I'm sure some of you might think a fantasy banjo is the best kind, but I've recently taken to banjo as well as mandolin and fiddle. Do you know, it's incredible actually to be heard a bit! My mando is quite a good one and pretty loud in a small group situation, but when surrounded by 4 box players, two concertinas, 2 sets of pipes, 4 fiddles, a guitar, miscellaneous long whistles, a bodhran and a djembe(!) plus a few other things I can't think of for the moment, it doesn't stand a chance. So I bought a banjo cheap in a local bric-a-brac shop which was in need a a few extra bits to make it work. It's probably something like a John Grey (no label), 19 frets, open backed (but would have had a resonator of sorts at some time) neck a bit curved but playable and doesn't sound too bad with a new head and some new bits of hardware. And I think I might get addicted which will mean I'm trawling websites ogling the fantastic range of vintage tenor b's that you can get, especially in the States. I can't buy one yet as I bought the mando this year and loads of other stuff and need to avoid becoming a domestic murder victim, but in a few months I might take the plunge. So my question to all you banjo enthusiasts is, what in particular shall I look for? I really want something from the jazz age that can be tuned GDAE - I don't want a new one. I'm OK with 19 frets but shorter scale might be an option. I want one which already has planetary tuners, a good straight neck that isn't going to warp. It would be a dowel-stick banjo. My fantasies have been directed towards Vega, but Bacon and Day look great, and people seem dead keen on Paramount. Would I best look at one with a resonator, or is open-backed a good option for "this" music? Are open-backed banjos from this era specifically built as open-backed with particular tone-rings, or are they just banjo's with the resonator missing? Which b from that era is the ideal one for Irish music? There's a few questions - but I'm going to mess around with the old one I've got just for the moment, especially to make sure that I can manage the longer scale one. There'd be greater choice with 19 frets wouldn't there? Your collective wisdom will be perused with interest!
I'm no expert on banjo's, but I know a man who is . . have a talk to Andy Banjo he's got a shop in Kent ( you'll find him if you do a search). He's got an excellent reputation, and I've spoke to him on the phone about a mandolin/banjo, he's very helpful, and know's banjo's inside out.
Don't worry your head to much about it. Play the cheap one out, and see how you feel about it. Trust your ears, and get used to the technique first. A 'vintage' or hand-built banjo probably does make the difference, but remember - Gerry O'Connor etc would still be Gerry O'Connor whether he was playing a Paramount or a cricket bat with four elaccy bands on it. It's the player, not the instrument, which really counts.
"Avoid jazz banjos" - surely all vintage tenor banjos are jazz banjos. They wouldn't have made tenor banjos for folk, or bluegrass or old time would they?
I've been the same route as you, Richard.
Banjo mandolin or resonator mandolin will give you more volume than a woodie, but there's something about a tenor that stands out. The octave lower is a big factor for me. In my opinion, definitely go for a back and a metal tone ring for volume.
If you can find a short-scale 17 fret, it will be an easier transition from mandolin; but not essential. My approach was to get a fairly good quality vintage instrument (B&D Silver Bell) because renovations cost the same on a lesser model. And why not play something nice?
See www.findajo.co.uk for some choice items.
Oh man, it's a sad day when you realize you're fantasizing about banjos!
One of the nice things about banjos is that you can get incredibly good instruments for very little money compared to most other instruments.
The true fantasy for me is a Clifford Essex Paragon from the 1920's. But those do tend to be very pricey, partially because they're rare, and partially because they sound incredible.
Pretty much any of the banjos made by William Lange (Lange, Orpheum, Paramount) will be good players if they're still in good shape, and there are still a lot of them out there.
The one B&D that I have played is pretty nice. I am not a big fan of all the abalone and pearl stuff that they did on a lot of their banjos (mostly jazz banjos, I guess).
I have owned several Vegas, and I generally like most of them. Some of their early 20th Century open-back models are a bit "plunky" sounding for me, but most of their resonator models are nice.
I am currently playing a 1925 Weymann Orchestra Style model that I love. They are extremely well crafted, and sound great with a good setup.
So long story short, get to know the instrument a bit more with the one that you already have, and then find one that you like the sound of.
One other note, a lot of Irish players do prefer the shorter scale (17 fret), but in my opinion, the shorter neck hurts the sound, and they never sound as good as the longer ones. I kind of split the difference with the Weymann, which is a slightly shorter scale than most 19 fret banjos. But if you can get used to playing a slightly longer scale, it is worth it for the better sound.
I also play a lot of tunes on a longer scale bouzouki, so I am used to switching around to different length instruments. But it might be a bit difficult at the beginning since you're accustomed to a mandolin.
Finally, you've probably already discovered these sites, but if not:
Thanks Pete - that's a useful reply. I hadn't seen the bernunzio or the findajo sites before - tempting stuff! My current banjo looks exactly like this one http://www.pamelasmusic.co.uk/images/Forsale/string/banjotenor/Bt055.htm except it has 19 frets and no maker's name. It had the same useless dowel stick brace as shown in this picture, but I put a vega-type one on it and it made a lot of difference. It actually packs a bit of a punch (was I getting sideways looks last night that I never got on mandolin? Mustn't revel too much in the new-found volume!) Having the 19 frets makes a good sound, but I need to work out new fingering for some tunes (where you jump from F# to B and back again like in Fred Finns). I also need to get an arm rest as my right forearm is getting shredded.
Fantasy banjo shopping
Fantasy banjo shopping
I'm sure some of you might think a fantasy banjo is the best kind, but I've recently taken to banjo as well as mandolin and fiddle. Do you know, it's incredible actually to be heard a bit! My mando is quite a good one and pretty loud in a small group situation, but when surrounded by 4 box players, two concertinas, 2 sets of pipes, 4 fiddles, a guitar, miscellaneous long whistles, a bodhran and a djembe(!) plus a few other things I can't think of for the moment, it doesn't stand a chance. So I bought a banjo cheap in a local bric-a-brac shop which was in need a a few extra bits to make it work. It's probably something like a John Grey (no label), 19 frets, open backed (but would have had a resonator of sorts at some time) neck a bit curved but playable and doesn't sound too bad with a new head and some new bits of hardware. And I think I might get addicted which will mean I'm trawling websites ogling the fantastic range of vintage tenor b's that you can get, especially in the States. I can't buy one yet as I bought the mando this year and loads of other stuff and need to avoid becoming a domestic murder victim, but in a few months I might take the plunge. So my question to all you banjo enthusiasts is, what in particular shall I look for? I really want something from the jazz age that can be tuned GDAE - I don't want a new one. I'm OK with 19 frets but shorter scale might be an option. I want one which already has planetary tuners, a good straight neck that isn't going to warp. It would be a dowel-stick banjo. My fantasies have been directed towards Vega, but Bacon and Day look great, and people seem dead keen on Paramount. Would I best look at one with a resonator, or is open-backed a good option for "this" music? Are open-backed banjos from this era specifically built as open-backed with particular tone-rings, or are they just banjo's with the resonator missing? Which b from that era is the ideal one for Irish music? There's a few questions - but I'm going to mess around with the old one I've got just for the moment, especially to make sure that I can manage the longer scale one. There'd be greater choice with 19 frets wouldn't there? Your collective wisdom will be perused with interest!
# Posted on June 22nd 2006 by RichardB
Re: Fantasy banjo shopping
Open a music shop!
# Posted on June 23rd 2006 by mcknowall
Re: Fantasy banjo shopping
What a good idea! But I don't like parting with all the mostly cr@ppy instruments I own - I just want more...
# Posted on June 23rd 2006 by RichardB
Re: Fantasy banjo shopping
I'm no expert on banjo's, but I know a man who is . . have a talk to Andy Banjo he's got a shop in Kent ( you'll find him if you do a search). He's got an excellent reputation, and I've spoke to him on the phone about a mandolin/banjo, he's very helpful, and know's banjo's inside out.
# Posted on June 23rd 2006 by Justintime
Re: Fantasy banjo shopping
Don't worry your head to much about it. Play the cheap one out, and see how you feel about it. Trust your ears, and get used to the technique first. A 'vintage' or hand-built banjo probably does make the difference, but remember - Gerry O'Connor etc would still be Gerry O'Connor whether he was playing a Paramount or a cricket bat with four elaccy bands on it. It's the player, not the instrument, which really counts.
# Posted on June 23rd 2006 by tom roscoe
Re: Fantasy banjo shopping
Yeah maybe Tom. Avoid jazz banjos. Period!
# Posted on June 23rd 2006 by Newty
Re: Fantasy banjo shopping
"Avoid jazz banjos" - surely all vintage tenor banjos are jazz banjos. They wouldn't have made tenor banjos for folk, or bluegrass or old time would they?
# Posted on June 23rd 2006 by RichardB
Re: Fantasy banjo shopping
I've been the same route as you, Richard.
Banjo mandolin or resonator mandolin will give you more volume than a woodie, but there's something about a tenor that stands out. The octave lower is a big factor for me. In my opinion, definitely go for a back and a metal tone ring for volume.
If you can find a short-scale 17 fret, it will be an easier transition from mandolin; but not essential. My approach was to get a fairly good quality vintage instrument (B&D Silver Bell) because renovations cost the same on a lesser model. And why not play something nice?
See www.findajo.co.uk for some choice items.
# Posted on June 25th 2006 by oldstrings
Re: Fantasy banjo shopping
Oh man, it's a sad day when you realize you're fantasizing about banjos!
One of the nice things about banjos is that you can get incredibly good instruments for very little money compared to most other instruments.
The true fantasy for me is a Clifford Essex Paragon from the 1920's. But those do tend to be very pricey, partially because they're rare, and partially because they sound incredible.
Pretty much any of the banjos made by William Lange (Lange, Orpheum, Paramount) will be good players if they're still in good shape, and there are still a lot of them out there.
The one B&D that I have played is pretty nice. I am not a big fan of all the abalone and pearl stuff that they did on a lot of their banjos (mostly jazz banjos, I guess).
I have owned several Vegas, and I generally like most of them. Some of their early 20th Century open-back models are a bit "plunky" sounding for me, but most of their resonator models are nice.
I am currently playing a 1925 Weymann Orchestra Style model that I love. They are extremely well crafted, and sound great with a good setup.
So long story short, get to know the instrument a bit more with the one that you already have, and then find one that you like the sound of.
One other note, a lot of Irish players do prefer the shorter scale (17 fret), but in my opinion, the shorter neck hurts the sound, and they never sound as good as the longer ones. I kind of split the difference with the Weymann, which is a slightly shorter scale than most 19 fret banjos. But if you can get used to playing a slightly longer scale, it is worth it for the better sound.
I also play a lot of tunes on a longer scale bouzouki, so I am used to switching around to different length instruments. But it might be a bit difficult at the beginning since you're accustomed to a mandolin.
Finally, you've probably already discovered these sites, but if not:
http://bernunzio.com
http://www.vintagebanjos.com/
And if anyone has the desire to buy me the Paragon on http://findajo.co.uk, I'd let you
Pete
# Posted on June 25th 2006 by Reverend
Re: Fantasy banjo shopping
Thanks Pete - that's a useful reply. I hadn't seen the bernunzio or the findajo sites before - tempting stuff! My current banjo looks exactly like this one http://www.pamelasmusic.co.uk/images/Forsale/string/banjotenor/Bt055.htm except it has 19 frets and no maker's name. It had the same useless dowel stick brace as shown in this picture, but I put a vega-type one on it and it made a lot of difference. It actually packs a bit of a punch (was I getting sideways looks last night that I never got on mandolin? Mustn't revel too much in the new-found volume!) Having the 19 frets makes a good sound, but I need to work out new fingering for some tunes (where you jump from F# to B and back again like in Fred Finns). I also need to get an arm rest as my right forearm is getting shredded.
# Posted on June 27th 2006 by RichardB