Okay, so maybe there's only a few times when you need to talk while playing, but sometimes it IS good to be able to do it. So, how many of us have a tough time talking and playing at the same time?
I can manage getting the title of the next tune out, and maybe a key change or two, but not much more than that -- if it's a complex sentence, I might have to stop playing, or risk screwing up the tune, unless I know the tune very well indeed.
Somebody, I can't remember who, told me this story of a bunch of fine musicians playing live on RTE. They'd agreed beforehand on the set they were going to play. They began the set, and a mighty one it is. As they approached the turn of the second tune, the fiddler realized he'd forgotten what the third tune they'd agreed on was.
So he leans, still fiddling, over to the box player, working away, and murmurs, "what's next?" The box player gazes desperately at him, pumping and sweating, struggling manfully to get the words out, all through the last B, eyes slowly starting to burst out of their sockets, his face getting redder and redder from his efforts. Finally, he manages to burst out with a loud "Feck off!" (on live radio!), and they were off into the third tune.
I give a little nod with my head if I have another tune in mind, otherwise I stick out my tongue if I want someone else to pick up the set, and of course, I wink at everyone if it is the last tune. 8-D
Kidding.
Really, this is a problem, but not one easily overcome.
In the session i go to, the leader just says "hup!" and starts playing the next tune. Somehow, people follow. Sometimes it's because we play the same sets all the time, sometimes people will listen for a couple of bars and jump in.
Over on IRTRAD-L there was a long discussion about this a couple of years ago, complete with suggestions for how to practice to do it. My favorite story was from someone who had played with a Dublin piper who was known for leaning over while playing a tune and saying, "D'ye know this one?" and then lilting another tune at the same time...
Can't do it myself -- it never struck me as a useful skill for a fluteplayer to learn, but now that I play the box a bit it would be handy. I've tried, but nothing ever comes out, not even a squeak. It's a weird sensation to feel that I *could* actually say something while playing, but there's an invisible barrier that somehow prevents the instruction from reaching the talking bits. So I make do with grunts and wonderfully expressive eyebrow movements, none of which are comprehensible to anyone.
It's all part of the fun though, and I do enjoy watching someone work up the steam (or whatever) to say something, and after various contortions and pained looks, they come out with "gringsfjdkdithook!!!". We all smile and nod and carry on with whatever we were doing, as if nothing had happened.
I actually *prefer* not being able to talk and play fiddle at the same time. I tried, and after many months of "gringsfjdkdithook!" (great word, Greg), I eventually was able to say one or two intelligible syllables--grunt out the key change, for instance, or a recognizable piece of the title for the next tune. In no time, other musicians began *expecting* this help--and more (continuous chord changes, the names of *all* the tunes in the set, alternate names (!!!) )--from me.
So it's much safer to pretend that it can't be done and everyone leaves you to your playing. Besides, after two pints no one can understand what I say even with the fiddle in its case....
Zina, you are way ahead of me if you can get the title of the next tune out! I'm like Greg - there's some kind of impassible barrier, although I've tried and tried and tried. Then there are those ones you love to hate - at Gaelic Roots this year, Bruce Molskey talked *and* sang while he was playing! He did say that it took a lot of work to get to that point. By the way, I'm not that into old-time fiddling, but he plays a mean fiddle - safe to say that he impressed the hell out of everyone.
Good point, Will. I hadn't thought of that. I did notice at the Abbey Pub session in Chicago that no one said the name of the next tune or key change. Somehow though, tunes just seemed to flow from one to the next. I figured that they were all so good and used to playing with each other that they could tell by the twinkle in the eye what the next tune would be . It wasn't like they had planned sets because after each one, they'd all be asking the persons who, apparently, caused the switch to another tune, what the tune was. Frequently, the person had a nice story to go along with the tune name (or instead of the tune name in some cases) - which was enjoyable.
well,many years ago i could talk and play at the same time without thinking until the day came when i was told that this was a really hard thing to do.
needless to say,i've never been able to do it since.
i think it is useful sometimes if you want to give a guitar player a hint of the next tune's key,for example or to say a different tune that's just come into your head instead of a standard set that everyone may be expecting.
as for lilting and playing a different tune at the same time...yes indeed,we must seek out these people,praise and honour them and then shoot them through both lungs slowly.......
Zina - Was it my slip that started this evil thread? It has taken me practice to at least warn folk about the next tune Jigs are usually easy to handle. Reels at a clip are impossible. Somtimes I can say A D or G - Somtimes I can. I usually bobble a few notes though. Tacking "Minor" "Dorian" "Seven" - FORGET IT. A minor turns into Ajmui. People accomodate me by saying WHAT? AHJIFOHS. What? AGHROWS. Basically I can't even Play and speak AT ALL at the same time. Both events crumble. I think it has to do with right brain and left brain stuff and having my jaw clamped onto the chin rest.
If someone askes me if I want a drink I cant even say 'yep', I'm one of those people who has to stop playing to even say yes or no! I was on stage the other night and I forgot what we were going into and I had to stop playing lean over to my friend playing the flute and ask her. Needless to say we got a few laughs from the audience and the backer was not very impressed!
Aargh. Did I tell you that story, Will, or did you tell it to me? I guess it was by e-mail, too, not here on the boards, or maybe it was and I'm just not putting in the right thing to find it, since you said in the last that you thought it was in a previous thread...it's terrible when the mind goes....
You should see Dirk trying to talk and play at the same time. In my mind's eye, that's exactly what the box player looks like.
I think it has alot to do with the fact that talking & playing music happen in the same part of the brain. Sometimes I've had conversations, other times I couldn't mummer out a key change. Singing is easier for me while playing, I think that comes with years of practicing playing guitar & singing at the same time. The most frustrating situation is when you call out the next tune & no one hears you & you have to do it again. It's funny - I've noticed many musicians are at least a little hard of hearing.
I has just struck me that the answer is to sing the name of the next tune or key, to the melody of the last two bars of the current tune, that way the one half of the brain can stay in sync with itself.
I must try that at the next session.....
Seriously, I've had more than one occasion when a promised drink from a well meaning member of the public (ignorent of musicians speach problems) hasn't arrived. All I could do when he/she asked "what'll you have to drink" was stare blankly for 10 seconds then bark out too loud,"A BITTER".
Leaving me having forgotten how many repeats I've played and them thinking "ungrateful b*****d".
Heh. Brad, Michael Reshetnick, who leads a session in Boulder, and I were laughing about yelling the tune name out while everyone is playing last Sunday. We had quite a few people who didn't normally attend that session there (including me) and we were trying to figure out tunes that we all knew as we went.
I'd yell, "Maid Behind the Bar?" or whatever and someone would yell, "Yes! Good!" and we'd be off. After a while I couldn't think of any more tunes, and as we were on the C of Gravel Walk on the standard fourth time through, I yelled, "Shall we do it again?!" He yelled, "What?!" I yammered, "Shall we do it again!!" He screamed, "Sure! Good! What? What did you say?" By that time we'd hit the end and half of us stopped and half of us didn't, and we squawked into a sort of ending and laughed.
Michael turned to me and said, "Have you ever noticed that when someone is yelling over the music, it all sounds like noise no matter what you say?"
Which I hadn't thought of -- I've always known it was hard to talk at the same time you play, but never realized that for some it's hard to listen to someone talk at the same time you're playing, too!
Hey jill - off the subject completly - I went to the doctor today and I have - Tennis Elbow!! How the hell does a fiddle player get Tennis Elbow??? How weird...I have to now go to physio once a week, wear a stupid looking brace and do exercises each day, what a pain. I used to set dance and had to give it up cause I got two cases of really bad shin splints - somone up there is giving me a hint to drop the irish stuff I think Ahh well sure - am I the only loser out there who has gotten tennis elbow from playing the fiddle, I mean, tendonitis is ok - even RSI or anything, but how wimpy does tennis elbow sound!
I thought only harses got splints, and tennis players tennis elbow. So you're certainly very unique! You must be some wild fiddle player. But wimpy sounding or not, its really great you did something about it and you're putting it right again. No more shinanigans with the bow McEnroe. Cheers
A neurologist once told me that most people play music with the same side of the brain that they speak with, thus making multi tasking difficult. But there are a few people who don't, these are the ones who can speak and play at the same time. I've spent ages trying to see if I could tell the difference between these two types. You would think there would be a difference, but I've never found one
Over here most tunes are played three times round. If it's not one of the hundreds of standard sets then you will find that most of the musicians will pick up after a couple of notes. The rule is that whoever starts the set gets to choose what's in it. As a flute player I'll usually indicate that I'm coming to the end of my bit by the phrasing of the last few bars and I'll hand over the set with a look at one of the others. Usually works but have had some disasters.
If it works we say 'great finish' and if not then it's a 'great norwegian'.
Yes, I'm used to three times round myself, Brendon. However, it's four times round at that session, which makes me nuts, because I'm already awful at keeping track of how many times I've gone round, and for some reason four times around makes it even worse!
We also usually leave it up to the person who started the set to go onto the next tune. However, it's fun to toss that around with chins -- *you* choose...
bb,re:tennis elbow,
I had it about 10 years ago, from some repetitive stuff I was doing at work, at the time I had 3 or 4 treatments that didn't work then one that did work.
That was sustained pressure on the sore bit for a minute then relaxing it. This done often had the effect of relaxing the "knotted up muscle" bit so much as to barely be able to lift the arm imediately after (overrelaxed, not over painful), but with a little time for the arm to recover, its been fine since, notice it only a little doing hard physical things, not fiddle or box.
Relaxing the sore bit was the key.
It's interesting you mention that, Michael, that whole sides of the brain thing. Because I dance as well as fiddle, I spend a lot of time memorizing things (all of it in groups of eight). It has always taken me longer to memorize steps then it does to memorize tunes. I wonder why that is, and whether it has something to do with sides of the brain? The dancing is physical, but in some ways so is learning a tune, but in some ways it's totally different... Might be interesting to follow up on that...
Oh, yes, I can do that for sure (at least after I've got the step firmly memorized). In fact, it's endemic among dancers that (after you get to a certain level) that we talk too much during rehearsals and practise, and then you really have to watch yourself during competitions and performance to make sure that everything (such as those hands you talk with) is in the right place.
So I rather wonder whether it matters if you learn a tune kinesthetically or truly aurally as to whether playing it is on the right or left side of the brain?
It's not just the same side of the brain; in most people, there's an overlap between the specific part of the brain that controls speech, the part that controls facial muscles, and the part of the brain that's involved in fine motor control of your fingers.
This is the source of the infamous "musician face", where so many people get very strange and silly-looking facial expressions while they're playing: the signals from the fine-motor skills neurons in the brain "bleed over" into the facial muscles. (A good example is a friend of mine who's an excellent bluegrass guitarist. When he's playing something hard, his face goes slack, his jaw hangs open, and his tongue sticks out and wiggles side-to-side.)
If you're one of the lucky people who's brains are wired a little differently, those parts don't overlap so much, and so, not only can you talk while you're playing, but you don't look like an idiot.
Fortunately, I'm a woodwind player. Because we're conscioucsly working the facial muscles in order to play, we don't get the musician face thing, and no one expects us to be able to talk while we're playing. (I
also play the banjo, and look like a complete idiot when I'm playing it.)
Thanks for explaining the weird facial expressions Mark! It makes a lot of sense. Francie McPeake III used to look like he was chewing gum when he played the pipes, God rest him. I always thought this was strange until I saw a young violin player do the same a few years ago. There's also a Dutch lady who runs a hostel in a tiny village near Miltown, can't remember her name but maybe some of you have stayed with her. When she plays her fiddle, she opens her mouth as wide as it goes and her eyes bulge slightly - it's really hard not to laugh, especially when people are copying her behind her back... Anthony McGrath, if you're out there, does this ring any bells? ;
a guy that really impresses me is the bass player who leads the pep band here..... not only can he write out a whole arrangement for the pep band from his head while a game is going on takes him as long as it does to just physically write out the notes..... he can have a detailed conversation about anything while directing the band giving cues to the drummer and laying down a fat funky slap bass line....... i know that has nothing to do with ITM but it did have a bit to do with talking while playing....... as for me maybe im wierd but as a guitar player.... and really even when i took piano i never really had a huge problem with talking while playing.... if im sight reading a classical piece i can still talk (in the classical guitar ensemble i play in i give directions to the freshman on interpretation while we are reading through a piece) if its not terribly difficult and if the piece is memorized classically speaking i can chat a bit.... not too much though..... anyone else find it easy to talk while playing
A great mandolin playing chum of mine is also great at talking whilst playing. The odd thing is that when he's not playing, he has quite a bad stammer. Amazing huh. I think there is a PHD in there somewhere for some budding brain surgeon
My dad plays melodeon (he can't help it) - hecan't talk so when he wntsto change tune or finish a set he sticks his leg out - all very sensible until he got a new, heavier melodeon. He tried to the same trick but ended up falling off the chair! - I'm not ure whether he jus couldn't balance the melodeon or whether he'd had a few too many - whichever - it was v. funny
Michael, do you mean to say that when he's playing and talking he has no stammer, but when he's not playing and talking, he does?! Now THAT is weird....
Mark and Glauber, I didn't realize that I had to be actually *playing* my banjo to look like an eejit....
Zina, apparenty you haven't heard of Mel...oh hell, what's his name? A big-time Nashville singer who stutters like crazy when he talks but the words come out smooth as butter when he sings. That's actually a not uncommon twist. Of course, like many amateur musicians, my fingers stutter all the time, and it gets worse when I play an instrument. I'd hate to think of what havoc I could wreak on sign language....
You know, somehow I missed the end of this thread. I know the name Mel Tillis, but I don't actually listen to country and western, so I didn't know about that. Huh. So if it's all that common, they must know something about it, all this singing with no stuttering vs. talking and stuttering thing...I wonder what practical applications you can get out of that sort of knowledge? If someone stutters, if you teach them to sing everything they say, do they stop stuttering?
I wonder, could somebody who is ambidextrous learn to write two different sentences simultaneously, one with each hand? Is there anyone who can already do it? Surely, if an organist can play a Bach fugue - essentially 4 different melodies at once - then it must be possible. Imagine the time it would save - you could start at the top with your right hand, at the bottom with your left, and meet in the middle.
Talking while you're playing
Talking while you're playing
Okay, so maybe there's only a few times when you need to talk while playing, but sometimes it IS good to be able to do it. So, how many of us have a tough time talking and playing at the same time?
I can manage getting the title of the next tune out, and maybe a key change or two, but not much more than that -- if it's a complex sentence, I might have to stop playing, or risk screwing up the tune, unless I know the tune very well indeed.
Somebody, I can't remember who, told me this story of a bunch of fine musicians playing live on RTE. They'd agreed beforehand on the set they were going to play. They began the set, and a mighty one it is. As they approached the turn of the second tune, the fiddler realized he'd forgotten what the third tune they'd agreed on was.
So he leans, still fiddling, over to the box player, working away, and murmurs, "what's next?" The box player gazes desperately at him, pumping and sweating, struggling manfully to get the words out, all through the last B, eyes slowly starting to burst out of their sockets, his face getting redder and redder from his efforts. Finally, he manages to burst out with a loud "Feck off!" (on live radio!), and they were off into the third tune.
Zina
# Posted on September 12th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Talking while you're playing
Very tough ...
of course, I play the flute... however:
I give a little nod with my head if I have another tune in mind, otherwise I stick out my tongue if I want someone else to pick up the set, and of course, I wink at everyone if it is the last tune. 8-D
Kidding.
Really, this is a problem, but not one easily overcome.
--Eliot
# Posted on September 12th 2002 by Eliot
Re: Talking while you're playing
In the session i go to, the leader just says "hup!" and starts playing the next tune. Somehow, people follow. Sometimes it's because we play the same sets all the time, sometimes people will listen for a couple of bars and jump in.
# Posted on September 12th 2002 by glauber
Re: Talking while you're playing
Over on IRTRAD-L there was a long discussion about this a couple of years ago, complete with suggestions for how to practice to do it. My favorite story was from someone who had played with a Dublin piper who was known for leaning over while playing a tune and saying, "D'ye know this one?" and then lilting another tune at the same time...
Can't do it myself -- it never struck me as a useful skill for a fluteplayer to learn, but now that I play the box a bit it would be handy. I've tried, but nothing ever comes out, not even a squeak. It's a weird sensation to feel that I *could* actually say something while playing, but there's an invisible barrier that somehow prevents the instruction from reaching the talking bits. So I make do with grunts and wonderfully expressive eyebrow movements, none of which are comprehensible to anyone.
It's all part of the fun though, and I do enjoy watching someone work up the steam (or whatever) to say something, and after various contortions and pained looks, they come out with "gringsfjdkdithook!!!". We all smile and nod and carry on with whatever we were doing, as if nothing had happened.
Greg
# Posted on September 12th 2002 by Gzeg
Re: Talking while you're playing
Heh, Zina, go to http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display.php/229 for the RTE story. You re-told it better here
I actually *prefer* not being able to talk and play fiddle at the same time. I tried, and after many months of "gringsfjdkdithook!" (great word, Greg), I eventually was able to say one or two intelligible syllables--grunt out the key change, for instance, or a recognizable piece of the title for the next tune. In no time, other musicians began *expecting* this help--and more (continuous chord changes, the names of *all* the tunes in the set, alternate names (!!!) )--from me.
So it's much safer to pretend that it can't be done and everyone leaves you to your playing. Besides, after two pints no one can understand what I say even with the fiddle in its case....
# Posted on September 12th 2002 by Will Harmon
Re: Talking while you're playing
Zina, you are way ahead of me if you can get the title of the next tune out! I'm like Greg - there's some kind of impassible barrier, although I've tried and tried and tried. Then there are those ones you love to hate - at Gaelic Roots this year, Bruce Molskey talked *and* sang while he was playing! He did say that it took a lot of work to get to that point. By the way, I'm not that into old-time fiddling, but he plays a mean fiddle - safe to say that he impressed the hell out of everyone.
# Posted on September 12th 2002 by chicagofiddler
Re: Talking while you're playing
Good point, Will. I hadn't thought of that. I did notice at the Abbey Pub session in Chicago that no one said the name of the next tune or key change. Somehow though, tunes just seemed to flow from one to the next. I figured that they were all so good and used to playing with each other that they could tell by the twinkle in the eye what the next tune would be
. It wasn't like they had planned sets because after each one, they'd all be asking the persons who, apparently, caused the switch to another tune, what the tune was. Frequently, the person had a nice story to go along with the tune name (or instead of the tune name in some cases) - which was enjoyable.
# Posted on September 12th 2002 by chicagofiddler
Naming the un-namable...
well,many years ago i could talk and play at the same time without thinking until the day came when i was told that this was a really hard thing to do.
needless to say,i've never been able to do it since.
i think it is useful sometimes if you want to give a guitar player a hint of the next tune's key,for example or to say a different tune that's just come into your head instead of a standard set that everyone may be expecting.
as for lilting and playing a different tune at the same time...yes indeed,we must seek out these people,praise and honour them and then shoot them through both lungs slowly.......
# Posted on September 12th 2002 by Götz von Berlichingen, III. Akt, Szene 17
Re: Talking while you're playing
Zina - Was it my slip that started this evil thread? It has taken me practice to at least warn folk about the next tune Jigs are usually easy to handle. Reels at a clip are impossible. Somtimes I can say A D or G - Somtimes I can. I usually bobble a few notes though. Tacking "Minor" "Dorian" "Seven" - FORGET IT. A minor turns into Ajmui. People accomodate me by saying WHAT? AHJIFOHS. What? AGHROWS. Basically I can't even Play and speak AT ALL at the same time. Both events crumble. I think it has to do with right brain and left brain stuff and having my jaw clamped onto the chin rest.
# Posted on September 13th 2002 by Mark Cordova
Re: Talking while you're playing
If someone askes me if I want a drink I cant even say 'yep', I'm one of those people who has to stop playing to even say yes or no! I was on stage the other night and I forgot what we were going into and I had to stop playing lean over to my friend playing the flute and ask her. Needless to say we got a few laughs from the audience and the backer was not very impressed!
# Posted on September 13th 2002 by bb
Re: Talking while you're playing
Does grinning like a Cheshire Cat count?
How's your arm going bb? (Don't mind if you don't answer till you've finished the set).
# Posted on September 13th 2002 by Jill
Re: Talking while you're playing
Aargh. Did I tell you that story, Will, or did you tell it to me? I guess it was by e-mail, too, not here on the boards, or maybe it was and I'm just not putting in the right thing to find it, since you said in the last that you thought it was in a previous thread...it's terrible when the mind goes....
You should see Dirk trying to talk and play at the same time. In my mind's eye, that's exactly what the box player looks like.
Zina
# Posted on September 13th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Talking while you're playing
I think it has alot to do with the fact that talking & playing music happen in the same part of the brain. Sometimes I've had conversations, other times I couldn't mummer out a key change. Singing is easier for me while playing, I think that comes with years of practicing playing guitar & singing at the same time. The most frustrating situation is when you call out the next tune & no one hears you & you have to do it again. It's funny - I've noticed many musicians are at least a little hard of hearing.
# Posted on September 13th 2002 by B Rad
Re: Talking while you're playing
I has just struck me that the answer is to sing the name of the next tune or key, to the melody of the last two bars of the current tune, that way the one half of the brain can stay in sync with itself.
I must try that at the next session.....
Seriously, I've had more than one occasion when a promised drink from a well meaning member of the public (ignorent of musicians speach problems) hasn't arrived. All I could do when he/she asked "what'll you have to drink" was stare blankly for 10 seconds then bark out too loud,"A BITTER".
Leaving me having forgotten how many repeats I've played and them thinking "ungrateful b*****d".
# Posted on September 13th 2002 by Kenn
Re: Talking while you're playing
Heh. Brad, Michael Reshetnick, who leads a session in Boulder, and I were laughing about yelling the tune name out while everyone is playing last Sunday. We had quite a few people who didn't normally attend that session there (including me) and we were trying to figure out tunes that we all knew as we went.
I'd yell, "Maid Behind the Bar?" or whatever and someone would yell, "Yes! Good!" and we'd be off. After a while I couldn't think of any more tunes, and as we were on the C of Gravel Walk on the standard fourth time through, I yelled, "Shall we do it again?!" He yelled, "What?!" I yammered, "Shall we do it again!!" He screamed, "Sure! Good! What? What did you say?" By that time we'd hit the end and half of us stopped and half of us didn't, and we squawked into a sort of ending and laughed.
Michael turned to me and said, "Have you ever noticed that when someone is yelling over the music, it all sounds like noise no matter what you say?"
Which I hadn't thought of -- I've always known it was hard to talk at the same time you play, but never realized that for some it's hard to listen to someone talk at the same time you're playing, too!
Zina
# Posted on September 13th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Talking while you're playing
Hey jill - off the subject completly - I went to the doctor today and I have - Tennis Elbow!! How the hell does a fiddle player get Tennis Elbow??? How weird...I have to now go to physio once a week, wear a stupid looking brace and do exercises each day, what a pain. I used to set dance and had to give it up cause I got two cases of really bad shin splints - somone up there is giving me a hint to drop the irish stuff I think
Ahh well sure - am I the only loser out there who has gotten tennis elbow from playing the fiddle, I mean, tendonitis is ok - even RSI or anything, but how wimpy does tennis elbow sound!
# Posted on September 13th 2002 by bb
Re: Talking while you're playing
I thought only harses got splints, and tennis players tennis elbow. So you're certainly very unique! You must be some wild fiddle player. But wimpy sounding or not, its really great you did something about it and you're putting it right again. No more shinanigans with the bow McEnroe. Cheers
# Posted on September 13th 2002 by Jill
Re: Talking while you're playing
A neurologist once told me that most people play music with the same side of the brain that they speak with, thus making multi tasking difficult. But there are a few people who don't, these are the ones who can speak and play at the same time. I've spent ages trying to see if I could tell the difference between these two types. You would think there would be a difference, but I've never found one
# Posted on September 13th 2002 by ...
Re: Talking while you're playing
bb what a pain (no pun)
but i hope you get it sorted and can continue in your passion (for music)
# Posted on September 13th 2002 by donnchad
Re: Talking while you're playing
Over here most tunes are played three times round. If it's not one of the hundreds of standard sets then you will find that most of the musicians will pick up after a couple of notes. The rule is that whoever starts the set gets to choose what's in it. As a flute player I'll usually indicate that I'm coming to the end of my bit by the phrasing of the last few bars and I'll hand over the set with a look at one of the others. Usually works but have had some disasters.
If it works we say 'great finish' and if not then it's a 'great norwegian'.
# Posted on September 13th 2002 by breandan
Re: Talking while you're playing
Yes, I'm used to three times round myself, Brendon. However, it's four times round at that session, which makes me nuts, because I'm already awful at keeping track of how many times I've gone round, and for some reason four times around makes it even worse!
We also usually leave it up to the person who started the set to go onto the next tune. However, it's fun to toss that around with chins -- *you* choose...
Zina
# Posted on September 13th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Talking while you're playing
bb,re:tennis elbow,
I had it about 10 years ago, from some repetitive stuff I was doing at work, at the time I had 3 or 4 treatments that didn't work then one that did work.
That was sustained pressure on the sore bit for a minute then relaxing it. This done often had the effect of relaxing the "knotted up muscle" bit so much as to barely be able to lift the arm imediately after (overrelaxed, not over painful), but with a little time for the arm to recover, its been fine since, notice it only a little doing hard physical things, not fiddle or box.
Relaxing the sore bit was the key.
# Posted on September 13th 2002 by Kenn
Re: Talking while you're playing
It's interesting you mention that, Michael, that whole sides of the brain thing. Because I dance as well as fiddle, I spend a lot of time memorizing things (all of it in groups of eight). It has always taken me longer to memorize steps then it does to memorize tunes. I wonder why that is, and whether it has something to do with sides of the brain? The dancing is physical, but in some ways so is learning a tune, but in some ways it's totally different... Might be interesting to follow up on that...
Zina
# Posted on September 13th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Talking while you're playing
Zina, I bet you can dance and talk at the same time. Try it
# Posted on September 13th 2002 by ...
Re: Talking while you're playing
Oh, yes, I can do that for sure (at least after I've got the step firmly memorized). In fact, it's endemic among dancers that (after you get to a certain level) that we talk too much during rehearsals and practise, and then you really have to watch yourself during competitions and performance to make sure that everything (such as those hands you talk with) is in the right place.
So I rather wonder whether it matters if you learn a tune kinesthetically or truly aurally as to whether playing it is on the right or left side of the brain?
Zina
# Posted on September 13th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Talking while you're playing
It's not just the same side of the brain; in most people, there's an overlap between the specific part of the brain that controls speech, the part that controls facial muscles, and the part of the brain that's involved in fine motor control of your fingers.
This is the source of the infamous "musician face", where so many people get very strange and silly-looking facial expressions while they're playing: the signals from the fine-motor skills neurons in the brain "bleed over" into the facial muscles. (A good example is a friend of mine who's an excellent bluegrass guitarist. When he's playing something hard, his face goes slack, his jaw hangs open, and his tongue sticks out and wiggles side-to-side.)
If you're one of the lucky people who's brains are wired a little differently, those parts don't overlap so much, and so, not only can you talk while you're playing, but you don't look like an idiot.
Fortunately, I'm a woodwind player. Because we're conscioucsly working the facial muscles in order to play, we don't get the musician face thing, and no one expects us to be able to talk while we're playing. (I
also play the banjo, and look like a complete idiot when I'm playing it.)
-Mark
# Posted on September 14th 2002 by MarkCC
Re: Talking while you're playing
Mark, everybody does...
Sorry, couldn't resist.
# Posted on September 14th 2002 by glauber
Re: Talking while you're playing
Thanks for explaining the weird facial expressions Mark! It makes a lot of sense. Francie McPeake III used to look like he was chewing gum when he played the pipes, God rest him. I always thought this was strange until I saw a young violin player do the same a few years ago. There's also a Dutch lady who runs a hostel in a tiny village near Miltown, can't remember her name but maybe some of you have stayed with her. When she plays her fiddle, she opens her mouth as wide as it goes and her eyes bulge slightly - it's really hard not to laugh, especially when people are copying her behind her back... Anthony McGrath, if you're out there, does this ring any bells? ;
# Posted on September 15th 2002 by Conán McDonnell
Re: Talking while you're playing
a guy that really impresses me is the bass player who leads the pep band here..... not only can he write out a whole arrangement for the pep band from his head while a game is going on takes him as long as it does to just physically write out the notes..... he can have a detailed conversation about anything while directing the band giving cues to the drummer and laying down a fat funky slap bass line....... i know that has nothing to do with ITM but it did have a bit to do with talking while playing....... as for me maybe im wierd but as a guitar player.... and really even when i took piano i never really had a huge problem with talking while playing.... if im sight reading a classical piece i can still talk (in the classical guitar ensemble i play in i give directions to the freshman on interpretation while we are reading through a piece) if its not terribly difficult and if the piece is memorized classically speaking i can chat a bit.... not too much though..... anyone else find it easy to talk while playing
# Posted on September 15th 2002 by Opherman47
Re: Talking while you're playing
Oh, if I'm reading a piece of music, no sweat. I can talk almost all you like. I never thought of that, that's kind of weird...
zls
# Posted on September 15th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Talking while you're playing
that is wierd isnt it that reading is a bit differnt
# Posted on September 15th 2002 by Opherman47
Re: Talking while you're playing
A great mandolin playing chum of mine is also great at talking whilst playing. The odd thing is that when he's not playing, he has quite a bad stammer. Amazing huh. I think there is a PHD in there somewhere for some budding brain surgeon
# Posted on September 16th 2002 by ...
Re: Talking while you're playing
My dad plays melodeon (he can't help it) - hecan't talk so when he wntsto change tune or finish a set he sticks his leg out - all very sensible until he got a new, heavier melodeon. He tried to the same trick but ended up falling off the chair! - I'm not ure whether he jus couldn't balance the melodeon or whether he'd had a few too many - whichever - it was v. funny
# Posted on September 16th 2002 by Nutty Nessie
Re: Talking while you're playing
Michael, do you mean to say that when he's playing and talking he has no stammer, but when he's not playing and talking, he does?! Now THAT is weird....
Zina
# Posted on September 16th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Talking while you're playing
Thats correct, when he plays, he has no stammer. And when he's not playing, he stammers. Amazing huh
# Posted on September 17th 2002 by ...
Re: Talking while you're playing
Yes, it really is, Michael...wow. What does he think about it?
# Posted on September 17th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Talking while you're playing
Mark and Glauber, I didn't realize that I had to be actually *playing* my banjo to look like an eejit....
Zina, apparenty you haven't heard of Mel...oh hell, what's his name? A big-time Nashville singer who stutters like crazy when he talks but the words come out smooth as butter when he sings. That's actually a not uncommon twist. Of course, like many amateur musicians, my fingers stutter all the time, and it gets worse when I play an instrument. I'd hate to think of what havoc I could wreak on sign language....
# Posted on September 17th 2002 by Will Harmon
Re: Talking while you're playing
It's 2:17 AM, so. . .
MEL TILLIS
Whew! It's a good thing I didn't have any phone numbers to call someone with -
CJ
# Posted on September 17th 2002 by cj
Re: Talking while you're playing
You know, somehow I missed the end of this thread. I know the name Mel Tillis, but I don't actually listen to country and western, so I didn't know about that. Huh. So if it's all that common, they must know something about it, all this singing with no stuttering vs. talking and stuttering thing...I wonder what practical applications you can get out of that sort of knowledge? If someone stutters, if you teach them to sing everything they say, do they stop stuttering?
# Posted on September 25th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Talking while you're playing
I wonder, could somebody who is ambidextrous learn to write two different sentences simultaneously, one with each hand? Is there anyone who can already do it? Surely, if an organist can play a Bach fugue - essentially 4 different melodies at once - then it must be possible. Imagine the time it would save - you could start at the top with your right hand, at the bottom with your left, and meet in the middle.
# Posted on September 30th 2002 by CreadurMawnOrganig
Re: Talking while you're playing
suolucidir si shit
# Posted on December 24th 2002 by Bryan