Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
I'm a whistle player myself, rather newbie one. I play irish and scottish music. Right now I'm trying to make a band.
Ant there is a girl who wants to play with us. She is classicaly trained violin player, and she plays really great. But when she plays some jig or hornpipe from the sheetmusic I gave her, that sounds like classical music, not irish.
So we need something like, say, "irish fiddle introduction for violin player in N easy steps". If you can get that on the web - that will be perfect, as ordering&shippig books from US or Europe is expensive and takes lots of time.
Another bad thing is that she does not know English (we are in Moscow, Russia), so we defenitely don't want any BIG books - I'll have to translate for her, and I don't think I want to read&translate hundreds of pages.
Anyway, she has a very good ear and is willing to learn - I'm sure that listening to CDs of great fiddlers (like, say, Tommy Peoples or Kevin Burke) will help her to improve - but she needs something to start with. And I can't help her, as I know nothing about classical music training and fiddle playing.
I will be very grateful for any links, advice or ideas.
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
Tunes don't need translating - LOTS of listening will help a lot. As far as books, I've found Mel Bay's Complete Irish FIddle Player by Peter Cooper to be helpful. My copy didn't come with a CD but apparently there is a companion CD so you can listen to the techniques and tunes in the book.
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
That's a good book, but there's no subsitute for just immersing yourself in listening. That's the only true cure for the dreaded classical music ailment, non stop listening. Osmosis is the best tool at a brain's disposal.
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
As someone who has crossed over, I can say that listening is the best way to learn about the nuances in ITM. Playing with someone that knows what they are doing is invaluable. Lacking that, use recordings and listen.
A couple of pointers: keep the bow on the string, find the "groove," and listen, listen, listen!
Good luck!
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
No vibrato! Some classical players find this hard not to do!
Listening is crucial, but watching also helps. Watching videos, even on youtube.com will help to show how the bowing and use of the right arm is very different.
There is a need to accept that written music does not give all the information as it does in classical playing. In particular the rhythm is nearly always different from what is notated. This is most obvious in hornpipes where pairs of 8th notes are played unequal as "dotted" or triplets, or somewhere between. But the main thing is to get away from notation anyway.
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
Matt Cranitch has a good book with a CD. I don't know that he says "do this ye classical fiddlers and be cured" but you can listen and hear for yourself how the sheet music isn't a perfect match.
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
No vibrato! Some classical players find this hard not to do!
so spoke chad mills.
I was advised by a comhaltas judge,a well respected sliabh Luchra fiddle player by the name of Denis Mcmahon,to use a little more vibrato in my playing of airs on the fiddle.
DenisMcmahon is not a classically trained fiddle player,but a traditional fiddler,and he suggested using vibrato.
I think the use of vibrato,providing its not overdone,and isnt too wide,is a good addition to the music.clearly Denis Mcmahon thinks so too.
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
I pretty recently started trying to figure out the fiddling style, so I might still be "fresh" enough to state what she should pay attention to early on...
There are a lot of similarities to the rules of interpreting Baroque violin music. Most of the basic forms are based on dance rhythms and you need to learn the patterns/tempos. Vibrato isn't used much and would never be very wide. The ornaments aren't written out and it is customary for you to add them in yourself. You don't improvise, you embellish. The music is melody driven, not harmony driven. For ex. chord backing is completely optional, and doesn't normally follow a specific pattern. There is not really an bass either, so the melodies typically have a rhythmic pulse to them. You can alter notes and rhythms a bit for variation if you stay in the general framework. As a guideline, don't play anything that would clash much if someone else was playing the melody at the same time. The specific speed and articulation of the ornaments has specific conventions that you just have to learn by hearing them. Turns and grace notes dominate the choices, but they have different names for them. I've yet to hear any trills. Favor left hand ornaments over bowing devices for articulation. For ex. , there is an odd device where you "pull off" the string on a grace note to accent the "real note" without changing bow speed/pressure/direction (cut). Most of the time your bow will never leave the string. Occasionally you'll pick it up for "space" between notes, not so much for the articulation of hitting the string on the way down. Bowing patterns are going to be very awkward at first. Many are designed to accent certain beats in a bar defining a rhythmic pattern rather than to set up a musical phrase. It's really important to figure these out right away. You'll have to figure out how to phrase despite the bowing pattern. A big fat tone - not important. Economy of motion is the general rule. There is a notion of "lift" which is somewhat like swing in jazz but is achieved as much (more?) through articulation than just manipulating the timing of a dotted rhythm. It's a LOT more subtle than a swing feel. Have fun figuring that out. Finally - the music isn't really fiddle dominated. Much of the elements are probably more derived early on from the various pipes/winds (different limitations), which might help explain why certain "devices" dominate over others - the fiddlers were copying what the pipes/winds were doing. With all that in mind, take everyone else's great advice: and listen carefully to how the music is put together.
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
dickens, you're right, there is certainly a use for vibrato in traditional music. You can hear vibrato in the playing of loads of well-known fiddlers.
Chadmills, I don't wanna split hairs, but the written music in no way shows everything a classical player needs to know. Just like in this music, it's about listening, passed-down knowledge, and being around people that know how to do it.
Listen, lots, and try to be in the presence of those who know how to produce the right sounds, that's really about it.
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
Id have to agree that in the playing of slow airs, a touch of vibrato can be used to good effect. But a touch, and a ITM specific vibrato at that. However this is the only time vibrato is acceptable . Indiscriminate application to any note long enough is one of those things that bug me. One of the difficulties faced by 'classical' fidlers approaching this genre.
Another is to assume that if the note can be ornamented then thats what they should do, nothing could be further from the truth. ornaments are to be viewed as variation. The melody is the prime factor.
The idea is not to be 'clever', not to show how good you are as a fiddler[violinist], but to lose the 'head' and 'be' the tune. This is hard for intellectuals to understand perhaps.
This is dance music, trance music even! this is one reason why it can be so powerfull. Not in an intellectual way, but in a spiritual [ spirit-full ?] way. ...... or..
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
That's a sharp contrast to American fiddling styles (U.S., that is), many of which are quite blatantly "contest" oriented. A lot of American players never figure that out. Individuality is such a strong element in the general American culture, it's easy to see why.
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
3 words: NO SHEET MUSIC! They need to learn by ear or else they're going to take a classical approach (including playing directly from sheet music) to learning traditional fiddle music. Get them a teacher, at least to get them started, for a few months, and a few good, classic, traditional fiddle albums to listen to and play along with. That plus playing in sessions should break them of their classical habits in a year or two. If they're trying to play both classical and Irish/Scottish at the same time, good luck. It's very difficult for a classicly trained violinist to learn to play Irish music without giving up classical music entirely. Not impossible, just very difficult, depending on how long they've been playing classical music. I don't think books or tutorials are the best way to go, especially with a language barrier between you two. That won't teach her the bowing and fingering techniques of traditional music that are so different from classical. Try recording several simple tunes for her and having her practice along with them.
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
I quite agree with the exceptions to what I said pointed out by the "hare splitters" (!) but,
You've got to be able to take the vibrato out before you can put it back in the right places.
I quite agree that there's a huge amount of artistry and interpretation as applied to "the composer's intention" written down on the page, but there's a change of mindset needed to realise that the dots may be "wrong" or misleading, and that they're just a sketch of one way to play the tune etc.
I'm not sure teachers or sessions are an option for breqwas and friend, neither are books. Hopefully fine advice from you folks will get them started!
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
I don't play the fiddle, but Matt Cranitch's book has a lot of info about bowing in there that would be useful. I don't know if you can quite pick up bowing by ear alone.
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
As a classically trained violinist who's been working hard for the last 3 years or so to unlearn some of my "bad" habits, I agree with the preceding posts. Although I still have a long way to go, here's my 2 cents for what it's worth.
I think the key difference between playing the violin and playing the fiddle, is that with the violin you work very very hard to eliminate the natural unevenness of playing, whereas with the fiddle you harness that unevenness to provide rhythm and groove. This is a difficult thing for a classical violinist to unlearn.
1. Absolutely: listen listen listen.
2. Throw away the sheet music. Until she gets the hang of it she should learn everything by ear. This will definitely slow things down to start with, but she'll make faster progress in the long run.
3. Practice different rhythmic and bowing patterns using repeated eighth notes. Using a metronome can help. In a group of 8 eighth notes, practice accenting 2, 4, 6, and 8 (the upbows); then 3 and 7; then 1, 4, and 7. Practice slurring 4, 5, and 6 - this will naturally put an accent on a downbow on 7. There are of course many other possible rhythm/bowing patterns but this is a good set to start out with to help her get the groove. Seldom if ever should 1 and 5 be accented. This is counterintuitive for classical violinists and it took me a couple years of hard work for it to start coming naturally.
4. Start overlaying the rhythmic/bowing patterns onto tunes. Try different patterns with the same tune. What seemed easy when you were playing repeated eighth notes suddenly becomes a lot more difficult.
5. In general, fiddle tunes take a lot less vibrato than classical players use. While vibrato certainly has its place and can be used to great effect in fiddle music, she should practice supressing it completely until she is able to summon it at will. It's hard for classical players to not use vibrato all the time, whereas in fiddle music it is used sparingly and deliberately.
6. Keep the bow on the string, don't stop it between notes, and eliminate the space between the notes. The tunes may be fast but they are not stacatto. Think of the bow as moving in a circle where it doesn't stop moving as it changes direction. Part of what makes classical players sound classical is the articulation of the notes. Get rid of it. (Yes, in fiddle music the bow often leaves the string, but in a very different way than it typically does in classical music. As with vibrato, she should practice suppressing it until she gets the groove down, then she can reintroduce it in a controlled way.)
7. I wouldn't worry so much about ornamentation. That comes pretty naturally from listening, and is not counter-intuitive for a classical player (at least it wasn't for me).
8. Get the groove going. This is really hard to explain without sound - it's about playing with drive but not necessarily playing fast, playing with rhythm and offbeats and not just 1 2 3 4, playing in such a way that people listening want to move or tap their feet. I took Scottish dance lessons for awhile, which I found very helpful.
9. Listen. Alasdair Fraser and Natalie Haas are a really good example of what I mean by groove: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjdOcQNg9N0&feature=related
Most of all though, it's about having fun. Don't forget to have fun!
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
Good points fiddlebliss. I'd just disagree about "eliminate the space between the notes. The tunes may be fast but they are not stacatto"
That "space between the notes" is very necessary to lift, though more perhaps in polkas etc than in reels. It's not so much the space between the notes that can be a classical giveaway as the way it's done.
It's nearly all about that right arm.
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
You're absolutely right that fiddle music has lift and air, chadmills, but it's achieved differently. The bow shouldn't come to a complete stop, and it shouldn't be bouncy. That beautiful articulation that a classical player worked so hard to achieve can make fiddle playing sound stilted. I agree it's a fine line, but to start with I'd recommend working on keeping the bow moving and eliminating the space between the notes. The lift and the air can be reintroduced later: deliberately instead of out of habit. Anyway, that's what has worked for me.
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
I think we probably agree from different angles fiddlebliss!
I'd think that if someone moves to a trad rather than classical way of using their right arm, the issue will disappear.
Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
I'm a whistle player myself, rather newbie one. I play irish and scottish music. Right now I'm trying to make a band.
Ant there is a girl who wants to play with us. She is classicaly trained violin player, and she plays really great. But when she plays some jig or hornpipe from the sheetmusic I gave her, that sounds like classical music, not irish.
So we need something like, say, "irish fiddle introduction for violin player in N easy steps". If you can get that on the web - that will be perfect, as ordering&shippig books from US or Europe is expensive and takes lots of time.
Another bad thing is that she does not know English (we are in Moscow, Russia), so we defenitely don't want any BIG books - I'll have to translate for her, and I don't think I want to read&translate hundreds of pages.
Anyway, she has a very good ear and is willing to learn - I'm sure that listening to CDs of great fiddlers (like, say, Tommy Peoples or Kevin Burke) will help her to improve - but she needs something to start with. And I can't help her, as I know nothing about classical music training and fiddle playing.
I will be very grateful for any links, advice or ideas.
# Posted on December 20th 2007 by breqwas
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
Tunes don't need translating - LOTS of listening will help a lot. As far as books, I've found Mel Bay's Complete Irish FIddle Player by Peter Cooper to be helpful. My copy didn't come with a CD but apparently there is a companion CD so you can listen to the techniques and tunes in the book.
# Posted on December 20th 2007 by aikifiddler
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
That's a good book, but there's no subsitute for just immersing yourself in listening. That's the only true cure for the dreaded classical music ailment, non stop listening. Osmosis is the best tool at a brain's disposal.
# Posted on December 20th 2007 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
As someone who has crossed over, I can say that listening is the best way to learn about the nuances in ITM. Playing with someone that knows what they are doing is invaluable. Lacking that, use recordings and listen.
A couple of pointers: keep the bow on the string, find the "groove," and listen, listen, listen!
Good luck!
# Posted on December 20th 2007 by wyogal
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
No vibrato! Some classical players find this hard not to do!
Listening is crucial, but watching also helps. Watching videos, even on youtube.com will help to show how the bowing and use of the right arm is very different.
There is a need to accept that written music does not give all the information as it does in classical playing. In particular the rhythm is nearly always different from what is notated. This is most obvious in hornpipes where pairs of 8th notes are played unequal as "dotted" or triplets, or somewhere between. But the main thing is to get away from notation anyway.
# Posted on December 20th 2007 by TomB-R
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
Matt Cranitch has a good book with a CD. I don't know that he says "do this ye classical fiddlers and be cured" but you can listen and hear for yourself how the sheet music isn't a perfect match.
# Posted on December 20th 2007 by sbhikes
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
The following site will present you with the biggest choice of traditional music books, tutors etc. that you are likely to find in the UK:
http://www.themusicroom-online.co.uk
- They might have something helpful!
# Posted on December 20th 2007 by nicholas
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
No vibrato! Some classical players find this hard not to do!
so spoke chad mills.
I was advised by a comhaltas judge,a well respected sliabh Luchra fiddle player by the name of Denis Mcmahon,to use a little more vibrato in my playing of airs on the fiddle.
DenisMcmahon is not a classically trained fiddle player,but a traditional fiddler,and he suggested using vibrato.
I think the use of vibrato,providing its not overdone,and isnt too wide,is a good addition to the music.clearly Denis Mcmahon thinks so too.
# Posted on December 20th 2007 by dickens metrognome
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
I pretty recently started trying to figure out the fiddling style, so I might still be "fresh" enough to state what she should pay attention to early on...
There are a lot of similarities to the rules of interpreting Baroque violin music. Most of the basic forms are based on dance rhythms and you need to learn the patterns/tempos. Vibrato isn't used much and would never be very wide. The ornaments aren't written out and it is customary for you to add them in yourself. You don't improvise, you embellish. The music is melody driven, not harmony driven. For ex. chord backing is completely optional, and doesn't normally follow a specific pattern. There is not really an bass either, so the melodies typically have a rhythmic pulse to them. You can alter notes and rhythms a bit for variation if you stay in the general framework. As a guideline, don't play anything that would clash much if someone else was playing the melody at the same time. The specific speed and articulation of the ornaments has specific conventions that you just have to learn by hearing them. Turns and grace notes dominate the choices, but they have different names for them. I've yet to hear any trills. Favor left hand ornaments over bowing devices for articulation. For ex. , there is an odd device where you "pull off" the string on a grace note to accent the "real note" without changing bow speed/pressure/direction (cut). Most of the time your bow will never leave the string. Occasionally you'll pick it up for "space" between notes, not so much for the articulation of hitting the string on the way down. Bowing patterns are going to be very awkward at first. Many are designed to accent certain beats in a bar defining a rhythmic pattern rather than to set up a musical phrase. It's really important to figure these out right away. You'll have to figure out how to phrase despite the bowing pattern. A big fat tone - not important. Economy of motion is the general rule. There is a notion of "lift" which is somewhat like swing in jazz but is achieved as much (more?) through articulation than just manipulating the timing of a dotted rhythm. It's a LOT more subtle than a swing feel. Have fun figuring that out. Finally - the music isn't really fiddle dominated. Much of the elements are probably more derived early on from the various pipes/winds (different limitations), which might help explain why certain "devices" dominate over others - the fiddlers were copying what the pipes/winds were doing. With all that in mind, take everyone else's great advice: and listen carefully to how the music is put together.
How was that?
# Posted on December 20th 2007 by monkey440
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
dickens, you're right, there is certainly a use for vibrato in traditional music. You can hear vibrato in the playing of loads of well-known fiddlers.
Chadmills, I don't wanna split hairs, but the written music in no way shows everything a classical player needs to know. Just like in this music, it's about listening, passed-down knowledge, and being around people that know how to do it.
Listen, lots, and try to be in the presence of those who know how to produce the right sounds, that's really about it.
# Posted on December 20th 2007 by reenactor
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
Id have to agree that in the playing of slow airs, a touch of vibrato can be used to good effect. But a touch, and a ITM specific vibrato at that. However this is the only time vibrato is acceptable . Indiscriminate application to any note long enough is one of those things that bug me. One of the difficulties faced by 'classical' fidlers approaching this genre.
or..
Another is to assume that if the note can be ornamented then thats what they should do, nothing could be further from the truth. ornaments are to be viewed as variation. The melody is the prime factor.
The idea is not to be 'clever', not to show how good you are as a fiddler[violinist], but to lose the 'head' and 'be' the tune. This is hard for intellectuals to understand perhaps.
This is dance music, trance music even! this is one reason why it can be so powerfull. Not in an intellectual way, but in a spiritual [ spirit-full ?] way. ......
# Posted on December 20th 2007 by jig
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
That's a sharp contrast to American fiddling styles (U.S., that is), many of which are quite blatantly "contest" oriented. A lot of American players never figure that out. Individuality is such a strong element in the general American culture, it's easy to see why.
# Posted on December 20th 2007 by monkey440
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
Listen well. That should change their approach to bowing, the biggest difference between a violinist and a fiddler.
# Posted on December 20th 2007 by drone
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
Lots of good advice so far. Also, search YouTube for:
Martin Hayes
Kevin Burke
Frankie Gavin
Liz Carroll
Charlie Lennon
Randal Bays
Brian Conway
Jerry Holland
Sean Smyth
Natalie MacMaster
# Posted on December 21st 2007 by mickray
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
also
Alasdair Fraser
Ashley MacIsaac
# Posted on December 21st 2007 by mickray
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
3 words: NO SHEET MUSIC! They need to learn by ear or else they're going to take a classical approach (including playing directly from sheet music) to learning traditional fiddle music. Get them a teacher, at least to get them started, for a few months, and a few good, classic, traditional fiddle albums to listen to and play along with. That plus playing in sessions should break them of their classical habits in a year or two. If they're trying to play both classical and Irish/Scottish at the same time, good luck. It's very difficult for a classicly trained violinist to learn to play Irish music without giving up classical music entirely. Not impossible, just very difficult, depending on how long they've been playing classical music. I don't think books or tutorials are the best way to go, especially with a language barrier between you two. That won't teach her the bowing and fingering techniques of traditional music that are so different from classical. Try recording several simple tunes for her and having her practice along with them.
# Posted on December 21st 2007 by FidDLe01
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
I quite agree with the exceptions to what I said pointed out by the "hare splitters" (!) but,
You've got to be able to take the vibrato out before you can put it back in the right places.
I quite agree that there's a huge amount of artistry and interpretation as applied to "the composer's intention" written down on the page, but there's a change of mindset needed to realise that the dots may be "wrong" or misleading, and that they're just a sketch of one way to play the tune etc.
I'm not sure teachers or sessions are an option for breqwas and friend, neither are books. Hopefully fine advice from you folks will get them started!
# Posted on December 21st 2007 by TomB-R
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
I don't play the fiddle, but Matt Cranitch's book has a lot of info about bowing in there that would be useful. I don't know if you can quite pick up bowing by ear alone.
# Posted on December 21st 2007 by sbhikes
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
As a classically trained violinist who's been working hard for the last 3 years or so to unlearn some of my "bad" habits, I agree with the preceding posts. Although I still have a long way to go, here's my 2 cents for what it's worth.
I think the key difference between playing the violin and playing the fiddle, is that with the violin you work very very hard to eliminate the natural unevenness of playing, whereas with the fiddle you harness that unevenness to provide rhythm and groove. This is a difficult thing for a classical violinist to unlearn.
1. Absolutely: listen listen listen.
2. Throw away the sheet music. Until she gets the hang of it she should learn everything by ear. This will definitely slow things down to start with, but she'll make faster progress in the long run.
3. Practice different rhythmic and bowing patterns using repeated eighth notes. Using a metronome can help. In a group of 8 eighth notes, practice accenting 2, 4, 6, and 8 (the upbows); then 3 and 7; then 1, 4, and 7. Practice slurring 4, 5, and 6 - this will naturally put an accent on a downbow on 7. There are of course many other possible rhythm/bowing patterns but this is a good set to start out with to help her get the groove. Seldom if ever should 1 and 5 be accented. This is counterintuitive for classical violinists and it took me a couple years of hard work for it to start coming naturally.
4. Start overlaying the rhythmic/bowing patterns onto tunes. Try different patterns with the same tune. What seemed easy when you were playing repeated eighth notes suddenly becomes a lot more difficult.
5. In general, fiddle tunes take a lot less vibrato than classical players use. While vibrato certainly has its place and can be used to great effect in fiddle music, she should practice supressing it completely until she is able to summon it at will. It's hard for classical players to not use vibrato all the time, whereas in fiddle music it is used sparingly and deliberately.
6. Keep the bow on the string, don't stop it between notes, and eliminate the space between the notes. The tunes may be fast but they are not stacatto. Think of the bow as moving in a circle where it doesn't stop moving as it changes direction. Part of what makes classical players sound classical is the articulation of the notes. Get rid of it. (Yes, in fiddle music the bow often leaves the string, but in a very different way than it typically does in classical music. As with vibrato, she should practice suppressing it until she gets the groove down, then she can reintroduce it in a controlled way.)
7. I wouldn't worry so much about ornamentation. That comes pretty naturally from listening, and is not counter-intuitive for a classical player (at least it wasn't for me).
8. Get the groove going. This is really hard to explain without sound - it's about playing with drive but not necessarily playing fast, playing with rhythm and offbeats and not just 1 2 3 4, playing in such a way that people listening want to move or tap their feet. I took Scottish dance lessons for awhile, which I found very helpful.
9. Listen. Alasdair Fraser and Natalie Haas are a really good example of what I mean by groove:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjdOcQNg9N0&feature=related
Most of all though, it's about having fun. Don't forget to have fun!
# Posted on December 21st 2007 by fiddlebliss
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
Good points fiddlebliss. I'd just disagree about "eliminate the space between the notes. The tunes may be fast but they are not stacatto"
That "space between the notes" is very necessary to lift, though more perhaps in polkas etc than in reels. It's not so much the space between the notes that can be a classical giveaway as the way it's done.
It's nearly all about that right arm.
# Posted on December 21st 2007 by TomB-R
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
Wow! Thank you for your advice. That should help a lot.
# Posted on December 21st 2007 by breqwas
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
You're absolutely right that fiddle music has lift and air, chadmills, but it's achieved differently. The bow shouldn't come to a complete stop, and it shouldn't be bouncy. That beautiful articulation that a classical player worked so hard to achieve can make fiddle playing sound stilted. I agree it's a fine line, but to start with I'd recommend working on keeping the bow moving and eliminating the space between the notes. The lift and the air can be reintroduced later: deliberately instead of out of habit. Anyway, that's what has worked for me.
# Posted on December 21st 2007 by fiddlebliss
Re: Introducing violin player to irish/scottish fiddling
I think we probably agree from different angles fiddlebliss!
I'd think that if someone moves to a trad rather than classical way of using their right arm, the issue will disappear.
# Posted on December 21st 2007 by TomB-R