Im a long time fan of pirastro strings. I use eudoxa..can any one compare these with some others, pros and cons.... like olive or the steel strings.
What about the different guages?
Any comparisons would be welcome.
recomendations.
strings to avoid?
just put a low C obligato on yesterday[5 string viola]
the gold wound top E?
thanks in advance.
Don't know, but I've been thinking of trying some - I've got a practice fiddle at work and I put some Lenzner gut core strings on it to see if I could cope with the retuning, but I'm sure Pirastros are better, but bloomin expensive. Lenzner don't seem to be able to provide a gut core A - they put a steel core A in the set which I didn't like at all. I do want to try out other gut core strings though and was wondering if anyone gets good results from the d'Addario ones (they're a bit cheaper - what a cheapskate I am!) The fiddle I've put them on is a high-arched German one, not particularly special, about 100 years old, and I've read that this type of fiddle responds well to gut core - and I'm sure that's true - the Lenzner G and D have settled in and are adding a richness and warmth to the fiddle I think. They are loop-ended by the way, which I found a bit of a surprise.
I use Evah Pirazzis and love playing on them. Very responsive and full sound. The gold plated E string makes a significant difference in the sound when playing on the E string. Makes it less metallic and harsh sounding and makes the overall sound of my fiddle more well-rounded.
I agree with FidDLe01. I have Pirazzis on both my fiddles with the gold E. The E has a clean bell like tone. They last long too. I have had a set of Pirazzis on one of my fiddles for over 1 1/2 years and they still play beautifully.
Expensive yes to begin with but in the end you save not buying string set after string set.
I've used the gold label for some time. I don't like the Eudoxa as well - not as bright/full on my axe - feels like they are missing something. I've yet to try the Pirazzis. Sounds like I'm due.
The synthetic strings sound "tinny" to me in comparison.
great i will try them. I have a few of the eudoxa wound E's which i have allways used but will try out their Pirazzis E
Its the most important string to get sounding good as far as i am concerned.
have you tried any of the others? to compare, like eudoxa? etc
I tried a gold A for a while but didnt really get on with it, perhaps if id had a set... but getting a set of each to try would really cost a fortune...
Im happy with my obligato C compared to the Jargar i had on befor, so much more life, but the price of a C alone!
monkey - when you say gold label do you mean the Pirastro Gold? They are wound gut like the Eudoxas but Evahs are synthetic. It's the gut core ones I was interested in experimenting with, and wondered how many people use them in sessions. There's an interesting (but not recent) review of strings with lots of stuff about the problems of using Eudoxas here http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~leonid/violin_strings.htm
He says "these strings have the most refined sound imaginable" - can't get a better recommendation than that. With gut core strings you are meant to tune from the pegs (they don't like being tuned from the tailpiece, and frequent tuning might be necessary, but good practice - especially for those of us that need it. Also if you tune frequently from the pegs it becomes easier to do, whereas if you mostly just tune from fine adjusters the pegs cease to turn smoothly and the pegbox holes get distorted. I think I'll give Eudoxas a try or perhaps the gut core Golden Spirals from d'Adddario - anyone tried them?
well i only have 1 fine tuner so thats not a bother. didnt realise that though Richard. Eudoxa come in both loop and ball end. Took a few days to 'wear in'. While the obligato seems to 'sing' straight away. I cant remember if My A is gut or steel.Its the one with a ball end as is the E, my D G are both loop. I have noticed the D G seem to drop in pitch, perhaps thats because they are gut?
nice link richard, very helpfull.
I found eudoxa by trial and error. The obligato was a recommendation and i will get a set now i have tried one. Interesting to read about the correlli I use Savarez exclusively on my Spanish guitar. I will give them a go some time.
A luthier has told me that the G string is the one string that most affects the tone of the fiddle. The harmonics from a top-class open G drive the harmonics in the notes produced on the other strings, both open-string notes and when they are fingered.
It's easy enough to experiment. Put on the cheapest 'n' nastiest steel core G you can get hold of (probably the sort you find on cheap 'n' nasty £50 Chinese fiddles on a street stall at a fest) and listen to how it deadens the tone. Then change it for something decent like an Obbligato (synthetic) or an Eudoxa covered gut, And listen again ...
For the record, I use Eudoxas (covered gut) on my old German fiddle, but they didn't work so well on my modern fiddle (the one I regularly use in sessions), so on that one I'm currently using up an old set of Helicores for the winter before trying something else (or possibly a new set of H's). But I'm still using the Eudoxa wound E. It's the best I've found for both my fiddles so far.
Now that is very interesting, i don't need to experiment. i will take your word on it. I just love a good set of strings!
That would be the C then on a 5string Viola?
Id love to spend some time studying the way these stringed instruments work , I have the general picture for the soul but the bass bar, and the rest I have no Idea. Do you know of any usefull books that might explain the basic concepts and perhaps a bit more? My Luthier friends are hundreds of miles away and busy busy busy. One of them is making 10 grand fiddles now!
Jig, I don't know of any specific books, but a google search might turn something up. The function of the bass bar, so I've been told, is principally to transfer the vibrations from the bass foot of the bridge to the table. The longer the bass bar the more vibrations are transferred to more of the table and the bigger the sound. Bass bars on Baroque fiddles were relatively short, and this, together with other factors, contributed to the quieter tone of those instruments.
The cellist Yo Yo Ma some years ago did a CD of Baroque works with an Amsterdam ensemble directed by Ton Koopman. In order to get closer to the authentic Baroque sound he had his Stradivari cello altered so as to return it as much as possible to its original setup. He was able to have the strings changed to gut, the bridge to a flatter Baroque bridge, a lower tuning pitch (about A415), and the tail-pin removed (which apparently caused him some initial problems). He also used a Baroque bow. But the insurers wouldn't allow any internal modifications like replacing the bass bar with a shorter Baroque version, so he wasn't able to get back quite to the sound that Stradivari and his contemporaries would have heard.
I don't think he would have achieved that authentic Baroque sound anyway, because the early 18th century would have heard a new instrument from Stradivari which hadn't yet achieved its full richness of tone and power, something that wouldn't yet be reached for several decades. The deduction that I'd like to make is, that although Stradivari's instruments were extremely good and much sought after in his time, they probably didn't sound better then than a comparable instrument made today by a top luthier. One wonders therefore what today's best instruments are going to sound like in 50 -100 years time.
The bass bar was lengthened, fiddle necks replaced (they had been at a much flatter angle and were shorter and thicker), and the fingerboard lengthened towards the end of the 18th century to meet the requirements of bigger and louder ensembles. Up to the present day orchestral pitch has risen to A440 to get more brilliance, and this process still continues with the development of louder and more brilliant strings and a higher tuning pitch - there are rumours that today's A440 is going to be pushed even higher (blame the brass and woodwind and Hollywood for this!)
Gut strings tend to not work as well on modern violins that are not quite broken in..
Eudoxa with the Golden Spiral E is my favorite set up...but I use Dominants with a Gold Label E b/c I don't like to retune so often these days...I may switch back though b/c Eudoxas are so great!
The other thing is that you have to have some pretty decent technique to use gut wound strings..otherwise string crossings can be very scratchy...that's another reason I stick to Dominants most of the time...if I have time to practice, tehn I feel more confident with Eudoxas.
pirastro violin strings
pirastro violin strings
Im a long time fan of pirastro strings. I use eudoxa..can any one compare these with some others, pros and cons.... like olive or the steel strings.
What about the different guages?
Any comparisons would be welcome.
recomendations.
strings to avoid?
just put a low C obligato on yesterday[5 string viola]
the gold wound top E?
thanks in advance.
# Posted on November 14th 2007 by jig
Re: pirastro violin strings
Don't know, but I've been thinking of trying some - I've got a practice fiddle at work and I put some Lenzner gut core strings on it to see if I could cope with the retuning, but I'm sure Pirastros are better, but bloomin expensive. Lenzner don't seem to be able to provide a gut core A - they put a steel core A in the set which I didn't like at all. I do want to try out other gut core strings though and was wondering if anyone gets good results from the d'Addario ones (they're a bit cheaper - what a cheapskate I am!) The fiddle I've put them on is a high-arched German one, not particularly special, about 100 years old, and I've read that this type of fiddle responds well to gut core - and I'm sure that's true - the Lenzner G and D have settled in and are adding a richness and warmth to the fiddle I think. They are loop-ended by the way, which I found a bit of a surprise.
# Posted on November 14th 2007 by RichardB
Re: pirastro violin strings
yeah, i know, pricey! but well worth it. Different fiddles respond to different strings as well which makes it all more complicated!
# Posted on November 14th 2007 by jig
Re: pirastro violin strings
I use Evah Pirazzis and love playing on them. Very responsive and full sound. The gold plated E string makes a significant difference in the sound when playing on the E string. Makes it less metallic and harsh sounding and makes the overall sound of my fiddle more well-rounded.
# Posted on November 15th 2007 by FidDLe01
Re: pirastro violin strings
I agree with FidDLe01. I have Pirazzis on both my fiddles with the gold E. The E has a clean bell like tone. They last long too. I have had a set of Pirazzis on one of my fiddles for over 1 1/2 years and they still play beautifully.
Expensive yes to begin with but in the end you save not buying string set after string set.
# Posted on November 15th 2007 by Pirate-Fiddler
Re: pirastro violin strings
I've used the gold label for some time. I don't like the Eudoxa as well - not as bright/full on my axe - feels like they are missing something. I've yet to try the Pirazzis. Sounds like I'm due.
The synthetic strings sound "tinny" to me in comparison.
# Posted on November 15th 2007 by monkey440
Re: pirastro violin strings
great i will try them. I have a few of the eudoxa wound E's which i have allways used but will try out their Pirazzis E
Its the most important string to get sounding good as far as i am concerned.
have you tried any of the others? to compare, like eudoxa? etc
# Posted on November 15th 2007 by jig
Re: pirastro violin strings
I tried a gold A for a while but didnt really get on with it, perhaps if id had a set... but getting a set of each to try would really cost a fortune...
Im happy with my obligato C compared to the Jargar i had on befor, so much more life, but the price of a C alone!
# Posted on November 15th 2007 by jig
Re: pirastro violin strings
monkey - when you say gold label do you mean the Pirastro Gold? They are wound gut like the Eudoxas but Evahs are synthetic. It's the gut core ones I was interested in experimenting with, and wondered how many people use them in sessions. There's an interesting (but not recent) review of strings with lots of stuff about the problems of using Eudoxas here http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~leonid/violin_strings.htm
He says "these strings have the most refined sound imaginable" - can't get a better recommendation than that. With gut core strings you are meant to tune from the pegs (they don't like being tuned from the tailpiece, and frequent tuning might be necessary, but good practice - especially for those of us that need it. Also if you tune frequently from the pegs it becomes easier to do, whereas if you mostly just tune from fine adjusters the pegs cease to turn smoothly and the pegbox holes get distorted. I think I'll give Eudoxas a try or perhaps the gut core Golden Spirals from d'Adddario - anyone tried them?
# Posted on November 15th 2007 by RichardB
Re: pirastro violin strings
well i only have 1 fine tuner so thats not a bother. didnt realise that though Richard. Eudoxa come in both loop and ball end. Took a few days to 'wear in'. While the obligato seems to 'sing' straight away. I cant remember if My A is gut or steel.Its the one with a ball end as is the E, my D G are both loop. I have noticed the D G seem to drop in pitch, perhaps thats because they are gut?
# Posted on November 15th 2007 by jig
Re: pirastro violin strings
nice link richard, very helpfull.
I found eudoxa by trial and error. The obligato was a recommendation and i will get a set now i have tried one. Interesting to read about the correlli I use Savarez exclusively on my Spanish guitar. I will give them a go some time.
# Posted on November 15th 2007 by jig
Re: pirastro violin strings
A luthier has told me that the G string is the one string that most affects the tone of the fiddle. The harmonics from a top-class open G drive the harmonics in the notes produced on the other strings, both open-string notes and when they are fingered.
It's easy enough to experiment. Put on the cheapest 'n' nastiest steel core G you can get hold of (probably the sort you find on cheap 'n' nasty £50 Chinese fiddles on a street stall at a fest) and listen to how it deadens the tone. Then change it for something decent like an Obbligato (synthetic) or an Eudoxa covered gut, And listen again ...
For the record, I use Eudoxas (covered gut) on my old German fiddle, but they didn't work so well on my modern fiddle (the one I regularly use in sessions), so on that one I'm currently using up an old set of Helicores for the winter before trying something else (or possibly a new set of H's). But I'm still using the Eudoxa wound E. It's the best I've found for both my fiddles so far.
# Posted on November 16th 2007 by lazyhound
Re: pirastro violin strings
Now that is very interesting, i don't need to experiment. i will take your word on it. I just love a good set of strings!
That would be the C then on a 5string Viola?
Id love to spend some time studying the way these stringed instruments work , I have the general picture for the soul but the bass bar, and the rest I have no Idea. Do you know of any usefull books that might explain the basic concepts and perhaps a bit more? My Luthier friends are hundreds of miles away and busy busy busy. One of them is making 10 grand fiddles now!
# Posted on November 16th 2007 by jig
Re: pirastro violin strings
Jig, I don't know of any specific books, but a google search might turn something up. The function of the bass bar, so I've been told, is principally to transfer the vibrations from the bass foot of the bridge to the table. The longer the bass bar the more vibrations are transferred to more of the table and the bigger the sound. Bass bars on Baroque fiddles were relatively short, and this, together with other factors, contributed to the quieter tone of those instruments.
The cellist Yo Yo Ma some years ago did a CD of Baroque works with an Amsterdam ensemble directed by Ton Koopman. In order to get closer to the authentic Baroque sound he had his Stradivari cello altered so as to return it as much as possible to its original setup. He was able to have the strings changed to gut, the bridge to a flatter Baroque bridge, a lower tuning pitch (about A415), and the tail-pin removed (which apparently caused him some initial problems). He also used a Baroque bow. But the insurers wouldn't allow any internal modifications like replacing the bass bar with a shorter Baroque version, so he wasn't able to get back quite to the sound that Stradivari and his contemporaries would have heard.
I don't think he would have achieved that authentic Baroque sound anyway, because the early 18th century would have heard a new instrument from Stradivari which hadn't yet achieved its full richness of tone and power, something that wouldn't yet be reached for several decades. The deduction that I'd like to make is, that although Stradivari's instruments were extremely good and much sought after in his time, they probably didn't sound better then than a comparable instrument made today by a top luthier. One wonders therefore what today's best instruments are going to sound like in 50 -100 years time.
The bass bar was lengthened, fiddle necks replaced (they had been at a much flatter angle and were shorter and thicker), and the fingerboard lengthened towards the end of the 18th century to meet the requirements of bigger and louder ensembles. Up to the present day orchestral pitch has risen to A440 to get more brilliance, and this process still continues with the development of louder and more brilliant strings and a higher tuning pitch - there are rumours that today's A440 is going to be pushed even higher (blame the brass and woodwind and Hollywood for this!)
# Posted on November 16th 2007 by lazyhound
Re: pirastro violin strings
Gut strings tend to not work as well on modern violins that are not quite broken in..
Eudoxa with the Golden Spiral E is my favorite set up...but I use Dominants with a Gold Label E b/c I don't like to retune so often these days...I may switch back though b/c Eudoxas are so great!
The other thing is that you have to have some pretty decent technique to use gut wound strings..otherwise string crossings can be very scratchy...that's another reason I stick to Dominants most of the time...if I have time to practice, tehn I feel more confident with Eudoxas.
# Posted on November 17th 2007 by Sunnybear