Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Try listening for the differences instead of reading about it. (And while you're at it, listen for the similarities) (And while you're at that, listen for the similarities between West Highland styles and Donegal Styles) etc etc etc
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
The one you can hear right away is the scotch snap,,
as they say in Antrim , Quick hard player short (snap) notes
they play thought the tune ,whereas the Irish would roll triplet
or slurr,, Also the Triplets are diffirent than ours...
ie, An irish triplet = 3notes some times and they would also move there fingers ie/ c# d c# | But the scots would bow 4
notes same one in a row in their - triplet,, and some times
hammer on an open string ie/ A
This is easier to show you that to right here,,
jim,,,
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
the scottish take alot of the best irish tunes and claim them as their own jenny chickens,the bog to name a few not to mention all of the jigs. Stepdancing originated in Ireland but a few Cape Bretoners seem to think that they brought it from Scotland. It actually came to cape brton via Ireland. Cape Breton has alot of Irsh descendants as well. As for the music Scottish music is a little more choppy and oftern played in minors more often to mimick bag pipes. Irish music flows and is more melodic. To add to fiddle4 's trplet idea Irish usually end a 3 with a slur to the next note too. Scottish strathespeys on the other hand are very unique to Scotland.
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
the scottish take alot of the best irish tunes and claim them as their own.
yes and the Irish take Scottish tunes,and claim them as their own.[MissMcleods Reel]springs to mind instantly.
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Fid42: I think you need to listen to more Scottish fiddle music.. I suspect the odd adjective you used is based on a very small sample of Scottish fiddle music. There you go - (he said YELLING!!!)
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Fid42 - which Scottish fiddlers, and which Irish fiddlers have you listened to which lead you to that conclusion ?
Please bear in mind that there is no one singular "Scottish" style of fiddle playing any more than there is one singular "Irish" style of fiddle playing.
"Severus" - don't look to "read" about it - listen to it. [ as "llig" says.]
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
There's a huge variety of Scottish styles.
What you sometimes get on here - apart from Kenny & Ron & MG- is a view of Scots fiddling from an Irish perspective, seen through a glass darkly
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Okay -- perhaps I need to listen to more.
I have not pursued a collection of Scottish fiddle music on CD's.
I may be basing my statement on my impression of strictly "Northern-style" Irish fiddle playing as compared with other styles. Isn't it more heavily influenced by Scottish? Also, I have heard a lot of Cape Breton fiddle playing which is more heavily influenced by Scottish playing, isn't it????
I absolutely miss the use of rolls in most Scottish fiddle playing, for one thing. Also, though I appreciate lively and fast playing, there are different kinds of "fast" -- and I don't always like the extremely fast tempo when it is all that is used -- seems as though it is conforming to "the law of how this music should be played -- at breakneck speed.
Also, I think the predominance of single bow strokes as opposed to significant use of slurring sets up a "staccatto" (I' certain I mispelled that) ambience that tires my ear out rather quickly.
Haivng said the above, I admit to being no expert at all on regional differences or Scottish fiddle playing. Perhaps I would have served myself better by *not posting* my opinion about the difference between Scoth and Irish fiddle style; but I guess I felt like wanding out onto a small "twig on the far end of the limb."
Linda
I've developed quite a strong preference for the way the Kane Sisters play. I love it. I don't know if it could be called "any pure style," as most young players don't play in a strictly pure style any more. They've had too many influences.
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
It's true that you don't hear slow rolls in Scottish music. But fast snappy rolls are common in the pipe music. It is an odd thing though that it doesn't seem to be traditional in Scotland for fiddle players to emulate the articulations of the pipes in the same way they do in Ireland. Thankfully though, all the really good younger generation (under 35ish) of Scottish fiddle players I know eschew this anomaly and readily play fast snappy rolls.
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
The great Donegal fiddler John Doherty said “There is only a paper wall between Irish and Scottish music”. And just as the Gaelic language has very diverse dialects, so does the music. And Donegal Gaelic is probably as close to the Gaelic of Uist as it is to the Gaelic of Kerry (in certain respects at least). The West Highland fiddler Alasdair Fraser, finding that traditional Scottish fiddling had largely become an insipid shadow of its former self (due to the insistence on playing everything like light-classical music), went to Donegal to learn to play reels in the Scottish style, (and to Cape Breton to learn Strathspeys.) Dividing the styles into ‘the Irish play like this…’ and ‘The Scottish play like this…’ will not yield any results that are true to the facts!
Also, I’m somewhat sceptical that all fiddle ornaments must be copying the pipes. For sure many West Highland and Donegal ornaments mimic the pipe ornaments deliberately. But close relatives of many of the other ornaments (like rolls) occur in other European fiddle traditions, not least in Scandinavia. The fiddle has been played in Ireland since the Middle Ages, before the violin was invented, and certainly before the Uilleann pipes were.
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
*The fiddle has been played in Ireland since the Middle Ages, before the violin was invented, and certainly before the Uilleann pipes were.*
Could you please clarify this statement for one who hasn't studied early music and the arrival of various musical instruments into the "third dimension." Are you saying that the form of music that makes an instrument a "violin" rather than "a fiddle" came AFTER dance music? Or are you saying that there was a predecessor of the instrument we call the violin -- something close but not quite a violin, on which fiddle music was played????
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Honor Among Thives-
This Could be said in steeling Traditional
tunes from each other + Irish , Scots,, Music.
I have be told by - Leslie craig a man who plays alot of both
Theres lots the irish stole from the scots too, Here is a wee
sample I think I've worked out for my self,,The famous Rakish Paddy
was a scots tune 1ST,, The Caber Feigh,,I think it means-
{The Deers antlers}in English From scots callic,,--and theres many more.
Its not all one way Traffic..
jim,,,,
ps
If you listen to these two tunes never mind Key diff- and speed diff-
X:4
T:Caber Feigh
M:4/4
L:1/8
K:C
G | c2 ed c2 GB | c2 GF ECCA | defe d2 A^c | d2 AG FDDB |
c2 ed c2 GB | c2 GF ECCE | DEFG ABcA | d2 AG FDD ||
f | ecgc acgc | ecgc ecce | fdad bdad | fgag fddf |
ecgc acgc | GAcd eccg | afge fde^c | d2 AG FDD |]
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
I wasnt trying to get anyone angry here but all I was saying was that I notice alot more scots playing Irish tunes than anything else. Thats not to say vise versa or anything else. The Scots do have a unique sound with their strathspey reels that make me want to tap my toe. But from a stepdance perspective the Irish have been playing dance music since the dawn of time and has influenced all other styles nevermind scottish. If you listen the early recordings of each you will clearly notice the difference making Irish music in general more melodic and danceable. Yes there are about 20 differentstyles in ireland but I am keeping this to a general overall statement.
Where I live in PEI we have strong Irish/Scottish background and everyone mixes styles a little bit.I do love scottish music as well, I am only 1 hr drive from Cape Breton.
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
there really are not that many "great" older recordings of highland fiddle playing...not like all the treasure trove of great Irish fiddling that there is around from the likes of Paddy Canny, John Doherty, et al..
it would be great if there were some recordings of say Hector MacAndrew...but there are only several tracks here and there
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
About Scottish fiddle not imitating the pipes - could that, in some styles at least, be a legacy of Baroque and Classical leanings on the part of the Gows et al. in the c18 and Scott Skinner later on?
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
In response to Linda,
The fiddle is a bowed mediaeval instrument, the immediate ancestor of the violin (which itself is just a fiddle that has been significantly redesigned and refined to make it suitable for Italian court music). In mediaeval Ireland there was also a fiddle that had three or four bowed strings plus two extra strings that were either plucked or were sympathetic resonating strings. Since the 17th century the fiddle began to be replaced by the (more refined) violin throughout Europe, but players of the old folk or traditional music still refer to the (new) violin as a fiddle (after the mediaeval instrument on which the music was originally played.)
Here’s what mediaeval fiddles looked like: http://www.gaita.co.uk/fiddle.html
There are more mediaeval fiddles at the Early Music Shop: www.e-m-s.com
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
in the tunes of the Gow's, you can definitely hear the "rough and ready" nature shining through..the Gow's were not classically trained.
Composers such as Marshall ( a true geniuos, not only musically..he was a gardener, a clockmaker, an architect....a prefect...), Mackintosh, and even Skinner were classically trained and it shows in their tunes
the fiddle did not really start to imitate the pipes until right after clearings, when pipes, kilts, and other things "Scottish" were outlawed by the English.
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Well, first of all Irish fiddling is distilled three times, while Scottish fiddling is only distilled twice. Also, Irish fiddling never uses peat when malting, so there's none of the smoky, earthy taste you get with Scottish fiddling.
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
To restate something I wrote on another post,
According to Aonghas Grant the great west highland fiddler : “In the Highlands, even to the present day, many fiddlers play the pipes and vice versa.” From: The Scots Fiddle (volume 3): Tunes, Tales and Traditions of the Western Highlands, Hebrides, Orkney and Shetland, by J.Murray Neil, page 94.
The highly pipey West Highland fiddle style may have become more pronouncedly pipey due to the 1746 ban on pipes, but, according to Alastair Hardie, the style was in existence prior to the earlier 1715 Jacobite uprising. (see Hardie’s book The Caledonian Companion, page 118). There is some dispute as to whether the bagpipes were actually banned. Recent scholarship seems to point to there having been no actual ban on the great pipes.
There's great old record by Aonghas Grant called "Angus Grant- Highland Fiddle' which is superb (but not on CD, I bought it on tape years ago) and he's got a new one I've not got yet. Aonghas Grant plays in a very old style and is wonderful to listen to. Aonghas Grant on the web: http://www.scottishfiddle.org/angusgrant/ And there are three very old tracks by west highland fiddler Donald MacDonald on the CD 'The Fiddler and His Art'
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Neddiescotus, Thank you a lot! That is fascinating information and all new to me. I don't know why I never explored this before myself, but I'm glad to have learned it.
Thank you west-coaster for the name of 'the most soulful Scottish fiddler" -- and I will try to look into that as well.
All in all, though, it's very nice that there are a number of styles of playing -- it provides for personal preferences (something for everyone) and provides fodder for arguing, indignation, a proliferation of 'ignoramuses' who haven't got it straight about all the varieties (take me for example) who need educating -- and the making of a nice discussion here -- a nice place to meet musicians from "everywhere" who lean TOWARD this type of music. I love meeting all these "players" from all over the place -- even Russia !!!
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
If anyone's interested, Aonghas Grant's CD is up on ebay almost exactly 24 hours from me posting this.[ nearly 6.00pm, Saturday,] No bids at the moment, and it's not me selling it.
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
It is interesting to note that i has been argued ha our musical sense preceded our ability to speak. Not only in terms of human culture on on the level of the individual. Oliver Sacks, in his recent book Musicaphilla, talks about studies that may indicate that that our musical sense is tied up in our ability to learn the spoken language. One of the more interesting studies he talks about shows that people who grow up learning pitch sensitive languages, such as Chinese are far more likely develop perfect pitch later in life during musical training. I have often thought about how the names of some tunes resemble the rhythm of the tune itself, Drunken Landlady comes to mind. It might be fun to speculate how the respective languages may have influenced the musical styles of the times. I can hear the “Scottish Hop” (sometime called the scotch hiccup)in the the spoken scots language. I also know that I make things up and it can be so hard to tell.
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
It is interesting to note that it has been argued that our musical sense preceded our ability to speak. Not only in terms of human culture on on the level of the individual. Oliver Sacks, in his recent book Musicaphilla, talks about studies that may indicate that that our musical sense is tied up in our ability to learn the spoken language. One of the more interesting studies he talks about shows that people who grow up learning pitch sensitive languages, such as Chinese are far more likely develop perfect pitch later in life during musical training. I have often thought about how the names of some tunes resemble the rhythm of the tune itself, Drunken Landlady comes to mind. It might be fun to speculate how the respective languages may have influenced the musical styles of the times. I can hear the “Scottish Hop” (sometime called the scotch hiccup)in the the spoke scots language. I also know that I make things up and it can be so hard to tell.
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
I'm rather surprised by the extent to which English and Irish songs (in those languages, I mean) use the same rhythms, except for the drawn-out arhythmic slow ones in Irish - though I dare say an Irish speaker could point out differences within the basic rhythms when one language or the other is sung.
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Essential musical rhythms might be sort-of biological in origin -- having their essence in the underlying mathematics of "heart function."
Mathematical intervals are certainly at the heart of melody and musical rhythms. I am TERRIBLE AT MATH -- but I love thinking about the relationship of mathematics to everything in life. I just never concentrated on learning a lot of math. I used to hate it. I don't hate it any more, but I'm not good at it. Too bad for me. It seems that perhaps "God" is a "Mathematician."
Don't some people say the universe is music made manifest???
Maybe the simple, straightforward rhythms of reels and hornpipes are "the heartbeat" expressed musically.
Wow, 38 replies! thanx for everyone! Yea to listen to is the best way to know but if you listen to records without titles even and without performers names - it's a bit diffcult to understand who is who. 'll study every link. Thanks again, people!
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
In reply to the original post:
1) be aware that "Scotch" is not used to refer to Scottish people or things other than the drink. "Scots" or "Scottish" are the usual words used. (Scots can get testy about that.)
2) the question "Scottish vs Irish" styles is obviously simplistic. There are a large number of different Scottish styles, and a like number of differen Irish styles.
If you, for example, take certain Donegal playing and compare it to certain West Highland playing, the differences are more like Johnny Dohery's "paper wall".
A lot of people equate Scottish fiddling with the semi-classical SFO style stuff.
But while visiting the West Highlands years ago I heard a fiddler named Farquar MacRae who was the polar opposite of anything "classical". His playing was perhaps a window into an entire style I'd never been exposed to.
Then there's Shetland fiddling.
And Cape Breton fiddling, which has strong Scottish roots.
The answer to your question lies in doing a lot of listening and becoming exposed to a lot of different Scottish and Irish styles.
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Very well put Richard. Farquhar was a fantastic fiddler and was a great ambassador for West Highland fiddle - his was typical of the style of fiddle here. There are many very ignorant posts on this thread but only through an unawareness of the variety of styles in Scotland AND Ireland. There are fast, slow, melodic, major, minor soulful etc tunes in both countries. To say one is this and the other is that is nonsense.
And yes, as Richard says listening is the only way to answer the question. You will make many amazing discoveries that will make a mockery of some of the daft posts above.
etc, etc, etc. You'll find many more links on these pages to give you an idea of how big and varied the Scottish scene is and also how there is no major distinction between Scottish and Irish tunes. It is more region to region rather than country v country.
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Just in case you don't know, most artists have 4 - 6 tracks on their myspace page - great way to learn about styles without having to listen to years worth or radio.
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
there is a great scholarly book about Scottish Fiddle playing in the 18th century...deals with stuff really up to the late 1700's when the Gows hit the scene...there were a lot of continental influences in Scottish music at that time...it would not be uncommon to have a program with sonatas, minuets, jigs and reels all being danced.
And we call this music "traditional" now because we are "preserving" what we think of as traditional, but at the time this music was being written, it was very progressive!
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
SWFL Fiddler
I hope this explains the Scots snap.
{Not scotch, = Irish whiskey watered down lol.}
A NURSERY RYTHME = Pop goes the weasel
X: 1
T: Irish- Pop goes the weasel
M: 6/8
R: JIG
K: D
A,|:
D2F EG2| FAF D3 |(3DCDF EEG| FGF D3 |
D2F EG2| FAF Dz2| BAB E2G| FGE D3:||
X: 2
T: Scots-Pop goes the weasel
M: 4/4
R: JIG
K: A
.E|:
Azc B<d2| c<ec Az2|(3AAA A.B2d|c<e2 A3 |
A2c B<d2| c<ec Az2|f<e.f .B2d|c<dB A3:||
Hope may Abc's are ok,,or ceolachan will
eat my face off,I'll Put these jigs in as Videos
of me playing them. In as best as I can in their
two different styles next Tuesday,,see tunes
below,,(Even These jig can show - difference..}
X: 3
T: Morrison's- Irish jig
R: jig
M: 6/8
L: 1/8
K: EDor
|
~E3 BEB|EBE AFD|~E3 BEB|dcB AFD|!
~E3 BEB|EBE AFD|~G3 FGA|BAG FED:|!
Bee fee|aee fed|Bee fee|fag fed|!
Bee fee|aee fed|gfe d2A|BAG FED|!
Bee fee|aee fed|Bee fee|faf def|!
~g3 gfe|def g2d|edc d2A|BAG FED||!
X: 4
T: Farewell to the Tay- Scots jig
R: jig
M: 6/8
L: 1/8
K:A
|:e
A>AA c>BA|e2 A f>ec|A>AA c>BA |f>ec B2 e|
A>AA c>BA|e2 A f>ec|a2 e f>ec |e>dB A2 :|
e|
a2 e f>ec|A>ce f>ec|a2 e f>ec|B>ce f2 e|
a2 e f>ec|A>ce f>ec|a2 e f>ec|e>dB A2 :||
HIPOAs his little cinematic compositions reflected the growing social complexities surrounding him, they also began to rebel against the tyranny of 4/4. ...
www.hip-oselect.com/scr.public.productdetails.asp?product_id=ba85d60d-e6bb-5ff6-1d6e-37136a254754 - 60k - Cached - Similar pages
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Scotch was in former times a perfectly acceptible way to refer to Scottish people. It is relatively recently (20th century) that this term stopped being used in this sense and became restricted to whisky. Taking offence at being called "scotch" always strikes me as taking offence just for the sake of it. I'd maybe point out that it usually means whisky nowadays, but hardly worth getting in a fuss over.
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
To think that the creeping constriction of the worlds musics by the inescapable rise of 4 (and multiples of) has anything to do with the natural rhythms of the heart beat is the same as thinking there is a "natural" tendency for boys to prefer blue and girls to prefer pink. It's mere conformity.
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Darn it...what seemed poetic and true is just....
...wrong. (Why won't the font size change so I can type that very small so noone sees it) A theory induced by bad memories of 'physical culture' and marching figures and doing lots of counting in 4. Ah well. No wonder I was no good at it!
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
There was a widely circulating "cliche" years ago in the U.S. that disco music, which dominated the radio and "club" dance floors for some time.......
was purposefully designed around the rhythm of the human heartbeat.
That kind of flipped up in my consciousness and was the basis for my "romantic" ideation about the "heartbeat and the reel."
However, for your satisfaction Ilig, I'll just come right out and admit in order to agree with you.......
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
C'mon, folk, which word of the belonging to Scotland I should use if the dictionary have three words: Scotch, Scottish, Scot's?
Scotch (in our spoken language) means the "sticky tape", "Sellotape" as well as "Scotch tape" , Whiskey is always Whiskey. "Scot's" - means "belong to the Scot people" and Scottish - adjective to it? So, for no one squabble anymore, let's use the :Styles of Scotland and Ireland".
What else.,,about the Russian folk music can say that due to the 1551 and 1648 bans on skomorokh (vagrant musicians, bearers of old pre-Christian tradition of folk culture) Slavonian people were deprived to make, play, keep native instruments.
But pipes and folk violins are typical for the Western regions of the country.
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Scots or Scottish, I Ithink is right- But I've just found out I have to go to a pub session this week in Donegal,, And strange as it
may seem their ''Scots lad's''- Great wee fiddler Stephen
Campbell anybody know them here,,Jim,,,,
see=
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
The Scottish/Scotch thing seems pretty simple. Scots don't call themselves Scotch so it's a nickname. I can't imagine many people being the slightest bit worried about it, i certainly don't mind but Scottish or Scots is the norm. Scotch is a bit like Americish or Irelander - hardly an insult but you wouldn't use it yourself.
difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
so the question is "what's the difference between Scotch and Irish fiddle styles?" where can I read about?
# Posted on February 15th 2008 by severus
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Try listening for the differences instead of reading about it. (And while you're at it, listen for the similarities) (And while you're at that, listen for the similarities between West Highland styles and Donegal Styles) etc etc etc
# Posted on February 15th 2008 by llig leahcim
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
http://www.library.yale.edu/~mkoth/fidstyle.htm
# Posted on February 15th 2008 by joesmith
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Scotch is a drink isn't it? At least that's what Scotsmen tell me...
# Posted on February 15th 2008 by Jusa Nutter Eejit
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
The one you can hear right away is the scotch snap,,
as they say in Antrim , Quick hard player short (snap) notes
they play thought the tune ,whereas the Irish would roll triplet
or slurr,, Also the Triplets are diffirent than ours...
ie, An irish triplet = 3notes some times and they would also move there fingers ie/ c# d c# | But the scots would bow 4
notes same one in a row in their - triplet,, and some times
hammer on an open string ie/ A
This is easier to show you that to right here,,
jim,,,
# Posted on February 15th 2008 by FIDDLE4
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
the scottish take alot of the best irish tunes and claim them as their own jenny chickens,the bog to name a few not to mention all of the jigs. Stepdancing originated in Ireland but a few Cape Bretoners seem to think that they brought it from Scotland. It actually came to cape brton via Ireland. Cape Breton has alot of Irsh descendants as well. As for the music Scottish music is a little more choppy and oftern played in minors more often to mimick bag pipes. Irish music flows and is more melodic. To add to fiddle4 's trplet idea Irish usually end a 3 with a slur to the next note too. Scottish strathespeys on the other hand are very unique to Scotland.
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by islanda
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Looking to get my head knocked off here:
Scottish fiddle style is more militant-sounding.
Irish fiddle style is more soulful-sounding.
This is a generalization, but to my ear, this is an applicable generalization.
LET THE YELLING BEGIN.
LInda
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by Fid42
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
the scottish take alot of the best irish tunes and claim them as their own.
yes and the Irish take Scottish tunes,and claim them as their own.[MissMcleods Reel]springs to mind instantly.
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by Rufus Jameson
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Fid42: I think you need to listen to more Scottish fiddle music.. I suspect the odd adjective you used is based on a very small sample of Scottish fiddle music. There you go - (he said YELLING!!!)
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by Ron P
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Fid42 - which Scottish fiddlers, and which Irish fiddlers have you listened to which lead you to that conclusion ?
Please bear in mind that there is no one singular "Scottish" style of fiddle playing any more than there is one singular "Irish" style of fiddle playing.
"Severus" - don't look to "read" about it - listen to it. [ as "llig" says.]
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by Kenny
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
There's a huge variety of Scottish styles.
What you sometimes get on here - apart from Kenny & Ron & MG- is a view of Scots fiddling from an Irish perspective, seen through a glass darkly
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by Bren
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Okay -- perhaps I need to listen to more.
I have not pursued a collection of Scottish fiddle music on CD's.
I may be basing my statement on my impression of strictly "Northern-style" Irish fiddle playing as compared with other styles. Isn't it more heavily influenced by Scottish? Also, I have heard a lot of Cape Breton fiddle playing which is more heavily influenced by Scottish playing, isn't it????
I absolutely miss the use of rolls in most Scottish fiddle playing, for one thing. Also, though I appreciate lively and fast playing, there are different kinds of "fast" -- and I don't always like the extremely fast tempo when it is all that is used -- seems as though it is conforming to "the law of how this music should be played -- at breakneck speed.
Also, I think the predominance of single bow strokes as opposed to significant use of slurring sets up a "staccatto" (I' certain I mispelled that) ambience that tires my ear out rather quickly.
Haivng said the above, I admit to being no expert at all on regional differences or Scottish fiddle playing. Perhaps I would have served myself better by *not posting* my opinion about the difference between Scoth and Irish fiddle style; but I guess I felt like wanding out onto a small "twig on the far end of the limb."
Linda
I've developed quite a strong preference for the way the Kane Sisters play. I love it. I don't know if it could be called "any pure style," as most young players don't play in a strictly pure style any more. They've had too many influences.
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by Fid42
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
It's true that you don't hear slow rolls in Scottish music. But fast snappy rolls are common in the pipe music. It is an odd thing though that it doesn't seem to be traditional in Scotland for fiddle players to emulate the articulations of the pipes in the same way they do in Ireland. Thankfully though, all the really good younger generation (under 35ish) of Scottish fiddle players I know eschew this anomaly and readily play fast snappy rolls.
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by llig leahcim
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
The great Donegal fiddler John Doherty said “There is only a paper wall between Irish and Scottish music”. And just as the Gaelic language has very diverse dialects, so does the music. And Donegal Gaelic is probably as close to the Gaelic of Uist as it is to the Gaelic of Kerry (in certain respects at least). The West Highland fiddler Alasdair Fraser, finding that traditional Scottish fiddling had largely become an insipid shadow of its former self (due to the insistence on playing everything like light-classical music), went to Donegal to learn to play reels in the Scottish style, (and to Cape Breton to learn Strathspeys.) Dividing the styles into ‘the Irish play like this…’ and ‘The Scottish play like this…’ will not yield any results that are true to the facts!
Also, I’m somewhat sceptical that all fiddle ornaments must be copying the pipes. For sure many West Highland and Donegal ornaments mimic the pipe ornaments deliberately. But close relatives of many of the other ornaments (like rolls) occur in other European fiddle traditions, not least in Scandinavia. The fiddle has been played in Ireland since the Middle Ages, before the violin was invented, and certainly before the Uilleann pipes were.
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by neddiescotus
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
*The fiddle has been played in Ireland since the Middle Ages, before the violin was invented, and certainly before the Uilleann pipes were.*
Could you please clarify this statement for one who hasn't studied early music and the arrival of various musical instruments into the "third dimension." Are you saying that the form of music that makes an instrument a "violin" rather than "a fiddle" came AFTER dance music? Or are you saying that there was a predecessor of the instrument we call the violin -- something close but not quite a violin, on which fiddle music was played????
Thanks.
Linda
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by Fid42
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Yes,Scottish fiddle style.Scotch is a drink.
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by dafydd
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Honor Among Thives-
This Could be said in steeling Traditional
tunes from each other + Irish , Scots,, Music.
I have be told by - Leslie craig a man who plays alot of both
Theres lots the irish stole from the scots too, Here is a wee
sample I think I've worked out for my self,,The famous Rakish Paddy
was a scots tune 1ST,, The Caber Feigh,,I think it means-
{The Deers antlers}in English From scots callic,,--and theres many more.
Its not all one way Traffic..
jim,,,,
ps
If you listen to these two tunes never mind Key diff- and speed diff-
X:4
T:Caber Feigh
M:4/4
L:1/8
K:C
G | c2 ed c2 GB | c2 GF ECCA | defe d2 A^c | d2 AG FDDB |
c2 ed c2 GB | c2 GF ECCE | DEFG ABcA | d2 AG FDD ||
f | ecgc acgc | ecgc ecce | fdad bdad | fgag fddf |
ecgc acgc | GAcd eccg | afge fde^c | d2 AG FDD |]
X:1
T:Rakish Paddy
R:reel
M:C|
L:1/8
K:D
(=cBc).d cBAB|=cAGF EFGc|Ad{e}dc defe|dcAG FGAB|
=cedB cBAB|cAGF EDCE|DEFG ABce|d=cAG FD D2||
eg"~"g2 agfg|efgf e=c ="~"c2|ea "#~"a2 b^gag|eaag ((3efg) dg|
eg "~"g2 agfg|efge defg|afge fdec|dcAG FD D2||
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by FIDDLE4
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
PS_
T:Caber Feigh is Hornpipe..
jim,,,
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by FIDDLE4
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
I wasnt trying to get anyone angry here but all I was saying was that I notice alot more scots playing Irish tunes than anything else. Thats not to say vise versa or anything else. The Scots do have a unique sound with their strathspey reels that make me want to tap my toe. But from a stepdance perspective the Irish have been playing dance music since the dawn of time and has influenced all other styles nevermind scottish. If you listen the early recordings of each you will clearly notice the difference making Irish music in general more melodic and danceable. Yes there are about 20 differentstyles in ireland but I am keeping this to a general overall statement.
Where I live in PEI we have strong Irish/Scottish background and everyone mixes styles a little bit.I do love scottish music as well, I am only 1 hr drive from Cape Breton.
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by islanda
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Fid42: listen to the Scottish player Duncan Chisholm - a more soulful player of any fiddling style you'll never find.
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by west-coaster
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
I find Alistair Fraser's playing more pan-celtic than highland...he plays with a really nice tone...but it is not necessarily Highland...
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by Sunnybear
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
there really are not that many "great" older recordings of highland fiddle playing...not like all the treasure trove of great Irish fiddling that there is around from the likes of Paddy Canny, John Doherty, et al..
it would be great if there were some recordings of say Hector MacAndrew...but there are only several tracks here and there
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by Sunnybear
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
About Scottish fiddle not imitating the pipes - could that, in some styles at least, be a legacy of Baroque and Classical leanings on the part of the Gows et al. in the c18 and Scott Skinner later on?
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by nicholas
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
In response to Linda,
The fiddle is a bowed mediaeval instrument, the immediate ancestor of the violin (which itself is just a fiddle that has been significantly redesigned and refined to make it suitable for Italian court music). In mediaeval Ireland there was also a fiddle that had three or four bowed strings plus two extra strings that were either plucked or were sympathetic resonating strings. Since the 17th century the fiddle began to be replaced by the (more refined) violin throughout Europe, but players of the old folk or traditional music still refer to the (new) violin as a fiddle (after the mediaeval instrument on which the music was originally played.)
Here’s what mediaeval fiddles looked like: http://www.gaita.co.uk/fiddle.html
There are more mediaeval fiddles at the Early Music Shop: www.e-m-s.com
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by neddiescotus
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
in the tunes of the Gow's, you can definitely hear the "rough and ready" nature shining through..the Gow's were not classically trained.
Composers such as Marshall ( a true geniuos, not only musically..he was a gardener, a clockmaker, an architect....a prefect...), Mackintosh, and even Skinner were classically trained and it shows in their tunes
the fiddle did not really start to imitate the pipes until right after clearings, when pipes, kilts, and other things "Scottish" were outlawed by the English.
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by Sunnybear
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Well, first of all Irish fiddling is distilled three times, while Scottish fiddling is only distilled twice. Also, Irish fiddling never uses peat when malting, so there's none of the smoky, earthy taste you get with Scottish fiddling.
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
...but seriously folks, I'm going to go listen for the "Scotch Snap".
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
To restate something I wrote on another post,
According to Aonghas Grant the great west highland fiddler : “In the Highlands, even to the present day, many fiddlers play the pipes and vice versa.” From: The Scots Fiddle (volume 3): Tunes, Tales and Traditions of the Western Highlands, Hebrides, Orkney and Shetland, by J.Murray Neil, page 94.
The highly pipey West Highland fiddle style may have become more pronouncedly pipey due to the 1746 ban on pipes, but, according to Alastair Hardie, the style was in existence prior to the earlier 1715 Jacobite uprising. (see Hardie’s book The Caledonian Companion, page 118). There is some dispute as to whether the bagpipes were actually banned. Recent scholarship seems to point to there having been no actual ban on the great pipes.
There's great old record by Aonghas Grant called "Angus Grant- Highland Fiddle' which is superb (but not on CD, I bought it on tape years ago) and he's got a new one I've not got yet. Aonghas Grant plays in a very old style and is wonderful to listen to. Aonghas Grant on the web: http://www.scottishfiddle.org/angusgrant/ And there are three very old tracks by west highland fiddler Donald MacDonald on the CD 'The Fiddler and His Art'
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by neddiescotus
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Neddiescotus, Thank you a lot! That is fascinating information and all new to me. I don't know why I never explored this before myself, but I'm glad to have learned it.
Thank you west-coaster for the name of 'the most soulful Scottish fiddler" -- and I will try to look into that as well.
All in all, though, it's very nice that there are a number of styles of playing -- it provides for personal preferences (something for everyone) and provides fodder for arguing, indignation, a proliferation of 'ignoramuses' who haven't got it straight about all the varieties (take me for example) who need educating -- and the making of a nice discussion here -- a nice place to meet musicians from "everywhere" who lean TOWARD this type of music. I love meeting all these "players" from all over the place -- even Russia !!!
Linda
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by Fid42
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
If anyone's interested, Aonghas Grant's CD is up on ebay almost exactly 24 hours from me posting this.[ nearly 6.00pm, Saturday,] No bids at the moment, and it's not me selling it.
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by Kenny
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Islanda first post is almost funny it's so packed with ignorance.
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by Bogman
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
My God, so is your second post. I have to assume you visit Ireland and Scotland pretty infrequently.
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by Bogman
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
It is interesting to note that i has been argued ha our musical sense preceded our ability to speak. Not only in terms of human culture on on the level of the individual. Oliver Sacks, in his recent book Musicaphilla, talks about studies that may indicate that that our musical sense is tied up in our ability to learn the spoken language. One of the more interesting studies he talks about shows that people who grow up learning pitch sensitive languages, such as Chinese are far more likely develop perfect pitch later in life during musical training. I have often thought about how the names of some tunes resemble the rhythm of the tune itself, Drunken Landlady comes to mind. It might be fun to speculate how the respective languages may have influenced the musical styles of the times. I can hear the “Scottish Hop” (sometime called the scotch hiccup)in the the spoken scots language. I also know that I make things up and it can be so hard to tell.
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by toumi
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
It is interesting to note that it has been argued that our musical sense preceded our ability to speak. Not only in terms of human culture on on the level of the individual. Oliver Sacks, in his recent book Musicaphilla, talks about studies that may indicate that that our musical sense is tied up in our ability to learn the spoken language. One of the more interesting studies he talks about shows that people who grow up learning pitch sensitive languages, such as Chinese are far more likely develop perfect pitch later in life during musical training. I have often thought about how the names of some tunes resemble the rhythm of the tune itself, Drunken Landlady comes to mind. It might be fun to speculate how the respective languages may have influenced the musical styles of the times. I can hear the “Scottish Hop” (sometime called the scotch hiccup)in the the spoke scots language. I also know that I make things up and it can be so hard to tell.
reposted to fix the typos
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by toumi
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
I'm rather surprised by the extent to which English and Irish songs (in those languages, I mean) use the same rhythms, except for the drawn-out arhythmic slow ones in Irish - though I dare say an Irish speaker could point out differences within the basic rhythms when one language or the other is sung.
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by nicholas
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Essential musical rhythms might be sort-of biological in origin -- having their essence in the underlying mathematics of "heart function."
Mathematical intervals are certainly at the heart of melody and musical rhythms. I am TERRIBLE AT MATH -- but I love thinking about the relationship of mathematics to everything in life. I just never concentrated on learning a lot of math. I used to hate it. I don't hate it any more, but I'm not good at it. Too bad for me. It seems that perhaps "God" is a "Mathematician."
Don't some people say the universe is music made manifest???
Maybe the simple, straightforward rhythms of reels and hornpipes are "the heartbeat" expressed musically.
Ouch, I just tied my brain up in a major knot.
Linda
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by Fid42
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Makes you wonder what bizarre heart conditions must be endemic to the people of the Balkans...
# Posted on February 16th 2008 by nicholas
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
The "so called" simple, straightforward rhythms of reels and hornpipes are nothing more than the global tyrany of "4".
# Posted on February 17th 2008 by llig leahcim
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Please explain WHY there IS a global tyranny of "4" -- then .....
I don't really undestand what you are getting at here (although I could venture a guess -- I won't -- perhaps you will just TELL US.
Linda
# Posted on February 17th 2008 by Fid42
Thanx a lot!!!
Wow, 38 replies! thanx for everyone! Yea to listen to is the best way to know but if you listen to records without titles even and without performers names - it's a bit diffcult to understand who is who. 'll study every link. Thanks again, people!
# Posted on February 17th 2008 by severus
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
In reply to the original post:
1) be aware that "Scotch" is not used to refer to Scottish people or things other than the drink. "Scots" or "Scottish" are the usual words used. (Scots can get testy about that.)
2) the question "Scottish vs Irish" styles is obviously simplistic. There are a large number of different Scottish styles, and a like number of differen Irish styles.
If you, for example, take certain Donegal playing and compare it to certain West Highland playing, the differences are more like Johnny Dohery's "paper wall".
A lot of people equate Scottish fiddling with the semi-classical SFO style stuff.
But while visiting the West Highlands years ago I heard a fiddler named Farquar MacRae who was the polar opposite of anything "classical". His playing was perhaps a window into an entire style I'd never been exposed to.
Then there's Shetland fiddling.
And Cape Breton fiddling, which has strong Scottish roots.
The answer to your question lies in doing a lot of listening and becoming exposed to a lot of different Scottish and Irish styles.
# Posted on February 17th 2008 by Richard D Cook
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Very well put Richard. Farquhar was a fantastic fiddler and was a great ambassador for West Highland fiddle - his was typical of the style of fiddle here. There are many very ignorant posts on this thread but only through an unawareness of the variety of styles in Scotland AND Ireland. There are fast, slow, melodic, major, minor soulful etc tunes in both countries. To say one is this and the other is that is nonsense.
And yes, as Richard says listening is the only way to answer the question. You will make many amazing discoveries that will make a mockery of some of the daft posts above.
Myspace is good for tasters. Try
http://www.myspace.com/daimh
http://www.myspace.com/sessiona9
http://www.myspace.com/oldblinddogs
http://www.myspace.com/backofthemoon
http://www.myspace.com/theannamassieband
http://www.myspace.com/breabach
etc, etc, etc. You'll find many more links on these pages to give you an idea of how big and varied the Scottish scene is and also how there is no major distinction between Scottish and Irish tunes. It is more region to region rather than country v country.
# Posted on February 17th 2008 by Bogman
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Just in case you don't know, most artists have 4 - 6 tracks on their myspace page - great way to learn about styles without having to listen to years worth or radio.
# Posted on February 17th 2008 by Bogman
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
And some Irish bands...
http://www.myspace.com/lunasaofficial
http://www.myspace.com/lochaltan
http://www.myspace.com/sharonshannon
http://www.myspace.com/gradamusic
http://www.myspace.com/beoga
http://www.myspace.com/atfirstlightmusic
and for a combination of both, combination of Uillean pipes and Scottish Border pipes try the amazing
http://www.myspace.com/rossandjarlath
# Posted on February 17th 2008 by Bogman
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Skinner wrote "The Mathematician"...not God..
oh...wait a minute....
# Posted on February 17th 2008 by Sunnybear
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
there is a great scholarly book about Scottish Fiddle playing in the 18th century...deals with stuff really up to the late 1700's when the Gows hit the scene...there were a lot of continental influences in Scottish music at that time...it would not be uncommon to have a program with sonatas, minuets, jigs and reels all being danced.
And we call this music "traditional" now because we are "preserving" what we think of as traditional, but at the time this music was being written, it was very progressive!
# Posted on February 17th 2008 by Sunnybear
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
SWFL Fiddler
I hope this explains the Scots snap.
{Not scotch, = Irish whiskey watered down lol.}
A NURSERY RYTHME = Pop goes the weasel
X: 1
T: Irish- Pop goes the weasel
M: 6/8
R: JIG
K: D
A,|:
D2F EG2| FAF D3 |(3DCDF EEG| FGF D3 |
D2F EG2| FAF Dz2| BAB E2G| FGE D3:||
X: 2
T: Scots-Pop goes the weasel
M: 4/4
R: JIG
K: A
.E|:
Azc B<d2| c<ec Az2|(3AAA A.B2d|c<e2 A3 |
A2c B<d2| c<ec Az2|f<e.f .B2d|c<dB A3:||
Hope may Abc's are ok,,or ceolachan will
eat my face off,I'll Put these jigs in as Videos
of me playing them. In as best as I can in their
two different styles next Tuesday,,see tunes
below,,(Even These jig can show - difference..}
X: 3
T: Morrison's- Irish jig
R: jig
M: 6/8
L: 1/8
K: EDor
|
~E3 BEB|EBE AFD|~E3 BEB|dcB AFD|!
~E3 BEB|EBE AFD|~G3 FGA|BAG FED:|!
Bee fee|aee fed|Bee fee|fag fed|!
Bee fee|aee fed|gfe d2A|BAG FED|!
Bee fee|aee fed|Bee fee|faf def|!
~g3 gfe|def g2d|edc d2A|BAG FED||!
X: 4
T: Farewell to the Tay- Scots jig
R: jig
M: 6/8
L: 1/8
K:A
|:e
A>AA c>BA|e2 A f>ec|A>AA c>BA |f>ec B2 e|
A>AA c>BA|e2 A f>ec|a2 e f>ec |e>dB A2 :|
e|
a2 e f>ec|A>ce f>ec|a2 e f>ec|B>ce f2 e|
a2 e f>ec|A>ce f>ec|a2 e f>ec|e>dB A2 :||
# Posted on February 17th 2008 by FIDDLE4
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
I still want to know what "The Tyranny of 4" is!!!!
Linda
# Posted on February 17th 2008 by Fid42
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Fid42
"The Tyranny of 4"
I googled it - I think its something
to do with 4/4 Time ??????????
jim,,,
http://books.google.com/books?id=h0HOAgm4FRMC&pg=PA90&lpg=PA90&dq=%22the+tyranny+of+4%22&source=web&ots=invlaVEvws&sig=WlT87fvhDFxDzIIfEIdH7fstg6o
HIPOAs his little cinematic compositions reflected the growing social complexities surrounding him, they also began to rebel against the tyranny of 4/4. ...
www.hip-oselect.com/scr.public.productdetails.asp?product_id=ba85d60d-e6bb-5ff6-1d6e-37136a254754 - 60k - Cached - Similar pages
# Posted on February 18th 2008 by FIDDLE4
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Scotch was in former times a perfectly acceptible way to refer to Scottish people. It is relatively recently (20th century) that this term stopped being used in this sense and became restricted to whisky. Taking offence at being called "scotch" always strikes me as taking offence just for the sake of it. I'd maybe point out that it usually means whisky nowadays, but hardly worth getting in a fuss over.
- Chris
# Posted on February 18th 2008 by ramblingpitchfork
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Thanks -- I figured it would have something to do with the connection between social "classes" and artistic expression.
# Posted on February 18th 2008 by Fid42
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
ramblingpitchfork = I quite agree,,
Scotch Vs Scottish
To quote an english guy-
''Much Ado About Nothing''
jim,,,
# Posted on February 18th 2008 by FIDDLE4
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Thankyou all,
I think that you have perambulated masterfully around the two most asked queries I ever get as a year long fiddlin' convert! Bravo!
# Posted on February 18th 2008 by fiddlebd
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Actually add a third...Scots versus Scottish, Diff between Scottish n Irish music and Diff between a fiddle n violin!
# Posted on February 18th 2008 by fiddlebd
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
To think that the creeping constriction of the worlds musics by the inescapable rise of 4 (and multiples of) has anything to do with the natural rhythms of the heart beat is the same as thinking there is a "natural" tendency for boys to prefer blue and girls to prefer pink. It's mere conformity.
# Posted on February 18th 2008 by llig leahcim
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
The heart is in swing time...
# Posted on February 18th 2008 by ceolachan
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Conformity and uniformity Michael...you can march to 4....but you have to skip or waltz to three's......and noone ever goes skipping off to war......
# Posted on February 18th 2008 by TheCurvyFiddle
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
You march to two.
# Posted on February 18th 2008 by llig leahcim
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
& three too...
# Posted on February 18th 2008 by ceolachan
Difference between scotch and irish style
I play this often. Check out the comments;
http://www.thesession.org/tunes/display/2923
'Battle of Somme'
# Posted on February 18th 2008 by Random_notes
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Darn it...what seemed poetic and true is just....
...wrong. (Why won't the font size change so I can type that very small so noone sees it)
A theory induced by bad memories of 'physical culture' and marching figures and doing lots of counting in 4. Ah well. No wonder I was no good at it!
# Posted on February 18th 2008 by TheCurvyFiddle
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
To think that the creeping constriction of the worlds musics by the inescapable rise of 4 (and multiples of)
What are you talking about? Honestly????
Or do you know????
Linda
# Posted on February 18th 2008 by Fid42
Skipping to scotch and irish fiddle
TheCurvyFiddle I can think of a war or 2, 3, or 4
worth skipping. ;)
Or more . . .
# Posted on February 18th 2008 by Random_notes
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
There was a widely circulating "cliche" years ago in the U.S. that disco music, which dominated the radio and "club" dance floors for some time.......
was purposefully designed around the rhythm of the human heartbeat.
That kind of flipped up in my consciousness and was the basis for my "romantic" ideation about the "heartbeat and the reel."
However, for your satisfaction Ilig, I'll just come right out and admit in order to agree with you.......
I AM DOWNRIGHT STUPID, IN FACT, I'M DUMB.
Do you feel complete now???
Linda
# Posted on February 18th 2008 by Fid42
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Who needs the tyranny of 4 when you can have the joy of 6
# Posted on February 19th 2008 by Bogman
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
C'mon, folk, which word of the belonging to Scotland I should use if the dictionary have three words: Scotch, Scottish, Scot's?
Scotch (in our spoken language) means the "sticky tape", "Sellotape" as well as "Scotch tape" , Whiskey is always Whiskey. "Scot's" - means "belong to the Scot people" and Scottish - adjective to it? So, for no one squabble anymore, let's use the :Styles of Scotland and Ireland".
What else.,,about the Russian folk music can say that due to the 1551 and 1648 bans on skomorokh (vagrant musicians, bearers of old pre-Christian tradition of folk culture) Slavonian people were deprived to make, play, keep native instruments.
But pipes and folk violins are typical for the Western regions of the country.
# Posted on February 19th 2008 by severus
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Scots or Scottish, I Ithink is right- But I've just found out I have to go to a pub session this week in Donegal,, And strange as it
may seem their ''Scots lad's''- Great wee fiddler Stephen
Campbell anybody know them here,,Jim,,,,
see=
http://www.irishmusicreview.com/smithcampbell.htm
# Posted on February 19th 2008 by FIDDLE4
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Yeah, why am I arguing about pink and blue, 4 and 6? Duh.
It's not worth it. I don't really enjoy arguing -- I do enjoy conversing.
I have to become more "aware" of the pugilistic direction some of these 'dicussions' can veer in to -- and just quietly slip away for a while
Linda
# Posted on February 19th 2008 by Fid42
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
Yeah, Whiskey is always Whiskey ... in Ireland. But it's Whisky in the land of Scotch.
Hence diddley music and it's near relative, diddly music
# Posted on February 19th 2008 by llig leahcim
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
And the Spy in Spate, yeah?
# Posted on February 19th 2008 by Steve Shaw
Re: difference between scotch and irish fiddle style
The Scottish/Scotch thing seems pretty simple. Scots don't call themselves Scotch so it's a nickname. I can't imagine many people being the slightest bit worried about it, i certainly don't mind but Scottish or Scots is the norm. Scotch is a bit like Americish or Irelander - hardly an insult but you wouldn't use it yourself.
# Posted on February 19th 2008 by Bogman