Occasionally when I try to play an open E, I get a blank spot. No, I am not accidentally muting the string with the edge of my left hand, and I am using enough rosin to get good tone otherwise.
Lately, I think that I might be allowing my bow hand to turn a bit when crossing to the E string, so that the stick does not lean away from the bridge like it's supposed to--thus putting the bow hairs flat on the string, so that one side of the hairs mutes the other. At least that's my theory of the moment. (The make and model of E string also seems to matter--the Dominant E string being the worst, Pirastro Gold the best.)
Anybody else fighting this annoyance? If so, what's your theory?
I hate when that happens! And it doesn't just have to be the open E, either. I'm told it's from not playing "in the string"---the bow isn't making solid enough contact with the string. Usually if I adjust the plane of the bow a bit (drop my right elbow), it goes away. The right wrist might also have something to do with it, but I'm not expert enough yet to be able to say for sure.
There's a lot of good advice there. In my particular case, changing my technique by easing up on the E string just as a crossed to and from it helped a lot, but I still got the silent (or squeaky) E at times, just less frequently. The main culprit turned out to be the fact that I was using a cr@p E string on a cr@p fiddle. Replacing my cheap student rental fiddle with one that was more expensive by a factor of 10, and switching E strings (I've had success with the aluminum-wound Tonica, as well as the Kaplan non-whistling E) did the trick.
TD&M, you're right. Provided the fiddle player is reasonably competent the cause is often in the string. I had it happen unexpectedly a while ago, and a change of string solved the problem. I'm told it's less likely to happen with a wound E, and apparently never with a gut E - but the only people nowadays using gut E's are the Early Music / Baroque specialists, and they'll likely be tuned to A 415.
The whislting E doesn't seem to be quite the same as the silent E. I think the whistling is caused by the string going into a high harmonic mode. The "silent" E is disconcerting, because you feel that you've missed the string completely. I suspect (but don't really know) that the bow is failing to overcome the inertia of the string and the string is either failing completely to "speak" or is going into a harmonic beyond our hearing range or the ability of the fiddle to reproduce it.
Sometimes a silent E can be caused by a build up of rosin where the bow touches it, which can lead to the 'failure to overcome' inertia that lazyhound mentions.
Thanks, all. I just finished a long practice, and I think I have made good progress with the problem.
And I should give credit where it's due--a beginner pointed out my error to me--not keeping the stick leaning away from the bridge--after I passed on a few things I was told about proper bow grip.
I used a wound E for a while, but it didn't seem to help.
It's most likely due to pilot error, I think. Keeping the bow at the correct angle and attacking the E string firmly (no cringing!) seems to do the trick.
This problem (or at least its related 'squeaky' E-string problem) seems more common than I'd thought. I submitted exactly this problem a while ago - the responses are useful (see Lazyhound's in particular)
"Most common when slurring onto the open e. Try changing direction when changing to that string."
If you change direction, you're not slurring. I think it's important to be able to slur from one string to the next. One thing that I think will help that's not mentioned yet is the speed of the bow. Intuitively you might think it helps to press a bit harder, but this will probably make it squeak. Try laying off the pressure and just speeding up a bit.
I used to have this problem too.. I think I was just letting the bow "glide" over the e (ie, not enough contact with the string) ... when I made a conscious effort to press on the string it didn't happen as often.. but I can't always be expected to be conscious while I'm playing, can I? ;)
Also switching strings from an unknown e string (first string change on my fiddle) to Dominant e helped.. unfortunately, my fiddle hates Dominants..
"blank" open E on fiddle
"blank" open E on fiddle
Occasionally when I try to play an open E, I get a blank spot. No, I am not accidentally muting the string with the edge of my left hand, and I am using enough rosin to get good tone otherwise.
Lately, I think that I might be allowing my bow hand to turn a bit when crossing to the E string, so that the stick does not lean away from the bridge like it's supposed to--thus putting the bow hairs flat on the string, so that one side of the hairs mutes the other. At least that's my theory of the moment. (The make and model of E string also seems to matter--the Dominant E string being the worst, Pirastro Gold the best.)
Anybody else fighting this annoyance? If so, what's your theory?
# Posted on September 13th 2007 by mickray
Re: "blank" open E on fiddle
I hate when that happens! And it doesn't just have to be the open E, either. I'm told it's from not playing "in the string"---the bow isn't making solid enough contact with the string. Usually if I adjust the plane of the bow a bit (drop my right elbow), it goes away. The right wrist might also have something to do with it, but I'm not expert enough yet to be able to say for sure.
# Posted on September 13th 2007 by kennedy
Re: "blank" open E on fiddle
I had a similar problem a few months ago, and posted about my troubles here: http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display/12084
There's a lot of good advice there. In my particular case, changing my technique by easing up on the E string just as a crossed to and from it helped a lot, but I still got the silent (or squeaky) E at times, just less frequently. The main culprit turned out to be the fact that I was using a cr@p E string on a cr@p fiddle. Replacing my cheap student rental fiddle with one that was more expensive by a factor of 10, and switching E strings (I've had success with the aluminum-wound Tonica, as well as the Kaplan non-whistling E) did the trick.
# Posted on September 13th 2007 by Tall, Dark, and Mysterious
Re: "blank" open E on fiddle
TD&M, you're right. Provided the fiddle player is reasonably competent the cause is often in the string. I had it happen unexpectedly a while ago, and a change of string solved the problem. I'm told it's less likely to happen with a wound E, and apparently never with a gut E - but the only people nowadays using gut E's are the Early Music / Baroque specialists, and they'll likely be tuned to A 415.
The whislting E doesn't seem to be quite the same as the silent E. I think the whistling is caused by the string going into a high harmonic mode. The "silent" E is disconcerting, because you feel that you've missed the string completely. I suspect (but don't really know) that the bow is failing to overcome the inertia of the string and the string is either failing completely to "speak" or is going into a harmonic beyond our hearing range or the ability of the fiddle to reproduce it.
# Posted on September 13th 2007 by lazyhound
Re: "blank" open E on fiddle
Sometimes a silent E can be caused by a build up of rosin where the bow touches it, which can lead to the 'failure to overcome' inertia that lazyhound mentions.
# Posted on September 13th 2007 by benhall.1
Re: "blank" open E on fiddle
Thanks, all. I just finished a long practice, and I think I have made good progress with the problem.
And I should give credit where it's due--a beginner pointed out my error to me--not keeping the stick leaning away from the bridge--after I passed on a few things I was told about proper bow grip.
Out of the mouths of newbies.... ;>}
# Posted on September 13th 2007 by mickray
Re: "blank" open E on fiddle
Mickray
Are you using a wound e string? I had that problem also and have not had it since I changed to a wound e...just a thought.
# Posted on September 14th 2007 by fiddlefamily
Re: "blank" open E on fiddle
Ugh! That happens to me sometimes too.Glad I'm not the only one.
Sara
# Posted on September 14th 2007 by Celtic Lass
Re: "blank" open E on fiddle
I used a wound E for a while, but it didn't seem to help.
It's most likely due to pilot error, I think. Keeping the bow at the correct angle and attacking the E string firmly (no cringing!) seems to do the trick.
# Posted on September 14th 2007 by mickray
Re: "blank" open E on fiddle
The wound e string fixed it for me...
# Posted on September 14th 2007 by seisflutes
Re: "blank" open E on fiddle
It only happens my on one tune... upstairs in a tent. Every single time I play that tune I get the phantom E.
Glad I'm not alone too.
# Posted on September 14th 2007 by session savage
Re: "blank" open E on fiddle
This problem (or at least its related 'squeaky' E-string problem) seems more common than I'd thought. I submitted exactly this problem a while ago - the responses are useful (see Lazyhound's in particular)
http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display/11487/comments
I've still not been able to get to the bottom of it, despite changes of strings etc
Hope springs eternal
# Posted on September 14th 2007 by domnull
Re: "blank" open E on fiddle
"Most common when slurring onto the open e. Try changing direction when changing to that string."
If you change direction, you're not slurring. I think it's important to be able to slur from one string to the next. One thing that I think will help that's not mentioned yet is the speed of the bow. Intuitively you might think it helps to press a bit harder, but this will probably make it squeak. Try laying off the pressure and just speeding up a bit.
# Posted on September 14th 2007 by llig leahcim
Re: "blank" open E on fiddle
I used to have this problem too.. I think I was just letting the bow "glide" over the e (ie, not enough contact with the string) ... when I made a conscious effort to press on the string it didn't happen as often.. but I can't always be expected to be conscious while I'm playing, can I? ;)
Also switching strings from an unknown e string (first string change on my fiddle) to Dominant e helped.. unfortunately, my fiddle hates Dominants..
# Posted on September 14th 2007 by fiftymission