Does anyone know what models of guitars does some of the most famous players (Arty McGlynn,John Doyle,Ed Boyd,.....) use?I think Arty and John play Takamine, but what model?Thanks.
Rafix
John Doyle plays a mahogany-body Lowden (http://www.lowdenguitars.com) dreadnought D-10 and a Martin D-28. The Lowden was built as a lefty, while the Martin is an off-the-rack right-handed model with the nut and saddle switched for left-handed playing. This info I got at http://www.acguitar.com/issues/ag108/gear108.html#6
I don't know for sure, but I doubt Arty Mcglynn plays a Takamine. I recently heard a guitar player from a top band say on stage "Don't ever buy a Takemine, they don't stay in tune for a minute!"
It would appear from photos and from what I have heard that Arty McGlynn does play a Takamine. That does not mean that they are any good however. It just means that he is even better than you might have previously thought. I believe he just likes his guitar and Takamine were certainly a popular brand for a while and for a reason. But please don't buy one justbecause McGlynn plays one - they really are pap!!
Alistair, I haven't played a takamine yet, would you recommend me to buy one? Are good guitars or everything depends on what a player is looking for?:Sorry because my bad English.Bye
Lowden are fantastic guitars for a very high price and long waiting period. For a similar sound / feel, I like Taylors. Excellent quality, but not cheap. Takamines can be had cheap, probably why people play them at all. Under no circumstances should anyone be forced to play a Yamaha except financial ones...
What sort of guitar you want is very subjective. What some people like, others don't. Try various ones out first. It might also depend on your budget.
However, NO. In my last post I was NOT saying that Takamines were good. I was saying they were bad. Pap = bad!!. Try them though. Some people like them. I have a Taylor and love it. I have played other Taylors though that I did not like. In fact when I bought my guitar there were two identical guitars in the shop - identical except in sound - they were the same model but the other one just did not compare.
When I was originally shopping for a good guitar I was looking for a Lowden. They proved impossible to find however (look at George Lowden's site for details).
Really all I can suggest is shop around. Find what you are happy with and that will be best.
A bit like this place, rule no.1 is "be nice". Rule no.2 is "brand bashing is not tolerated". The forum is very tolerant of people asking for advice in buying new guitars - most posters there seem to feel that the answer, "go read the archives" isn't necessarily in keeping with the spirit of a discussion forum. So, you can have reasoned discussions of the strengths and weaknesses of various guitars and tonewoods and their suitablility or otherwise for different kinds of playing without the mindless pro- and anti-[insert brand/maker here] drivel and flaming that goes on at some other guitar forums.
When I started playing I looked around and found a bunch of prominent players using small-bodied guitars, so I started looking at those. I settled on a Santa Cruz OM PW. I chose to use the OM ("orchestra model") size introduced by the Martin Co. in the early '30's, and the Santa Cruz OM PW was, at that time, the least expensive expression of that design.
The Lowden S and F models, Santa Cruz H models and Webber Roundbody models all fit in this category.
Dreadnought-shaped guitars are still the most popular. Daithi Sproul played a Bourgeois dread here and I've seen John Doyle playing a dread'.
Tell you what guitar to choose...? i'd just as soon tell you who to marry. Nope.
I like small-bodied guitars, and tho I have others besides my Santa Cruz OM PW, I keep coming back to that one. It's my main guitar and it's pretty difficult to knock it off the pedestal. I also have a Lowden 032 and a Greven custom made for me in 1977, but they do studio functions and not ITM. (So many guitars, so little time... <GG>)
Play as many as you can, use what makes you happy.
This is the usual minefield then.
Lowden = good
Avalon [cheap] = ok - but watch the necks
Taylor = rotten for traditional music, ok for C&W.
Yamaha can be fine guitars, better than Taylor, just pick a solid top one
Takamine - I played a good one last week - it cost £300..
Arty always plays taks but that has more to do with the pick up than the accustic quality. They just don't work in a session. Some of their new guitars aren't too bad though. Lowden or Martin are the job. Played a Taylor last week. Not impressed!
I'd recommend a Norman guitar. I bought one 4 years ago, and it's the best I ever had. I think the price was around 1300 euro (including a fishman pick-up), but i suspect its a bit cheaper now.....
I play a Martin 000M and it is very nice, although it is VERY sensitive to humidity, must keep a humidifier in the case and moisten it regularly. My brother, who runs a music shop here in New England says that the new low-end Taylor guitars are the best guitar for the money these days, and if you can afford it, the high end are the best. I do have the old Yamaha I learned on (purchased in 1976), which is sturdy as a tank, the problem is, it has the acoustical properties of a tank as well--but it is an old friend, so I still play it on occasion.
Christy Moore is now playing a Martin OM guitar (I think it's an OM42 with some added bits).
He used to play a takamine but there is a ?true? story that he used carpet tape to cover the name on the head after they rebuffed his request for some support from them.
The OM size guitars are well balanced and in my opinion are well worth looking at.
All of this being said a lot of the sound is down to the player not the instrument so an expensive instrument won't make you sound good without your help.
Denis Cahill has at least one Running Dog guitar (from Vermont: www.vtguitars.com) which he used on the live CD with Martin Hayes. Apparently, Arty McGlynn tried Denis's and then ordered an identical one for himself.
There's quite a story about the Lowden/Avalon affair, but to make it short... Lowden expanded to do more 'accessible' guitars and the company became Avalon. Then there were problems with George Lowden and the Avalon Co., so there was an acrimonious period and then a corporate split.
Today, Avalon, tho they use the Lowden name whenever they wish, have no real relation to George Lowden, musically nor in business, and George has a new shop where he makes his wonderful instruments. The new Lowden shop is growing, with more workers and more models.
I have played some Avalons and they are real nice for low $, but since I had some of the details of the business tangle, I'm not real interested in buying any of them. I do have a nice Lowden tho, and I'd like to have some others (probably just one at a time, tho... <GGG>) I'd also like to play a Collings OM or a David Webber RoundBody.
Thanks, Ian, for the location of Running Dog! I had heard about them, but never had a way to find them.
Ged Foley played Sobells for a long time and now plays a nice, black Santa Cruz H model. Randal Bays plays a Martin J-model, and I think that's what I saw Paul DeGrae play, too. Pat Egan plays a Santa Cruz OM. Zan McLeod plays a late-50's Martin D-18 and he also has a lovely Collings. In the Planxty reunion DVD, Christy Moore was playing a Martin-style dreadnaught ....
lowdens ar legend but as mentioned they are expensive and have a long waiting list.
takamines,lowdens,martins,flyde,taylor are fairly top class guitars if you get a good one.
i love the nylonstring cutaway that jim murray plays.i think its a takamine???not sure.jim murray must be one of the best guitar players at the moment??i think himself and john doyle are the top two
Yes Christy Moore does own a Martin but he prefers Takamines:
"Some of them are always slaggin’ me about playing my trusty Takamine guitars, I have three of them, the eldest is 18 and the others not much younger. They would not be rated by either the guitar experts nor aficionados but I like the feel of them. As a company, Takamine were just about as unhelpful as they could have been, so I stopped calling them 12 years ago but that does not detract from my 3 instruments. I can’t speak for the younger models but they don't seem to sound as good. Got my first classy guitar recently - a unique Martin. Play it at home all the time but so far have not been able to get a stage sound that I like but we'll keep trying"
The very early Takamines really were excellent. I used to borrow one that was originally owned by Mark Knopfler, with carved top. a truly lovely instrument. I have G-series tak from rock-band days, with a thin acoustic sound and a horrible transducer quack, but ok to play at home and makes a handy doorstop. Taylors look great, but tend to suffer from lack of volume, particularly bass (a luthier friend explained why, it's how they're made, with compromises to the ribbing to allow for the flash finish). The only reliable big manufacturer for projecting in a session or folk club is Martin, though the new cheaper range needs care. Lowdens can be fantastic but even some of their later ones can be dodgy. Acually my favorite to play is still my Eko Ranger (almost silent - but what a neck!)
If you're buying on a budget, go - with a mate you trust - to the biggest and best shop you can reach, only play guitars you can afford, and then buy the one your mate says sounds best (you can't hear it properly from up back)
Faust, I am with you on this one. To criticise Taylors saying they are no good for traditional music is utter drivel (no offence intended Allan). I am quite sure there are some that are not particularly suited to it but there are some that are very suited to it. It depends on the model and even the individual guitar. It depends on the individual sound that you are after and any one of a million other things.
Personally I find my Taylor (a 414ce with Rosewood back and sides) very suited to traditional music and I know of plenty of other traditional musicians who have Taylors too. They do not generally have as much bass as say a Lowden, but then again nothing does. Martins are also renouned for a prominent bass. Taylors are generally more balanced in their sound and do have a strong clear treble end. The bass on my guitar is fantastic though. The expression pickup system is also an outstanding system (although I do know those who disagree). Taylors are fantastic instruments for picking on (something I believe Allan likes to have a go at!!)
I admit to having a bit of a pop at Takamines and I am sure that there are some really good Takamines out there (and Yamahas). I just find that Takamine's reputation is somewhat inflated. They build some good, solid guitars with powerful, if not necessarily tthe most acoustically sounding, pickups on the market. They are certainly very popular amongst pub singers for these reasons (and because Christy plays them).
I have had a go at a couple of really nice mid-range Avalons, and some really poor ones too. I however am biased against them for much the same reason as stv.
I have played Taylors that I did not like. As I said above it is difficult to generalise. You need to try them all out and find the right one for you.
I agree, choosing a guitar, or any instrument for that matter, is like choosing one’s life partner although much less an expensive process to be sure if you decide down the road you’ve made the wrong choice. I play a Martin D-35 and am very happy with the sound and reliability. It is only about seven or eight years old.
I have a Running Dog (ordered after meeting Rick Davis a few years ago) and it is a beautiful sounding and looking instrument.
I have being playing music with Grit Laskin for a number of years so about 5 years ago I put myself on his waiting list and finally got the guitar in January. The guitar has an amazing sound and the feature of a sound port (i.e. hole) on the top side facing the play gives the player an essentially full volume monitor sound, which means you don't need to play as hard to hear yourself in a noisy room. The waiting list is long, but it gives you time to save up the money (http//:www.williamlaskin.com). The cost is such that I originally vowed never to bring it to a session, but the sound is so good it hasn't missed a session since I got it.
2. I find that Taylors are either too loud and lack individual string definition if strummed and dissolve into a kind of aural soup if picked.
I think they are ok for C&W.
yes Im generalising - Ive played TWO decent Taylors in about 10 years.
I was offered one, for free, to replace my Lowden when it broke its neck, and I declined and went back to play my old yamaha.
Lots of great players use Taylors, including NY's Danny Novek, who is a fantastic player. Larrivee guitars are generally wonderful, the less expensive ones are a great value tho they take a lot of time to really blossom (IMO) and the upper range ones are splendid. I love their rosewood OMs. A local session player here has an L-05 that is really, really nice.
The Takemine players I hear in the States are mostly trying to sound like mainstream country hits, with that thin pickup sound, and I don't remember hearing one in a session here, but I heard some great ones in Ireland in sessions.
Guitars, much like cars, are generally soooo much better now than they were ten years ago that it's amazing. And the hand-made, boutique ones are just astounding. There's a fine guitar for everyone who wants one!!
Hey, you can play that Ovation in tune in a heavy fog -all night-, and my Santa Cruz will only do that for a few hours!! <GGG>
I have to throw in my opinion here that Martin's are ideal for trad. At least my one is anyway! It has a very warm/deep sound which I haven't found in Lowden's, Taylors and definitely not Takamine's (which ARE crap!). Taylor's tend to have a very bright sound which is nice for some things but I don't think they are great for backing because the brightness doesn't really blend well with the common tune instruments, Lowden's are indeed very nice but quite expensive, so unless you have a huge budget, go for a lower end Martin and I'm sure you won't be disappointed, but whatever you do don't get a Takamine unless it is the one Arty McGlynn plays, it must be good by some freakish accident!
i've got to get my old 'yamaha FG-365S (Japan, early 1980's) repaired, not the greatest but, nevertheless, an old bright tone _but i've tried out older ones with warmer tones
i've never tried out a 'takamine' i like yet, and a couple of 'taylors' didn't do it (but i admit i'm not a great tester-outer of guitars)
what did blow me away 20-odd yrs ago were some old 'martins' up denmark street in london i tried out _1933, 1950's & 1961 (year i was born); this was revelationary for me and in line with the known and loved tone of early 'clannad' albums
for stage now, ive settled with the following workhorses : 'yamaha APX-4A' electric acoustic (Japan, early 1990's), 'fender strat (US 1979)' and 'fender precision bass (US 1982) through 'trace elliot' and 'gallion krugger' amplification
Don't hide, Grego. Stand up and be counted! My working axe till a few months ago, when the back just couldn't take the weight any more, was a deep-bowl 1987 Legend.
(Peanut gallery, get it out of your collective system, altogether now, 1-2-3: "Ovations are crap!!" )
It does some things very well. It stays in tune, has a comfortable neck profile, isn't feedback-prone, is robust - has survived strap failure over a hard floor mid-song and a microphone stand hitting it pointy-end first on the soundboard - and at the time I bought it, the electronics were pretty much the best you could do (all my playing is plugged-in). I can't complain about it as a stage guitar. It doesn't do other things well at all but I knew that before I bought it and it wasn't designed to do those things anyway, so I can hardly bash it for that reason. I won't record my next solo album on it, but as a live workhorse, it served me well.
Taks are crap ... well, I sure wouldn't buy a Tak meself but one of the main backers at the regular session here plays one (at the session at least) and neither it nor he sound like "crap" to me. It does the job just fine. Mind you, last time I went, one backer had a spruce-topped Gerard Gilet and as soon as you walked in, even through the pub racket, you just knew there was a quality instrument in there. And I've not long bought a hand-made David Worthy acoustic myself that stood out in a shop full of Martins, Taylors, Collings, Larrivees, etc and other hand-mades. (Though that little Gilet parlour 12-fretter was soooo tempting ... maybe if I win the lottery!) So sure, you can easily tell the difference between a Tak and a better guitar, but to say a whole brand is "crap" kinda implies that it's no good for anything, anywhere, anytime and that doesn't seem to be *quite* so.
And maybe my old Yamaha FG345 "beater" is a freak too, but it's had it's share of compliments over the years from players and listeners.
I'm not particularly trying to defend these brands, I just don't see that "Brand X is crap" is necessarily helpful advice.
Go the Worthys!
BTW David likes to keep track of who is playing his guitars and where. You should email him and let him know you bought one. If he's passing through he likes to go hear how the guitars are aging.
I sent an e-mail enquiry or two before taking the plunge and then let him know I'd gone ahead. I didn't hear back but then he was in the throes of moving house, so I might drop him another line.
Me and thee need a T, I reckon - "My Guitar is Worthy" emblazoned across the front
Since this topic has morphed into Good Guitar / Bad Guitar, I’ll cast my two bits. My main weapon is a Lowden that overtook my old Martin, but I’m about to buy a Blueridge for flatpick work. The Blueridges are amazing, partly because they sound so good and partly because they’re incredibly inexpensive. For under $1000, you can get an instrument that competes with the $3000-4000 Martins and Santa Cruzez. Even the $400 model sounds very nice.
We really are in a Golden Age of lutherie. The best guitars ever made are in the shops right now.
Morgan's are nice, and Larrivee's are great. Brad Davidge (Natalie MacMaster) plays a really sweet Larrivee and he justbought a nice baritone too... now THAT thing thumps in a session. I have a 300$ Washburn D6 that i've had for 10 years, sounds half decent. some say washburn is crap but I think they're ok. you can hear it under "mattrick" on mighty craic online.
looks like i missed this some time back...and now take it off topic some.
so nice to hear Danny N. mentioned...he really is a good sound player. I saw him play, to great effect, with All Ireland Champ Isaac Alderson I belive it was Sam Amidon...a great trio they had and a great show a few years back. Haven't heard any of them since. He was playing a beautiful Taylor that day, and through the five zillion watt high end fest system it sounded incredible.
Answering quite late...
Arty McGlynn does play a Takamine. He recently told me (mid-November 2007) that Takamine is his choice (price/quality) "when he is on the road". I suspect that means he doesn't play a Tak for recordings.
Don't bag Takamines. Like all quality manufacturers, their best instruments are superb. I'm playing a Yamaha apx4a and a 1962 Gibson J45 at present. The yamma tunes better and is great to play but for stage I prefer the gibbo sound with the 70's magnetic pickup I'm using, which is a pity because I hate beating up drummers with the Gibson.
Drummer joke.
Q. How many drummers does it take to change a light globe?
A. None, they're supposed to be digging ditches.
At first the guitarist makes the music and a good guitarist with a cheap guitar is better for any session than a bad guitarist with an expensive one.
I live in Germany and on the sessions around many players use Lowdens. On my various tours around Ireland, where I played sessions every night in a different town I can hardly remember having seen one Lowden. According to my experience most irish players prefer Takamine guitars. Martins and Yamahas are popular as well but less.
Me myself owning a Gibson J-200 would seldom use it on a session. It is very loud, sensible against temperature and humidity and not really easy to play. I use it on stage to accompany songs.
On sessions I strumm a very cheap chinese guitar, I even forgot the name and nobody ever told me it sounds poor. On stage I strumm a takamine, not because I looked for this particular guitar, but it was cheap and had a handy pickup system.
I bought a Lakewood, hand made german built, some years ago as a cheap box for those wild west gigs and sessions where things were apt to get a little out of control. 20 years on it's now wrecked, worn through the top from playing, glued back together several times because of dropping etc. It cost £350 and at the time was a third of the price of a martin D28.
You get what you pay for, but don't discount the bottom end of the quality market, 20 years and 10's of thousands of hours playing for a third of the price ain't bad. Sounded great too. Still not given up on it, hopefully the top will shrink back and the intonation recover enough to resurrect it, thats worked before and it may work again.
Guitars
Guitars
Does anyone know what models of guitars does some of the most famous players (Arty McGlynn,John Doyle,Ed Boyd,.....) use?I think Arty and John play Takamine, but what model?Thanks.
Rafix
# Posted on June 14th 2005 by Rafix
Re: Guitars
John Doyle plays a mahogany-body Lowden (http://www.lowdenguitars.com) dreadnought D-10 and a Martin D-28. The Lowden was built as a lefty, while the Martin is an off-the-rack right-handed model with the nut and saddle switched for left-handed playing. This info I got at http://www.acguitar.com/issues/ag108/gear108.html#6
I don't know for sure, but I doubt Arty Mcglynn plays a Takamine. I recently heard a guitar player from a top band say on stage "Don't ever buy a Takemine, they don't stay in tune for a minute!"
# Posted on June 14th 2005 by Backer
Re: Guitars
http://www.georgelowden.com/
George Lowden's temporary web address above.
http://www.kinkadeguitars.co.uk/
Ed Boyd's guitar manufacturer above.
It would appear from photos and from what I have heard that Arty McGlynn does play a Takamine. That does not mean that they are any good however. It just means that he is even better than you might have previously thought. I believe he just likes his guitar and Takamine were certainly a popular brand for a while and for a reason. But please don't buy one justbecause McGlynn plays one - they really are pap!!
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by No Cause For Alarm
Re: Guitars
Alistair, I haven't played a takamine yet, would you recommend me to buy one? Are good guitars or everything depends on what a player is looking for?:Sorry because my bad English.Bye
Rafix
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by Rafix
Re: Guitars
Lowden are fantastic guitars for a very high price and long waiting period. For a similar sound / feel, I like Taylors. Excellent quality, but not cheap. Takamines can be had cheap, probably why people play them at all. Under no circumstances should anyone be forced to play a Yamaha except financial ones...
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by Farr
Re: Guitars
What sort of guitar you want is very subjective. What some people like, others don't. Try various ones out first. It might also depend on your budget.
However, NO. In my last post I was NOT saying that Takamines were good. I was saying they were bad. Pap = bad!!. Try them though. Some people like them. I have a Taylor and love it. I have played other Taylors though that I did not like. In fact when I bought my guitar there were two identical guitars in the shop - identical except in sound - they were the same model but the other one just did not compare.
When I was originally shopping for a good guitar I was looking for a Lowden. They proved impossible to find however (look at George Lowden's site for details).
Really all I can suggest is shop around. Find what you are happy with and that will be best.
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by No Cause For Alarm
Re: Guitars
Rafix, it doesn't directly answer your question but if you want to read about and discuss acoustic guitars, I'd recommend this discussion forum:
http://www.acousticguitarforum.com/forums/
A bit like this place, rule no.1 is "be nice". Rule no.2 is "brand bashing is not tolerated". The forum is very tolerant of people asking for advice in buying new guitars - most posters there seem to feel that the answer, "go read the archives" isn't necessarily in keeping with the spirit of a discussion forum. So, you can have reasoned discussions of the strengths and weaknesses of various guitars and tonewoods and their suitablility or otherwise for different kinds of playing without the mindless pro- and anti-[insert brand/maker here] drivel and flaming that goes on at some other guitar forums.
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by Tish
Re: Guitars
When I started playing I looked around and found a bunch of prominent players using small-bodied guitars, so I started looking at those. I settled on a Santa Cruz OM PW. I chose to use the OM ("orchestra model") size introduced by the Martin Co. in the early '30's, and the Santa Cruz OM PW was, at that time, the least expensive expression of that design.
The Lowden S and F models, Santa Cruz H models and Webber Roundbody models all fit in this category.
Dreadnought-shaped guitars are still the most popular. Daithi Sproul played a Bourgeois dread here and I've seen John Doyle playing a dread'.
Tell you what guitar to choose...? i'd just as soon tell you who to marry. Nope.
I like small-bodied guitars, and tho I have others besides my Santa Cruz OM PW, I keep coming back to that one. It's my main guitar and it's pretty difficult to knock it off the pedestal. I also have a Lowden 032 and a Greven custom made for me in 1977, but they do studio functions and not ITM. (So many guitars, so little time... <GG>)
Play as many as you can, use what makes you happy.
stv
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by stv culchie
Re: Guitars
I don't play a Tak and I don't particularly like them but Arty McGlynn DOES play one!
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by Cuso
Re: Guitars
This is the usual minefield then.
Lowden = good
Avalon [cheap] = ok - but watch the necks
Taylor = rotten for traditional music, ok for C&W.
Yamaha can be fine guitars, better than Taylor, just pick a solid top one
Takamine - I played a good one last week - it cost £300..
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by allan21
Re: Guitars
Arty always plays taks but that has more to do with the pick up than the accustic quality. They just don't work in a session. Some of their new guitars aren't too bad though. Lowden or Martin are the job. Played a Taylor last week. Not impressed!
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by John McCartin
Re: Guitars
I'd recommend a Norman guitar. I bought one 4 years ago, and it's the best I ever had. I think the price was around 1300 euro (including a fishman pick-up), but i suspect its a bit cheaper now.....
There's a link in the links section!
/DADdyGADdy
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by DADdyGADdy
Re: Guitars
Christy Moore actually plays a takamine as his main guitar i believe
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by ecidralla
Re: Guitars
I play a Martin 000M and it is very nice, although it is VERY sensitive to humidity, must keep a humidifier in the case and moisten it regularly. My brother, who runs a music shop here in New England says that the new low-end Taylor guitars are the best guitar for the money these days, and if you can afford it, the high end are the best. I do have the old Yamaha I learned on (purchased in 1976), which is sturdy as a tank, the problem is, it has the acoustical properties of a tank as well--but it is an old friend, so I still play it on occasion.
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by AlBrown
Re: Guitars
Christy Moore is now playing a Martin OM guitar (I think it's an OM42 with some added bits).
He used to play a takamine but there is a ?true? story that he used carpet tape to cover the name on the head after they rebuffed his request for some support from them.
The OM size guitars are well balanced and in my opinion are well worth looking at.
All of this being said a lot of the sound is down to the player not the instrument so an expensive instrument won't make you sound good without your help.
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by Cuso
Re: Guitars
Denis Cahill has at least one Running Dog guitar (from Vermont: www.vtguitars.com) which he used on the live CD with Martin Hayes. Apparently, Arty McGlynn tried Denis's and then ordered an identical one for himself.
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by ian clark
Re: Guitars
Now that I think of it. Avalon (made Lowdens til lately) are making graet guitars! They'll make to order too.
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by John McCartin
Re: Guitars
Alan, what are you talking about? How are Taylors rotten for Trad but Ok for C&W? Even as an opinion that makes no sense.
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by Farr
Re: Guitars
There's quite a story about the Lowden/Avalon affair, but to make it short... Lowden expanded to do more 'accessible' guitars and the company became Avalon. Then there were problems with George Lowden and the Avalon Co., so there was an acrimonious period and then a corporate split.
Today, Avalon, tho they use the Lowden name whenever they wish, have no real relation to George Lowden, musically nor in business, and George has a new shop where he makes his wonderful instruments. The new Lowden shop is growing, with more workers and more models.
I have played some Avalons and they are real nice for low $, but since I had some of the details of the business tangle, I'm not real interested in buying any of them. I do have a nice Lowden tho, and I'd like to have some others (probably just one at a time, tho... <GGG>) I'd also like to play a Collings OM or a David Webber RoundBody.
Thanks, Ian, for the location of Running Dog! I had heard about them, but never had a way to find them.
Ged Foley played Sobells for a long time and now plays a nice, black Santa Cruz H model. Randal Bays plays a Martin J-model, and I think that's what I saw Paul DeGrae play, too. Pat Egan plays a Santa Cruz OM. Zan McLeod plays a late-50's Martin D-18 and he also has a lovely Collings. In the Planxty reunion DVD, Christy Moore was playing a Martin-style dreadnaught ....
stv
http://www.cdbaby.com/Culchies
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by stv culchie
Re: Guitars
lowdens ar legend but as mentioned they are expensive and have a long waiting list.
takamines,lowdens,martins,flyde,taylor are fairly top class guitars if you get a good one.
i love the nylonstring cutaway that jim murray plays.i think its a takamine???not sure.jim murray must be one of the best guitar players at the moment??i think himself and john doyle are the top two
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by fused
Re: Guitars
Yes Christy Moore does own a Martin but he prefers Takamines:
"Some of them are always slaggin’ me about playing my trusty Takamine guitars, I have three of them, the eldest is 18 and the others not much younger. They would not be rated by either the guitar experts nor aficionados but I like the feel of them. As a company, Takamine were just about as unhelpful as they could have been, so I stopped calling them 12 years ago but that does not detract from my 3 instruments. I can’t speak for the younger models but they don't seem to sound as good. Got my first classy guitar recently - a unique Martin. Play it at home all the time but so far have not been able to get a stage sound that I like but we'll keep trying"
See, that is from his website.
# Posted on June 15th 2005 by ecidralla
Re: Guitars
The very early Takamines really were excellent. I used to borrow one that was originally owned by Mark Knopfler, with carved top. a truly lovely instrument. I have G-series tak from rock-band days, with a thin acoustic sound and a horrible transducer quack, but ok to play at home and makes a handy doorstop. Taylors look great, but tend to suffer from lack of volume, particularly bass (a luthier friend explained why, it's how they're made, with compromises to the ribbing to allow for the flash finish). The only reliable big manufacturer for projecting in a session or folk club is Martin, though the new cheaper range needs care. Lowdens can be fantastic but even some of their later ones can be dodgy. Acually my favorite to play is still my Eko Ranger (almost silent - but what a neck!)
If you're buying on a budget, go - with a mate you trust - to the biggest and best shop you can reach, only play guitars you can afford, and then buy the one your mate says sounds best (you can't hear it properly from up back)
# Posted on June 16th 2005 by tombliss
Re: Guitars
Faust, I am with you on this one. To criticise Taylors saying they are no good for traditional music is utter drivel (no offence intended Allan). I am quite sure there are some that are not particularly suited to it but there are some that are very suited to it. It depends on the model and even the individual guitar. It depends on the individual sound that you are after and any one of a million other things.
Personally I find my Taylor (a 414ce with Rosewood back and sides) very suited to traditional music and I know of plenty of other traditional musicians who have Taylors too. They do not generally have as much bass as say a Lowden, but then again nothing does. Martins are also renouned for a prominent bass. Taylors are generally more balanced in their sound and do have a strong clear treble end. The bass on my guitar is fantastic though. The expression pickup system is also an outstanding system (although I do know those who disagree). Taylors are fantastic instruments for picking on (something I believe Allan likes to have a go at!!)
I admit to having a bit of a pop at Takamines and I am sure that there are some really good Takamines out there (and Yamahas). I just find that Takamine's reputation is somewhat inflated. They build some good, solid guitars with powerful, if not necessarily tthe most acoustically sounding, pickups on the market. They are certainly very popular amongst pub singers for these reasons (and because Christy plays them).
I have had a go at a couple of really nice mid-range Avalons, and some really poor ones too. I however am biased against them for much the same reason as stv.
I have played Taylors that I did not like. As I said above it is difficult to generalise. You need to try them all out and find the right one for you.
# Posted on June 16th 2005 by No Cause For Alarm
Re: Guitars
Oh and p.s. Takamine = Pap!!!
# Posted on June 16th 2005 by No Cause For Alarm
Re: Guitars
There's some pretty nice lumber that comes into the Vic session where I play from time to time, including new and vintage Martins etc.
Whenever someone starts playing a Larivee though - you can tell that it's a quality guitar sitting in the guy's lap. They look and sound fantastic.
# Posted on June 16th 2005 by octogreg
Re: Guitars
I agree, choosing a guitar, or any instrument for that matter, is like choosing one’s life partner although much less an expensive process to be sure if you decide down the road you’ve made the wrong choice. I play a Martin D-35 and am very happy with the sound and reliability. It is only about seven or eight years old.
Peace,
Ed
# Posted on June 16th 2005 by ejsant
Re: Guitars
I have a Running Dog (ordered after meeting Rick Davis a few years ago) and it is a beautiful sounding and looking instrument.
I have being playing music with Grit Laskin for a number of years so about 5 years ago I put myself on his waiting list and finally got the guitar in January. The guitar has an amazing sound and the feature of a sound port (i.e. hole) on the top side facing the play gives the player an essentially full volume monitor sound, which means you don't need to play as hard to hear yourself in a noisy room. The waiting list is long, but it gives you time to save up the money (http//:www.williamlaskin.com). The cost is such that I originally vowed never to bring it to a session, but the sound is so good it hasn't missed a session since I got it.
# Posted on June 16th 2005 by ian clark
Re: Guitars
From Above
1. my name is Allan, not Alan
2. I find that Taylors are either too loud and lack individual string definition if strummed and dissolve into a kind of aural soup if picked.
I think they are ok for C&W.
yes Im generalising - Ive played TWO decent Taylors in about 10 years.
I was offered one, for free, to replace my Lowden when it broke its neck, and I declined and went back to play my old yamaha.
# Posted on June 16th 2005 by allan21
Re: Guitars
I play an Ovation, and like it.
So now I'll go hide somewhere....
# Posted on June 16th 2005 by grego
Re: Guitars
Lots of great players use Taylors, including NY's Danny Novek, who is a fantastic player. Larrivee guitars are generally wonderful, the less expensive ones are a great value tho they take a lot of time to really blossom (IMO) and the upper range ones are splendid. I love their rosewood OMs. A local session player here has an L-05 that is really, really nice.
The Takemine players I hear in the States are mostly trying to sound like mainstream country hits, with that thin pickup sound, and I don't remember hearing one in a session here, but I heard some great ones in Ireland in sessions.
Guitars, much like cars, are generally soooo much better now than they were ten years ago that it's amazing. And the hand-made, boutique ones are just astounding. There's a fine guitar for everyone who wants one!!
Hey, you can play that Ovation in tune in a heavy fog -all night-, and my Santa Cruz will only do that for a few hours!! <GGG>
stv
http://www.cdbaby.com/Culchies
# Posted on June 16th 2005 by stv culchie
Re: Guitars
Allan,
If I had a dime for every time they spelled my name wrong.....
Best wishes,
Alan
# Posted on June 16th 2005 by AlBrown
Martin's
I have to throw in my opinion here that Martin's are ideal for trad. At least my one is anyway! It has a very warm/deep sound which I haven't found in Lowden's, Taylors and definitely not Takamine's (which ARE crap!). Taylor's tend to have a very bright sound which is nice for some things but I don't think they are great for backing because the brightness doesn't really blend well with the common tune instruments, Lowden's are indeed very nice but quite expensive, so unless you have a huge budget, go for a lower end Martin and I'm sure you won't be disappointed, but whatever you do don't get a Takamine unless it is the one Arty McGlynn plays, it must be good by some freakish accident!
# Posted on June 17th 2005 by The Tune Composer
Re: Guitars
i've got to get my old 'yamaha FG-365S (Japan, early 1980's) repaired, not the greatest but, nevertheless, an old bright tone _but i've tried out older ones with warmer tones
i've never tried out a 'takamine' i like yet, and a couple of 'taylors' didn't do it (but i admit i'm not a great tester-outer of guitars)
what did blow me away 20-odd yrs ago were some old 'martins' up denmark street in london i tried out _1933, 1950's & 1961 (year i was born); this was revelationary for me and in line with the known and loved tone of early 'clannad' albums
for stage now, ive settled with the following workhorses : 'yamaha APX-4A' electric acoustic (Japan, early 1990's), 'fender strat (US 1979)' and 'fender precision bass (US 1982) through 'trace elliot' and 'gallion krugger' amplification
i will own a 'martin' of my own one day . . .
# Posted on June 18th 2005 by lisaniska
Re: Guitars
Don't hide, Grego. Stand up and be counted! My working axe till a few months ago, when the back just couldn't take the weight any more, was a deep-bowl 1987 Legend.
(Peanut gallery, get it out of your collective system, altogether now, 1-2-3: "Ovations are crap!!" )
It does some things very well. It stays in tune, has a comfortable neck profile, isn't feedback-prone, is robust - has survived strap failure over a hard floor mid-song and a microphone stand hitting it pointy-end first on the soundboard - and at the time I bought it, the electronics were pretty much the best you could do (all my playing is plugged-in). I can't complain about it as a stage guitar. It doesn't do other things well at all but I knew that before I bought it and it wasn't designed to do those things anyway, so I can hardly bash it for that reason. I won't record my next solo album on it, but as a live workhorse, it served me well.
Taks are crap ... well, I sure wouldn't buy a Tak meself but one of the main backers at the regular session here plays one (at the session at least) and neither it nor he sound like "crap" to me. It does the job just fine. Mind you, last time I went, one backer had a spruce-topped Gerard Gilet and as soon as you walked in, even through the pub racket, you just knew there was a quality instrument in there. And I've not long bought a hand-made David Worthy acoustic myself that stood out in a shop full of Martins, Taylors, Collings, Larrivees, etc and other hand-mades. (Though that little Gilet parlour 12-fretter was soooo tempting ... maybe if I win the lottery!) So sure, you can easily tell the difference between a Tak and a better guitar, but to say a whole brand is "crap" kinda implies that it's no good for anything, anywhere, anytime and that doesn't seem to be *quite* so.
And maybe my old Yamaha FG345 "beater" is a freak too, but it's had it's share of compliments over the years from players and listeners.
I'm not particularly trying to defend these brands, I just don't see that "Brand X is crap" is necessarily helpful advice.
# Posted on June 18th 2005 by Tish
Re: Guitars
Go the Worthys!
BTW David likes to keep track of who is playing his guitars and where. You should email him and let him know you bought one. If he's passing through he likes to go hear how the guitars are aging.
# Posted on June 18th 2005 by Donough
Re: Guitars
Yay Donough!
I sent an e-mail enquiry or two before taking the plunge and then let him know I'd gone ahead. I didn't hear back but then he was in the throes of moving house, so I might drop him another line.
Me and thee need a T, I reckon - "My Guitar is Worthy" emblazoned across the front
# Posted on June 18th 2005 by Tish
Re: Guitars
Since this topic has morphed into Good Guitar / Bad Guitar, I’ll cast my two bits. My main weapon is a Lowden that overtook my old Martin, but I’m about to buy a Blueridge for flatpick work. The Blueridges are amazing, partly because they sound so good and partly because they’re incredibly inexpensive. For under $1000, you can get an instrument that competes with the $3000-4000 Martins and Santa Cruzez. Even the $400 model sounds very nice.
We really are in a Golden Age of lutherie. The best guitars ever made are in the shops right now.
# Posted on June 20th 2005 by Bob himself
Re: Guitars
Morgan's are nice, and Larrivee's are great. Brad Davidge (Natalie MacMaster) plays a really sweet Larrivee and he justbought a nice baritone too... now THAT thing thumps in a session. I have a 300$ Washburn D6 that i've had for 10 years, sounds half decent. some say washburn is crap but I think they're ok. you can hear it under "mattrick" on mighty craic online.
# Posted on June 23rd 2005 by Mattrick
Re: Guitars
looks like i missed this some time back...and now take it off topic some.
so nice to hear Danny N. mentioned...he really is a good sound player. I saw him play, to great effect, with All Ireland Champ Isaac Alderson I belive it was Sam Amidon...a great trio they had and a great show a few years back. Haven't heard any of them since. He was playing a beautiful Taylor that day, and through the five zillion watt high end fest system it sounded incredible.
# Posted on July 17th 2006 by farquharson whistler
Re: Guitars
Answering quite late...
Arty McGlynn does play a Takamine. He recently told me (mid-November 2007) that Takamine is his choice (price/quality) "when he is on the road". I suspect that means he doesn't play a Tak for recordings.
# Posted on December 31st 2007 by Moxhe
Re: Guitars
Don't bag Takamines. Like all quality manufacturers, their best instruments are superb. I'm playing a Yamaha apx4a and a 1962 Gibson J45 at present. The yamma tunes better and is great to play but for stage I prefer the gibbo sound with the 70's magnetic pickup I'm using, which is a pity because I hate beating up drummers with the Gibson.
Drummer joke.
Q. How many drummers does it take to change a light globe?
A. None, they're supposed to be digging ditches.
# Posted on May 23rd 2008 by ronnierude
Re: Guitars
At first the guitarist makes the music and a good guitarist with a cheap guitar is better for any session than a bad guitarist with an expensive one.
I live in Germany and on the sessions around many players use Lowdens. On my various tours around Ireland, where I played sessions every night in a different town I can hardly remember having seen one Lowden. According to my experience most irish players prefer Takamine guitars. Martins and Yamahas are popular as well but less.
Me myself owning a Gibson J-200 would seldom use it on a session. It is very loud, sensible against temperature and humidity and not really easy to play. I use it on stage to accompany songs.
On sessions I strumm a very cheap chinese guitar, I even forgot the name and nobody ever told me it sounds poor. On stage I strumm a takamine, not because I looked for this particular guitar, but it was cheap and had a handy pickup system.
# Posted on January 22nd 2012 by Toby
Re: Guitars
I bought a Lakewood, hand made german built, some years ago as a cheap box for those wild west gigs and sessions where things were apt to get a little out of control. 20 years on it's now wrecked, worn through the top from playing, glued back together several times because of dropping etc. It cost £350 and at the time was a third of the price of a martin D28.
You get what you pay for, but don't discount the bottom end of the quality market, 20 years and 10's of thousands of hours playing for a third of the price ain't bad. Sounded great too. Still not given up on it, hopefully the top will shrink back and the intonation recover enough to resurrect it, thats worked before and it may work again.
# Posted on January 22nd 2012 by Solidmahog