I don't know about you, but whenever I use classical terms (such as 'violin') I just feel kind of awkward. Don't know why, though. And unfortunatly, I don't know all the trad terms for musical stuff.
What are the trad equivalents to classical terms like 'trill', 'slur', 'grace note', etc...?
As long as you make yourself understood, I don't think it really matters. I regularly use terms like trill, slur and grace note, but I am sure this varies from player to player. I guess you'd have trouble if you tried to pin down a trad equivalent for all the terms we use. That is one of the quirks aout trad music, so much variation from place to place and player to player.
I guess I'm not really helping or answering your question, but I do think we use a lot of the same terms.
"Weapon" = any instrument
"Slide" = slur (not to be confused with the tune type of the same name)
"Cut", "Tap", or "Strike" = grace note
"Roll" or "Cran" = mordent
It's quite simple really.
Trill: Budgie food
Slur: Unmitigated insult e.g. "You speeded up!" or "You speeded up, you B*stard".
Grace Note: Piece of paper slipped to attractive whistle player in vain attempt to attract her attention.
Mordent: Something from Lord Of the rings, or Someone from The Knights Of The Round Table.
Appoggiatura: A drunken attempt to apologise.
Counterpoint: Another way of looking at things.
Gavotte: To strangle.
Legato: Italian Lego
Natural: Someone Who can play better than you.
Obbligato: The Bucks Of Oranmore
Overture: Clumsy attempt to seduce the young Polish Barmaid
Pizzicato: Melted Mozzarella dropped in the f-hole of your fiddle
Polyphony: A parrot with a mobile.
Quintet: Five Pints.
Recital: A chance to go to the bar.
Relative Pitch: Slinging your cousin's banjo out the window.
Rhythm: Something everyone else gets wrong.
Vibrato: Instrument requiring 2 AA Batteries
A violin is a fiddle in evening dress under the chandeliers
But classical players use "fiddle" and "violin" interchangeably.
"violin" comes from the Italian, and "fiddle" is a more English word, but probably originated with the Romans. "Fidicen" is Latin for "lute player" or is a generic term for a player of any stringed instrument 2000 years ago.
Both "violin" and "fiddle" come from the Latin "vitula". The difference is that "violin" entered english from the Romance languages and "fiddle" came from the Germanic. Since in English Germanic words tend to be considered vulgar "fiddle" got snubed by the the classical world in general.
"Just remember, fiddle player does not equal violin player, unless you multiply the pay by at least ten!"
Oh yes. I have been using the same line in shows for more than twelve years now ( I should be ashamed, I know..)
"Itzhak Perlman plays a violin, I play a fiddle... know the difference? About three million a year"
So I'm dividing those "3 Million a year" by ten Wire, & I find that by your own calculations, you must be earning £300,000 a year, from your 'fiddle' - COOL.
Can I join 'your' band?
No band Ptar, just the instruments and me... the fiddle drinks to excess so we always seem short of cash.
$300k? .. eh.. could be... but all that is left to declare are the bar tabs.
Ottery, if you made that up on the spot I am realllllly impressed. One way or the other it was good. Maybe Jeremy should stick it in the FAQ section just to show what a serious mob we all are.
I kind of disagree with everyone who say they're the same...the instrument is the same physically, but the way you play it is what really sets it apart.
Things that can be translated into "traditional lingo"....normally aren't. Most fiddlers I know say "slur" and "Grace note"...but a lot of ornamentations just aren't classical. Example-calling a trill a roll is wrong. They're not the same thing. Ornamentation as much as tunes are what sets Celtic music apart from Classical.
(And a slide definitely isn't a slur...it's a slide...)
Traditional Lingo
Traditional Lingo
I don't know about you, but whenever I use classical terms (such as 'violin') I just feel kind of awkward. Don't know why, though. And unfortunatly, I don't know all the trad terms for musical stuff.
What are the trad equivalents to classical terms like 'trill', 'slur', 'grace note', etc...?
# Posted on July 24th 2006 by Ben314
Re: Traditional Lingo
As long as you make yourself understood, I don't think it really matters. I regularly use terms like trill, slur and grace note, but I am sure this varies from player to player. I guess you'd have trouble if you tried to pin down a trad equivalent for all the terms we use. That is one of the quirks aout trad music, so much variation from place to place and player to player.
I guess I'm not really helping or answering your question, but I do think we use a lot of the same terms.
# Posted on July 24th 2006 by anastasiadesroches
Re: Traditional Lingo
These may help:
"Weapon" = any instrument
"Slide" = slur (not to be confused with the tune type of the same name)
"Cut", "Tap", or "Strike" = grace note
"Roll" or "Cran" = mordent
# Posted on July 24th 2006 by Drop_D_Chalupa
Re: Traditional Lingo
Just remember, fiddle player does not equal violin player, unless you multiply the pay by at least ten!
# Posted on July 24th 2006 by AlBrown
Re: Traditional Lingo
The difference between the fiddle and a violin is that you can spill beer on a fiddle and no one will cry.
# Posted on July 24th 2006 by Phantom Button
Re: Traditional Lingo
Nice TPB. I like that one.
If a slide is a slur, what it is a slide (sliding a finger between both notes, not just the bow)?
# Posted on July 25th 2006 by Ben314
Re: Traditional Lingo
It's quite simple really.
Trill: Budgie food
Slur: Unmitigated insult e.g. "You speeded up!" or "You speeded up, you B*stard".
Grace Note: Piece of paper slipped to attractive whistle player in vain attempt to attract her attention.
Mordent: Something from Lord Of the rings, or Someone from The Knights Of The Round Table.
Appoggiatura: A drunken attempt to apologise.
Counterpoint: Another way of looking at things.
Gavotte: To strangle.
Legato: Italian Lego
Natural: Someone Who can play better than you.
Obbligato: The Bucks Of Oranmore
Overture: Clumsy attempt to seduce the young Polish Barmaid
Pizzicato: Melted Mozzarella dropped in the f-hole of your fiddle
Polyphony: A parrot with a mobile.
Quintet: Five Pints.
Recital: A chance to go to the bar.
Relative Pitch: Slinging your cousin's banjo out the window.
Rhythm: Something everyone else gets wrong.
Vibrato: Instrument requiring 2 AA Batteries
# Posted on July 25th 2006 by Ottery
Re: Traditional Lingo
A violin is a fiddle in evening dress under the chandeliers
But classical players use "fiddle" and "violin" interchangeably.
"violin" comes from the Italian, and "fiddle" is a more English word, but probably originated with the Romans. "Fidicen" is Latin for "lute player" or is a generic term for a player of any stringed instrument 2000 years ago.
# Posted on July 25th 2006 by Trevor Jennings
Re: Traditional Lingo
Both "violin" and "fiddle" come from the Latin "vitula". The difference is that "violin" entered english from the Romance languages and "fiddle" came from the Germanic. Since in English Germanic words tend to be considered vulgar "fiddle" got snubed by the the classical world in general.
# Posted on July 25th 2006 by peterlenz
Re: Traditional Lingo
Ottery, that is hilarious, I love it.
# Posted on July 25th 2006 by anastasiadesroches
Re: Traditional Lingo
Haha, Ottery!
# Posted on July 25th 2006 by alison kale
Re: Traditional Lingo
Go Ottery!
# Posted on July 25th 2006 by jtrout
Re: Traditional Lingo
"Just remember, fiddle player does not equal violin player, unless you multiply the pay by at least ten!"
Oh yes. I have been using the same line in shows for more than twelve years now ( I should be ashamed, I know..)
"Itzhak Perlman plays a violin, I play a fiddle... know the difference? About three million a year"
Robert
# Posted on July 25th 2006 by WireHarp
Re: Traditional Lingo
So I'm dividing those "3 Million a year" by ten Wire, & I find that by your own calculations, you must be earning £300,000 a year, from your 'fiddle' - COOL.
Can I join 'your' band?
P.S. How much of that are you declaring?
# Posted on July 25th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: Traditional Lingo
Hmmm, Ptarmi, d'you suppose we've uncovered a Big Name?
http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display/10738
# Posted on July 25th 2006 by Trevor Jennings
Re: Traditional Lingo
Ottery has outdone us all!
# Posted on July 25th 2006 by AlBrown
Re: Traditional Lingo
The cheque's in the post, Al ...
# Posted on July 25th 2006 by Ottery
Re: Traditional Lingo
Ottery that is so good! God, I needed that laugh.......
# Posted on July 25th 2006 by Andee
Re: Traditional Lingo
The violin sings but the fiddle dances. Why do some people automatically equate "reward" with cash ?
# Posted on July 25th 2006 by duffgen
Re: Traditional Lingo
No band Ptar, just the instruments and me... the fiddle drinks to excess so we always seem short of cash.
$300k? .. eh.. could be... but all that is left to declare are the bar tabs.
Damn that fiddle....
# Posted on July 25th 2006 by WireHarp
Re: Traditional Lingo
Are bar tabs like guitar tabs?
# Posted on July 25th 2006 by AlBrown
Re: Traditional Lingo
In the sense that both can get you in trouble if extended too much, yes.
In the sense of getting drinks bought for you after the session, no.
# Posted on July 25th 2006 by Drop_D_Chalupa
Re: Traditional Lingo
A parrot with a mobile,, good stuff Ott !!
# Posted on July 25th 2006 by lamh trom
Re: Traditional Lingo
Ottery, if you made that up on the spot I am realllllly impressed. One way or the other it was good. Maybe Jeremy should stick it in the FAQ section just to show what a serious mob we all are.
# Posted on July 26th 2006 by Donough
Re: Traditional Lingo
It's a fiddle when you buy it
It's a violin when you sell it
Avi
# Posted on July 26th 2006 by improziv
Re: Traditional Lingo
"Slide" = slur (not to be confused with the tune type of the same name)
Chalupa - a 'slide' and a 'slur' ain't the same thing.
And, by your reckoning, we should be calling this tune
http://thesession.org/tunes/display/35
'The Jig of Slides'.
# Posted on July 27th 2006 by CreadurMawnOrganig
Re: Traditional Lingo
I kind of disagree with everyone who say they're the same...the instrument is the same physically, but the way you play it is what really sets it apart.
Things that can be translated into "traditional lingo"....normally aren't. Most fiddlers I know say "slur" and "Grace note"...but a lot of ornamentations just aren't classical. Example-calling a trill a roll is wrong. They're not the same thing. Ornamentation as much as tunes are what sets Celtic music apart from Classical.
(And a slide definitely isn't a slur...it's a slide...)
# Posted on July 29th 2006 by possumawesome