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Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I've read in many places that the key we choose to play a tune in, determines the emotions/moods that are transmitted (more sadness, more joy, more energy, etc). However I am unable to notice this. Is it me or is it normal?
One thing is obvious is that the type of scale the tune is in, determines the transmitted emotions. For example tunes in minor scales are usually more sad/melancholic than tunes in major scales. About this there is no doubt.
But THE SAME TUNE being played in (for example) A major instead of D major changes the mood? If this is true I am unable to notice it. If the instrument is the same and the playing is the same I am unable to notice any difference in transmitted emoitons between tunes played shifted from one another.
What do you think? Is there really a difference or is it just poetical talk?
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Definitely is the truth as far as I'm concerned. When you sharpen a note it sounds brighter since the pitch is a half step higher. Therefore, for example a tune in A (3 sharps) is going to sound brighter than a tune in D (2 sharps). There isn't necessarily a huge difference, but to the trained ear the difference is certainly noticeable. This is also the same reason why recordings are often done in E flat as opposed to D since E flat is one step higher than D. Makes it sound that much brighter.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Jason G says 'When you sharpen a note it sounds brighter since the pitch is a half step higher. Therefore, for example a tune in A (3 sharps) is going to sound brighter than a tune in D (2 sharps).'
But, is that true or just an illusion or perhaps both at the same time. Surely it only sounds 'brighter' because it's a little different to the 'normal' key the tune is played in, if you know what I mean. If you're used to hearing a tune in G major and then it's played in A major - you might say 'oh that's brighter' but if you usually play it in A.... Surely it's the tone intervals that are important not whether they're sharp or not?
Undoubtedly tunes say in E Dorian, E Minor, A Dorian, G Mix etc. are 'sadder' but that's because instead of sticking to a major scale interval, they have various flattened notes. That's my very half baked contribution to this thread!!!
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I always thought this was due to playing tunes on particular instruments which did not sound the same in all keys. e.g. a baroque flute playing D-Major will sound very different to one playing in C-Major due to the different character of the equivalent notes on the scale. i.e. normal, half-holed, bent, cross fingered or not. We all know that the E on a modern simple system flute sounds very different to the bottom D... If that is the tonic, then it does make a big difference to the nature of the scale.
Also, tuning quirks would have a different effect depending on where the affected notes are in the scale.
As another example, on a fiddle, the open strings sound different to the other notes and certain keys also make it possible to drone open strings - change the key and this no longer works the same way easily. I'm not a fiddler, so I don't know how much skill can counterbalance (i.e. drone a string with a finger down on it, effectvely the classical double stop technique) this...
As a contrast, I find very little difference in tunes played on a modern Boehm flute. The character of the different notes in the scale is very consistent (except C#) and I know of someone who can play Mozart's flute concertos in every possible key. The character of the piece doesn't change as far as I can say - Though in this case the competence of the player in each of the given keys is probably the most important influence.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
And as a test, shifting the key of a recording using software does not - to my ear - make the same difference that making the same key change does on a real instrument. Try it and let me know what you think...
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I think it depends on the tuning and on the instrument.
There have been different tuning systems over the years which vary in how they space the frequencies of the notes in a scale. In the modern 12 tone equal temperament, all notes are spaced evenly so the key shouldn't make a difference. With other systems it will do.
As an example of what I mean by the instrument, playing mandolin for example, I find if I play in A instead of G,, I've often got open A /E strings to play with and I think the end result does feel a bit different.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
IMHO most Irish traditional music is played in natural tuning, not equal or well tempered. The scale is based on the drones of the pipes and so it makes a big difference whether you play a tune in G or D.
Another influence is the sound of the instrument, which can vary a lot when you transpose the tune more than just one note.
Some esoteric people bring together the frequencies of the planets and the notes and do characterize them as evil, holy, sexy and so on....
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
The thing that more often than not determines the keys we play our tunes in is not the particular sound of a key, but the tune's range.
The vast majority of these diddley tunes sit between and including the open D string on the fiddle and the top B on the E string. An octave and a sixth. So the character of the tune is more influenced by this than the actual sound of the notes.
A tune in Dmaj, for example, has a range of one octave and a sixth. It's lowest note is the root.
A tune in G maj has a range from the fifth (fourth below the root) through one octave and up to the major third.
A tune in Amaj goes from the sixth (fifth below the root) through one octave and a second.
The other thing, however, that often determines keys is their friendliness. Fiddle players like F, it's easy and often has many advantages over G. Fs a bitch on the flute though. Take that splendid tune of Tommy Peoples, Black Pat. If there are flute players in the company, I'd invariably play it in G It's great in G, but I miss not being able to roll the top B. So when there are no flute players, I'd much rather play it in F (Peoples plays it in F) because the major third is an A and I can roll that.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I found Michael's (similar) comments in this thread very useful - it's something I'd not thought about before he mentioned it (see Llig comment Sep 27 2007)
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I was at a Dave Swarbrick, Kevin Dempsey, and Martin Allcock gig (collectively known as Swarb's Lazarus) and there were one or two sets they played usually starting off in the keys of G or D....i noticed the last tunes were in A or A mix and at the start of the A or A mix tunes the crowd whooped....that NEVER happened when the last tune of a set they played was in D or G or whatever key sig that wasn't A...trust me!
So i think that changing a key to A really does lift the mood!
My music teacher also told me once that JS Bach found out or worked out (wouldn't put it past him since he was a genius) that the interval between A and C# forming the major third for the key of A major was slightly bigger than any other major thirds of other key sigs...he found out the difference in Herz was bigger for A....so my music teacher concluded that it was for that reason that the key of A sounds very bright in comparison!
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Bach's well tempered scale really doesn't come into play with this music, way too subtle.
As for playing the last tune in a set A, It's such a hackneyed old pathetic trick (typical of rubbish old 70s folk rockers and their fans). Going up a tone is a mainstay of pop arrangements also.
Come on guys, make the effort and be a bit cleverer
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
As has been said, on an equal-tempered scale, the difference is based on the character of the instrument.
And modern sessions are almost exclusively equally tempered (yes, fiddles can play whatever they want, but they players are almost certainly playing in equal temperment, and most other instruments don't really have a choice).
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
That change up of the key, usually a tone, whether in a set of tunes or, more often, as a change for the last verse and chorus of a trite ( often country ) song, is known as "The Truck-Drivers' Gear-Change".
It does raise the spirits, unless you are already jaded with it.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I need to drag out my old cassettes.
I know there are some recordings of a singer from India.
I cannot think of her name offhand.
She uses different keys for different moods & emotions.
Here is a good link. Unfortunately I didn't see Ravi mentioning keys in this page; http://www.ravishankar.org/indian_music.html
Is anyone more familiar with Indian musical tradition?
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
wolfbird I believe you are following an assumption.
I will let you know when I come up with the singer.
She did specifically refer to keys or modes (in her liner notes).
I am always willing to learn something.
But a little research goes a long ways.
;)
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I'm happy to stand corrected when you've provided the requisite evidence, Muse.
However, I responded more to your mention of Ravi Shankar, than the anonymous singer. The Indian musical tradition is, in many respects, more sophisticated then the Western Classical tradition (microtones, etc) and keys, major, minor, etc. are Western concepts.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Wolfbird, TheMuse,
You guys are periphally referencing "ragas", which are the scales that make up Indian classical music. Traditionally, there are particular times of days or seasons you're supposed to improvise in a certain raga. These quite often have microtones (like the "lonesome" note some people talk about here), and don't often use all seven notes (swara). They interact with the tala, which are the rhythmic patterns used to build the melodies.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
oh, and the rest of the stuff -
effectively key probably shouldn't change the mood, but it does, because of a few factors - sounds of the instruments (most instruments are a little more strident when you raise the pitches), the fact that because the vast majority instruments except the fiddle are built around equal temperment, and so there are subtle differences in half steps and whole steps within the scale when you change keys, a fiddle specific thing where when you're in A the top two strings resonate better and are more likely to be open, and something I notice from the kids I teach - that on a basic level our ears interpret high as "happy" and low as "sad". Also, moving key up a step or a fifth from a previous tune is an easy relationship for our ear to interpret as getting more energy, for various reasons.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Wolfbird,
Yeah, I know, it's amazing. Most of Western tradition is so melody-rooted, too, and here there are these folks on the other side of the world with really complicated systems controlling everything *but* the melody... I can't think of any tradition more opposite in construction from Irish music than classical Indian.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I'm not disagreeing, reenactor. I have quite a lot of Indian, Turkish, Iranian, Chinese music on CDs which i enjoy listening to. One thing that Irish music shares, which the Western Classical does not, is the background drone, don't you think ? Same as in the 5 string banjo, there's usually a drone over or against which the decoration presented.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
The Western tradition has certainly had specific pieces of music for specific times of day, notably in the Mediaeval Church. Even now, hymns usually used at Evensong are in general more repose-ful than those characteristic of morning services.
I suspect a lot of significance went out of the time of day when, and where, artificial light became ubiquitous and the clock, not dawn or dusk, determined human activity.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Yes, I mean that. Maybe not Western Classical tradition, but certainly mainstream Western music in its time.
I don't know, but I'd be surprised if Baroque courts didn't have musicians playing pieces for different times of day, meal-times, night music, etc. - Eine Kleine Nachtmusik, of course! I don't know who wrote that, but one of the greats.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I'm no expert, nicholas, so you may well be nearer the mark on this stuff. I kind of see Classical Western as the Baroque and then Classical mainstream and on up to the present day, the music of the Academies, elites and 'respectable' composers, whilst there are the genres, such as irish trad, flamenco, ancient religious stuff,
say Hildegarde von Bingen, etc, as 'outside'. But yes, when i think about it, vespers, matins, evensong, etc, obviously linked to time of day....
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I thought tunes in A sounded brighter simply because most of the time in your average session tunes are played in D and G. I thought that flute players sometimes use an Eb flute so that it sounds brighter, too.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Ok guys thanks a lot for all the input. But I think the conversation went a bit off topic from my initial question (not that I don't find all of what you said interesting).
I just want to re-formulate my question so that it is more clear what I want to know:
First of all, IGNORE THE SPECIFICITIES OF THE INSTRUMENT. And ignore the type of music or type of tune or type of scale.
Simply imagine hearing a tune (for example in C major) being played by computer software without the subtile differences that instruments give to different notes.
Now imagine that some time passes. I dont want to compare the change of key when it's done shortly after because that causes a change that is visible and the act of changing (in itself) can transmit some emotion. But rather imagine that some several days pass. And then you hear the exact same tune played by the exact same software but in E major instead of C major.
Is there a difference in transmitted emotions because of being in C or E?
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
wolfbird hello; I did not locate the tape but I remembered the singers' name.
Sheila Chandra ~ she was not born in India but did immerse herself in the musical tradition. If I remember right she learned tabla playing & developed songs from those rhythms. Her music blurs the lines between genres. I will just post the 1st thing I came. Hope you enjoy. http://www.sheilachandra.com/interviews/interview_3_10.html
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I've never got the perfect pitch bit.
The pitch notes has varied over the years, and I think our concert A=440 is a 20th century standard. I'd imagine feelings over "this key feels happier/sadder, etc." have not been effected by the changes of the frequency of a "tuning" note.
I'd think relative pitch is a different matter as there are different spacings of the semi-tones depending on the tuning system in use.
--
btw. for those who may not know about our tuning systems, there is an ancient problem and something known as the Pythagorean comma see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pythagorean_comma
As far as I understand it (very little) our different tuning systems come around from this, eg, aim to have one scale where the fifths is exact or distribute the "errors" evenly, etc.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Hi reenactor.
I like your answer, but you have to realize one thing: I did not know if the things I am telling you to ignore ARE or AREN'T ALL the things that MAKE A DIFFERENCE.
Actually, THAT is my question: Are all these things the only things that make a difference or is there something more? (for example something related to having perfect pitch, or something else).
Apparently your answer is: NO, there is nothing else that makes a difference.
I also suspected that this is the answer: only having perfect pitch would someone detect a difference. But sometimes you can read things that induce you to think otherwise. I very often read things like "an A major scale is more lively than a D major scale" and similar sentences... I believe such sentences are not true because they don't even refer to any instrument.... And a "normal" person doesn't have perfect pitch, right?
That's another interesting question... Sometimes I have the feeling I know the note my whistle will play when I first pick it up in that day. And then I try and it's true, it is the note I was imagining. I believe I don't have perfect pitch, so this must be related to the instrument specificities, right? Or was I just lucky? :D
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I don't think that you're 'just lucky', cesarpim. I've found that the ability to remember pitch can be learned over time. Lots of folks can disagree with me, and you're welcome to call it something different from perfect pitch as well.
In response to your original question, I happen to agree with Johannas Brahms.... he believed that different keys are able to evoke differing moods specific to each key.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Everything that goes into a piece of music contributes to the mood or emotion transmitted. But if shifting the key is supposed to have an emotional impact similar to changing the mode or dramatically altering the tempo, I just don't hear it. Or feel it.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
My, my, my - it's hard to know where to jump in here. How about some error correction:
"Definitely is the truth as far as I'm concerned. When you sharpen a note it sounds brighter since the pitch is a half step higher. Therefore, for example a tune in A (3 sharps) is going to sound brighter than a tune in D (2 sharps). There isn't necessarily a huge difference, but to the trained ear the difference is certainly noticeable. This is also the same reason why recordings are often done in E flat as opposed to D since E flat is one step higher than D. Makes it sound that much brighter. "
Eh... no. Not even a little bit right. Why? Well, the simplest answer is, the circle of fiths is a circle, and thus no key is inherently "higher" than any other. (picture the Escher drawing "Ascending and Descending and ask whether this monk is above the other one, it's the same question) A modulation up a fifth, or up two fifths (=a major 2nd - G > D > A for example) will give a sense of rising, for something like the reasons you suggest, but under simple transposition, without the comparison of the original pitch, the tune will be the tune. (if you're playing on one of the pre-equal temperement tunings, yes, one key will sound the most "right" and the others will sound compensatorily worse, but if you're playing a fiddle or a flute you'll correct for that by reflex, one hopes)
Now, if you compare the same tune played in D versus in A, you're likely to find that it's been moved up a fifth, and the A version will be higher in pitch, which might sound "brighter" but on the fiddle it might also be played low, which will certainly not. So that effect is more a mechanical one than a musicological one.
As to the playing in E flat, that is a matter of tuning the fiddles and guitars up a half step, which puts more tension on the strings and thus produces a brighter tone. It's nothing to do with the absolute pitch of the tune, or the fingering. It's also a good way to keep novice box players like me from joining in at your session, since it's hard enough to play the thing in D, let alone E flat!
In Michael's post, otherwise correct, there's one slip of the keyboard:
"A tune in Amaj goes from the sixth (fifth below the root) through one octave and a second. "
For "sixth" read "fourth", just for fastidiousness' sake.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
As regards Indian classical music and the matching of time of day to the raga played, I always have to remember hearing the great sarangi player Ran Narayan introduce a rag saying "The next piece is in Such-and-such Raga. It is a morning raga, but I will play it for you tonight because I like to play it." It's not so very strict for all the players... (He added, by way of expiation, "It it morning in India now!" - which was true)
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
And finally, as to the relation of absolute pitch to the character of a tune, there are a few things I could add.
1) Music is a mathematical experience. It is usually not perceived as such, but there is an underlying psychological reality to the laws of harmony, and they work (in a much-abused metaphor) as a grammar, a set of rules for generating sequences of pitches and for understanding them as good or bad, ie, conforming to or violating the rules, and as clever or not, ie, conforming in novel or trite ways.
One of the most basic facts about this mathematical experience is that in principle any pitch can be your starting point. By multiplying the frequency of that pitch by 1+ (twelfth root of two) recursively, you get your equal tempered chromatic scale. So in principle wherever you start the musical experience is the same. You can verify this for yourself. Take out your favorite recording of Shostakovich's 24 Preludes and Fugues (you can use Bach's too, if you'd rather) and play random tracks. See if you can associate moods with keys. See if you can guess the keys from the moods Good luck.
2) However, everyone has a memory for pitch. Car alarms are in B, dial tones (remember land lines) were a combination of, I think F and A, and so forth. Change those pitches and you'll notice. Pick a song you've heard on the radio a lot - if you just start singing it, odds are you'll sing it at the same pitch you've always heard it. This is why karaoke works, and when it doesn't, this is why it's funny.
So if you take a tune that you've heard before in A minor and transpose it to G minor (I think Hayes plays Star of Munster in G minor, right?) you'll probably have an unconscious sense that it's different, and lower, and since you don't know that you actually remember the original pitch, you'll just say it sounds "dark" or "mysterious", effects you might attribute to the key of G minor rather than your brain rationalizing your experience of the tune.
3) There's also a mechanical effect, as Michael began to observe. Tunes are played within a limited range on all instruments. If you're used to hearing tunes in the first octave that peak in the second octave (eg, a typical ending phrase like... |afge d2BA|GBAG FDD2:||) and then you hear something that spends a lot of actual melody time up in the higher reaches, you're going to notice that it sounds "brighter" - in that sense, the key of A major is going to sound, in Irish music, brighter and happier, and contrariwise D minor will probably end up sounding a lot darker and "moodier" - not for musicological reasons but for mechanical as well as memory reasons.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
that makes sense, except that I don't believe everyone has some kind of automatic perfect pitch. Also, Yes, if you take a tune down a tone you may think it sounds darker. Take it down another tone, darker still? Keep goind till you're an octave lower, very dark indeed, but the same key.
I know this works because I often do it on the viola. For example, on the viola, Gmaj tunes use Dmaj fiddle fingering. I can sart off a tune in Gma - the tune's usual key - but a combination of the tone of the instrument and the character of Dmaj fiddle fingerings (for example, open string crans on the bottom root note rather than a third finger roll) often make people a little unsure of whether to join in in G. It can take 'em a bar or two to realise.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Cesarpim,
Yes, that's what I was getting at. I don't think sticking sharps all over something intrinsically makes it brighter, if you remove context and what it does to the instruments.
What you're talking about with remembering pitch is certainly learnable.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Somewhere on this site, can't find it now, is a link to an article that suggest we tend to use our own speaking voice as a rough pitch reference. Also the average male and female speaking voices in our culture (partially how we distinguish screams and moanes etc). The point was that we are geared up to recognise pitch changes and that a change in key of fifth (quite a high proportion of a normal speaking voice range) would effect how a tune fitted into our mental map.
And if trying to lilt a typical diddly tune even a couple of semitones is enough to make the difference between possible and impossible (or difficult and don't even try) for most people.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I interpreted the original question as referring to the folklore, particularly as expressed by some classical composers, which holds that certain keys have a characteristic, and unique, emotional quality independent of instrumentation or context. Does the key of C# minor have an emotional profile that D minor lacks? I would expect nearby keys to have “nearby” qualities.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I maintain it's the character of the unstrument, not the exact frequency. Dmaj and Ebmaj on the fiddle are completely diffrerent. But tune up your fiddle half a tone, as many do, and it really isn't all that different. And as I mentioned above, Gmaj on the viola has a completly different character to Gmaj of the fiddle.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Yeah, different whistles have their own sound. Playing the same note on a different whistle does not give you the same sound. The bore is different, the distance from the hole to the fipple, the shape of the chamber etc. So much so that, for example, some D whistles have a mellow tone that makes them sound like C whistles. And some C whistles are so bright, they sound like D whistles
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
So would people suggest that different whistles have different "emotional profiles" ?
One sometimes hears how old commercial recordings were speeded up to fit them on the media. So the record companies obviously thought that any effect on emotion or mood simply related to pitch was either illusary or not commercially important. I wonder how many listeners noticed ?
Most texts introducing the baroque flute say early on that composers made deliberate use of the different character that the cross-fingered notes gave to keys that used them. The point being that it was related to the key *on that instrument*, not the absolute pitch of the set of notes they were using.
Mind you changing from Bb to Eb whistle seems to alter the mood and emotions of my neighbours.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Thank you Jon Kiparsky,
your text made a lot of sense to me and cleared out most of my doubts.
I have just a small question remaining:
As you say (and as I suspected) people have some kind of pitch memory (wheather it's the car alarm pitch, the pitch of the tune we heard 1000 times in the same key, or the pitch of our own voice, etc...). So my question is, if we have this pitch memory (memory of an absolute pitch, when we heard it many times) isn't that equivalent to having perfect pitch? If you heard a song/tune 1000 times in the same pitch and then you are able to start singing it in that pitch without any reference (except for my memory) then don't you have absolute pitch?
Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I've read in many places that the key we choose to play a tune in, determines the emotions/moods that are transmitted (more sadness, more joy, more energy, etc). However I am unable to notice this. Is it me or is it normal?
One thing is obvious is that the type of scale the tune is in, determines the transmitted emotions. For example tunes in minor scales are usually more sad/melancholic than tunes in major scales. About this there is no doubt.
But THE SAME TUNE being played in (for example) A major instead of D major changes the mood? If this is true I am unable to notice it. If the instrument is the same and the playing is the same I am unable to notice any difference in transmitted emoitons between tunes played shifted from one another.
What do you think? Is there really a difference or is it just poetical talk?
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by cesarpim
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Definitely is the truth as far as I'm concerned. When you sharpen a note it sounds brighter since the pitch is a half step higher. Therefore, for example a tune in A (3 sharps) is going to sound brighter than a tune in D (2 sharps). There isn't necessarily a huge difference, but to the trained ear the difference is certainly noticeable. This is also the same reason why recordings are often done in E flat as opposed to D since E flat is one step higher than D. Makes it sound that much brighter.
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by Jason G
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I believe that a pint of Guinness vibrates in the frequency of D.
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by Frunobulax
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
G, surely??
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by Mark Harmer
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
How poetic, I agree.
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by Frunobulax
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Jason G says 'When you sharpen a note it sounds brighter since the pitch is a half step higher. Therefore, for example a tune in A (3 sharps) is going to sound brighter than a tune in D (2 sharps).'
But, is that true or just an illusion or perhaps both at the same time. Surely it only sounds 'brighter' because it's a little different to the 'normal' key the tune is played in, if you know what I mean. If you're used to hearing a tune in G major and then it's played in A major - you might say 'oh that's brighter' but if you usually play it in A.... Surely it's the tone intervals that are important not whether they're sharp or not?
Undoubtedly tunes say in E Dorian, E Minor, A Dorian, G Mix etc. are 'sadder' but that's because instead of sticking to a major scale interval, they have various flattened notes. That's my very half baked contribution to this thread!!!
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by the wounded hussar
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I always thought this was due to playing tunes on particular instruments which did not sound the same in all keys. e.g. a baroque flute playing D-Major will sound very different to one playing in C-Major due to the different character of the equivalent notes on the scale. i.e. normal, half-holed, bent, cross fingered or not. We all know that the E on a modern simple system flute sounds very different to the bottom D... If that is the tonic, then it does make a big difference to the nature of the scale.
Also, tuning quirks would have a different effect depending on where the affected notes are in the scale.
As another example, on a fiddle, the open strings sound different to the other notes and certain keys also make it possible to drone open strings - change the key and this no longer works the same way easily. I'm not a fiddler, so I don't know how much skill can counterbalance (i.e. drone a string with a finger down on it, effectvely the classical double stop technique) this...
As a contrast, I find very little difference in tunes played on a modern Boehm flute. The character of the different notes in the scale is very consistent (except C#) and I know of someone who can play Mozart's flute concertos in every possible key. The character of the piece doesn't change as far as I can say - Though in this case the competence of the player in each of the given keys is probably the most important influence.
Chris.
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by Crackpot
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
And as a test, shifting the key of a recording using software does not - to my ear - make the same difference that making the same key change does on a real instrument. Try it and let me know what you think...
Chris
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by Crackpot
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I think it depends on the tuning and on the instrument.
There have been different tuning systems over the years which vary in how they space the frequencies of the notes in a scale. In the modern 12 tone equal temperament, all notes are spaced evenly so the key shouldn't make a difference. With other systems it will do.
As an example of what I mean by the instrument, playing mandolin for example, I find if I play in A instead of G,, I've often got open A /E strings to play with and I think the end result does feel a bit different.
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by Jon Freeman
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
IMHO most Irish traditional music is played in natural tuning, not equal or well tempered. The scale is based on the drones of the pipes and so it makes a big difference whether you play a tune in G or D.
Another influence is the sound of the instrument, which can vary a lot when you transpose the tune more than just one note.
Some esoteric people bring together the frequencies of the planets and the notes and do characterize them as evil, holy, sexy and so on....
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by swisspiper
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
The thing that more often than not determines the keys we play our tunes in is not the particular sound of a key, but the tune's range.
The vast majority of these diddley tunes sit between and including the open D string on the fiddle and the top B on the E string. An octave and a sixth. So the character of the tune is more influenced by this than the actual sound of the notes.
A tune in Dmaj, for example, has a range of one octave and a sixth. It's lowest note is the root.
A tune in G maj has a range from the fifth (fourth below the root) through one octave and up to the major third.
A tune in Amaj goes from the sixth (fifth below the root) through one octave and a second.
The other thing, however, that often determines keys is their friendliness. Fiddle players like F, it's easy and often has many advantages over G. Fs a bitch on the flute though. Take that splendid tune of Tommy Peoples, Black Pat. If there are flute players in the company, I'd invariably play it in G It's great in G, but I miss not being able to roll the top B. So when there are no flute players, I'd much rather play it in F (Peoples plays it in F) because the major third is an A and I can roll that.
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by llig leahcim
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I found Michael's (similar) comments in this thread very useful - it's something I'd not thought about before he mentioned it (see Llig comment Sep 27 2007)
http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display/15284/comments#comment315901
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by domnull
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I was at a Dave Swarbrick, Kevin Dempsey, and Martin Allcock gig (collectively known as Swarb's Lazarus) and there were one or two sets they played usually starting off in the keys of G or D....i noticed the last tunes were in A or A mix and at the start of the A or A mix tunes the crowd whooped....that NEVER happened when the last tune of a set they played was in D or G or whatever key sig that wasn't A...trust me!
So i think that changing a key to A really does lift the mood!
My music teacher also told me once that JS Bach found out or worked out (wouldn't put it past him since he was a genius) that the interval between A and C# forming the major third for the key of A major was slightly bigger than any other major thirds of other key sigs...he found out the difference in Herz was bigger for A....so my music teacher concluded that it was for that reason that the key of A sounds very bright in comparison!
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by D.J.F.
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Bach's well tempered scale really doesn't come into play with this music, way too subtle.
As for playing the last tune in a set A, It's such a hackneyed old pathetic trick (typical of rubbish old 70s folk rockers and their fans). Going up a tone is a mainstay of pop arrangements also.
Come on guys, make the effort and be a bit cleverer
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by llig leahcim
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
As has been said, on an equal-tempered scale, the difference is based on the character of the instrument.
And modern sessions are almost exclusively equally tempered (yes, fiddles can play whatever they want, but they players are almost certainly playing in equal temperment, and most other instruments don't really have a choice).
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by Dave Weinstein
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
That change up of the key, usually a tone, whether in a set of tunes or, more often, as a change for the last verse and chorus of a trite ( often country ) song, is known as "The Truck-Drivers' Gear-Change".
It does raise the spirits, unless you are already jaded with it.
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by Guernsey Pete
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
That's it, yes, "The Truck-Drivers' Gear-Change". Somebody posted a link to a very funny website about it, was that you Pete?
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by llig leahcim
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
It's all in here
http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display/13417/comments#comment276198
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by domnull
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I need to drag out my old cassettes.
I know there are some recordings of a singer from India.
I cannot think of her name offhand.
She uses different keys for different moods & emotions.
Here is a good link. Unfortunately I didn't see Ravi mentioning keys in this page;
http://www.ravishankar.org/indian_music.html
Is anyone more familiar with Indian musical tradition?
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by Random_notes
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
That's because the Indian Musical tradition does not think in terms of 'keys', it's a Western thing, Muse
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by wolfbird
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
wolfbird I believe you are following an assumption.
I will let you know when I come up with the singer.
She did specifically refer to keys or modes (in her liner notes).
I am always willing to learn something.
But a little research goes a long ways.
;)
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by Random_notes
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I'm happy to stand corrected when you've provided the requisite evidence, Muse.
However, I responded more to your mention of Ravi Shankar, than the anonymous singer. The Indian musical tradition is, in many respects, more sophisticated then the Western Classical tradition (microtones, etc) and keys, major, minor, etc. are Western concepts.
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by wolfbird
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Wolfbird, TheMuse,
You guys are periphally referencing "ragas", which are the scales that make up Indian classical music. Traditionally, there are particular times of days or seasons you're supposed to improvise in a certain raga. These quite often have microtones (like the "lonesome" note some people talk about here), and don't often use all seven notes (swara). They interact with the tala, which are the rhythmic patterns used to build the melodies.
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by reenactor
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Yes. Isn't it fascinating that the Western tradition never noticed that various types of music might suit the various times of the daily cycle.
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by wolfbird
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
oh, and the rest of the stuff -
effectively key probably shouldn't change the mood, but it does, because of a few factors - sounds of the instruments (most instruments are a little more strident when you raise the pitches), the fact that because the vast majority instruments except the fiddle are built around equal temperment, and so there are subtle differences in half steps and whole steps within the scale when you change keys, a fiddle specific thing where when you're in A the top two strings resonate better and are more likely to be open, and something I notice from the kids I teach - that on a basic level our ears interpret high as "happy" and low as "sad". Also, moving key up a step or a fifth from a previous tune is an easy relationship for our ear to interpret as getting more energy, for various reasons.
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by reenactor
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Wolfbird,
Yeah, I know, it's amazing. Most of Western tradition is so melody-rooted, too, and here there are these folks on the other side of the world with really complicated systems controlling everything *but* the melody... I can't think of any tradition more opposite in construction from Irish music than classical Indian.
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by reenactor
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I'm not disagreeing, reenactor. I have quite a lot of Indian, Turkish, Iranian, Chinese music on CDs which i enjoy listening to. One thing that Irish music shares, which the Western Classical does not, is the background drone, don't you think ? Same as in the 5 string banjo, there's usually a drone over or against which the decoration presented.
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by wolfbird
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
The Western tradition has certainly had specific pieces of music for specific times of day, notably in the Mediaeval Church. Even now, hymns usually used at Evensong are in general more repose-ful than those characteristic of morning services.
I suspect a lot of significance went out of the time of day when, and where, artificial light became ubiquitous and the clock, not dawn or dusk, determined human activity.
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by nicholas
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Are you talking about Gregorian chant, Plainsong, etc, nicholas ?
I wouldn't really include that modal music as part of the Western Classical tradition, although perhaps you do ?
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by wolfbird
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Yes, I mean that. Maybe not Western Classical tradition, but certainly mainstream Western music in its time.
I don't know, but I'd be surprised if Baroque courts didn't have musicians playing pieces for different times of day, meal-times, night music, etc. - Eine Kleine Nachtmusik, of course! I don't know who wrote that, but one of the greats.
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by nicholas
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I'm no expert, nicholas, so you may well be nearer the mark on this stuff. I kind of see Classical Western as the Baroque and then Classical mainstream and on up to the present day, the music of the Academies, elites and 'respectable' composers, whilst there are the genres, such as irish trad, flamenco, ancient religious stuff,
say Hildegarde von Bingen, etc, as 'outside'. But yes, when i think about it, vespers, matins, evensong, etc, obviously linked to time of day....
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by wolfbird
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I thought tunes in A sounded brighter simply because most of the time in your average session tunes are played in D and G. I thought that flute players sometimes use an Eb flute so that it sounds brighter, too.
# Posted on January 7th 2008 by sbhikes
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Ok guys thanks a lot for all the input. But I think the conversation went a bit off topic from my initial question (not that I don't find all of what you said interesting).
I just want to re-formulate my question so that it is more clear what I want to know:
First of all, IGNORE THE SPECIFICITIES OF THE INSTRUMENT. And ignore the type of music or type of tune or type of scale.
Simply imagine hearing a tune (for example in C major) being played by computer software without the subtile differences that instruments give to different notes.
Now imagine that some time passes. I dont want to compare the change of key when it's done shortly after because that causes a change that is visible and the act of changing (in itself) can transmit some emotion. But rather imagine that some several days pass. And then you hear the exact same tune played by the exact same software but in E major instead of C major.
Is there a difference in transmitted emotions because of being in C or E?
This is what I want to know.
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by cesarpim
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
yes, if you have perfect pitch. No if you don't
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by llig leahcim
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
"Forget all the things that might make a difference - does it make a difference?"
You've answered your own question!
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by reenactor
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
wolfbird hello; I did not locate the tape but I remembered the singers' name.
Sheila Chandra ~ she was not born in India but did immerse herself in the musical tradition. If I remember right she learned tabla playing & developed songs from those rhythms. Her music blurs the lines between genres. I will just post the 1st thing I came. Hope you enjoy.
http://www.sheilachandra.com/interviews/interview_3_10.html
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by Random_notes
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I've never got the perfect pitch bit.
The pitch notes has varied over the years, and I think our concert A=440 is a 20th century standard. I'd imagine feelings over "this key feels happier/sadder, etc." have not been effected by the changes of the frequency of a "tuning" note.
I'd think relative pitch is a different matter as there are different spacings of the semi-tones depending on the tuning system in use.
--
btw. for those who may not know about our tuning systems, there is an ancient problem and something known as the Pythagorean comma see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pythagorean_comma
As far as I understand it (very little) our different tuning systems come around from this, eg, aim to have one scale where the fifths is exact or distribute the "errors" evenly, etc.
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by Jon Freeman
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Hi reenactor.
I like your answer, but you have to realize one thing: I did not know if the things I am telling you to ignore ARE or AREN'T ALL the things that MAKE A DIFFERENCE.
Actually, THAT is my question: Are all these things the only things that make a difference or is there something more? (for example something related to having perfect pitch, or something else).
Apparently your answer is: NO, there is nothing else that makes a difference.
I also suspected that this is the answer: only having perfect pitch would someone detect a difference. But sometimes you can read things that induce you to think otherwise. I very often read things like "an A major scale is more lively than a D major scale" and similar sentences... I believe such sentences are not true because they don't even refer to any instrument.... And a "normal" person doesn't have perfect pitch, right?
That's another interesting question... Sometimes I have the feeling I know the note my whistle will play when I first pick it up in that day. And then I try and it's true, it is the note I was imagining. I believe I don't have perfect pitch, so this must be related to the instrument specificities, right? Or was I just lucky? :D
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by cesarpim
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I don't think that you're 'just lucky', cesarpim. I've found that the ability to remember pitch can be learned over time. Lots of folks can disagree with me, and you're welcome to call it something different from perfect pitch as well.
In response to your original question, I happen to agree with Johannas Brahms.... he believed that different keys are able to evoke differing moods specific to each key.
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by morning star
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Everything that goes into a piece of music contributes to the mood or emotion transmitted. But if shifting the key is supposed to have an emotional impact similar to changing the mode or dramatically altering the tempo, I just don't hear it. Or feel it.
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by Bob himself
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
My, my, my - it's hard to know where to jump in here. How about some error correction:
"Definitely is the truth as far as I'm concerned. When you sharpen a note it sounds brighter since the pitch is a half step higher. Therefore, for example a tune in A (3 sharps) is going to sound brighter than a tune in D (2 sharps). There isn't necessarily a huge difference, but to the trained ear the difference is certainly noticeable. This is also the same reason why recordings are often done in E flat as opposed to D since E flat is one step higher than D. Makes it sound that much brighter. "
Eh... no. Not even a little bit right. Why? Well, the simplest answer is, the circle of fiths is a circle, and thus no key is inherently "higher" than any other. (picture the Escher drawing "Ascending and Descending and ask whether this monk is above the other one, it's the same question) A modulation up a fifth, or up two fifths (=a major 2nd - G > D > A for example) will give a sense of rising, for something like the reasons you suggest, but under simple transposition, without the comparison of the original pitch, the tune will be the tune. (if you're playing on one of the pre-equal temperement tunings, yes, one key will sound the most "right" and the others will sound compensatorily worse, but if you're playing a fiddle or a flute you'll correct for that by reflex, one hopes)
Now, if you compare the same tune played in D versus in A, you're likely to find that it's been moved up a fifth, and the A version will be higher in pitch, which might sound "brighter" but on the fiddle it might also be played low, which will certainly not. So that effect is more a mechanical one than a musicological one.
As to the playing in E flat, that is a matter of tuning the fiddles and guitars up a half step, which puts more tension on the strings and thus produces a brighter tone. It's nothing to do with the absolute pitch of the tune, or the fingering. It's also a good way to keep novice box players like me from joining in at your session, since it's hard enough to play the thing in D, let alone E flat!
In Michael's post, otherwise correct, there's one slip of the keyboard:
"A tune in Amaj goes from the sixth (fifth below the root) through one octave and a second. "
For "sixth" read "fourth", just for fastidiousness' sake.
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by Jon Kiparsky
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
As regards Indian classical music and the matching of time of day to the raga played, I always have to remember hearing the great sarangi player Ran Narayan introduce a rag saying "The next piece is in Such-and-such Raga. It is a morning raga, but I will play it for you tonight because I like to play it." It's not so very strict for all the players... (He added, by way of expiation, "It it morning in India now!" - which was true)
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by Jon Kiparsky
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
And finally, as to the relation of absolute pitch to the character of a tune, there are a few things I could add.
1) Music is a mathematical experience. It is usually not perceived as such, but there is an underlying psychological reality to the laws of harmony, and they work (in a much-abused metaphor) as a grammar, a set of rules for generating sequences of pitches and for understanding them as good or bad, ie, conforming to or violating the rules, and as clever or not, ie, conforming in novel or trite ways.
One of the most basic facts about this mathematical experience is that in principle any pitch can be your starting point. By multiplying the frequency of that pitch by 1+ (twelfth root of two) recursively, you get your equal tempered chromatic scale. So in principle wherever you start the musical experience is the same. You can verify this for yourself. Take out your favorite recording of Shostakovich's 24 Preludes and Fugues (you can use Bach's too, if you'd rather) and play random tracks. See if you can associate moods with keys. See if you can guess the keys from the moods Good luck.
2) However, everyone has a memory for pitch. Car alarms are in B, dial tones (remember land lines) were a combination of, I think F and A, and so forth. Change those pitches and you'll notice. Pick a song you've heard on the radio a lot - if you just start singing it, odds are you'll sing it at the same pitch you've always heard it. This is why karaoke works, and when it doesn't, this is why it's funny.
So if you take a tune that you've heard before in A minor and transpose it to G minor (I think Hayes plays Star of Munster in G minor, right?) you'll probably have an unconscious sense that it's different, and lower, and since you don't know that you actually remember the original pitch, you'll just say it sounds "dark" or "mysterious", effects you might attribute to the key of G minor rather than your brain rationalizing your experience of the tune.
3) There's also a mechanical effect, as Michael began to observe. Tunes are played within a limited range on all instruments. If you're used to hearing tunes in the first octave that peak in the second octave (eg, a typical ending phrase like... |afge d2BA|GBAG FDD2:||) and then you hear something that spends a lot of actual melody time up in the higher reaches, you're going to notice that it sounds "brighter" - in that sense, the key of A major is going to sound, in Irish music, brighter and happier, and contrariwise D minor will probably end up sounding a lot darker and "moodier" - not for musicological reasons but for mechanical as well as memory reasons.
Any other questions?
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by Jon Kiparsky
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
that makes sense, except that I don't believe everyone has some kind of automatic perfect pitch. Also, Yes, if you take a tune down a tone you may think it sounds darker. Take it down another tone, darker still? Keep goind till you're an octave lower, very dark indeed, but the same key.
I know this works because I often do it on the viola. For example, on the viola, Gmaj tunes use Dmaj fiddle fingering. I can sart off a tune in Gma - the tune's usual key - but a combination of the tone of the instrument and the character of Dmaj fiddle fingerings (for example, open string crans on the bottom root note rather than a third finger roll) often make people a little unsure of whether to join in in G. It can take 'em a bar or two to realise.
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by llig leahcim
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I think most of us only "hear" where other notes should be in relation to a start pitch.
As regards absolute pitch, a quick look at a Wikipedia article suggests A varying from 380hz to 450hz, apparently approx 4 semi-tones difference.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pitch_(music)#History_of_pitch_standards_in_Western_music
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by Jon Freeman
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Cesarpim,
Yes, that's what I was getting at. I don't think sticking sharps all over something intrinsically makes it brighter, if you remove context and what it does to the instruments.
What you're talking about with remembering pitch is certainly learnable.
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by reenactor
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Somewhere on this site, can't find it now, is a link to an article that suggest we tend to use our own speaking voice as a rough pitch reference. Also the average male and female speaking voices in our culture (partially how we distinguish screams and moanes etc). The point was that we are geared up to recognise pitch changes and that a change in key of fifth (quite a high proportion of a normal speaking voice range) would effect how a tune fitted into our mental map.
And if trying to lilt a typical diddly tune even a couple of semitones is enough to make the difference between possible and impossible (or difficult and don't even try) for most people.
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by david_h
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I interpreted the original question as referring to the folklore, particularly as expressed by some classical composers, which holds that certain keys have a characteristic, and unique, emotional quality independent of instrumentation or context. Does the key of C# minor have an emotional profile that D minor lacks? I would expect nearby keys to have “nearby” qualities.
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by Bob himself
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
I maintain it's the character of the unstrument, not the exact frequency. Dmaj and Ebmaj on the fiddle are completely diffrerent. But tune up your fiddle half a tone, as many do, and it really isn't all that different. And as I mentioned above, Gmaj on the viola has a completly different character to Gmaj of the fiddle.
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by llig leahcim
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
So how about on a whistle ? Eb compared with Bb, same brand. Unacompanied.
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by david_h
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Yeah, different whistles have their own sound. Playing the same note on a different whistle does not give you the same sound. The bore is different, the distance from the hole to the fipple, the shape of the chamber etc. So much so that, for example, some D whistles have a mellow tone that makes them sound like C whistles. And some C whistles are so bright, they sound like D whistles
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by llig leahcim
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Yep. Brightness has more to do with overtones than with fundamental pitch.
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by Bob himself
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
So would people suggest that different whistles have different "emotional profiles" ?
One sometimes hears how old commercial recordings were speeded up to fit them on the media. So the record companies obviously thought that any effect on emotion or mood simply related to pitch was either illusary or not commercially important. I wonder how many listeners noticed ?
Most texts introducing the baroque flute say early on that composers made deliberate use of the different character that the cross-fingered notes gave to keys that used them. The point being that it was related to the key *on that instrument*, not the absolute pitch of the set of notes they were using.
Mind you changing from Bb to Eb whistle seems to alter the mood and emotions of my neighbours.
# Posted on January 8th 2008 by david_h
Re: Does shifting the key of the tune really transmits different mood/emotions?
Thank you Jon Kiparsky,
your text made a lot of sense to me and cleared out most of my doubts.
I have just a small question remaining:
As you say (and as I suspected) people have some kind of pitch memory (wheather it's the car alarm pitch, the pitch of the tune we heard 1000 times in the same key, or the pitch of our own voice, etc...). So my question is, if we have this pitch memory (memory of an absolute pitch, when we heard it many times) isn't that equivalent to having perfect pitch? If you heard a song/tune 1000 times in the same pitch and then you are able to start singing it in that pitch without any reference (except for my memory) then don't you have absolute pitch?
# Posted on January 20th 2008 by cesarpim