Is there any decent young box players coming through that will develop a standard of the likes of jacky daly, mairtin o connor, seamus begley, mcmahon etc
As far as im witnising rythem & style is being substituted by speed, over ornamentation, and playing new (poor) compositions
I'm in two minds about the amount of new compositions coming out on young bands' albums. Some are dire and won't stand the test of time. But there always have been dire tunes littering the byways of the history of the tradition.
Then again, I've heard several very imaginitive new compositions on some of these albums. So I disagree if you suggest all new compositions are poor.
But at least there ARE new tunes being composed, so that shows the tradition is thriving.
Im not saying all new compositions are poor but the best part of them are. people are composing tunes just for the sake of it and it doesnt say alot about a musician who plays/records his/her new composition just cause they composed it when its not up to standard.
But back to the point. Any good up and coming box players out there?
This idea that all young players play too quickly is an overgeneralization. I know many young musicians who play with a lilting 'older' style, and some who play quickly and with much 'style' (much like Martin O'Connor, now that I think of it). I also know younger players who play so quickly that they ruin the tune with empty virtuosity and flashy variations that have little melodic melody.
To say that all young players, box or otherwise, fall into the third category is far too simplistic and is the same as saying that all older players play in traditional 'older' styles because they can't hack the pace and/ or technique of the young guns.
Of course, neither of these statements are true. This seems to be one of the many recent broadsides on younger players. As was stated elsewhere, olduns complaining about younguns is inevitable.
In twenty years todays 'young players' will no doubt be saying the same thing as the next batch of upstarts.
P.S. Sean O'Kane of Belfast is a fine young box player who, to me, is innovating within the tradition.
You can't replace "style" with anything, including ornamentation and speed. Certainly style incorporates these aspects of somone's playing, but just because you don't like someone's style, it doesn't mean that they have none.
And to those who claim that using a lot of ornamentation isn't traditional and is a gimmmicky approach used only by young musicians, what do you have to say about Sean Keane, Matt Molloy, Jean-Michel Veillon, Noel Hill, Tony McMahon, Michael O Raghallaigh, John Carty, Frankie Gavin, Mairtin O' Connor, Kevin Crawford, etc.?
Surely you'll agree that these are all well-respected traditional musicians, all of whom use a moderate to high amount of ornamentation. There's nothing fundamentally wrong with having an ornamented style, regardless of of the instrument, and it's simply incorrect to presume that there's a one-to-one correlation between the amount of ornamentation and the level of traditionalism.
I heard a brilliant young box player from Co. Offaly playing in Seamus Bugler's session at Shortt's in Feakle in January. I either didn't get her name or don't remember it. She was in her late teens.
Well, as a young box player myself, I can think of one name who will almost certainly ascend to the ranks of Begley, O'Connor at al, Florina Doyle. I've heard her playing only from recordings, as she is in Ireland, and I'm in Australia, but she is very good. She's a student of Joe Burke's and it's obvious in her playing. I would think it won't be too many years before she'll be one of the top players in the world.
as one who has taken plenty o'heat for their sometimes perhaps over-vividly worded lack of enthusiasm for busy and noisy ornamentation, i can only reiterate that subjective preference while conceding that the ornamental wizards have amazing technique. i'm with the school that puts expression & rhythm first, though that can occur with or without ornamentation. example might be, while my own ornamental taste in concertina playing runs more to claire keville or terry bingham, i find noel hill to be an extremely expressive player whose music has enormous lift.
about box: yes, i think there are amazing young box players coming up.....i have seen plenty at festivals (including in classes) that seemed to fit the syndrome mentioned here of technical flash but low on feeling, but i have seen plenty who had it all......one who is now teaching and recording but definitely younger has been the subject of an admiring thread over on the c&f site's reed section, i.e., damien connolly......
oh, forgot---balledfan, if you like a very clean, slower, soulful box style, check out the new cd by east clare box player & photographer christy mcnamara, who is about martin hayes' age. as of a week or two ago, you got audio samples just by clicking on the site home page, not sure whether it's still there. it is titled something like "the house i grew up in." to me, this is liquid velvet....wonderful stuff. another gem in this vein is "solo run," more lovely clare stuff by ennis box player johnny mccarthy, who is probably the begleys' age-ish, but not to be missed.....
Let people compose tunes just for the sake of it. People have been doing that for centuries. If the new tunes are any good they'll find their way into sessions; if they are pants, they'll probably stay on the composer's CD.
Darren Breslin is a fine example of a young box player(he is 20) who has his own unique style, doesnt play too fat, and doesnt over ornament his tunes. he is definaty a name for the future
Don't forget the piano box either - there's some tasty playing on today's Comhaltas "clip of the day" at http://comhaltas.ie/music/detail/comhaltaslive_199_3_echoes_of_erin_dean_warner/ by young Dean Warner (ex Leeds and now living in Armagh) which shows that this, sometimes maligned instrument, also has a future when in the right hands!
Two other young box players definitely worth looking out for are Janine Redmond and Peter Staunton both from Dublin; also Daire Mulhern from Clare is another highly talented young box and melodeon player.
Benny McCarthy from Danu comes to mind. I know some others also, but I am pretty sure they are in their 30's, and someone younger than me might not consider them "young."
Don't know have young you want 'm, but Josephine Marsh, Verena Commins and Mary Rafferty are hardly over the hill.
If you want them younger, this year's Young Musician TG4 Award winner plays box: Fiachna Ó Mongáin. Haven't heard him yet, but have been told he's a lovely old style player from Connemara. Speaking of which, you may wish to throw in Johnny Og Connolly at this point.
A one who also frequently laments about speed, over ornamentation and lest we also forget in this new digital world, grossly over post produced work (eg 'God is in the reverb unit'), I'd have to agree.
Current American players I tend to hear because I am here, who probably no longer fall into the young category, play virtuoso techniques, usually with some guitar wizard along side. Only a couple worry about the original tune.
But that's what crowds want. Fast, fancy, something to clap along to. And the musicians play to it.
In the States, I can't say I've seen young box players. More seem drawn to guitar (every kid learns to bang out chords by the time they are 10), fiddle and recently flute. Actually had a chance to work with a young piper-14 or so years old.
Here, ITM usually doesn't draw until the rock n roll wears off.
Thanks Danny - some great playing by Damien on Youtube and no one can can accuse him of over production as he's sitting out in the street with a guitar and bodhrán player. This must be 2005 as I'm fairly sure that was when he took the two All-Ireland titles on box and melodeon.
>Only a couple worry about the original tune.
But that's what crowds want. Fast, fancy, something to clap along to.
So it's reduced to this lowly common denominator, the demands of an audience at a paying gig. 2000 years ago the Romans fed Christians to the lions, and the crowds loved it. So that makes it ok?
Now I see where Balledfan is coming from.
Damien Connolly, Benny McCarthy, Martin Quinn, Sean McComisky.
I just met after an email and telephone friendship... not a young player, middle aged, but a great player from Dublin who plays really archaic old style melodeon, named Alan Morrisroe, maybe some over there have met him?He's a real character, very upbeat and full of more energy than anyone should be allowed to have! He doesn't tend to play out at sessions, because he plays mostly in C which doesn't work for most, he has all the tunes, but transposed (by ear) into C.
I got him out to a NYC session the other night and he did a bunch of solos, absolutely knocked everyone out. Some of us fully intend to get him a little more out there on his next trip to USA. He's a real treasure. He learned from his grandmother, has many tunes she wrote that have not been heard elsewhere, at least not for a very long time.
I bemoaning a trend I am upset with not in anyway promoting it.
I gave up paying smokey, drunken bar scenes long ago for that reason.
But your right. It is an LCD these days.
Maybe if we kvetch about it enough, people reading this will get the idea that the music is important....not the drunks wailing 'Rising of the Moon' before passing out.
We sessioned with a very young box player a couple of weekends ago in Canada. He looks to be about 10 years old, and he's growing up in the right tradition. I was impressed by his mature playing along with Andre Brunet, Genticorum, Hurlevent and Philippe Guay on the tunes he was familiar with. We think we remember having seen him draw a crowd last August at a festival in Montreal. Anyway, I think he's one you might be talking about in a few years - the tunes come shining through.
Sorry, I misunderstood your irony Zippy. You're absolutely right of course, but I think no amount of us moaning will make any difference...just think in terms of Romans and Christians again...
Mairtin O'Connor, seen by balledfan as a good example, certainly caught the flak when he was starting out 30-odd years ago - "flashy", all the rest of it. I think he lived it down!
"But that's what crowds want. Fast, fancy, something to clap along to. And the musicians play to it."
I dont suppose it would occur to anyone here that people might actually play like that because they like it, enjoy it and dont give a flying whatever about what the crowd thinks. I know lots of people who play more modernish style and tunes etc and they dont give a whatever about what anyone thinks. I seem to be the only idiot (out of said modern style playing friends) stupid enough to try and stand up for that kind of playing. But dont worry - think I'm learning.....the long way.
Thats the problem 'bb' the modernish style and those playing it that dont give a flying whatever is doing untold damage to the real irish traditional music. This spead and over ornamentation is becoming the norm and the accepted thing. The feeling behind the music, the undersanding of where it came from, the transfer of emotion of the past and surroundings, through irish trad music, to the listener is been lost in technecality (which is easier to do because of the spead and reaction of the fingerboard) spead and over enthusiasim to please an audiance with little or no understanding of ITM. insted of playing music for what it is, 'music.'
Change is a natural part of life. Its normal. It happens in everything from Music to art to dance to literature and everything else in the world. The people I mentioned before all have much feeling for the music - and they understand where it comes from. They didnt just wander into the trad scene and start playing funky -they grew up playing trad and now they just happen to have different taste in music - thank god I say. It'd be a very boring music scene if we all liked exactly the same thing.
This is an interesting polarisation. A fan of ballads puts it that damage is being done to traditional music by those who have no feeling behind it. And the converse is that you should simply play it as you feel it (with the caveat, of course, that you understand it).
I am cynical of the "transfer of emotion of the past and surroundings". Leave it to the the archivists and musicologists.
The transfer of emotion of the past and surroundings is where the core of Irish music comes from. Being cynical about it implys and ignorance of ITM. ITM has its basis in he mountains the hill the rives the strams the lakes the seas the emotioal state and being of those in the past that played it composed the tunes suffered the injustices of the past. It was there release from the tyranny and oppression and the sheer enjoyment and 'emotional outburst' that represents traditional music as i preceive it to be. This is why i have reservations about changes of the tradition and a lack of understanding of the past. Understanding past irish histroy has a direct correlation with playin traditional irish music.
bb, you've gotta stop calling yourself an 'irish' musician. Your always going to end up in these "museum versus living tradition" arguements...
Just call yourself an Aussie Bush Muso and you can get away with calling anything 'traditional' - i mean, look at the bushwhackers - they butcher drowsy maggie with electric mando and bluegrassy-funk-style wah-wah fiddle and half the audience still swears they can almost smell the gumleaves, billy tea and smoked kangaroo meat
christy mcnamara is gonna be at a gallery opening in my city next week because some of his photos are showing for one week at this joint, which seems to be a hotel or something. per the notice i received, mr hayes & mr cahill are due to be there at least for a short while, and all will play a few tunes at some point during the evening. it's kinda maddening because it's a four-hour open-house-mingling-wingling type event and you don't know when the playing might happen, so i'll have to blow off an expensive night class to be there....but i will be there. we rarely get the good stuff in my city and i wouldn't miss it, even if it's brief.........
I find it interesting - yet again that some people get on the site and spout loads of crazy stuff about mountains and streams and lack of understanding etc and yet dont have anything in their bio......
Anyway - I dont consider myself and 'Irish musician' - I'm a Newtown musician and proud of it!
yes, but you must admit that it is the mountains, hils, rivers, lakes and streams of Newtown that provides the basis for the REAL Newtown Traditional Music (NTM)
If you want the emotions of the past then listen to old recordings. You can't presume to represent anything but your own emotions in your own playing, no matter how "connected" you feel or how certain you are about your own interpretation of history.
Anyway, there are some good young box players in Scotland that I like to hear, but I've no idea where they stand in the hierarchy of famous names mentioned here. They are just people I know whose playing I admire and , more importantly, enjoy. It's got nothing to do with how many or how few ornaments they use.
"You can't presume to represent anything but your own emotions in your own playing, no matter how "connected" you feel"
Good Point Bren - couldnt have said it better.
Sirnose - I have a bone to pick with you - Ive decided that you should respect the music more - you make me sick the way that you play and dont even think about the streams - how could you! http://www.thepuredrop.com.au/video/skye.htm
"yes, but you must admit that it is the mountains, hils, rivers, lakes and streams of Newtown that provides the basis for the REAL Newtown Traditional Music (NTM" -Sirnose
Well, there are legions of ballads about mountains, hill, the rivers the streams the lakes the seas the emotional state the suffering of injustices of the past etc etc etc.
And I suppose that if you are a fan of ballads you will find all this romantic twaddle inescapable.
I'm not so sure what it is that puts the soul into trad music (Séamus Tansey talks about the sounds of horses galloping through the fields while more talk about the hardships of our ancestors and our tragic history) but I don't think any of this matters. To me the important thing is to recognise it (some call it the draíocht or more flippantly, the nyah) and to ensure that it's preserved. As to "how do you recognise this", it's not easy to answer. In my own view the music of Joe Cooley has it in abundance while many of the modern offerings like some of the newly composed stuff or high octane music with off-beats or/and East European influences are really a different genre altogether.
Right, this topic is probably dead by now but i had to leave this in reply to this post:
"Thats the problem 'bb' the modernish style and those playing it that dont give a flying whatever is doing untold damage to the real irish traditional music."
So youre telling me that when charlie lennon et al crank it up at their weekly session that they are doing untold damage to the tradition??? that they dont give a flying whatever??!!! i dont think so.
DAMAGE??? What damage? the great thing about our tradition is that its still very much alive and well and growing and changing and expanding. if it stayed stagnant it would have died many generations ago. Granted the likes of Coleman and Morisson (who played at a fair oul nip when they wanted to) should and have to be respected and admired, and they are!
Vis-a-vis the young box players, Darach Mac Mathúna is fantastic.
Have to agree that Darach MacMathúna is a great young box player. He's also a good sean nós dancer and a great sean nós singer so watch out for this name in future!
Another good young box player we forgot to mention is Paul Finn who now plays with the group Téada. Also what about Danny O'Mahoney and Pádraig King, another two great young players. I think this thread proves conclusively that we have no fear for the future with regard to good box players.
I'm a little confused as to why Michael assumes that balledfan is a fan of ballads. It's obviously a reference to an accident involving testicles and a ventilation system.
Damien Mullane by far the most talented young box player in years. I didn't see Danny O'Mahony mentioned in the earlier posts, fantastic box player from Ballyduff in Co. Kerry (And of course Damien is an adopted Dingle man now) Up the Kingdom!!!
Young box players
Young box players
Is there any decent young box players coming through that will develop a standard of the likes of jacky daly, mairtin o connor, seamus begley, mcmahon etc
As far as im witnising rythem & style is being substituted by speed, over ornamentation, and playing new (poor) compositions
Any opinion?
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by balledfan
Re: Young box players
Yes - its shocking the way people play with lots of ornaments. Sometimes I just cant get my head around it.
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by bb
Re: Young box players
I'm in two minds about the amount of new compositions coming out on young bands' albums. Some are dire and won't stand the test of time. But there always have been dire tunes littering the byways of the history of the tradition.
Then again, I've heard several very imaginitive new compositions on some of these albums. So I disagree if you suggest all new compositions are poor.
But at least there ARE new tunes being composed, so that shows the tradition is thriving.
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by Alf Tupper
Re: Young box players
Im not saying all new compositions are poor but the best part of them are. people are composing tunes just for the sake of it and it doesnt say alot about a musician who plays/records his/her new composition just cause they composed it when its not up to standard.
But back to the point. Any good up and coming box players out there?
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by balledfan
Re: Young box players
This idea that all young players play too quickly is an overgeneralization. I know many young musicians who play with a lilting 'older' style, and some who play quickly and with much 'style' (much like Martin O'Connor, now that I think of it). I also know younger players who play so quickly that they ruin the tune with empty virtuosity and flashy variations that have little melodic melody.
To say that all young players, box or otherwise, fall into the third category is far too simplistic and is the same as saying that all older players play in traditional 'older' styles because they can't hack the pace and/ or technique of the young guns.
Of course, neither of these statements are true. This seems to be one of the many recent broadsides on younger players. As was stated elsewhere, olduns complaining about younguns is inevitable.
In twenty years todays 'young players' will no doubt be saying the same thing as the next batch of upstarts.
P.S. Sean O'Kane of Belfast is a fine young box player who, to me, is innovating within the tradition.
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by Sinocal
Re: Young box players
Please read 'melodic value'.
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by Sinocal
Re: Young box players
You can't replace "style" with anything, including ornamentation and speed. Certainly style incorporates these aspects of somone's playing, but just because you don't like someone's style, it doesn't mean that they have none.
And to those who claim that using a lot of ornamentation isn't traditional and is a gimmmicky approach used only by young musicians, what do you have to say about Sean Keane, Matt Molloy, Jean-Michel Veillon, Noel Hill, Tony McMahon, Michael O Raghallaigh, John Carty, Frankie Gavin, Mairtin O' Connor, Kevin Crawford, etc.?
Surely you'll agree that these are all well-respected traditional musicians, all of whom use a moderate to high amount of ornamentation. There's nothing fundamentally wrong with having an ornamented style, regardless of of the instrument, and it's simply incorrect to presume that there's a one-to-one correlation between the amount of ornamentation and the level of traditionalism.
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by mcdevincabe
Re: Young box players
I heard a brilliant young box player from Co. Offaly playing in Seamus Bugler's session at Shortt's in Feakle in January. I either didn't get her name or don't remember it. She was in her late teens.
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by GaryAMartin
Re: Young box players
Well, as a young box player myself, I can think of one name who will almost certainly ascend to the ranks of Begley, O'Connor at al, Florina Doyle. I've heard her playing only from recordings, as she is in Ireland, and I'm in Australia, but she is very good. She's a student of Joe Burke's and it's obvious in her playing. I would think it won't be too many years before she'll be one of the top players in the world.
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by kjay_bc_box
Re: Young box players
as one who has taken plenty o'heat for their sometimes perhaps over-vividly worded lack of enthusiasm for busy and noisy ornamentation, i can only reiterate that subjective preference while conceding that the ornamental wizards have amazing technique. i'm with the school that puts expression & rhythm first, though that can occur with or without ornamentation. example might be, while my own ornamental taste in concertina playing runs more to claire keville or terry bingham, i find noel hill to be an extremely expressive player whose music has enormous lift.
about box: yes, i think there are amazing young box players coming up.....i have seen plenty at festivals (including in classes) that seemed to fit the syndrome mentioned here of technical flash but low on feeling, but i have seen plenty who had it all......one who is now teaching and recording but definitely younger has been the subject of an admiring thread over on the c&f site's reed section, i.e., damien connolly......
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by ceemonster
Re: Young box players
oh, forgot---balledfan, if you like a very clean, slower, soulful box style, check out the new cd by east clare box player & photographer christy mcnamara, who is about martin hayes' age. as of a week or two ago, you got audio samples just by clicking on the site home page, not sure whether it's still there. it is titled something like "the house i grew up in." to me, this is liquid velvet....wonderful stuff. another gem in this vein is "solo run," more lovely clare stuff by ennis box player johnny mccarthy, who is probably the begleys' age-ish, but not to be missed.....
www.christymcnamara.com
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by ceemonster
Re: Young box players
Christy Mac is a nice understated box player, he's not only 'the same age as Martin Hayes' they're first cousins.
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by kilfarboy
Re: Young box players
Let people compose tunes just for the sake of it. People have been doing that for centuries. If the new tunes are any good they'll find their way into sessions; if they are pants, they'll probably stay on the composer's CD.
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by robharper
Re: Young box players
Damien Mullane, Sean McComiskey
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Young box players
Conán McDonnell
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by Pól
Re: Young box players
Darren Breslin is a fine example of a young box player(he is 20) who has his own unique style, doesnt play too fat, and doesnt over ornament his tunes. he is definaty a name for the future
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by garyfitz123
Re: Young box players
Pol - the request was for "young" box players...........
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by Alf Tupper
Re: Young box players
Not "young box" players then?
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by Paul_draper
Re: Young box players
Darren Breslin: http://comhaltas.ie/music/detail/programme_182_segment_1_more_from_the_street_session/
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by slainte
Re: Young box players
Don't forget the piano box either - there's some tasty playing on today's Comhaltas "clip of the day" at http://comhaltas.ie/music/detail/comhaltaslive_199_3_echoes_of_erin_dean_warner/ by young Dean Warner (ex Leeds and now living in Armagh) which shows that this, sometimes maligned instrument, also has a future when in the right hands!
Two other young box players definitely worth looking out for are Janine Redmond and Peter Staunton both from Dublin; also Daire Mulhern from Clare is another highly talented young box and melodeon player.
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by Bannerman
Re: Young box players
Damien Mullane from London (or England someplace) has been turning heads too...
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by PaddyCmusic
Re: Young box players
Benny McCarthy from Danu comes to mind. I know some others also, but I am pretty sure they are in their 30's, and someone younger than me might not consider them "young."
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by AlBrown
Re: Young box players
Eh? I thought Damien Mullane had an Irish accent - I could be wrong though.
Check out this playing:
http://www.bebo.com/Profile.jsp?MemberId=20208757
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by Alf Tupper
Re: Young box players
Don't know have young you want 'm, but Josephine Marsh, Verena Commins and Mary Rafferty are hardly over the hill.
If you want them younger, this year's Young Musician TG4 Award winner plays box: Fiachna Ó Mongáin. Haven't heard him yet, but have been told he's a lovely old style player from Connemara. Speaking of which, you may wish to throw in Johnny Og Connolly at this point.
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by SL*
Re: Young box players
Damien Mullane by a mile. He's London Irish, lovely lad.
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by Leftheris
Re: Young box players
A one who also frequently laments about speed, over ornamentation and lest we also forget in this new digital world, grossly over post produced work (eg 'God is in the reverb unit'), I'd have to agree.
Current American players I tend to hear because I am here, who probably no longer fall into the young category, play virtuoso techniques, usually with some guitar wizard along side. Only a couple worry about the original tune.
But that's what crowds want. Fast, fancy, something to clap along to. And the musicians play to it.
In the States, I can't say I've seen young box players. More seem drawn to guitar (every kid learns to bang out chords by the time they are 10), fiddle and recently flute. Actually had a chance to work with a young piper-14 or so years old.
Here, ITM usually doesn't draw until the rock n roll wears off.
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by zippydw
Re: Young box players
Thanks Danny - some great playing by Damien on Youtube and no one can can accuse him of over production as he's sitting out in the street with a guitar and bodhrán player. This must be 2005 as I'm fairly sure that was when he took the two All-Ireland titles on box and melodeon.
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by Bannerman
Re: Young box players
Check out Dan Gurney, 19 yrs old, originally from NY, living in Boston.
http://www.myspace.com/dangurney
http://www.dangurney.net
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by GaryAMartin
Re: Young box players
>Only a couple worry about the original tune.
But that's what crowds want. Fast, fancy, something to clap along to.
So it's reduced to this lowly common denominator, the demands of an audience at a paying gig. 2000 years ago the Romans fed Christians to the lions, and the crowds loved it. So that makes it ok?
Now I see where Balledfan is coming from.
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by Alf Tupper
Re: Young box players
As mentioned above I think Seán O Kane is a great player, as is Seán Óg Graham.
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Young box players
Also had the pleasure of meeting Dan Gurney in the Catskills - great head on him for the tunes, very tasteful.
Danny and Pól thanks for the comments. I shall cherish them always. ;o)
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Young box players
Damien Connolly, Benny McCarthy, Martin Quinn, Sean McComisky.
I just met after an email and telephone friendship... not a young player, middle aged, but a great player from Dublin who plays really archaic old style melodeon, named Alan Morrisroe, maybe some over there have met him?He's a real character, very upbeat and full of more energy than anyone should be allowed to have! He doesn't tend to play out at sessions, because he plays mostly in C which doesn't work for most, he has all the tunes, but transposed (by ear) into C.
I got him out to a NYC session the other night and he did a bunch of solos, absolutely knocked everyone out. Some of us fully intend to get him a little more out there on his next trip to USA. He's a real treasure. He learned from his grandmother, has many tunes she wrote that have not been heard elsewhere, at least not for a very long time.
Stay tuned!
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by irisnevins
Re: Young box players
This is not exactly on topic, but some of you might like to have this video of Joe Cooley:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCiqPCA_MRA
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by irisnevins
Re: Young box players
There are a couple of Damien Mullane's tracks up here:
http://comhaltas.ie/music/tag/Damien+Mullane
- lovely stuff. I think that the slow air playing on "An Buachaill Caol Dubh" is some of the nicest I've heard .... and he nailed it in one take!
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by b
Re: Young box players
Wonderful!
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by irisnevins
Re: Young box players
A nice kalm day
I bemoaning a trend I am upset with not in anyway promoting it.
I gave up paying smokey, drunken bar scenes long ago for that reason.
But your right. It is an LCD these days.
Maybe if we kvetch about it enough, people reading this will get the idea that the music is important....not the drunks wailing 'Rising of the Moon' before passing out.
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by zippydw
Re: Young box players
We sessioned with a very young box player a couple of weekends ago in Canada. He looks to be about 10 years old, and he's growing up in the right tradition. I was impressed by his mature playing along with Andre Brunet, Genticorum, Hurlevent and Philippe Guay on the tunes he was familiar with. We think we remember having seen him draw a crowd last August at a festival in Montreal. Anyway, I think he's one you might be talking about in a few years - the tunes come shining through.
# Posted on March 7th 2007 by vonnieestes
Re: Young box players
Sorry, I misunderstood your irony Zippy. You're absolutely right of course, but I think no amount of us moaning will make any difference...just think in terms of Romans and Christians again...
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by Alf Tupper
Re: Young box players
Mairtin O'Connor, seen by balledfan as a good example, certainly caught the flak when he was starting out 30-odd years ago - "flashy", all the rest of it. I think he lived it down!
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by nicholas
Re: Young box players
"But that's what crowds want. Fast, fancy, something to clap along to. And the musicians play to it."
I dont suppose it would occur to anyone here that people might actually play like that because they like it, enjoy it and dont give a flying whatever about what the crowd thinks. I know lots of people who play more modernish style and tunes etc and they dont give a whatever about what anyone thinks. I seem to be the only idiot (out of said modern style playing friends) stupid enough to try and stand up for that kind of playing. But dont worry - think I'm learning.....the long way.
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by bb
Re: Young box players
Thats the problem 'bb' the modernish style and those playing it that dont give a flying whatever is doing untold damage to the real irish traditional music. This spead and over ornamentation is becoming the norm and the accepted thing. The feeling behind the music, the undersanding of where it came from, the transfer of emotion of the past and surroundings, through irish trad music, to the listener is been lost in technecality (which is easier to do because of the spead and reaction of the fingerboard) spead and over enthusiasim to please an audiance with little or no understanding of ITM. insted of playing music for what it is, 'music.'
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by balledfan
Re: Young box players
Change is a natural part of life. Its normal. It happens in everything from Music to art to dance to literature and everything else in the world. The people I mentioned before all have much feeling for the music - and they understand where it comes from. They didnt just wander into the trad scene and start playing funky -they grew up playing trad and now they just happen to have different taste in music - thank god I say. It'd be a very boring music scene if we all liked exactly the same thing.
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by bb
Re: Young box players
This is an interesting polarisation. A fan of ballads puts it that damage is being done to traditional music by those who have no feeling behind it. And the converse is that you should simply play it as you feel it (with the caveat, of course, that you understand it).
I am cynical of the "transfer of emotion of the past and surroundings". Leave it to the the archivists and musicologists.
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by llig leahcim
Re: Young box players
The transfer of emotion of the past and surroundings is where the core of Irish music comes from. Being cynical about it implys and ignorance of ITM. ITM has its basis in he mountains the hill the rives the strams the lakes the seas the emotioal state and being of those in the past that played it composed the tunes suffered the injustices of the past. It was there release from the tyranny and oppression and the sheer enjoyment and 'emotional outburst' that represents traditional music as i preceive it to be. This is why i have reservations about changes of the tradition and a lack of understanding of the past. Understanding past irish histroy has a direct correlation with playin traditional irish music.
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by balledfan
Re: Young box players
bb, you've gotta stop calling yourself an 'irish' musician. Your always going to end up in these "museum versus living tradition" arguements...
Just call yourself an Aussie Bush Muso and you can get away with calling anything 'traditional' - i mean, look at the bushwhackers - they butcher drowsy maggie with electric mando and bluegrassy-funk-style wah-wah fiddle and half the audience still swears they can almost smell the gumleaves, billy tea and smoked kangaroo meat
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by SirNose
Re: Young box players
christy mcnamara is gonna be at a gallery opening in my city next week because some of his photos are showing for one week at this joint, which seems to be a hotel or something. per the notice i received, mr hayes & mr cahill are due to be there at least for a short while, and all will play a few tunes at some point during the evening. it's kinda maddening because it's a four-hour open-house-mingling-wingling type event and you don't know when the playing might happen, so i'll have to blow off an expensive night class to be there....but i will be there. we rarely get the good stuff in my city and i wouldn't miss it, even if it's brief.........
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by ceemonster
Re: Young box players
mmmm Kangaroo meat. My favourite!
I find it interesting - yet again that some people get on the site and spout loads of crazy stuff about mountains and streams and lack of understanding etc and yet dont have anything in their bio......
Anyway - I dont consider myself and 'Irish musician' - I'm a Newtown musician and proud of it!
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by bb
Re: Young box players
A newtown musician playing irish music so respect it and dont abuse it
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by balledfan
NTM forever!
yes, but you must admit that it is the mountains, hils, rivers, lakes and streams of Newtown that provides the basis for the REAL Newtown Traditional Music (NTM)
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by SirNose
Re: Young box players
and balledfan-of-the-blank-bio, maybe you should check this in regards to bb's 'abuse' of the music:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhA-PeKbMn0&mode=related&search
Just an example of NTM for ye...
(and beebs, sorry for posting this link, second time it's getting an airing in the own day - you thesession celebrity you!)
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by SirNose
Re: Young box players
If you want the emotions of the past then listen to old recordings. You can't presume to represent anything but your own emotions in your own playing, no matter how "connected" you feel or how certain you are about your own interpretation of history.
Anyway, there are some good young box players in Scotland that I like to hear, but I've no idea where they stand in the hierarchy of famous names mentioned here. They are just people I know whose playing I admire and , more importantly, enjoy. It's got nothing to do with how many or how few ornaments they use.
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by Bren
Re: Young box players
"You can't presume to represent anything but your own emotions in your own playing, no matter how "connected" you feel"
Good Point Bren - couldnt have said it better.
Sirnose - I have a bone to pick with you - Ive decided that you should respect the music more - you make me sick the way that you play and dont even think about the streams - how could you!
http://www.thepuredrop.com.au/video/skye.htm
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by bb
Re: Young box players
"yes, but you must admit that it is the mountains, hils, rivers, lakes and streams of Newtown that provides the basis for the REAL Newtown Traditional Music (NTM" -Sirnose
Streams of beer maybe
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by bb
Re: Young box players
If I said it was called mountain music; you'd just tell me to go jump in a lake.
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by Ray Mariani
Re: Young box players
Colm Healy...
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by charliechamo
Re: Young box players
Well, there are legions of ballads about mountains, hill, the rivers the streams the lakes the seas the emotional state the suffering of injustices of the past etc etc etc.
And I suppose that if you are a fan of ballads you will find all this romantic twaddle inescapable.
Me? I like my music sans words.
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by llig leahcim
Re: Young box players
I'm not so sure what it is that puts the soul into trad music (Séamus Tansey talks about the sounds of horses galloping through the fields while more talk about the hardships of our ancestors and our tragic history) but I don't think any of this matters. To me the important thing is to recognise it (some call it the draíocht or more flippantly, the nyah) and to ensure that it's preserved. As to "how do you recognise this", it's not easy to answer. In my own view the music of Joe Cooley has it in abundance while many of the modern offerings like some of the newly composed stuff or high octane music with off-beats or/and East European influences are really a different genre altogether.
# Posted on March 8th 2007 by Bannerman
Re: Young box players
Right, this topic is probably dead by now but i had to leave this in reply to this post:
"Thats the problem 'bb' the modernish style and those playing it that dont give a flying whatever is doing untold damage to the real irish traditional music."
So youre telling me that when charlie lennon et al crank it up at their weekly session that they are doing untold damage to the tradition??? that they dont give a flying whatever??!!! i dont think so.
DAMAGE??? What damage? the great thing about our tradition is that its still very much alive and well and growing and changing and expanding. if it stayed stagnant it would have died many generations ago. Granted the likes of Coleman and Morisson (who played at a fair oul nip when they wanted to) should and have to be respected and admired, and they are!
Vis-a-vis the young box players, Darach Mac Mathúna is fantastic.
# Posted on March 9th 2007 by galway-fiddle
Re: Young box players
Have to agree that Darach MacMathúna is a great young box player. He's also a good sean nós dancer and a great sean nós singer so watch out for this name in future!
Another good young box player we forgot to mention is Paul Finn who now plays with the group Téada. Also what about Danny O'Mahoney and Pádraig King, another two great young players. I think this thread proves conclusively that we have no fear for the future with regard to good box players.
# Posted on March 9th 2007 by Bannerman
Re: Young box players
I'm a little confused as to why Michael assumes that balledfan is a fan of ballads. It's obviously a reference to an accident involving testicles and a ventilation system.
# Posted on March 9th 2007 by GaryAMartin
Re: Young box players
or because he/she's a ba'heid?
# Posted on March 9th 2007 by Bren
Re: Young box players
there are so many good box players at the moment... so what if irish music changes a bit! The most important thing is that the trad stays alive
# Posted on March 14th 2007 by fluter
Re: Young box players
Damien Mullane by far the most talented young box player in years. I didn't see Danny O'Mahony mentioned in the earlier posts, fantastic box player from Ballyduff in Co. Kerry (And of course Damien is an adopted Dingle man now) Up the Kingdom!!!
Jonathan
# Posted on March 15th 2007 by Jonathan Roche
Re: Young box players
Agree with you Jonathan about Danny O'Mahony - I mentioned him on March 9th.
# Posted on March 15th 2007 by Bannerman
Re: Young box players
Daire Mulhern fron Ennis is just pure class!Damien Mullane is pretty class too...
# Posted on July 6th 2007 by cara090