelessly. When well-established tunes come on that I haven't mastered, I do the same - sometimes trying to play the whole thing, sometimes just sitting on it and trying to get that G# or F natural right each time it comes round. No-one has yet thrown beer at me for doing this, though whether this is an indication of great generosity or of great parsimony I am not sure.
In short, I would describe the situation as healthy.
"The trouble with the concept of 'introducing' tunes is , , , that implies a 'repertoire' . . .Sounds terribly stale to me, even before you start."
I hear you benhall1. Been there ~ done that.
I am much more interested in keeping the craic going. Especially when someone starts a tune & you think, "What have we got here?" Maybe I have heard it before. maybe not, might be making it up as she/he goes along. Something is 'new' (call it what you like). So then what do you do? Jump right in . . . listen . . wait for the next tune?
Cheers
(NB - If someone's playing really beautiful music and everyone else is listening spellbound and enchanted, or has passed out, I sometimes forbear to noodle: I do maintain certain standards...)
"In any one of the local sessions, most of the tunes are played more or less every time."
Now, I'm just checking here ... but that's a wind-up, right? The last few times I've been to my local session, I shouldn't think there was even *one* tune that was played on more than one occasion.
In answer to your last question, Random Muse, if I haven't heard it before, I'll listen the first time and then, if I think I've got it (happens with about 50% of tunes, provided I'm 'in the groove', as I think our American brethren have it), I'll jump in on the second time round. I usually can't remember it after that one 'outing' as it were - it would normally take me 'til I've heard it in 3 or 4 sessions before I can actually remember it. And there are some tunes that I can't pick up until I've heard them over and over again. I haven't yet figured out which tunes they are, and which the 'easy' ones are.
No, benhall, that bit of my post wasn't a wind-up, sets do get played pretty well every time at the sessions I go to (different sets at each session, mind) - but it's not entirely like Groundhog Day as new tunes *do* feed in and get taken up.
But there are always "regular" tunes I haven't got the hang of (yet), so I redeem the time by noodling them. Indeed, that's why I noodle so much. They may be tunes I don't like enough to practise properly at home, or can't remember between sessions...
Granted, take my answers with a grain of salt, as I just moved to a new area, and I don't know a lot of the "regular" tunes. I've found in my travels (I traveled to many different sessions in the past year or so) that each region has it's own "regular" tune sets. And in this area, a lot of the players overlap at the sessions.
Of all the tunes played in our last session I:
-knew about *half* of the tunes.
At the last session in which new tunes were introduced I:
- introduced a new tune as did at least one other player. several new tunes, actually, one of which is rarely heard in these parts.
One session leader actually filled me in on some of the sets that group played regularly, and I hope to become at least familiar with those sets.
Regarding learning new tunes:
-if the tune is familiar to me, I'll listen a round through, and then join in (quietly), with the goal of hitting all the right notes. If I really like the tune, but don't know it, I'll record it, or ask the name. It takes me about three sessions of hearing the tune before I know it and join in at full volume.
the weekly session i attend varies greatly in terms of who shows up, experience level of the players, etc. "noodling" is generally frowned upon, as the space we play in is rather small and the session is often amplified by an overhead mic. A lot of the players will use recording devices when a new tune is played if they wish to learn it. in general this results in long sets being played with people dropping in and out when appropriate. sometimes the tunes are chosen beforehand to ascertain what tunes everyone knows, other times it is more spontaneous. it "keeps the craic going"
The session meets:
I usually go weekly, but there is music every night so I often turn up on other nights
Of all the tunes played in the last session I went to:
I knew most of the tunes played. (which did leave 20 or 30 or so that I had the pleasure of just listening to. And learning a couple of nice jigs)
At the last session in which new tunes were introduced I:
I can't remember the last time I went out and didn't hear a tune I've never heard before. And often I'll play a tune that nobody else knows.
Regarding new tunes ~
Tune played that other people don't know fall into one of two categories: Tunes you've known for yonks and just dragged up and tunes you newly acquired. Usually, the tunes you've just dragged up are hardly ever good tunes, That's why you kind of forgot about them. But if you've been playing this music for yonks, you should be getting into the knack of choosing good tunes, so the ones you choose to learn should, on balance be better tunes that the ones you've let slip into obscurity.
So when people play a tune they've just acquired they usually let everyone else know. So they can sit up and pay attention. Usually, these tunes get learned by the rest of us.
-weekly
-knew most
-introduced a 'new' one - not heard before at this session - and
found a couple of people also knew it, but I've never heard them play it
I've learned a whole bunch of interesting tunes that nobody plays and
I try to sort of 'leak' them out, but they're not getting picked up
If we want to, we can go to a session every week depending on how far we feel like driving.
Twice a month, there are sessions at Cregeen's here in North Little Rock.
Twice a month, there are sessions in Conway and it takes about thirty minutes to drive there from here.
Once a month, there is a session in Hot Springs Village and it takes almost ninety minutes to drive there from here.
After playing piano more-or-less irregularly at the local sessions since they started in 1995, I know most of the tunes which are played at the local sessions.
Speaking as the piano player, instead of trying to introduce new tunes, I just accompany the other musicians. Occasionally, one of the melody players will introduce a new tune. If the other melody players want to learn the new tune, they will either listen to a recording of it if they can't read music or go some web site (like this) which has sheet music (otherwise known as the "dots').
If we are going to play a set of three or more tunes, the melody players will discuss it briefly and then start playing. I don't try to influence these discussions--I just literally play along with whatever the rest of this group of mixed nuts has decided they want to play.
The session meets:
- Never - There aren't any sessions here.
Of all the tunes played in our last session I:
- had already learned every tune played, since I was the only one there.
At the last session in which new tunes were introduced I:
- introduced every tune, but sometimes I surprise myself, and forget the name, or the tune - and have to move on to something else.
I live in a vacuum of music which allows for a very free and liberal interpretation of ITM, and when I go to an outside session, this ability to elaborate at will has garnered some fairly astonished looks by the regulars.
When someone gets a new favorite tune, and nobody else knows it, s/he plays it every week or every other week. After we've heard it for a couple of weeks, we can play it.
Of all the tunes played in our last session I knew most of the tunes played.
At the last session in which new tunes were introduced I introduced a new tune as did at least one other player.
Regarding new tunes ~ The session is very open regarding new tunes. Every few weeks, someone will just start a tune which not every one will be familiar with. For example, last week, a flute player played "Jack Roe", which no one else knew. I tinkered around quietly to see if I could make it out, then sat it out after the first run through. It was different to the version I was familiar with. I asked him his source, it was one of his friends.
So, yesterday, I dug out my recordings of Jack Roe and learnt the tune. Next week, I'll be able to play it. Thats how it works. It will be a surprise to see how many others have learnt the tune since. And, its probable, that another tune I don't know will come up!
Out of those tunes, there are maybe a handful of them that I can say I know.
And then sometimes I hear someone playing that tune who shows me that that tune that I THOUGHT I knew, I never really knew it as I should, and so it's back to the drawing board.
Some weeks I know most of the tunes and sometime it know around half. I never mind just sitting out and listening, and am not one to noodle or try to figure one out on the fly, unless it sounds really easy. I'll write down the name of any new tunes I want to learn.
More than half the time I'll introduce a new tune.
Of all the tunes played in our last session I:
- knew most of the tunes played.
At the last session in which new tunes were introduced I:
- introduced a new tune as did at least one other player.
Regarding new tunes ~
When learning a tune in session I try and work it out as I go along, then ask the name so I can go and look it up. I often find I can play a tune in a session but if you ask me to play it later I'm clueless.
Our local session meets weekly. The tunes are posted on a website, and updated frequently, so I can catch up just by looking at the website. New tunes are introduced weekly or every other week, depending. The moderators start with beginners at 3pm for an hour of slow, by-ear learning, then at four the rest of us drift in for trying the tunes closer to speed, then 5:00 to 6:00 is "play what you know", where everyone gets a chance to lead a tune or a set of tunes, and other tunes are randomly introduced. Works for me, and the pub gives us a free pint each.
Not quite on topic, but I had a bizarre tune-learning experience at a fiddle workshop in Donegal a couple of weeks ago. The tutor, Mick Brown, was teaching us a gan ainm two-step. After he'd gone through it in some detail the six of us played it through with him a few times as a group, without any problems. Then, as usual, Mick asked each of us one-by-one to play the tune on our own, he standing by to render assistance where necessary.
When it came to my turn, to my surprise and embarrassment I just couldn't get past the first few notes without freezing, despite Mick's help. What happened was that the first few notes were very similar to the start of the children's nursery rhyme "Nellie the Elephant", and that was sufficient to fire up that tune in my head and obliterate everything of the tune we'd been taught. I hadn't realised it, but "Nellie" must have got embedded in my brain when my kids were small, about 30 years ago, because that tune was very popular on radio and television, and almost anywhere where you'd find young children. Anyway, I explained what I thought was happening, and another member of the group, an Irish primary school teacher from Cavan, sang the song for the benefit of the class, which included a German and two French players.
I have since worked out that the only reasonable way I'm going to learn Mick's tune is to transcribe the B-part first from my tape, learn that thoroughly, and then chance the A-part, hoping it's not going to fall apart!
I've checked out "Nellie the Elephant" on Wikipedia. It's a nice little jig in its own right, was composed in the 1950s (so is still very much in copyright - see the BMI thread, people!), and has been very popular since.
Anyone else had any strange or unusual tune-learning stories to tell?
lazyhound there are so many stories I have like yours.
I am just deranged enough that I try to find tunes which. as you say, start off like . . . & then try to work them out. This is usually a long process. So I tell myself it's working. Then again I also like starting some tunes on the B part. Good luck.
When I was much younger, I used to waste some of my precious and valuable free time hanging out at science fiction conventions because that is what I like to read when I am not pretending to be a musician. Some of the other musicians at these conventions borrowed Irish and/or Scottish tunes for their songs about science fictional subjects. As a result, I originally learned some Irish and Scottish tunes in an altered or a slightly different form or version from how they are played at sessions. When some other local musicians started an Irish Jam Session here in 1995, I finally got to learn the original versions of these tunes which I had first heard many years ago at a science fiction convention.
- waited until they left for a break and then
played my most subversive, rhythmic new
tunes to obstruct their candy, lifeless, squishy,
familiar stuff.
Lazyhound, that would depend on how you value your free time and what sort of value you place on your time.
By "free time", I mean time when I am not working at my day job. I consider myself lucky to have finally found a job I like. I actually look forward to going to work every day.
Yes, benhall.1, I do like the books of the late Michael Moorcock and have read almost everything he wrote. I even had the opportunity to meet Moorcock in person at a science fiction convention in Atlanta, Georgia in 1993 but I was too shy to introduce myself to him. I still like to read science fiction when I am not pretending to be a musician but I no longer attend conventions because I prefer to spend my free time playing music.
Yep, I've read pretty much everything Moorcock wrote as well. I think the people who liked his stuff would, like me, just pounce on the latest book as soon as it hit the shelves. Certainly, at one time, over here at least, if you didn't get a copy on the first day of publication, you'd normally have to wait about a year 'til you got the chance again.
Did you ever see him with Hawkwind? I'm afraid I didn't, but that is definitely one of those things I'd do 'if I had my time again'.
No, I never did get to see Moorcock perform with Hawkwind.
When I was thirteen, I discovered the Conan the Barbarian books by Robert E. Howard which were edited by Lin Carter and L. Sprague de Camp and read all of them. In one of the introductions to a collection of Conan stories which Carter edited, he mentioned some book titled the Worm Ouroboros by E.R. Eddison which Carter claimed was one of the books that influenced Howard so of course I had to read this Worm Ouroboros also.
Then I discovered Moorcock's books about Elric of Melnibone and his Eternal Champion series as well as the books which were supposed to be set at the End Of Time and read all of them.
This was after I discovered and read all of the Narnia books by C.S. Lewis when I was eleven. Then, the next year, when I was twelve, I discovered The Hobbit by Tolkien and read that book. So, of course, I then had to read all three books of The Lord Of The Rings as well.
I should probably mention that I've been playing fiddle less than 3 years.
The session meets:
- weekly
Of all the tunes played in our last session I:
- knew most of the tunes played. However, many of the tunes I know about 1/2 and about 3/4 of the tunes I have no name for.
At the last session in which new tunes were introduced I:
I usually listen to old obscure recordings that many of those in our session haven't heard. In the last year, I have probably played about 10-20 new tunes and heard about 100+ new tunes I didn't know.
Regarding new tunes ~
When learning a tune in session we ______
I don't know about others, but I usually try to identify the key the tune is in and the notes that stick out. I try to recognize patterns and consider what notes are likely to be played and what not. For instance in a tune in A major, C# is much more common than D, depending on how the tune goes. Also, recently, I have been lilting the tune if I don't know it well enough to play. This really helps me get the tune in my head. If I try to play without this on new tunes, I really screw up. Then there's the tunes that I've heard a ton, but never managed to play. Suddenly I try to play and boom, I've got it. Pretty cool stuff.
good experienced players so pretty much any set someone starts there are at least two others who know the tunes
one thing we do every once and a while is go around in a circle, with each person playing a different tune. Like one person plays a jig, say twice, then the person to his or her left goes into some other jig, etc...People tend to join in the second time around.
Or we might do the same thing with original tunes, where each player starts up a tune after the previous player's gone around twice, that kind of thing...
Survey ~ learning tunes in session
Survey ~ learning tunes in session
If anyone cares to discuss how they go about learning a new tune ~
here is a short survey regarding your session/ your tunes. Feel free to skip over the 1st part if you like. But thanks if you care to elaborate on the last bit.
The session meets:
- once a month
- weekly
- more often than once a week
Of all the tunes played in our last session I:
- had already learned every tune played.
- knew most of the tunes played.
- knew a few of the tunes.
- none of the above.
At the last session in which new tunes were introduced I:
- introduced every tune.
- introduced a new tune as did at least one other player.
- did not introduce a new tune.
- have not heard a new tune submitted in the past year.
Regarding new tunes ~
When learning a tune in session we ______ .
# Posted on August 30th 2008 by Random_notes
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
- weekly
- knew most of the tunes
- introduced a new tune as did at least one other player
When learning a tune in session, we usually have had one person learn it, and send it around to at least one of the other players via email. And then people get interested in it, and ask to have it sent to them so they can learn it too.
There are tunes that I play that I never "officially learned". Often, those will be tunes that I've heard played for some time, and I know the tune well enough to try playing it on my instrument. Occasionally, I'll be playing a tune, and think "wow, I haven't played this forever, and I'm playing it like crap..." Later to find out that it was the first time I ever tried playing that tune...
# Posted on August 30th 2008 by Reverend
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
-weekly
-knew most of the tunes
-did not introduce a new tune.
-When learning a tune in session we quietly noodle to ourselves or ask the name so we can learn it later.
******
It's a session that gets a lot of visitors and new people, so new/unusual tunes get played very often without any fuss.
# Posted on August 30th 2008 by Whiddler
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
Weekly
Knew most of the tunes
Introduced a new tune as did at least one other player
A month ago, I learned The Golden Keyboard on the fly as our flute player played it. I kept it very quiet - in fact I turned away from the other players so as not to disrupt - but the phrases jumped right out at me and I nearly had it complete by the time he was done. I went home and ironed out a few wrinkly spots with a few ABC files and was able to play it cleanly with him by the next session. Some tunes just come easily that way - others take me months to get comfortable with - so it goes.
# Posted on August 31st 2008 by Jusa Nutter Eejit
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
- Weekly session
- Knew most of the tunes played
- did not introduce a tune.
When new tunes are introduced it depends on who brings the tune. So I'll take the most recent ~ a Breton tune recorded by Ad Vielle Que Pourra. I have not learned it but can pick up the basic melody if they play it several times in the next few sessions.I think it is in A minor with some funny modulation that has a G# (maybe). Iwill try to borrow the CD.
'Golden Keyboard' is cool, A few months back one of the flute players' introduced 'Golden Castle'. It is a good new/old tune that is fun to play.
# Posted on August 31st 2008 by Random_notes
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
once a week
knew some of the tunes
did not introduce a tune
new tunes - if I like a tune we hear, ask the name, go away and learn it, some other people can learn asthey go, but not me
# Posted on August 31st 2008 by mehere
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
"learning tunes in sessions" - just happens
# Posted on August 31st 2008 by lazyhound
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
Spot on, Trevor. Also, I'm not aware of *anyone* deliberately introducing 'new' tunes, unless it's me, once in a blue moon, trying to sneak one of my own in ...
Mostly, though, people just play tunes they've thought of, and sometimes everyone knows them, and sometimes not.
# Posted on August 31st 2008 by benhall.1
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
The trouble with the concept of 'introducing' tunes is that that implies that there is a 'repertoire' for the session. Sounds terribly stale to me, even before you start.
To me, the way it works is this:
All my session mates (well, most, anyway) have hundreds of tunes.
I have hundreds of tunes.
Not all of our respective 'repertoires' overlap.
All of us have constantly shifting repertoires, with some tunes being added - because of trips, fleadhs etc, and some being forgotten.
All of the above means that, for any given night, none of us knows quite what's going to happen, which keeps the session interesting.
# Posted on August 31st 2008 by benhall.1
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
The session meets:
- weekly
Of all the tunes played in our last session I:
- knew most of the tunes played.
At the last session in which new tunes were introduced I:
- introduced a new tune as did at least one other player.
Regarding new tunes ~
When learning a tune in session we listen first... give it a go if we can pick it up... or ask what the name is/where the person got it from and learn it later.
# Posted on August 31st 2008 by davydd
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
The session meets:
Weekly, though I have folks over for a relaxed, learning-style kitchen session at my house too.
Of all the tunes played in our last session I:
Knew nearly all of them
At the last session in which new tunes were introduced I:
Introduced a new tune as did at least one other player.
Regarding new tunes:
Here's where it gets tricky. I'm the anchor and there's a small gang of weekly regulars. We know all each others' tunes or almost know them all. We are always are learning new things and inflicting (teaching?) them on each other, which is great and lots of fun. Keeps the relationship new and exciting, we've never needed any session counseling over the years.
We also have a rotating cast of folks who make it every few weeks, so there' always a different face around. Always they have tunes not everyone knows that we get from them and try to make sure everyone in the extended circle knows. It's a never ending wonderful and fun challenge to try to get everyone in the big extended circle to know everyone else's tunes, plus everyone keeps learning new ones and sharing them! AAA!!!
What fun!
# Posted on August 31st 2008 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
One of our session regulars has just gone off on a motorbike trekking holiday in the Himalayas. He's been instructed to bring back a few tunes.
# Posted on August 31st 2008 by lazyhound
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
In any one of the local sessions, most of the tunes are played more or less every time. But new or seldom-played tunes are regularly brought on. When I do this they are usually of shattering obscurity, mainly because I have made them up the week before. This allows others to go to the bar or the bogs or catch up on the goss, so it's a public service, really. When new tunes come in, I noodle shamelessly. When well-established tunes come on that I haven't mastered, I do the same - sometimes trying to play the whole thing, sometimes just sitting on it and trying to get that G# or F natural right each time it comes round. No-one has yet thrown beer at me for doing this, though whether this is an indication of great generosity or of great parsimony I am not sure.
In short, I would describe the situation as healthy.
# Posted on August 31st 2008 by nicholas
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
"The trouble with the concept of 'introducing' tunes is , , , that implies a 'repertoire' . . .Sounds terribly stale to me, even before you start."
I hear you benhall1. Been there ~ done that.
I am much more interested in keeping the craic going. Especially when someone starts a tune & you think, "What have we got here?" Maybe I have heard it before. maybe not, might be making it up as she/he goes along. Something is 'new' (call it what you like). So then what do you do? Jump right in . . . listen . . wait for the next tune?
Cheers
# Posted on August 31st 2008 by Random_notes
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
Listen the first time round, start noodling the second, unless it's obviously something quite intractable because of its notes and/or speed.
# Posted on August 31st 2008 by nicholas
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
(NB - If someone's playing really beautiful music and everyone else is listening spellbound and enchanted, or has passed out, I sometimes forbear to noodle: I do maintain certain standards...)
# Posted on August 31st 2008 by nicholas
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
"In any one of the local sessions, most of the tunes are played more or less every time."
Now, I'm just checking here ... but that's a wind-up, right? The last few times I've been to my local session, I shouldn't think there was even *one* tune that was played on more than one occasion.
In answer to your last question, Random Muse, if I haven't heard it before, I'll listen the first time and then, if I think I've got it (happens with about 50% of tunes, provided I'm 'in the groove', as I think our American brethren have it), I'll jump in on the second time round. I usually can't remember it after that one 'outing' as it were - it would normally take me 'til I've heard it in 3 or 4 sessions before I can actually remember it. And there are some tunes that I can't pick up until I've heard them over and over again. I haven't yet figured out which tunes they are, and which the 'easy' ones are.
# Posted on August 31st 2008 by benhall.1
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
No, benhall, that bit of my post wasn't a wind-up, sets do get played pretty well every time at the sessions I go to (different sets at each session, mind) - but it's not entirely like Groundhog Day as new tunes *do* feed in and get taken up.
But there are always "regular" tunes I haven't got the hang of (yet), so I redeem the time by noodling them. Indeed, that's why I noodle so much. They may be tunes I don't like enough to practise properly at home, or can't remember between sessions...
# Posted on August 31st 2008 by nicholas
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
Granted, take my answers with a grain of salt, as I just moved to a new area, and I don't know a lot of the "regular" tunes. I've found in my travels (I traveled to many different sessions in the past year or so) that each region has it's own "regular" tune sets. And in this area, a lot of the players overlap at the sessions.
Of all the tunes played in our last session I:
-knew about *half* of the tunes.
At the last session in which new tunes were introduced I:
- introduced a new tune as did at least one other player. several new tunes, actually, one of which is rarely heard in these parts.
One session leader actually filled me in on some of the sets that group played regularly, and I hope to become at least familiar with those sets.
Regarding learning new tunes:
-if the tune is familiar to me, I'll listen a round through, and then join in (quietly), with the goal of hitting all the right notes. If I really like the tune, but don't know it, I'll record it, or ask the name. It takes me about three sessions of hearing the tune before I know it and join in at full volume.
# Posted on August 31st 2008 by thebunnystomper
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
the weekly session i attend varies greatly in terms of who shows up, experience level of the players, etc. "noodling" is generally frowned upon, as the space we play in is rather small and the session is often amplified by an overhead mic. A lot of the players will use recording devices when a new tune is played if they wish to learn it. in general this results in long sets being played with people dropping in and out when appropriate. sometimes the tunes are chosen beforehand to ascertain what tunes everyone knows, other times it is more spontaneous. it "keeps the craic going"
# Posted on August 31st 2008 by pipewatcher
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
The session meets:
I usually go weekly, but there is music every night so I often turn up on other nights
Of all the tunes played in the last session I went to:
I knew most of the tunes played. (which did leave 20 or 30 or so that I had the pleasure of just listening to. And learning a couple of nice jigs)
At the last session in which new tunes were introduced I:
I can't remember the last time I went out and didn't hear a tune I've never heard before. And often I'll play a tune that nobody else knows.
Regarding new tunes ~
Tune played that other people don't know fall into one of two categories: Tunes you've known for yonks and just dragged up and tunes you newly acquired. Usually, the tunes you've just dragged up are hardly ever good tunes, That's why you kind of forgot about them. But if you've been playing this music for yonks, you should be getting into the knack of choosing good tunes, so the ones you choose to learn should, on balance be better tunes that the ones you've let slip into obscurity.
So when people play a tune they've just acquired they usually let everyone else know. So they can sit up and pay attention. Usually, these tunes get learned by the rest of us.
# Posted on August 31st 2008 by llig leahcim
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
-weekly
-knew most
-introduced a 'new' one - not heard before at this session - and
found a couple of people also knew it, but I've never heard them play it
I've learned a whole bunch of interesting tunes that nobody plays and
I try to sort of 'leak' them out, but they're not getting picked up
# Posted on September 1st 2008 by Hup
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
If we want to, we can go to a session every week depending on how far we feel like driving.
Twice a month, there are sessions at Cregeen's here in North Little Rock.
Twice a month, there are sessions in Conway and it takes about thirty minutes to drive there from here.
Once a month, there is a session in Hot Springs Village and it takes almost ninety minutes to drive there from here.
After playing piano more-or-less irregularly at the local sessions since they started in 1995, I know most of the tunes which are played at the local sessions.
Speaking as the piano player, instead of trying to introduce new tunes, I just accompany the other musicians. Occasionally, one of the melody players will introduce a new tune. If the other melody players want to learn the new tune, they will either listen to a recording of it if they can't read music or go some web site (like this) which has sheet music (otherwise known as the "dots').
If we are going to play a set of three or more tunes, the melody players will discuss it briefly and then start playing. I don't try to influence these discussions--I just literally play along with whatever the rest of this group of mixed nuts has decided they want to play.
# Posted on September 1st 2008 by fauxcelt
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
The session meets:
- Never - There aren't any sessions here.
Of all the tunes played in our last session I:
- had already learned every tune played, since I was the only one there.
At the last session in which new tunes were introduced I:
- introduced every tune, but sometimes I surprise myself, and forget the name, or the tune - and have to move on to something else.
I live in a vacuum of music which allows for a very free and liberal interpretation of ITM, and when I go to an outside session, this ability to elaborate at will has garnered some fairly astonished looks by the regulars.
# Posted on September 1st 2008 by Toppish
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
When someone gets a new favorite tune, and nobody else knows it, s/he plays it every week or every other week. After we've heard it for a couple of weeks, we can play it.
# Posted on September 1st 2008 by m_gavin
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
The session meets weekly
Of all the tunes played in our last session I knew most of the tunes played.
At the last session in which new tunes were introduced I introduced a new tune as did at least one other player.
Regarding new tunes ~ The session is very open regarding new tunes. Every few weeks, someone will just start a tune which not every one will be familiar with. For example, last week, a flute player played "Jack Roe", which no one else knew. I tinkered around quietly to see if I could make it out, then sat it out after the first run through. It was different to the version I was familiar with. I asked him his source, it was one of his friends.
So, yesterday, I dug out my recordings of Jack Roe and learnt the tune. Next week, I'll be able to play it. Thats how it works. It will be a surprise to see how many others have learnt the tune since. And, its probable, that another tune I don't know will come up!
# Posted on September 1st 2008 by PaddyCmusic
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
I can bluff my way through hundreds of tunes.
Out of those tunes, there are maybe a handful of them that I can say I know.
And then sometimes I hear someone playing that tune who shows me that that tune that I THOUGHT I knew, I never really knew it as I should, and so it's back to the drawing board.
# Posted on September 1st 2008 by jwvansteenwyk
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
The session I go to is weekly.
Some weeks I know most of the tunes and sometime it know around half. I never mind just sitting out and listening, and am not one to noodle or try to figure one out on the fly, unless it sounds really easy. I'll write down the name of any new tunes I want to learn.
More than half the time I'll introduce a new tune.
# Posted on September 1st 2008 by ElaineP
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
The session meets:
- once a month
Of all the tunes played in our last session I:
- knew most of the tunes played.
At the last session in which new tunes were introduced I:
- introduced a new tune as did at least one other player.
Regarding new tunes ~
When learning a tune in session I try and work it out as I go along, then ask the name so I can go and look it up. I often find I can play a tune in a session but if you ask me to play it later I'm clueless.
# Posted on September 1st 2008 by snowyowl
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
Our local session meets weekly. The tunes are posted on a website, and updated frequently, so I can catch up just by looking at the website. New tunes are introduced weekly or every other week, depending. The moderators start with beginners at 3pm for an hour of slow, by-ear learning, then at four the rest of us drift in for trying the tunes closer to speed, then 5:00 to 6:00 is "play what you know", where everyone gets a chance to lead a tune or a set of tunes, and other tunes are randomly introduced. Works for me, and the pub gives us a free pint each.
# Posted on September 1st 2008 by Mackeagan
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
Not quite on topic, but I had a bizarre tune-learning experience at a fiddle workshop in Donegal a couple of weeks ago. The tutor, Mick Brown, was teaching us a gan ainm two-step. After he'd gone through it in some detail the six of us played it through with him a few times as a group, without any problems. Then, as usual, Mick asked each of us one-by-one to play the tune on our own, he standing by to render assistance where necessary.
When it came to my turn, to my surprise and embarrassment I just couldn't get past the first few notes without freezing, despite Mick's help. What happened was that the first few notes were very similar to the start of the children's nursery rhyme "Nellie the Elephant", and that was sufficient to fire up that tune in my head and obliterate everything of the tune we'd been taught. I hadn't realised it, but "Nellie" must have got embedded in my brain when my kids were small, about 30 years ago, because that tune was very popular on radio and television, and almost anywhere where you'd find young children. Anyway, I explained what I thought was happening, and another member of the group, an Irish primary school teacher from Cavan, sang the song for the benefit of the class, which included a German and two French players.
I have since worked out that the only reasonable way I'm going to learn Mick's tune is to transcribe the B-part first from my tape, learn that thoroughly, and then chance the A-part, hoping it's not going to fall apart!
I've checked out "Nellie the Elephant" on Wikipedia. It's a nice little jig in its own right, was composed in the 1950s (so is still very much in copyright - see the BMI thread, people!), and has been very popular since.
Anyone else had any strange or unusual tune-learning stories to tell?
# Posted on September 2nd 2008 by lazyhound
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
lazyhound there are so many stories I have like yours.
I am just deranged enough that I try to find tunes which. as you say, start off like . . . & then try to work them out. This is usually a long process. So I tell myself it's working. Then again I also like starting some tunes on the B part. Good luck.
# Posted on September 2nd 2008 by Random_notes
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
When I was much younger, I used to waste some of my precious and valuable free time hanging out at science fiction conventions because that is what I like to read when I am not pretending to be a musician. Some of the other musicians at these conventions borrowed Irish and/or Scottish tunes for their songs about science fictional subjects. As a result, I originally learned some Irish and Scottish tunes in an altered or a slightly different form or version from how they are played at sessions. When some other local musicians started an Irish Jam Session here in 1995, I finally got to learn the original versions of these tunes which I had first heard many years ago at a science fiction convention.
# Posted on September 2nd 2008 by fauxcelt
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
er, how can "free time" be valuable, when it doesn't cost anything?
# Posted on September 2nd 2008 by lazyhound
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
"when the cock crows it is day"=Here we go lop-de-loo"
# Posted on September 2nd 2008 by pipewatcher
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
Ooh, do you like Michael Moorcock, by any chance, fauxcelt?
# Posted on September 2nd 2008 by benhall.1
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
- once a month
- knew most of the tunes played.
- waited until they left for a break and then
played my most subversive, rhythmic new
tunes to obstruct their candy, lifeless, squishy,
familiar stuff.
# Posted on September 3rd 2008 by dogmageek
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
sounds like a mighty session!
# Posted on September 3rd 2008 by pipewatcher
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
Lazyhound, that would depend on how you value your free time and what sort of value you place on your time.
By "free time", I mean time when I am not working at my day job. I consider myself lucky to have finally found a job I like. I actually look forward to going to work every day.
Yes, benhall.1, I do like the books of the late Michael Moorcock and have read almost everything he wrote. I even had the opportunity to meet Moorcock in person at a science fiction convention in Atlanta, Georgia in 1993 but I was too shy to introduce myself to him. I still like to read science fiction when I am not pretending to be a musician but I no longer attend conventions because I prefer to spend my free time playing music.
# Posted on September 3rd 2008 by fauxcelt
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
Yep, I've read pretty much everything Moorcock wrote as well. I think the people who liked his stuff would, like me, just pounce on the latest book as soon as it hit the shelves. Certainly, at one time, over here at least, if you didn't get a copy on the first day of publication, you'd normally have to wait about a year 'til you got the chance again.
Did you ever see him with Hawkwind? I'm afraid I didn't, but that is definitely one of those things I'd do 'if I had my time again'.
You'd have liked ER Eddison as well, then ...
# Posted on September 3rd 2008 by benhall.1
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
No, I never did get to see Moorcock perform with Hawkwind.
When I was thirteen, I discovered the Conan the Barbarian books by Robert E. Howard which were edited by Lin Carter and L. Sprague de Camp and read all of them. In one of the introductions to a collection of Conan stories which Carter edited, he mentioned some book titled the Worm Ouroboros by E.R. Eddison which Carter claimed was one of the books that influenced Howard so of course I had to read this Worm Ouroboros also.
Then I discovered Moorcock's books about Elric of Melnibone and his Eternal Champion series as well as the books which were supposed to be set at the End Of Time and read all of them.
This was after I discovered and read all of the Narnia books by C.S. Lewis when I was eleven. Then, the next year, when I was twelve, I discovered The Hobbit by Tolkien and read that book. So, of course, I then had to read all three books of The Lord Of The Rings as well.
# Posted on September 4th 2008 by fauxcelt
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
Hi
I should probably mention that I've been playing fiddle less than 3 years.
The session meets:
- weekly
Of all the tunes played in our last session I:
- knew most of the tunes played. However, many of the tunes I know about 1/2 and about 3/4 of the tunes I have no name for.
At the last session in which new tunes were introduced I:
I usually listen to old obscure recordings that many of those in our session haven't heard. In the last year, I have probably played about 10-20 new tunes and heard about 100+ new tunes I didn't know.
Regarding new tunes ~
When learning a tune in session we ______
I don't know about others, but I usually try to identify the key the tune is in and the notes that stick out. I try to recognize patterns and consider what notes are likely to be played and what not. For instance in a tune in A major, C# is much more common than D, depending on how the tune goes. Also, recently, I have been lilting the tune if I don't know it well enough to play. This really helps me get the tune in my head. If I try to play without this on new tunes, I really screw up. Then there's the tunes that I've heard a ton, but never managed to play. Suddenly I try to play and boom, I've got it. Pretty cool stuff.
# Posted on September 4th 2008 by enirehtac
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
I was with you most of the way, fauxcelt ... until you got to CS Lewis ... can't stand the nasty, preachy litttle "*?!
Jerry Cornelius was my particular favourite.
# Posted on September 4th 2008 by benhall.1
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
weekly
good experienced players so pretty much any set someone starts there are at least two others who know the tunes
one thing we do every once and a while is go around in a circle, with each person playing a different tune. Like one person plays a jig, say twice, then the person to his or her left goes into some other jig, etc...People tend to join in the second time around.
Or we might do the same thing with original tunes, where each player starts up a tune after the previous player's gone around twice, that kind of thing...
Jim
# Posted on September 5th 2008 by Jmbu
Re: Survey ~ learning tunes in session
Oops -- sorry, I didn't answer the question...
We noodle quietly to learn new tunes...
# Posted on September 5th 2008 by Jmbu