Am looking to buy a new guitar for about a grand. Have my heart set on either a Martin or a Seagull. Have heard lots of positive things about both types from various trad heads, but haven't a clue as to what actual models to consider? Any pearls of wisdom (or financial donations) would be much appreciated
Hi Siansa,a grand in $ or £?Seagulls are good value for money i use one myself.When funds permit I will be looking at a Fylde or Taylor I think .There was a discussion about good value guitars not long ago on here I'll finf the link
Might want to take a look at Larrivee , don't want to steer you away from the others , but they are worth a listen and I think there is something in that price range.I love my JV-05 way more than Taylor-They have a warm bright tone -good luck
Start haunting your local guitar shops. Play everything they've got, then come back next week and do it again. Repeat until you start to get a sense of what guitars you want to come back to.
I could load you up with my prejudices, but it's much more fun to develop your own. (but if you ever see a late '80s Epiphone PR-350, it might be a good guitar at a good price. I love the way mine sounds, anyway, especially for flatpicking)
(and be sure to buy some strings or something when you go in, even if you can get them cheaper on line)
Not only play everything in your local guitar shops, BUT always take along a second opinion, including to play it so you can listen, and hear how the instrument projects to an audience, which is always different to how it sounds to you, hunched over the soundboard.
Also keep checking out all the local small ads - it should not be the reason you're buying it, but an old guitar, not mistreated, shouldn't loose any value, but you won't get all your money back if you sell off a new one soon after purchase. I have an old Guild D25 which I love, saw one similar in Hobgoblin for £950, then a local small ad for similar for £500 - steered a friend who was looking towards that, result very satisfied friend with great guitar.
Thanks for your responses everyone - am taking them all on board. I have my eye on a few on ebay Pete - there's a Seagull Artist Mosaic and a Martin Dreadnought DM. Neither have a cutaway though, wich would be useful. Anyone know anything about either of these models? Its actually Euro that I'll be parting with Meri-Lawes, which is about 1300 Dollars or 700 Pounds Sterling. Postage from the US to Ireland would probably cost about 150 Euro, so I'll have to factor that in, and then there would be import duty of about 100 Euro. So I guess that still leaves a grand Have been shopping in local shops in Dublin John but the range is quite bad - will actually have to travel about 60 miles to get to a shop that sells Seagulls! I haven't seen sight of a Larrivee Dorian, but I'll investigate it. I reckon I might end up getting something on the internet, but I won't get to try it out first - which is why I'm hoping for some advice about models most suitable for trad playing.
At that price, the Martins will have a marginally better resale value later on, just from the Martin name.
It could be possible to find a used solid-wood Martin, an 00-18, ... maaaayyyyybe a D-18 for that sort of money. It's worth looking. At that price, a used Martin will probably have been used pretty hard.
The new Martins around that price will most likely have laminated backs and sides, with model numbers in the -15, 16, ranges. Martin makes all their models of guitars in these ranges, and they're pretty nice.
I ha en't seen very many seagull guitars, but I've heard that they deliver really good value for the money...
When I was in Ireland, Martin guitars were very overpriced, but then the dollar was closer to parity with the Euro...
Models... I like OM size and shape. It's easier to handle in crowded sessions than a dreadnaught, and I like the tonal balance better (speaking -very- generally). I think that smaller guitars are very nice for ITM.
Have to agree with stv culchie. It’s pretty hard to beat the cachet of a Martin, even the lower end ones. I think most Seagulls at that price have laminates sides as well. Go Martin.
If you want a great sound though, at that price, take a look at Tacoma guitars. Personally, I don’t care for the ones with offset paisley sound holes but they offer very nice traditional center round holes that are a great bargain for the sound. I bought a mini jumbo cutaway several years ago, and spent only slightly more than you’re contemplating. It’s a really nice guitar.
Siansa,
I'm looking to sell my Rosewood Larrivee D-02R. I sent you a PM, maybe we can work something out. I think it's a really sweet, warm sounding guitar, and it's in great shape (I never turned into much of a guitar player).
Good luck,
Kevin
What to recommend depends on what you want to do with the guitar. However, I will give you brief details about my Seagull.
I have a Seagull Grand (solid cedar top, laminate sides, parlour size) that I really like. Goes for about $300. The small body size and slightly shorter scale length makes it a lot of fun to play. Nice for finger style work and has a sort of classical guitar type of voice which I like for certain tunes. Works fine for flat picking and strumming as well, but not very loud compared to my Taylor (big surprise there). However, it is sufficiently loud to work in a small group (say 4 - 5 people). I fitted the Grand with a Baggs I-Beam and it sounds amazing when amplified.
Seagull makes an Artist series version of the Grand that is all solid I believe for about $700. It has a spruce top, so I suspect it would have a different voice then the one I have. I have never tried one of them out.
This is the only model I have had any experience with. I have met many folks that have Seagull low-end dreadnoughts that have been very happy with them. Unfortunately I do not know the models they had.
I have a Martin D 35 which I purchased for around $1000.00. It was made in 1972 (not a good year for Martins supposedly) and was badly damaged before I bought it . But it sounds grand and I love it. It`s a testament to the workmanship that it`s stood up to such bad damage but repaired so wonderfully.
But be perpared if you buy a new one. I have heard they are cantankerous for a period of time until they break in. Hard to tune for while till they settle down.
Cheers
Have played it and loved it, just waiting for the day I get the cash together. The stirling price (in Hendersons, Derry) is around £700, but looking around the net I see that it may be bought in the states for half that price ($650) if my maths are correct.
Sure you will get plenty of good advice here, but you seem to be on the right track considering either Martin or Seagull.
Good luck with your choice!
The wife gave me a Martin DCXIE for an anniversary gift a month ago. I play hammered dulcimer but haven't had much chance to play it lately because of the Martin. One G chord on this thing is like a full body massage. I'd been banging away on an Oscar Schmidt for nearly a decade because I couldn't afford anything better. What I did back then was to tune up all 45 of the guitars they had sitting on the rack then go through playing each one. My Oscar "sang" to me unlike the others. This Martin also sings but LOTS better. Ferget brand names and strum the thing. I'm not necessarly recommending the Martin over the Seagull but it shouldn't take you long to choose once you have one of each to compare.
I have a Martin DM. Superb guitar. It resonates for ever. The bass is particularly good, the action is so easy to play and the whole thing SO much better than the Takamine (spit) that the guitarist in our band plays.
I have to agree with my obviously learned friend above, the Martin DM is a dream, believe it or not I actually prefer the origional model without the compensated bridge but I think I may be alone in that, the action is perfect, it plays itslef and with a set of 13 guage strings you can be heard over the highland pipes ! I have had mine for about 10 years now and the sound just keeps getting better, I play a lot a quite hard so it's coming up to needing a half re-fret but even at that the who;e package is so forgiving that the sound is still great, and instantly reognisable, oh and the final plus...... ITS A MARTIN !!!
I will say the same thing I say every time this thread comes up. My little brother, who plays guitar and runs a music store, and does the purchasing for an entire chain, says that if you are buying a new guitar, what is coming off the Taylor assembly lines during the past few years is superior to the Martins in the same price range. I don't know many people in the session world that play Taylors, probably because their guitars were previously limited to the high end of the price range, but they have introduced some more reasonably priced guitars that are worth checking out.
I myself play a Martin 000M, beautiful tone and playability, but fussy about humidity. I myself prefer the small bodied guitars, which have a nice light voice that goes well with this type of music.
First, why on Earth are you limiting yourself to Martin and Seagull? There’s a lot more out there in your price range. Don’t pay *too* much to attention to warnings or raves about a particular brand. Martin, for instance, has a huge number of models and there’s hardly anything you can say that applies to every one of them. One generalization I *will* make about Martin is that their quality is not as consistent as some others.
As to which model you might like, that’s for you to learn. As others have already said, get out there and shop! There are worse things to do with your time than trying out lots of instruments!
Thanks a mill for the heads-up. Looks like its gotta be a Martin doesn't it. Will try out a Taylor and a Larrivee, but you're in the minority folks. Then again I guess I don't have to do this democratically By the way have you all heard the the first World Fleadh is being held in Ballybunion this August. The line up is pretty impressive - lots of top quality trad and contemporary Irish bands.
Bob himself offers good advice. Judge guitars as individuals, not as types and brands. Two guitars from the same maker and of the same model can play and sound very different. And keep your eyes open for used guitars, which is something we pickers need to learn from our fiddle-playing bretheren (and sisteren?)--newer is not necessarily better. I got the chance to play a 1940's version of my Martin parlor guitar recently--oh my God was it beautiful--it had improved with age.
Yeah, gotta agree with Bob, don't limit yourself to just a few brand names - even if most of the people you see playing in sessions are playing Martins, Seaguls etc. Depending on where in the Martin range you're looking (there's quite a bit of variation in price) you might wanna think about having one custom built - and the luthier will be able to direct you to what shape of body is best for your style - and then you can specify things like neck width, neck radius, fret height, scale length, and things like having a zero fret, compensated string spacing etc etc. I've come across many guitars that sound great, but don't play right for me, and some the other way around. It might end up being a bit more expensive, but if you don't use someone who is hugely well known you could end up getting a bargain, as obviously less people take their cut of profit. The downside is that you don't have an expensive brand name on the headstock of your guitar, but frankly, who cares? After all, Stephan Sobell's guitars (which would set you back around £7000 and require a wait of towards 2 years - last time I heard) don't have anything on the headstock..........
just about smack-dab in the "about a grand" price range is martin's mojo-laden, soul-killin' all-mahogany satin-finish slothead 000 model, the 000-15s. fifteen inches at the lower bout (one inch smaller than a dred), this repro of a vintage martin slothead (i believe an old 000-18, not sure) is a 12-fretter (losing 2 frets gives richer bass tone due to altered bridge placement, added length, etc), and the star entry in martin's chocolate-brown "15" series, which delivers solid-wood instruments & world-class tone at a bargain price by foregoing the high-gloss cosmetics. the triple-ought slotheads are fingerstyle heaven & collector classics of the future. if you like a country-blues type fingerstyle sound, this is it. i can't believe the tone it puts out for the price. if you prefer a spruce top, they do a triple-ought slothead "16" series, also satin finish, for only a little more dough.
So many guitars...so little money!?
So many guitars...so little money!?
Hey folks!
Am looking to buy a new guitar for about a grand. Have my heart set on either a Martin or a Seagull. Have heard lots of positive things about both types from various trad heads, but haven't a clue as to what actual models to consider? Any pearls of wisdom (or financial donations) would be much appreciated
# Posted on April 21st 2006 by Siansa
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
Hi Siansa,a grand in $ or £?Seagulls are good value for money i use one myself.When funds permit I will be looking at a Fylde or Taylor I think
.There was a discussion about good value guitars not long ago on here I'll finf the link
# Posted on April 22nd 2006 by meri-lawes
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display/9684
# Posted on April 22nd 2006 by meri-lawes
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
Might want to take a look at Larrivee , don't want to steer you away from the others , but they are worth a listen and I think there is something in that price range.I love my JV-05 way more than Taylor-They have a warm bright tone -good luck
# Posted on April 22nd 2006 by dorian
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
Start haunting your local guitar shops. Play everything they've got, then come back next week and do it again. Repeat until you start to get a sense of what guitars you want to come back to.
I could load you up with my prejudices, but it's much more fun to develop your own. (but if you ever see a late '80s Epiphone PR-350, it might be a good guitar at a good price. I love the way mine sounds, anyway, especially for flatpicking)
(and be sure to buy some strings or something when you go in, even if you can get them cheaper on line)
# Posted on April 22nd 2006 by Jon Kiparsky
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
Not only play everything in your local guitar shops, BUT always take along a second opinion, including to play it so you can listen, and hear how the instrument projects to an audience, which is always different to how it sounds to you, hunched over the soundboard.
Also keep checking out all the local small ads - it should not be the reason you're buying it, but an old guitar, not mistreated, shouldn't loose any value, but you won't get all your money back if you sell off a new one soon after purchase. I have an old Guild D25 which I love, saw one similar in Hobgoblin for £950, then a local small ad for similar for £500 - steered a friend who was looking towards that, result very satisfied friend with great guitar.
# Posted on April 22nd 2006 by Guernsey Pete
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
Thanks for your responses everyone - am taking them all on board. I have my eye on a few on ebay Pete - there's a Seagull Artist Mosaic and a Martin Dreadnought DM. Neither have a cutaway though, wich would be useful. Anyone know anything about either of these models? Its actually Euro that I'll be parting with Meri-Lawes, which is about 1300 Dollars or 700 Pounds Sterling. Postage from the US to Ireland would probably cost about 150 Euro, so I'll have to factor that in, and then there would be import duty of about 100 Euro. So I guess that still leaves a grand
Have been shopping in local shops in Dublin John but the range is quite bad - will actually have to travel about 60 miles to get to a shop that sells Seagulls! I haven't seen sight of a Larrivee Dorian, but I'll investigate it. I reckon I might end up getting something on the internet, but I won't get to try it out first - which is why I'm hoping for some advice about models most suitable for trad playing.
Thanks again everyone, keep the wisdom coming!
# Posted on April 22nd 2006 by Siansa
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
Hey - me again!
Just to clarify - it's really models of Seagulls and Martins I'm interested in rather than makes of guitar..
Cheers
# Posted on April 22nd 2006 by Siansa
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
At that price, the Martins will have a marginally better resale value later on, just from the Martin name.
It could be possible to find a used solid-wood Martin, an 00-18, ... maaaayyyyybe a D-18 for that sort of money. It's worth looking. At that price, a used Martin will probably have been used pretty hard.
The new Martins around that price will most likely have laminated backs and sides, with model numbers in the -15, 16, ranges. Martin makes all their models of guitars in these ranges, and they're pretty nice.
Look here:
http://www.martinguitar.com/guitars/
I ha en't seen very many seagull guitars, but I've heard that they deliver really good value for the money...
When I was in Ireland, Martin guitars were very overpriced, but then the dollar was closer to parity with the Euro...
Models... I like OM size and shape. It's easier to handle in crowded sessions than a dreadnaught, and I like the tonal balance better (speaking -very- generally). I think that smaller guitars are very nice for ITM.
My personal taste only, YMMV. Good luck!
stv
http://cdbaby.com/Culchies
# Posted on April 22nd 2006 by stv culchie
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
Have to agree with stv culchie. It’s pretty hard to beat the cachet of a Martin, even the lower end ones. I think most Seagulls at that price have laminates sides as well. Go Martin.
If you want a great sound though, at that price, take a look at Tacoma guitars. Personally, I don’t care for the ones with offset paisley sound holes but they offer very nice traditional center round holes that are a great bargain for the sound. I bought a mini jumbo cutaway several years ago, and spent only slightly more than you’re contemplating. It’s a really nice guitar.
# Posted on April 22nd 2006 by fidkid
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
Siansa,
I'm looking to sell my Rosewood Larrivee D-02R. I sent you a PM, maybe we can work something out. I think it's a really sweet, warm sounding guitar, and it's in great shape (I never turned into much of a guitar player).
Good luck,
Kevin
# Posted on April 22nd 2006 by dirtyheel
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
What to recommend depends on what you want to do with the guitar. However, I will give you brief details about my Seagull.
I have a Seagull Grand (solid cedar top, laminate sides, parlour size) that I really like. Goes for about $300. The small body size and slightly shorter scale length makes it a lot of fun to play. Nice for finger style work and has a sort of classical guitar type of voice which I like for certain tunes. Works fine for flat picking and strumming as well, but not very loud compared to my Taylor (big surprise there). However, it is sufficiently loud to work in a small group (say 4 - 5 people). I fitted the Grand with a Baggs I-Beam and it sounds amazing when amplified.
Seagull makes an Artist series version of the Grand that is all solid I believe for about $700. It has a spruce top, so I suspect it would have a different voice then the one I have. I have never tried one of them out.
This is the only model I have had any experience with. I have met many folks that have Seagull low-end dreadnoughts that have been very happy with them. Unfortunately I do not know the models they had.
# Posted on April 23rd 2006 by rob zouk
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
I have a Martin D 35 which I purchased for around $1000.00. It was made in 1972 (not a good year for Martins supposedly) and was badly damaged before I bought it . But it sounds grand and I love it. It`s a testament to the workmanship that it`s stood up to such bad damage but repaired so wonderfully.
But be perpared if you buy a new one. I have heard they are cantankerous for a period of time until they break in. Hard to tune for while till they settle down.
Cheers
# Posted on April 23rd 2006 by pagra
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
would recomend this one.
http://www.mguitar.com/guitars/choosing/guitars.php?p=c&g=9&m=DCX1RE
Have played it and loved it, just waiting for the day I get the cash together. The stirling price (in Hendersons, Derry) is around £700, but looking around the net I see that it may be bought in the states for half that price ($650) if my maths are correct.
Sure you will get plenty of good advice here, but you seem to be on the right track considering either Martin or Seagull.
Good luck with your choice!
# Posted on April 23rd 2006 by proinsiasrua
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
The wife gave me a Martin DCXIE for an anniversary gift a month ago. I play hammered dulcimer but haven't had much chance to play it lately because of the Martin. One G chord on this thing is like a full body massage. I'd been banging away on an Oscar Schmidt for nearly a decade because I couldn't afford anything better. What I did back then was to tune up all 45 of the guitars they had sitting on the rack then go through playing each one. My Oscar "sang" to me unlike the others. This Martin also sings but LOTS better. Ferget brand names and strum the thing. I'm not necessarly recommending the Martin over the Seagull but it shouldn't take you long to choose once you have one of each to compare.
# Posted on April 24th 2006 by jrathbun
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
I have a Martin DM. Superb guitar. It resonates for ever. The bass is particularly good, the action is so easy to play and the whole thing SO much better than the Takamine (spit) that the guitarist in our band plays.
# Posted on April 24th 2006 by Geoff Pollitt
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
I have to agree with my obviously learned friend above, the Martin DM is a dream, believe it or not I actually prefer the origional model without the compensated bridge but I think I may be alone in that, the action is perfect, it plays itslef and with a set of 13 guage strings you can be heard over the highland pipes ! I have had mine for about 10 years now and the sound just keeps getting better, I play a lot a quite hard so it's coming up to needing a half re-fret but even at that the who;e package is so forgiving that the sound is still great, and instantly reognisable, oh and the final plus...... ITS A MARTIN !!!
# Posted on April 24th 2006 by bloodyfiddlers
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
I will say the same thing I say every time this thread comes up. My little brother, who plays guitar and runs a music store, and does the purchasing for an entire chain, says that if you are buying a new guitar, what is coming off the Taylor assembly lines during the past few years is superior to the Martins in the same price range. I don't know many people in the session world that play Taylors, probably because their guitars were previously limited to the high end of the price range, but they have introduced some more reasonably priced guitars that are worth checking out.
I myself play a Martin 000M, beautiful tone and playability, but fussy about humidity. I myself prefer the small bodied guitars, which have a nice light voice that goes well with this type of music.
# Posted on April 24th 2006 by AlBrown
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
First, why on Earth are you limiting yourself to Martin and Seagull? There’s a lot more out there in your price range. Don’t pay *too* much to attention to warnings or raves about a particular brand. Martin, for instance, has a huge number of models and there’s hardly anything you can say that applies to every one of them. One generalization I *will* make about Martin is that their quality is not as consistent as some others.
As to which model you might like, that’s for you to learn. As others have already said, get out there and shop! There are worse things to do with your time than trying out lots of instruments!
# Posted on April 24th 2006 by Bob himself
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
Yo guitar gurus!
By the way have you all heard the the first World Fleadh is being held in Ballybunion this August. The line up is pretty impressive - lots of top quality trad and contemporary Irish bands.
Thanks a mill for the heads-up. Looks like its gotta be a Martin doesn't it. Will try out a Taylor and a Larrivee, but you're in the minority folks. Then again I guess I don't have to do this democratically
Siansa
# Posted on April 24th 2006 by Siansa
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
Bob himself offers good advice. Judge guitars as individuals, not as types and brands. Two guitars from the same maker and of the same model can play and sound very different. And keep your eyes open for used guitars, which is something we pickers need to learn from our fiddle-playing bretheren (and sisteren?)--newer is not necessarily better. I got the chance to play a 1940's version of my Martin parlor guitar recently--oh my God was it beautiful--it had improved with age.
# Posted on April 24th 2006 by AlBrown
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
Yeah, gotta agree with Bob, don't limit yourself to just a few brand names - even if most of the people you see playing in sessions are playing Martins, Seaguls etc. Depending on where in the Martin range you're looking (there's quite a bit of variation in price) you might wanna think about having one custom built - and the luthier will be able to direct you to what shape of body is best for your style - and then you can specify things like neck width, neck radius, fret height, scale length, and things like having a zero fret, compensated string spacing etc etc. I've come across many guitars that sound great, but don't play right for me, and some the other way around. It might end up being a bit more expensive, but if you don't use someone who is hugely well known you could end up getting a bargain, as obviously less people take their cut of profit. The downside is that you don't have an expensive brand name on the headstock of your guitar, but frankly, who cares? After all, Stephan Sobell's guitars (which would set you back around £7000 and require a wait of towards 2 years - last time I heard) don't have anything on the headstock..........
# Posted on April 25th 2006 by Andy V
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
just about smack-dab in the "about a grand" price range is martin's mojo-laden, soul-killin' all-mahogany satin-finish slothead 000 model, the 000-15s. fifteen inches at the lower bout (one inch smaller than a dred), this repro of a vintage martin slothead (i believe an old 000-18, not sure) is a 12-fretter (losing 2 frets gives richer bass tone due to altered bridge placement, added length, etc), and the star entry in martin's chocolate-brown "15" series, which delivers solid-wood instruments & world-class tone at a bargain price by foregoing the high-gloss cosmetics. the triple-ought slotheads are fingerstyle heaven & collector classics of the future. if you like a country-blues type fingerstyle sound, this is it. i can't believe the tone it puts out for the price. if you prefer a spruce top, they do a triple-ought slothead "16" series, also satin finish, for only a little more dough.
god, i love my 000-15s.
# Posted on April 27th 2006 by ceemonster
Re: So many guitars...so little money!?
an old yamaha . . .
# Posted on May 6th 2006 by lisaniska