I can't believe I wasted my time doing this, but Phantom Button, Taocat, and a few others made a good case, in the interest of fair play.
So...I did some recording, quick and dirty, one take each, in my kitchen, with the laptop's internal mic. If the sound quality isn't great, try headphones (and you hear every scrape )
I posted three tunes: Bantry Lasses, Sergeant Early's Dream, and The Woodcock.
Who knows, may this will make me work on my chops more, instead of just cruising along uncritically at my session. I know I have plenty I could improve....
WIll
I went onto Sound Lantern for the 1st time this evening-
I enjoyed your playing.
I also clicked onto someone else's submissions - all my suspicions were confirmed.
Very nice playing Will, I certainly won't hesitate to take any advice on fiddling from you (not that I had any doubts before hearing you; I could tell you knew what you were talking about).
Y'know bliss, I was thinking that very thing after pressing the record button. And you'd be my first pick for a goat thumping pardner. We should do an album....
Now isn't that better than criticizing someone else's clip? Nice playing, Will.
I just had my first tune with you, Will -- Sergeant Early's Dream... nice tune. The best part was you got to play it without hearing me playing along with you and messing it up. LOL
Sometimes one wonders what a person is really like, compared to their web persona. In your case, Will, you sound like I imagined you would. And thanks for posting the Woodcock, I had heard that tune before and liked it very much, but never heard it again, and didn't have a name for it.
Nice tunes Will. You don't sound "classical" at all. I hear
some influence from Burke but you're not a Burke clone. He
doesn't do so many bowed triplets and you don't do those big
slow slides. Also your playing doesn't have the swing that
Burke has; I'm not saying that's good or bad, it's just what I observe.
And finally, you are a far better player than I am -- which I already
knew would be the case before hearing a note
Me and dow were just saying after all these years and taking your advice on board etc - that you can actually play! I didnt realise I'll be honest that you were so good - but good you certainly are, its lovely to hear some tunes so nicely played! thanks for biting the bullet and posting, cause its lovely stuff!
Hmmm....in reply to "insert user name here" above, yes, I'm an American. I was five the last time I was in Ireland. I've played Irish fiddle those 30 years. I really don't have any classical training (that was a joke perpetrated by Eliot). I took lessons 25 plus years ago with Kevin Burke, and the rest has pretty much been trial and error based on a lot of listening to the music, despite living in the northern Rockies, USA, far from all the great sessions and players of Irish trad hotbeds.
In hopes of inspiring others, I also want to mention that I've struggled with serious nerve damage and arthritis-like conditions in my hands all of my life. Better diagnosis and treatement in the last 8 years is finally letting my fingers do what I'd been trying to get them to do on fiddle for years before that. If I can play this music half way decently, then anyone can--don't let other people, physical ailments, or lack of confidence get in your way. Just get after it and don't give up.
Hup, I like your comments--thanks. It took me some years to figure out how to take what Kevin taught me and massage it into my own approach to the music. I consciously aimed for a somewhat less pulsing style, though I love Kevin's signature rhythmic pulse. And his influence will always stick with me.
LOL, slainte, my flute is keyless, and I'm no where near good enough on it to get all those F nats, at speed. I seem to be on the slow road to flute mediocrity....
Will.you originally linked peoples playing,in relation to reading from the dots,both SeamusCreagh and MattCranitch use some form of notation,here they are playing on you tube http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=yeN4Vkj_Q9E.
I prefer their playing,I also prefer KevinBurke,he who advocated the metronome
and alsoJames Morrison and PadraigOkeefe who all used notation.
Sergeant Earlys dream,In the first edition of Oneills, it inotated in a different key,to the later edition,which requires the player to go into third position,a technique that is difficult for less accomplished players,there is areason for this, the tune sounds brighter in that key,you sound to my ears as if youare playing it in the lower key.
one reason why your version although pleasant doesnt get me excited,you ought to try it in the higher key,if your technique allows
your playing is pleasant enough,but lacks power, it lacks oomph,itsounds abit polite ,I dont feel any urge to get up and dance when listening to you.
you have criticised me for giving help,all my advice has come from Cranitch or Mcnevin,who are in my opinion better qualified than you.
your playing is good but nothing more.
I think your limiting yourself by the way you hold your bow,Ithink that if you held it abit lower youwould get more power into your playing more oomph, good clips but not in Cranitch s league .
When I listened to Will's playing it didn't make me want to get up and dance either... but it did make me want to pick up my concertina and play along... and so I did.
Dick , I wasn't aware that this was supposed to be a rating game. You take Will's playiing as you like. The main purpose of this mp3 posting is (as far as I can see) so that people can be aware of how Will sounds, and then decide for themselves if they want to take his advice on matters of the fiddle.
Quoting someone else when giving advice is not to be compared with giving advice that is from your own experience.
(I can't help but wonder how dickens thinks he knows anything about how I hold my bow, and why he's qualified to advise me on improving it. What can he mean by "lower?" I'm already at the frog, pretty much the standard bow hand. But I suppose he thought he had to find fault somewhere, even if he had to make it up as he went along.)
I enjoyed listening to your playing Will. I think it sounds great and if I could play that that then I would be very happy. I also admire your courage in putting it up there after all the critiscism that has gone on around here.
Lovely stuff Will. I'm going to try and learn that Sgt Early's by ear from your recording if I ever get my desk cleared. It'll be the second tune I've picked up through you, having benefitted years ago from your posting of 'The White Petticoat.'
WILL,I said good playing,
Now if you post up the video of you all playing,which I cant find,I may have been looking at the wrong man.
.to my ears,and my criticism is intended to be constructive, your playing lacks power,that doesnt mean that it is not pleasant,in tune etc.
however I think if you were using more wrist action, and more pull,occassional long bows with a bit more power ,you would get more oomph.
my opinion is this that I would rather take the advice of Cranitch via his tutor than you,because I think he is a better player.
just so there is no misunderstanding I think your playing is good,and my minor criticism is inteneded to be helpful.
"my opinion is this that I would rather take the advice of Cranitch via his tutor than you,because I think he is a better player."
Mmm, these days I get weary of comparisons. Will is obviously a really good player and while I'm sure that he himself might consider that there's always room for improvement, it's not up to us to give advice unless he seeks it.
He's got his own style which sounds perfectly fine to me.
Also, good players don't necessarily make good teachers although Matt Crannitch certainly is both.
Well Dickens, here is a good opportunity for you to show us or let us hear how you would play. Can you let us hear how dynamic your own playing is, maybe show or let us hear a bit of the oomph you refer to?
"my opinion is this that I would rather take the advice of Cranitch via his tutor than you,because I think he is a better player."
Matt Cranitch, as far as I am aware, does not post on this board and is not available to answer specific questions. His fiddle tutor, so I've heard, is top notch. But that's not to say Will doesn't have good advice to give that happens not to be in Matt's book - or just different ways of explaining certain things that appeal better to some people.
Lovely fiddlin' Will. I really like your style. You sound to me to be completely in control of your bow, something I've never been accused of. As for tempo, you might want to try speeding up and slowing down often like I do, even stop the tune right in the middle sometimes and start over! The patrons at my session really seem to love it! They don't actually tell me this, but I can tell. Keep up the good work!
Dick, thanks for attempting to be helpful, but I think you must have mistaken someone else for me on the RMIMR YouTube clip. As I said when I posed that clip, I am the fiddler in the light brown pants and dark brown tee-shirt (it says "Will Play for Pints"). There are only two other fiddlers in that video (of us playing A Night in Ennis)--and I am *not* the woman. The other fiddler is Dave, in a light, almost white shirt (with his back to the camera most of the time).
Once you've figured out who I am, you'll see that I hold the bow at the frog, and that I use both short and long bow strokes. We played A Night in Ennis at a very easy lope--this was a tired lot of people after three days straight of tunes and, erm, "craic." There were no dancers present. If I remember right, the flute player next to me set the pace, and he was new to the tune at that point, so we took it easy on him.
As for your other "helpful" advice, I play Sgt. Early's Dream in the same key I've heard it at every session I've ever heard it played. I learned it by ear (from Reverend, so it happens), not from a book. I do play tunes that go into 2nd and 3rd position, but Sgt. Early's isn't one of them.
So you can see why I might be having a hard time taking any of your advice on board.
BTW, Dick, I've heard only your concertina playing (including clips from your albums as posted on your wewbsite)--I'd love to hear a sample of your fiddling.
LOL - love they false modesty - Average...hardly. Very lovely stuff. When is the CD release party?
By the way, Sgt. Early's, that sounds like the key Paddy Canny, Kathleen Collins and Randal Bays have recorded it in. If it's good enough for them it sure works for me!
Precisely the sort of insinuating a higher authority--in this case, a book, of all things. And precisely the context for my initial posting of his (and my own session) playing on that thread. Yep.
It is the Key Randal and Joel play it in. That's the version I play for the most part. Will's setting goes up when I'm going down in one or two spots and vice versa, but it didn't really clash I don't think.
Yeah, there are the alternate endings--whether you choose to end on the "D" or the "d." I learned those both from Reverend, but I wasn't really thinking about which I was doing where when I recorded it. In a session, I generally just match whatever local custom dictates.
I'm not sure that playing a tune in a brighter key (regardless of difficulty) is necessarily any better. I kind of like it down lower, and there is something to be said for the more natural sound of a tune played in a comfortable key, whatever the instrument. Was Early himself a flute player? That more likely dictated the key-choice for that tune...
Dick, if your initial advice was indeed truly constructive, and not mildly condescending as it seemed (though it's dangerous to infer tone in internet postings), than Will might benefit from it.
Still, Will sounds to me like he's got a pretty good handle on what he's doing, and I haven't heard any suggestion from him that he was looking for pointers. I, for one, would no sooner tell Will where to hold his bow than I would tell any of these folks:
I can't think of too many higher authorities than a Reverend, book in hand of course... We all know we shouldn't do anything until we've cleared it with a printed authority... Oops! I forgot to check this out before writing it down... I can see the earth opening up and smell the stink of brimstone and burning flesh... Where's my copies of O'Neill's when I need them to ward off evil variants?
Just for the record, Georgi is being very generous and modest here. He's a terrific Irish fiddler, one I've had the pleasure of hanging onto his coat tails through a thoroughly enjoyable evening of cranking reels and brilliant playing in the fine Finlen Hotel.
Yea... Georgi showed up at one of the sessions at the Plough and I enjoyed his playing despite the fact that it was a larger than usual session and a bit unruly. There were a few tunes he kicked out on his own that sounded great. I'd love to hear a few Soundlantern uploads from him too.
Nice playing will, but after 30 yrs I would not expect otherwise. What about your whistling? your mandolin,? and your guitar. You do, I know, play these instruments. Fair play to you for posting your link.
I just checked my first edition copy of O'Neills and Seargent Early's is indeed in a different key. Key of A Major!! So Dickens, you can of course play it in that key, but I'm very much afraid you'll be doing a solo, as everyone else will be enjoying the darkness of the lower, minor sound.
The "best" players, in sport and music, often make the worst teachers because they are intolerant and fail to understand why someone else cannot do things that they themselves find easy.
Well CPT - this has been one heck of a series of exchanges over the past few days - some of the most inflammatory reading I have ever seen. For what it's worth - I very much enjoyed your playing too - but I didn't need to hear it to validate your many helpful posts over the past couple of years. In fact the only thing you have ever said here that with which I have flatly and vehemently disagreed is that "real" surfers never say "dude." That sir, is total BS and revisionist history by those who would wish otherwise.
Ho hum - nice one Dickens - giving people pointers on how to play the fiddle. What tha? It would be like me giving you pointers on the engilsh concertina. But the difference is - I wouldnt cause I am the first to admit I know nothing about it.
I know nothing about how to play the English Concertina either, but I can say from first hand observation that if you play it like Dow, then it will be well worth listening to.
Will--wanted to hear your clip, but, like the other soundlantern
productions--nothing comes in. Is some special "player", or software needed, do they take a long time to load ?
An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
I can't believe I wasted my time doing this, but Phantom Button, Taocat, and a few others made a good case, in the interest of fair play.
So...I did some recording, quick and dirty, one take each, in my kitchen, with the laptop's internal mic. If the sound quality isn't great, try headphones (and you hear every scrape
)
I posted three tunes: Bantry Lasses, Sergeant Early's Dream, and The Woodcock.
Go to:
http://www.soundlantern.com/UpdatedUser.do?UsName=willcpt&UsId=1131
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
ahh, very nice... I can stop looking for my clips of you then
Hopefully this doesn't ignite another firestorm of personal attacks and such, because I really enjoy your playing!
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by Reverend
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
(I considered saying that you sound too "classical", but stifled the urge)
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by Reverend
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Woo hoo! Thanks, will, those were great!
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by mickray
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Who knows, may this will make me work on my chops more, instead of just cruising along uncritically at my session. I know I have plenty I could improve....
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
"(I considered saying that you sound too "classical", but stifled the urge)
"
Pretty sure you just did...
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by mcdevincabe
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Good thing they're just audio clips then. My tuxedo would've really given me away....
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
>> My tuxedo would've really given me away....
LOL, I'd pay actual money to see that one...
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by Reverend
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
You'd have to--someone would have to rent me a tux.
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
You have photos of Will, don't you, Rev? There's always PhotoShop....
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by mickray
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
LOL, he doesn't need photoshop--the real pix are incriminating enough.
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Will, good stuff.
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by crazy_fingerz
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Will, have you had yourself tested for unusually high levels of "nyah"? I would definitely suggest getting an appointment with your doctor soon.
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
WIll
I went onto Sound Lantern for the 1st time this evening-
I enjoyed your playing.
I also clicked onto someone else's submissions - all my suspicions were confirmed.
"If the cap fits..." (KB)
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by domnull
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
LOL, I go in every three months and have them bleed off the excess. But it just keeps building. Aaaarrrggghhhh....the pressure within!
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
SWFL, he has monthly appointments to bleed off some of the nyah. I've been trying to get transfusions.
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by Reverend
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
hah, cross post
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by Reverend
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Pete, it's clearly contagious--we just need to play together more. But you've got nyah of your own (especially for a banjo player
).
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Excellent. Now the combatants are compared fairly, and all concerned may listen and decide for themselves.
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by TaoCat
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Now that's a session, you two making the same joke with different variations at the same time. Sounds lovely, carry on lads.
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Average is right.
Nothing a bodhran couldn't fix though.
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by bodhran bliss
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Very nice playing Will, I certainly won't hesitate to take any advice on fiddling from you (not that I had any doubts before hearing you; I could tell you knew what you were talking about).
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by Marklar
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Y'know bliss, I was thinking that very thing after pressing the record button. And you'd be my first pick for a goat thumping pardner. We should do an album....
# Posted on June 17th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
In response to the banjo jab:
http://ntw.net/~reverend/WillZinaPete.jpg
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Reverend
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Play somethin' you know.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by John Culhane
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Do you know how much I charge Will?
Besides, I would only download the CD and we would be out of pocket.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by bodhran bliss
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Aw, c'mon bliss, I figured it would be the standard arrangement--I get my fair cut, as the melody player, and you'd take the remaining 90 percent.
Forget the CD--we'll just load the tracks onto iTunes....
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Such a big waste of time was it?
Nice playing, you pass the mustard test!
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by leoj
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
LOL, for *me* it was--I already know what I sound like....
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Sounds really nice. I wish I could come to Montana!
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by pavlf
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
95% and it's a deal.
Plus expenses. Flight to the states, accommodation, food, women, narcotics, and the trimmings.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by bodhran bliss
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Now isn't that better than criticizing someone else's clip? Nice playing, Will.
I just had my first tune with you, Will -- Sergeant Early's Dream... nice tune. The best part was you got to play it without hearing me playing along with you and messing it up. LOL
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Phantom Button
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Reverend - is that really a tux, or is Will CPT just wearing one of your session t-shirts?
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Keith Dubinsky
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Bliss, I chat up the local culture and arts board and see if we can't get you funded over here.
Jack, my pleasure. Class tune, eh? Next time we'll have to do it over pints....
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Sometimes one wonders what a person is really like, compared to their web persona. In your case, Will, you sound like I imagined you would. And thanks for posting the Woodcock, I had heard that tune before and liked it very much, but never heard it again, and didn't have a name for it.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by AlBrown
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Nice playing, Will. Cheers for that.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by TheSilverSpear
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
In my case, warts and all, WYSIWYG.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Enjoyed that, Will, nice stuff.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by mutatis mutandis
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Cheers Mutatis, and to Mrs. K. Mutatis too.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
I'm sure jig appreciates your playing, too.
Is it OK if he moves in with you?
Just for a little while?
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by leoj
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
leoj, there's a tune for that: Thank God We're Surrounded By Water.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
I suppose if he lived closer you might be playing "The Broken Windscreen."
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by leoj
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
There's a screen for broken wind? Where can I get one?
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by GaryAMartin
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Are you American? If not in your info did you mean that you have played irish fiddle for 30 years or just fiddle?
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by insert username here
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
But can you play those tunes on guitar??
Nice playing!
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by gw
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Nice tunes Will. You don't sound "classical" at all. I hear
some influence from Burke but you're not a Burke clone. He
doesn't do so many bowed triplets and you don't do those big
slow slides. Also your playing doesn't have the swing that
Burke has; I'm not saying that's good or bad, it's just what I observe.
And finally, you are a far better player than I am -- which I already
knew would be the case before hearing a note
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Hup
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Me and dow were just saying after all these years and taking your advice on board etc - that you can actually play! I didnt realise I'll be honest that you were so good - but good you certainly are, its lovely to hear some tunes so nicely played! thanks for biting the bullet and posting, cause its lovely stuff!
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by bb
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Another ME TOO post!
It wasn't really all that brave when you're that good
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Donough
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
How come the fiddle sounds like it has a clothespin clipped to its nose?
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by silver bow
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
thanks Will. It's a real pleasure to hear you play.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by dogbox
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Hmmm....in reply to "insert user name here" above, yes, I'm an American. I was five the last time I was in Ireland. I've played Irish fiddle those 30 years. I really don't have any classical training (that was a joke perpetrated by Eliot). I took lessons 25 plus years ago with Kevin Burke, and the rest has pretty much been trial and error based on a lot of listening to the music, despite living in the northern Rockies, USA, far from all the great sessions and players of Irish trad hotbeds.
In hopes of inspiring others, I also want to mention that I've struggled with serious nerve damage and arthritis-like conditions in my hands all of my life. Better diagnosis and treatement in the last 8 years is finally letting my fingers do what I'd been trying to get them to do on fiddle for years before that. If I can play this music half way decently, then anyone can--don't let other people, physical ailments, or lack of confidence get in your way. Just get after it and don't give up.
Hup, I like your comments--thanks. It took me some years to figure out how to take what Kevin taught me and massage it into my own approach to the music. I consciously aimed for a somewhat less pulsing style, though I love Kevin's signature rhythmic pulse. And his influence will always stick with me.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Will, when are you going to record yourself play Sergeant Early's Dream on the flute?
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by slainte
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
LOL, slainte, my flute is keyless, and I'm no where near good enough on it to get all those F nats, at speed. I seem to be on the slow road to flute mediocrity....
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Will.you originally linked peoples playing,in relation to reading from the dots,both SeamusCreagh and MattCranitch use some form of notation,here they are playing on you tube http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=yeN4Vkj_Q9E.
I prefer their playing,I also prefer KevinBurke,he who advocated the metronome
and alsoJames Morrison and PadraigOkeefe who all used notation.
Sergeant Earlys dream,In the first edition of Oneills, it inotated in a different key,to the later edition,which requires the player to go into third position,a technique that is difficult for less accomplished players,there is areason for this, the tune sounds brighter in that key,you sound to my ears as if youare playing it in the lower key.
one reason why your version although pleasant doesnt get me excited,you ought to try it in the higher key,if your technique allows
your playing is pleasant enough,but lacks power, it lacks oomph,itsounds abit polite ,I dont feel any urge to get up and dance when listening to you.
you have criticised me for giving help,all my advice has come from Cranitch or Mcnevin,who are in my opinion better qualified than you.
your playing is good but nothing more.
I think your limiting yourself by the way you hold your bow,Ithink that if you held it abit lower youwould get more power into your playing more oomph, good clips but not in Cranitch s league .
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Rufus Jameson
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
When I listened to Will's playing it didn't make me want to get up and dance either... but it did make me want to pick up my concertina and play along... and so I did.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Phantom Button
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
So I'm not in the same class as Matt Cranitch...glad we got that cleared up.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Dick , I wasn't aware that this was supposed to be a rating game. You take Will's playiing as you like. The main purpose of this mp3 posting is (as far as I can see) so that people can be aware of how Will sounds, and then decide for themselves if they want to take his advice on matters of the fiddle.
Quoting someone else when giving advice is not to be compared with giving advice that is from your own experience.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Donough
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
You're in your own league! Silly comparisons. Are you in Helena?
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by leoj
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Yep, Helena. Sessions through the summer on Thursdays at Riley's Pub down on the gulch. Drop in if you're in the area--we'll save a seat for you.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
(I can't help but wonder how dickens thinks he knows anything about how I hold my bow, and why he's qualified to advise me on improving it. What can he mean by "lower?" I'm already at the frog, pretty much the standard bow hand. But I suppose he thought he had to find fault somewhere, even if he had to make it up as he went along.)
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Nice playing Will, thanks.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Alf Tupper
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
I never watch how fiddlers hold their bow... I just listen. Sounded good to me. I'm working on the jig now.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Phantom Button
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
I spent several summers at the Bray--more than ten years ago now and well before I started playing itm.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by leoj
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
I enjoyed listening to your playing Will. I think it sounds great and if I could play that that then I would be very happy. I also admire your courage in putting it up there after all the critiscism that has gone on around here.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by bowburner
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Lovely stuff Will. I'm going to try and learn that Sgt Early's by ear from your recording if I ever get my desk cleared. It'll be the second tune I've picked up through you, having benefitted years ago from your posting of 'The White Petticoat.'
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by sergeant fox
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
WILL,I said good playing,
Now if you post up the video of you all playing,which I cant find,I may have been looking at the wrong man.
.to my ears,and my criticism is intended to be constructive, your playing lacks power,that doesnt mean that it is not pleasant,in tune etc.
however I think if you were using more wrist action, and more pull,occassional long bows with a bit more power ,you would get more oomph.
my opinion is this that I would rather take the advice of Cranitch via his tutor than you,because I think he is a better player.
just so there is no misunderstanding I think your playing is good,and my minor criticism is inteneded to be helpful.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Rufus Jameson
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Hey! I'm more courageous than he is. I was SCARED. That makes me more courageous.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by benhall.1
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Those are LUSH!!! Thank yewww Will!
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by mehitabel23
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
"my opinion is this that I would rather take the advice of Cranitch via his tutor than you,because I think he is a better player."
Mmm, these days I get weary of comparisons. Will is obviously a really good player and while I'm sure that he himself might consider that there's always room for improvement, it's not up to us to give advice unless he seeks it.
He's got his own style which sounds perfectly fine to me.
Also, good players don't necessarily make good teachers although Matt Crannitch certainly is both.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Johannes J
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
I just learned the Bantry Lasses off your recording.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by TheSilverSpear
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
My compliments on fine playing. Good tunes, well interpretted, technique did them some justice.
Thanks for sharing.
As for the critics and experts, sod the lot of them. Sounds like you are finding your way along the path quite nicely.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Rook
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Sorry, I can't oblige you with agreement, I've already had you categorized as above-average...
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by ceolachan
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Well Dickens, here is a good opportunity for you to show us or let us hear how you would play. Can you let us hear how dynamic your own playing is, maybe show or let us hear a bit of the oomph you refer to?
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by concertinaplayer
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
"my opinion is this that I would rather take the advice of Cranitch via his tutor than you,because I think he is a better player."
Matt Cranitch, as far as I am aware, does not post on this board and is not available to answer specific questions. His fiddle tutor, so I've heard, is top notch. But that's not to say Will doesn't have good advice to give that happens not to be in Matt's book - or just different ways of explaining certain things that appeal better to some people.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by ragaman
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Enjoyed the tunes, Will. Thanks!
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by grego
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Lovely fiddlin' Will. I really like your style. You sound to me to be completely in control of your bow, something I've never been accused of. As for tempo, you might want to try speeding up and slowing down often like I do, even stop the tune right in the middle sometimes and start over! The patrons at my session really seem to love it! They don't actually tell me this, but I can tell. Keep up the good work!
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by wardelliott
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Dick, thanks for attempting to be helpful, but I think you must have mistaken someone else for me on the RMIMR YouTube clip. As I said when I posed that clip, I am the fiddler in the light brown pants and dark brown tee-shirt (it says "Will Play for Pints"). There are only two other fiddlers in that video (of us playing A Night in Ennis)--and I am *not* the woman.
The other fiddler is Dave, in a light, almost white shirt (with his back to the camera most of the time).
Once you've figured out who I am, you'll see that I hold the bow at the frog, and that I use both short and long bow strokes. We played A Night in Ennis at a very easy lope--this was a tired lot of people after three days straight of tunes and, erm, "craic." There were no dancers present. If I remember right, the flute player next to me set the pace, and he was new to the tune at that point, so we took it easy on him.
As for your other "helpful" advice, I play Sgt. Early's Dream in the same key I've heard it at every session I've ever heard it played. I learned it by ear (from Reverend, so it happens), not from a book. I do play tunes that go into 2nd and 3rd position, but Sgt. Early's isn't one of them.
So you can see why I might be having a hard time taking any of your advice on board.
BTW, Dick, I've heard only your concertina playing (including clips from your albums as posted on your wewbsite)--I'd love to hear a sample of your fiddling.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Great, just great, Will, blame your crap setting on me... So it's *my* fault that you play it in the "wrong key"
I've never heard it played in any other key in a session, but I do have a couple of recordings of it in different keys.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Reverend
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Reverend, every time I play with you I get worse. It's like the banjoitis is contagious. At this rate, we'll both end up sounding like John Carty....
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
LOL - love they false modesty - Average...hardly. Very lovely stuff. When is the CD release party?
By the way, Sgt. Early's, that sounds like the key Paddy Canny, Kathleen Collins and Randal Bays have recorded it in. If it's good enough for them it sure works for me!
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by RogueFiddler
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
It amuses me that Dickens think you played that tune in the "wrong" key because he "saw" it "written" in a different key.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by llig leahcim
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Precisely the sort of insinuating a higher authority--in this case, a book, of all things. And precisely the context for my initial posting of his (and my own session) playing on that thread. Yep.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
It is the Key Randal and Joel play it in. That's the version I play for the most part. Will's setting goes up when I'm going down in one or two spots and vice versa, but it didn't really clash I don't think.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Phantom Button
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Yeah, there are the alternate endings--whether you choose to end on the "D" or the "d." I learned those both from Reverend, but I wasn't really thinking about which I was doing where when I recorded it. In a session, I generally just match whatever local custom dictates.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Ha, yeah, and "written" in a book by someone who didn't play diddley.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by llig leahcim
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Nice playing, Will.
I'm not sure that playing a tune in a brighter key (regardless of difficulty) is necessarily any better. I kind of like it down lower, and there is something to be said for the more natural sound of a tune played in a comfortable key, whatever the instrument. Was Early himself a flute player? That more likely dictated the key-choice for that tune...
Dick, if your initial advice was indeed truly constructive, and not mildly condescending as it seemed (though it's dangerous to infer tone in internet postings), than Will might benefit from it.
Still, Will sounds to me like he's got a pretty good handle on what he's doing, and I haven't heard any suggestion from him that he was looking for pointers. I, for one, would no sooner tell Will where to hold his bow than I would tell any of these folks:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b1EU4ipTkRg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h4OAkUN-m3A
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dtPjgqSI-js
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xubrsb3aquI
... all of whom are holding the bow higher up the stick (that last one is particularly relevant, since it's Paul McNevin himself).
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Georgi
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
I can't think of too many higher authorities than a Reverend, book in hand of course... We all know we shouldn't do anything until we've cleared it with a printed authority...
Oops! I forgot to check this out before writing it down... I can see the earth opening up and smell the stink of brimstone and burning flesh... Where's my copies of O'Neill's when I need them to ward off evil variants?
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by ceolachan
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Nice links Georgi, I enjoyed that...
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by ceolachan
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
That said, by the way, I concur that holding the bow closer to the frog does add to the volume/power.
But holding it higher does make string-crossing easier, so do as you will.
If you REALLY want the weight of the bow to power your notes, hold it upside-down, by the tip. ;)
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Georgi
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Just for the record, Georgi is being very generous and modest here. He's a terrific Irish fiddler, one I've had the pleasure of hanging onto his coat tails through a thoroughly enjoyable evening of cranking reels and brilliant playing in the fine Finlen Hotel.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Yea... Georgi showed up at one of the sessions at the Plough and I enjoyed his playing despite the fact that it was a larger than usual session and a bit unruly. There were a few tunes he kicked out on his own that sounded great. I'd love to hear a few Soundlantern uploads from him too.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by Phantom Button
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Nice playing will, but after 30 yrs I would not expect otherwise. What about your whistling? your mandolin,? and your guitar. You do, I know, play these instruments. Fair play to you for posting your link.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by jig
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
I just checked my first edition copy of O'Neills and Seargent Early's is indeed in a different key. Key of A Major!! So Dickens, you can of course play it in that key, but I'm very much afraid you'll be doing a solo, as everyone else will be enjoying the darkness of the lower, minor sound.
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by woops
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
~ and his flute...
# Posted on June 18th 2008 by ceolachan
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
aww shuks.
For the record, both those nights at the Finlen and the Plough&Stars were great fun! Y'all should come out east sometime!
# Posted on June 19th 2008 by Georgi
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
The "best" players, in sport and music, often make the worst teachers because they are intolerant and fail to understand why someone else cannot do things that they themselves find easy.
# Posted on June 19th 2008 by bodhran bliss
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Heh, Georgi, I'd love to, but I can't promise I'll have Damien S. in tow....
# Posted on June 19th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Well CPT - this has been one heck of a series of exchanges over the past few days - some of the most inflammatory reading I have ever seen. For what it's worth - I very much enjoyed your playing too - but I didn't need to hear it to validate your many helpful posts over the past couple of years. In fact the only thing you have ever said here that with which I have flatly and vehemently disagreed is that "real" surfers never say "dude." That sir, is total BS and revisionist history by those who would wish otherwise.
# Posted on June 19th 2008 by Jusa Nutter Eejit
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Ho hum - nice one Dickens - giving people pointers on how to play the fiddle. What tha? It would be like me giving you pointers on the engilsh concertina. But the difference is - I wouldnt cause I am the first to admit I know nothing about it.
# Posted on June 19th 2008 by bb
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
I know nothing about how to play the English Concertina either, but I can say from first hand observation that if you play it like Dow, then it will be well worth listening to.
# Posted on June 19th 2008 by mutatis mutandis
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Will--wanted to hear your clip, but, like the other soundlantern
productions--nothing comes in. Is some special "player", or software needed, do they take a long time to load ?
# Posted on June 24th 2008 by hauke
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Do you have flash installed? Can you see youtube clips?
# Posted on June 24th 2008 by Ramiro
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Yes, I can see youtube clips------aaahh, I do NOT have flash.
Thanks Ramiro.
# Posted on June 25th 2008 by hauke
Re: An Average Session Player - Solo Fiddle Clips
Hmmm... I don't think you can see youtube clips without flash.
# Posted on June 25th 2008 by Ramiro