I play in an italian bluegrass band.
I want to use only a microphone ( condenser, large diaphragm) for the band ( like Del Mccoury band ).
What microphone can I use ?
Audiotechnica 4040, 4033, 3035 ?
I really hate questions like this - mainly because to answer it we need more information. Are you talking about recording? Playing live? How big a band? What sort of venue?
Anyway, do a search on "microphone" on this site and you'll find tons of useful experience.
Only one microphone for the band? okay. But what is the composition of the band? And as Mark said, what use do you want to make of the microphone?
I guess there is at least one guitar and one bass in your band, don they have electrical outputs? Do your musicians use amps?
So the microphone would be for the voice and possibly for an harmonica? Other instruments?
Thank you for the gentle answer..
sorry, but I have problems with english language...and so I try to write short comunications...every word is a possible error!!!!
Now I read your link to the forum.
The microphone is for live performance and we are a tipical (?) bluegrass band: banjo, mandolin guitar and bass.
We play generally in pubs or little places ..
Thank's
We are not sitting..
The pubs generally have a corner for the bands, a good place for music and to see...
We like the show with one microphone for the movements of the musicians for the solos... and for the sound, of course.
As folks are no doubt aware, there is a strong "single microphone" tradition in bluegrass. Partly a matter of history, 1940's radio stations etc, but also it works well and looks good in performance. As each player takes their break they step up to the microphone, then move away when they go back to backing. Creates a nice dynamic for the audience to watch.
Just because it's the traditional method doesn't actually mean it's the best.
If the band sound is actually mainly acoustic, ie the audience could still hear the band without a microphone, and/or you are not turning the amplifier up very loud, then using a single microphone would work, using the microphone only to emphasize the solo instruments, and the vocalist, in turn.
For any larger degree of amplification, individual instrument mikimg would be much more effective, and less likely to produce feedback through the PA system.
Something else to consider is that in a "pub environment" you'll likely be picking up ambient noise from the audience. That being said, I believe the AT 404 is what Del and the boys use and they sound flawless.
Well, this has got me interested. I don't know anything at all about Bluegrass but clearly I'm missing out. Does anyone have any links to YouTube videos that show the mic technique in action?
I looked through a dozen or so Del McCoury videos before I found this one. It looks like the ones from the 80s use a bunch of microphones and the very recent ones use two or three (one for the bass, one for the fiddle & mandolin players, and one for the guitars, banjo, and vocals). (Sometimes the angle of the video makes it hard to tell.) I think even the link I posted may have a mic on the bass that's barely visible.
As far as I can tell Pete, in bluegrass, traditional ie 1940's-50s = best! Not much room for discussion.
I think there's a lot to be said for the method, bearing in mind that taking turns on the breaks is surely fundamental to bluegrass. You can see, and hear, each person doing it, and it makes a nice visual dynamic. A soundman shifting sliders in turn hardly has the same feel!
I've only seen it done at the concerts at Didmarton Bluegrass Festival, but most of the bands used this method and I liked it a lot. That was a concert environment, fair point as to whether it works for a pub gig. Possibly not, I'm not sure how much one could rely on the cardiod properties of the mike.
I’ve been following bluegrass for more than fifty years (without even trying!) and I’ve run sound for concerts and festivals. I’ve seen the single-mic approach work really well, but it depends on several factors. You need a good large-diaphragm cardioid mic and a stage with decent acoustic properties to begin with. A band whose singers and instruments are naturally well-balanced can work that arrangement very nicely.
But a generation and a half of bluegrass musicians grew up with the multiple spot mic arrangement and slick studio recordings that enabled a new approach to soloing on guitar and mandolin involving a lighter touch and more virtuosity. This is harder to capture with a single mic. It’s tough to swing a guitar or mando up to mouth level and do your best playing. I’ve seen several bands do fine with a big mic with an additional spot mic for guitar and mandolin solos. I’ve also seen several bands who just couldn’t balance their sound for a single mic, yet they sound really good with ten spot mics.
In my experience, the most satisfying sound comes from the multiple mic setup with players and singers who know how to work a mic, and with a good sound engineer (good luck on that). But the single mic is usually good enough and is far simpler to manage.
only a microphone..
only a microphone..
I play in an italian bluegrass band.
I want to use only a microphone ( condenser, large diaphragm) for the band ( like Del Mccoury band ).
What microphone can I use ?
Audiotechnica 4040, 4033, 3035 ?
# Posted on April 24th 2008 by peppino
Re: only a microphone..
I really hate questions like this - mainly because to answer it we need more information. Are you talking about recording? Playing live? How big a band? What sort of venue?
Anyway, do a search on "microphone" on this site and you'll find tons of useful experience.
Try this as a start: http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display/16308/
# Posted on April 24th 2008 by Mark Harmer
Re: only a microphone..
Only one microphone for the band? okay. But what is the composition of the band? And as Mark said, what use do you want to make of the microphone?
I guess there is at least one guitar and one bass in your band, don they have electrical outputs? Do your musicians use amps?
So the microphone would be for the voice and possibly for an harmonica? Other instruments?
Laurent
# Posted on April 24th 2008 by Laurent Trenk
Re: only a microphone..
Thank you for the gentle answer..
sorry, but I have problems with english language...and so I try to write short comunications...every word is a possible error!!!!
Now I read your link to the forum.
The microphone is for live performance and we are a tipical (?) bluegrass band: banjo, mandolin guitar and bass.
We play generally in pubs or little places ..
Thank's
# Posted on April 24th 2008 by peppino
Re: only a microphone..
The microphone is for all the band...
We sing 2 voices and nobody use ampli.
We like the acustic sound!!
# Posted on April 24th 2008 by peppino
Re: only a microphone..
When you play in pubs, are you usually sitting at a table or in a corner? Or is it usually on a stage of some kind?
# Posted on April 24th 2008 by Rook
Re: only a microphone..
We are not sitting..
The pubs generally have a corner for the bands, a good place for music and to see...
We like the show with one microphone for the movements of the musicians for the solos... and for the sound, of course.
# Posted on April 24th 2008 by peppino
Re: only a microphone..
As folks are no doubt aware, there is a strong "single microphone" tradition in bluegrass. Partly a matter of history, 1940's radio stations etc, but also it works well and looks good in performance. As each player takes their break they step up to the microphone, then move away when they go back to backing. Creates a nice dynamic for the audience to watch.
There's a useful page here, peppino
http://www.newessexbluegrass.homecall.co.uk/onemike.htm
They recommend the Audiotechnica 4033 and mention a Rode alternative, I think.
# Posted on April 24th 2008 by TomB-R
Re: only a microphone..
Thank you for the answer TomB-R . The site of the link is good for bluegrass bands...
# Posted on April 24th 2008 by peppino
Re: only a microphone..
I knew that!
# Posted on April 24th 2008 by mcknowall
Re: only a microphone..
Good links, TomB-R!
# Posted on April 24th 2008 by Mark Harmer
Re: only a microphone..
Just because it's the traditional method doesn't actually mean it's the best.
If the band sound is actually mainly acoustic, ie the audience could still hear the band without a microphone, and/or you are not turning the amplifier up very loud, then using a single microphone would work, using the microphone only to emphasize the solo instruments, and the vocalist, in turn.
For any larger degree of amplification, individual instrument mikimg would be much more effective, and less likely to produce feedback through the PA system.
# Posted on April 25th 2008 by Guernsey Pete
Re: only a microphone..
Something else to consider is that in a "pub environment" you'll likely be picking up ambient noise from the audience. That being said, I believe the AT 404 is what Del and the boys use and they sound flawless.
# Posted on April 25th 2008 by scadgrad
Re: only a microphone..
Well, this has got me interested. I don't know anything at all about Bluegrass but clearly I'm missing out. Does anyone have any links to YouTube videos that show the mic technique in action?
# Posted on April 25th 2008 by Mark Harmer
Re: only a microphone..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=URs643QaiaA
I looked through a dozen or so Del McCoury videos before I found this one. It looks like the ones from the 80s use a bunch of microphones and the very recent ones use two or three (one for the bass, one for the fiddle & mandolin players, and one for the guitars, banjo, and vocals). (Sometimes the angle of the video makes it hard to tell.) I think even the link I posted may have a mic on the bass that's barely visible.
# Posted on April 25th 2008 by GaryAMartin
Re: only a microphone..
As far as I can tell Pete, in bluegrass, traditional ie 1940's-50s = best! Not much room for discussion.
I think there's a lot to be said for the method, bearing in mind that taking turns on the breaks is surely fundamental to bluegrass. You can see, and hear, each person doing it, and it makes a nice visual dynamic. A soundman shifting sliders in turn hardly has the same feel!
I've only seen it done at the concerts at Didmarton Bluegrass Festival, but most of the bands used this method and I liked it a lot. That was a concert environment, fair point as to whether it works for a pub gig. Possibly not, I'm not sure how much one could rely on the cardiod properties of the mike.
# Posted on April 25th 2008 by TomB-R
Re: only a microphone..
I’ve been following bluegrass for more than fifty years (without even trying!) and I’ve run sound for concerts and festivals. I’ve seen the single-mic approach work really well, but it depends on several factors. You need a good large-diaphragm cardioid mic and a stage with decent acoustic properties to begin with. A band whose singers and instruments are naturally well-balanced can work that arrangement very nicely.
But a generation and a half of bluegrass musicians grew up with the multiple spot mic arrangement and slick studio recordings that enabled a new approach to soloing on guitar and mandolin involving a lighter touch and more virtuosity. This is harder to capture with a single mic. It’s tough to swing a guitar or mando up to mouth level and do your best playing. I’ve seen several bands do fine with a big mic with an additional spot mic for guitar and mandolin solos. I’ve also seen several bands who just couldn’t balance their sound for a single mic, yet they sound really good with ten spot mics.
In my experience, the most satisfying sound comes from the multiple mic setup with players and singers who know how to work a mic, and with a good sound engineer (good luck on that). But the single mic is usually good enough and is far simpler to manage.
# Posted on April 25th 2008 by Bob himself
Re: only a microphone..
What a blast! Loved the YouTube vid - thanks for the link, GaryAMartin
# Posted on April 25th 2008 by Mark Harmer
Re: only a microphone..
I liked this one for its own sake, but thought I'd add it to this discussion
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VPmGTF2PRZU
# Posted on May 7th 2008 by TomB-R