This thread is about those (of us) who are either good or , at least, fairly proficient on one instrument but not so great on the others we try.
For example, there was a very good singer who was told (by another singer, in fact) to "put away the fiddle" because he was "crap" and sing a song instead.
Also, I have a friend who is a marvellous concertina player but is, admittedly, very scrapy on the fiddle(though he knows plenty of tunes). At a festival session recently, one of the other musicians told him to "leave the fiddle in its case". Understandably, the poor guy looked a little hurt.
Now, we probably would be more tactful in making comment if it was obvious that a person was just in the process of learning or "improving" on their first instrument. Of course, there might come a time when they would have to be told...if they failed to improve any further and/or cause disruption. Yet, we(collectively, not me personally) feel that we have the right to tell other musicians to "stick to what they do best". Not very encouraging, is it?
You've probably come across this sort of thing before. What's your opinion? Should we be more encouraging and patient if our musical colleagues want to try something different? Or do you take the view that they ought to be playing "to their strengths" in a session? Perhaps, you might argue that "experienced" players should really know better and not play a different instrument in a session until they are ready? What do you think?
Well this question is really asking what a session is all about, isn't it John?
If it is one of those gig type sessions then I'd say the musicians probably should stick to their strengths as they are performing & being paid to perform.
If, on the other hand, if it is a regular session type session & just for the crack, then I feel that anything goes & really, where else can a musician try out but at a session.
I think that's what they're all about & if a musician doesn't get support from his 'friends' at a session, then he needs to find new friends & a new session.
Someone slagging off your playing is not a friend!
As they say in all the best U S chat shows - kick them to the kerb!
Aye John Bull, agreed, but of course being told to "leave the fiddle in its case" is just not constructive, it's a put down.
John J, I don't believe any 'good' musician would actually treat another musician like this so what we are talking about here are inferior musos with a bad attitude - & who needs them!
If I have a choice of sitting in with either ego-headed all stars or with decent people who might just happen to be musically inferior, I know which session I would go for
Let's face it, in sessions some musicians are pretty crap, even on their best instrument, & I'll happily put my hand up to that charge, but surely that is what a good session is all about, usually, non pros getting together & having fun with whatever music they have.
I would be incredibly insulted, a. I know my ITM is crap. b. I havent played with others in 20 years. c. my technique has gone to hell and d. I was once a very good classical player.
To me sessions are about enjoyment, learning and socialising with with with like minds.
Well, there is a school of thought that sessions are *not* for beginners and that one shouldn't take apart until he/she is "ready" and can play their chosen instrument.
I personally think this is an extreme view and we all have to start somewhere. We are also constantly learning.
The point is that whereas we might encourage or, in some cases, tolerate(those with a more elite view of sessions) beginners and improvers, we are sometimes actually less patient with our (musical) friends and you'll hear comments such as "I actually prefer to hear you play concertina" and so on.
Again, this is not my personal viewpoint or necessarily that of all the musician I know and I use the term "we" in the broader sense.
For several years we have been plagued by a certain zouk player who hunts us out at All Ireland Fleadhs. His zouk playing is truly awful while he can play passably at the banjo.
The last time we met with him I pointed out that there was a great zouk player in our team already and that he could perhaps learn a trick or two by watching him. I also suggested that he play the banjo.
Unfortunately he simply wouldn't take the hint and continued thumpin the livin bejasus out of his three chord wonder zouk.
Eventualy we all headed to another venue as we could take no more. He duly followed us like a lap dog and drove a couple of great musos away. [Including Pat Higgins from thesession all the way from NZ]
At that point I had little choice but to offer him some 'constructive criticism'. I'LL CONSTRUCTIVELY CRITICISE YOU ME BOY.
He took it really thick and nearly lost the bap completely but left [thank you jebus].
The following day he came and apologised profusely for his behaviour but I am still not sure if he has learned anything from the experience. In any event he wasn't to be see in Leitir last year and we are keeping the fingers crossed for this.
Notwithstanding the above, however, I don't think there's any harm in passing an opinion to the effect you think a certain tune would suit another instrument a little better or that "a little bit of mandolin(or whatever)" would be nice there.
This is a completely different scenario than saying "Stick to your first instrument because you're better at it".
well its just typical of the snobby trend that exists in trad music among some musicians. give people a chance to try their instrument. it shows a real love for music to want to learn a few instruments. In saying that though - you really should practice before sitting down to a decent session
As with many of these situations, you have to try & put yourself in their shoes.
So if you yourself had been beavering away at home for months on end, learning to play a new instrument, &, knowing that the only way you were really going to know if you were really getting somewhere with it was to take it to a session with your - 'friends', you produced it one night & gave it your best shot & some, soon to be 'former friend', told you to stick the blasted yolk back in its case!
How would you feel?
I know of a musician who took up the fiddle in his maturity, being already an experienced and recorded musician. After six weeks he took it out to a club, and discovered that it all fell to pieces in public. He "paid " for his getting up to speed in public by always bringing guitar or banjo as well - he would play one number on the fretted, one on the fiddle. It was a bit painful for a time, though.
I suppose the thing is that, generaly speaking, if someone is good on one instrument they can usually have a fair idea of what is good on another. So we sort of expect that a great fiddler who is a crap fluter will probably know it and probably not play their second instrument without a caveat to the sess before they launch into a set of tunes.
My issue is with those who are jack of all trades and master of none and who wont listen to genuine feedback from musicians who actually care.
I DO want people to feel at home in our sess and will go out of my way to provide genuine constructive feedback but there really does come a point when the truth will out and if that hurts someone's feelings then so be it.
I would just hope that, on reflection, they will realsie that it was well intentioned with the objective of helping them to learn and fit in with the team.
I have been playing mandolin for the past six years or so, gaining enough confidence to go to the occasional session and managing to join in, on the tunes I know, fairly competently (I'll never be great, maybe never even good, but what the).
The local (ish) sessioneers, when they discovered I was trying to learn the fiddle almost insisted I brought it. They are a great bunch and totally accepting of anyone who has a love for the music and a willingness to learn (usual disclaimers about following ettiquette and respect).
Agreed Breandan, & there is often a tactful way of doing these things.
For example, when one of our Bodhran players decided to bring a Tambourine & tap it under the table, I could have embarrassed him in front of everyone, but instead, I waited till the next day to confront him & although he didn't like the idea that he would be strung up if he ever brought it again, I believe the fact that I spelled it out to him in private, rather than make a fuss in front of everyone, led to him accepting things & five years on, he still comes to our session - but has never brought the tambourine again.
So yes, sometimes you have to be cruel to be kind, but there is often a kind way to be cruel.......I think? ..
In sessions, I try to limit playing of different instruments (accordion, harmonica) to a few sets of those tunes that I have worked up to a passable level of performance. I don't think it is fair to turn a session into a workshed where you learn to play, which I have seen some people try to do. Some accomodation of newcomers is polite (example- "could you play this one set I am learning a little slower than usual?" is a fair request). But there are reasonable limits.
This gets into the issue of noodling, which we have discussed frequently, and also of etiquette (where my policy is be firm and honest, but also work to be polite and sympathetic).
Instead of telling them to put the new instrument back in the case, you could tell them that they are making improvement, although they still have a way to go before they are ready for another public appearance. Give them suggestions of techniques they should work on, and weaknesses they can focus on as they practice. In other words, rather than tell them they stink, tell them how they can get better.
Now, if only I could play my MAIN instrument (guitar) up to acceptable levels!
Agreed Ptarmy on the put down thing, it wasn't very helpful to be sure.
What I should have gone on to say was that some tips on improving things would always be better than a flat "Don't play that freaking thing near me".
I guess it comes down again to session etiquette. If someone brings something good to a session, than something a little less good along with it should be tolerated, at least for a while.
If after a while no improvement in the less good thing is evident, surely the player realises it for him/herself?
I wish that all people did realize the impact they had on others. Unfortunately, some people are just thickheaded and not sensitive to what others might be feeling, and that is where the problems start....
Most people who play two instruments don't have a best and a less good instrument. They have two instruments with different functions. They might have, for instance, a fiddle for expression and a mandolin for jollity and bounce - so they play different tunes on each. A mandolin is a lot easier to play than a fiddle, so the mandolin playing might seem better. That doesn't mean the fiddle should stay in its case all night. Nor does it mean that if they are in a dark, un-mandolinish mood they will necessarily appreciate feedback on their fiddle playing, however constructive.
My best instrument in the CD player into which I deftly slot someone else's brilliant, professional, edited, polished, over-dubbed recording - but I don't always stay at home and play it because I like to take my inferior instruments to a session where I enjoy exchanging the proper quota of tactless, ill-worded remarks with others who share my taste for the sensual pleasure derived when such remarks slide harmlessly off a crocodile skin. We all need to remember that it doesn't always work like that.
Good thread, I agree with everyone who wants to help out in a nice way, Al Brown, I totally agree with you, and whoever else it was who said that it is possible to be cruel in a kind way. Instead of putting people down or try to give constructive criticism (because not all people will see it as constructive criticism), tell them how they can improve instead of telling them they suck. If you want your session to have a friendly and good reputation, simply treat others as you would like to be treated. Putting people down will eventually lead to that people won't come to the session because it will have a bad reputation (I might be wrong here - maybe big-headed stars will still be interested).
One question - if you shouldn't use the session as a workstead, how do you know when you're good enough?
Now when I have a brand new zouk and know a few chords, can accompany most tunes in major keys (still learning to remember where to find the minor chords), how will I know when I can bring it to a session?
I think people who play, or try to play, different instruments should be encouraged. Playing different instruments is good for whatever instrument you play, one instrument will help you improve on another instrument, etc. Since I got the bouzouki I've improved a lot on tone and rhythm on the mandolin, and also the fiddle has helped me improve on the mandolin(mandolin is my main instrument).
It's weird, after playing Irish bouzouki I play much better bluegrass mandolin!!
There are cds of slower tunes for most instruments. If you can't play along with one of those at home, how can you hope to cope with speed-merchants in session?
Full marks to anyone who doesn't try to play all the tunes but asks if someone will play a particular tune with them (on the slow side).
What bigger compliment can a beginer give?
Ok, and if you don't play a melody instrument? I have no intentions, yet, to play melodies on the bouzouki, but only rhythm, at least so far.
I can play some useful chords, I can play rhythm for reels, jigs and polkas reasonably in my own opinion, but how will I know I'm session-ready with that, if now there is harm in bringing the instrument to simply try?
The key to this is to be "session-ready", i.e. no harm bringing a second instrument, the benchmark has to be that you can paly to a standard which is acceptable to the rest of the session - how do you know this? - use your common sense!! This should be easier if you are already accomlished on your main instrument as (hopefully) you will be better able to distinguish between good and crap playing.
As a guitar player I sometimes bring a bouzouki to a session as well, for 2 reasons:
- variation
- insurance policy if there is another guitar at the session as I find it very difficult to play with another guitar player I don't know well
I'm sure I was ropey at first but sooner or later as an accompanist you have to "road-test" yourself in a session environment, plasying along to Bothy Band records will only get you so far!!!
Mind you I've seen a couple of sad cases over the years, especially people who try to learn the fiddle in later life. I know of one person who struggled with this for about 5 years, and was never any good (he is superb on his main instrument).
Another guy I know is "proficient" on banjo but insists on bring along a fiddle and a guitar as welll!! The main opinion seems to be that he should improve his banjo playing before he tries to diversify.
thats a moot point. as I am NOT what you would call session ready, I miss 95% of the tunes played and end up doing a background drone in the base notes of the phrase. HOWEVER I do get thanked for providing a base (god knows why) and I usually spend 5 minutes at the end, teaching self taught fiddlers bowing, positioning and playing little dittys written by composers caller Paganini, Purcell, Bach, Mozart, Corelli and Beethoven. They ask me to show them. My guess is so long as you arent disruptive and out of key who is to say.
On the other hand the session I go to is so relaxed, we take requests, we are constantly switching seats, you stand up, sit down, get a drink, go for a gossip whenever you feel like it.
You'll never be "session-ready" if you don't have a go. You have to dive in somewhere and to extend the analogy, you'll soon find out if you're in too deep.
This thread makes me think of the busker I saw singing in the tube last year. Some smartie said "Don't give up your day job"
He replied, "This is my day job ya pr*ck!"
"Stick to the day job"
"Stick to the day job"
This thread is about those (of us) who are either good or , at least, fairly proficient on one instrument but not so great on the others we try.
For example, there was a very good singer who was told (by another singer, in fact) to "put away the fiddle" because he was "crap" and sing a song instead.
Also, I have a friend who is a marvellous concertina player but is, admittedly, very scrapy on the fiddle(though he knows plenty of tunes). At a festival session recently, one of the other musicians told him to "leave the fiddle in its case". Understandably, the poor guy looked a little hurt.
Now, we probably would be more tactful in making comment if it was obvious that a person was just in the process of learning or "improving" on their first instrument. Of course, there might come a time when they would have to be told...if they failed to improve any further and/or cause disruption. Yet, we(collectively, not me personally) feel that we have the right to tell other musicians to "stick to what they do best". Not very encouraging, is it?
You've probably come across this sort of thing before. What's your opinion? Should we be more encouraging and patient if our musical colleagues want to try something different? Or do you take the view that they ought to be playing "to their strengths" in a session? Perhaps, you might argue that "experienced" players should really know better and not play a different instrument in a session until they are ready? What do you think?
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by Johnny Jay
Re: "Stick to the day job"
A session is not a concert, and people should be allowed to play what they want, but should expect constructive feedback.
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by Martin Milner
Re: "Stick to the day job"
Well this question is really asking what a session is all about, isn't it John?
If it is one of those gig type sessions then I'd say the musicians probably should stick to their strengths as they are performing & being paid to perform.
If, on the other hand, if it is a regular session type session & just for the crack, then I feel that anything goes & really, where else can a musician try out but at a session.
I think that's what they're all about & if a musician doesn't get support from his 'friends' at a session, then he needs to find new friends & a new session.
Someone slagging off your playing is not a friend!
As they say in all the best U S chat shows - kick them to the kerb!
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: "Stick to the day job"
Aye John Bull, agreed, but of course being told to "leave the fiddle in its case" is just not constructive, it's a put down.
John J, I don't believe any 'good' musician would actually treat another musician like this so what we are talking about here are inferior musos with a bad attitude - & who needs them!
If I have a choice of sitting in with either ego-headed all stars or with decent people who might just happen to be musically inferior, I know which session I would go for
Let's face it, in sessions some musicians are pretty crap, even on their best instrument, & I'll happily put my hand up to that charge, but surely that is what a good session is all about, usually, non pros getting together & having fun with whatever music they have.
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: "Stick to the day job"
I would be incredibly insulted, a. I know my ITM is crap. b. I havent played with others in 20 years. c. my technique has gone to hell and d. I was once a very good classical player.
To me sessions are about enjoyment, learning and socialising with with with like minds.
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by Joze
Re: "Stick to the day job"
Well, there is a school of thought that sessions are *not* for beginners and that one shouldn't take apart until he/she is "ready" and can play their chosen instrument.
I personally think this is an extreme view and we all have to start somewhere. We are also constantly learning.
The point is that whereas we might encourage or, in some cases, tolerate(those with a more elite view of sessions) beginners and improvers, we are sometimes actually less patient with our (musical) friends and you'll hear comments such as "I actually prefer to hear you play concertina" and so on.
Again, this is not my personal viewpoint or necessarily that of all the musician I know and I use the term "we" in the broader sense.
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by Johnny Jay
Re: "Stick to the day job"
For several years we have been plagued by a certain zouk player who hunts us out at All Ireland Fleadhs. His zouk playing is truly awful while he can play passably at the banjo.
The last time we met with him I pointed out that there was a great zouk player in our team already and that he could perhaps learn a trick or two by watching him. I also suggested that he play the banjo.
Unfortunately he simply wouldn't take the hint and continued thumpin the livin bejasus out of his three chord wonder zouk.
Eventualy we all headed to another venue as we could take no more. He duly followed us like a lap dog and drove a couple of great musos away. [Including Pat Higgins from thesession all the way from NZ]
At that point I had little choice but to offer him some 'constructive criticism'. I'LL CONSTRUCTIVELY CRITICISE YOU ME BOY.
He took it really thick and nearly lost the bap completely but left [thank you jebus].
The following day he came and apologised profusely for his behaviour but I am still not sure if he has learned anything from the experience. In any event he wasn't to be see in Leitir last year and we are keeping the fingers crossed for this.
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by breandan
Re: "Stick to the day job"
Notwithstanding the above, however, I don't think there's any harm in passing an opinion to the effect you think a certain tune would suit another instrument a little better or that "a little bit of mandolin(or whatever)" would be nice there.
This is a completely different scenario than saying "Stick to your first instrument because you're better at it".
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by Johnny Jay
Re: "Stick to the day job"
Was he wearing a leather Bikers Jacket Breandan?
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: "Stick to the day job"
Sorry, Breandan and I posted at the same time.
I was commenting on my own last post.
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by Johnny Jay
Re: "Stick to the day job"
well its just typical of the snobby trend that exists in trad music among some musicians. give people a chance to try their instrument. it shows a real love for music to want to learn a few instruments. In saying that though - you really should practice before sitting down to a decent session
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by ruairc
Re: "Stick to the day job"
As with many of these situations, you have to try & put yourself in their shoes.
So if you yourself had been beavering away at home for months on end, learning to play a new instrument, &, knowing that the only way you were really going to know if you were really getting somewhere with it was to take it to a session with your - 'friends', you produced it one night & gave it your best shot & some, soon to be 'former friend', told you to stick the blasted yolk back in its case!
How would you feel?
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: "Stick to the day job"
I know of a musician who took up the fiddle in his maturity, being already an experienced and recorded musician. After six weeks he took it out to a club, and discovered that it all fell to pieces in public. He "paid " for his getting up to speed in public by always bringing guitar or banjo as well - he would play one number on the fretted, one on the fiddle. It was a bit painful for a time, though.
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by Guernsey Pete
Re: "Stick to the day job"
I suppose the thing is that, generaly speaking, if someone is good on one instrument they can usually have a fair idea of what is good on another. So we sort of expect that a great fiddler who is a crap fluter will probably know it and probably not play their second instrument without a caveat to the sess before they launch into a set of tunes.
My issue is with those who are jack of all trades and master of none and who wont listen to genuine feedback from musicians who actually care.
I DO want people to feel at home in our sess and will go out of my way to provide genuine constructive feedback but there really does come a point when the truth will out and if that hurts someone's feelings then so be it.
I would just hope that, on reflection, they will realsie that it was well intentioned with the objective of helping them to learn and fit in with the team.
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by breandan
Re: "Stick to the day job"
Or perhaps some would prefer the old and very traditional approach - back stabbing and gutting??
I think in the end I would prefer the truth.
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by breandan
Re: "Stick to the day job"
I have been playing mandolin for the past six years or so, gaining enough confidence to go to the occasional session and managing to join in, on the tunes I know, fairly competently (I'll never be great, maybe never even good, but what the).
The local (ish) sessioneers, when they discovered I was trying to learn the fiddle almost insisted I brought it. They are a great bunch and totally accepting of anyone who has a love for the music and a willingness to learn (usual disclaimers about following ettiquette and respect).
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by Davetnova
Re: "Stick to the day job"
Agreed Breandan, & there is often a tactful way of doing these things.
For example, when one of our Bodhran players decided to bring a Tambourine & tap it under the table, I could have embarrassed him in front of everyone, but instead, I waited till the next day to confront him & although he didn't like the idea that he would be strung up if he ever brought it again, I believe the fact that I spelled it out to him in private, rather than make a fuss in front of everyone, led to him accepting things & five years on, he still comes to our session - but has never brought the tambourine again.
So yes, sometimes you have to be cruel to be kind, but there is often a kind way to be cruel.......I think? ..
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by Ptarmigan
Re: "Stick to the day job"
In sessions, I try to limit playing of different instruments (accordion, harmonica) to a few sets of those tunes that I have worked up to a passable level of performance. I don't think it is fair to turn a session into a workshed where you learn to play, which I have seen some people try to do. Some accomodation of newcomers is polite (example- "could you play this one set I am learning a little slower than usual?" is a fair request). But there are reasonable limits.
This gets into the issue of noodling, which we have discussed frequently, and also of etiquette (where my policy is be firm and honest, but also work to be polite and sympathetic).
Instead of telling them to put the new instrument back in the case, you could tell them that they are making improvement, although they still have a way to go before they are ready for another public appearance. Give them suggestions of techniques they should work on, and weaknesses they can focus on as they practice. In other words, rather than tell them they stink, tell them how they can get better.
Now, if only I could play my MAIN instrument (guitar) up to acceptable levels!
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by AlBrown
Re: "Stick to the day job"
Agreed Ptarmy on the put down thing, it wasn't very helpful to be sure.
What I should have gone on to say was that some tips on improving things would always be better than a flat "Don't play that freaking thing near me".
I guess it comes down again to session etiquette. If someone brings something good to a session, than something a little less good along with it should be tolerated, at least for a while.
If after a while no improvement in the less good thing is evident, surely the player realises it for him/herself?
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by Martin Milner
Re: "Stick to the day job"
I wish that all people did realize the impact they had on others. Unfortunately, some people are just thickheaded and not sensitive to what others might be feeling, and that is where the problems start....
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by AlBrown
Re: "Stick to the day job"
Most people who play two instruments don't have a best and a less good instrument. They have two instruments with different functions. They might have, for instance, a fiddle for expression and a mandolin for jollity and bounce - so they play different tunes on each. A mandolin is a lot easier to play than a fiddle, so the mandolin playing might seem better. That doesn't mean the fiddle should stay in its case all night. Nor does it mean that if they are in a dark, un-mandolinish mood they will necessarily appreciate feedback on their fiddle playing, however constructive.
My best instrument in the CD player into which I deftly slot someone else's brilliant, professional, edited, polished, over-dubbed recording - but I don't always stay at home and play it because I like to take my inferior instruments to a session where I enjoy exchanging the proper quota of tactless, ill-worded remarks with others who share my taste for the sensual pleasure derived when such remarks slide harmlessly off a crocodile skin. We all need to remember that it doesn't always work like that.
# Posted on July 14th 2006 by LowProfile
Re: "Stick to the day job"
Good thread, I agree with everyone who wants to help out in a nice way, Al Brown, I totally agree with you, and whoever else it was who said that it is possible to be cruel in a kind way. Instead of putting people down or try to give constructive criticism (because not all people will see it as constructive criticism), tell them how they can improve instead of telling them they suck. If you want your session to have a friendly and good reputation, simply treat others as you would like to be treated. Putting people down will eventually lead to that people won't come to the session because it will have a bad reputation (I might be wrong here - maybe big-headed stars will still be interested).
One question - if you shouldn't use the session as a workstead, how do you know when you're good enough?
Now when I have a brand new zouk and know a few chords, can accompany most tunes in major keys (still learning to remember where to find the minor chords), how will I know when I can bring it to a session?
I think people who play, or try to play, different instruments should be encouraged. Playing different instruments is good for whatever instrument you play, one instrument will help you improve on another instrument, etc. Since I got the bouzouki I've improved a lot on tone and rhythm on the mandolin, and also the fiddle has helped me improve on the mandolin(mandolin is my main instrument).
It's weird, after playing Irish bouzouki I play much better bluegrass mandolin!!
# Posted on July 15th 2006 by zinacef
Re: "Stick to the day job"
How do you know when you are session-ready?
There are cds of slower tunes for most instruments. If you can't play along with one of those at home, how can you hope to cope with speed-merchants in session?
Full marks to anyone who doesn't try to play all the tunes but asks if someone will play a particular tune with them (on the slow side).
What bigger compliment can a beginer give?
# Posted on July 15th 2006 by geoffwright
Re: "Stick to the day job"
Ok, and if you don't play a melody instrument? I have no intentions, yet, to play melodies on the bouzouki, but only rhythm, at least so far.
I can play some useful chords, I can play rhythm for reels, jigs and polkas reasonably in my own opinion, but how will I know I'm session-ready with that, if now there is harm in bringing the instrument to simply try?
# Posted on July 15th 2006 by zinacef
Re: "Stick to the day job"
The key to this is to be "session-ready", i.e. no harm bringing a second instrument, the benchmark has to be that you can paly to a standard which is acceptable to the rest of the session - how do you know this? - use your common sense!! This should be easier if you are already accomlished on your main instrument as (hopefully) you will be better able to distinguish between good and crap playing.
As a guitar player I sometimes bring a bouzouki to a session as well, for 2 reasons:
- variation
- insurance policy if there is another guitar at the session as I find it very difficult to play with another guitar player I don't know well
I'm sure I was ropey at first but sooner or later as an accompanist you have to "road-test" yourself in a session environment, plasying along to Bothy Band records will only get you so far!!!
Mind you I've seen a couple of sad cases over the years, especially people who try to learn the fiddle in later life. I know of one person who struggled with this for about 5 years, and was never any good (he is superb on his main instrument).
Another guy I know is "proficient" on banjo but insists on bring along a fiddle and a guitar as welll!! The main opinion seems to be that he should improve his banjo playing before he tries to diversify.
# Posted on July 18th 2006 by lysaghtm
Re: "Stick to the day job"
thats a moot point. as I am NOT what you would call session ready, I miss 95% of the tunes played and end up doing a background drone in the base notes of the phrase. HOWEVER I do get thanked for providing a base (god knows why) and I usually spend 5 minutes at the end, teaching self taught fiddlers bowing, positioning and playing little dittys written by composers caller Paganini, Purcell, Bach, Mozart, Corelli and Beethoven. They ask me to show them. My guess is so long as you arent disruptive and out of key who is to say.
On the other hand the session I go to is so relaxed, we take requests, we are constantly switching seats, you stand up, sit down, get a drink, go for a gossip whenever you feel like it.
# Posted on July 18th 2006 by Joze
Re: "Stick to the day job"
You'll never be "session-ready" if you don't have a go. You have to dive in somewhere and to extend the analogy, you'll soon find out if you're in too deep.
This thread makes me think of the busker I saw singing in the tube last year. Some smartie said "Don't give up your day job"
He replied, "This is my day job ya pr*ck!"
# Posted on July 18th 2006 by Bren