Hey everyone! I'm new at this site and wanted to say that I've learned alot just reading these discussions. I've just started to learn how to play fiddle, I picked it up in February and I'm just really enjoying it!! I wanted to get anyone's feedback about how to play a double stop.
My teacher has given me a couple of songs and has showed me how to incorporate the double stop recently, and sometimes I can get it and others I can't. How can you play a double stop smoothly?? and without letting your fingers touch the other string when it's not supposed to! Every once in a while, I can get a good tone when I play one, but most of the time it screechs, or I'm playing just 1 string when I thought I was playing 2!!
Any advice would be greatly appreciated
The short answer is to practice 4 X as much as your teacher suggests.... :O)
When I started fiddling 20 years ago, there was no internet. I remember asking a top local fiddler for some advice, and he just said "Practice. Keep at it and you will get it." I wasn't very satisfied with his answer, and felt that I had to learn how to ask more specific questions. But, 20 years later, I realize that his message was one of encouragement, rather than advice. "You'll get it" was his real message, provided that I put in the effort to learn it. Well,... after 20 years I have put in enough effort to learn whatever it is that I have. I could have made a stronger effort at times, but I needed to keep a balance in my life, and as a result, I still enjoy fiddling, and I still keep learning.
If you keep at it, you WILL get it. Make sure that you enjoy yourself in the meantime. Keep it fun, that is the only to keep at it long enough to reach your goals. Enough preaching...
apologies...
Double stops are quite a challenge. To create an even tone on one string, the right balance must be achieved between bow speed, bow pressure, and the point where the bow contacts the string. If you move the bow closer to the bridge, then you must increase the pressure, or increase the bow speed, or face the squeels.
Too much pressure, or not enough speed, and you are headed for a crunch. If you move the contact point closer to the fingerboard, then you must decrease the pressure or suffer the crunch.
So, with the above in mind, many fiddlers play double stops with the bow contacting the strings a little further from the bridge with a very light pressure and with a longer bow stroke (= more bow speed). To make it even easier to maintain an even bow pressure, they play near the top half of the bow, using mainly the weight of the bow to apply the pressure to the string. If you are not already doing this, then you will likely find that this helps a fair amount. Some styles of fiddling will require that you learn to play double stops close to the bridge, with lots of pressure, but you can cross that bridge later, if you ever want to go in that direction.
There are several benefits to new fiddlers to practice double stops. First, it helps to develop control of bow pressure, and accuracy in drawing the bow along the plane of the two strings.
Second, by listening to the two notes, one can begin making adjustments in left hand finger placement to bring the two notes into accurate pitch. So, even if it doesn't seem to sound nice to your ear, as an exercise, it enables you to begin developing skills which necessarily take a long time to acquire. You can think it as part of the initiation rite into the brother/sisterhood of fiddlers. We all go through it, and as God's way of trying to keep us humble, He lets us screech or crunch once in a while.
The other essential, for learning double stops, is to keep a wet sponge handy, for the purpose of throwing at anybody who makes insensitive comments about 'cats fighting', etc. (speaking from personal experience! :O)
Wow, Scotty This is really great advice and Texas Gal what a great question. I love this place! I am trying the sponge thing... though I don't think it is fair to throw it at my audience as they are cats and they seem to enjoy it...they probably think I am mutating into one herself...
All this complex fiddling advice is putting me off ever attempting to learn the fiddle. At the age of 8 or 9, I was offered violin lessons at school, but turned them down in favour of the guitar (which I didn't stick at) - I'm kicking myself black and blue now.
Since getting into traditional music I've always thought I'd get round to the fiddle sometime. But now I'm just terrified of the ghastly noise I'd make - for which I've got no excuse, being over 21. I don't know if I could put up with myself for long enough to attain any degree of competence. From fiddlers' comments in The Session, there seems to be so much to learn, just to become a passable player - and the longer I leave it, no doubt, the smaller my chances of ever becoming that.
Sorry about that bit of self indulgent rant. Ignore all foregoing text.
I gotta admit when I see all the stuff these guys are writing out it makes me stop and think, "Is this how I'm doing it?". Seeing it all written out like that makes it look worse than it really is. Don't be discouraged, don't expect fast results, but for heavens sakes don't not give it a go!
Don't be silly, David. Pick it up! ALL instruments sound horrible in the hands of rank beginners. I started when I was 38 or so. I know lots of people who have started at late ages. And...
Irish traditional musicians are known for being multi-instrumentalists, and you know, they don't sound wonderful when they first pick up an instrument either. If you're familiar with the music, you'll have an edge on learning the fiddle -- you already know what it's supposed to sound like. It'll just be a matter of getting some facility at the instrument you're trying to pick up.
Will is learning the flute and whistle now, you know...after years and years of fiddle. Shannon Heaton just picked up the box about two years ago. Matt Heaton is a stellar guitar player, and he's right now taking fiddle lessons from Tommy Peoples, and he definitely considers himself a beginner at the fiddle. Mike Dugger is just now getting to the point where he feels he can bring his box to a session.
So go pick up a fiddle! Everybody makes ghastly noises when they start out. Give yourself the same breaks you'd give anyone else just starting, fer cats sake!
Ah yes, but of all instruments, the fiddle, while it can make some of the most beautiful sounds, can also make some of the ugliest. I play mandolin - give one of them to the most unmusical of people and they'd be hard pressed to get a REALLY horrible noise out of it.
Well, you realize that from now on we're going to do our best to shame you into trying, David. *grin* You most regret the things that you didn't try rather than the things you did, you know. Fear of failure shouldn't stop you, or none of us would ever do ANYthing.
Umm,, I guess this means I should'nt give up on the penney whistle don't it.
Most frustrating instrument I've ever picked up. I have no wind control. Just a lot of hot air.
That was the sound of whatever you said going over my head there Zina. Hoist I understand,,if it's a Beamish, Guiness, or Harp yer talking 'bout. But the rest, alas, I'm a bit slow.
Origin:
A petard is a small, bell-shaped explosive device used to break down doors or walls. Hence - hoist on one's own petard... Used by Shakespeare in Hamlet 'For tis the sport to have the enginer / Hoist with his owne petar'. From the French and Latin words for "breaking wind", ie: to fart.
All right then. Has anyone got a fiddle they don't want? Another problem I have is that I might end up spending too much on a terrible fiddle, which I might never even learn to play. I'm a Capricorn, you see - we don't like spending money unless we know it's going to be a long term investment.
David,
The point that got overlooked in the excitement of the wind breaking above is that with the mandolin you're more than half way there. You already know the left hand fingerings, even where triplets and twiddly bits fit in (specially if you've listened to the people you're playing with). And your fingertips will be toughened up. You only have to convert strums into bows. A doddle! Can't help you with a fiddle though.
Cheers
David, I bought what I considered to be an old beater fiddle that I figured would NOT be a good long term investment until I could see whether I might actually be any good at the fiddle -- it cost me less than $400. I wanted a decent student fiddle grade instrument, was all. To my surprise, I was told two years later by Dale Morris that it's actually quite a good fiddle, well made, good sound, good measurements, etc. All it needed was good strings and a good adjustment, which he gave it. Surprise, and there went my excuse for being such a poor fiddler. *grin*
I bought it at a pawn shop. If you trust your own ears and not the salesmen who want to overprice the fiddle at you, you can often find a nice enough instrument at places like that. There usually aren't any fiddles worth over a few hundred there, but every now and again you hear of someone getting lucky. Take a fiddling friend with you if you don't trust your ears.
Whatever you do, don't go buying one of the cheapo E-bay Chinese fiddles -- there are many good Chinese fiddles being made inexpensively these days, but those aren't them. Dale has some really good Chinese new fiddles available for less than $700, I believe he said, great sound, comes with a good case, should hold value pretty well -- you can contact him at 940/433-9996 or e-mail him at dtmorris@compuwise.net to see what he has.
You've made a valid point there, Jill. The thing is, I'm still trying to get to grips with making the instruments I'm making, and a kettle's a bit of a different fiddle of kesh. Strange as it may sound for a student of musical instrument making, I don't have any particular talent for woodwork - I rely on determination alone - so things take me a long time. That and the fact that I don't have access to a workshop other than at the college, means it'll be a good few years before I get round to making a fiddle.
I agree david - nothing sounds worse than a fiddle when its played badly - except maybe the pipes - but go for it - its worth it in the end - though I admit I had and still do have a lot more problems with the bowing )
Thanks for the advice guys!! I guess I should know that what I need to do is practice, practice, practice, but's it good to hear it from other players, too.
To correct an error in my reply to Texas Gal....
With respect to bow pressure, bow speed and 'contact point' (the point on the string where the bow makes contact with the string),
To create a squeel... apply too little pressure, or too much bow speed, or play too close to the bridge...
To create a crunch... apply too much pressure, too little bow speed, or move bow closer to the fingerboard (while maintaining bow pressure and bow speed).
These three factors can be varied in countless ways, changing the volume, the richness of the tone, etc.... in short: variations of pressure, speed and contact point give you "dynamic control", allowing you to put expression into a piece.
One way to develop these skills is to practice the 'son file', which is a French expression (maybe Zina can translate for me) referring to a long slow bowstroke. The basis of the exercise is to draw a long slow bowstroke, maintaining pleasant tone. The slower the stroke, the more challenging it is to keep the tone steady. Changes in volume can be incorporated into the exercise.
i.e. start soft, finish strong; start strong, soft in the middle, and finish strong, etc
For anybody who might find all this daunting,.... remember, first and foremost, keep it fun. I don't have to sound like the best fiddler in the world, which is a good thing, because I ain't even the best fiddler in the ROOM most days....
You can all stop reading now, because I am going to tell some stories about some of the things that I learned along the way.
When I first started fiddling (at the age of 24), I met an elderly woman, who played piano. (Here in Canada, it is a tradition to accompany fiddle tunes with a piano.) Turns out her father was an accomplished fiddler from PEI. Before I met her, she had about 60 years experience playing the piano. She knew the music. She knew the tradition, and she could make the tunes hop. She would invite me over to her house, and we would play tunes into the wee hours. I felt a little too self concious about my lack of finesse, and would only visit every few months, until I realized that she actually was enjoying herself, in spite of my lack of skill. The point is: the music stands on its own; you or I can't do anything that will harm or help it. Those who love the music and the tradition, enjoy it whether done with finesse, or with simple exuberance.
I love playing in nursing homes, hospitals, and retirement homes.
There are dozens of stories that I could tell, but will share a few of the ones that are extra special to me.
After a program in a nearby retirement home, a gentleman approached me and told me about being stationed in Halifax during WWII. He was told that his ship was going to leave for duty, shortly. He was given 24 hours shore leave, went and found his beloved and proposed to her. They couldn't find a church in which to get married, but they did find a clergyman who agreed to marry them in a simple ceremony on the street. Word got out about this wedding, and complete strangers began showing up, bringing with them food and refreshments, flowers, etc. Somebody brought a fiddle, and they partied in the street into the early morning hours.
The fellows eyes where getting glassy as he told me his story, and how hearing some fiddle tunes brought back memories of his wedding day and the years he and his wife had shared.
It was then, that I realized that fiddling is about the simple things, a smile, a tapping toe, just sharing a good time.
Last summer, I played at a Cape Breton wedding, and some of the guests asked "which part of Cape Breton are you from?". (Actually, I am from Ontario, but that is about the biggest compliment that can be paid to a fiddler, in this area). Shortly after, I did a program of mostly Irish fiddle tunes in a retirement home in Toronto, and a gentleman in the early stages of Alzhiemers disease, began to believe that he was back in Donegal, and he asked me what part of Donegal I was from. At the age of 90, he wanted to take me up the street to play for his father!
Another favourite... up until last year, I used to play almost every day in a nursing home somewhere. There is a children's residence for kids with severe mental and physical challenges, and I used to travel out of town once a month to play there, as well as a few other places in the same community. There is a little girl there named Amanda, who asked me to play 'Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer" for her. (That was in the month of May.) I told her that I didn't think that I could manage the tune, but promised her that I would play it the following month. The next month came(June), and Amanda asked for her tune. To my horror, and her deep disappointment, I had forgotten my promise. I will never forget her quivering lip when I apologized to her. Later that night, I resolved that I was going to learn that tune, and put some sheet music into my fiddle case.
The following month, (July) I had a few hours to spare between shows, and stopped at a coffee shop before heading up to the children's residence, when I remembered my promise. So, while sitting in the car, in the parking lot of a donut shop, I got out my fiddle and began plucking the strings to get the tune into my fingers. Shortly, a police officer pulled up, and seeing me sitting in my wreck of a car, with a rather fancy looking violin, decided to investigate. The officer asked what I was doing, and I replied, "trying to learn 'Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer"! I was lucky that he didn't arrest me on the spot, because he thought that I was trying to be a wise guy. I tried to explain to him about the little girl in the wheelchair, but I could see by his expression that he felt my story was just too tender, to be true. I managed to give him a phone number, which he had his dispatcher call to verify some of the details of my story, and he just shook his head and left. Afterwards, I realized how lucky, fortunate, blessed, I must be to find myself in situations which literally are too good to be true. Situations, which are unbelievable to so many people, yet are real.
There are dozens of similar stories, and for anyone who dares to be a fiddler, and to take the fiddle out into the community, to share the music, share a smile, and share a good time, there are experiences, similar to those above, waiting. 'These kind of experiences, the little smiles, the tapping toe, etc,, are the reason I fiddle. There is no requirement to be especially talented (good thing, too)
For those who are waiting to become the best fiddler in the world, someone else is going to beat you to all the fun.
Ah, Scotto. Now I remember why exactly I miss having you around as much these days.
There's nothing quite like doing the Christmas shows out at DIA in December for their Cultural Christmas thing. Ron always came out to play for us on his box, and we would do The Fairy Reel and the four hand reel and all the other fun ceili dances to Rudolph, and Frosty the Snowman, and Jingle Bells. Totally surreal, but a lot of fun. Heh.
That's what I want people to get out of my playing. I don't expect the be the best in the world, but I'd love to see people get up and want to dance when I play, and just to share the reason why I wanted to learn this instrument in the first place. I just love the sound of the fiddle. If people can listen to me, and it brings back memories, or entices them to dance, or they just sit and enjoy it, I would just love it. Of course, I've only been playing for about 4 months, so these scenarios I'm dreaming of are a little in the future, but I can still dream, right?? I can barely play in front of family/friends right now!
Boy, talk about bringing back memories. That is what you are doing for me right now. Your comments remind me SO much of my own feelings when I was getting started. I remember having dreams. What a great time that was. I didn't have a case for my fiddle, except for a brown paper bag, so I made a wooden rack to hang my fiddle and bow on the wall. Every time that I came into the room, I would see the fiddle hanging there, start dreaming, and the urge to play became irresistable. Your dreams are very important, and they give you something that nobody else can. It is ok to have big dreams too. I know that I did, and they provided a lot of motivation for me, helped me over some of those days when I struggled. It is also ok to have modest dreams. Sometimes the little things are the most satisfying.
Don't forget to give yourself 'permission' to realize your dreams! That may sound like an odd comment, but there is a grain of truth in it. Your dreams have a funny way of coming true, if you allow yourself to live them, given the opportunity. As an example, I remember listening to some fiddle music on a local University radio station. It had a 50 watt transmitter, with a range of about 3 miles, (if the wind was pushing it downhill One night, the announcer came on and said that the regular DJ wasn't available that night, so he was going to fill in, but didn't know where to find the fiddle recordings in the station library, and so was going to play Jim Nabors and Slim Whitman all night long. I phoned the station, to try to give him some titles/artists to look for, and even offered to bring in some of my own recordings if needed. 30 minutes later, we were spinning records, and I was telling him what to say about each tune.... till he showed me how to operate the turntables, etc. and left me to do the last two hours of the show. The regular DJ heard about it later, and asked me to be his emergency backup, on a volunteer basis, to fill during holidays, etc. (Most small stations operate with a full complement of volunteers, so there ARE opportunities for anyone who is interested! If they don't have a IRtrad program, offer to do one for them...)
In retrospect, I wanted to decline the fillin DJ's offer to be in the studio during the show, but my dreams forced me to accept his offer. When the regular DJ offered me some spots, I felt too inexperienced, but my dreams forced me to go for it. As a result, I made a lot of great friends (never did become famous, 50 watts barely gets past the parking lot) and had a lot of fun. The point is, there were moments when I almost said "no", but something inside said "yes". Give yourself permission to 'go for it' when opportunity knocks... Some pretty far fetched dreams can become reality, so dream without limits.
A good place to start, is to become a recording artist,....today, right now!!! See the thread 'THE MIGHTY CRAICK", or 'THE SESSION RECORDINGS", and submit a tune. Would love to hear you play!
Double stops
Double stops
Hey everyone! I'm new at this site and wanted to say that I've learned alot just reading these discussions. I've just started to learn how to play fiddle, I picked it up in February and I'm just really enjoying it!! I wanted to get anyone's feedback about how to play a double stop.
My teacher has given me a couple of songs and has showed me how to incorporate the double stop recently, and sometimes I can get it and others I can't. How can you play a double stop smoothly?? and without letting your fingers touch the other string when it's not supposed to! Every once in a while, I can get a good tone when I play one, but most of the time it screechs, or I'm playing just 1 string when I thought I was playing 2!!
Any advice would be greatly appreciated
# Posted on June 13th 2002 by TexasGal
Re: Double stops
The short answer is to practice 4 X as much as your teacher suggests.... :O)
When I started fiddling 20 years ago, there was no internet. I remember asking a top local fiddler for some advice, and he just said "Practice. Keep at it and you will get it." I wasn't very satisfied with his answer, and felt that I had to learn how to ask more specific questions. But, 20 years later, I realize that his message was one of encouragement, rather than advice. "You'll get it" was his real message, provided that I put in the effort to learn it. Well,... after 20 years I have put in enough effort to learn whatever it is that I have. I could have made a stronger effort at times, but I needed to keep a balance in my life, and as a result, I still enjoy fiddling, and I still keep learning.
If you keep at it, you WILL get it. Make sure that you enjoy yourself in the meantime. Keep it fun, that is the only to keep at it long enough to reach your goals. Enough preaching...
apologies...
Double stops are quite a challenge. To create an even tone on one string, the right balance must be achieved between bow speed, bow pressure, and the point where the bow contacts the string. If you move the bow closer to the bridge, then you must increase the pressure, or increase the bow speed, or face the squeels.
Too much pressure, or not enough speed, and you are headed for a crunch. If you move the contact point closer to the fingerboard, then you must decrease the pressure or suffer the crunch.
So, with the above in mind, many fiddlers play double stops with the bow contacting the strings a little further from the bridge with a very light pressure and with a longer bow stroke (= more bow speed). To make it even easier to maintain an even bow pressure, they play near the top half of the bow, using mainly the weight of the bow to apply the pressure to the string. If you are not already doing this, then you will likely find that this helps a fair amount. Some styles of fiddling will require that you learn to play double stops close to the bridge, with lots of pressure, but you can cross that bridge later, if you ever want to go in that direction.
There are several benefits to new fiddlers to practice double stops. First, it helps to develop control of bow pressure, and accuracy in drawing the bow along the plane of the two strings.
Second, by listening to the two notes, one can begin making adjustments in left hand finger placement to bring the two notes into accurate pitch. So, even if it doesn't seem to sound nice to your ear, as an exercise, it enables you to begin developing skills which necessarily take a long time to acquire. You can think it as part of the initiation rite into the brother/sisterhood of fiddlers. We all go through it, and as God's way of trying to keep us humble, He lets us screech or crunch once in a while.
The other essential, for learning double stops, is to keep a wet sponge handy, for the purpose of throwing at anybody who makes insensitive comments about 'cats fighting', etc. (speaking from personal experience! :O)
Best of luck,
scottythefiddler
# Posted on June 13th 2002 by scottythefiddler
Re: Double stops
Wow, Scotty This is really great advice and Texas Gal what a great question. I love this place! I am trying the sponge thing... though I don't think it is fair to throw it at my audience as they are cats and they seem to enjoy it...they probably think I am mutating into one herself...
# Posted on June 14th 2002 by nikki
Re: Double stops
All this complex fiddling advice is putting me off ever attempting to learn the fiddle. At the age of 8 or 9, I was offered violin lessons at school, but turned them down in favour of the guitar (which I didn't stick at) - I'm kicking myself black and blue now.
Since getting into traditional music I've always thought I'd get round to the fiddle sometime. But now I'm just terrified of the ghastly noise I'd make - for which I've got no excuse, being over 21. I don't know if I could put up with myself for long enough to attain any degree of competence. From fiddlers' comments in The Session, there seems to be so much to learn, just to become a passable player - and the longer I leave it, no doubt, the smaller my chances of ever becoming that.
Sorry about that bit of self indulgent rant. Ignore all foregoing text.
# Posted on June 15th 2002 by CreadurMawnOrganig
Re: Double stops
I gotta admit when I see all the stuff these guys are writing out it makes me stop and think, "Is this how I'm doing it?". Seeing it all written out like that makes it look worse than it really is. Don't be discouraged, don't expect fast results, but for heavens sakes don't not give it a go!
# Posted on June 15th 2002 by flyinfiddler
Re: Double stops
Don't be silly, David. Pick it up! ALL instruments sound horrible in the hands of rank beginners. I started when I was 38 or so. I know lots of people who have started at late ages. And...
Irish traditional musicians are known for being multi-instrumentalists, and you know, they don't sound wonderful when they first pick up an instrument either. If you're familiar with the music, you'll have an edge on learning the fiddle -- you already know what it's supposed to sound like. It'll just be a matter of getting some facility at the instrument you're trying to pick up.
Will is learning the flute and whistle now, you know...after years and years of fiddle. Shannon Heaton just picked up the box about two years ago. Matt Heaton is a stellar guitar player, and he's right now taking fiddle lessons from Tommy Peoples, and he definitely considers himself a beginner at the fiddle. Mike Dugger is just now getting to the point where he feels he can bring his box to a session.
So go pick up a fiddle! Everybody makes ghastly noises when they start out. Give yourself the same breaks you'd give anyone else just starting, fer cats sake!
Zina
# Posted on June 15th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Double stops
Ah yes, but of all instruments, the fiddle, while it can make some of the most beautiful sounds, can also make some of the ugliest. I play mandolin - give one of them to the most unmusical of people and they'd be hard pressed to get a REALLY horrible noise out of it.
# Posted on June 15th 2002 by CreadurMawnOrganig
Re: Double stops
You've never heard me play penney whistle that's for sure. I'll stick to strings.
# Posted on June 15th 2002 by flyinfiddler
Re: Double stops
Well, you realize that from now on we're going to do our best to shame you into trying, David. *grin* You most regret the things that you didn't try rather than the things you did, you know. Fear of failure shouldn't stop you, or none of us would ever do ANYthing.
Zina
# Posted on June 15th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Double stops
Well said Zina.
# Posted on June 15th 2002 by flyinfiddler
Re: Double stops
Umm,, I guess this means I should'nt give up on the penney whistle don't it.
Most frustrating instrument I've ever picked up. I have no wind control. Just a lot of hot air.
# Posted on June 15th 2002 by flyinfiddler
Re: Double stops
Hoist by your own petard.
# Posted on June 15th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Double stops
ZING!!!!!
That was the sound of whatever you said going over my head there Zina. Hoist I understand,,if it's a Beamish, Guiness, or Harp yer talking 'bout. But the rest, alas, I'm a bit slow.
# Posted on June 15th 2002 by flyinfiddler
Re: Double stops
"Hoist by your own petard"
Meaning:
Caught in your own trap.
Origin:
A petard is a small, bell-shaped explosive device used to break down doors or walls. Hence - hoist on one's own petard... Used by Shakespeare in Hamlet 'For tis the sport to have the enginer / Hoist with his owne petar'. From the French and Latin words for "breaking wind", ie: to fart.
Isn't language wonderful?
Zina
# Posted on June 15th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Double stops
All right then. Has anyone got a fiddle they don't want? Another problem I have is that I might end up spending too much on a terrible fiddle, which I might never even learn to play. I'm a Capricorn, you see - we don't like spending money unless we know it's going to be a long term investment.
# Posted on June 15th 2002 by CreadurMawnOrganig
Re: Double stops
David,
The point that got overlooked in the excitement of the wind breaking above is that with the mandolin you're more than half way there. You already know the left hand fingerings, even where triplets and twiddly bits fit in (specially if you've listened to the people you're playing with). And your fingertips will be toughened up. You only have to convert strums into bows. A doddle! Can't help you with a fiddle though.
Cheers
# Posted on June 15th 2002 by Jill
Replace 'strums' with picks or pecks or whatever you call them when you're playing melodies instead of chords.
# Posted on June 15th 2002 by Jill
Re: Double stops
David, I bought what I considered to be an old beater fiddle that I figured would NOT be a good long term investment until I could see whether I might actually be any good at the fiddle -- it cost me less than $400. I wanted a decent student fiddle grade instrument, was all. To my surprise, I was told two years later by Dale Morris that it's actually quite a good fiddle, well made, good sound, good measurements, etc. All it needed was good strings and a good adjustment, which he gave it. Surprise, and there went my excuse for being such a poor fiddler. *grin*
I bought it at a pawn shop. If you trust your own ears and not the salesmen who want to overprice the fiddle at you, you can often find a nice enough instrument at places like that. There usually aren't any fiddles worth over a few hundred there, but every now and again you hear of someone getting lucky. Take a fiddling friend with you if you don't trust your ears.
Whatever you do, don't go buying one of the cheapo E-bay Chinese fiddles -- there are many good Chinese fiddles being made inexpensively these days, but those aren't them. Dale has some really good Chinese new fiddles available for less than $700, I believe he said, great sound, comes with a good case, should hold value pretty well -- you can contact him at 940/433-9996 or e-mail him at dtmorris@compuwise.net to see what he has.
Zina
# Posted on June 16th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Double stops
David, looking at your bio - Why not have a go at making your own?
# Posted on June 16th 2002 by Jill
Making a fiddle
You've made a valid point there, Jill. The thing is, I'm still trying to get to grips with making the instruments I'm making, and a kettle's a bit of a different fiddle of kesh. Strange as it may sound for a student of musical instrument making, I don't have any particular talent for woodwork - I rely on determination alone - so things take me a long time. That and the fact that I don't have access to a workshop other than at the college, means it'll be a good few years before I get round to making a fiddle.
# Posted on June 16th 2002 by CreadurMawnOrganig
Re: Double stops
I agree david - nothing sounds worse than a fiddle when its played badly - except maybe the pipes - but go for it - its worth it in the end - though I admit I had and still do have a lot more problems with the bowing
)
# Posted on June 17th 2002 by bb
Re: Double stops
Thanks for the advice guys!! I guess I should know that what I need to do is practice, practice, practice, but's it good to hear it from other players, too.
# Posted on June 17th 2002 by TexasGal
Re: Double stops
To correct an error in my reply to Texas Gal....
With respect to bow pressure, bow speed and 'contact point' (the point on the string where the bow makes contact with the string),
To create a squeel... apply too little pressure, or too much bow speed, or play too close to the bridge...
To create a crunch... apply too much pressure, too little bow speed, or move bow closer to the fingerboard (while maintaining bow pressure and bow speed).
These three factors can be varied in countless ways, changing the volume, the richness of the tone, etc.... in short: variations of pressure, speed and contact point give you "dynamic control", allowing you to put expression into a piece.
One way to develop these skills is to practice the 'son file', which is a French expression (maybe Zina can translate for me) referring to a long slow bowstroke. The basis of the exercise is to draw a long slow bowstroke, maintaining pleasant tone. The slower the stroke, the more challenging it is to keep the tone steady. Changes in volume can be incorporated into the exercise.
i.e. start soft, finish strong; start strong, soft in the middle, and finish strong, etc
For anybody who might find all this daunting,.... remember, first and foremost, keep it fun. I don't have to sound like the best fiddler in the world, which is a good thing, because I ain't even the best fiddler in the ROOM most days....
You can all stop reading now, because I am going to tell some stories about some of the things that I learned along the way.
When I first started fiddling (at the age of 24), I met an elderly woman, who played piano. (Here in Canada, it is a tradition to accompany fiddle tunes with a piano.) Turns out her father was an accomplished fiddler from PEI. Before I met her, she had about 60 years experience playing the piano. She knew the music. She knew the tradition, and she could make the tunes hop. She would invite me over to her house, and we would play tunes into the wee hours. I felt a little too self concious about my lack of finesse, and would only visit every few months, until I realized that she actually was enjoying herself, in spite of my lack of skill. The point is: the music stands on its own; you or I can't do anything that will harm or help it. Those who love the music and the tradition, enjoy it whether done with finesse, or with simple exuberance.
I love playing in nursing homes, hospitals, and retirement homes.
There are dozens of stories that I could tell, but will share a few of the ones that are extra special to me.
After a program in a nearby retirement home, a gentleman approached me and told me about being stationed in Halifax during WWII. He was told that his ship was going to leave for duty, shortly. He was given 24 hours shore leave, went and found his beloved and proposed to her. They couldn't find a church in which to get married, but they did find a clergyman who agreed to marry them in a simple ceremony on the street. Word got out about this wedding, and complete strangers began showing up, bringing with them food and refreshments, flowers, etc. Somebody brought a fiddle, and they partied in the street into the early morning hours.
The fellows eyes where getting glassy as he told me his story, and how hearing some fiddle tunes brought back memories of his wedding day and the years he and his wife had shared.
It was then, that I realized that fiddling is about the simple things, a smile, a tapping toe, just sharing a good time.
Last summer, I played at a Cape Breton wedding, and some of the guests asked "which part of Cape Breton are you from?". (Actually, I am from Ontario, but that is about the biggest compliment that can be paid to a fiddler, in this area). Shortly after, I did a program of mostly Irish fiddle tunes in a retirement home in Toronto, and a gentleman in the early stages of Alzhiemers disease, began to believe that he was back in Donegal, and he asked me what part of Donegal I was from. At the age of 90, he wanted to take me up the street to play for his father!
Another favourite... up until last year, I used to play almost every day in a nursing home somewhere. There is a children's residence for kids with severe mental and physical challenges, and I used to travel out of town once a month to play there, as well as a few other places in the same community. There is a little girl there named Amanda, who asked me to play 'Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer" for her. (That was in the month of May.) I told her that I didn't think that I could manage the tune, but promised her that I would play it the following month. The next month came(June), and Amanda asked for her tune. To my horror, and her deep disappointment, I had forgotten my promise. I will never forget her quivering lip when I apologized to her. Later that night, I resolved that I was going to learn that tune, and put some sheet music into my fiddle case.
The following month, (July) I had a few hours to spare between shows, and stopped at a coffee shop before heading up to the children's residence, when I remembered my promise. So, while sitting in the car, in the parking lot of a donut shop, I got out my fiddle and began plucking the strings to get the tune into my fingers. Shortly, a police officer pulled up, and seeing me sitting in my wreck of a car, with a rather fancy looking violin, decided to investigate. The officer asked what I was doing, and I replied, "trying to learn 'Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer"! I was lucky that he didn't arrest me on the spot, because he thought that I was trying to be a wise guy. I tried to explain to him about the little girl in the wheelchair, but I could see by his expression that he felt my story was just too tender, to be true. I managed to give him a phone number, which he had his dispatcher call to verify some of the details of my story, and he just shook his head and left. Afterwards, I realized how lucky, fortunate, blessed, I must be to find myself in situations which literally are too good to be true. Situations, which are unbelievable to so many people, yet are real.
There are dozens of similar stories, and for anyone who dares to be a fiddler, and to take the fiddle out into the community, to share the music, share a smile, and share a good time, there are experiences, similar to those above, waiting. 'These kind of experiences, the little smiles, the tapping toe, etc,, are the reason I fiddle. There is no requirement to be especially talented (good thing, too)
For those who are waiting to become the best fiddler in the world, someone else is going to beat you to all the fun.
Cheers,
scottythefiddler
# Posted on June 17th 2002 by scottythefiddler
Re: Double stops
Ah, Scotto. Now I remember why exactly I miss having you around as much these days.
There's nothing quite like doing the Christmas shows out at DIA in December for their Cultural Christmas thing. Ron always came out to play for us on his box, and we would do The Fairy Reel and the four hand reel and all the other fun ceili dances to Rudolph, and Frosty the Snowman, and Jingle Bells. Totally surreal, but a lot of fun. Heh.
Zina
# Posted on June 17th 2002 by Zina Lee
Re: Double stops
You Rock Scotty!
Jamie :0)
(love the stories!)
# Posted on June 18th 2002 by jamiedj
Re: Double stops
amen...
# Posted on June 18th 2002 by bb
Re: Double stops
That's what I want people to get out of my playing. I don't expect the be the best in the world, but I'd love to see people get up and want to dance when I play, and just to share the reason why I wanted to learn this instrument in the first place. I just love the sound of the fiddle. If people can listen to me, and it brings back memories, or entices them to dance, or they just sit and enjoy it, I would just love it. Of course, I've only been playing for about 4 months, so these scenarios I'm dreaming of are a little in the future, but I can still dream, right?? I can barely play in front of family/friends right now!
# Posted on June 18th 2002 by TexasGal
Re: Double stops
That's a good attitude there Texas gal. It'll happen. Just don't give up and don't let other people get you down if they say something you don't like.
# Posted on June 18th 2002 by flyinfiddler
Re: Double stops
Keep dreaming, Texas Gal!
One night, the announcer came on and said that the regular DJ wasn't available that night, so he was going to fill in, but didn't know where to find the fiddle recordings in the station library, and so was going to play Jim Nabors and Slim Whitman all night long. I phoned the station, to try to give him some titles/artists to look for, and even offered to bring in some of my own recordings if needed. 30 minutes later, we were spinning records, and I was telling him what to say about each tune.... till he showed me how to operate the turntables, etc. and left me to do the last two hours of the show. The regular DJ heard about it later, and asked me to be his emergency backup, on a volunteer basis, to fill during holidays, etc. (Most small stations operate with a full complement of volunteers, so there ARE opportunities for anyone who is interested! If they don't have a IRtrad program, offer to do one for them...)
Boy, talk about bringing back memories. That is what you are doing for me right now. Your comments remind me SO much of my own feelings when I was getting started. I remember having dreams. What a great time that was. I didn't have a case for my fiddle, except for a brown paper bag, so I made a wooden rack to hang my fiddle and bow on the wall. Every time that I came into the room, I would see the fiddle hanging there, start dreaming, and the urge to play became irresistable. Your dreams are very important, and they give you something that nobody else can. It is ok to have big dreams too. I know that I did, and they provided a lot of motivation for me, helped me over some of those days when I struggled. It is also ok to have modest dreams. Sometimes the little things are the most satisfying.
Don't forget to give yourself 'permission' to realize your dreams! That may sound like an odd comment, but there is a grain of truth in it. Your dreams have a funny way of coming true, if you allow yourself to live them, given the opportunity. As an example, I remember listening to some fiddle music on a local University radio station. It had a 50 watt transmitter, with a range of about 3 miles, (if the wind was pushing it downhill
In retrospect, I wanted to decline the fillin DJ's offer to be in the studio during the show, but my dreams forced me to accept his offer. When the regular DJ offered me some spots, I felt too inexperienced, but my dreams forced me to go for it. As a result, I made a lot of great friends (never did become famous, 50 watts barely gets past the parking lot) and had a lot of fun. The point is, there were moments when I almost said "no", but something inside said "yes". Give yourself permission to 'go for it' when opportunity knocks... Some pretty far fetched dreams can become reality, so dream without limits.
A good place to start, is to become a recording artist,....today, right now!!! See the thread 'THE MIGHTY CRAICK", or 'THE SESSION RECORDINGS", and submit a tune. Would love to hear you play!
All the best
scottythefiddler
# Posted on June 18th 2002 by scottythefiddler