I’ve heard MG knock him for various reasons – and although the reasons all seem good
ie. plays on the beat in a boom chuck way – I’ve never actually heard that from Arty.
So maybe I’m listening to the wrong albums.
The album with Paddy Keenan I think is a excellent example of great backing.
Also his tune playing is great.
But I’m open to contrasting opinions – not for the sake of knocking, but for the sake of finding out more
about accompaniment.
I like Arty McGlynn's style too. It seems very tasteful, at least what I've heard of it, and very well done. If a certain guitar player I know would take a leaf from his book, our session would be a better accompanied place!
His backing is absolutely perfect. Brilliantly rythmic. The sound just flows from the guitar. He understands perfectly the harmonies. The way that he will often back the first four/six bars with one chord and then play the complex end cadence perfectly. He is a consummate musician who, rarely among accompanisits, I have to say, understands that it about the overall sound. Guitar heroes, who lead the music, and I have nothing against them, belong in rock music
I'm not actually that mad about his tune playing, brilliant though it is. But then i think that there is no point playing tunes on the guitar. It doesn't sound right.
But as I say his backing is superb. 'Lead the Knave', Stony Steps and arguably the best trad recording ever 'Contentment is wealth' show backing at its absolute best
Incredible player. I was blown away by his first traditional LP "Arty McGlynn" (now renamed something celticky.) Amazing thing for someone to produce after years on the road with a showband. The Swedish Jig and the Star of Munster were the highlights among some great tunes.
I really enjoyed Lead the Knave as well, even the telecaster stuff. His contribution to the early Patrick Street was superb. Lovely jig on the Live at Matt Molly's album.
I first heard AM at a Patrick Street gig maybe twelve years ago. He played one tune, which might've been played well. I don't know because I was so distracted by the horrible pickup sound - the worst I've ever heard. I don't remember anything about the backup work, except that it sounded a bit muddy. Andy Irvine used a mic and sounded great.
I didn't hear him again until last year, when I finally bought McGlynn's Fancy, the highly acclaimed album. I've listened to it a lot and learned The Floating Crowbar from it. The playing is masterful, but for something hailed as being the first guitar recording solidly in the Irish tradition, it's sort of American sounding to me, particularly the swing rhythm on the reels. Not to imply that that isn't a valid expression of the music. It's just his influences coming through.
My wife thinks some of the backing on that album sounds American. I hadn't thought of it that way. I just thought it was cool, if not dead-center traditional. I admire the tune selection, too.
Arty McGlynn's has his own distinctive style of accompaniment and you may or may not like the style but he does do it very well. I do not feel he ever tries to overpower the melody on any recordings I have heard and his flatpicking blends in beautifully with the fiddle.
I think what he does is generally deceptively simple which is usualy the sign of genius - You only find out how hard it is when you try to emulate.
Having said all that I would not choose to emulate him anyway - too many other influences that I have taken a bit from, here and there.
The thing about arty is he doesn't really play with people. He's like this perfect machine that tune players use as a kind of crutch, almost a drum machine. When ever I hear his playing I imagine him in the studio doing his bit one day and then someone coming in and playing the tune the next day. He gets this amazingly perfect wall of strummyness that is so comfortable. There is no challenge. He has no edges. Everything is smooth and neat and orderly and perfect. He really is the ultimate session musician. (And I mean a faceless hired hand, not someone who plays down the boozer).
Now you may like this cozyness and that's fine. Me? I want interaction
But Dow, I am saying it's the melody players' fault. It is their fault for wanting/needing/enjoying a crutch.
If "getting it right" is to be so perfect as to like a machine then fair play. This thread isn't about saying arty is no good, he's bloody brilliant. It's just that I hate it.
Good point Beg. This is something I've been on about for a while now. All the rythmn you need is in the tune itself, it shouldn't need re-enforcing. The job of the strummer should be to add to the music, not to duplicate what is already there. And this, of course, is why bodhran playing is dumb.
I know you won’t agree with me, but I would say “can be dumb” rather than “is dumb”
I think I understand what you’re saying re Arty McGlynn and the connection with Bodhran playing.
Not sure I fully agree though (still processing it) as I saw dumb old Donal Lunny playing Bodran recently and it made me think twice.
What is this site coming to? I started reading a previous posting, but had to turn away before it ended for fear of it getting even more pornographic - "I think the "crutch" thing is interesting though - I often feel tied down......." - see what I mean?
Come on chaps, let's not lower the standards any more?
Arty does play down the boozer from tme to time.
So,John Coltrane used to need McCoy Tyner and Elvin Jones as a crutch? Rhythm section has an awful lot to do with how melody players react and is something that has been in development within Irish music properly since the 60's.
McGlynn has spearheaded an entire generation of rhythm players,and even though there's alot of them,there are few who can even match him at this stage.
OK,bad backing can destroy a session,and sometimes good backing can destroy a session too, depending on the players,wether they are used to reacting to it not,or if it's just wallpaper. I'd certainly be picky when it comes to hiring a guitarist or bouzouki for a gig.
As a melody player and guitarist,I love playing with backers that have the ability to react to you,can keep time and know their harmony properly,and are asthetically astute.
I know only a handfull who can do this and ,McGlynn is certainly one,dispite what your tastes may be,he is a terrible musician
P. Browne,
I have seen many a disagreement on this site, but the last two posts are the first time I remember seeing someone instantaneously disagree with himself!
Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
This came from here : http://www.thesession.org/discussions/display.php/7743/comments#comment166380
I’ve heard MG knock him for various reasons – and although the reasons all seem good
ie. plays on the beat in a boom chuck way – I’ve never actually heard that from Arty.
So maybe I’m listening to the wrong albums.
The album with Paddy Keenan I think is a excellent example of great backing.
Also his tune playing is great.
But I’m open to contrasting opinions – not for the sake of knocking, but for the sake of finding out more
about accompaniment.
# Posted on September 15th 2005 by BegF
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
…………………..<THUMBLEWEED>…………………….
……somewhere in the distance a dog barked…..
# Posted on September 15th 2005 by BegF
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
Well I don’t care.
I’m going to stick around this room for a while.
Peace and quiet. Get away from it all.
# Posted on September 15th 2005 by BegF
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
BegF,
Just so you don't feel lonely, I like what Mr. McGlynn does!
# Posted on September 15th 2005 by AlBrown
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
Knock knock...So do I like McGlynn. And I've got a kerry-oot.
# Posted on September 15th 2005 by Rudall the time
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
I like Arty McGlynn's style too. It seems very tasteful, at least what I've heard of it, and very well done. If a certain guitar player I know would take a leaf from his book, our session would be a better accompanied place!
# Posted on September 15th 2005 by seisflutes
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
Well I'm saying something - McGlynn is a masterful melody and back-up player. Awright?
# Posted on September 15th 2005 by Cammy
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
To coin a phrase 'Arty McGlynn is God'.
His backing is absolutely perfect. Brilliantly rythmic. The sound just flows from the guitar. He understands perfectly the harmonies. The way that he will often back the first four/six bars with one chord and then play the complex end cadence perfectly. He is a consummate musician who, rarely among accompanisits, I have to say, understands that it about the overall sound. Guitar heroes, who lead the music, and I have nothing against them, belong in rock music
I'm not actually that mad about his tune playing, brilliant though it is. But then i think that there is no point playing tunes on the guitar. It doesn't sound right.
But as I say his backing is superb. 'Lead the Knave', Stony Steps and arguably the best trad recording ever 'Contentment is wealth' show backing at its absolute best
# Posted on September 15th 2005 by Pól
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
Incredible player. I was blown away by his first traditional LP "Arty McGlynn" (now renamed something celticky.) Amazing thing for someone to produce after years on the road with a showband. The Swedish Jig and the Star of Munster were the highlights among some great tunes.
I really enjoyed Lead the Knave as well, even the telecaster stuff. His contribution to the early Patrick Street was superb. Lovely jig on the Live at Matt Molly's album.
# Posted on September 15th 2005 by grego
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
I first heard AM at a Patrick Street gig maybe twelve years ago. He played one tune, which might've been played well. I don't know because I was so distracted by the horrible pickup sound - the worst I've ever heard. I don't remember anything about the backup work, except that it sounded a bit muddy. Andy Irvine used a mic and sounded great.
I didn't hear him again until last year, when I finally bought McGlynn's Fancy, the highly acclaimed album. I've listened to it a lot and learned The Floating Crowbar from it. The playing is masterful, but for something hailed as being the first guitar recording solidly in the Irish tradition, it's sort of American sounding to me, particularly the swing rhythm on the reels. Not to imply that that isn't a valid expression of the music. It's just his influences coming through.
My wife thinks some of the backing on that album sounds American. I hadn't thought of it that way. I just thought it was cool, if not dead-center traditional. I admire the tune selection, too.
# Posted on September 15th 2005 by Bob himself
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
I'll say it then -- nothin... there. What's it mean anyway?
# Posted on September 16th 2005 by Phantom Button
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
Hey, you never bummed a smoke from me Jim!
# Posted on September 16th 2005 by Ptarmigan
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
Arty McGlynn's has his own distinctive style of accompaniment and you may or may not like the style but he does do it very well. I do not feel he ever tries to overpower the melody on any recordings I have heard and his flatpicking blends in beautifully with the fiddle.
I think what he does is generally deceptively simple which is usualy the sign of genius - You only find out how hard it is when you try to emulate.
Having said all that I would not choose to emulate him anyway - too many other influences that I have taken a bit from, here and there.
# Posted on September 16th 2005 by Donough
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
What about his dry sense of humour??
# Posted on September 16th 2005 by Donough
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
"What about his dry sense of humour??"
There is that.
# Posted on September 16th 2005 by BegF
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
The thing about arty is he doesn't really play with people. He's like this perfect machine that tune players use as a kind of crutch, almost a drum machine. When ever I hear his playing I imagine him in the studio doing his bit one day and then someone coming in and playing the tune the next day. He gets this amazingly perfect wall of strummyness that is so comfortable. There is no challenge. He has no edges. Everything is smooth and neat and orderly and perfect. He really is the ultimate session musician. (And I mean a faceless hired hand, not someone who plays down the boozer).
Now you may like this cozyness and that's fine. Me? I want interaction
# Posted on September 16th 2005 by llig leahcim
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
Me? I want inter-coorse...
# Posted on September 16th 2005 by Ptarmigan
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
Wwhat? you're into the Cors?
# Posted on September 16th 2005 by llig leahcim
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
"He's like this perfect machine that tune players use as a kind of crutch, almost a drum machine"
Yeah a backer gets it just right and all of a sudden it's his fault, not the melody players who are playing with him. Wot?!
# Posted on September 16th 2005 by Dr. Dow
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
But Dow, I am saying it's the melody players' fault. It is their fault for wanting/needing/enjoying a crutch.
If "getting it right" is to be so perfect as to like a machine then fair play. This thread isn't about saying arty is no good, he's bloody brilliant. It's just that I hate it.
# Posted on September 16th 2005 by llig leahcim
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
LOL, fair enough - can't argue with that!
# Posted on September 16th 2005 by Dr. Dow
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
BIG yawn.... I'm with Clint Eastwood on this one....
# Posted on September 16th 2005 by Cammy
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
Bit of a relief all the same that we don’t have to be as good as Arty.
I think the “crutch” thing is interesting though - I often feel tied down by being expected to “provide” the rhythm or re-enforce it.
# Posted on September 16th 2005 by BegF
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
Good point Beg. This is something I've been on about for a while now. All the rythmn you need is in the tune itself, it shouldn't need re-enforcing. The job of the strummer should be to add to the music, not to duplicate what is already there. And this, of course, is why bodhran playing is dumb.
# Posted on September 16th 2005 by llig leahcim
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
I know you won’t agree with me, but I would say “can be dumb” rather than “is dumb”
I think I understand what you’re saying re Arty McGlynn and the connection with Bodhran playing.
Not sure I fully agree though (still processing it) as I saw dumb old Donal Lunny playing Bodran recently and it made me think twice.
# Posted on September 16th 2005 by BegF
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
What is this site coming to? I started reading a previous posting, but had to turn away before it ended for fear of it getting even more pornographic - "I think the "crutch" thing is interesting though - I often feel tied down......." - see what I mean?
Come on chaps, let's not lower the standards any more?
# Posted on September 16th 2005 by Ptarmigan
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
Arty does play down the boozer from tme to time.
So,John Coltrane used to need McCoy Tyner and Elvin Jones as a crutch? Rhythm section has an awful lot to do with how melody players react and is something that has been in development within Irish music properly since the 60's.
McGlynn has spearheaded an entire generation of rhythm players,and even though there's alot of them,there are few who can even match him at this stage.
OK,bad backing can destroy a session,and sometimes good backing can destroy a session too, depending on the players,wether they are used to reacting to it not,or if it's just wallpaper. I'd certainly be picky when it comes to hiring a guitarist or bouzouki for a gig.
As a melody player and guitarist,I love playing with backers that have the ability to react to you,can keep time and know their harmony properly,and are asthetically astute.
I know only a handfull who can do this and ,McGlynn is certainly one,dispite what your tastes may be,he is a terrible musician
# Posted on September 17th 2005 by P.browne
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
I retract my last statement,I was getting bored with my rant
# Posted on September 17th 2005 by P.browne
Re: Arty McGlynn – Accompaniment style
P. Browne,
I have seen many a disagreement on this site, but the last two posts are the first time I remember seeing someone instantaneously disagree with himself!
# Posted on September 17th 2005 by AlBrown