I thought for a moment I could see a 5th peg on his banjo, but I think it was just sometihng in the background - it's rather fuzzy footage.
There are mandolin-banjos and saz-banjo hybrids made in Turkey, probably largely for the sake of volume. I wonder if the bouzouki (originally a type of saz) has been similarly adapted in Greece. The instrument in this clip clearly has single strings but, by the sound of it could have some form of non-equal-tempered fretting - or perhaps additional quarter-tone frets.
The old 3-course bouzouki was typically tuned D, A, D or similar (as used by Alec Finn). In Greece, 4-course instruments are usually tuned C, F, A, D (like the first 4 strings of a guitar, a tone lower). But somehow, from the sound of the music in this clip, I don't think he was using that tuning. The actual pitch they are playing in is about B. The banjo seems to have its lowest string tuned to B,, (i.e. the B a 4th below the low E of a guitar), and there would appear to be another string tuned to the next B up.
So, based on what I can see and what little I know of Greek stringed instrument tunings, my guess is:
Incidentally, D, D A d (the same intervals as the above tuning) is used on the fiddle for some tunes in the Old Time repertoire. Dan Beimborn sometimes tunes his mandolin that way.
I know that is says on the intro 1935, but colour film was pretty damn rare at that time and I wonder if it would really have been used filming this. Mind you I know nothing about Greek music and am prepared to stand corrected that she really was a 30's popstrel.
Rebetika, the Greek "Urban Blues" of the WW2 era, was often backed by a bouzouki and/or something called a "baglama". The latter was smaller and squatter in shape than a bouzouki and was typically played mainly by strumming chords in a regular chopping style, like a ukulele, or a 5-string banjo as sometimes played (as for "Oh Susannah", and suchlike). The examples I've heard that I can remember accompanied songs in a brisk 2/4 rhythm. I think the baglama generally had three courses of strings, but there were probably different kinds and tunings in use.
I can't get Youtube so can't see / hear the players under discussion. But I imagine a 5-string banjo would have been at least a workable alternative to the baglama if one of those 1930s - 1950s Greek players had happened upon one; it would have had something of the baglama's plangent sound, and lent itself to the usual style of playing the baglama.
This instrument is too like the Cretan Lauta ( thats how the word sounds in Greek ) not to be a very near relative , and it sounds as if the strings are gut not steel.
For some 'Geek Banjo' with drive to it check out Michael Tzouganakis the Cretan Lauto player.
no no no that IS a cretan lauta youre thinking of but look to the right you will see a guy playing bass lines on the tenor banjo, and it has a very nice banjoey sound maybe youre confused i donno.
"Rebetika, the Greek "Urban Blues" of the WW2 era, was often backed by a bouzouki and/or something called a "baglama"."
Nicholas - The baglama is usually tuned D A d an octave above the 3-course bouzouki. It has roughly the same scale length as a mandolin (~350mm/14"), but a much smaller body - about the size of half a coconut (out of which they have been made). LIke the bouzouki, it started out as a member of the saz family (baglama saz).
But I digress.
Dafydd - the 4-course bouzouki, with it's guitar-like tuning, is a relatively modern develpoment, only coming to the fore in the 1950s, due the increasing Western influence on Greek popular music. The music in this video would appear to have its roots quite firmly in the Near East and, whether or not the date of the film is genuine, I think it is unlikely that this tuning would have been used for such music.
Greek Banjo
Greek Banjo
Before the Irish adopted the Greek Bouzouki to their music, it looks like the Greeks had adopted the tenor banjo.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQwgO535Oso
Who knew? I wonder how he tunes it?
# Posted on May 17th 2007 by McMandolin
Re: Greek Banjo
Lovely stuff.
I thought for a moment I could see a 5th peg on his banjo, but I think it was just sometihng in the background - it's rather fuzzy footage.
There are mandolin-banjos and saz-banjo hybrids made in Turkey, probably largely for the sake of volume. I wonder if the bouzouki (originally a type of saz) has been similarly adapted in Greece. The instrument in this clip clearly has single strings but, by the sound of it could have some form of non-equal-tempered fretting - or perhaps additional quarter-tone frets.
The old 3-course bouzouki was typically tuned D, A, D or similar (as used by Alec Finn). In Greece, 4-course instruments are usually tuned C, F, A, D (like the first 4 strings of a guitar, a tone lower). But somehow, from the sound of the music in this clip, I don't think he was using that tuning. The actual pitch they are playing in is about B. The banjo seems to have its lowest string tuned to B,, (i.e. the B a 4th below the low E of a guitar), and there would appear to be another string tuned to the next B up.
So, based on what I can see and what little I know of Greek stringed instrument tunings, my guess is:
B,, B, F# B
# Posted on May 17th 2007 by OrganicPeatCreature
Re: Greek Banjo
Incidentally, D, D A d (the same intervals as the above tuning) is used on the fiddle for some tunes in the Old Time repertoire. Dan Beimborn sometimes tunes his mandolin that way.
# Posted on May 17th 2007 by OrganicPeatCreature
Re: Greek Banjo
I know that is says on the intro 1935, but colour film was pretty damn rare at that time and I wonder if it would really have been used filming this. Mind you I know nothing about Greek music and am prepared to stand corrected that she really was a 30's popstrel.
# Posted on May 17th 2007 by nick b
Re: Greek Banjo
Rebetika, the Greek "Urban Blues" of the WW2 era, was often backed by a bouzouki and/or something called a "baglama". The latter was smaller and squatter in shape than a bouzouki and was typically played mainly by strumming chords in a regular chopping style, like a ukulele, or a 5-string banjo as sometimes played (as for "Oh Susannah", and suchlike). The examples I've heard that I can remember accompanied songs in a brisk 2/4 rhythm. I think the baglama generally had three courses of strings, but there were probably different kinds and tunings in use.
I can't get Youtube so can't see / hear the players under discussion. But I imagine a 5-string banjo would have been at least a workable alternative to the baglama if one of those 1930s - 1950s Greek players had happened upon one; it would have had something of the baglama's plangent sound, and lent itself to the usual style of playing the baglama.
# Posted on May 17th 2007 by nicholas
Re: Greek Banjo
I think the baglama is tuned dad an octave higher than the 3 course bouzouki.
Spoon mentions the low B that the banjo keeps thumping.
The tuning may well be B,,B,F#B
Nice bones playing too.
# Posted on May 17th 2007 by McMandolin
Re: Greek Banjo
This instrument is too like the Cretan Lauta ( thats how the word sounds in Greek ) not to be a very near relative , and it sounds as if the strings are gut not steel.
For some 'Geek Banjo' with drive to it check out Michael Tzouganakis the Cretan Lauto player.
# Posted on May 18th 2007 by Schlongbow
Re: Greek Banjo
no no no that IS a cretan lauta youre thinking of but look to the right you will see a guy playing bass lines on the tenor banjo, and it has a very nice banjoey sound maybe youre confused i donno.
# Posted on May 18th 2007 by ecidralla
Re: Greek Banjo
yes they finally changed my name from tw at :(
# Posted on May 18th 2007 by ecidralla
Re: Greek Banjo
Assuming that the guy started out on Greek bouzouki (not "zouk" thank you very much) it would be tuned DGBE or CFAD.Nice to see Borat on the fiddle!
# Posted on May 18th 2007 by dafydd
Re: Greek Banjo
"Rebetika, the Greek "Urban Blues" of the WW2 era, was often backed by a bouzouki and/or something called a "baglama"."
Nicholas - The baglama is usually tuned D A d an octave above the 3-course bouzouki. It has roughly the same scale length as a mandolin (~350mm/14"), but a much smaller body - about the size of half a coconut (out of which they have been made). LIke the bouzouki, it started out as a member of the saz family (baglama saz).
But I digress.
Dafydd - the 4-course bouzouki, with it's guitar-like tuning, is a relatively modern develpoment, only coming to the fore in the 1950s, due the increasing Western influence on Greek popular music. The music in this video would appear to have its roots quite firmly in the Near East and, whether or not the date of the film is genuine, I think it is unlikely that this tuning would have been used for such music.
# Posted on May 18th 2007 by OrganicPeatCreature