I've got a generation whistle for a while now but haven't played it much since it sounds shrill and bad on most notes. I think I know why though, the plastic mouthpiece isn't completely smooth and there's a tiny piece of plastic blocking a bit of the windway. I tried to fix this but none of the tools I have are long and small enough to reach there.
So I wanted to take the plastic top off so I can reach it from the other side. But first I want to know for sure I won't render it unplayable by doing this.
My whistle is a Generation Eb, the top is glued firm to the body (I think, can't get any movement in it anyway). If I take it off and put it back on will I still be able to play or will I just screw it up? And what would be the best way to take it off?
put it head down in a pan of hor water for a minute, the glue should melt. However, have concidered the possibillity that it's simply a shrill whistle because it's an eb whistle
Go to www.chiffandfipple.com/tweak.html There is a complete article there on tweaking plastic fipple, metal tube whistles written by Dale Wisely. I've successfully used the process many times to tweak whistles for beginners. Good luck.
Dipping it in warm water for a couple of minutes will loosen the glue enough to remove the head. It must be warm enough that the glue is soft enough to remove it without putting too much stress on the plastic, but not so hot that the plastic softens (possibly resulting in deformation of the windway) or expands and contracts (causing cracks to form).
The temperature of a cup of tea with cold milk added should be about right (although using an actual cup of tea is not to be recommended).
Once the whistle has been in the water for a couple of minutes, cup your fist right around the mouthpiece, so as not to stress it unevenly, and try twisting it slowly. If this takes a lot of force, put it back in the water, perhaps warming the water a little more first. When the glue has softened enough that the mouthpiece will turn easily on the shaft, ease it off with a gentle twisting action.
Bear in mind that, when doing anything to the tongue of windway of a whistle, a small change can make a very big difference, so take great care not to remove any more than you intend to. On the other hand, Generation whistles are cheap, so they're the ideal test-bed for your whistle-improvment skills. Besides, if you do mess up, a dodgy whistle's not much better than a dead whistle anyway.
'have (you - ed.) concidered the possibillity that it's simply a shrill whistle because it's an eb whistle?"
Yes, Michael, there is that. But I've got a very nice Generation Eb. Shrill, but nice. Unfortunately, it has undergone the same fate of many a Generation whistle - repeated moving of the mouthpiece over the years usually leads, eventually, to cracking. The mouthpiece is now so loose that it moves while you play, which rather defeats the object of 'tuneability'. Better to be consistently out of tune than to waver.
I think she ( my Brittany) may be sensitive to regular and repeated playing of The Lilting Banshee.
Try some bee's wax on the top of the tube to secure those loose fipples. When you need to move it, just hold the top of the tube/bottom of the fipple tightly in your hand until the wax softens a bit so you can make adjustments.
You always have to loosen the tops on Generations, as they shove the tops all the way down at the factory so that the whistle plays very sharp.
As people have said, soaking it in hot water for a bit usually does the trick (though I had one that I never could get loose).
Yes the tops usually end up splitting eventually. I bind heavy thread around the base of the top (where it tends to split) and soak the thread with super-glue. It will now be rock-solid.
If a top gets a tad loose you can put a thin wrap of plumber's teflon tape around the top the the whistle. That makes it airtight and easy to move as well.
You have to play a lot of Generations sometimes to find a good one. I played a box of 24 new Generation D's: one was a fantastic player with strong low notes, sweet high notes, and well in-tune octaves. A second whistle was nearly as good. (I bought these two.) Of that batch there were a few- two or three I think- which were horrid. Scratchy, breathy, just unplayable. The rest were in the middle somewhere, mediocre, but nothing I would want to play.
A guy on C&F tested a batch of 200 Generations and found that 6% were good, 6% were horrid, and the rest mediocre, agreeing with what I found using a much smaller sample.
So if you just by an untested Generation you have a rather small chance of getting a really good one.
Rather than spend a lot of time trying to fix a defective Generation top, I would just go out and find that rare great one. Don't worry about the body (the brass tube), you can always switch tops and bottoms later.
I have an old beat-up body I've played for 20 years, but I have a great top on it that I recently bought (that one-of-two-dozen mentioned above).
Does anyone have recommendations on modifying a whistle that's too flat even with the fipple all the way in? I have a whistle that I love the sound of - very sweet mellow tone - but it's always flat when I play it at sessions. I've thought about removing the fipple and trimming the metal edge just slightly - any recommendations on doing this or another modification?
Though I've never had that, because Generations usually play very sharp with the top shoved down, I certainly wouldn't hesitate to chop the top of the whistle body if I had to.
After you chop it just make sure that the top is filed & sanded smooth so that the top with slide smoothly up and down.
You should have enough tunig leeway to be able to tune to a session that's a bit sharp (perhaps up to 444 on a tuner) and tune to a session that's a bit flat. 440 should be pretty much in the middle of the whistle's tuning range.
Careful "chopping" that tube. The brass will distort easily - and then not fit back into the head.
Hacksaw might work, but is going to leave a lot of filing to get it all smoothe again. Don't use a vice unless it's got some padding and not too tight.
Thanks for the suggestions, I'll try something when I get back to the States. To clarify, I think the whistle is actually a Clarke (the print is barely engraved and hard to read), not a Generation.
I use my Generations to mix the cream in my coffee.
Sorry to whoever makes the things. I found them so frustrating that I purchased my michael burke and later came across a beautiful feadog (for 3 euro a year or so ago when I was traveling with Herself through Connemara).
Life is to short to mess around with bad whistles.
We had ( my Sirgnificant Other ) a wooden whistle that sounded quite flat but had a lovely tone ( impulse purchase at Folk Festival).
After some discussion we took mouthpiece off barrel ( they're made like that ), and started sanding down both the end of the insert in the barrel, and the end of the shoulders of the mouthpiece, taking care to keep the pieces square ( vertical ) over the piece of sandpaper. This shortened the joint somewhat ( it was WELL flat ), but the instrument still holds together and now plays satisfacorily in pitch.
If you have a consistently flat Generation, and you have to shorten the barrel inside the mouthpiece, try fitting a piece of dowel into the barrel before removing the millimetres of metal.
Adjusting of fipples, as mentioned, should be done slowly and carefully.
Generation Tin Whistle modifying
Generation Tin Whistle modifying
Hi,
I've got a generation whistle for a while now but haven't played it much since it sounds shrill and bad on most notes. I think I know why though, the plastic mouthpiece isn't completely smooth and there's a tiny piece of plastic blocking a bit of the windway. I tried to fix this but none of the tools I have are long and small enough to reach there.
So I wanted to take the plastic top off so I can reach it from the other side. But first I want to know for sure I won't render it unplayable by doing this.
My whistle is a Generation Eb, the top is glued firm to the body (I think, can't get any movement in it anyway). If I take it off and put it back on will I still be able to play or will I just screw it up? And what would be the best way to take it off?
Greets,
Enclose
# Posted on January 11th 2008 by Enclose
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
put it head down in a pan of hor water for a minute, the glue should melt. However, have concidered the possibillity that it's simply a shrill whistle because it's an eb whistle
# Posted on January 11th 2008 by llig leahcim
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
Go to www.chiffandfipple.com/tweak.html There is a complete article there on tweaking plastic fipple, metal tube whistles written by Dale Wisely. I've successfully used the process many times to tweak whistles for beginners. Good luck.
# Posted on January 11th 2008 by whistler gan ainm
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
Dipping it in warm water for a couple of minutes will loosen the glue enough to remove the head. It must be warm enough that the glue is soft enough to remove it without putting too much stress on the plastic, but not so hot that the plastic softens (possibly resulting in deformation of the windway) or expands and contracts (causing cracks to form).
The temperature of a cup of tea with cold milk added should be about right (although using an actual cup of tea is not to be recommended).
Once the whistle has been in the water for a couple of minutes, cup your fist right around the mouthpiece, so as not to stress it unevenly, and try twisting it slowly. If this takes a lot of force, put it back in the water, perhaps warming the water a little more first. When the glue has softened enough that the mouthpiece will turn easily on the shaft, ease it off with a gentle twisting action.
Bear in mind that, when doing anything to the tongue of windway of a whistle, a small change can make a very big difference, so take great care not to remove any more than you intend to. On the other hand, Generation whistles are cheap, so they're the ideal test-bed for your whistle-improvment skills. Besides, if you do mess up, a dodgy whistle's not much better than a dead whistle anyway.
# Posted on January 11th 2008 by granama
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
Thanks for that link as I'm also interested in this - try it like this:
http://www.chiffandfipple.com/tweak.html
BTW for extra fine sandpaper (or glasspaper as it is known in the trade) P80, P120 or above are fine grades, but check this table:
http://www.sizes.com/tools/sandpaper.htm
# Posted on January 11th 2008 by Key Maniac Lad
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
'have (you - ed.) concidered the possibillity that it's simply a shrill whistle because it's an eb whistle?"
Yes, Michael, there is that. But I've got a very nice Generation Eb. Shrill, but nice. Unfortunately, it has undergone the same fate of many a Generation whistle - repeated moving of the mouthpiece over the years usually leads, eventually, to cracking. The mouthpiece is now so loose that it moves while you play, which rather defeats the object of 'tuneability'. Better to be consistently out of tune than to waver.
# Posted on January 11th 2008 by granama
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
Just wait till you've got a little 5-year old boy who uses them as swords etc. You'll be thankful Generations are cheap.
# Posted on January 11th 2008 by Key Maniac Lad
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
Or a Brittany Spaniel that buries them in the back yard...
# Posted on January 11th 2008 by whistler gan ainm
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
Do you think the spaniel means anything by that?
# Posted on January 11th 2008 by TomB-R
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
Maybe its remote ancestors chewed/buried bone whistles.
# Posted on January 11th 2008 by nicholas
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
I think she ( my Brittany) may be sensitive to regular and repeated playing of The Lilting Banshee.
Try some bee's wax on the top of the tube to secure those loose fipples. When you need to move it, just hold the top of the tube/bottom of the fipple tightly in your hand until the wax softens a bit so you can make adjustments.
# Posted on January 11th 2008 by whistler gan ainm
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
You always have to loosen the tops on Generations, as they shove the tops all the way down at the factory so that the whistle plays very sharp.
As people have said, soaking it in hot water for a bit usually does the trick (though I had one that I never could get loose).
Yes the tops usually end up splitting eventually. I bind heavy thread around the base of the top (where it tends to split) and soak the thread with super-glue. It will now be rock-solid.
If a top gets a tad loose you can put a thin wrap of plumber's teflon tape around the top the the whistle. That makes it airtight and easy to move as well.
You have to play a lot of Generations sometimes to find a good one. I played a box of 24 new Generation D's: one was a fantastic player with strong low notes, sweet high notes, and well in-tune octaves. A second whistle was nearly as good. (I bought these two.) Of that batch there were a few- two or three I think- which were horrid. Scratchy, breathy, just unplayable. The rest were in the middle somewhere, mediocre, but nothing I would want to play.
A guy on C&F tested a batch of 200 Generations and found that 6% were good, 6% were horrid, and the rest mediocre, agreeing with what I found using a much smaller sample.
So if you just by an untested Generation you have a rather small chance of getting a really good one.
Rather than spend a lot of time trying to fix a defective Generation top, I would just go out and find that rare great one. Don't worry about the body (the brass tube), you can always switch tops and bottoms later.
I have an old beat-up body I've played for 20 years, but I have a great top on it that I recently bought (that one-of-two-dozen mentioned above).
# Posted on January 12th 2008 by Richard D Cook
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
Does anyone have recommendations on modifying a whistle that's too flat even with the fipple all the way in? I have a whistle that I love the sound of - very sweet mellow tone - but it's always flat when I play it at sessions. I've thought about removing the fipple and trimming the metal edge just slightly - any recommendations on doing this or another modification?
# Posted on January 13th 2008 by Amy J
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
Though I've never had that, because Generations usually play very sharp with the top shoved down, I certainly wouldn't hesitate to chop the top of the whistle body if I had to.
After you chop it just make sure that the top is filed & sanded smooth so that the top with slide smoothly up and down.
You should have enough tunig leeway to be able to tune to a session that's a bit sharp (perhaps up to 444 on a tuner) and tune to a session that's a bit flat. 440 should be pretty much in the middle of the whistle's tuning range.
# Posted on January 13th 2008 by Richard D Cook
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
I had the same problem Amy J and doing that solved it very well
# Posted on January 13th 2008 by rob_handel
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
Careful "chopping" that tube. The brass will distort easily - and then not fit back into the head.
Hacksaw might work, but is going to leave a lot of filing to get it all smoothe again. Don't use a vice unless it's got some padding and not too tight.
The little cutting wheels on a Dremel are best.
Pliers are right out.
# Posted on January 13th 2008 by Mozle
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
i found that the best method for me is to actually grind the body down on a stone.
I used an electric knife sharpening stone, but if you have or knows someone who has a bench grinder that can work.
the other option is to sand it down with sand paper. that might take a while though!
# Posted on January 14th 2008 by rob_handel
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
I used a saw and a mitre box. It worked fine. I did file and sand to smooth after.
# Posted on January 14th 2008 by Richard D Cook
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
Thanks for the suggestions, I'll try something when I get back to the States. To clarify, I think the whistle is actually a Clarke (the print is barely engraved and hard to read), not a Generation.
# Posted on January 14th 2008 by Amy J
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
I use my Generations to mix the cream in my coffee.
Sorry to whoever makes the things. I found them so frustrating that I purchased my michael burke and later came across a beautiful feadog (for 3 euro a year or so ago when I was traveling with Herself through Connemara).
Life is to short to mess around with bad whistles.
# Posted on January 14th 2008 by zippydw
Re: Generation Tin Whistle modifying
We had ( my Sirgnificant Other ) a wooden whistle that sounded quite flat but had a lovely tone ( impulse purchase at Folk Festival).
After some discussion we took mouthpiece off barrel ( they're made like that ), and started sanding down both the end of the insert in the barrel, and the end of the shoulders of the mouthpiece, taking care to keep the pieces square ( vertical ) over the piece of sandpaper. This shortened the joint somewhat ( it was WELL flat ), but the instrument still holds together and now plays satisfacorily in pitch.
If you have a consistently flat Generation, and you have to shorten the barrel inside the mouthpiece, try fitting a piece of dowel into the barrel before removing the millimetres of metal.
Adjusting of fipples, as mentioned, should be done slowly and carefully.
# Posted on January 16th 2008 by Guernsey Pete