I've been watching many of the Comholtas videos available on You-tube.
I found a great one and decided to learn the half of the set of reels I didn't know and then try to play along on all four reels.
Brian Conway, Billie McComiskey, Joannie Madden and Feelix Dolan - starting a set with two of Crowley's major key reels.
This reminds me of being at Elkins Irish week many years ago -- the music I heard in the "Ice House" in a year when Seamus Egan, Eileen Ivers, Joannie Madden, Jerry O'Sullivan and James Keane were all teaching, and playing in the Ice House in the evenings off and on. HOT **** VERY HOT MUSIC. I LOVED IT. It really gives me a thrill to hear music played like that.
I hear the same thing when I listen to Brian Conway et al on this You.tube video. I don't know what it is exactly but it makes me feel like I want to leap off the chair. What it really does is make my insides feel wildly happy.
I tend to think of this as "The New York or "Da Bronx" style, but maybe it's just great playing.
There is certainly a NY - Sligo fiddle style that comes from
Michael Coleman via Andy McGann. You can hear a characteristic
bow stroke in McGann and Conway. ... and also Frankie Gavin.
All three have their own personalities, but they all have a way
of punching the downbeat. You can hear Coleman doing it
sometimes, but the recording quality kinda gets in the way.
Listen to Andy McGann to get a pure dose of that style.
Now that I know about it, I wish I could pop over to NYC just
to one of the hot sessions, just for one night to hear it live.
Fid42, you do have that luxury - just hop on the creaky old
train from Union Station and off you go.
You wouldn't call Gavin an NY fiddler, but he is sort of a cousin
to that style.
I was in NYC over the Easter holidays and visited a session in Manhattan.
There were three musicians and the leader was clearly the fiddle player. I found his style very interesting because it was definately based on the Sligo style of fiddling, but was highly ornamented and some of his variations were clearly his personal take on what could be done with the tune.
I thoroughly enjoyed the music but it was not a session I could have joined in with - and not because I didn´t know the tunes !
I found out later that the fiddle player was Tony de Marco, so I don´t know whether I was listening to the "New York style" or Tony de Marco´s style.
Either way, it was great music.
'You wouldn't call Gavin an NY fiddler, but he is sort of a cousin
to that style'
I don't know what you mean by that. Are you just implying he is influenced by that type of music? Indeed he was influenced a lot by The Flanagan boys, and other music of that period - 78's.
However saying what you said, for me - puts him in a hole. Its not the only style he plays. I'd suggest listening to his flute album.
Yes i would say there is a new york style. It is quite closely related to the sligo style like coleman and mcgann because of their influence but it has taken on its own characteristics over the years! i wouldn't say frankie is that closely related to the new york style per se. While him like many are influenced by those past masters, he is more a galway style and is heavily influenced by mick finn and tommy potts.
Not quite the same thing, ("America's a very big place" as Joe Cooley said,) but in the liner notes to "Frankie goes to Town" Frankie Gavin says "I have a great love for the Irish music recorded in America around the 1920s. I feel that the spirit in the music at that time is where we need to look for our inspiration when playing the music today."
Ah, finally a topic I know a little something about and speak a little about from experience.
Martin Mulvihill was a HUGE influence on many of the players to come out of NYC for decades starting in 70's until he passed away. I consider myself very lucky to have been taught by him. While Martin was a purest himself when it came to the music he his style of teaching was anything but traditional. One thing that made him different from other teachers of that time was the freedom he gave his students to find whatever style of playing they were most comfortable with. He would never make any one partcicular student play any one.particular style. This "freedom" made playing the music much more enjoyable for the kids and encouraged them to continue playing. In the end isn't that the goal of any teacher?
Please don't misunderstand me, when we were kids going into his basement on Hull Ave in "Da Bronx" for lessons he would make sure you would learn the tunes the way they should be played. He made sure when we played in competions, at ceili's or elswhere that the tunes were played with the respect for the Tradition. He was very succesful that way. But after a few years of learning from him and getting the basics down he would change his approach. Once he felt a student had a solid base and respect for the music he would encourage us to get a little more "creative" and play the tunes the way we would want to play them (within reason). This is where outside surrounding began creeping into some of our styles of playing. Going to school I would hear Latin percussion being blasted from the windows of the apartment buildings up the block from my house or maybe it was the car driving down the street pumping rap beats from its stereo. If it fell into a 4/4 beat I was going to try to put a reel to it. All of us did it as kids and fortunately for a few a great deal of success came from it. That's a whole other topic
Now, what I I can tell you that there is a distinct difference between players in NYC if you go from borough to borough just as there is a distinct difference in playing styles if you go from one County to another in Ireland. It really all depends on what sesiun you roll into or who ya talk to. It all depends on who taught ya, where ya grew up, if you were a Met fan or a Yankee fan etc......
All I know is that I had a GREAT time growing up in the Bronx playing irish music an playing stickball in traffic. We're a dysfunctional bunch but we have a lot of fun
Wow! Thanks LB! I've been waiting for one of you NY
guys to pop out of the woodwork. I know nothing at all about
Mulvihill. What can you tell us about his approach to bowing?
He is playing with John Whalen and Brian Dolan, they are amazing to watch. Hopefully they'll join the session at the end of the night, like last year. It was terrific.
here's a quote from a write up he was given The National Endowment for the Arts Lifetime Acheivemnet Award
".......He used the long bowing technique, common to southern Ireland, playing rolls rather than triplets, holding to the long, elegant lines of the old melodies, and adding subtle variations in timing, phrasing, or intonation to provide a "lilt" to the music...."
The rest of the article can be found at: http://www.nea.gov/honors/heritage/fellows/fellow.php?id=1984_10
I should hope there is a New York style, because supposedly my teacher is one of its major proponents; he played with McGann, Reynolds and Cronin in his youth, and that's where he got his music. That with a dash of Clare and Kerry is where you get the "Providence" style found around Rhode Island.
To a degree; he has a lot of short, bouncy bowstrokes interspersed with one or two long, powerful strokes. I'm not personally familiar with McGann, so I actually associate that type of bowing with Denis Murphy, whose music has also significantly influenced my teacher and myself - however, I can say for sure that there is a lot of lift and bounce to his playing.
Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
I've been watching many of the Comholtas videos available on You-tube.
I found a great one and decided to learn the half of the set of reels I didn't know and then try to play along on all four reels.
Brian Conway, Billie McComiskey, Joannie Madden and Feelix Dolan - starting a set with two of Crowley's major key reels.
This reminds me of being at Elkins Irish week many years ago -- the music I heard in the "Ice House" in a year when Seamus Egan, Eileen Ivers, Joannie Madden, Jerry O'Sullivan and James Keane were all teaching, and playing in the Ice House in the evenings off and on. HOT **** VERY HOT MUSIC. I LOVED IT. It really gives me a thrill to hear music played like that.
I hear the same thing when I listen to Brian Conway et al on this You.tube video. I don't know what it is exactly but it makes me feel like I want to leap off the chair. What it really does is make my insides feel wildly happy.
I tend to think of this as "The New York or "Da Bronx" style, but maybe it's just great playing.
Any comments?
Linda
# Posted on May 21st 2008 by Fid42
Re: Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
Did you intend to post a link to the video? Don't hold out on us now, I love Brian's playing.
# Posted on May 21st 2008 by Murph
Re: Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
I just added a link on the "Links" page.
Linda
# Posted on May 21st 2008 by Fid42
Re: Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
Well I've been readng some of these threads.
Maybe the "New York Style" just has a big, huge dose of THE NYAH in it!
Linda
# Posted on May 21st 2008 by Fid42
Re: Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
There is certainly a NY - Sligo fiddle style that comes from
Michael Coleman via Andy McGann. You can hear a characteristic
bow stroke in McGann and Conway. ... and also Frankie Gavin.
All three have their own personalities, but they all have a way
of punching the downbeat. You can hear Coleman doing it
sometimes, but the recording quality kinda gets in the way.
Listen to Andy McGann to get a pure dose of that style.
Now that I know about it, I wish I could pop over to NYC just
to one of the hot sessions, just for one night to hear it live.
Fid42, you do have that luxury - just hop on the creaky old
train from Union Station and off you go.
You wouldn't call Gavin an NY fiddler, but he is sort of a cousin
to that style.
# Posted on May 21st 2008 by Hup
Re: Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
I was in NYC over the Easter holidays and visited a session in Manhattan.
There were three musicians and the leader was clearly the fiddle player. I found his style very interesting because it was definately based on the Sligo style of fiddling, but was highly ornamented and some of his variations were clearly his personal take on what could be done with the tune.
I thoroughly enjoyed the music but it was not a session I could have joined in with - and not because I didn´t know the tunes !
I found out later that the fiddle player was Tony de Marco, so I don´t know whether I was listening to the "New York style" or Tony de Marco´s style.
Either way, it was great music.
# Posted on May 21st 2008 by murfbox
Re: Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
'You wouldn't call Gavin an NY fiddler, but he is sort of a cousin
to that style'
I don't know what you mean by that. Are you just implying he is influenced by that type of music? Indeed he was influenced a lot by The Flanagan boys, and other music of that period - 78's.
However saying what you said, for me - puts him in a hole. Its not the only style he plays. I'd suggest listening to his flute album.
# Posted on May 21st 2008 by Hugo Chavez
Re: Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
Yes, "influenced" is the way to put it - I don't think I put him
in any boxes. LOL - nobody could do that to Mr Gavin
# Posted on May 21st 2008 by Hup
Re: Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
Yes i would say there is a new york style. It is quite closely related to the sligo style like coleman and mcgann because of their influence but it has taken on its own characteristics over the years! i wouldn't say frankie is that closely related to the new york style per se. While him like many are influenced by those past masters, he is more a galway style and is heavily influenced by mick finn and tommy potts.
# Posted on May 21st 2008 by fiddleruairi
Re: Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
Not quite the same thing, ("America's a very big place" as Joe Cooley said,) but in the liner notes to "Frankie goes to Town" Frankie Gavin says "I have a great love for the Irish music recorded in America around the 1920s. I feel that the spirit in the music at that time is where we need to look for our inspiration when playing the music today."
# Posted on May 21st 2008 by TomB-R
Re: Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
I think there is a definite feel to NY stuff, like there is to London music.
I like em both alot.
**
However I am not into putting labels on things - it's just Frankie Gavin, or Andy McGann....
As I stated earlier, Frankie was influenced by those 1920's (and earlier) 78's - so was John Carty especially evident in 'At the racket'.
Does that make Carty a player of the London style with sprinklings of the New York style, thus making him a second cousin?
Come off it.
Its Frankie Gavin, and its John Carty - thats it.
Its Michael Flannigan, or its Joxer McFinnerty down the local - No Pigeon holes.
# Posted on May 21st 2008 by Hugo Chavez
Re: Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
Ah, finally a topic I know a little something about and speak a little about from experience.
Martin Mulvihill was a HUGE influence on many of the players to come out of NYC for decades starting in 70's until he passed away. I consider myself very lucky to have been taught by him. While Martin was a purest himself when it came to the music he his style of teaching was anything but traditional. One thing that made him different from other teachers of that time was the freedom he gave his students to find whatever style of playing they were most comfortable with. He would never make any one partcicular student play any one.particular style. This "freedom" made playing the music much more enjoyable for the kids and encouraged them to continue playing. In the end isn't that the goal of any teacher?
Please don't misunderstand me, when we were kids going into his basement on Hull Ave in "Da Bronx" for lessons he would make sure you would learn the tunes the way they should be played. He made sure when we played in competions, at ceili's or elswhere that the tunes were played with the respect for the Tradition. He was very succesful that way. But after a few years of learning from him and getting the basics down he would change his approach. Once he felt a student had a solid base and respect for the music he would encourage us to get a little more "creative" and play the tunes the way we would want to play them (within reason). This is where outside surrounding began creeping into some of our styles of playing. Going to school I would hear Latin percussion being blasted from the windows of the apartment buildings up the block from my house or maybe it was the car driving down the street pumping rap beats from its stereo. If it fell into a 4/4 beat I was going to try to put a reel to it. All of us did it as kids and fortunately for a few a great deal of success came from it. That's a whole other topic
Now, what I I can tell you that there is a distinct difference between players in NYC if you go from borough to borough just as there is a distinct difference in playing styles if you go from one County to another in Ireland. It really all depends on what sesiun you roll into or who ya talk to. It all depends on who taught ya, where ya grew up, if you were a Met fan or a Yankee fan etc......
All I know is that I had a GREAT time growing up in the Bronx playing irish music an playing stickball in traffic. We're a dysfunctional bunch but we have a lot of fun
# Posted on May 21st 2008 by The Lonesome Bowman
Re: Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
Hugo, I don't do silly arguments - it's boring.
# Posted on May 22nd 2008 by Hup
Re: Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
Wow! Thanks LB! I've been waiting for one of you NY
guys to pop out of the woodwork. I know nothing at all about
Mulvihill. What can you tell us about his approach to bowing?
# Posted on May 22nd 2008 by Hup
Brian is doing a workshop at our fest
http://www.thesession.org/events/display/883
He is playing with John Whalen and Brian Dolan, they are amazing to watch. Hopefully they'll join the session at the end of the night, like last year. It was terrific.
# Posted on May 22nd 2008 by tracywag
Re: Martin Mulvihill's bowing technique
here's a quote from a write up he was given The National Endowment for the Arts Lifetime Acheivemnet Award
".......He used the long bowing technique, common to southern Ireland, playing rolls rather than triplets, holding to the long, elegant lines of the old melodies, and adding subtle variations in timing, phrasing, or intonation to provide a "lilt" to the music...."
The rest of the article can be found at:
http://www.nea.gov/honors/heritage/fellows/fellow.php?id=1984_10
# Posted on May 22nd 2008 by The Lonesome Bowman
Re: Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
That's interesting - so it's not all about Sligo in NYC obviously.
# Posted on May 22nd 2008 by Hup
Re: Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
Mhuppet.
Not intended that way.....apologies.
# Posted on May 22nd 2008 by Hugo Chavez
Re: Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
I should hope there is a New York style, because supposedly my teacher is one of its major proponents; he played with McGann, Reynolds and Cronin in his youth, and that's where he got his music. That with a dash of Clare and Kerry is where you get the "Providence" style found around Rhode Island.
Or so he'd have me believe : P
--DtM
# Posted on May 22nd 2008 by Dan the Man
Re: Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
DTM - does he have that driving bow that McGann
had? I still want to know about the mechanics of that
# Posted on May 23rd 2008 by Hup
Re: Is there such a thing as "the new york style"
To a degree; he has a lot of short, bouncy bowstrokes interspersed with one or two long, powerful strokes. I'm not personally familiar with McGann, so I actually associate that type of bowing with Denis Murphy, whose music has also significantly influenced my teacher and myself - however, I can say for sure that there is a lot of lift and bounce to his playing.
--DtM
# Posted on May 23rd 2008 by Dan the Man