My fiddle is becoming less and less responsive, it seems like the bow is just not catching the string. I keep putting more rosin on which fixes the problem for a bit (10 mins) then the strings just hiss more than playing real notes.
The thing is that i've only had this bow a couple of days and it was new, so surely it doesn't need new hair?
Could it be the strings? they have been on for a while but not that long and i can't see any visible signs of wear.
Did the person you bought the bow off cover the hair in fine rosin dust when you bought it? if they neglected to do this , that would explain the lack of grip from the bow..if you have got some good rosin, crush it up really fine and apply it to the bow without touching the bow hair with your fingers ..P
I don't if it was covered in fine rosin, but as i took it out of my case before i had put my own rosin on, i snagged the hair slightly which gave off a big puff of rosin. Does this mean it did have the fine layer?
Yeah from what you are saying it sounds like its already been rosined..change your strings and see how that goes.. maybe they are just tired out ..also , old rosin can sometimes accumulate on strings and form a "glassy" coating causing an effect like you described..P
Jake, before you change strings, try wiping them off with some rubbing alcohol. Best to use the swabs nurses use before they give you a needle in the arm--less chance of dripping alcohol on your fiddle, which will damage the varnish.
The idea is to rub the rosin off the strings down between the bridge and end of the fingerboard. Let the alcohol dry off, then try bowing again.
I keep a few packets of alcohol swabs in my case for just this purpose.
You may simply have too much rosin. You only need to rosin up about once a week, even if playing a few hours every day. And lightly at that. Many people apply way too much rosin. You'll get smoother, clearer tone with less.
This sounds like an Unpacked Bow,, We call it packing
the bow -ie/ with rosin ,,~ And Not Soap as we set up one poor
learner to do,, NOT FUNNY,,~
Get old Rosin , break some up like powder say on a Newspaper {makes a mess + hands stick to everthing} Loosen slightly the bow tension, and Gently push in the powdered Rosin inio bow hairs- Going up and down bow,,Blow excess off, And that you bow packed -Just rosin as normal after that,,
Should Work Better After That,, jim,,
I can't believe i didn't think of this before! It must be the strings, as i've been trying out a couple of fiddles recently using this bow and had no problems.
I gave the strings a quick scrub with a clean toothbrush just now and took some rosin off the bow too. It hardly reduced the background fuzz at all and the responsiveness has got worse. New strings it is, and I'll get myself some alcohol swabs too i think.
OK, this is really bugging me. I put on an old (but still good) set of strings and still the same problem! cleaned more rosin off the bow too which hasn't helped. Last time i had clogged bow hair i gave it a proper wash which sorted it. I think i'll give it a go.
Could the sound post shifting cause these symptoms? I took the D off this morning and was playing about with another string. could this have caused the post to shift?
Check too for gaps in the seams where the top and back meet the sides, and in the top and back themselves. Also make sure the bridge isn't leaning or angled off its feet. Is the end pin being pulled out of its hole by the tailpiece?
How old is the hair on the bow?
How old are the strings?
I don't think the soundpost has slippped, can't see any impressions. Bridge angle OK. End pin OK. Joints OK.
The strings that are on it now are about 8 months old but have only been played for about 2, (but they are carp ones).
The bow is brand new and has probably only been played by a few people who might have tried it out in the shop before i bought it, so the hair should be in good nick.
Do you have fine tuners on the tailpiece? If so, make sure they aren't touching the top of the fiddle (which can happen if you screw them down too tight).
I was having a very similar problem a few weeks ago. Brand new coda bow, worked great for a few weeks then I just couldn't get a grip on the strings. I tried new strings and a number of different types of Rosin, in the end it just sort of worked itself out. I think what i ended up doing was putting far too much rosin on the bow the more frustrated I became with the slipping which just led to making the problem worse.
Sound as though you have some open seams. Tap the edges and see if you hear a snapping sound, I use a leather covered ball that is glued to a stick,it's solid and won't mar the fiddle.
You can use your knockle but that gets sore.
If you do need to re-position the soundpost, get hold of a kilt pin. You "spear" the soundpost and work it into position that way. Much easier than fiddling (excuse the pun) with two bits of string through both "f" holes. Ernie
I'd look at bowing technique, irrespective of whether or not the bow or strings are over-rosined, or whether the soundpost or other mechanical bits need adjusting. Btw, if changing just one string really does cause the soundpost to shift, then the services of a luthier are definitely needed, and pdq!.
Stiffness in the bowing hand/arm is a major cause of poor tone - glassy or without body - as is bowing not parallel to the bridge, or bowing over the fingerboard, or too close to the bridge, or (most important of all) not engaging the bow properly with the string. By "engaging" the string I mean the sensation of playing into the string (without a grunching sound) rather than playing on the surface, which is what can happen with a stiff bowing hand/arm.
A good player with good bowing technique will be able to get acceptable tone and response out of an indifferent instrument, but someone without good bow control won't be able to get a good tone out of even the best instruments.
Good bow control and technique can really only be taught face-to-face because there is a lot of important fine detail that is difficult or next to impossible to put into print and in any case depends on the anatomy and physiology of the individual pupil. Failing face-to-face, a good starting point is Todd Ehle's violin teaching series on YouTube. The blog http://virtualviolin.blogspot.com/ is a convenient access point.
Whatever learning route is taken, be warned. Good bowing technique doesn't arrive overnight. It takes years.
Unresponsive fiddle
Unresponsive fiddle
Hi,
My fiddle is becoming less and less responsive, it seems like the bow is just not catching the string. I keep putting more rosin on which fixes the problem for a bit (10 mins) then the strings just hiss more than playing real notes.
The thing is that i've only had this bow a couple of days and it was new, so surely it doesn't need new hair?
Could it be the strings? they have been on for a while but not that long and i can't see any visible signs of wear.
Any help would be great, its really annoying me!
thanks
Jake
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by sloth
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
Did the person you bought the bow off cover the hair in fine rosin dust when you bought it? if they neglected to do this , that would explain the lack of grip from the bow..if you have got some good rosin, crush it up really fine and apply it to the bow without touching the bow hair with your fingers ..P
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by peter wsll
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
Sounds like worn out strings to me. Try a new set.
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by Screetch
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
I don't if it was covered in fine rosin, but as i took it out of my case before i had put my own rosin on, i snagged the hair slightly which gave off a big puff of rosin. Does this mean it did have the fine layer?
Cheers for your advice
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by sloth
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
I might just do that, Screetch. Any particular ones you would recommend? I've got dominants on at the moment.
cheers
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by sloth
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
Yeah from what you are saying it sounds like its already been rosined..change your strings and see how that goes.. maybe they are just tired out ..also , old rosin can sometimes accumulate on strings and form a "glassy" coating causing an effect like you described..P
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by peter wsll
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
P.S dominants are lovely IMO well worth the moneyP
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by peter wsll
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
Oops, meant to say "I don't know if it was covered in fine rosin"
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by sloth
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
Jake, before you change strings, try wiping them off with some rubbing alcohol. Best to use the swabs nurses use before they give you a needle in the arm--less chance of dripping alcohol on your fiddle, which will damage the varnish.
The idea is to rub the rosin off the strings down between the bridge and end of the fingerboard. Let the alcohol dry off, then try bowing again.
I keep a few packets of alcohol swabs in my case for just this purpose.
You may simply have too much rosin. You only need to rosin up about once a week, even if playing a few hours every day. And lightly at that. Many people apply way too much rosin. You'll get smoother, clearer tone with less.
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
This sounds like an Unpacked Bow,, We call it packing
the bow -ie/ with rosin ,,~ And Not Soap as we set up one poor
learner to do,, NOT FUNNY,,~
Get old Rosin , break some up like powder say on a Newspaper {makes a mess + hands stick to everthing} Loosen slightly the bow tension, and Gently push in the powdered Rosin inio bow hairs- Going up and down bow,,Blow excess off, And that you bow packed -Just rosin as normal after that,,
Should Work Better After That,, jim,,
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by FIDDLE4
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
But Jim, he's already getting clouds of rosin off the hair when he loosens it. Sounds plenty packed to me.
Try a different bow--if the same thing happens, it's either your strings or technique.
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
I can't believe i didn't think of this before! It must be the strings, as i've been trying out a couple of fiddles recently using this bow and had no problems.
I gave the strings a quick scrub with a clean toothbrush just now and took some rosin off the bow too. It hardly reduced the background fuzz at all and the responsiveness has got worse. New strings it is, and I'll get myself some alcohol swabs too i think.
Cheers
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by sloth
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
Get some alcohol for me too
Btw, I think I may be having the same problem as you Jake so thanks for putting up this discussion!
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by D.J.F.
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
OK, this is really bugging me. I put on an old (but still good) set of strings and still the same problem! cleaned more rosin off the bow too which hasn't helped. Last time i had clogged bow hair i gave it a proper wash which sorted it. I think i'll give it a go.
Could the sound post shifting cause these symptoms? I took the D off this morning and was playing about with another string. could this have caused the post to shift?
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by sloth
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
Have you ever tried to reset your sound post with one of those doo-hickeys? What a nightmare. It's like trying to impale a mosquito on a toothpick.
Are you able to look into the fiddle and see if it slipped? Usually there are impressions where the post 'should' be that you can see if it has moved.
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
Is the sound post even still standing?
Check too for gaps in the seams where the top and back meet the sides, and in the top and back themselves. Also make sure the bridge isn't leaning or angled off its feet. Is the end pin being pulled out of its hole by the tailpiece?
How old is the hair on the bow?
How old are the strings?
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
I don't think the soundpost has slippped, can't see any impressions. Bridge angle OK. End pin OK. Joints OK.
The strings that are on it now are about 8 months old but have only been played for about 2, (but they are carp ones).
The bow is brand new and has probably only been played by a few people who might have tried it out in the shop before i bought it, so the hair should be in good nick.
This morning it was fine!
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by sloth
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
Do you have fine tuners on the tailpiece? If so, make sure they aren't touching the top of the fiddle (which can happen if you screw them down too tight).
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by Will CPT
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
My advice would be rub the strings down with meths, but be careful not to drip any onto the varnish! It really brought my strings back to life
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by snowyowl
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
I was having a very similar problem a few weeks ago. Brand new coda bow, worked great for a few weeks then I just couldn't get a grip on the strings. I tried new strings and a number of different types of Rosin, in the end it just sort of worked itself out. I think what i ended up doing was putting far too much rosin on the bow the more frustrated I became with the slipping which just led to making the problem worse.
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by jasten
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
Sound as though you have some open seams. Tap the edges and see if you hear a snapping sound, I use a leather covered ball that is glued to a stick,it's solid and won't mar the fiddle.
You can use your knockle but that gets sore.
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by cpicc
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
Another fiddle and bow that are working well would allow for some problem isolation, bow on different fiddle, fiddle with different bow.
# Posted on April 14th 2008 by TomB-R
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
Problem, i now have only one fiddle and one bow :(
# Posted on April 15th 2008 by sloth
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
If you do need to re-position the soundpost, get hold of a kilt pin. You "spear" the soundpost and work it into position that way. Much easier than fiddling (excuse the pun) with two bits of string through both "f" holes. Ernie
# Posted on April 15th 2008 by Ernie
Re: Unresponsive fiddle
I'd look at bowing technique, irrespective of whether or not the bow or strings are over-rosined, or whether the soundpost or other mechanical bits need adjusting. Btw, if changing just one string really does cause the soundpost to shift, then the services of a luthier are definitely needed, and pdq!.
Stiffness in the bowing hand/arm is a major cause of poor tone - glassy or without body - as is bowing not parallel to the bridge, or bowing over the fingerboard, or too close to the bridge, or (most important of all) not engaging the bow properly with the string. By "engaging" the string I mean the sensation of playing into the string (without a grunching sound) rather than playing on the surface, which is what can happen with a stiff bowing hand/arm.
A good player with good bowing technique will be able to get acceptable tone and response out of an indifferent instrument, but someone without good bow control won't be able to get a good tone out of even the best instruments.
Good bow control and technique can really only be taught face-to-face because there is a lot of important fine detail that is difficult or next to impossible to put into print and in any case depends on the anatomy and physiology of the individual pupil. Failing face-to-face, a good starting point is Todd Ehle's violin teaching series on YouTube. The blog http://virtualviolin.blogspot.com/ is a convenient access point.
Whatever learning route is taken, be warned. Good bowing technique doesn't arrive overnight. It takes years.
# Posted on April 15th 2008 by lazyhound