I've been a member here for a number of years and have read of discussions about open and closed sessions in Ireland. There are four of us going over in June and I want to avoid the embarrassment of carrying in a mandolin (leaving the hammered dulcimer home. . . .let the jokes begin!) into a session where the circle is closed. Has anyone done a survey or have a list of sessions that are open? Obviously before barging in and insisting we play Maid Behind the Bar for the umteenth time I'd also make an effort to contact the pub for a tune list or really know the top 100 from this site.
You won't find a list that stays the same, sometimes from one month to the next, so ...
Best bet, I've found over many years, is to get yourself over there, try and find out where a session is - any session, any type - then ask if they mind you joining them. If it's closed, firstly it's usually obvious (maybe a 'stage' or staged area or presence of big-name star(s) etc), and secondly, they'll tell you and direct you to a more appropriate session for what you want. 9 times out of ten, it's open in any case.
Asking is expected, and well-nigh everyone is as friendly as you could possibly want.
We're starting out in Limerick, heading to Cork then up the west Coast to Antrium. Hope to meet up with Ptarmigan the middle of June and hammer out a few issues (tunes)
Firstly there are no hundred most commonly played tunes in sessions in Ireland as the "most common" will vary from region to region and indeed from night to night.The publican generally won't have a clue either. There are usually more sessions in the summer months than the winter time so I wouldn't pay much attention to sessions listed here and some could be gone and new ones started by then.
Joining in sessions in Ireland is mostly about common sense.
When you enter a session pub, always sit on the outside of the circle/gathering. Never ever sit into a vacant seat in the centre of it, no matter how attractive this seems( this will avoid you taking a seat belonging to or reserved for a local or better musician.
Always wait to be asked to play and if you are not asked, painful as it might be, the truth is those particular musicans don't want or need you to play with them.
After sitting down, place your instrument case on the floor and listen. If for example, you hear loads of tunes you have never heard before being played or tunes known to you being played in unusual keys, then you can take it that you are possibly out of your depth repetoire and/or talent wise and the best thing to do is either listen and learn or go somewhere else. If you are asked, then by all means play a tune you are comfortable with and if it is played well, you will be given credit no matter how simple the tune might be considered.
If on the other hand you hear Saddle The Pony, Donnybrook Fair, Maid Behind The Bar (I use these as an example of tunes considered beginner's tunes and not to belittle them in any way)and similar being played then you are in with a chance. Still wait to be asked.
Keeping to be these guidelines no matter how unexciting they might be, will mean that you will steer the safest course through the session world and whether a session is open or closed won't matter as the above will be good for either. There was a discussion about the changing face of sessions in Ireland on another forum recently and some where a tad upset to gather that whilst people in Ireland are generally as welcoming and friendly as other nations, landing in to sessions and playing uninvited etc is not liked. Remembering to treat sessions as if they were already existing games of basketball/football etc and that you couldn't just land on the court/pitch and expect to be welcomed with open arms will do it.
Find a decent pub with no music. Open the box and start playing - word will get around there is a session and the musician-magnet will click into action.
concertinaplayer made some great points I'll remember. I once asked David James, a HD player how he got into sessions in Ireland. He said something about just bringing in his instrument, A rather large hammered dulcimer until enough people asked what could possibly be that weird in shape. In the three days or so he'd taken in the local tunes so could play with the rest of them. I asked how much sleep he got during that time. . .he said not a lot. Nights listening and days practicing.
Wish I could spend that much time in any one place but my three compatriots (especially my wife) would probably ditch me. Hummm. . . That's a bad thing?
Hmm... I´m not sure that I agree with concertinaplayer on this -
In my experience they are rather relaxed about session etiquette in Ireland, and they don´t necessarily play by strict rules or formulas.
Once you have established that it is in fact an "open session" and also double checked with a polite entry "mind if I join" then I see no point in sitting there with your hands tied if the ball is passed in your direction with a session-friendly tune.
Although I agree with concertinaplayer that this may be a safe way to enter the session world, I would not bet my flight ticket that the hosts are aware of your situation and chances are that you will be waiting a long while for the "open sesame" words. Why not join in?
Knowing that you have the ability to contribute in a positive manner I certainly would not sit there "still waiting to be asked"
Every session in every pub is different, some are more welcoming than others, it also depends on the amount of drink taken so many variables its not really possible to generalise.
The friendliest sesh will look askance at you if, after your polite request, may I join you for a few tunes, you proceed to play poorly and insist on doing so for the rest of the evening!. While you can sit down in a 'closed' session, do you mind if I play a tune? play like the Divil himself and be made welcome! The closed front is often simply there as self protection,Its simple, how good are you? when you finished put your instrument down , if they still want you to play, they will ask you.
A bunch of you is a different matter, you could easily take over a sesh. So if there is enough of you to form a quorum. then i concurr with Geoff, play a couple of nights in one pub which has no wide screen, or,if you find an active sesh, dont take over, whether you are all loads better than the session regulars or not, its their session, respect that.
Regarding waiting: I usually listen long enough to determine if the session is above my head or not before asking if I can "join in." Then I only play tunes I know (no noodling on tunes I don't know or only half know) and I wait for an invatation before starting any tunes. If they're catting between tunes I don't make the mistake of assuming this is a place where I should volunteer to start a tune either.
Just go and play. There is no need to fear, anyone takes umbrage tell them not to be so boorish and stick the head in them. Works all the time.
We play in Antrim Town, on the way to Ptarms, on a Sunday night, in a pub called Barneys. Easy to find, you see boorish people staggering out all the time with broken noses.
I quite agree with BB. Just join in and get it over with. If they really do not want any drop-ins, they will let you know, and likely it will be civil. If not, feel free to express yourself.
I remember walking into an establishment, heard the music, unpacked, jumped right in, and, sadly, was made to feel rather uncomfortable by the other musicians.
I simply packed up, stood up, and left, although I did take the time to mention that I thought it was a lot of dancers and musicians for such a small stage, and I did not think bolero hats and glitter were particularly Irish.
most sessions I know of would be baffled if you contacted them beforehand and asked for a tune list.
concertinaplayer's advice is good on how to steer the safest course but who wants to always steer the safest course? A mandolin is the least obtrusive of instruments and you'd be hard pushed to offend anybody with one (believe me, I've tried, --- and I suspect succeeded once or twice).
Thing is, at first you could hear some really good musicians playing obscure tunes and think "this is out of my league" and then later on, in comes the main body of players and starts to play stuff that you know. Or vice versa. It's not like there's a set programme. Or is there? Maybe I should get with it. And if you do hear "Maid Behind the Bar", fine Scottish tune that it is, then it's too late. By the time you get your instrument out, they'll be onto something else.
And sometimes the seat you take on the outside of the circle could end up in the middle as folk move around. Or it might be a square or L-shape and no circle at all.
Having said that, I'm a real coward and tend to walk in to a strange pub without an instrument and have a drink first to check it out. or if I've nowhere to leave my instrument, walk in and put it down near the bar as if I've just come from a gig, or a squash game, and have a desperate thirst from all that hard work. That way you can suss things out and they can suss you out too. One thing's for sure, if you're the sort of person who never normally drinks in a pub but just goes there cos you've heard that's where "ITM" is played, you'll stick out a mile whether you realise it or not. Whatever, the key is to use a pub for what it's there for, talk to people, socialise, break the ice and you'll soon be among friends and maybe even play a tune or two with them.
most sessions in ireland are payed gigs which consist of about 3-4 people, but there is no problem joining in as long as you ask, depening on what instrument you play. joining in with a guitar when there is already one there is usually a no unless you are asked. do not take from the music however. stay out of tunes etc and i suppose it does matter how much drink one has taken.
best of luck
I joined in at Molloy's in Westport playing a block of wood. Yes, a block of wood, with a tipper. No-one said a word, apart from a load of amazed punters who seemed to think this was wonderful.
We sometimes have a mere 5 guitarists so another one is always welcome. And a mandolin would be really welcome.
Have you got a special case and carry bag for your block of wood bb? do you have long discussions with other block of wood players about who made your block and how you got him to customise it?
I have long maintained on here that the best percussion I ever heard was modest Limerick man Paddy Sullivan rattling two biros off the edge of a desk in a cabin of an oil rig moored in the Tyne at South Shields. A lump of laminate you might say. If I remember rightly, his father made bodhrans, skun the goat himself and buried the skin with lime.
Sessioning it in Ireland
Sessioning it in Ireland
I've been a member here for a number of years and have read of discussions about open and closed sessions in Ireland. There are four of us going over in June and I want to avoid the embarrassment of carrying in a mandolin (leaving the hammered dulcimer home. . . .let the jokes begin!) into a session where the circle is closed. Has anyone done a survey or have a list of sessions that are open? Obviously before barging in and insisting we play Maid Behind the Bar for the umteenth time I'd also make an effort to contact the pub for a tune list or really know the top 100 from this site.
Any comments?
# Posted on January 13th 2008 by jrathbun
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
Perhaps in my years of being a member of this august group I might have clicked on the sessions tab then done a search. Nice utility.
# Posted on January 13th 2008 by jrathbun
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
You won't find a list that stays the same, sometimes from one month to the next, so ...
Best bet, I've found over many years, is to get yourself over there, try and find out where a session is - any session, any type - then ask if they mind you joining them. If it's closed, firstly it's usually obvious (maybe a 'stage' or staged area or presence of big-name star(s) etc), and secondly, they'll tell you and direct you to a more appropriate session for what you want. 9 times out of ten, it's open in any case.
Asking is expected, and well-nigh everyone is as friendly as you could possibly want.
# Posted on January 13th 2008 by benhall.1
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
Any particular area you are heading to?
# Posted on January 13th 2008 by jig
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
We're starting out in Limerick, heading to Cork then up the west Coast to Antrium. Hope to meet up with Ptarmigan the middle of June and hammer out a few issues (tunes)
# Posted on January 13th 2008 by jrathbun
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
Firstly there are no hundred most commonly played tunes in sessions in Ireland as the "most common" will vary from region to region and indeed from night to night.The publican generally won't have a clue either. There are usually more sessions in the summer months than the winter time so I wouldn't pay much attention to sessions listed here and some could be gone and new ones started by then.
Joining in sessions in Ireland is mostly about common sense.
When you enter a session pub, always sit on the outside of the circle/gathering. Never ever sit into a vacant seat in the centre of it, no matter how attractive this seems( this will avoid you taking a seat belonging to or reserved for a local or better musician.
Always wait to be asked to play and if you are not asked, painful as it might be, the truth is those particular musicans don't want or need you to play with them.
After sitting down, place your instrument case on the floor and listen. If for example, you hear loads of tunes you have never heard before being played or tunes known to you being played in unusual keys, then you can take it that you are possibly out of your depth repetoire and/or talent wise and the best thing to do is either listen and learn or go somewhere else. If you are asked, then by all means play a tune you are comfortable with and if it is played well, you will be given credit no matter how simple the tune might be considered.
If on the other hand you hear Saddle The Pony, Donnybrook Fair, Maid Behind The Bar (I use these as an example of tunes considered beginner's tunes and not to belittle them in any way)and similar being played then you are in with a chance. Still wait to be asked.
Keeping to be these guidelines no matter how unexciting they might be, will mean that you will steer the safest course through the session world and whether a session is open or closed won't matter as the above will be good for either. There was a discussion about the changing face of sessions in Ireland on another forum recently and some where a tad upset to gather that whilst people in Ireland are generally as welcoming and friendly as other nations, landing in to sessions and playing uninvited etc is not liked. Remembering to treat sessions as if they were already existing games of basketball/football etc and that you couldn't just land on the court/pitch and expect to be welcomed with open arms will do it.
# Posted on January 13th 2008 by concertinaplayer
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
Find a decent pub with no music. Open the box and start playing - word will get around there is a session and the musician-magnet will click into action.
# Posted on January 13th 2008 by geoffwright
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
concertinaplayer made some great points I'll remember. I once asked David James, a HD player how he got into sessions in Ireland. He said something about just bringing in his instrument, A rather large hammered dulcimer until enough people asked what could possibly be that weird in shape. In the three days or so he'd taken in the local tunes so could play with the rest of them. I asked how much sleep he got during that time. . .he said not a lot. Nights listening and days practicing.
Wish I could spend that much time in any one place but my three compatriots (especially my wife) would probably ditch me. Hummm. . . That's a bad thing?
# Posted on January 13th 2008 by jrathbun
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
Hmm... I´m not sure that I agree with concertinaplayer on this -
In my experience they are rather relaxed about session etiquette in Ireland, and they don´t necessarily play by strict rules or formulas.
Once you have established that it is in fact an "open session" and also double checked with a polite entry "mind if I join" then I see no point in sitting there with your hands tied if the ball is passed in your direction with a session-friendly tune.
Although I agree with concertinaplayer that this may be a safe way to enter the session world, I would not bet my flight ticket that the hosts are aware of your situation and chances are that you will be waiting a long while for the "open sesame" words. Why not join in?
Knowing that you have the ability to contribute in a positive manner I certainly would not sit there "still waiting to be asked"
# Posted on January 13th 2008 by MrGanAim
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
Every session in every pub is different, some are more welcoming than others, it also depends on the amount of drink taken
so many variables its not really possible to generalise.
The friendliest sesh will look askance at you if, after your polite request, may I join you for a few tunes, you proceed to play poorly and insist on doing so for the rest of the evening!. While you can sit down in a 'closed' session, do you mind if I play a tune? play like the Divil himself and be made welcome! The closed front is often simply there as self protection,Its simple, how good are you? when you finished put your instrument down , if they still want you to play, they will ask you.
A bunch of you is a different matter, you could easily take over a sesh. So if there is enough of you to form a quorum. then i concurr with Geoff, play a couple of nights in one pub which has no wide screen, or,if you find an active sesh, dont take over, whether you are all loads better than the session regulars or not, its their session, respect that.
# Posted on January 13th 2008 by jig
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
Regarding waiting: I usually listen long enough to determine if the session is above my head or not before asking if I can "join in." Then I only play tunes I know (no noodling on tunes I don't know or only half know) and I wait for an invatation before starting any tunes. If they're catting between tunes I don't make the mistake of assuming this is a place where I should volunteer to start a tune either.
# Posted on January 14th 2008 by Phantom Button
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
Just go and play. There is no need to fear, anyone takes umbrage tell them not to be so boorish and stick the head in them. Works all the time.
We play in Antrim Town, on the way to Ptarms, on a Sunday night, in a pub called Barneys. Easy to find, you see boorish people staggering out all the time with broken noses.
# Posted on January 14th 2008 by bodhran bliss
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
I suppose you won't have to bother waiting to see if the playing at BB's session is over your head or not.
# Posted on January 14th 2008 by Phantom Button
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
I quite agree with BB. Just join in and get it over with. If they really do not want any drop-ins, they will let you know, and likely it will be civil. If not, feel free to express yourself.
I remember walking into an establishment, heard the music, unpacked, jumped right in, and, sadly, was made to feel rather uncomfortable by the other musicians.
I simply packed up, stood up, and left, although I did take the time to mention that I thought it was a lot of dancers and musicians for such a small stage, and I did not think bolero hats and glitter were particularly Irish.
Good luck.
# Posted on January 14th 2008 by Rook
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
very good Rook!
most sessions I know of would be baffled if you contacted them beforehand and asked for a tune list.
concertinaplayer's advice is good on how to steer the safest course but who wants to always steer the safest course? A mandolin is the least obtrusive of instruments and you'd be hard pushed to offend anybody with one (believe me, I've tried, --- and I suspect succeeded once or twice).
Thing is, at first you could hear some really good musicians playing obscure tunes and think "this is out of my league" and then later on, in comes the main body of players and starts to play stuff that you know. Or vice versa. It's not like there's a set programme. Or is there? Maybe I should get with it. And if you do hear "Maid Behind the Bar", fine Scottish tune that it is, then it's too late. By the time you get your instrument out, they'll be onto something else.
And sometimes the seat you take on the outside of the circle could end up in the middle as folk move around. Or it might be a square or L-shape and no circle at all.
Having said that, I'm a real coward and tend to walk in to a strange pub without an instrument and have a drink first to check it out. or if I've nowhere to leave my instrument, walk in and put it down near the bar as if I've just come from a gig, or a squash game, and have a desperate thirst from all that hard work. That way you can suss things out and they can suss you out too. One thing's for sure, if you're the sort of person who never normally drinks in a pub but just goes there cos you've heard that's where "ITM" is played, you'll stick out a mile whether you realise it or not. Whatever, the key is to use a pub for what it's there for, talk to people, socialise, break the ice and you'll soon be among friends and maybe even play a tune or two with them.
# Posted on January 14th 2008 by Bren
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
most sessions in ireland are payed gigs which consist of about 3-4 people, but there is no problem joining in as long as you ask, depening on what instrument you play. joining in with a guitar when there is already one there is usually a no unless you are asked. do not take from the music however. stay out of tunes etc and i suppose it does matter how much drink one has taken.
best of luck
# Posted on January 14th 2008 by cg.f
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
I joined in at Molloy's in Westport playing a block of wood. Yes, a block of wood, with a tipper. No-one said a word, apart from a load of amazed punters who seemed to think this was wonderful.
We sometimes have a mere 5 guitarists so another one is always welcome. And a mandolin would be really welcome.
# Posted on January 14th 2008 by bodhran bliss
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
after all, it's just a block of wood ....
# Posted on January 14th 2008 by Bren
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
BB's a chip off the old block.
# Posted on January 15th 2008 by Phantom Button
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
Not just any old block of wood. The type you see on a washboard or a ceilidh drummer has, liberated it in the bodhran shop in Spideal.
# Posted on January 15th 2008 by bodhran bliss
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
There's an old fella in Ennis who plays a block of wood with two drum sticks at some of the sessions I've been to. He's a gas!
# Posted on January 15th 2008 by Phantom Button
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
Have you got a special case and carry bag for your block of wood bb? do you have long discussions with other block of wood players about who made your block and how you got him to customise it?
# Posted on January 15th 2008 by Bren
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
I have always claimed to be the best "lump of wood" player (bodhran style) in the world, as I assumed I was the only one.
In Molloy's people would ask "What do you call that instrument" and I would reply "A lump of wood".
# Posted on January 15th 2008 by bodhran bliss
Re: Sessioning it in Ireland
I have long maintained on here that the best percussion I ever heard was modest Limerick man Paddy Sullivan rattling two biros off the edge of a desk in a cabin of an oil rig moored in the Tyne at South Shields. A lump of laminate you might say. If I remember rightly, his father made bodhrans, skun the goat himself and buried the skin with lime.
# Posted on January 15th 2008 by Bren