You pick up your instrument, start practising, and your brain starts fizzing as new pathways are formed. Continued practice reinforces these pathways and soon you can play the tunes without mistakes and a few years later you form a Celtic supergroup whose name is made up of the first letters of the names of your fellow bandmembers.Or something.
I've just received an email touting a CD of high frequency noises that will kickstart my mojo in the morning, help me "be more productive, learn faster and make less errors", "solve your personal problems and sell more products and services", and best of all "legally steal the thinking patterns of millionaires and the most intelligent 1% of the people". For hopefully obvious reasons, I am reluctant to send $29.95 to Impulsive Profits, Inc.(not a joke) to see if it works. That said, I am curious to know if anyone had success with any techniques that enhance the learning process. I'm not talking about skiving off practice, just looking for ways to ensure that time spent practising is optimized.
I am reluctant to divulge this information, for fear of being kicked out of the Celtic supergroup, but as you have very bravely revealed that you have CONSIDERED paying $29.95 to I.P.I., here goes:
My brain starts fizzing (a little) if I drink no alcohol.
Aaaarghhh! I said it!
Will, I just sent a telepathic money transfer and I'm playing better already.
Don't know if you can actually spend money earned in telepathic transfers!
For me, just playing more helps -- a lot more, even if it means giving up other pastimes. Can you double or triple your daily play/practice time? I also try to have at least 2 full-immersion weeks (or at least long weekends) per year, full with tuition, workshops, concerts and sessions. At this events I usually jump from one plateau to another.
Not much discussion on neural pathways here...oh well.....
I don't think so much that many new neural pathways are formed, but that existing ones are reinforced by increased synaptic traffic. The "fizz" will only occur in specific brain regions - here's an article on piano playing but remember the visual cortex was activated (but less so than expected) as the performers were reading the piece as they played.
I doubt if there is any shortcut to learning tunes or technique. Just do it.
The voices in my head tell me that other, high-frequency noises would only serve to confuse the conflaguration that otherwise already goes on inside my normally constricted neural pathways... And my wife tells me my mojo needs no more of a kickstart than a good stiff cup of java...but that's not what the voices told me.
Sounds like the only one profiting would be the seller. Just practice a lot and it becomes second nature hopefully, tune by tune.
I think repetitive things do get encoded in out brains, but can this train your hands to coordinate with your brain too?
Practice should be fun if you love this. Stop worrying about getting ahead faster, and just enjoy what you're doing.
A lot has been written about learning and performance over the past centuries and there have been many theories about how the brain works, but none of them include the CD you are mentioning. I think you already know the concensus of the group on this one.
That being said, there are well studied (and applied) ways to improve performance - most of which has been studied in athletes but the principles apply - that you should consider. Performance is an amalgam of good technique, precision, accuracy, consistency, and confidence. Persons who perform well usually hve the talent to do so, are dedicated to the art (some say obsessed), and they practice on a regular basis.
It is the practice that you are referring to.
Learning to play an instrument well and then continuing to improve requires a fair amount of planning and analysis. Most of us don't do it that way, instead we try the music because we like it, realize we have a talent and a desire for the music, and then experiment. If we persist, we get better and usually most of us arrive at our talent level plus any technique we have picked up along the way. And that is fine since most of the time it is sufficient.
If you look at the well respected musicians in our field, almost all of whom are professionals, you will see that they are totally dedicated to the music, are very meticulous, and have very high standards to which they adhere. They always have a ton of talent usually in the 98th percentile. If you ask them what their practice habits are, you will receive a variety of answers from "I don't practice" to "three hours a day." The reason for this divergence is that their practice needs are different from the rest of us, they are, by definition, at the top of the game, so they have to make up the other 1% that defines perfection. But if you press them, they will tell you what Mick Moloney told me: that unless they work on the weaknesses, they are not as sharp as they want to be.
I am making an assumption about you, but at our level, we still need to work on technique and need to learn more sophisticated ways to present the music that are based on good standard technique and added layering of technique as we define ourselves with a style. (Style is the way we present the music. It only occurs if you have good technique and are consistent. The accuracy, precision and confidence only make the style more interesting.) Practice at this level requires working on those elements of our technique and evolving style and may take a lot of time since we still lack some of the parts. What parts, I can't tell you, but if you record your music as part of your development, you should be able to tell yourself.
The CD will not help, but listening to others and to yourself and then applying analysis and planning will. If you are like most of us, you have a ways to go but the journey will be fun.
So, as has been said above, the way to Carnegie Hall is "practice, practice, practice."
(My bona fides on this subject? Years of working with world class athletes and wriiting on the subject (http://www.shotgunsportsmagazine.com and look up the Mental Training article, it changes each month.)
The CD sounds like it might be related to the research from Tomatis - who uses filtered high-frequency sounds to train people's hearing. There are places all over the world that use this method. I must say it was a new one on me but you can read a bit about it here:
Hey - PS - just found the site for the CD you mention. Wow - a bit OTT. But if there is this much research into music and its effects (or even, just sound and its effects) then there's got to be something in this music larK!
So why aren't we all millionaires, is what I want to know?
Just been having a look at that Tomatis website. Can't make much sense of it except that the technique apparently stops you from falling over. Anyway, I can't see that this h-frequency stuff would be much use to someonewho can't hear high frequencies (higher than 8-9K in my case).
My (former) brother-in-law was studying as a pre-med back in the early to mid '90s, and he did a full research paper on the idea of brainwave synchronization using artificial means.
Interestingly enough, on my way out to visit him in Kansas City, I saw an ad for one of these devices in the SkyMall catalog, which is how the topic came up. And he had one to let me try. I immediately bought one upon returning home.
The theory is that you have several different types of brainwaves, and they operate in different frequency ranges. Alpha waves for waking states, Delta for sleeping states, etc. Basically, the research shows that if you get repetitive stimulation (visual and audible) at a particular frequency, your brain will eventually start producing brainwaves at that frequency. That much has been proven clinically.
Well, you take a concept like that, and immediately all the new-age wacko freaks latch onto it and try to make it into something else. Their claims are that with these devices, you can put your mind into a more receptive state for learning. Hmmm... maybe, I guess, but I have my doubts. These devices are built to have glasses with LED lights that you watch through your eyelids with your eyes closed, and headphones that will play some sort of whitenoise sound that matches the frequency of the flashing lights. And they have an audio-input so you can pipe in music or self-help books on tape...
From my experience with the one that I bought (a rather fancy one, in fact), you can do a number of cool things with it. You can certainly put yourself into a relaxed, yet still-aware state. The effect can be a hallucinogenic experience, akin to what people say they experience with meditation. But the main thing I found it useful for was putting myself to sleep in just about any environment - loud, bright, whatever.... the thing will put me to sleep if I start it at a high frequency and let it get slower and slower over a period of about 10 minutes, even if I wasn't tired to begin with.
I didn't, however, find any increased learning retention capabilities while using it - and neither did my brother-in-law in his research.
Now, having said that, one thing that just dawned on me is a similarity between learning tunes, and the state that the machine can put me into. When I am learning a new tune out of the blue (as opposed to one that I have heard forever, and am just now figuring out how to play), I find that I go into a trancelike state of concentration, which commonly makes me extremely sleepy (which is REALLY annoying!). But it is very similar to what can happen while wearing the brainwave synchronizer machine. Fascinating
The thing that I've noticed over the last few years of learning and playing tunes is that even a small amount of practice can often lead to a disproportionate amount of gain in ability. Sometimes a new plateau can be reached with relatively little effort. That certainly has to do with the fizziness of the old noggin waves defining and strengthening new pathways.
I'm no Martin Hayes, but here are some tips on how to help the noggin learn more effectively:
Subliminal learning - very true- before you even think about learning a tune get a recording and listen to it in the background while you do other things.
Water: a sip stimulates the body/brain into action.
Brain crossovers: try holding out both arms with index fingers pointing, then attempt to bring fingers together to meet. loads more of these..tip each finger on your hand with the thumb of the same hand.
Visualising - works! Try this - stand straight, try to turn as far around without moving feet. notice how far you can turn. Close eyes and imagine yourself like an owl turning all the way around. Open eyes and try again - did you get further? Then use visualising to aid learning.
I do a lot of these things with children I teach - they focus the mind if nothing else!
Keep the TV off while practicing. Play slowly. Take a break when you're tired so you don't commit mistakes to muscular memory. Try to find opportunities to play live--a great motivator to practice. Always play "musically."
Neural pathways and such
Neural pathways and such
You pick up your instrument, start practising, and your brain starts fizzing as new pathways are formed. Continued practice reinforces these pathways and soon you can play the tunes without mistakes and a few years later you form a Celtic supergroup whose name is made up of the first letters of the names of your fellow bandmembers.Or something.
I've just received an email touting a CD of high frequency noises that will kickstart my mojo in the morning, help me "be more productive, learn faster and make less errors", "solve your personal problems and sell more products and services", and best of all "legally steal the thinking patterns of millionaires and the most intelligent 1% of the people". For hopefully obvious reasons, I am reluctant to send $29.95 to Impulsive Profits, Inc.(not a joke) to see if it works. That said, I am curious to know if anyone had success with any techniques that enhance the learning process. I'm not talking about skiving off practice, just looking for ways to ensure that time spent practising is optimized.
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by bosco
Re: Neural pathways and such
I am reluctant to divulge this information, for fear of being kicked out of the Celtic supergroup, but as you have very bravely revealed that you have CONSIDERED paying $29.95 to I.P.I., here goes:
My brain starts fizzing (a little) if I drink no alcohol.
Aaaarghhh! I said it!
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by oldstrings
Re: Neural pathways and such
....and you call yourself a musician???? Get out and never darken our doors again.
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by bosco
Re: Neural pathways and such
Don't practice--*play.* Have fun, enjoy making music. You'll learn much more quickly and fully.
Please remit $29.95 through Paypal to my member profile email address.
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by Will CPT
Re: Neural pathways and such
Can I pay you in magic beans?
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by bosco
Re: Neural pathways and such
Will, I just sent a telepathic money transfer and I'm playing better already.
Don't know if you can actually spend money earned in telepathic transfers!
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by Donough
Re: Neural pathways and such
I can share with you my secret -
I found out that my learning patterns accelerate considerably when I'm not dead stoned or hopelessly hungover.
Does that help?
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by EastPole
Re: Neural pathways and such
For me, just playing more helps -- a lot more, even if it means giving up other pastimes. Can you double or triple your daily play/practice time? I also try to have at least 2 full-immersion weeks (or at least long weekends) per year, full with tuition, workshops, concerts and sessions. At this events I usually jump from one plateau to another.
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by skh
Re: Neural pathways and such
Not much discussion on neural pathways here...oh well.....
I don't think so much that many new neural pathways are formed, but that existing ones are reinforced by increased synaptic traffic. The "fizz" will only occur in specific brain regions - here's an article on piano playing but remember the visual cortex was activated (but less so than expected) as the performers were reading the piece as they played.
I doubt if there is any shortcut to learning tunes or technique. Just do it.
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by Alf Tupper
Re: Neural pathways and such
Here it is:
http://www.nici.kun.nl/mmm/courses/muscog05/imagery/Meister.pdf
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by Alf Tupper
Re: Neural pathways and such
The voices in my head tell me that other, high-frequency noises would only serve to confuse the conflaguration that otherwise already goes on inside my normally constricted neural pathways... And my wife tells me my mojo needs no more of a kickstart than a good stiff cup of java...but that's not what the voices told me.
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by pn5jn
Re: Neural pathways and such
Sounds like the only one profiting would be the seller. Just practice a lot and it becomes second nature hopefully, tune by tune.
I think repetitive things do get encoded in out brains, but can this train your hands to coordinate with your brain too?
Practice should be fun if you love this. Stop worrying about getting ahead faster, and just enjoy what you're doing.
my 2 cents.....
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by irisnevins
Re: Neural pathways and such
bosco,
A lot has been written about learning and performance over the past centuries and there have been many theories about how the brain works, but none of them include the CD you are mentioning. I think you already know the concensus of the group on this one.
That being said, there are well studied (and applied) ways to improve performance - most of which has been studied in athletes but the principles apply - that you should consider. Performance is an amalgam of good technique, precision, accuracy, consistency, and confidence. Persons who perform well usually hve the talent to do so, are dedicated to the art (some say obsessed), and they practice on a regular basis.
It is the practice that you are referring to.
Learning to play an instrument well and then continuing to improve requires a fair amount of planning and analysis. Most of us don't do it that way, instead we try the music because we like it, realize we have a talent and a desire for the music, and then experiment. If we persist, we get better and usually most of us arrive at our talent level plus any technique we have picked up along the way. And that is fine since most of the time it is sufficient.
If you look at the well respected musicians in our field, almost all of whom are professionals, you will see that they are totally dedicated to the music, are very meticulous, and have very high standards to which they adhere. They always have a ton of talent usually in the 98th percentile. If you ask them what their practice habits are, you will receive a variety of answers from "I don't practice" to "three hours a day." The reason for this divergence is that their practice needs are different from the rest of us, they are, by definition, at the top of the game, so they have to make up the other 1% that defines perfection. But if you press them, they will tell you what Mick Moloney told me: that unless they work on the weaknesses, they are not as sharp as they want to be.
I am making an assumption about you, but at our level, we still need to work on technique and need to learn more sophisticated ways to present the music that are based on good standard technique and added layering of technique as we define ourselves with a style. (Style is the way we present the music. It only occurs if you have good technique and are consistent. The accuracy, precision and confidence only make the style more interesting.) Practice at this level requires working on those elements of our technique and evolving style and may take a lot of time since we still lack some of the parts. What parts, I can't tell you, but if you record your music as part of your development, you should be able to tell yourself.
The CD will not help, but listening to others and to yourself and then applying analysis and planning will. If you are like most of us, you have a ways to go but the journey will be fun.
So, as has been said above, the way to Carnegie Hall is "practice, practice, practice."
(My bona fides on this subject? Years of working with world class athletes and wriiting on the subject (http://www.shotgunsportsmagazine.com and look up the Mental Training article, it changes each month.)
Mike Keyes
http://www.banjosessions.com
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by mikeyes
Re: Neural pathways and such
The CD sounds like it might be related to the research from Tomatis - who uses filtered high-frequency sounds to train people's hearing. There are places all over the world that use this method. I must say it was a new one on me but you can read a bit about it here:
http://www.tomatis-group.com/uk/frame.htm
I must admit I'm a bit skeptical about Tomatis but I've never tried the technique.
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by Mark Harmer
Re: Neural pathways and such
Hey - PS - just found the site for the CD you mention. Wow - a bit OTT. But if there is this much research into music and its effects (or even, just sound and its effects) then there's got to be something in this music larK!
So why aren't we all millionaires, is what I want to know?
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by Mark Harmer
Re: Neural pathways and such
Really? All it takes is tomatoes to make me a better player?
Pass the salsa!
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by Will CPT
Re: Neural pathways and such
Well, I've been pelted with enough of them while performing. Made me better! Other people will have to just... Ketch-up.
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by Mark Harmer
Re: Neural pathways and such
Just been having a look at that Tomatis website. Can't make much sense of it except that the technique apparently stops you from falling over. Anyway, I can't see that this h-frequency stuff would be much use to someonewho can't hear high frequencies (higher than 8-9K in my case).
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by lazyhound
Re: Neural pathways and such
This is actually an interesting topic.
My (former) brother-in-law was studying as a pre-med back in the early to mid '90s, and he did a full research paper on the idea of brainwave synchronization using artificial means.
Interestingly enough, on my way out to visit him in Kansas City, I saw an ad for one of these devices in the SkyMall catalog, which is how the topic came up. And he had one to let me try. I immediately bought one upon returning home.
The theory is that you have several different types of brainwaves, and they operate in different frequency ranges. Alpha waves for waking states, Delta for sleeping states, etc. Basically, the research shows that if you get repetitive stimulation (visual and audible) at a particular frequency, your brain will eventually start producing brainwaves at that frequency. That much has been proven clinically.
Well, you take a concept like that, and immediately all the new-age wacko freaks latch onto it and try to make it into something else. Their claims are that with these devices, you can put your mind into a more receptive state for learning. Hmmm... maybe, I guess, but I have my doubts. These devices are built to have glasses with LED lights that you watch through your eyelids with your eyes closed, and headphones that will play some sort of whitenoise sound that matches the frequency of the flashing lights. And they have an audio-input so you can pipe in music or self-help books on tape...
From my experience with the one that I bought (a rather fancy one, in fact), you can do a number of cool things with it. You can certainly put yourself into a relaxed, yet still-aware state. The effect can be a hallucinogenic experience, akin to what people say they experience with meditation. But the main thing I found it useful for was putting myself to sleep in just about any environment - loud, bright, whatever.... the thing will put me to sleep if I start it at a high frequency and let it get slower and slower over a period of about 10 minutes, even if I wasn't tired to begin with.
I didn't, however, find any increased learning retention capabilities while using it - and neither did my brother-in-law in his research.
Now, having said that, one thing that just dawned on me is a similarity between learning tunes, and the state that the machine can put me into. When I am learning a new tune out of the blue (as opposed to one that I have heard forever, and am just now figuring out how to play), I find that I go into a trancelike state of concentration, which commonly makes me extremely sleepy (which is REALLY annoying!). But it is very similar to what can happen while wearing the brainwave synchronizer machine. Fascinating
The thing that I've noticed over the last few years of learning and playing tunes is that even a small amount of practice can often lead to a disproportionate amount of gain in ability. Sometimes a new plateau can be reached with relatively little effort. That certainly has to do with the fizziness of the old noggin waves defining and strengthening new pathways.
Pete
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by Reverend
Re: Neural pathways and such
I'm no Martin Hayes, but here are some tips on how to help the noggin learn more effectively:
Subliminal learning - very true- before you even think about learning a tune get a recording and listen to it in the background while you do other things.
Water: a sip stimulates the body/brain into action.
Brain crossovers: try holding out both arms with index fingers pointing, then attempt to bring fingers together to meet. loads more of these..tip each finger on your hand with the thumb of the same hand.
Visualising - works! Try this - stand straight, try to turn as far around without moving feet. notice how far you can turn. Close eyes and imagine yourself like an owl turning all the way around. Open eyes and try again - did you get further? Then use visualising to aid learning.
I do a lot of these things with children I teach - they focus the mind if nothing else!
# Posted on October 13th 2006 by richrua
Re: Neural pathways and such
Keep the TV off while practicing. Play slowly. Take a break when you're tired so you don't commit mistakes to muscular memory. Try to find opportunities to play live--a great motivator to practice. Always play "musically."
# Posted on October 15th 2006 by sobro
Re: Neural pathways and such
Good advice, sobro. I'm very guilty of practicing when my mind isn't really on it....
# Posted on October 15th 2006 by Mark Harmer
Re: Neural pathways and such
All good stuff, people. Thanks.
# Posted on October 15th 2006 by bosco