Examples, come on, lets see some. I tried to find the worst one I'd heard most recently ~
"Fairytale of New York" ~ as sung by Catherine Jenkins
It truly is dreadful, but I can't stand anything she warbles. Why is it people give her air time? It can't be anything to do with musical talent... It is probably good I couldn't find a sample of it anywhere. I'm sure it would damage the ears to hear too much of that sort of thing.
Let's see, what else ~ James Galway on the whistle... And, to stir it up a little ~ a bit of IMO ~ lovely little moppet Marty Hayes ~ UGH!!! We are now officially a Martin Hayes free zone. I gave our last recordings of his away to one of his groupies. Crazy how some people have 'em and others, like me, haven't... Maybe it's that mop of dark curls as opposed to my shiny pate...
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
In the U.S. classical music is state-sponsored, with Orchestras in the schools cranking out musicians like me who eventually have to find a way to lose it. Rock and roll didn't do it, and Appalachian fiddle tunes didn't do it; but if ITM doesn't do it for me, then I am stuck with it. My tunes just don't sound right, but I HEAR it and I am trying.
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
State-sponsored????? You mean state-neglected. If anything is supported by the state, it is athletics, not the arts. Yet for nearly everyone, athletics ends the day you graduate from high school. Of course, you can pursue life-time sports, such as tennis, swimming, golf, etc, but baseball? football? Yet, you can continue to grow with your instrument for the rest of your life.
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
You might be interested to know that during a conversation with Jackie Small a few days ago, I learned that many of the tunes we play today, particularly what later became known as polkas, were actually composed by art musicians.
They came into the tradition under the guise of the Quadrille, Lancer and Caledonian sets and were played in the 'big houses', but often by ordinary folk musicians and needless to say made their way into the tradition.
I have a big handwritten book of them in my possesion but am struggling to find titles, so I can't give you examples just yet unfortunately! grr.
Just another slant on things even though you're talking about actuall performance...
I'm not a fan of vibrato myself if it helps on that account!
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
" ~ Quadrille, Lancer and Caledonian sets and were played in the 'big houses' ~ " ~ martin t
It didn't end there ~ they were also played and danced in the big halls of Belfast & Dublin. The tunes are also in print from then in large format with the dance figures for whichever quadrille given at the bottom. A 'classic' example, and named for an opera singer, is "Jenny Lind" / "Jenny Ling"...
"Johanna Maria Lind (October 6, 1820 – November 2, 1887), better known as Jenny Lind, was a Swedish-born opera singer, often known as the "Swedish Nightingale". She is known for her performances in soprano roles in Sweden and Europe, as well as for an extraordinarily popular tour of America beginning in 1850, and for her philanthropic work."
'Vibrato" hasn't necessarily the abuse it is put through repeatedly in the modern sense. Also, those musicians in the 1800s were playing for dancers ~ the idea they couldn't put the 'dance' in the music has never crossed my mind. What has developed as 'classical' is not necessarily the same thing that was regularly finding air time in the big halls and ballrooms of Europe in the 1800s, when the couple dances we take for granted now were in full swing ~ polka, waltz, mazurka, varsouvienne, schottische, etc... As happens, that memory, understanding and skill can sometimes be taken on outside and beyond the origin and lifespan of a thing, in this case music related. As well, those that took up the bow, flute or other musical tool to drive the dance then ~ were not necessarily of the same class they were performing that function for. 'Musician' has generally not meant 'upper class', though some have tried hard over time to put on the airs of that. In the immediate realm of these isles Scotland comes to mind. In another extreme, an earlier date ~ Henry the VIII, but his hired ensemble and music tutors would generally not have been blue bloods themselves...
Hey, where are the examples? There are tons of folks out there doing it to this music... ~ "Greensleeves" on recorder? ~ Playford pieces by some English Country Dance ensemble? ~ "The Irish Washerwoman"? ~ "Mason's Apron"? ~ endless variations typewritten out on the small pipes? ~ Some dull and plodding set of polkas by a highland bagpipe band in an Orange parade? ~ A lush arrangement of "Danny Boy" by 'The Berlin Philharmonic'? ~ Catnerine Jenkins or some other half-baked warbler singing "She Moved Through the Fair"?
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
The eighteenth and nineteenth century pastoral and union pipes tutors (the earliest known is Geoghehan, 1743)) contain tunes that appear in classical or baroque style, as well as jigs, reels, waltzes, strathspeys, and so on. One of the reasons for developing pastoral pipes was so they could play baroque style chamber music. Geoghehan himself writes, "The bagpipe being at this time brought to such perfection as now renders it able to perform the same number of notes as flute or hautboy." Pastoral pipes had a foot joint, which let you play a middle C and apparently there were cross fingerings for numerous accidentals.
I agree with you, Ceol, that modern fusions between classical and folk can suck spectacularly, to say the least. But historically classical and what we now label folk or traditional music had a much closer relationship than they do now.
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Mhuppert and Ceolachan, alarm bells should ring if someone describes themselves as having a 'Scottish' style, in the same way as someone who would say 'Irish' style. IMO there is no such thing as a Scottish style. There's Highland, west coast, east coast, Lowland, etc. West coast, for example is more similar to Donegal style than Scottish east coast style, despite being in a different country. I'm sure you know that but someone who describes themselves as having a Scottish style obviously doesn't.
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Absolutely, bogman - what about Borders as well?
I'd be interested to hear someone enumerate the number of English styles of playing their trad, as there must be hundreds once they all get disenterred and dusted down, as is being done by the likes of John Offord.
But back to the initial point - I haven't heard the Cathryn Jenkins recording, but I can imagine. I have to say, I don't hate ALL of these pumped-up trad offerings made into quasi-classical arrangements. They can sound quite sweet. But I question the motives - why would someone want to do this? Are they embarrassed by the "rough" sound of the music? Do they feel some need to "elevate" the tradition?
I think I asked similar questions recently in a similar discussion, right enough. Nothing that isn't worth repeating though....
"Art is not concerned with actual occurrences or events as such, but with their metaphysical significance to man."
"The reason why art has such a profoundly personal significance for men is that art confirms or denies the efficacy of a man's consciousness, according to whether an artwork supports or negates his own fundamental view of reality."
"The emotion involved in art is not an emotion in the ordinary meaning of the term. It is experienced more as a "sense" or "feel," but it has two characteristics pertaining to emotions: it is automatically immediate and it has an intense, profoundly personal (yet undefined) value meaning to the individual experiencing it. The value involved is life, and the words naming the emotion are: "This is what life means to me."
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
"We are now officially a Martin Hayes free zone. I gave our last recordings of his away to one of his groupies. Crazy how some people have 'em and others, like me, haven't... Maybe it's that mop of dark curls as opposed to my shiny pate... "
Or maybe its because you have no musical taste and an incredible lack of understanding of the tradition...
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
I'm gonna have to second the opinion of Hotspur here. Heck, there are lots of singers who I wouln't recognize if I saw them in person simply because there wasn't a glowing sign saying "MUTE" beside them.
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
The worst example of this was when I first picked the fiddle back up as an adult and had to shake off my childhood classical music training. Plenty of dirty pints and stomping feet later, I'm happy to say I believe I've shaken it off!
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Reading through this thread the following words come to mind.........Musically Intolerant – Musically Ill-Liberal – Musically conservative – Musically parochial – Musically provincial – Musically insular – Musically small minded – Musically petty - Musically blinkered – Musically inward looking – Musically prejudiced – Musically bigoted, and oops I nearly forgot.... I think that Miss Jenkins is a great singer as well.
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Err, Free Reed....while you're at it, what about "Musically Traditional"?.....
I did say I quite liked somethese hybrids, but wondred why anyone would want to mix, say, a good 15 year old malt whisky with a grand cru Burgundy?
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
"~ historically classical and what we now label folk or traditional music had a much closer relationship than they do now." ~ The Silver Spear
"There's Highland, west coast, east coast, Lowland, etc." (Borders) ~ bogman
Absolutely!!! ~ on both counts.
Silver Spear, I've no doubt they were better musicians back then than what has happened in the exclusions, divisions and categorizations of music that separates different forms and genres in the present... There's no way that 'dance' didn't inform it all for them, and life in general...
!@£$%^&*() ~ There's no escaping the man has talent. I don't dislike 'everything' that Marty comes out with, just the thick syrupy stuff, but some folks like lots of sugar and fat with everything... I'd never deny them their cream puffs and Crispy Cream Donuts... I even break down now and then and enjoy something fat and greasy...
Free Reed ~ it's not likely anyone would make such a sweeping judgement of any of us with your list. I've never said I didn't enjoy and appreciate different music, including things tagged under the general sweep of the category 'Classical'. But Catherine Jenkins? Alright, I realize some folks don't know the difference, but ~ UGH! ~ even with the mute on... Each to their own, but pushing it to try and sing pop and then to cover a Pogues track, "Fairytale of New York", so horribly pathetic?
Obviously your tastes are considerably different from mine. Musically intolerant? ~ You must be thick... I'd laugh, but as a judgement it doesn't even qualify for humour, by design or by ignorance... There isn't much out there musically that doesn't produce at least something I can enjoy, even if it is a good laugh because it is so awful, like Catherine Jenkins tyring to be a pop singer when she hasn't managed a pull off a reasonable result with things Classical ~ in my opinion... Which, by most measures would be considered at the least to be 'informed'...
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Maybe using ear plugs in my rock and roll period means my ears can still hear the difference, however long they've been in regular use... Someone once told me that the piano according causes more ear damage over time than rock and roll. I couldn't say...
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Sorry Free Reed, I don't mean that you are 'thick', but that the idea is pretty much a lump of lead. But, I usually freely admit my biases and inclinations. Some folks do new and experimental things very well, some cross over and blend with interesting results ~ most do not... Most are, as I have experienced it aurally, cack, shight... I think the difference is in attitude and motivaiton. Why Ms. Jenkins thought she could cover a Pogues track the Lord only knows, but it might have had something to do with it being Christmas time and that drive amongst the commercially motivated to at least attempt a Christmas #1... But hey, if you can do it, there is a lot of money to be made. Decent singer or not, she is definitely capitalizing on it all and I can't blame her. I wouldn't take that away from the lass. More power to her, however daft it is. She wouldn't be there if folks didn't find something in it that charmed them... Ah, isn't she cute! Sorry FR, I can only manage a primitive grunt ~ UGH!!! Just don't think I don't respect you despite your tastes in music or your negative judgements. I suffer from being thick myself now and then...
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Well in fairness to myself I wrote, and I qoute " reading through this thread the following words came to mind" so I had nobody particular in mind, only the whole nature of the thread. I didn't really expect to get away with it so no offence was taken at been accused of been 'thick' . However, just to put the record straight I did leave school with 'Two Spirt Levels' and a Degree in 'Dodging the Cane. I haven't heard my darling Catherin's rendition of The Fairytale of New York' so I can't comment on that, but perhaps she was just getting back at Shane MacGowan for murdering The Irish Rover or maybe just for been Shane MacGowan.
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
While respecting the great diversity in each tradition (or set of traditions), I can hear how a person could broadly refer to playing in a Scottish rather than an Irish style. Certain aspects of things like the amount of swing in reels, for example, or approach to ornamentation, rhythmic articulation, bowing, and tone to me at least sound similar enough between regional styles in each tradition and different enough from the other to be able to generalize a little bit. When I first started Irish music, my teacher, a talented Irish and Cape Breton fiddler, told me I sounded Scottish in my rhythmic, etc. approach to reels (due to years of classical training, my swing/lilt/nyah was not good). On the other hand, if the person can't tell you anything beyond "It's Scottish style!", they are almost certainly clueless.
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Hayes says that his aim with this album - and I guess
the Seattle one too - is to communicate with the world, not
only us ITM nerds - to make a universal music.
Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Examples, come on, lets see some. I tried to find the worst one I'd heard most recently ~
"Fairytale of New York" ~ as sung by Catherine Jenkins
It truly is dreadful, but I can't stand anything she warbles. Why is it people give her air time? It can't be anything to do with musical talent... It is probably good I couldn't find a sample of it anywhere. I'm sure it would damage the ears to hear too much of that sort of thing.
Let's see, what else ~ James Galway on the whistle... And, to stir it up a little ~ a bit of IMO ~ lovely little moppet Marty Hayes ~ UGH!!! We are now officially a Martin Hayes free zone. I gave our last recordings of his away to one of his groupies. Crazy how some people have 'em and others, like me, haven't... Maybe it's that mop of dark curls as opposed to my shiny pate...
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by ceolachan
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
This is by way of extension, via this previous thread ~
Discussion: How do you "lose" a classical sound?
# Posted on May 5th 2008 by lazyhound
http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display/17667
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by ceolachan
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
In the U.S. classical music is state-sponsored, with Orchestras in the schools cranking out musicians like me who eventually have to find a way to lose it. Rock and roll didn't do it, and Appalachian fiddle tunes didn't do it; but if ITM doesn't do it for me, then I am stuck with it. My tunes just don't sound right, but I HEAR it and I am trying.
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by justjim
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
State-sponsored????? You mean state-neglected. If anything is supported by the state, it is athletics, not the arts. Yet for nearly everyone, athletics ends the day you graduate from high school. Of course, you can pursue life-time sports, such as tennis, swimming, golf, etc, but baseball? football? Yet, you can continue to grow with your instrument for the rest of your life.
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by Greg the Piano Tuner
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
You might be interested to know that during a conversation with Jackie Small a few days ago, I learned that many of the tunes we play today, particularly what later became known as polkas, were actually composed by art musicians.
They came into the tradition under the guise of the Quadrille, Lancer and Caledonian sets and were played in the 'big houses', but often by ordinary folk musicians and needless to say made their way into the tradition.
I have a big handwritten book of them in my possesion but am struggling to find titles, so I can't give you examples just yet unfortunately! grr.
Just another slant on things even though you're talking about actuall performance...
I'm not a fan of vibrato myself if it helps on that account!
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by martin t
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Most of the fiddlers I've heard who claim to play in the 'scottish' style
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by mhuppert
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
" ~ Quadrille, Lancer and Caledonian sets and were played in the 'big houses' ~ " ~ martin t
It didn't end there ~ they were also played and danced in the big halls of Belfast & Dublin. The tunes are also in print from then in large format with the dance figures for whichever quadrille given at the bottom. A 'classic' example, and named for an opera singer, is "Jenny Lind" / "Jenny Ling"...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jenny_Lind
"Johanna Maria Lind (October 6, 1820 – November 2, 1887), better known as Jenny Lind, was a Swedish-born opera singer, often known as the "Swedish Nightingale". She is known for her performances in soprano roles in Sweden and Europe, as well as for an extraordinarily popular tour of America beginning in 1850, and for her philanthropic work."
'Vibrato" hasn't necessarily the abuse it is put through repeatedly in the modern sense. Also, those musicians in the 1800s were playing for dancers ~ the idea they couldn't put the 'dance' in the music has never crossed my mind. What has developed as 'classical' is not necessarily the same thing that was regularly finding air time in the big halls and ballrooms of Europe in the 1800s, when the couple dances we take for granted now were in full swing ~ polka, waltz, mazurka, varsouvienne, schottische, etc... As happens, that memory, understanding and skill can sometimes be taken on outside and beyond the origin and lifespan of a thing, in this case music related. As well, those that took up the bow, flute or other musical tool to drive the dance then ~ were not necessarily of the same class they were performing that function for. 'Musician' has generally not meant 'upper class', though some have tried hard over time to put on the airs of that. In the immediate realm of these isles Scotland comes to mind. In another extreme, an earlier date ~ Henry the VIII, but his hired ensemble and music tutors would generally not have been blue bloods themselves...
Hey, where are the examples? There are tons of folks out there doing it to this music... ~ "Greensleeves" on recorder? ~ Playford pieces by some English Country Dance ensemble? ~ "The Irish Washerwoman"? ~ "Mason's Apron"? ~ endless variations typewritten out on the small pipes? ~ Some dull and plodding set of polkas by a highland bagpipe band in an Orange parade? ~ A lush arrangement of "Danny Boy" by 'The Berlin Philharmonic'? ~ Catnerine Jenkins or some other half-baked warbler singing "She Moved Through the Fair"?
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by ceolachan
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Yes mhuppert... It doesn't stop with fiddlers...
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by ceolachan
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
The eighteenth and nineteenth century pastoral and union pipes tutors (the earliest known is Geoghehan, 1743)) contain tunes that appear in classical or baroque style, as well as jigs, reels, waltzes, strathspeys, and so on. One of the reasons for developing pastoral pipes was so they could play baroque style chamber music. Geoghehan himself writes, "The bagpipe being at this time brought to such perfection as now renders it able to perform the same number of notes as flute or hautboy." Pastoral pipes had a foot joint, which let you play a middle C and apparently there were cross fingerings for numerous accidentals.
I agree with you, Ceol, that modern fusions between classical and folk can suck spectacularly, to say the least. But historically classical and what we now label folk or traditional music had a much closer relationship than they do now.
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by TheSilverSpear
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Mhuppert and Ceolachan, alarm bells should ring if someone describes themselves as having a 'Scottish' style, in the same way as someone who would say 'Irish' style. IMO there is no such thing as a Scottish style. There's Highland, west coast, east coast, Lowland, etc. West coast, for example is more similar to Donegal style than Scottish east coast style, despite being in a different country. I'm sure you know that but someone who describes themselves as having a Scottish style obviously doesn't.
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by bogman
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Absolutely, bogman - what about Borders as well?
I'd be interested to hear someone enumerate the number of English styles of playing their trad, as there must be hundreds once they all get disenterred and dusted down, as is being done by the likes of John Offord.
But back to the initial point - I haven't heard the Cathryn Jenkins recording, but I can imagine. I have to say, I don't hate ALL of these pumped-up trad offerings made into quasi-classical arrangements. They can sound quite sweet. But I question the motives - why would someone want to do this? Are they embarrassed by the "rough" sound of the music? Do they feel some need to "elevate" the tradition?
I think I asked similar questions recently in a similar discussion, right enough. Nothing that isn't worth repeating though....
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by Key Maniac Lad
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Catherine Jenkins - on TV - just press the "mute" button and watch.
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by hotspur
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
The Romantic Manifesto
by Ayn Rand
Selected Quotes:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Art is not concerned with actual occurrences or events as such, but with their metaphysical significance to man."
"The reason why art has such a profoundly personal significance for men is that art confirms or denies the efficacy of a man's consciousness, according to whether an artwork supports or negates his own fundamental view of reality."
"The emotion involved in art is not an emotion in the ordinary meaning of the term. It is experienced more as a "sense" or "feel," but it has two characteristics pertaining to emotions: it is automatically immediate and it has an intense, profoundly personal (yet undefined) value meaning to the individual experiencing it. The value involved is life, and the words naming the emotion are: "This is what life means to me."
—Indeed.
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by Sir Dungsmere
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
I'll have to get over there and hear the real thing some day bogman
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by mhuppert
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
"We are now officially a Martin Hayes free zone. I gave our last recordings of his away to one of his groupies. Crazy how some people have 'em and others, like me, haven't... Maybe it's that mop of dark curls as opposed to my shiny pate...
"
Or maybe its because you have no musical taste and an incredible lack of understanding of the tradition...
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by !@£$%^&*()
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
I'm gonna have to second the opinion of Hotspur here. Heck, there are lots of singers who I wouln't recognize if I saw them in person simply because there wasn't a glowing sign saying "MUTE" beside them.
Still, she's awful pretty to look at.
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by Ashkettle
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
The worst example of this was when I first picked the fiddle back up as an adult and had to shake off my childhood classical music training. Plenty of dirty pints and stomping feet later, I'm happy to say I believe I've shaken it off!
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Reading through this thread the following words come to mind.........Musically Intolerant – Musically Ill-Liberal – Musically conservative – Musically parochial – Musically provincial – Musically insular – Musically small minded – Musically petty - Musically blinkered – Musically inward looking – Musically prejudiced – Musically bigoted, and oops I nearly forgot.... I think that Miss Jenkins is a great singer as well.
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by Free Reed
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Err, Free Reed....while you're at it, what about "Musically Traditional"?.....
I did say I quite liked somethese hybrids, but wondred why anyone would want to mix, say, a good 15 year old malt whisky with a grand cru Burgundy?
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by Key Maniac Lad
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
"~ historically classical and what we now label folk or traditional music had a much closer relationship than they do now." ~ The Silver Spear
"There's Highland, west coast, east coast, Lowland, etc." (Borders) ~ bogman
Absolutely!!! ~ on both counts.
Silver Spear, I've no doubt they were better musicians back then than what has happened in the exclusions, divisions and categorizations of music that separates different forms and genres in the present... There's no way that 'dance' didn't inform it all for them, and life in general...
!@£$%^&*() ~ There's no escaping the man has talent. I don't dislike 'everything' that Marty comes out with, just the thick syrupy stuff, but some folks like lots of sugar and fat with everything... I'd never deny them their cream puffs and Crispy Cream Donuts... I even break down now and then and enjoy something fat and greasy...
Free Reed ~ it's not likely anyone would make such a sweeping judgement of any of us with your list. I've never said I didn't enjoy and appreciate different music, including things tagged under the general sweep of the category 'Classical'. But Catherine Jenkins? Alright, I realize some folks don't know the difference, but ~ UGH! ~ even with the mute on... Each to their own, but pushing it to try and sing pop and then to cover a Pogues track, "Fairytale of New York", so horribly pathetic?
Obviously your tastes are considerably different from mine. Musically intolerant? ~ You must be thick... I'd laugh, but as a judgement it doesn't even qualify for humour, by design or by ignorance... There isn't much out there musically that doesn't produce at least something I can enjoy, even if it is a good laugh because it is so awful, like Catherine Jenkins tyring to be a pop singer when she hasn't managed a pull off a reasonable result with things Classical ~ in my opinion... Which, by most measures would be considered at the least to be 'informed'...
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by ceolachan
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Maybe using ear plugs in my rock and roll period means my ears can still hear the difference, however long they've been in regular use... Someone once told me that the piano according causes more ear damage over time than rock and roll. I couldn't say...
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by ceolachan
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Sir Dungsmere ~ enjoyed the quotes...
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by ceolachan
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Sorry Free Reed, I don't mean that you are 'thick', but that the idea is pretty much a lump of lead. But, I usually freely admit my biases and inclinations. Some folks do new and experimental things very well, some cross over and blend with interesting results ~ most do not... Most are, as I have experienced it aurally, cack, shight... I think the difference is in attitude and motivaiton. Why Ms. Jenkins thought she could cover a Pogues track the Lord only knows, but it might have had something to do with it being Christmas time and that drive amongst the commercially motivated to at least attempt a Christmas #1... But hey, if you can do it, there is a lot of money to be made. Decent singer or not, she is definitely capitalizing on it all and I can't blame her. I wouldn't take that away from the lass. More power to her, however daft it is. She wouldn't be there if folks didn't find something in it that charmed them... Ah, isn't she cute! Sorry FR, I can only manage a primitive grunt ~ UGH!!! Just don't think I don't respect you despite your tastes in music or your negative judgements. I suffer from being thick myself now and then...
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by ceolachan
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Well in fairness to myself I wrote, and I qoute " reading through this thread the following words came to mind" so I had nobody particular in mind, only the whole nature of the thread. I didn't really expect to get away with it so no offence was taken at been accused of been 'thick' . However, just to put the record straight I did leave school with 'Two Spirt Levels' and a Degree in 'Dodging the Cane. I haven't heard my darling Catherin's rendition of The Fairytale of New York' so I can't comment on that, but perhaps she was just getting back at Shane MacGowan for murdering The Irish Rover or maybe just for been Shane MacGowan.
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by Free Reed
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Martin Hayes is great.
Catherine Jenkins? Never heard of her.
James Galway on whistle. Jame's own opinion of himself on the whistle says it all, he approaches it like a classical musician, rather than a piper.
And when people say "Scottish style" referring to the fiddle, they mean Donegal.
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by bodhran bliss
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
While respecting the great diversity in each tradition (or set of traditions), I can hear how a person could broadly refer to playing in a Scottish rather than an Irish style. Certain aspects of things like the amount of swing in reels, for example, or approach to ornamentation, rhythmic articulation, bowing, and tone to me at least sound similar enough between regional styles in each tradition and different enough from the other to be able to generalize a little bit. When I first started Irish music, my teacher, a talented Irish and Cape Breton fiddler, told me I sounded Scottish in my rhythmic, etc. approach to reels (due to years of classical training, my swing/lilt/nyah was not good). On the other hand, if the person can't tell you anything beyond "It's Scottish style!", they are almost certainly clueless.
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by jasonb1985
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
>>when people say "Scottish style" referring to the fiddle, they mean Donegal.
Oh. Right.
Thanks for sharing that information with us bliss, you're too kind.
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by Key Maniac Lad
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Discussion: Irish Fiddle Virtuoso To Be Honoured By Native County ( Martin Hayes!
)
# Posted on May 8th 2008 by Martin Donohoe
http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display/1771
# Posted on May 9th 2008 by ceolachan
http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display/17714
# Posted on May 9th 2008 by ceolachan
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
BB - if that were true, I'd join the club
# Posted on May 9th 2008 by mhuppert
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Hayes says that his aim with this album - and I guess
the Seattle one too - is to communicate with the world, not
only us ITM nerds - to make a universal music.
# Posted on May 9th 2008 by mhuppert
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Always willing to serve and be helpful KML, think nothing of it. I mean, what is this site for, except to help others.
# Posted on May 9th 2008 by bodhran bliss
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
~ &, it would seem ~ WIND THEM UP!!! & even ~ SEND THEM ROUND THE TWIST!!!
# Posted on May 9th 2008 by ceolachan
Re: Criminal Abuse ~ That 'Classical' Way with Things
Moi? What a thing to say.
Is KML from Scotland/North Antrim? They all play Donegal style.
Dalriada rules.
# Posted on May 9th 2008 by bodhran bliss