I have a question about the pipes. Either the Irish kind or the Scottish kind, really. How on earth does one practice them when one is new to them? I honestly cannot imagine anybody's mom admonishing their kid to go and practice their pipes. I would think you'd be permanently banned from the house with them.
This is an honest question. How does someone learn to play them? I guess you can practice without the whole instrument put together, but eventually you do have to learn to play the whole instrument. So what do you do? Drive out to the country to practice? Build a sound-proof room in the garage?
I've been curious about this for a while. Thank you.
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
LOL!!
Uilleann pipes are usually begun with just a chanter, bellows, and bag - and given that they are no louder than a fiddle when properly set up, one can practice in a bedroom or bathroom pretty easily... There is no "practice chanter" for uilleann pipes, but a "tin" whistle can serve this purpose if need be to an extent - though the technique is very different.
Great Highland Bagpipes on the other hand ARE learned on a practice chanter... thank goodness! The practice chanter is relatively quiet - but very annoying!
Hope this helps... and in MY house, my daughter WILL get sent to her room to practice the pipes (uilleann)!
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Uilleann pipers tend to be single, seems to me, either before or after they start playing, or both.
But really, the best uilleann pipers have become that way because they learned while living singly in flag-floor stone cottages in west Clare, in front of a nice peat fire, next to the stil. You can't go wrong that way.
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
The problem with GHB is that the practice chanter sounds nothing like the real thing. Also, it doesn't even begin to prepare you for the wind you need to produce with the full set. Also, it takes practice to coordinate filling the bag with playing the tune. You don't generally breathe as you would if you were playing a flute, which is to say, you fill the bag as needed, which doesn't necessarily jive with where you are in the tune.
I am an extreme novice, so if I've mistated anything, experienced players feel free to correct me.
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Thirty years ago this winter I was in Cambridge doing a short teaching-English-to-foreigners course at a highly dubious and crummy establishment, where I learned that half the fairly numerous Middle Eastern students were dissidents who'd come there to plot against the Shah of Iran, and the other half were SAVAK (his secret police) come there to keep tabs on them. "No wonder we can't get any conversation out of them in classes", opined one of the school's bosses, adding that at least they paid the bills. Both the bosses were in fact clinically mad, but I could well believe that story.
Where was I? Follow on. I found a session in town at a pub called The Oak (I think). In it was a girl who played excellent whistle and was apparently starting on uilleann pipes at home. I asked her if the neighbours objected. She said that sometimes the next door ones did when she was playing pipes, but that the whistle could provoke objections from three or four houses away. I might not have quoted her here absolutely accurately, but the gist was clear - the whistle was more penetrating of walls etc. than the pipes. So there!
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
whoops, forgot to mention the existence of a very mellifluous type of uilleann pipes called flat pitch pipes - narrow bore, lower pitch than concert pitch pipes (in D)... they are fairly quiet and ideal for folks who have close neighbors!...
Ironically, I had a flat pitch set in B, and sold it a couple of years ago - then ironically my marriage broke up almost immediately after - should have kept the flat set and sold the concert pitch set i guess...
so picking up on duijera dubh's assessment on the marital status of pipers - pretty close to the mark in my case! pipes tend to be more than a mere mistress (not that i ever had one of those)... they demand one's fullest attention.
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
And the uilleann pipes probably aren't as exhausting as the highland pipes might be, as you only have to use the bellows rather than a mouthpiece, which probably only allows you to play longer at home. Spouses do not seem to compete well at all with uilleann pipes.
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Well, yes, I guess the Uillean pipes aren't very loud. I heard they were specifically invented to be quieter than GHB pipes because the GHB pipes were forbidden or something and so the quieter ones allowed people to play surreptitiously at home.
Still I can't think they are good for apartment living that's for sure.
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Ha, the highland pipes are best learnt in the highlands, a long way from anyone else.
The pratice chanter is but one aspect of learning. here you learn the fingering of tunes and build up some lip muscles.
Like any instrument ,you cant learn without the instrument.With the GBH you remove all parts and replace the chanter with your practice chanter and learn to blow a steady note, A 'goose' this is possibly the most important part. without a steady tone you have nothing much really. A bit like bow control on the fiddle.
then you learn to blow this tone with the real chanter.As you can imagine, that is loud. At the same time you practice an 'air' on the practice chanter.
Then perhaps join up the dots and play the air on the real chanter goose.
After a while, perhaps a year or so you might add a drone, etc.
Truly though this process wants to be done under the supervision of a pipe instructor. Just tuning a chanter , maintaining a reed etc etc is enough to turn you grey. What hair you might have left after pulling it out in frustration, that is!
The UP vary in volume, but that doesnt mean they are quite. in comparison with the GBH yes, but the GBH are F******n loud!
Small pipes, are one of the few pipes that are quiet. each maker will make different volume sets of course.
Then there are numerous european pipes. Spanish Gaita, Bulgarian Gaida, etc etc
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
This thread reminds me of that story about the young Scottish guy who's away at school, and his mum calls to ask him how it's going. He says, "Well it's pretty noisy here - a lot of people banging on the walls and screaming and so on. But I just put it all out of my mind and carry on practicing the pipes."
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Back to the original question, I know quite a few Highland pipers who go out to fairly isolated areas to practice. I used to play in a bathroom (great acoustics) with all the doors of the house shut, and not much sound escaped to the outside. For a while I worked in a Scottish goods shop and I would practice in the shop before opening every morning.
But the Highland pipes are really no louder than a trumpet, and kids practice those at home all the time.
(I was up in the stands at a football stadium while on the field a brass band and a pipe band performed together. At one point there was a trumpet descant that could clearly be heard over all the bagpipes.)
The uilleann pipes on the other hand are the same volume as a flute or violin and less than a clarinet or saxophone. No worries there.
Actually Highland pipers may spend most of their time, both as a beginner and as an experienced player, on the practice chanter. And, they make electronic practice chanters that use headphones. I have one and use it to practice on flights etc.
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Jig - "Ha, the highland pipes are best learnt in the highlands, a long way from anyone else." Ha ha, how true. Luckily I live in the highlands, a long way from anyone else. I think you and Richard have pretty accurately answered the question.
As Richard says, smallpipes or electronic chanters are good for practicing. If you get a hold of a good practise chanter with a good reed it can actually sound pretty good, though the majority of chanters seem to be made for complete beginners these days. Check ebay for old Henderson chanters - you'll probably pay about £100 but worth it.
When first going onto the full pipes beginners usually have a weak reed and like Richard says they are comparible volume to a trumpet though if you play a strong reed they are a good bit louder than a trumpet. I play in a band with a trumpet and he'll scuttle off when I'm tuning up to save his ears - poor thing.
So if you want to learn GHP then houses here in Skye average £150 - £200K or about £300 a month rent. You would only have to live here for about 10 years till you were reasonably proficiant and then you could practise big pipes at gigs and move back to the city.
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Nice to see Nicholas's reminiscences of the Oak in Cambridge. This pub is opposite the Catholic church (OLEM) and used to have a great session, but I only ever went to listen - I played guitar but hadn't at that time been bitten by the traditional music bug. The pub is now called something else, but I was chatting earlier this year to the retired landlord who was very proud of the session scene that he presided over there.
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
I've had the box more or less banished from the house, at least while the Other is at home. It's actually worked out nicely, I take it to work, leave it under my desk, and play a few tunes at lunch. Gets some great conversations started - there was the Vietnamese woman, her English was a bit spotty but her French was better than mine will ever be, and she wasn't bad with German. She tried at first to put a dollar in my case, but when I explained I was just playing for fun, she seemed to get it. "Yes, I know - I have a piano at home. I play. I'm very bad, but it makes me very happy." Nice old lady, and a conversation I'd never have had without being banned from playing in the house.
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
If bagpipes are louder than trumpets, how come I could clearly hear a solo trumpet over a dozen bagpipers? I think that people have the perception that pipes are louder than they are.
I played in an experimental group with two pipers, a tuba, an alto sax, and a djembe. The balance, playing acoustic, was fine. The sax could clearly be heard over two pipes, the tuba clearly heard under.
Maybe your trumpet man skedaddles because of your TUNING process, not the actual volume.
But I have to point out that Highland pipes are by no means uniform in volume, or in overall pitch. Chanters of 30 years ago played in concert B flat and were relatively warm and mellow. Today's chanters play halfway between B flat and B natural (if you use A as the point of reference, they're now in A=453 or thereabouts, actual cycles around 480) and they are much louder and brighter than the old chanters. I would say that six pipers playing the new chanters would probably be as loud as a dozen with the old ones. This is being driven by band competition, where the judges like the loudest, brightest, sharpest possible tone. But, you hire one of these band pipers to play in a chapel for a wedding or memorial service and they nearly blast the windows out. That's why many pipers maintain two sets, a band set and a solo set. The solo set is flatter, mellower, and much more pleasant to listen to indoors.
I myself, in addition to these two sets of full-size GHB's, also have a 100-year-old 7/8th size set, which all the old makers offered, and which they called "Lovat reel pipes" or "half-size pipes". In spite of the "half-size" name they were around 7/8th the size of a full set, and around half the volume. People today call these 3/4 pipes, and these have been revived under various names like "session pipes" and "border pipes". I use this set if playing in small chapels.
I also have a 100-year-old set of what the old makers called "miniature Highland pipes", which people today call smallpipes.
So, I can play Highland pipes at any volume level required.
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
The reason you can hear a trumpet over a dozen pipers is because of the contrasting tone. If a pipers amongst a dozen makes a mistake then why can you hear it over the other 11?
You are right about chanters for pipe band competitions becoming louder over the last few years and the pitch becoming sharper. But that is not ALL chanters. And not all Bb chanters are quieter. I play a Strathmore by Murray Henderson which is in concert pitch and is loud. Also I have a Naill, Shepherd and 30 year old Sinclair and they are all Bb with a small amount of tape. t IMO the volume has much more to do with the reed rather than the chanter in GHB but I'm sure we can agree to differ.
Im' interested in your 7/8th set Richard. Funnily enough I was given a set that had been hanging on a wall in a museum, which I would estimate are the about the same age as yours. But there is no chanter. Is the chanter with yours like a full sized one or is it somewhere between a practise chanter and big one? I have been told that some people used the bottom half of a practise chanter but I find that difficult to believe as they are a nice set of pipes that look like they desrve a good chanter. Any info would be appreciated.
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
I gather that GHB'ers in the Uk have to limit their exposure to the pipes due to the volume levels exceding the RDA of decibals, if you get my meaning. HMmmm. Sorry did I hear devolution?
Is that PC gone mad? what will they think of next? Its lucky the brits dont fight wars on their own soil, otherwise they couldnt use all those noisy big guns.
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
The chanters on those old "Lovat reel pipes" or "half-size pipes" were not like a practice chanter or smallpipe chanter, rather they were just like Highland chanters only with a bit narrower and less-tapered bore, thus putting out less volume. Though you can use a shaved-down GHB reed in them, they work best with their own sort of reed.
The chanters on these "Lovat reel pipes" was very similar if not identical to the chanters on the old "Lowland pipes", which were bellow-blown Scottish pipes which had the drones in a common stock. If you look at old engravings of town pipers in Scotland you'll see that most are playing Lowland pipes, not Highland. Many professional pipers in the old days owned a set of each, Highland and Lowland, and would play the Lowland indoors and the Highland outdoors.
This things are undergoing a huge revival in Scotland now, but under a somewhat false name "Border pipes". The way most makers configure them they are identical to the old Lowland pipes. The Highland pipemaker McCallum calls theirs "reelpipes" which name in the old days referred, as we have seen, to 7/8th size Highland pipes, not Lowland pipes. The maker Nigel Richard does make 7/8th size Highland pipes which he calls "session pipes". Several other makers call them "3/4 pipes". By whatever name, the chanters are all pretty much the same, like a Highland chanter with a narrower bore, putting out about half the volume of a Highland pipe, and usually pitched in A (one-half step flatter than the Highland chanter). These sound in the same octave as the Highland chanter, unlike a smallpipe chanter in A which sounds one octave lower.
A cool thing about these Lowland/Border/session/reel chanters is that "fork fingerings" work better on them than on the Highland chanter and with most of them you can get an entire chromatic scale without having to have keywork. Many makers do offer added keywork for high B, high C sharp, low G sharp, low F sharp, and low E.
I've owned three of these chanters, a Hamish Moore "reel", a Nigel Richard "session", and a Jon Swayne "Lowland" (all being basically the same thing despite the different names, even the reeds are interchangable) and I decided to stick with the Swayne. I preferred it because it was the quietest of the lot and it has a plastic reed (not like a PC reed but like a plastic GHB reed) so it stays in tune. I use this Swayne chanter in the old Glen 7/8th size pipes, with the drones reeded to play in A.
There are photos of my three sizes of Highland pipes on the thread "three sizes of Highland bagpipes" on the forum BobDunsire.
About the relative volume of chanters, my old 1960's Hardie chanter, no matter what reed I use, cannot match the volume of my new oval-hole McCallum band chanter. However the Hardie has, I think, a richer sound. The McCallum, though loud, sounds thin to me.
A question that has been in my mind about pipes
A question that has been in my mind about pipes
I have a question about the pipes. Either the Irish kind or the Scottish kind, really. How on earth does one practice them when one is new to them? I honestly cannot imagine anybody's mom admonishing their kid to go and practice their pipes. I would think you'd be permanently banned from the house with them.
This is an honest question. How does someone learn to play them? I guess you can practice without the whole instrument put together, but eventually you do have to learn to play the whole instrument. So what do you do? Drive out to the country to practice? Build a sound-proof room in the garage?
I've been curious about this for a while. Thank you.
# Posted on December 21st 2007 by sbhikes
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
LOL!!
Uilleann pipes are usually begun with just a chanter, bellows, and bag - and given that they are no louder than a fiddle when properly set up, one can practice in a bedroom or bathroom pretty easily... There is no "practice chanter" for uilleann pipes, but a "tin" whistle can serve this purpose if need be to an extent - though the technique is very different.
Great Highland Bagpipes on the other hand ARE learned on a practice chanter... thank goodness! The practice chanter is relatively quiet - but very annoying!
Hope this helps... and in MY house, my daughter WILL get sent to her room to practice the pipes (uilleann)!
# Posted on December 21st 2007 by maze
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Uilleann pipers tend to be single, seems to me, either before or after they start playing, or both.
But really, the best uilleann pipers have become that way because they learned while living singly in flag-floor stone cottages in west Clare, in front of a nice peat fire, next to the stil. You can't go wrong that way.
# Posted on December 21st 2007 by Duijera Dubh
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
The problem with GHB is that the practice chanter sounds nothing like the real thing. Also, it doesn't even begin to prepare you for the wind you need to produce with the full set. Also, it takes practice to coordinate filling the bag with playing the tune. You don't generally breathe as you would if you were playing a flute, which is to say, you fill the bag as needed, which doesn't necessarily jive with where you are in the tune.
I am an extreme novice, so if I've mistated anything, experienced players feel free to correct me.
# Posted on December 21st 2007 by Ailin
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Thirty years ago this winter I was in Cambridge doing a short teaching-English-to-foreigners course at a highly dubious and crummy establishment, where I learned that half the fairly numerous Middle Eastern students were dissidents who'd come there to plot against the Shah of Iran, and the other half were SAVAK (his secret police) come there to keep tabs on them. "No wonder we can't get any conversation out of them in classes", opined one of the school's bosses, adding that at least they paid the bills. Both the bosses were in fact clinically mad, but I could well believe that story.
Where was I? Follow on. I found a session in town at a pub called The Oak (I think). In it was a girl who played excellent whistle and was apparently starting on uilleann pipes at home. I asked her if the neighbours objected. She said that sometimes the next door ones did when she was playing pipes, but that the whistle could provoke objections from three or four houses away. I might not have quoted her here absolutely accurately, but the gist was clear - the whistle was more penetrating of walls etc. than the pipes. So there!
# Posted on December 21st 2007 by nicholas
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
whoops, forgot to mention the existence of a very mellifluous type of uilleann pipes called flat pitch pipes - narrow bore, lower pitch than concert pitch pipes (in D)... they are fairly quiet and ideal for folks who have close neighbors!...
Ironically, I had a flat pitch set in B, and sold it a couple of years ago - then ironically my marriage broke up almost immediately after - should have kept the flat set and sold the concert pitch set i guess...
so picking up on duijera dubh's assessment on the marital status of pipers - pretty close to the mark in my case! pipes tend to be more than a mere mistress (not that i ever had one of those)... they demand one's fullest attention.
# Posted on December 21st 2007 by maze
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
And the uilleann pipes probably aren't as exhausting as the highland pipes might be, as you only have to use the bellows rather than a mouthpiece, which probably only allows you to play longer at home. Spouses do not seem to compete well at all with uilleann pipes.
# Posted on December 21st 2007 by Duijera Dubh
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
But it's probably the same with all instruments.
# Posted on December 21st 2007 by Duijera Dubh
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Well, yes, I guess the Uillean pipes aren't very loud. I heard they were specifically invented to be quieter than GHB pipes because the GHB pipes were forbidden or something and so the quieter ones allowed people to play surreptitiously at home.
Still I can't think they are good for apartment living that's for sure.
# Posted on December 22nd 2007 by sbhikes
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Ha, the highland pipes are best learnt in the highlands, a long way from anyone else.
The pratice chanter is but one aspect of learning. here you learn the fingering of tunes and build up some lip muscles.
Like any instrument ,you cant learn without the instrument.With the GBH you remove all parts and replace the chanter with your practice chanter and learn to blow a steady note, A 'goose' this is possibly the most important part. without a steady tone you have nothing much really. A bit like bow control on the fiddle.
then you learn to blow this tone with the real chanter.As you can imagine, that is loud. At the same time you practice an 'air' on the practice chanter.
Then perhaps join up the dots and play the air on the real chanter goose.
After a while, perhaps a year or so you might add a drone, etc.
Truly though this process wants to be done under the supervision of a pipe instructor. Just tuning a chanter , maintaining a reed etc etc is enough to turn you grey. What hair you might have left after pulling it out in frustration, that is!
The UP vary in volume, but that doesnt mean they are quite. in comparison with the GBH yes, but the GBH are F******n loud!
Small pipes, are one of the few pipes that are quiet. each maker will make different volume sets of course.
Then there are numerous european pipes. Spanish Gaita, Bulgarian Gaida, etc etc
# Posted on December 22nd 2007 by jig
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
This thread reminds me of that story about the young Scottish guy who's away at school, and his mum calls to ask him how it's going. He says, "Well it's pretty noisy here - a lot of people banging on the walls and screaming and so on. But I just put it all out of my mind and carry on practicing the pipes."
# Posted on December 22nd 2007 by Gzeg
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Back to the original question, I know quite a few Highland pipers who go out to fairly isolated areas to practice. I used to play in a bathroom (great acoustics) with all the doors of the house shut, and not much sound escaped to the outside. For a while I worked in a Scottish goods shop and I would practice in the shop before opening every morning.
But the Highland pipes are really no louder than a trumpet, and kids practice those at home all the time.
(I was up in the stands at a football stadium while on the field a brass band and a pipe band performed together. At one point there was a trumpet descant that could clearly be heard over all the bagpipes.)
The uilleann pipes on the other hand are the same volume as a flute or violin and less than a clarinet or saxophone. No worries there.
Actually Highland pipers may spend most of their time, both as a beginner and as an experienced player, on the practice chanter. And, they make electronic practice chanters that use headphones. I have one and use it to practice on flights etc.
# Posted on December 22nd 2007 by Richard D Cook
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Jig - "Ha, the highland pipes are best learnt in the highlands, a long way from anyone else." Ha ha, how true. Luckily I live in the highlands, a long way from anyone else. I think you and Richard have pretty accurately answered the question.
As Richard says, smallpipes or electronic chanters are good for practicing. If you get a hold of a good practise chanter with a good reed it can actually sound pretty good, though the majority of chanters seem to be made for complete beginners these days. Check ebay for old Henderson chanters - you'll probably pay about £100 but worth it.
When first going onto the full pipes beginners usually have a weak reed and like Richard says they are comparible volume to a trumpet though if you play a strong reed they are a good bit louder than a trumpet. I play in a band with a trumpet and he'll scuttle off when I'm tuning up to save his ears - poor thing.
So if you want to learn GHP then houses here in Skye average £150 - £200K or about £300 a month rent. You would only have to live here for about 10 years till you were reasonably proficiant and then you could practise big pipes at gigs and move back to the city.
# Posted on December 22nd 2007 by bogman
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
But do ye have stils there, bogman.
# Posted on December 22nd 2007 by Duijera Dubh
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
And then there are Northumbrian smallpipes - but they are a musical instrument.
# Posted on December 22nd 2007 by geoffwright
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
That depends whose hands they are in Geoff. They don't do it for me unless in the hands of Kathryn Tickell to be honest. They have no b@lls.
# Posted on December 22nd 2007 by bogman
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Mmmm, please ignore that last sentence. Just a reaction to Geoff's highly ignorant comment.
# Posted on December 22nd 2007 by bogman
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Nice to see Nicholas's reminiscences of the Oak in Cambridge. This pub is opposite the Catholic church (OLEM) and used to have a great session, but I only ever went to listen - I played guitar but hadn't at that time been bitten by the traditional music bug. The pub is now called something else, but I was chatting earlier this year to the retired landlord who was very proud of the session scene that he presided over there.
# Posted on December 22nd 2007 by RichardB
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Commenting on a recent local session, someone mentioned that three Uilleann pipers showed up to play one evening.
One wag immediately asked "what did everyone else do?"
# Posted on December 22nd 2007 by ayedbl
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Interesting, Richard - so I did get the name of the pub right!
# Posted on December 22nd 2007 by nicholas
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
I've had the box more or less banished from the house, at least while the Other is at home. It's actually worked out nicely, I take it to work, leave it under my desk, and play a few tunes at lunch. Gets some great conversations started - there was the Vietnamese woman, her English was a bit spotty but her French was better than mine will ever be, and she wasn't bad with German. She tried at first to put a dollar in my case, but when I explained I was just playing for fun, she seemed to get it. "Yes, I know - I have a piano at home. I play. I'm very bad, but it makes me very happy." Nice old lady, and a conversation I'd never have had without being banned from playing in the house.
# Posted on December 23rd 2007 by Jon Kiparsky
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
If bagpipes are louder than trumpets, how come I could clearly hear a solo trumpet over a dozen bagpipers? I think that people have the perception that pipes are louder than they are.
I played in an experimental group with two pipers, a tuba, an alto sax, and a djembe. The balance, playing acoustic, was fine. The sax could clearly be heard over two pipes, the tuba clearly heard under.
Maybe your trumpet man skedaddles because of your TUNING process, not the actual volume.
But I have to point out that Highland pipes are by no means uniform in volume, or in overall pitch. Chanters of 30 years ago played in concert B flat and were relatively warm and mellow. Today's chanters play halfway between B flat and B natural (if you use A as the point of reference, they're now in A=453 or thereabouts, actual cycles around 480) and they are much louder and brighter than the old chanters. I would say that six pipers playing the new chanters would probably be as loud as a dozen with the old ones. This is being driven by band competition, where the judges like the loudest, brightest, sharpest possible tone. But, you hire one of these band pipers to play in a chapel for a wedding or memorial service and they nearly blast the windows out. That's why many pipers maintain two sets, a band set and a solo set. The solo set is flatter, mellower, and much more pleasant to listen to indoors.
I myself, in addition to these two sets of full-size GHB's, also have a 100-year-old 7/8th size set, which all the old makers offered, and which they called "Lovat reel pipes" or "half-size pipes". In spite of the "half-size" name they were around 7/8th the size of a full set, and around half the volume. People today call these 3/4 pipes, and these have been revived under various names like "session pipes" and "border pipes". I use this set if playing in small chapels.
I also have a 100-year-old set of what the old makers called "miniature Highland pipes", which people today call smallpipes.
So, I can play Highland pipes at any volume level required.
# Posted on December 23rd 2007 by Richard D Cook
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
The reason you can hear a trumpet over a dozen pipers is because of the contrasting tone. If a pipers amongst a dozen makes a mistake then why can you hear it over the other 11?
You are right about chanters for pipe band competitions becoming louder over the last few years and the pitch becoming sharper. But that is not ALL chanters. And not all Bb chanters are quieter. I play a Strathmore by Murray Henderson which is in concert pitch and is loud. Also I have a Naill, Shepherd and 30 year old Sinclair and they are all Bb with a small amount of tape. t IMO the volume has much more to do with the reed rather than the chanter in GHB but I'm sure we can agree to differ.
Im' interested in your 7/8th set Richard. Funnily enough I was given a set that had been hanging on a wall in a museum, which I would estimate are the about the same age as yours. But there is no chanter. Is the chanter with yours like a full sized one or is it somewhere between a practise chanter and big one? I have been told that some people used the bottom half of a practise chanter but I find that difficult to believe as they are a nice set of pipes that look like they desrve a good chanter. Any info would be appreciated.
# Posted on December 23rd 2007 by bogman
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
I gather that GHB'ers in the Uk have to limit their exposure to the pipes due to the volume levels exceding the RDA of decibals, if you get my meaning. HMmmm. Sorry did I hear devolution?
Is that PC gone mad? what will they think of next? Its lucky the brits dont fight wars on their own soil, otherwise they couldnt use all those noisy big guns.
# Posted on December 23rd 2007 by jig
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Luckily we will be independent here soon and we can pipe away to our hearts content with no interference from the 'UK government.'
# Posted on December 23rd 2007 by bogman
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
Finding tolerant flatmates is key.
# Posted on December 23rd 2007 by TheSilverSpear
Re: A question that has been in my mind about pipes
The chanters on those old "Lovat reel pipes" or "half-size pipes" were not like a practice chanter or smallpipe chanter, rather they were just like Highland chanters only with a bit narrower and less-tapered bore, thus putting out less volume. Though you can use a shaved-down GHB reed in them, they work best with their own sort of reed.
The chanters on these "Lovat reel pipes" was very similar if not identical to the chanters on the old "Lowland pipes", which were bellow-blown Scottish pipes which had the drones in a common stock. If you look at old engravings of town pipers in Scotland you'll see that most are playing Lowland pipes, not Highland. Many professional pipers in the old days owned a set of each, Highland and Lowland, and would play the Lowland indoors and the Highland outdoors.
This things are undergoing a huge revival in Scotland now, but under a somewhat false name "Border pipes". The way most makers configure them they are identical to the old Lowland pipes. The Highland pipemaker McCallum calls theirs "reelpipes" which name in the old days referred, as we have seen, to 7/8th size Highland pipes, not Lowland pipes. The maker Nigel Richard does make 7/8th size Highland pipes which he calls "session pipes". Several other makers call them "3/4 pipes". By whatever name, the chanters are all pretty much the same, like a Highland chanter with a narrower bore, putting out about half the volume of a Highland pipe, and usually pitched in A (one-half step flatter than the Highland chanter). These sound in the same octave as the Highland chanter, unlike a smallpipe chanter in A which sounds one octave lower.
A cool thing about these Lowland/Border/session/reel chanters is that "fork fingerings" work better on them than on the Highland chanter and with most of them you can get an entire chromatic scale without having to have keywork. Many makers do offer added keywork for high B, high C sharp, low G sharp, low F sharp, and low E.
I've owned three of these chanters, a Hamish Moore "reel", a Nigel Richard "session", and a Jon Swayne "Lowland" (all being basically the same thing despite the different names, even the reeds are interchangable) and I decided to stick with the Swayne. I preferred it because it was the quietest of the lot and it has a plastic reed (not like a PC reed but like a plastic GHB reed) so it stays in tune. I use this Swayne chanter in the old Glen 7/8th size pipes, with the drones reeded to play in A.
There are photos of my three sizes of Highland pipes on the thread "three sizes of Highland bagpipes" on the forum BobDunsire.
About the relative volume of chanters, my old 1960's Hardie chanter, no matter what reed I use, cannot match the volume of my new oval-hole McCallum band chanter. However the Hardie has, I think, a richer sound. The McCallum, though loud, sounds thin to me.
# Posted on December 24th 2007 by Richard D Cook