I am mediocre on bodhran, novice on whistle and weak on flute. I have been playing bass guitar for almost 30 years, mostly metal, folk-rock, post-punk, Motown, and have thought of bringing my bass ability into a session. I never see bass in a session, though I know there are some trad bass out there (Lunasa comes to mind).
Also, I have been trying to pick up some bass lines by playing along on tunes but am really finding it more challenging than picking up much more complex rock songs, as they have more a blues progression than trad. Does anyone know if the bass in ITM is still tuned GDAE? Or is there another tuning for trad like on other stringed instruments? Also, if any bassists are reading, is there a preference between fretted and fretless? Or does any of this really matter? Reason I am asking all this is because I am looking at purchasing an acoustic bass (already have 4 fretted electrics but am assuming bringing them to sessions with a small amp is forboden) and want to see if either frets or no frets is better suited to trad.
Fretless. Dont listen to naysayers, unless they are at the session in which case respect is due. I find playing the bass very hard for trad . So good luck.
I came to playing music through the bass as well (I have a fretless acoustic-electric which I haven't been playing for too long...it had such a sweet tone...). I tried playing bass in a session for a little while and eventually switched to banjo. While you can fit in if you are laid-back enough and don't push to be heard above the din, bass really doesn't fit in so well. In session playing, the rhythm is really driven by the melody players; in other forms of music, there are pockets for bass to fit in well.
That said, if you can pick up a nice fretless acoustic bass guit, go for it...but beware that the harmonic structures of the Irish music will make all the pentatonic/blues comfort zone drop out from under you! But it sure is fun for the ride.
I have seen it work well and also as a disaster of Biblical proportions . It depends a lot on the mix ,that is why it works better in a band such as Lunasa I would not risk it until you are sure only consenting adults are about
I think the cautions expressed above and elsewhere are well-founded. It's a lot more difficult than you'd expect to play good bass under session tunes, for a lot of reasons. If you are really interested, though, you might ask one or two of the players you like at your session to try it out with you, maybe at your place - not in the session. It'll be a lot easier for you if there's only one person playing the tune, and if you're both there to experiment. If it works, maybe you can try it out at the session. If not, it's another great idea that didn't quite make it out of the lab.
I've heard it done and I think it's just awful. I only think that, I don't know it. God, I'm finding I have to be so equivocal these days. But good luck. Be quiet with it and be discreet and try to not sound like you've just come from a bluegrass band.
I play the electric bass in my barn-dance band, which is a completely different kettle of tea.
I've enjoyed it a lot over the years, and it makes sense in a dance situation with the public, to have that consistent beat under the melody ( we don't have a drummer ).
For a session - I'm not so sure. I already hold fairly strong views about guitars, bodhrans, and other purveyors of rhythm; I reckon one of each in a session is enough. If you want to take along a bass you have the same problems as guitars and other chordal instruments, you have to either know the tunes or be very quick about picking up the chordal patterns for each tune, or you will annoy to the nth degree your fellow sessioneers. Also most acoustic basses ( guitar-bodied basses ) are actually poor on acoustic response and really need an amp.
But if you're determined, I'ld go for a fretless too.
There is normally a bass player at The Maltings session in York. He seems to do alright at adds something to the sound (in a good way) but if I recall, his bass is smaller than a normal one. At the end of the day, you can always have a go if nothing else.
We've had a double bass turn up a couple of times and it worked extremely well. Mind you, he is a highly accomplished player who has been around the scene for a long time and knows the music. He also played pretty quietly most of the time.
Listening to the left hand playing by good piano players like Charlie Lennon, Felix Dolan, Geraldine Cotter (to name just a few) could be instructive.
Not Irish, but there's some bass playing on Jean-Michel Veillon's "Er Pasker." And the Chris Norman Ensemble sports a bass, although they lean more toward Scottish/Cape Breton fare.
Here's my two cents- (conservatory grad, classical double bass major, as well as countless jazz, show, GB gigs on bass guitar)
You would be more attuned to the trad-acoustic ethos with a standard, unamplified double bass, but may not be entirely welcome in all sessions because you take up a lot of room, and it is not seen as "trad" in all quarters.
I would have to fortify myself with several Guinnesses before I could ever bring my electric bass guitar to our session.
I'm a lifelong bass player, but I have a lot more fun playing flute and whistle at our session, since we bass players NEVER get to play the melody, which of course is dominant in ITM.
I was a working bass player for 20 odd years but I picked up the banjo when I switched full time to Irish session music. (seems to be a rather common transition around here...) I suppose if you are determined to give bass a try in a session I would only say to you what I would say to any backing musician - it would be best if you only played on the tunes you are familiar with. Best of luck to you - However, I think in the long run, if you throw yourself headlong into the pursuit of your whistle, flute and/or bodhran, you'll be much happier 5 years from now.
Hopefully I am not trying to high-jack this thread (please ignore this if I am!), but on the same subject:
Are basses becoming more common at sessions?
There are only a few sessions near me, but one does have a guitarist (electric) who follows along with bass lines and walking accompaniments.
It does not particularly work for me with the ceili music, at least not yet or as attempted by that particular musician. However, I wonder might this be the next coming thing at the more "open" sessions? As in, is this the next bouzouki, or mandolin or, reaching perhaps further, piano accordian?
See if you can get hold of a copy of Fairport Convention's "Bonny Bunch Of Roses" album. The first track is "Jams O'Donnell's Jig" played by Dave Pegg on electric bass. Majic.
As a matter of fact, I used to play the Musical Priest on fretless bass in a surf/punk band I played with for a while - it served as an introduction to another song. It turns out that's a good tune for the electric bass, its range (F#- b) is just perfect.
It can be done if you think more like a cello player with light sympathetic lines that have something to do with the melody .
You are obviously a very experienced bassist looking at your post and you've got a lot of styles.
I always liked the way the old motown players and African American players in general have this very mobile, abstract way of playing and understate the root notes but do a lot of other stuff to outline the chord. They also do a lot of understating the down beat as well. Thats why that stuff is so
danceable. Your mind and feet are filling in where the downbeats are.
Of course, I'm referring to approaches to dance music playing bass and what seems to work in another genre. But it is a certain mindset that works to me and its a lot different to say , Rock or country 2 to the bar. I steer well clear of those feels myself as they hold the music down.
Our session is blessed with an excellent double bass player who we all agree is much missed when he is unable to attend.
Simple bass lines tastefully applied, occasional bowed drones, excellent!
Hi, my brother (kevin doherty) plays bass regulary in sessions and with well known musicians, it adds nicely to the session if played right, same as any instrument! he plays a 3/4 size double bass. ive often seen other bass players in sessions, paul o drisscoll, many others etc. practice with cds first see what your like, if you think your good enought then bring it to the session,
It all depends on how recently the bass was caught. We usually don't have this problem here because we have easy access to fresh grouper right from the Gulf of Mexico.
I played bass for years before going to sessions, but this was in addition to a GHB background, so my perspective may be a bit different.
I would *avoid* the whole I/V thump-thump style all together. The guy in Lunasa does this extremely rarely, for effect. It immediately introduces a "squaredance" kind of vibe.
You may be better off treating the bass like a large bouzouki or DADGAD guitar - use open strings to drone and do light countermelodies on top of the drone. Even then, it's a style that would be good intermittently but not on every tune.
As a bass player of thirty years it may be difficult to accept that in this field you are a rank beginer. There will be plenty of crossover but i assure you it will be just as hard to do well as learning another instrument[ or harder!]
However once you can do it your skills will be much in demand with serious musicians. I would actually suggest a 3/4 size double bass. The volume from an acc bass gtr is not up to it. A mute can be used if it is too loud.
And any band with a double bass gains immensely from the shear size and mass of the sound and from the instrument visually .
A local bass player is a full time jazz musician, very quick at picking things up, but he admits to struggling with Irish (and Northumbrian 9/8s) - he says the chords change in unexpected places.
An Irish sesh is probably not the place to be learning to accompany on bass.
Why do all these players who by their own admitance are mediocre on some instruments (and non-instruments), not learn their trade by playing along to recordings/internet etc at home instead of wanting to do it straight away in a sesson?
There was a great track on the first Slainte Mhath album with a bass playing the melody line all the way through. It was a great piece of playing but I imagine it would be exhausting if you had to keep it up due to the stretch. Unless you have hands like a gibbon of course.....
I learnt my first tunes on the bass, but it is simply inappropriate to do this in a session[and damned hard!] If you are serious, you will have an awful lot of work ahead of you. learning the tunes on a whistle or something is really a requisite to any competence in this style.
You would hardly expect to walk into an orchestra and jam along now would you?
The last two tracks, at least, on
"Fiddle Sticks, Irish Traditional Music From Donegal: http://www.thesession.org/recordings/display.php/202
have some very tasteful bass playing, that adds to the mix. This is a lovely album.
Aye Curamach, if I'm not mistaken, I think it was a Scottish musician playing that Bass, one Alan Clark.
As Bliss says, in a session a Bass tends to make a Bodhran superfluous, so maybe, in years to come, who knows, maybe the Bass will actually take over completely from the Bodhran, in ITM session & then the only place you'll see a Bodhran is hanging up in a museum .... no doubt, with a mummified Bodhran player hanging by it's side!
Ralphus, from what I can gather, a fretless is more suited to songs & a fretted to tunes.
As for an Acoustic Bass, my son used to play one sometimes, but it was never really loud enough in a full session, except when he had it plugged into a small amp under his seat. Certainly I'd say an Acoustic Bass, discreetly plugged in, does look far more appropriate than a Fender Electric Jazz Bass, next to Whistles, Fiddles & Concertinas.
As far as I can see, there's little or no difference between those folk who use microphones in the Trad sessions in all those tourist pub sessions & an electric Bass in a session.
Salt for the Goose & Guinness for the Gander etc etc
Someone famous dude once said - "Power corrupts & absolute Power corrupts absolutely" Hmmm, I wonder were they talking about Electrical Power?
For once i agree with you BB, thanks for pointing out that a bass is a real instrument, i am not an idiot! What i meant to say is, leave your bass at home if you want to play it in a ITM session. There is no place for it, Lunasa and other bands use the bass, but that is in a completely different context. I can only say this: Learn an instrument that is suited to sessions, fiddle, whistle, flute, banjo, box, concertina etc, even god help us a bodhran.....leave your preconceived notions about how good you are at the bass at home. If you are serious about learning ITM that is...... good luck!
Well tombo, we shall have to agree to disagree....I feel that a bass is more than welcome in a session[in the hands of someone who understands this idiom] though obviously not all sessions! I agree fully that the Bodhran is in a way the bass in/of trad. but i would like to think a sensitive,responsive, bodhran player and a sensitive, responsive, bass player could work together well with a bit of practice and co-ordination. To forstall any sarcastic comments id like to say i know bass players and drummers who fit with in this description, and sadly too many melody players who dont.
I see your point Jig, and I love a sensitive WELL played bodhran as backing, such as that of Late in the evening or Sir Nose over here in oz...but i really don't think that a bass player has any place in a ITM session...especially an electric one with an amp!!! To be even more controversal, I have never understood why someone would want to play a bass in a session in the first place, that goes for someone playing a trumpet in a session...they sound good in their own music genre but NOT IN ITM!! I know I will be up for the old "purist or a "conservative traditionalist" label but there is no better session than one where everyone is enjoying the tunes and playing them on traditional session instruments. And I don't care what you think !
the point here is, as far as im concerned, any instrument, and i mean any, as long as its played well and in tune is welcome to any session im in, forget this talk of learning " regular session instruments", whats that all about? theres plenty of melody instruments about what we need is more people adding good backing! why would you discourage somebody from trying to learn an instrument for a session? ive had some great sessions with , bass's, saxaphones, keyboards, snare drums, neil yates a fantastic melody player on trumpet, subtle bass playing adds nicely, anyone that reckons it doesnt, i honestly think they actually dont know what their talking about or just have not had an enough experience, or else there just too stuck in their old ways of play old tunes on traditional instruments with no room for change or backing.
Practice the bass with cds lad, see how it goes, find a sound bunch of sessioners and try it out, dont mind most of the opinions on here cause they dont actually matter! go for it.
yeah what ever S.Doherty! You sound like a few i have come across before...question the "old" ways if you like, at the end of the day the tradition will always hold out and it won't include trumpets, basses, keyboards, saxs and what ever tickles your fancy!
"Irish Bass Protection and Awareness Group
Who are we?
The Irish Bass Protection and Awareness Group was formed in response to the decline of European Sea Bass (Dicentrarchus Labrax) in Irish coastal waters. Despite the bye-laws and regulations that have existed to protect Bass in Ireland since 1990, scientific evidence shows that stock levels remain severly depleted. We believe that illegal commercial fishing for Bass (poaching), supported by clandestine illegal trading, poses the greatest threat to the survival of Bass in Irish coastal waters."
might i mention that some ceili bands used double bass's a hundred years ago? traditional enough?
if you want people to stay interested in the music then you support musicians and new alternatives.
please dont think you can try and stop irish music moving forward, yes the tradition stays, i like it myself, nothing wrong with it at all, but its great to see new instruments being used and the music being explored. there are a great variety of different types of sessions around,
Tombo many of the instruments frequently used to day are imported. The primary factor for a long time has been financial constraints. Not some obscure view that the melodian or whatever is not a traditional instrument. The younger generation in Ireland are the people who will pass the tradition on. If you could see the breadth of young talent here in Ireland you might not be so sure of your position. There is no one' tradition' carved in stone but many . They are living and in good hands.
As it happens there are historical records stretching back to the 17th century attesting to the presance of Viols in Ireland. they simply became generally unfordable due to the imposition of Colonial rule. Now lets not get started on that subject eh?
The fact is S.Doherty that even if ceili bands used double bass's a hundred years ago the bass doesn't have a place in sessions. Ceili bands are a whole new argument anyway....I am in no way trying to stop irish music moving forward, I am just stating that why must you experiment and include instruments such as the bass in a session just to "keep people interested in the music"? Explore all the music you want just do it at home and don't subject other people to the plonk of the bass, the tooting of the trumpet or what ever you think is arty farty and makes you a big head in some ego driven music scene!
Fair enough Jig and I am well aware of the breathe and talent of the new generation in ireland. I am not agruing the debate of what are "traditional instruments" in ireland as I am also well aware of when the different instruments appeared in ITM. What i am saying is some instruments really don't have a place in the ITM session, these including basses, saxes, keyboards, trumpets etc...... I know there isn't one tradition carved out in stone also, so don't come over all "I am irish so listen to me all you foriegners as you don't know what you are talking about" either, the tradition does however have boundaries that are increasingly being crossed, mostly to satisfy the egocentric drive of people bent on using it for their own self gratification or because they really don't understand the music.
mmm i have to say, tombo your comments to not impress or convince me,
these boundaries you speak off? who sets them? i think these boundaries are in your head!
fact of the matter is, ive heard many sax players who are brilliant at play reels etc, much better than the common joe soap in fiddle. keyboarda, yes. bass yes, they all get the thumbs up from me, dont mind you trying to dictate whats allowed and what suits? who are you to decided? its a free world and music is there to be enjoyed.
im not on here to make enemys, why cant you except irish music for what it is? i know what it is? i play it every day of the week, ive been numerous festivals this year, i see and hear what goes on, i know what people like!
>>the tradition does however have boundaries that are increasingly being crossed, mostly to satisfy the egocentric drive of people bent on using it for their own self gratification or because they really don't understand the music.<<
I would'nt dissagree with that, but at the same time who is qualified to define exactly what the tradition is?
All we can do is give our opinion. nothing more. there are certain constants fair enough, certain traits everyone would agree on[maybe not!] but to define something automatically constrains it within the conceptual framework of that definition. your very language may not have enough concepts to define and constrain ITM.
We can define something roughly at a certain stage for a certain group of people, but only for those people at that time.
For example at this time some groups of people around the world define ITM as ' fill in the blanks '. but that doesnt mean that therefor everyone must or does use that same definition.
I hope you dont get offended by this but i would not define your position re the bass as 'traditionalist', but as 'reactionary'.
so you see it means different things to different people', your definition is not the same as mine.
The notion that any instrument played well within this idiom is ok, (although well meaning and romantic,) is quite far from the reality of a real session.
Jig I have no doubt you know some quality bass players and drummers who would do well and add to the session with their instruments. I'm sure you would agree however, that those folks you know are in the %.0001 percentage of bass players/drummers in the world who actually have a clue. I tend to agree with Tombo on this. The bass players and drummers I have seen and heard who attempt to play in a session know zilch about Irish session music, and make an unholy racket trying to guess what it is everyone else is playing.
Ralphus - leave your bass at home and continue your pursuit of the flute, whistle or bodhran. I promise you will be happier for it in a few years. Good Luck.
yes, probably. JNE , which is why i would strongly encourage a serious musician with an interest in playing trad to settle down , study hard and become well acquainted with the tunes, idiom, chord patterns and all other aspects of ITM that might or might not be relevant. whatever instrument they might play.
Stressing the point that fluency in jazz, classical or pretty much any other type of music will not automatically crossover into trad. That there are no short cuts. That it will be no easier than learning another instrument but that once that work is done and the transition made there will be many positive bonuses.
My advice to any one beginning trad is to leave their instrument at home, practice damn hard with good instruction for a while. until fluency is attained in,a selection of tunes.
I dont mean struggle through them without too many mistakes , but a nice polished performance. In fact play just one tune well ,a beautiful air and you will probably be welcome for your contribution.
Mixed opinions, as in everything else. Ask the sessioners you play with for their feedback. We have an electric, fretless bass player and play in a very noisy place, so it helps fill in the sound.
Ask to try and see what they think. They may enjoy it.
I'd be happy to play an acoustic bass giuitar in my session, if I weren't already playing tunes and chords on my 'zouk. Why play the bass when you CAN play the tunes ?
The tune is the thing !
I agree with what I originally posted, session use a bodhran, "Folk Group" or "Celtic Rock" group, both electrified, use a bass. So I also agree with Tombo and Jusa.
I of all people am not against the music moving forward, I embrace it. But for the life of me, I cannot see that a bass adds anything at a session, and I have experienced such.
OK BB but if you are there then it probably wont! ie it will likely get in the way of the master Bodhran player.
Any instruments that occupy the same register can get in each others way. The bass end more than any. If the bass player played in the higher positions perhaps this clash might not occur,
You have a very valid point. the bodhran is the bass in a sesh,2 bass instruments may well interfere with the enjoyment of the music and players.
Ah we will have to agree to disagree on this one Jig Reactionary or traditionalist I maintain there is no place for a bass in a session. Sorry S.Doherty I just don't agree with you, I am not maintaining rules and regulations but if you actually played ITM and lived the tradition as you claim you do then you would realise that there are certain boundaries as there are to any traditional music.
Thanks for the wealth of opinions and information. I got some good feedback from you all, even Tombo. Being a bass player I know enough not to step on the toes of the other musicians. This is job one, so I wouldn't dare bring a bass to session until the necessary homework is done. I think the fretless is the way to go, from what you've all told me. A 3/4 upright sounds better though I don't drive and the commute on public transport and the cold Chicago winters would not be condusive to lugging it around. I also promise to be a good sessioner by struggling with the flute, whistle etc. ITM is a very melody based genre and I agree the task of trying to add a bass is daunting. I really wouldn't lump it in with keyboards, sax and trumpet. This is unfair, as those are melodic instruments and the bass is usually not. Thanks again!
Don't let them win ralphus. Take your bass to the session. Give it ago. I used to take my uprite bass to the Story Bridge
session every week many years ago and everyone loved it.
The worst thing that happened was that I got a lot of gigs out of it at the time and I didn't have time for the session anymore.If you love making music it will will be good. Some of these guys need to strap one up and chill out.
The problem with acc bass guitar is that its very quiet. Fine for learning but my philosophy is that if i cant hear it whats the point?
Same with drummers who are too shy to let rip and actually be heard. Especially in band situation and i am paying the wages!
However like you say a double bass, the real thing, is mighty large and inconvenient to carry around.
The solution adopted by a friend of mine who has played with numerous luminaries over the years is a radio transmitter 'bug' and a top quality portable amp hidden away in a bag for sound re-enforcement.
Personally i think the double bass is the way forward, but perhaps start off with a fretless Acc bs/gtr for learning and portability. Having a dbl bass, i guess, means having a car to put it in [ or on! a friend of mine used to drive around in a small car dwarfed by the bass on the roof!]
I reckon a walnut fretlessTaylor acoustic bass played with a stiff pick back near the bridge instead of the fingers would cut it and cry out at a session. Expensive, But you only get what you pay for. Jig is right. The cheap ones are useless.
I think there's a lot of future for resonator basses.
I think in the National style ie chrome plated brass
body with definitely a much larger cone would add
enough brightness to make the bass competive in volume. Maybe I'll talk someone I know into making one,
I came to this sort of thing from a folk scene, as the occasional Irish tune would spring up. I've enjoyed the stuff immensely, but never thought to play it with others. I learned of a session nearby, and took stock of all instruments present. Being one who likes to bring something to the table that wasn't there before, I brought my upright. In the folk sessions, you almost never saw one, mainly because it's the biggest pain in the posterior to lug around. However, I hated being guitarist # 9, so out came the bass. For these sessions, however, I was fully aware that I was a bit out of my normal element, so I stayed towards the back, listening more than playing. However, I found myself quite welcomed, even encouraged. The thought that a bass might be unwelcome at a session never crossed my mind until reading such a sentiment recently. Perhaps I was only being tolerated? Who knows? Though the ringleader of this particular session does lurk about these pages, so perhaps he'll drop a note sometime. Until then, I'll continue to frequent the doings, 4 string beast in hand ( though the guitar has come along when said beast was 'under the weather'). I'd like to bring the mandolin and/or the banjo, but the current talent on both are far more capable than I. Besides, I'm a fake banjo player anyhow ( 5 string banjo with drone string removed - remainder tuned to E-A-D-E - guitarlike). In closing, I'll continue to feel welcome until I don't!
I have been playing piano since my mother (who was a music teacher) began teaching me how to play piano when I was seven. In band in junior high and high school, I played the tuba. In my twenties, I switched to playing an electric bass guitar and, when I could afford to buy one, I also began playing a bass fiddle.
When some local musicians started an Irish Session here in 1995, I went to listen and asked which instrument should I bring to the next Session. I was asked to bring my Roland EP-90 Digital Piano because the other musicians thought a piano would add more to the general cacophony than a bass. As a result, for several years, I just brought my electronic piano to the sessions before I began bringing my bass fiddle also. Since I had a better understanding of this music by this time, I was able to play appropriate and effective bass lines for some of the tunes. I would set up my bass fiddle on its stand next to my electronic keyboard and switch back and forth from one instrument to the other depending on what the other musicians were playing.
Occasionally, I have played melody lines on my electronic keyboard but never on my bass.
Yes, even a 3/4 size upright bass is a difficult instrument to carry around and transport--(speaking from experience)--especially getting through doors without hitting something.
Since I was born and raised in Chicago, I can sympathize with Ralphus' comments about the winters there and the traffic.
As for "Tombo", I would recommend psychiatric help and anger management classes.
I've been practicing the chunes (melody, not bass notes) on my double bass- sounds about an octave lower than a viola- 7th position and thumb position- and I just might haul the beast to my session, if I ever get the nerve...
bass in a session
bass in a session
I am mediocre on bodhran, novice on whistle and weak on flute. I have been playing bass guitar for almost 30 years, mostly metal, folk-rock, post-punk, Motown, and have thought of bringing my bass ability into a session. I never see bass in a session, though I know there are some trad bass out there (Lunasa comes to mind).
Also, I have been trying to pick up some bass lines by playing along on tunes but am really finding it more challenging than picking up much more complex rock songs, as they have more a blues progression than trad. Does anyone know if the bass in ITM is still tuned GDAE? Or is there another tuning for trad like on other stringed instruments? Also, if any bassists are reading, is there a preference between fretted and fretless? Or does any of this really matter? Reason I am asking all this is because I am looking at purchasing an acoustic bass (already have 4 fretted electrics but am assuming bringing them to sessions with a small amp is forboden) and want to see if either frets or no frets is better suited to trad.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by ralphus
Re: bass in a session
Fretless. Dont listen to naysayers, unless they are at the session in which case respect is due. I find playing the bass very hard for trad . So good luck.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by the wicked hacker
Re: bass in a session
I came to playing music through the bass as well (I have a fretless acoustic-electric which I haven't been playing for too long...it had such a sweet tone...). I tried playing bass in a session for a little while and eventually switched to banjo. While you can fit in if you are laid-back enough and don't push to be heard above the din, bass really doesn't fit in so well. In session playing, the rhythm is really driven by the melody players; in other forms of music, there are pockets for bass to fit in well.
That said, if you can pick up a nice fretless acoustic bass guit, go for it...but beware that the harmonic structures of the Irish music will make all the pentatonic/blues comfort zone drop out from under you! But it sure is fun for the ride.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by benhockenberry
Re: bass in a session
I have seen it work well and also as a disaster of Biblical proportions . It depends a lot on the mix ,that is why it works better in a band such as Lunasa I would not risk it until you are sure only consenting adults are about
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by bazouki dave
Re: bass in a session
I think the cautions expressed above and elsewhere are well-founded. It's a lot more difficult than you'd expect to play good bass under session tunes, for a lot of reasons. If you are really interested, though, you might ask one or two of the players you like at your session to try it out with you, maybe at your place - not in the session. It'll be a lot easier for you if there's only one person playing the tune, and if you're both there to experiment. If it works, maybe you can try it out at the session. If not, it's another great idea that didn't quite make it out of the lab.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by Jon Kiparsky
Re: bass in a session
I've heard it done and I think it's just awful. I only think that, I don't know it. God, I'm finding I have to be so equivocal these days. But good luck. Be quiet with it and be discreet and try to not sound like you've just come from a bluegrass band.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by Steve Shaw
Re: bass in a session
I play the electric bass in my barn-dance band, which is a completely different kettle of tea.
I've enjoyed it a lot over the years, and it makes sense in a dance situation with the public, to have that consistent beat under the melody ( we don't have a drummer ).
For a session - I'm not so sure. I already hold fairly strong views about guitars, bodhrans, and other purveyors of rhythm; I reckon one of each in a session is enough. If you want to take along a bass you have the same problems as guitars and other chordal instruments, you have to either know the tunes or be very quick about picking up the chordal patterns for each tune, or you will annoy to the nth degree your fellow sessioneers. Also most acoustic basses ( guitar-bodied basses ) are actually poor on acoustic response and really need an amp.
But if you're determined, I'ld go for a fretless too.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by Guernsey Pete
Re: bass in a session
I suppose.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by Steve Shaw
Re: bass in a session
There is normally a bass player at The Maltings session in York. He seems to do alright at adds something to the sound (in a good way) but if I recall, his bass is smaller than a normal one. At the end of the day, you can always have a go if nothing else.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by Daniel Gott
Re: bass in a session
We've had a double bass turn up a couple of times and it worked extremely well. Mind you, he is a highly accomplished player who has been around the scene for a long time and knows the music. He also played pretty quietly most of the time.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by bc_box_player
Re: bass in a session
Listening to the left hand playing by good piano players like Charlie Lennon, Felix Dolan, Geraldine Cotter (to name just a few) could be instructive.
Not Irish, but there's some bass playing on Jean-Michel Veillon's "Er Pasker." And the Chris Norman Ensemble sports a bass, although they lean more toward Scottish/Cape Breton fare.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by Tintin
Re: bass in a session
Here's my two cents- (conservatory grad, classical double bass major, as well as countless jazz, show, GB gigs on bass guitar)
You would be more attuned to the trad-acoustic ethos with a standard, unamplified double bass, but may not be entirely welcome in all sessions because you take up a lot of room, and it is not seen as "trad" in all quarters.
I would have to fortify myself with several Guinnesses before I could ever bring my electric bass guitar to our session.
I'm a lifelong bass player, but I have a lot more fun playing flute and whistle at our session, since we bass players NEVER get to play the melody, which of course is dominant in ITM.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by Greg the Piano Tuner
Re: bass in a session
I was a working bass player for 20 odd years but I picked up the banjo when I switched full time to Irish session music. (seems to be a rather common transition around here...) I suppose if you are determined to give bass a try in a session I would only say to you what I would say to any backing musician - it would be best if you only played on the tunes you are familiar with. Best of luck to you - However, I think in the long run, if you throw yourself headlong into the pursuit of your whistle, flute and/or bodhran, you'll be much happier 5 years from now.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by Jusa Nutter Eejit
Re: bass in a session
Hopefully I am not trying to high-jack this thread (please ignore this if I am!), but on the same subject:
Are basses becoming more common at sessions?
There are only a few sessions near me, but one does have a guitarist (electric) who follows along with bass lines and walking accompaniments.
It does not particularly work for me with the ceili music, at least not yet or as attempted by that particular musician. However, I wonder might this be the next coming thing at the more "open" sessions? As in, is this the next bouzouki, or mandolin or, reaching perhaps further, piano accordian?
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by Rook
Re: bass in a session
Greg the Piano Tuner,
See if you can get hold of a copy of Fairport Convention's "Bonny Bunch Of Roses" album. The first track is "Jams O'Donnell's Jig" played by Dave Pegg on electric bass. Majic.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by bc_box_player
Re: bass in a session
As a matter of fact, I used to play the Musical Priest on fretless bass in a surf/punk band I played with for a while - it served as an introduction to another song. It turns out that's a good tune for the electric bass, its range (F#- b) is just perfect.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by Jon Kiparsky
Re: bass in a session
This is not an uncommon scene in Bell's in Edinburgh: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9c-Qstp1c8
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by slainte
Re: bass in a session
It can be done if you think more like a cello player with light sympathetic lines that have something to do with the melody .
You are obviously a very experienced bassist looking at your post and you've got a lot of styles.
I always liked the way the old motown players and African American players in general have this very mobile, abstract way of playing and understate the root notes but do a lot of other stuff to outline the chord. They also do a lot of understating the down beat as well. Thats why that stuff is so
danceable. Your mind and feet are filling in where the downbeats are.
Of course, I'm referring to approaches to dance music playing bass and what seems to work in another genre. But it is a certain mindset that works to me and its a lot different to say , Rock or country 2 to the bar. I steer well clear of those feels myself as they hold the music down.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by chuneboi slim
Re: bass in a session
leave your bass at home if you are going to an ITM session, you wont be popular, learn a real instrument.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by fiddly dee fiddly doo oh how all take it so seriously!
Re: bass in a session
bass banjo maybe? http://www.viewimages.com/Search.aspx?mid=3262482&epmid=3&partner=Google
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by RichardB
Re: bass in a session
Bass mandolin - that's the stuff, if you can find one. Good luck, though, I don't think anyone's made a production model in about a hundred years.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by Jon Kiparsky
Re: bass in a session
Our session is blessed with an excellent double bass player who we all agree is much missed when he is unable to attend.
Simple bass lines tastefully applied, occasional bowed drones, excellent!
Bye now
Keith
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by ocarolan
Re: bass in a session
Hi, my brother (kevin doherty) plays bass regulary in sessions and with well known musicians, it adds nicely to the session if played right, same as any instrument! he plays a 3/4 size double bass. ive often seen other bass players in sessions, paul o drisscoll, many others etc. practice with cds first see what your like, if you think your good enought then bring it to the session,
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by S.Doherty
Re: bass in a session
It all depends on how recently the bass was caught. We usually don't have this problem here because we have easy access to fresh grouper right from the Gulf of Mexico.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: bass in a session
I played bass for years before going to sessions, but this was in addition to a GHB background, so my perspective may be a bit different.
I would *avoid* the whole I/V thump-thump style all together. The guy in Lunasa does this extremely rarely, for effect. It immediately introduces a "squaredance" kind of vibe.
You may be better off treating the bass like a large bouzouki or DADGAD guitar - use open strings to drone and do light countermelodies on top of the drone. Even then, it's a style that would be good intermittently but not on every tune.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by wormdiet
Re: bass in a session
As a bass player of thirty years it may be difficult to accept that in this field you are a rank beginer. There will be plenty of crossover but i assure you it will be just as hard to do well as learning another instrument[ or harder!]
However once you can do it your skills will be much in demand with serious musicians. I would actually suggest a 3/4 size double bass. The volume from an acc bass gtr is not up to it. A mute can be used if it is too loud.
And any band with a double bass gains immensely from the shear size and mass of the sound and from the instrument visually .
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by the wicked hacker
Re: bass in a session
A local bass player is a full time jazz musician, very quick at picking things up, but he admits to struggling with Irish (and Northumbrian 9/8s) - he says the chords change in unexpected places.
An Irish sesh is probably not the place to be learning to accompany on bass.
Why do all these players who by their own admitance are mediocre on some instruments (and non-instruments), not learn their trade by playing along to recordings/internet etc at home instead of wanting to do it straight away in a sesson?
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by geoffwright
Re: bass in a session
There was a great track on the first Slainte Mhath album with a bass playing the melody line all the way through. It was a great piece of playing but I imagine it would be exhausting if you had to keep it up due to the stretch. Unless you have hands like a gibbon of course.....
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by nick b
Re: bass in a session
I learnt my first tunes on the bass, but it is simply inappropriate to do this in a session[and damned hard!] If you are serious, you will have an awful lot of work ahead of you. learning the tunes on a whistle or something is really a requisite to any competence in this style.
You would hardly expect to walk into an orchestra and jam along now would you?
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by the wicked hacker
Re: bass in a session
Bass is essential in an electrified "folk" group, or "Celtic Rock", such as Fairport and Horslips.
At a session I do not think it adds anything, much better with a bodhran which does the same job. If electric, the bass replaces the bodhran.
And Tombo, a bass is a real instrument, just like the triangle, cello, saxophone and countless others. It may not be "real" for a session.
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by bodhran bliss
Re: bass in a session
The last two tracks, at least, on
"Fiddle Sticks, Irish Traditional Music From Donegal:
http://www.thesession.org/recordings/display.php/202
have some very tasteful bass playing, that adds to the mix. This is a lovely album.
Dan
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by curamach
Re: bass in a session
Aye Curamach, if I'm not mistaken, I think it was a Scottish musician playing that Bass, one Alan Clark.
As Bliss says, in a session a Bass tends to make a Bodhran superfluous, so maybe, in years to come, who knows, maybe the Bass will actually take over completely from the Bodhran, in ITM session & then the only place you'll see a Bodhran is hanging up in a museum .... no doubt, with a mummified Bodhran player hanging by it's side!
Ralphus, from what I can gather, a fretless is more suited to songs & a fretted to tunes.
As for an Acoustic Bass, my son used to play one sometimes, but it was never really loud enough in a full session, except when he had it plugged into a small amp under his seat. Certainly I'd say an Acoustic Bass, discreetly plugged in, does look far more appropriate than a Fender Electric Jazz Bass, next to Whistles, Fiddles & Concertinas.
As far as I can see, there's little or no difference between those folk who use microphones in the Trad sessions in all those tourist pub sessions & an electric Bass in a session.
Salt for the Goose & Guinness for the Gander etc etc
Someone famous dude once said - "Power corrupts & absolute Power corrupts absolutely" Hmmm, I wonder were they talking about Electrical Power?
Cheers
Dick
# Posted on November 19th 2007 by Ptarmigan
Re: bass in a session
Nice job here with a bass
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1I5bziZlA4
Ken
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by salmoncove
Re: bass in a session
Nah ptarmigan, a frettless is where its at for the tunes. I take it on high authority. i personally cant play bass to trad on any type of bass so.....
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by the wicked hacker
Re: bass in a session
For once i agree with you BB, thanks for pointing out that a bass is a real instrument, i am not an idiot! What i meant to say is, leave your bass at home if you want to play it in a ITM session. There is no place for it, Lunasa and other bands use the bass, but that is in a completely different context. I can only say this: Learn an instrument that is suited to sessions, fiddle, whistle, flute, banjo, box, concertina etc, even god help us a bodhran.....leave your preconceived notions about how good you are at the bass at home. If you are serious about learning ITM that is...... good luck!
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by fiddly dee fiddly doo oh how all take it so seriously!
Re: bass in a session
Well tombo, we shall have to agree to disagree....I feel that a bass is more than welcome in a session[in the hands of someone who understands this idiom] though obviously not all sessions! I agree fully that the Bodhran is in a way the bass in/of trad. but i would like to think a sensitive,responsive, bodhran player and a sensitive, responsive, bass player could work together well with a bit of practice and co-ordination. To forstall any sarcastic comments id like to say i know bass players and drummers who fit with in this description, and sadly too many melody players who dont.
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by the wicked hacker
Re: bass in a session
I see your point Jig, and I love a sensitive WELL played bodhran as backing, such as that of Late in the evening or Sir Nose over here in oz...but i really don't think that a bass player has any place in a ITM session...especially an electric one with an amp!!! To be even more controversal, I have never understood why someone would want to play a bass in a session in the first place, that goes for someone playing a trumpet in a session...they sound good in their own music genre but NOT IN ITM!! I know I will be up for the old "purist or a "conservative traditionalist" label but there is no better session than one where everyone is enjoying the tunes and playing them on traditional session instruments. And I don't care what you think !
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by fiddly dee fiddly doo oh how all take it so seriously!
Re: bass in a session
the point here is, as far as im concerned, any instrument, and i mean any, as long as its played well and in tune is welcome to any session im in, forget this talk of learning " regular session instruments", whats that all about? theres plenty of melody instruments about what we need is more people adding good backing! why would you discourage somebody from trying to learn an instrument for a session? ive had some great sessions with , bass's, saxaphones, keyboards, snare drums, neil yates a fantastic melody player on trumpet, subtle bass playing adds nicely, anyone that reckons it doesnt, i honestly think they actually dont know what their talking about or just have not had an enough experience, or else there just too stuck in their old ways of play old tunes on traditional instruments with no room for change or backing.
Practice the bass with cds lad, see how it goes, find a sound bunch of sessioners and try it out, dont mind most of the opinions on here cause they dont actually matter! go for it.
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by S.Doherty
Re: bass in a session
yeah what ever S.Doherty! You sound like a few i have come across before...question the "old" ways if you like, at the end of the day the tradition will always hold out and it won't include trumpets, basses, keyboards, saxs and what ever tickles your fancy!
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by fiddly dee fiddly doo oh how all take it so seriously!
Re: bass in a session
"Irish Bass Protection and Awareness Group
Who are we?
The Irish Bass Protection and Awareness Group was formed in response to the decline of European Sea Bass (Dicentrarchus Labrax) in Irish coastal waters. Despite the bye-laws and regulations that have existed to protect Bass in Ireland since 1990, scientific evidence shows that stock levels remain severly depleted. We believe that illegal commercial fishing for Bass (poaching), supported by clandestine illegal trading, poses the greatest threat to the survival of Bass in Irish coastal waters."
http://www.irishbass.org/
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by SWFL Fiddler
Re: bass in a session
is that a fact now "tombo"
might i mention that some ceili bands used double bass's a hundred years ago? traditional enough?
if you want people to stay interested in the music then you support musicians and new alternatives.
please dont think you can try and stop irish music moving forward, yes the tradition stays, i like it myself, nothing wrong with it at all, but its great to see new instruments being used and the music being explored. there are a great variety of different types of sessions around,
honestly is that not fair enough?
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by S.Doherty
Re: bass in a session
Tombo many of the instruments frequently used to day are imported. The primary factor for a long time has been financial constraints. Not some obscure view that the melodian or whatever is not a traditional instrument. The younger generation in Ireland are the people who will pass the tradition on. If you could see the breadth of young talent here in Ireland you might not be so sure of your position. There is no one' tradition' carved in stone but many . They are living and in good hands.
As it happens there are historical records stretching back to the 17th century attesting to the presance of Viols in Ireland. they simply became generally unfordable due to the imposition of Colonial rule. Now lets not get started on that subject eh?
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by the wicked hacker
Re: bass in a session
The fact is S.Doherty that even if ceili bands used double bass's a hundred years ago the bass doesn't have a place in sessions. Ceili bands are a whole new argument anyway....I am in no way trying to stop irish music moving forward, I am just stating that why must you experiment and include instruments such as the bass in a session just to "keep people interested in the music"? Explore all the music you want just do it at home and don't subject other people to the plonk of the bass, the tooting of the trumpet or what ever you think is arty farty and makes you a big head in some ego driven music scene!
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by fiddly dee fiddly doo oh how all take it so seriously!
Re: bass in a session
Fair enough Jig and I am well aware of the breathe and talent of the new generation in ireland. I am not agruing the debate of what are "traditional instruments" in ireland as I am also well aware of when the different instruments appeared in ITM. What i am saying is some instruments really don't have a place in the ITM session, these including basses, saxes, keyboards, trumpets etc...... I know there isn't one tradition carved out in stone also, so don't come over all "I am irish so listen to me all you foriegners as you don't know what you are talking about" either, the tradition does however have boundaries that are increasingly being crossed, mostly to satisfy the egocentric drive of people bent on using it for their own self gratification or because they really don't understand the music.
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by fiddly dee fiddly doo oh how all take it so seriously!
Re: bass in a session
mmm i have to say, tombo your comments to not impress or convince me,
these boundaries you speak off? who sets them? i think these boundaries are in your head!
fact of the matter is, ive heard many sax players who are brilliant at play reels etc, much better than the common joe soap in fiddle. keyboarda, yes. bass yes, they all get the thumbs up from me, dont mind you trying to dictate whats allowed and what suits? who are you to decided? its a free world and music is there to be enjoyed.
im not on here to make enemys, why cant you except irish music for what it is? i know what it is? i play it every day of the week, ive been numerous festivals this year, i see and hear what goes on, i know what people like!
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by S.Doherty
Re: bass in a session
>>the tradition does however have boundaries that are increasingly being crossed, mostly to satisfy the egocentric drive of people bent on using it for their own self gratification or because they really don't understand the music.<<
I would'nt dissagree with that, but at the same time who is qualified to define exactly what the tradition is?
All we can do is give our opinion. nothing more. there are certain constants fair enough, certain traits everyone would agree on[maybe not!] but to define something automatically constrains it within the conceptual framework of that definition. your very language may not have enough concepts to define and constrain ITM.
We can define something roughly at a certain stage for a certain group of people, but only for those people at that time.
For example at this time some groups of people around the world define ITM as ' fill in the blanks '. but that doesnt mean that therefor everyone must or does use that same definition.
I hope you dont get offended by this but i would not define your position re the bass as 'traditionalist', but as 'reactionary'.
so you see it means different things to different people', your definition is not the same as mine.
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by the wicked hacker
Re: bass in a session
The notion that any instrument played well within this idiom is ok, (although well meaning and romantic,) is quite far from the reality of a real session.
Jig I have no doubt you know some quality bass players and drummers who would do well and add to the session with their instruments. I'm sure you would agree however, that those folks you know are in the %.0001 percentage of bass players/drummers in the world who actually have a clue. I tend to agree with Tombo on this. The bass players and drummers I have seen and heard who attempt to play in a session know zilch about Irish session music, and make an unholy racket trying to guess what it is everyone else is playing.
Ralphus - leave your bass at home and continue your pursuit of the flute, whistle or bodhran. I promise you will be happier for it in a few years. Good Luck.
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by Jusa Nutter Eejit
Re: bass in a session
yes, probably. JNE , which is why i would strongly encourage a serious musician with an interest in playing trad to settle down , study hard and become well acquainted with the tunes, idiom, chord patterns and all other aspects of ITM that might or might not be relevant. whatever instrument they might play.
Stressing the point that fluency in jazz, classical or pretty much any other type of music will not automatically crossover into trad. That there are no short cuts. That it will be no easier than learning another instrument but that once that work is done and the transition made there will be many positive bonuses.
My advice to any one beginning trad is to leave their instrument at home, practice damn hard with good instruction for a while. until fluency is attained in,a selection of tunes.
I dont mean struggle through them without too many mistakes , but a nice polished performance. In fact play just one tune well ,a beautiful air and you will probably be welcome for your contribution.
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by the wicked hacker
Re: bass in a session
Mixed opinions, as in everything else. Ask the sessioners you play with for their feedback. We have an electric, fretless bass player and play in a very noisy place, so it helps fill in the sound.
Ask to try and see what they think. They may enjoy it.
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by banjobabe
Re: bass in a session
I'd be happy to play an acoustic bass giuitar in my session, if I weren't already playing tunes and chords on my 'zouk. Why play the bass when you CAN play the tunes ?
The tune is the thing !
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by Guernsey Pete
Re: bass in a session
I agree with what I originally posted, session use a bodhran, "Folk Group" or "Celtic Rock" group, both electrified, use a bass. So I also agree with Tombo and Jusa.
I of all people am not against the music moving forward, I embrace it. But for the life of me, I cannot see that a bass adds anything at a session, and I have experienced such.
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by bodhran bliss
Re: bass in a session
OK BB but if you are there then it probably wont! ie it will likely get in the way of the master Bodhran player.
Any instruments that occupy the same register can get in each others way. The bass end more than any. If the bass player played in the higher positions perhaps this clash might not occur,
You have a very valid point. the bodhran is the bass in a sesh,2 bass instruments may well interfere with the enjoyment of the music and players.
# Posted on November 20th 2007 by the wicked hacker
Re: bass in a session
Ah we will have to agree to disagree on this one Jig
Reactionary or traditionalist I maintain there is no place for a bass in a session. Sorry S.Doherty I just don't agree with you, I am not maintaining rules and regulations but if you actually played ITM and lived the tradition as you claim you do then you would realise that there are certain boundaries as there are to any traditional music.
# Posted on November 21st 2007 by fiddly dee fiddly doo oh how all take it so seriously!
Re: bass in a session
Fair enough, tombo, we are all entitled to our opinions. I wish you the best in your music.
# Posted on November 21st 2007 by the wicked hacker
Re: bass in a session
You too Jig
Hopefully might catch up with you next year for a yarn and a few tunes!
# Posted on November 21st 2007 by fiddly dee fiddly doo oh how all take it so seriously!
Re: bass in a session
By the way S.Doherty some nice playing on you tube!
# Posted on November 21st 2007 by fiddly dee fiddly doo oh how all take it so seriously!
Re: bass in a session
cheers. i guess we will have to agree to disagree so,. lets put this one to bed and hope everything works out for "ralphus"
# Posted on November 21st 2007 by S.Doherty
Re: bass in a session
The master bodhran player was reduced to playing electric mandolin, and blues harp, when we had a bass player in the folk group.
# Posted on November 21st 2007 by bodhran bliss
Re: bass in a session
What he could actually play another instrument BB!!! Shock ...horror! Na only kidding
Have a brilliant day one and all!
# Posted on November 21st 2007 by fiddly dee fiddly doo oh how all take it so seriously!
Re: bass in a session
Thanks for the wealth of opinions and information. I got some good feedback from you all, even Tombo. Being a bass player I know enough not to step on the toes of the other musicians. This is job one, so I wouldn't dare bring a bass to session until the necessary homework is done. I think the fretless is the way to go, from what you've all told me. A 3/4 upright sounds better though I don't drive and the commute on public transport and the cold Chicago winters would not be condusive to lugging it around. I also promise to be a good sessioner by struggling with the flute, whistle etc. ITM is a very melody based genre and I agree the task of trying to add a bass is daunting. I really wouldn't lump it in with keyboards, sax and trumpet. This is unfair, as those are melodic instruments and the bass is usually not. Thanks again!
# Posted on November 21st 2007 by ralphus
Re: bass in a session
Don't let them win ralphus. Take your bass to the session. Give it ago. I used to take my uprite bass to the Story Bridge
session every week many years ago and everyone loved it.
The worst thing that happened was that I got a lot of gigs out of it at the time and I didn't have time for the session anymore.If you love making music it will will be good. Some of these guys need to strap one up and chill out.
# Posted on November 21st 2007 by chuneboi slim
Re: bass in a session
The problem with acc bass guitar is that its very quiet. Fine for learning but my philosophy is that if i cant hear it whats the point?
Same with drummers who are too shy to let rip and actually be heard. Especially in band situation and i am paying the wages!
However like you say a double bass, the real thing, is mighty large and inconvenient to carry around.
The solution adopted by a friend of mine who has played with numerous luminaries over the years is a radio transmitter 'bug' and a top quality portable amp hidden away in a bag for sound re-enforcement.
Personally i think the double bass is the way forward, but perhaps start off with a fretless Acc bs/gtr for learning and portability. Having a dbl bass, i guess, means having a car to put it in [ or on! a friend of mine used to drive around in a small car dwarfed by the bass on the roof!]
# Posted on November 21st 2007 by the wicked hacker
Re: bass in a session
I reckon a walnut fretlessTaylor acoustic bass played with a stiff pick back near the bridge instead of the fingers would cut it and cry out at a session. Expensive, But you only get what you pay for. Jig is right. The cheap ones are useless.
I think there's a lot of future for resonator basses.
I think in the National style ie chrome plated brass
body with definitely a much larger cone would add
enough brightness to make the bass competive in volume. Maybe I'll talk someone I know into making one,
# Posted on November 21st 2007 by chuneboi slim
Re: bass in a session
I came to this sort of thing from a folk scene, as the occasional Irish tune would spring up. I've enjoyed the stuff immensely, but never thought to play it with others. I learned of a session nearby, and took stock of all instruments present. Being one who likes to bring something to the table that wasn't there before, I brought my upright. In the folk sessions, you almost never saw one, mainly because it's the biggest pain in the posterior to lug around. However, I hated being guitarist # 9, so out came the bass. For these sessions, however, I was fully aware that I was a bit out of my normal element, so I stayed towards the back, listening more than playing. However, I found myself quite welcomed, even encouraged. The thought that a bass might be unwelcome at a session never crossed my mind until reading such a sentiment recently. Perhaps I was only being tolerated? Who knows? Though the ringleader of this particular session does lurk about these pages, so perhaps he'll drop a note sometime. Until then, I'll continue to frequent the doings, 4 string beast in hand ( though the guitar has come along when said beast was 'under the weather'). I'd like to bring the mandolin and/or the banjo, but the current talent on both are far more capable than I. Besides, I'm a fake banjo player anyhow ( 5 string banjo with drone string removed - remainder tuned to E-A-D-E - guitarlike). In closing, I'll continue to feel welcome until I don't!
# Posted on December 31st 2007 by dbphiladelphia
Re: bass in a session
I have been playing piano since my mother (who was a music teacher) began teaching me how to play piano when I was seven. In band in junior high and high school, I played the tuba. In my twenties, I switched to playing an electric bass guitar and, when I could afford to buy one, I also began playing a bass fiddle.
When some local musicians started an Irish Session here in 1995, I went to listen and asked which instrument should I bring to the next Session. I was asked to bring my Roland EP-90 Digital Piano because the other musicians thought a piano would add more to the general cacophony than a bass. As a result, for several years, I just brought my electronic piano to the sessions before I began bringing my bass fiddle also. Since I had a better understanding of this music by this time, I was able to play appropriate and effective bass lines for some of the tunes. I would set up my bass fiddle on its stand next to my electronic keyboard and switch back and forth from one instrument to the other depending on what the other musicians were playing.
Occasionally, I have played melody lines on my electronic keyboard but never on my bass.
Yes, even a 3/4 size upright bass is a difficult instrument to carry around and transport--(speaking from experience)--especially getting through doors without hitting something.
Since I was born and raised in Chicago, I can sympathize with Ralphus' comments about the winters there and the traffic.
As for "Tombo", I would recommend psychiatric help and anger management classes.
# Posted on February 17th 2008 by fauxcelt
Re: bass in a session
I've been practicing the chunes (melody, not bass notes) on my double bass- sounds about an octave lower than a viola- 7th position and thumb position- and I just might haul the beast to my session, if I ever get the nerve...
# Posted on June 14th 2009 by Greg the Piano Tuner